Althouse: "It’s really hard to say that you would have a child if given X amount of money from the government, because I think that’s just not the calculus. It is a very intimate, personal decision that people make."

November 14, 2025

"It’s really hard to say that you would have a child if given X amount of money from the government, because I think that’s just not the calculus. It is a very intimate, personal decision that people make."

Said Christina Gibson-Davis, a sociology and public policy professor at Duke University, quoted in "Raising kids is too expensive, most Americans say in new survey/Seven in 10 respondents said raising children is too expensive, a notable jump from 2024, according to an annual public opinion survey on U.S. family life" (WaPo).

68 comments:

RCOCEAN II said...: There are two big barriers. The cost of housing. And the need for day care.; 11/14/25, 10:32 AM
Chris said...: Paying people for kids, is what leads to ghetto cows that pop out all those kids, for the sweet government money, and the kids end up neglected and later criminals.; 11/14/25, 10:32 AM
n.n said...: The biggest barriers to functional America are "benefits" and "burdens".

Make Americans Viable Again; 11/14/25, 10:37 AM
n.n said...: MAVA is impeded by Diversity class-disordered ideologies (e.g. racism) that set quotas for your child's development.; 11/14/25, 10:39 AM
RideSpaceMountain said...: Not the fundamental reason I think, but it rhymes. I think the deeper question the conscientious ask themselves regarding this question is, "will my children have better opportunities and a better life than I have/had."

In East-Asia, that is very frequently how the question is put to oneself, I just think it gets expressed as a $ problem here and elsewhere. I know this is exactly the question I put to myself, and then my wife, when I decided to have children rather late in life (40). It took that long for my answer to come back "yes" to myself, which I know for a fact is not the answer so many globally facing the same question unambiguously receive.

There's a popular saying online these days paraphrased from John Calhoun's "Mouse Universe" Experiments (specifically "Universe 25" at NIMH) that "humans don't breed well in captivity". It's left up to yourself to decide what the nature of that "captivity" actually is...; 11/14/25, 10:45 AM
tim maguire said...: Never before in history has so much been asked of parents. Never before in history have parents been given less authority to raise their children.

It's crushingly expensive in part due to "keeping up with the Joneses," where so much is competitive that didn't used to be. But also because of the endless government regulations and expert advice that you ignore at your legal peril.; 11/14/25, 10:46 AM
Lyssa said...: I think people in the type A, educated professional, super-planner lifestyle (and I’m one of them) often really misunderstand how little planning a lot of people put into having children. For me, it was carefully parsed and planned, but a lot of people are going through life either way a basic attitude of “well, we’re not trying, but if it happens, it happens.” Something like 50% of babies born are unplanned, but most of them are still viewed as blessings. We’re wired to operate that way. For those people in that no strong plan either way territory, I bet some (relatively small in the grand scheme of things) amount of money can tip over the edge (at least, over the edge between trying hard to prevent and just casually preventing, of viewing the whoops as a happy accident verses a burden.); 11/14/25, 10:49 AM
n.n said...: MAVA is restrained by women encouraged to earn taxable income by progwives and human rites performed for social, clinical, criminal, political, and climate progress.

What is the barrier to pregnant women... people?; 11/14/25, 10:49 AM
rehajm said...: Yes incentivizing people to have children they wouldn't otherwise have is a horrific central planner idea....and yes, that is what it is despite what you choose to call it...; 11/14/25, 10:50 AM
PM said...: Saying 'It's too expensive' never stopped the neighbors where I grew up. That's the government's look-out.; 11/14/25, 10:54 AM
rhhardin said...: Workmate long ago, on his wife becoming pregnant: It takes $800,000 to raise an 18 year old. For $800,000 you can buy a heck of a nice 18 year old.; 11/14/25, 10:55 AM
Jim Gust said...: It's not about money, having children is a leap of faith.

When we had our first, we were living with my wife's parents, paying no rent, she in grad school and me making $15k per year. When my parents had me, they couldn't afford it, I did not realize until years later how poor we were in my early childhood. Faith was rewarded. Tax credits would have zero effect on the decision.; 11/14/25, 10:59 AM
Wa St Blogger said...: The "cost of raising a child" metric is designed to discourage having children. I have 6, and at 440,000 per child, that would mean I would have had to earn over 2.6 million dollars, not to mention what it would cost to take care of me and the blogger spouse. I guarantee you I don't make that kind of scratch. You can raise a family of 8 in the expensive Seattle area on less than 100k a year. I know. we did just that.; 11/14/25, 10:59 AM
jim said...: Says a sociologist. Economists might say that a government check would reduce an economic batrrer for people who would like to have a child.; 11/14/25, 11:01 AM
Temujin said...: Especially when considering the cost of chocolate martinis that you don't intend on giving up.; 11/14/25, 11:02 AM
CJinPA said...: Reasons Given for Not Having Kids:
* Too expensive
* Won't subject them to the fate of climate catastrophe
* More humans will cause climate catastrophe
* Don't want them

Only one of these is an honest answer, in my opinion.; 11/14/25, 11:05 AM
RideSpaceMountain said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 11/14/25, 11:05 AM
Jupiter said...: " ... a sociology and public policy professor at Duke University ..."
It is depressing to reflect that this woman had the potential to be a productive human being.; 11/14/25, 11:06 AM
Howard said...: Fiat money inflation plus Kafkaesque building permit processes has destroyed the American Dream for most regular folks who work hard and play by the rules.; 11/14/25, 11:06 AM
RideSpaceMountain said...: rehajm said, "central planner idea"

I have a significant subject-matter focus on Asia, China specifically, which permits me to opine that China's infamous centrally-planned "One Child Policy" has been an unequivocal disaster, one even they now realize. It remains to be seen if its repeal 10 years ago caught the mistake in time.

From Mt. Taygetus to the Lex Julia to Nazi Germany to now, government is the last thing you want anywhere near questions of who should and should not breed and how. They universally turn out to be bad ideas.; 11/14/25, 11:08 AM
Gospace said...: RCOCEAN II said...
There are two big barriers. The cost of housing. And the need for day care.

We have 5, all successful adults. Total cost for daycare over 38 years from firstborn to last leaving for college- $0.00.

Don't need daycare of one parents takes care of it.; 11/14/25, 11:13 AM
Derve said...: Paying people to have kids is a "tweak" to the system. America is unaffordable for the formerly Middle Class. You really do have to change the whole system. Stop giving "free" money to people who don't need it. Some took all. If we don't share the wealth and make a more level capitalistic playing field, America will continue to decline. It's actually GOOD not to have children you cannot afford...; 11/14/25, 11:18 AM
Derve said...: Howard said...
Fiat money inflation plus Kafkaesque building permit processes has destroyed the American Dream for most regular folks who work hard and play by the rules.
----------

ann althouse: You're not OWED anything. The predators will rise to the top. The suckers will get played. Same as it ever was... (says the lady who cleaned up in Higher Ed over the decades... heh heh heh: suckahs! Hit my tip jar, cuz I'll never have enough for all I contributed...); 11/14/25, 11:19 AM
Derve said...: Jupiter said...
" ... a sociology and public policy professor at Duke University ..."
It is depressing to reflect that this woman had the potential to be a productive human being.

11/14/25, 11:06 AM
----------
Lol. She probably has multiples... time off/a sabbatical for every child she pushes out, and then the ability to .... work from home. The intellectual class really isn't for all their credentials. They top the list of takers.; 11/14/25, 11:21 AM
Jim said...: I blame car seats. When I was a toddler, I stood up next to my Mom on the bench sear of her Ford Fairlane. My scoutmaster took four of us to scout camp in the back sear of his Dodge Dart; no seatbelts. It was much cheaper in the 60’s.; 11/14/25, 11:25 AM
Yancey Ward said...: "Never before in history has so much been asked of parents. Never before in history have parents been given less authority to raise their children."

This sentence summarizes the main problem very pithily.; 11/14/25, 11:36 AM
n.n said...: Don't need daycare of one parents takes care of it.

One parent earns taxable income, the other operates a non-profit household, and the gross domestic product increases with our Posterity.; 11/14/25, 11:38 AM
Luke Lea said...: Here's a better way: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00U0C9HKW

Quote: "In A Part-time Job in the Country, Luke Lea has penned a popular manifesto in behalf of the tens of millions of ordinary Americans for whom happiness would be an abundance of well-paying, part-time employment opportunities in rural areas where land is inexpensive and families would have time to build their own houses, cultivate a garden, properly care for their children and grandchildren, and pursue hobbies and other outside interests.

To bring this about, he proposes the idea of factories in the countryside that run on part-time jobs, looking not only at the new lifestyle such factories would make possible, but at the new kinds of neighborhood communities and country towns that might develop around them. The result is an American Eutopia* for the 21st century.

Of crucial importance, the author devotes a whole chapter to showing why, with the right kind of wage bargain between labor and management, many kinds of factories--above all those that are most labor-intensive--can be expected to run up to forty percent faster and more efficiently than when manned by full-time workers, generating proportionately higher hourly earnings and rates of return on investment.; 11/14/25, 11:38 AM
Curious George said...: "Don't need daycare of one parents takes care of it." That's what we did. I worked, she stayed home. Even though I was a good earner, it wasn't easy. Our biggest "luxury" was living in an upper middle-class area with good schools.; 11/14/25, 11:47 AM
Aggie said...: As always, you get more of what you incentivize. Maybe we should try incentivizing stable families, then just watch the birth rate take care of itself.; 11/14/25, 11:47 AM
RideSpaceMountain said...: @Aggie, the problem, as Lyssa put it ("...a lot of people are going through life either way a basic attitude of 'well, we’re not trying, but if it happens, it happens.' Something like 50% of babies born are unplanned, but most of them are still viewed as blessings. We’re wired to operate that way.") is that a huge cohort of families like "that" aren't stable no matter what incentives are on the table.; 11/14/25, 11:54 AM
Wa St Blogger said...: I have a significant subject-matter focus on Asia, China specifically, which permits me to opine that China's infamous centrally-planned "One Child Policy" has been an unequivocal disaster, one even they now realize. It remains to be seen if its repeal 10 years ago caught the mistake in time.

Nope. They broke it. With moving all the people to the cities and adopting western consumer values, none of the new generation even WANTS kids, much less multiple. They no longer value children.; 11/14/25, 11:58 AM
MadTownGuy said...: Add to all that's in the foregoing comments, the additional costs related to public schools for materials, etc. as listed in the official notices published everywhere in discount stores, plus fees for extracurricular athletics and other things that used to be included at no cost to families.

Where does all that property tax money go?; 11/14/25, 12:17 PM
Gospace said...: Jim said...
I blame car seats.

So do a lot of "experts". Certainly a contributing factor. Not the sole factor- but they all add up. When I first got married couldn't afford a large car. Now that I'm retired just bought a 7 seater. Wife wanted one so when we visit the 5 (of 10 so far) grandkids we can take them all in one car to wherever we were taking them. That's the son making the big bucks- his big car seats 8. His 12 year old Prius he commutes in gets the good mileage.

Maybe a partial solution is subsidizing a large car with birth of child #3 to a couple, and a larger car when they have #5 or 6. Note: to a couple, not a single parent. One of each subsidy per couple- no one needs a new car every other year. I don't trade in cars, I keep the old one as a spare. Had a 2014 until last year- gifted it to a family member who needed one. I buy new and keep them until the wheels fall off.; 11/14/25, 12:21 PM
Gospace said...: MadTownGuy said...
Where does all that property tax money go?

Administrators. More extraneous staff with nebulous job titles and mysterious functions. Sort of like the very important 6 figure job with secretary Michelle had at that Chicago hospital, a job so important she was never replaced when she left...; 11/14/25, 12:24 PM
LH in Montana said...: Of course it's more expensive this year compared to last. Who hasn't seen a significant jump in the costs of nearly everything? But, please, let's not throw (away) more money at the problem!; 11/14/25, 12:26 PM
Mason G said...: "More extraneous staff with nebulous job titles and mysterious functions."

Somebody's got to work to convince as many of those kids as possible that they're trans. You can't count on the parents to do it.; 11/14/25, 12:29 PM
Quaestor said...: Google AI says the typical Amish family includes six to eight children.

Raising kids isn't too expensive; it's too distracting from suburban pleasure-seeking.; 11/14/25, 12:30 PM
n.n said...: Check your ego and hedonistic proclivities at the door.; 11/14/25, 12:36 PM
n.n said...: Trans: two fathers, a mother and mother in a husband's suit, a gender simulation.; 11/14/25, 12:38 PM
Gospace said...: Quaestor said...
Google AI says the typical Amish family includes six to eight children.

My Mennonite next door neighbors are up to 12. Family gatherings at their house during the summer are large. Don't actually know any of the local Amish, but driving by their properties 6-8 might be a low side estimate. Of course, the families with fewer children or even none would be far less visible.; 11/14/25, 12:42 PM
n.n said...: Deposits in banks, wombs on farms, and a community, obliviously, obviously.; 11/14/25, 12:50 PM
tommyesq said...: I notice that a lot of mainstream media emphasizes how much having kids can ruin one's "freedom" to live life to the fullest, to have it all, do what you want, etc. Children are portrayed as a burden, and not just in terms of finances. The drumbeat has to have an effect.; 11/14/25, 1:01 PM
tommyesq said...: Don't need daycare of one parents takes care of it.

Agreed to an extent, but one problem with that is when the world moves primarily to two-income families, the cost of many things - housing, automobiles, day care, etc. - rise to meet that ability to pay more, much in the way that the cost of college skyrocketed when the government started providing (and backing) student loans.; 11/14/25, 1:05 PM
Mason G said...: "when the world moves primarily to two-income families"

Some (a lot?) of the cost to raise a child is actually the cost of maintaining two incomes.; 11/14/25, 1:27 PM
n.n said...: Women needed to enter the workforce with social progress, dysfunction and progressive prices through shared responsibility. NOW what? Immigration reform, of course. Global arbitrage, too.; 11/14/25, 1:34 PM
Gospace said...: tommyesq said...
I notice that a lot of mainstream media emphasizes how much having kids can ruin one's "freedom" to live life to the fullest, to have it all, do what you want, etc. Children are portrayed as a burden, and not just in terms of finances. The drumbeat has to have an effect.

Just ask Stevie Nicks, now childless. Wonder if she has any cats... she doesn't have a husband.

"Stevie Nicks has spoken about an abortion she had in 1979, stating it was necessary for her to continue her career with Fleetwood Mac. She said that if she had not had the abortion, she is "pretty sure there would have been no Fleetwood Mac". In recent years, she has become a vocal advocate for abortion access, calling it essential for women's healthcare and the ability to shape their own lives.

Killing her child was essential to her career.; 11/14/25, 1:40 PM
Steve said...: Pennsylvania set up Orphan Schools after the Civil War. Many of the kids in the live-away schools had living mothers, but the fathers had either been severely wounded or killed. The mothers would give up the younger kids who couldn't work on the farm, but keep the older kids who could.
The economics of subsistence farming resulted in a high birth rate, so there were plenty in each category.; 11/14/25, 2:14 PM
n.n said...: Abortion is the fourth choice, the wicked solution, a dirty denoument.; 11/14/25, 2:50 PM
Big Mike said...: As I type this I’m at my son’s house with an 18 month old granddaughter on my lap as she eats a cookie. What dollar value does Christina Gibson-Davis impute to this interaction? Whatever figure she assigns, it’s not even within an order of magnitude of being right.; 11/14/25, 2:54 PM
Odi said...: It's not too expensive. As the father of 8 Children, 4 adopted and 4 biological, it's very affordable to have children. What is unaffordable is to maintain a carefree party lifestyle without sacrifice and kids require sacrifice.; 11/14/25, 3:47 PM
n.n said...: Correction: abortion is the fifth choice, a wicked solution, a dirty denoument.; 11/14/25, 3:51 PM
Aught Severn said...: Don't need daycare of one parents takes care of it.

There is the implied cost of one lost income, which can be significant when considered over 12-15 years (at which point the kid can become latch key in all municipalities).

When we had 3 in daycare with my wife significantly underemployed, we discussed whether she should continue to work. In the end, it was better for her, mentally, to keep working and I had to keep working so she wouldn't get jealous of me having all that time with the kids while she was earning the bread... but do you know what costs almost as much as daycare these days? Competitive club sports (also shoeless called travel teams). Swimming, gymnastics, soccer, martial arts: team fees, coaches fees, travel fees, volunteer requirements and associated fees for not meeting them, equipment costs. Higher level kids sports = $$$...; 11/14/25, 3:53 PM
rehajm said...: Back twenty something years ago we ran some numbers for a family that said they couldn't afford to stop having both parents work. When we factored in the costs for the lower earner and child care it paid for one of them to stay home. There were tears...; 11/14/25, 4:18 PM
Achilles said...: RCOCEAN II said...

There are two big barriers. The cost of housing. And the need for day care.

I am waiting for people to get o the root cause of all of this. It is inevitable but still frustrating that Trump kicked Bannon out. I fear Trump is listening to rich people around him too much. Trump has always been a star chaser.

Bannon understands the true problem here. He knows why Trump and Mamdani are the political lodestars right now

Bush Clinton Bush Obama repealed Glass-Steagle and they added trillions to the Fed balance sheet and the national debt. All of that money went to banks and to people who already had money.

Trump in his first term really did nothing to stop that trend.

Biden just dumped cash on the system causing the worst real inflation in history.

Most of the people on this board have money and assets. We don't really feel the affects of what is going on.

About 70% of the people in the United States are fucked economically. They have 0 chance to actually buy a house or live the way their parents lived.

Zohran Mamdani and Nick Fuentes are the best thing you can expect to come out of this situation. There are a lot of fat rich Trump supporters and a few democrats on this board who refuse to see the writing on this wall.; 11/14/25, 4:22 PM
Achilles said...: Jim said...

I blame car seats. When I was a toddler, I stood up next to my Mom on the bench sear of her Ford Fairlane. My scoutmaster took four of us to scout camp in the back sear of his Dodge Dart; no seatbelts. It was much cheaper in the 60’s.

My wife has finally stopped yelling at me for not using car seats.; 11/14/25, 4:27 PM
Achilles said...: Howard said...

Fiat money inflation plus Kafkaesque building permit processes has destroyed the American Dream for most regular folks who work hard and play by the rules.

This.

I would say both parties in this country have been a 1 2 punch at the middle class.

But it is more like 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 punch at the middle class.; 11/14/25, 4:28 PM
RideSpaceMountain said...: "About 70% of the people in the United States are fucked economically. They have 0 chance to actually buy a house or live the way their parents lived."

It's way worse in the cities. I estimate 90%. Not only do they know their children, if they had them, "would not live better than they have/had", they know that about their own lives. Now. I don't know about "best", but I see a lot of Nicks, Zohrans, and others showing up in a future that belongs them.; 11/14/25, 4:39 PM
Mason G said...: "Back twenty something years ago we ran some numbers for a family that said they couldn't afford to stop having both parents work."

Many moons ago, one of the network news magazine programs did a story on this, where they showed couples that both worked how one of them could stay home if they rearranged their finances without adding any additional income.

Not all the couples were excited to hear the news.; 11/14/25, 5:03 PM
Achilles said...: It will be interesting to see if Trump can get back out in front of this.

Trump stepped on his dick with that "Not enough talent" comment.; 11/14/25, 5:17 PM
Gusty Winds said...: Achilles said...
It will be interesting to see if Trump can get back out in front of this....Trump stepped on his dick with that "Not enough talent" comment.

The liberal American education system has been dumbing down American children for at least 40 years. The data is clear. Colleges worse with their high priced bullshit. But it's real. Pride parades are more important than math skills. That's why Musk wants it too.

Trump is speaking and ugly truth. I don't like it either. I hire people. And I'll take the young and hungry "poorly educated" high school grad vs a University of Wisconsin woke grad any day. I can at least train the former.

Sad part is the more we have to do this, and import talent, they hire their own culture at the corporate level. They're taking over America, while educators march American kids around waiving pride flags. You can get any degree my kissing ass and getting a COVID booster every year. It's damned if you do or don't. We have to wade to shore.

It's not Trump. The root cause is American Liberal educators who survive on politics for self-preservation. They care about their gov't pensions. Not kids, or the economic future of America. They can't even absorb that thought.

Until the arrogant liberal education system is fixed, nothing can be fully won.; 11/14/25, 7:18 PM
Gusty Winds said...: On the flip side, let Trump ban all University foreign imports. Watch colleges sink and go under. A full reset like the Great Flood. It would take a long time to rebuild. A few generations. But they'd be better off. Won't happen in our lifetime.; 11/14/25, 7:21 PM
Birches said...: This post was made for me and I missed it! Finances are not a problem if you are committed to having a family and think it's the highest priority. I haven't worked since 2007. We are very frugal and we've moved twice for better cost of living. I have a lot of kids and though we spend about a car payment every month on piano lessons, they really aren't that expensive. Car insurance for them is expensive, but if we were not as prosperous as we are, they just wouldn't get their licenses. You can make it work if you really want to. Most parents have done a terrible job of selling having children to their own children. Too bad for them.; 11/14/25, 10:13 PM
Achilles said...: Gusty Winds said...

On the flip side, let Trump ban all University foreign imports. Watch colleges sink and go under. A full reset like the Great Flood. It would take a long time to rebuild. A few generations. But they'd be better off. Won't happen in our lifetime.

AI Agents are going to completely replaces teachers at every level within 3 years.

They will come complete with 3rd party evaluation exams that will grant degrees.

Corporations will very quickly start accepting these AI Agent driven evaluations. I expect hiring practices to start employing AI interviewers soon.; 11/14/25, 10:31 PM
JIM said...: I fully embrace the idea of Progressives not having babies.; 11/14/25, 11:29 PM
Bunkypotatohead said...: The fertility rate in this country is highest among the poorest households. How can it be too expensive?; 11/14/25, 11:42 PM
Eric the Fruit Bat said...: I doubt there are all that many young married people who have this problem but it must really suck to think you genuinely can't afford to have kids and have your parents sitting on a pile of money who don't offer to help out.; 11/15/25, 5:36 AM
Tina Trent said...: They are being pushed by the system to not get married even if they live together, not demand child support, and make the rest of us pay for their kids. Those who do the right thing and support their own children can't afford it. Thus, Idiocracy.; 11/15/25, 3:54 PM