Meanwhile: "Vice President Pence... welcomes the efforts of members of the House and Senate to use the authority they have under the law to raise objections and bring forward evidence before the Congress and the American people on January 6th."
And, from Ted Cruz: "I think everyone needs to calm down.... I think we need to tone down the rhetoric. This is already a volatile situation. It's like a tinderbox and throwing lit matches into it... That’s not helpful ... at a time when we’re pitted against each other. Just relax, and let’s do our jobs... We have a responsibility to follow the law."
AND: Chuck Todd to Ron Johnson: "Stop! You don't get to make allegations that haven't been proven true."
WATCH: @chucktodd to @senronjohnson: "You made an allegation that there was widespread fraud, you failed to offer specific evidence of that widespread fraud, but you're demanding an investigation on ... allegations of widespread fraud."
— Meet the Press (@MeetThePress) January 3, 2021
"Essentially, you're the arsonist here." pic.twitter.com/PtZMSPoWtu
Posts
231 comments:
1 – 200 of 231 Newer› Newest»Presumably Democrat vote fraud is neither extreme nor unusual.
If Trump had given him the gig he wanted, the state dept, he would not be talking this way.
Romney lies. Every single leftist is lying. All of them.
As a fellow who donated money to Romney’s campaigns in ‘08 and ‘12 and who’s been disappointed by his performance ever since, I say Fuck Mitt Romney!!!!!!!!!!
Fuck Mitt Romney. Let him be the Democrat he longs to be.
I could never have imagined seeing these things in the greatest democracy in the world. Has ambition so eclipsed principle?
He doesn't have to imagine it, the Democrats have literally done it with every presidential election they have lost since 1988. But of course Romney doesn't even mention that.
Romney has graduated from rolling over and showing his belly to giving rim jobs.
You see the game that's being played here.
Courts get to eschew ruling on the actual merits with doctrines such as "standing," "laches" and "political question", while Romney advocates that the political branch abdicate its role to the judiciary.
Nothing could happen to Mitt Romney that would make me sad.
Senator Josh Hawley is ready to debate this completely soulless douche on the floor of the senate.
Mitt is too much of a coward to actually debate this subject.
So are a lot of people.
Romney is quite right, those Democrats who objected after the 2000 election were demagogues.
So were the Democrats who objected after the 2004 election.
So were the Democrats who objected after the 2016 election.
So were the Democrats who objected to the Georgia election Stacey Adams lost.
What does Romney think of the power to remove the President
Dear Mitt:
The procedure proposed by Cruz is EXACTLY what Congress did in 1876.
There is loads of evidence of fraud.
I urge Mitt and all Althousians to watch Ted Cruz, Jim Jordan and Mo Brooks on Maria B’s Sunday show on Fox. For example, the PA Supreme Court and Secretary of State directly violates PA law. And, of course, we have video of the theft in Atlanta.
Bah. What to do courts have to do with it? The courts didn't examine the evidence, they rejected the cases for lack of standing. The courts have taken taken themselves out of the picture. OTOH, the Constitution has a number of provisions for dealing with problem elections, so it seems to me perfectly legitimate for Congress to become involved. We are not a dikastocracy.
Romney is an example of public virtue. It always goes evil.
I want to see Romney and Sasse debate Cruz and Hawley. Beat down!
"President Trump’s lawyers made their case before scores of courts; in every instance, they failed"
WTF is that person talking about. NO court, none of them, took any evidence, going out their way to avoid the countless incidences of fraud.
Oso Negro said...Fuck Mitt Romney. Let him be the Democrat he longs to be.
No. Mitt wants to be the tame Republican "statesman" that the Democrat Media absolutely love ...
... until he runs against a true leftist Democrat.
Does that remind you of someone?
"Do what they really want is business as usual?
Leader McConnell would seem to have more than a whiff of that.
But the rest do not have to go along. Do they need a reminder the Democrats protested the electoral college certification of the last three Republican presidents—-Trump in 2016 and George W. Bush in 2000 and 2004?
There’s nothing new in this, except maybe the search for the truth in what happened and the promise of a better tomorrow.
And that truth is bigger than Donald Trump, larger than life though he may sometimes be, much bigger.
It speaks to the nature of what we are as a functioning democratic republic. Can we actually have elections the majority of the public trusts? They clearly don’t trust this one."- Roger L Simon
The guy who kept women in binders? No thanks
Mitt Romney would have been an excellent President. Maybe one of the most competent in the history of our beautiful nation.
But he doesn't really have his finger on the pulse of the current times.
Congressional power reserved for the most extreme or egregious cases,Sen. Romney? Where were those principles for the impeachment vote?
Back in the day I worked for and with a number of Mormons. By their standards Mitt simply does not measure up.
*Except when democrat do it.*
Mitt is just another government-corporate whore.
In Toddworld you only investigate after you have proof.
C'mon guys, if the Senators, Supreme Court judges, finance types, and law professors are all bending their necks to Kagan/ Breyer/ Roberts, how can you not do so? What, are you gonna join the Trump cult just because he's the only American leader standing up to the fraud?
Chuck Todd(D).
F chuck
https://creativedestructionmedia.com/investigations/2021/01/03/gas-sos-raffensperger-gave-hackers-roadmap-to-infiltrate-machines-a-year-before-election/
There is evidence all over the place.
Joe and his corrupt press yell "It's all lies!" "You have no proof!"
Begley makes an important point. This IS following procedure and precedent. If you have objections you should make them. Cruz et al are doing just that.
Americans know so little about their own government and history.
Pompous dorks like Romney have it bass ackwards. Challenges like these are good for our democracy. These processes are the institutional equivalent of an immune system, designed to fight infections in the form of voter fraud and electoral incompetence. Just as the human body responds to stressors by changing, improving, and becoming more efficient, institutions and organizations respond to stressors by adapting, improving, and becoming more efficient.
I say bring on the challenges, the political battles, the protests! Our system will survive a few challenges made according to the constitutional processes set in place by previous generations. In fact, the more we debate these issues and bring them to light, the more likely they are to be resolved before the next election. The more people feel like their voice was heard, the more likely they are to accept the results even if they lose.
Serious question. How many of you here knew about Hayes and the election of 1876 before this thread?
Chuck Todd to Ron Johnson: "Stop! You don't get to make allegations that haven't been proven true."
Allegation: An assertion that someone has done something wrong, often without proof. --thefreedictionary.com
Allegations that have been proven true are called "statements of fact".
Also, please see "russia, russia", Brett Kavanaugh is a rapist, etcetera...
Mr Wibble for the win.
You made an allegation that there was widespread fraud, you failed to offer specific evidence of that widespread fraud
Johnson gave him just one example of 42,000 double votes in Nevada before being interrupted by Todd.
but you're demanding an investigation...
Investigations do follow evidence and allegations to see if they're true or not, don't they?
on ... allegations of widespread fraud.
The alleged fraud is concentrated in certain counties in battleground states that in many cases exhibited collusive behavior by acting in unison to "suspend" vote counting.
Yes, continue the nonsense facts are Pelosi will be MJority house leader voted in again today Joe Biden is the new President and inaguaration on Jan 20, 2021, we will have 1st women and minority vice president of the United States and trumps reign as a 1 term fluke president joining the very small all time group of presidents who couldnt get reelected no matter what they trie will be relieved of representing America (the ideal plan of Democracy),the brilliant theorists and lawyers and conspiracists up in here still believing this ain't happening should probably search for another way to express themselves outside of politics.These are the facts ,not Conway's alternative facts but real facts.trump has been MIA since he lost in a landslide and is being paid to golf and do twitter while Rome burns.Those who cannot get this are doomed to a world of delusion.Sorry elections have consequences Democracy has held together and the American people fired the representative of the Republic by a large majority.This time no authoritarian, despot,king has prevailed.God bless America,it will need it!
Yes, narciso!
How much todd woulda todd chuck chuck
If a todd chuck could chuck todd?
Mittens Romney: "NOW, can you like me, Democrats! PLEEEASE!?" Gets on knees and holds hands up like a puppy holding paws, and makes wimpering, begging sounds.
More specific evidence bullshit. Has there been any discovery in any of those cases? No. The complaints are all based on publically available data, generated by the defendants themselves. Actual ballots, signatures, machines, and source code have not been provided to the plaintiffs and access denied by the courts.
If there were some monetary incentive in this for members of the Romney family he would be all for it.
I got Judgement on Deltchev because the situation reminded me of that book. Essentially a good patriotic leader knowingly turns his nation over Communist dictators because he cannot take an extraordinary action. He knows the action that would save the country but he cannot get over the fact that liberals think elections are fair and therefore decisive although he knows the election will not be fair. He is a liberal and his view of reality, which is that things never go seriously wrong, paralyzes him. A Commie coup is enacted which ruins the election and takes over as the elected government. Deltchev ends up on trial and is executed and, as the book ends, his nation is going under the jackboot.
Here already, Pelosi has passed rules which deplatform members of the House and allow anonymous accusations if the accuser is a "whistleblower." At what point will Mitt acknowledge that democratic forms are being abused for anti-democratic purposes? Never. He's a Deltchev, a Pollyanna who can't say when things are going wrong. It's the Candy Crawley episode all over again - and he's not the only one.
Chuck Todd was so butthurt when His gal Hillary lost. This is Chuck's revenge.
Is this the same Chuck Todd that pushed a baseless and ultimately debunked Russia story that disrupted the Trump Administration for three years? The Russia lies paid for by the Dems?
The fact that Todd has a job just shows how corrupt the Fake News really is.
I'm thinking that the 10 day audit, if they can get it, could put all the claims to rest, and get Trump out of Cruz's way.
Win-win.
Cf. Tood's demand for proof prior to making allegation to his clownish behavior during the "Russian collusion" investigation.
BTW, if you want to see what it takes to get to the top of the heap of "non-partisan" political commenters, check out Todd's entry on wikipedia.
"The courts didn't examine the evidence"
Wisc supremes offered to hear the evidence but Trump team folded like a house of cards. Same in Pa.
The CCP must be laughing their asses off. It was so, easy to steal the election and put their puppet in. Pay Joe’s cokehead son a few million and then release a manmade virus on the world. The Dems and Fake News did the rest.
China owes us trillions in money damages. Biden won’t do a thing.
This is hard to believe what America has become. The Dems love money and power more than they love their country.
Fuck Romney. Fuck Todd. And fuck Biden and anyone who voted for him. Fuck ‘em all.
"Our system will survive a few challenges made according to the constitutional processes set in place by previous generations."
What are Democrats afraid of? If there was no fraud, an investigation won't find anything, right?
"Josh Hawley and Ted Cruz are perfect examples [of GOP elites]. Hawley graduated from Stanford and Yale Law School. He taught at Oxford and clerked for the Chief Justice of the United States. Ted Cruz graduated from Princeton and Harvard Law School. They have become completely faithless to their oaths and American democracy in the name of their ambition. They have no convictions, only self-interest." ~Steve Schmidt, The Lincoln Project
"Bring forward evidence." Ha!
I know from reading comments here since election day that Alito, Thomas, and Trump's 3 appointees will be hearing the evidence from the Barr DOJ to deliver the presidency back to Trump. As foretold by the wise televangelists.
Todd like schmidt didnt graduate from college he worked like a drone for red harkin then got into nbc somehow like a barnicle.
Burn it down.
By the way, where do I go for my money and power? The Trump family made it look fun.
I haven't heard anybody refute the stopping of the ballot count in a number of crucial states the night of the election. Is stopping the count on election night and going home a regular thing?
A most uncurious press.
The democrat's argument, as illustrated by Chuck Todd, is this: in order to prove legal fraud was committed in the presidential election one must prove not only the existence of fraud but also the identity of those who committed the fraud. If both are not proven, there is no fraud.
"Has ambition so eclipsed principle?"
In your case Mitt the answer would appear to be a solid yes.
The widespread piece is a bit of a red herring, or even a strawman. The fraud alleged took place in a handful of cities or states, so it wasn't really widespread. It it alleged, however, to have been quite large, large enough to change the outcome of the election, and therefore consequential. So I recommend we drop the widespread descriptor.
David Begley
As a lawyer, one would think that you are interested in the evidence, and that you make up your mind only after considering the evidence. Not the other way around. Tweets of Trump and Giuliani, and Lin Wood and Sidney Powell are not evidence. Nor are John Doe affidavits.
So what is the evidence of significant voter fraud?
"Mitt Romney would have been an excellent President. Maybe one of the most competent in the history of our beautiful nation."
He wasn't much of a governor.
Serious question. How many of you here knew about Hayes and the election of 1876 before this thread?
@Ken B - I knew. I read about it on various web sites and probably Twitter.
Ah Geez Chuckles--you didn't spout that kind of codswallopo when Hilary said "The russkies did it". As for Hayes and the disputed election of 1876- pre say 1970, anybody who paid attention in high school American history classes would have learned about it.
And Mittens---just go away.
Partisanship increases as power and money increase.
How many allegations against Trump were made by Todd regarding Russia that had not been (and ultimately never were) proven true?
How many of you here knew about Hayes and the election of 1876 before this thread?
Probably everybody except me.
Every time Willard opens his mouth, I'm glad he lost.
@I'm Not Sure said...
What are Democrats afraid of? If there was no fraud, an investigation won't find anything, right?
Wrong! 155 million Americans (a new record) voted, about 2 million poll workers processed ballot counts and recounts and all we have from poor-loser Trump and his minions is unprovable conspiracy claims that were dismissed in sixty-some lawsuits before 90 or so judges including the Supreme Court.
"the Lincoln project"
LOL - assholes, all.
'AND: Chuck Todd to Ron Johnson: "Stop! You don't get to make allegations that haven't been proven true."'
"Sentence first, verdict afterward!", was the Red Queen's peculiar approach to the law. The Democrat's media trolls have a different chant; "There can be no investigation until after the charges have been proven!".
Chuck Todd has never heard a lie he didn't long to tell.
"the widely perceived reality that Congress is an overwhelmingly partisan body"
WTF? It is a partisan body. It has to be. What kind of effing self-regarding a*$!#le do you have to be to use an obvious fact for moral grandstanding?
The question needs to be asked of these Republican senators: are they representing the views of their constituents? The answer for most of the "dissident" crew of Republican senators is "yes". Is Romney representing his constituents? I can't find a polling breakout by state, but I'm assuming in a state like Utah where Trump won 58% of the vote, there's a sizable fraction of his constituents who are wondering exactly what happened on election night.
Like the man who beat Mitt used to say, this is a "teachable moment." It could do a lot to shine the light on abuses and possibly improve election security.
1876 was a big deal back in 2001, but circumstances this time are even more similar to 1876 than they were 20 years ago.
Sure, Hawley and Cruz are GOP or conservative elites in terms of their educational backgrounds, but do you really want to be cite grifter-boob Steve Schmidt's opinion about anything as having any authority? Neither Hawley nor Cruz has ever sullied himself as much as Schmidt and his opportunistic crew have.
wild chicken:
Bullshit. No such thing happened in PA. The PA SC threw out any case filed before the election as no standing and the case brought 3 weeks after the election as not filed in a timely manner. If you think that's acceptable and not an outright violation of Trump's right to have their day in court, then you're just complicit in the steal.
Todd isn't even trying to pretend to be a reporter dispassionately seeking to report on the views of the Senator from Wisconsin. He is using the Senator's newsworthiness as an opportunity to put forth his own views, which he finds to be considerably more interesting than the Senator's. He has a lie, and he needs to tell it.
Romney should just switch parties now and get it over with...he's going to get a primary challenge if he stays an R.
We didn't start the fire
No, we didn't light it
But we tried to fight it
Sebastian: Of course, and at the same time, they insist that the 5 Democrat to 2 Republicans PA Supreme Court that illegally overwrite election law AND overruled every PA judge that ruled in Trump's favor isn't partisan in the slightest and we must submit to their decisions... in fact, their overrule of those decisions is held to mean that no judge ever ruled in Trump's favor at all.
And then they pretend to wonder and be outraged that folks think Civil War is the only remaining option.
Jake Tapper apparently called it "sedition" this morning.
He needs better writers. Perhaps non-ignorant writers.
First, sedition is not illegal under any federal law and the word does not appear in the US Code.
I did a word search a couple weeks ago when this first started being bandied about.
"Seditious Conspiracy" is illegal. 18 USC 2384
Since it is more than 1 senator, I guess it is technically a conspiracy.
But not a "seditious conspiracy" That requires the use of force.
If two or more persons in any State or Territory, or in any place subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, conspire to overthrow, put down, or to destroy by force the Government of the United States, or to levy war against them, or to oppose by force the authority thereof, or by force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States, or by force to seize, take, or possess any property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof, they shall each be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both.
Nobody, at least not on the president's side is talking about the use of any force. All they are talking about is exercising their legal rights.
How can that be seditious?
John Henry
"Mitt is just another government-corporate whore."
And there is a shit-ton of power and money if you're the 'McCain guy'...forever the swing voter...the world kisses your ass.
Standards on Russian collusion seem to be different for some reason. I note that Mr. Romney did not mention that the Democrats have objected to the electoral count in the last three elections where Republicans won.
How many of you here knew about Hayes and the election of 1876 before this thread?
Not me.
I guess the nurses haven't been around to hand out today's noon-time rations of lithium, judging by the shrieking bedlam above.
Steve Schmidt, The Lincoln Project
Co-Queen Bee of the Hive of Villainy and Scum.
Blogger Ken B said...
Serious question. How many of you here knew about Hayes and the election of 1876 before this thread?
Define "knew about"
I knew there was hanky panky in the Hayes election. I have read about it in the past.
So I knew about it. But if you had wanted me to say anything more than some hanky panky, well that was all I knew. I could not have told you what it was.
John Henry
Just press your bedside buzzer, Cook. The nurse will get to you ASAP.
The calculation that Romney would stand a better chance running against Biden or Kamala, in 2023, instead of waiting and hoping Trump would pick him after his second term, is not supposed to cross our minds?
It was the year of fire
The year of destruction
The year we took back what was ours
It was the year of rebirth
The year of great sadness
The year of pain
And a year of joy
It was a new age
It was the end of history
It was the year everything changed
The year is 2021
The place: The United States of America
I live across from the North Fulton Annex. It is an early and also Election Day site. I drove by this morning and there were several Leased Enterprise box trucks. There were all kinds of wheeled cases coming out and machines going in. I have no idea what was going on, So naturally I decided to walk in and check it out. I have this all recorded. As I was standing there, some woman told me to get out. I declined. She said I had to, I told her the was the entrance of a public building. At that moment some goon in a white t shirt came and told me to “get the duck out”. I said nope, and at that moment another guy came up, told me he was the supervisor and I had to leave. I said no, and next thing I know, I’m surrounded by several more goons yelling at me, with one of them losing his mind over me using the term “you people who are trying to intimidate me. Again, this is all recorded. The self described supervisor (He had no identification and refused to produce any) called 911. I waited and when the cop got here, the presumed supervisor said that I was trespassing and that he did not want to prosecute. I told the cop that he and his goons were attempting to intimidate me and that one had threatened me (Again, it’s recorded)
And that I did want to prosecute. The cop told me he would take a report.
I don’t really know what was happening, but the threats of physical violence and intimidation by the Fulton County election workers is noted. I called the Ga Republican voter fraud number when I got home. I told the guy what I had observed and the threats to me. I asked him if they had somebody in the building. He said no. It was the Sunday before the election and they were setting up as always. I asked him that in view of recent events did it not occur to them to have somebody there observing. He said no.
So that’s my election report from the cesspool of Sandy Springs. Citizen and voter intimidation is alive and well.
The fuck out. He told me to get the fuck out.
"These are far from it.... President Trump’s lawyers made their case before scores of courts; in every instance, they failed....
Alternative and truthful statement:
The courts have repeatedly refused to hear any suits, most often saying no one has any standing to challenge elections, followed by the excuse it's too late, and you couldn't do it before the election, it was too early.
Maybee, I agree Romney is an exceptionally competent (and incidentally a good man in his personal and business life). However neither is enough without "the vision thing" as GHBush put it. Bush 1 was a very competent man, his handling of the fall of the Soviet Union and the Color Revolutions was so brilliant that we hardly noticed how well it went until we got to contrast it with the Bosnian disaster and The Arab Spring. However, he was destroyed by our partisan press. Romney would have been the same. I think we're past the time for Bushes and Romneys if we're going preserve our way of life.
Wince said...
You see the game that's being played here.
Courts get to eschew ruling on the actual merits with doctrines such as "standing," "laches" and "political question", while Romney advocates that the political branch abdicate its role to the judiciary.
****************************
Double + 1.
Romney has a freaking Harvard law degree, yet he claims that courts have looked at the claims, which virtually none have, and certainly no federal court has.
If the courts won't act, who will?
Nice Quinn. Quote from Hitler in 1933?
Turn it the other way around.
Is there any reason to believe these elections are legitimate? Because I don't see it.
Have the supporters of this election addressed the issues that have been raised? Because I don't see it. I don't see it on this forum and I don't see it on other forums.
What I see is a constant avoidance of the issues.
The calculation that Romney would stand a better chance running against Biden or Kamala, in 2023, instead of waiting and hoping Trump would pick him after his second term, is not supposed to cross our minds?
If Romney thinks that he has a shot at the GOP nomination in 2024, he's delusional.
Batten down the laches ...
"Laches" replaces "standing" as the Word of the Month ...
"Laches" ... it's not just a dialogue by Plato any more ...
Readering said...
"By the way, where do I go for my money and power? The Trump family made it look fun."
Don't be facetious. Your a lawyer on the public arm. You get your money from the graft you legislate for. Hard work and original ideas make money. Are you capable of any of those?
Steve Uhr:
I’ve seen the ATL video. I read the Lott paper on Power Line. Rudy Giuliani says 200k fake votes in Dane County alone. I’m assuming that isn’t made up.
But much of the problem isn’t dead people, illegal aliens and double voters, but the pure legal questions presented in GA, WI and PA. I also read all 3 briefs in the case filed by TX and posted my analysis on my blog. Same for the PA case filed by Congressman Kelly.
The elections weren’t legally conducted in several states. The results are unreliable in 6 states. The results in those 6 states should be thrown out. Then vote in the House, by state, per the Constitution.
Romney voted Democrat before he realized he could have a political career in the Republican Party (and probably only in the Republican Party). He's a numbers guy. Not much people sense. Somehow, he just doesn't connect with people. I don't think his constituents are that mad at him, though. Many of them were only reluctantly for Trump.
We need to go back to the runner-up being Vice President. This crap wouldn't be such a problem if that were the case. Trump would become VP, and then be back in office once Biden's dementia forced the latter's resignation.
The courts, with their ponderous procrastination, have failed to realize a nation of people tyrannized by their own government officials is not willing to accept servitude, or starvation.
The courts have sunken into the depths of inconsequence. They gave up their power to provide justice, when they decided to legislate and ignore the founder's wish to limit the power of government.
Reader-
Trump is in the real estate and international hotel business.
That's not illegal.
What the Biden family does to make money - is illegal.
"Essentially, you're the arsonist here."
This coming from someone who spent the last four years trying to burn the house down.
This bullshit induces cold rage.
Fuck
All
These
Assholes
This isnt a game, yet they treat it as if it were.
There are millions of people who feel this and more. What comes after Trump is going to be much worse and they are incapable of understanding that they are the cause.
Delete this comment if you feel the need.
Posted before. Still amazingly prescient:
The National Interest
Donald Trump's Stealthy Road to Victory
Author: Graham Allison | November 6, 2020
'...As the counting of votes in Arizona, Georgia, and especially Pennsylvania continues, most of the press and punditry have concluded that Vice President Biden has won the 2020 election. Certainly, a substantial majority of the rest of us are suffering from “election fatigue” and eager for this drama to be over. Without disagreeing with the conventional wisdom about the final tally when all the legal votes are counted, I believe the current consensus is missing the fact that Trump has a second, viable stealthy road to victory. I’m reluctantly betting that the debate about who won will continue until at least January 6 when slates of electoral college members are opened in Washington, and most likely beyond that as whatever is decided then is appealed by the loser to the Supreme Court. My conclusion reflects the analysis of my colleague in the Applied History Network at the Belfer Center which is below.
As he notes, this stealthy road follows in the footsteps of a number of previous contested American elections, especially the 1876 election that pitted Tilden v. Hayes. Then as now, each state must decide on a group of electors to meet with a joint session of Congress on January 6 where the winner of the presidential election is declared. The normal practice in a state where Biden won the popular-vote total would be for state election officials to certify the results and send a slate of electors to Congress. But state legislatures have the constitutional authority to conclude that the popular vote has been corrupted and thus send a competing slate of electors on behalf of their state. The 12th Amendment to the Constitution specifies that the “President of the Senate shall, in the presence of the Senate and House of Representatives, open all the certificates and the votes shall then be counted.”
That means that in the case of disputes about competing electoral slates, the President of the Senate—Vice President Pence—would appear to have the ultimate authority to decide which to accept and which to reject...'
https://www.belfercenter.org/publication/donald-trumps-stealthy-road-victory
If Romney thinks that he has a shot at the GOP nomination in 2024, he's delusional.
@Mr. Wibble, IMHO he does and he is.
@chuck said...
Bah. What to do courts have to do with it? The courts didn't examine the evidence, they rejected the cases for lack of standing. The courts have taken taken themselves out of the picture. OTOH, the Constitution has a number of provisions for dealing with problem elections, so it seems to me perfectly legitimate for Congress to become involved. We are not a dikastocracy.
"little c" chuck:
Rule by judges is called kritarchy, also known as kritocracy, from the biblical Book of Judges.
What the courts have to do with this election was brought about by GOP lawyers visiting federal and state courthouses seeking relief for unproven conspiratorial claims. Most were given hearings but sorry, no proof was ever presented.
Next we have GOP attempting to turn the election by legislative maneuvers that will fail - and they know it. Just another "We got your back, past-President Trump, but we need your supporters votes in the 2024 presidential primary."
Mitt Romney is such a liar. Damn, why can't people see what a lying dishonest Clown this guy is. He's a Mormon Elmer Gantry. Biden got elected due to fraud. But Mittens doesn't care. Instead, electing a man based on fraud is the Moral Constitutional thing to do! Remember this is man, who was so shocked at a "Ukrainian telephone call" he had to talk to God, and impeach Trump. But Biden's Ukrainian corruption is A-OK with Mitt!
And then he gives us this Lie:
This argument ignores the widely perceived reality that Congress is an overwhelmingly partisan body; the American people wisely place greater trust in the federal courts where judges serve for life.
Hey, Mr. Dumbshit Romney, the SCOTUS said it was none of their business. The constitution gives the right to resolve election fraud DIRECTLY to the state legislatures and the US Congress. Even more laughable is the idea that we can Trust Breyer, Roberts, Kagan, and Sotomayor and the Obama Judges because they are "Appointed for life".
I am SO HAPPY, Mitt Romney lost in 2012. I shudder to think what this liberal democrat in Republican clothing would've done!
Dave — 200,000 fake votes in Dane County? So are you saying that the Biden total should be reduced by 200k. Or should the Biden total be reduced by 100k and the trump total increased by 100k. Please clarify. Tks.
Has anyone mentioned that Mitt Romney was offered a cabinet job by Joe Biden? It seems to have fallen through, because Biden could only put so many white men in his cabinet.
I have no idea why so many Republican Senators want to let a liberal Democrat steal the Presidency. But they've made it clear, they will stop at nothing to get Trump out of office, and they don't believe a word they said on the campaign trail about "Conservativism" and "Enforcing the law".
go read the report put out by Trump a week ago. IT goes into all the fraud in 1,000 ways.
I wish to never watch a Chuck Todd “interview” again, he seems constipated. Also Mitt Romney
Serious question. How many of you here knew about Hayes and the election of 1876 before this thread?
A long time ago I read Gore Vidal's 1876. Does that count? Actually, it counts whether you like it or not.
Thank God McCain is dead. Otherwise, he'd be leading the charge to get Biden fraudulently elected. And notice we've heard ZERO from George Bush, except his congratulations to Biden. This globalist fat-cat, like his brother Jeb, didn't say one word against Obama, but can't keep from sniping at Trump and helping the D's. Its clear that all their talk of the Republican Party being "a big tent" was just bullshit.
Mitt Romney - the liberal/left's Favorite Republican. Always ready to help them out and stab the R's in the back.
Thanks Utah!
In either case, trump would have won Dane County. I take it you have never been to Madison? Get real
Not only possible, but also probable. The very model of an allegation. The Fourth Estate needs to stop publishing truth to facts. That said, does it rise to a democratic majority? For when civil rights are denied... nay, aborted and sequestered, that is the question.
The treason in the Republican party goes deep. I was reading the McCain biography by Salter, and noticed the following names on McCain's 2008 VP "short list":
1) joe lieberman - liberal democrat
2) Bloomberg - liberal Democrat
3) charlie Crist - liberal democrat
4) Mitt Romney - RINO Traitor
5) Pawlenty - an actual Republican
6) Palin - the one conservative.
Chuck Todd might have the most punchable demeanor I've ever seen. How anyone can tolerate watching that smarmy asswipe look down his nose at the camera is beyond me.
Paul Ryan (Romney's VP) couldn't wait to sell us out and then leave for $$$ at Fox News and wall street. The treason goes deep.
I wouldn't piss on Chuck Todd, even if it caused him to grow 6 inches and no longer be a dwarf.
Presumably Democrat vote fraud is neither extreme nor unusual.
They have a legacy of playing with double-edged scalpels and exercising liberal license to indulge wicked solutions. So, no, it is not beyond their religious/ethical choice to normalize truths that speak to their facts.
“I guess the nurses haven't been around to hand out today's noon-time rations of lithium, judging by the shrieking bedlam above.”
The inmates are running the asylum. These election threads are becoming more deranged by the day. The nurses have left the facility.
All you need to know about the legitimacy of the election is that democrats are deathly afraid of a public investigation into how it was held and will do whatever they can to keep it from happening.
C'mon, man- if you didn't do anything wrong, why are you fighting so hard to keep what you did hidden?
"...You don't get to make allegations that haven't been proven true." No, John Brennan and Adam Schiff do.
The courts didn't examine the evidence but declined to take the case. Presumably they recognized that if the courts did, they might find fraud that would endanger the election.
But I suspect the real reason is that riots would follow. The Antifa and friends have had six months of practice in "peaceful protests" (/s) so are ready to sow chaos. Ordinary folks have jobs and family, and may not be ready to put up a fight.
to quote Hans Solo: Let the wookie win.
Mitt Romney would have been an excellent President.
I voted for him, and given the choice don't regret it.
However, I have come to the conclusion that, had he won, he would have kept the decks of the ship of state completely level as we headed for the iceberg.
By contrast, we have just had 4 years of wild tilts & yaws as the captain tries to fight his way to the wheel and steer away.
The basic nature and strength of the unique system of American politics is challenges, disagreement, fights. It's this that prevents overreach, dictatorship, and tyranny. There should always be challenges to keep things constantly readjusted and repaired. The facts get discovered, presented, and judged. Those who refuse to do that are suspect, as to why they want to weaken the American system. The only real difficulty should be judging the facts, not the mere discovery, presentation, or examination of them. We have only been able to do partial discovery and it has been stalled at that stage. The only reason for that is to avoid discovering the truth. Who fears the truth.
I voted for Romney, I donated to Romney. Fuck Romney!
Big Mike
I will count that. It certainly counts if you want to concede my claim. After all, that's a lot more than most Americans know.
In either case, trump would have won Dane County. I take it you have never been to Madison? Get real
I don't know how you can't see what's being alleged.
Of COURSE Trump didn't win Dane County. But if there are 200K more votes there than should be, even if you proportionally remove that amount based on the actual results in that county, wouldn't that put Trump over the top for the state of Wisconsin?
Think, Steve.
No wonder the cultists/lunatics are still ranting. The head lunatic keeps the fantasy alive.
‘I just want to find 11,780 votes’: In extraordinary hour-long call, Trump pressures Georgia secretary of state to recalculate the vote in his favor.
Where the votes cannot be certified. That said, audits are not egregious, but a Democrat mainstay, typically accompanied by extraordinary allegations of diversity (e.g. racism) to deny civil rights.
After all, that's a lot more than most Americans know.
... he said. And then he turned and sat down to what he knew best... a plate of smoked meat, cheese and a six-pack of Molson...
Inga - who are you trying to persuade here? Stop posting links to WaPo. They're consummate liars and everyone here knows it. No one is going to take seriously a single link to that rag.
Rudy Giuliani says 200k fake votes in Dane County alone. I’m assuming that isn’t made up.
Well then you are an idiot. Approximately 350,000 votes were cast in Dane County. So you believe that 200,000 of them were fraudulent out of a total of 260,000 for Biden (which BTW would have meant Trump won one of the most liberal counties in Wisconsin, hell, the entire midwest)?
Iman - you forgot the back-bacon...
Well then you are an idiot. Approximately 350,000 votes were cast in Dane County. So you believe that 200,000 of them were fraudulent out of a total of 260,000 for Biden (which BTW would have meant Trump won one of the most liberal counties in Wisconsin, hell, the entire midwest)?
I'm someone who works with math on a daily basis, but I'm not understanding the math here. Where are your numbers coming from?
“Inga - who are you trying to persuade here?”
Not the lunatics, certainly. There is no arguing with cultists. Newsflash, there are others besides Trump cultists who read Althouse’s blog.
Damn it, I’m well off my game!
And speaking of being off his game, ladies, gents and shims, I give you Patterico:
http://patterico.com/2021/01/03/the-house-of-representatives-should-impeach-donald-trump-again-right-now/
http://patterico.com/2021/01/02/unamerican-senators-proudly-proclaim-their-intent-to-challenge-the-results-of-a-free-and-fair-election/
Happy Gascon, Patterico!
“Of course Trump didn’t win Dane County”. I didn’t say he did. That would be Dave Begley. Or is he saying that a significant number of the 200k fake votes were for Trump? Competing fraudsters.
But let’s move on. What is the evidence there were 200k fake votes in Dane County? Something I can look at?
I didnt realize he had dialed to 12 lol.
OK, so I pulled Dane County election counts for 2016 and 2020:
2016: Hillary 218K, Trump 71K
2020: Biden 260K, Trump 79K
Hard to see how 200K votes were manufactured, unless the argument is that it happened in both years. I'm just trying to understand the assertion.
I Callahan said...
Hard to see how 200K votes were manufactured, unless the argument is that it happened in both years. I'm just trying to understand the assertion.
1/3/21, 2:00 PM
The Trump campaign attempted to have 220K ineligible votes removed in Milwaukee and Dane Counties. Some were fraudulent, some simply ineligible to be counted due to a variety of problems. The problem with social media is that it balloons into "200K fraudulent votes in Dane County."
“Well then you are an idiot. Approximately 350,000 votes were cast in Dane County. So you believe that 200,000 of them were fraudulent out of a total of 260,000 for Biden (which BTW would have meant Trump won one of the most liberal counties in Wisconsin, hell, the entire midwest)?”
“I'm someone who works with math on a daily basis, but I'm not understanding the math here. Where are your numbers coming from?”
In Dane County nearly 345,604 votes — about 80% of the county’s voting-age population — were counted Tuesday night with all precincts reporting results. In 2016, about 311,000 votes were cast.
So it’s a rational and sane allegation that 200,000 Dane County votes went to Trump? That Biden only got 60,000 votes in Dane County? What lunacy.
I'm so old I remember when dissent was the highest form of patriotism.
Patterico’s Pontifications appeal is becoming much more selective, narciso.
Much more...
The inmates are running the asylum. These election threads are becoming more deranged by the day. The nurses have left the facility.
You stupid fucks screamed for three years about non-existent Russian collusion and you have the balls to call us insane?
So it’s a rational and sane allegation that 200,000 Dane County votes went to Trump? That Biden only got 60,000 votes in Dane County? What lunacy.
Try reading my most recent comments, Inga, and you won't be so quick to knee-jerk.
In 2016 many of the same voting laws were in effect in WI, that are now being touted as illegal. Why did Trump accept the election results in WI without a peep in 2016?
Chuck Todd to Ron Johnson: "Stop! You don't get to make allegations that haven't been proven true."
That's Chuck Todd's job and he won't have anyone interfering.
Any direct evidence of fraud was done away with by excluding poll watchers.
Laches have consequences.
What Giuliani actually said was that 60,000 votes in Milwaukee and 40,000 votes in Dane County were illegal and should be tossed. You can see that, wherever this "200,000 votes in Dane" came from, it is a strawman that our resident lefties are utterly delighted to smack down, having utterly failed in the last 7 weeks to actually debunk a single allegation honestly described.
I'm someone who works with math on a daily basis, but I'm not understanding the math here. Where are your numbers coming from?
From the Dane County Clerks Office
Qwinn - that makes more sense to me.
So if Giuliani is lying about Dane County, why should I believe anything he says absent hard evidence?
Blogger Big Mike said...
A long time ago I read Gore Vidal's 1876. Does that count? Actually, it counts whether you like it or not.
I'd forgotten all about that book. I read it in about 1976. I remember liking it but not a lot of detail other than Washington intrigue.
That got me to read the prequel Burr and I REALLY liked that book.
Just downloaded samples of both.
Thanks for reminind me of them.
John Henry
Let's apply the leftist George Floyd rule to voter fraud. If there is one case then it is systemic and should be rioted about until addressed.
The kind of statistical anomalies that have been found to occur just don't happen in real life unless there was some kind of interference. They are theoretically possible, but incredibly unlikely. The lack of voter ID in many locations, minimal signature verification, and last-minute implementation of high-volume mail-in ballots make fraud much less risky, which then makes it inherently more likely. The problem is that it is also close to impossible to prove, especially in the time frame that is being considered.
The problem is that judges perceive fraudulent votes as sacred votes. Sacred votes exceed the rule of law and require special dispensation.
Your normally strict judge wanting to use small technicalities to set an "example for all" gets all mushy when it comes to sacred voting. The opposite effect is achieved though.
There should be one judicial setting to looks at all these fraud claims and evaluates them. Physical and statistical.
Giuliani hasn't lied about Dane County, Steve.
You're lying about what Giuliani said.
And by your own logic, since you are lying about what Giuliani said, there is no reason to believe anything else you say.
Repubs trying to show their hand, dems, like 4 year old saying "NA AH to your UH HA". We say lets see. No evidence allowed. Trump, the most examined president in history is not the one with BULLSHIT for "evidence". Dems haven't had "evidence" YET!
“Blogger David Begley said...
Steve Uhr:
I’ve seen the ATL video. I read the Lott paper on Power Line. Rudy Giuliani says 200k fake votes in Dane County alone. I’m assuming that isn’t made up.”
———————————-
‘What Giuliani actually said was that 60,000 votes in Milwaukee and 40,000 votes in Dane County were illegal and should be tossed. You can see that, wherever this "200,000 votes in Dane" came from, it is a strawman that our resident lefties are utterly delighted to smack down, having utterly failed in the last 7 weeks to actually debunk a single allegation honestly described.”
Inga said...
‘What Giuliani actually said was that 60,000 votes in Milwaukee and 40,000 votes in Dane County were illegal and should be tossed. You can see that, wherever this "200,000 votes in Dane" came from, it is a strawman that our resident lefties are utterly delighted to smack down, having utterly failed in the last 7 weeks to actually debunk a single allegation honestly described.”
1/3/21, 2:32 PM
Exactly so, Inga.
You folks need to keep your talking points straight.
Qwinn sez...
“Giuliani hasn't lied about Dane County, Steve.
You're lying about what Giuliani said.
And by your own logic, since you are lying about what Giuliani said, there is no reason to believe anything else you say.”
—————————-
Blogger David Begley said...
Steve Uhr:
I’ve seen the ATL video. I read the Lott paper on Power Line. Rudy Giuliani says 200k fake votes in Dane County alone. I’m assuming that isn’t made up.”
————————
Unlike all of you, I have worked in elections in Georgia since 1988, represented Trump in a major district, continued to support him in 2020, and ran for a state house seat, which requires intense analysis of demographic change, polling, fraud, party perfidy, and all the rest. Screw the GOP. Also screw the leftitarian retards who lost us one Senate seat, and Doug Collins, who lost us the other one by playing a Trump supporter on TV while opposing him in 2016. As I sat next to him, a Trump delegate in his district, the 9th. You want to dump some angst on someone? Call Doug Collins, that bitter, pathetic, dishonest liar. And while you're at it, go after Bannon, Fredricks, and the other buffoons trying to crash the system for personal hobbyhorses.
There was leftist election fraud. There is always fraud in Fulton and DeKalb and Clayton and other areas of the state such as Savannah.
Yet we completely and utterly failed to prove it. We failed to do the things necessary to prove it. We dumbly demonized our strongest conservative allies and fell for garbage from shiny objects like Steve Bannon and John Fredricks and anyone else who said they're a patriot while idiotically being manipulated and paid off by by Hong Kong millionaires, the ACLU, the Koch/Soros Axis, and other assorted scum.
We have only ourselves to blame for our failures. Grow up. Blow your nose. Learn something from your mistakes, and get the fuck to work saving the Senate tomorrow. Or, at the very least, STFU and let the adults try to salvage what you broke through sheer self-indulgence.
I have read every lawsuit and every exhibit, and we have nothing. Grow up.
Okay, I should have checked the Dane County vote totals. I just repeated what Rudy said.
Maybe he said 20k. Maybe he was off by half. But the big thing is that there is little doubt that all sorts of cheating went on in Dane County. That's what Dems do.
The above example is why the pure legal question approach is much preferable to getting into the weeds on how many dead people voted or whatever.
From reading the TX briefs, it is clear that PA, WI and GA plainly violated both federal and state law when Executive Branch officials changed the time, manner and place of the elections. Only the state legislature can do so.
The PA and WI Supreme Court decisions were total abortions. Corrupt to the core. The PA case cooked up laches. The WI decision was 4-3. I wish Ann had analyzed it, but she doesn't care to. I do recall the younger woman Dem marathon runner Justice, in oral argument, babbling about racial justice or racism. A complete joke.
I learned from Prof John Eastman, one of Trump's lawyers, that serious GA cases that the campaign has filed have NOT even been assigned a judge. Total corruption.
The judiciary doesn't have the stones to act so the states or the VP will have to act.
I'm informed by Rudy or someone else on Steve Bannon's War room broadcast that competing Trump electors have been sent in from 7 states. At the same time, Rudy and Bannon are begging the state legislatures to act. So, I don't know what's really true.
But I can see in my mind's eye that after the debate in the Senate, Pence refuses to count the Electoral College votes from the 6 disputed states. He'll say that the results are unreliable and the elections, in some states, were not regular and conducted per state law.
Pence will then announce the tally and it will be short of a majority. Feder can give you the numbers. Per the constitution, the vote will be thrown into the House and all 50 states will have one vote per state. Therefore, the 6 states aren't disenfranchised. We know that Trump will win that vote because the GOP has the majority of House delegations.
Schumer will promptly stroke out on the floor of the Senate.
Mike Pence can either be a constitutional hero for the Republic or another worthless VP.
Begley sez...
“I just repeated what Rudy said.”
Qwinn sez Rudy never said that! LIES I tells ya!
The fraud was obvious, I live in Georgia so have paid particular attention to what happened in Fulton County. If going through a process that is set out in the Constitution is considered sedition, then I think the country is done. Let's skip all the rest of the brouhaha and go straight to the war. I'm not getting any younger.
If you're clean... No Worries! However. I can smell your fear.
“Inga said...
‘What Giuliani actually said was that 60,000 votes in Milwaukee and 40,000 votes in Dane County were illegal and should be tossed. You can see that, wherever this "200,000 votes in Dane" came from, it is a strawman that our resident lefties are utterly delighted to smack down, having utterly failed in the last 7 weeks to actually debunk a single allegation honestly described.”
NO, Inga didn’t say that, Qwinn said that. Sheesh you folks are getting all your “evidence” and who said what mixed up. It would be funny, but...
remember the Walker recall? Petitions were flying around. As I recall I made the bold statement that at least 10% of those signatures were fraudulent. I was off by a factor of two. 20% + or_ were fraudulent or couldn't be verified. Now you expect us to believe that the vote in Dane county was as pure as the driven snow? I don't think so. You're democrats. You're liars. And cheats.
Let's for arguments sake that there are 350,000 registered voters in Dane County. How many of those registered voters were alive at the time they voted? How many of those left are human? How many of those that are human are registered more than once. How many actually live in Dane County? In Wisconsin? In the United States? How many voted more than once? How many that voted are convicted felons. How many were paid to vote?
If you are interested in finding out if there was vote fraud and if you're an honest person I think you are. Let's audit the votes in Dane County. Let's match every vote to a voter. Let's make sure every legal vote was counted. Who would be against that?
Also, in reference to the data dumps, in every single election in Georgia, the hard majority-democrat districts always report late, after all the GOP votes are counted. The pattern did not deviate this time, and it wasn't strange.
Jesus wept, stop listening to pundits who know nothing about Georgia politics and start listening to proved conservatives in the state. We know we lost. We lost because of demographic change. That's the real conspiracy. Get a grip. Imagine taking the hard social steps to say the hard social things needed to be said to tell the truth about the situation.
Again, grow a spine. Population replacement lost Georgia, just like it lost Virginia, just like it lost California. We knew it was coming. Stop jacking off to fantasies of easy solutions to a difficult and unpleasant reality. And gather the courage to face the truth and articulate it.
Inga said...
“I guess the nurses haven't been around to hand out today's noon-time rations of lithium, judging by the shrieking bedlam above.”
The inmates are running the asylum. These election threads are becoming more deranged by the day. The nurses have left the facility.
*******************
As long as "Nurse Ratched" Inga left after cleaning out the bedpans, that's fine.
Inga said...
“Inga said...
‘What Giuliani actually said was that 60,000 votes in Milwaukee and 40,000 votes in Dane County were illegal and should be tossed. You can see that, wherever this "200,000 votes in Dane" came from, it is a strawman that our resident lefties are utterly delighted to smack down, having utterly failed in the last 7 weeks to actually debunk a single allegation honestly described.”
NO, Inga didn’t say that, Qwinn said that. Sheesh you folks are getting all your “evidence” and who said what mixed up. It would be funny, but...
_________________________________________________
Why should I assume that? I copied the post you made at 2:32. You didn't quote Qwinn as saying that, so it's pretty clear that you agreed with it.
Unless you just made a mistake, but given your current pettifogging? Let the gander accept the sauce for the goose.
1/3/21, 2:44 PM
Holy fucking shit.
Trump, on a recorded phone call, telling the Georgia Secretary of State, Republican Brad Raffensperger, to "find" enough votes to make Trump the "winner" of the state's electoral votes. And threatening that the Georgians had engaged in criminal acts.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/video/politics/audio-trump-berates-ga-secretary-of-state-urges-him-to-find-votes/2021/01/03/aba64f5f-8c3c-490f-af34-618ccea732d7_video.html
What I'd like to know is whether Trump and Raffensperger discussed Trump's having just four days ago re-Tweeted the false and fraudulent claim that Raffensperger's "brother" was engaged in part of an election fraud, having worked for China...
https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/30/politics/ga-sos-brother-trump-tweet-fact-check/index.html
Tina Trent tried changing the subjec, when she said:
Again, grow a spine. Population replacement lost Georgia, just like it lost Virginia, just like it lost California. We knew it was coming. Stop jacking off to fantasies of easy solutions to a difficult and unpleasant reality. And gather the courage to face the truth and articulate it.
********************
Explain Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, and Michigan.
Grow some neurons while you're at it.
Tina Trent: Not one person claiming fraud I have heard has made an issue of urban districts "reporting late". Complete strawman. What we have brought up is the completely unprecedented stopping of the count on election night, then kicking every watcher out, then resuming the count without supervision and running the same batch of blots through the scanner 3 times. On fucking video.
If your "research" amounted to "debunking" an argument no one has made that urban districts reporting late alone counts as fraud, no wonder you think there's no evidence. You don't even know what the evidence is, and your conclusions are shit. YOU grow the fuck up and get the evidence from the people making the allegations, not the people invested in lying and erecti g strawman to deflect them. Idiotic.
This seems to be the bottom line:
Democrats have always cheated in urban counties in IL, NY and CA (where it makes no difference) GA, PA, WI and others where it makes a difference. However, Republicans have never been able to stop the cheat. So the only difference in this election was the size of the cheat.
Was this cheat big enough to swing a POTUS election? I suspect we will never know because there have always been hundreds of thousands of fraudulent votes and no one has ever been able to do anything about it. So what if we had a few million fraudulent votes. If the Republicans try to fix things they will be accused of ... wait for it ...
You got it ... racist voter suppression.
Ms Trent, read my post earlier in this thread about being at the North Fulton Annex this morning. I’ve since spoken with a Republican voter fraud hotline guy, who told me they are not allowed to have anybody in there while those thuggish apparatchiks do whatever the hell they’re doing. I cannot believe theRepublican party of Georgia don’t have anybody there.
"I have read every lawsuit and every exhibit, and we have nothing. Grow up."
Really?!! If you talk about what is right and wrong, what is clearly and outrageously wrong. Well then there is a staggering amount of evidence! How do you not see that!
But if you're about forcing a corrupt, left-wing judge to rule against the process, well, yes, of course. Who would ever be able to pass that standard?! Be real!
Why should anyone care what the junior senator from some nothing western state says about anything?
“Why should I assume that? I copied the post you made at 2:32. You didn't quote Qwinn as saying that, so it's pretty clear that you agreed with it.”
I guess you don’t know what quotation marks are used for. I used quotations marks when I quoted Qwinn. That should’ve given you a hint.
Tina Trent said...
"I have read every lawsuit and every exhibit, and we have nothing. Grow up."
Mandrewa said...
“Really?!! If you talk about what is right and wrong, what is clearly and outrageously wrong. Well then there is a staggering amount of evidence! How do you not see that!”
But, but, but conspiracy theories are ever so much more believable than the truth, eh?
I am sure that Tina Trent will also tell us about how the error logs from the Antrim Co. MI voting machines showing an 84% ballot scan error rate, when the maximum allowable error rate permitted by the FEC is 0.008%, is easily explained by shifting demographics.
Moronic.
Inga said...
I guess you don’t know what quotation marks are used for. I used quotations marks when I quoted Qwinn. That should’ve given you a hint.
1/3/21, 3:08 PM
Qwinn's name isn't there. Why should anyone assume you're offering his opinion instead of your own?
Perhaps you made a mistake, as Dave Begley did with Giuliani, but I'm content to keep hitting you until you explain it better than Dave did.
Inga, you never argue in good faith. I've never seen you do it.
"Psychological projection is a defense mechanism people subconsciously employ in order to cope with difficult feelings or emotions. Psychological projection involves projecting undesirable feelings or emotions onto someone else, rather than admitting to or dealing with the unwanted feelings." -google.
“Inga, you never argue in good faith. I've never seen you do it.”
That is your opinion. I am not required to believe what you say, because you too are in the grips of a cult and fall prey to conspiracy theories like the rest of the loons here.
Um, I think the video of the Fulton County election workers running the same ballots through the machines late at night after dismissing observers is proof of fraud.
Problem is, there were very real and consequential problems with this presidential election, starting with the excessive mail-in balloting. As Americans, we need to have enough faith in the system to agree to participate as lawful citizens who accept the result and recognize that the winner will have the commensurate power whether we voted for them or not. Cheaters should never win. We all know that. Let’s get the data, subject it to cross examination, and see what really happened here.
Blogger Mark said...
Why should anyone care what the junior senator from some nothing western state says about anything?
Point well taken, but that nothing western state sends in just as many Senators as those consequential eastern states.
"The problem is that judges perceive fraudulent votes as sacred votes. Sacred votes exceed the rule of law and require special dispensation."
Everyone talks about how 'sacred' voting is, and how it's a 'civic duty,' but nobody really treats it that way.
To be able to vote, a citizen should (in a sane world) have to pass the most vigorous of hurdles. It should be incredibly difficult to cast a vote.
I don't want the illiterate masses voting.
The fact that the crack addict living on the street in a cardboard box can cancel my vote is appalling to me and it should be to you.
Instead, it's no harder than an 18-year-old buying a 6-pack of beer at 7-11, and in many ways much easier.
This is how you lose a country.
I haven't really paid a lot of attention to Wisconsin. But, just guessing, here are the issues:
1) Were the laws that the Wisconsin State Legislature passed that govern how the election was to be conducted obeyed?
And I will guess that the answer is no. And it's a really big no with a lot of votes impacted. And I will also guess that the violations were inordinately concentrated in the City of Milwaukee and Dane County.
2) The City of Milwaukee has a number of districts where somehow an inordinate percentage of the voters 'voted' that is totally out-of-line with what other counties around the state reported and it is also even more out-of-line with other indicators of civic participation in these districts that we would expect to see if those votes were legitimate.
3) (Now I heard about this one.) Every voter is supposed to present some minimal evidence as to who they are and where they reside in Wisconsin, but there is a special category which amounts to basically anonymous voting, which I forget the rationale for, but it's supposed to be a tiny number of people, except in Dane County it blew up into a huge number of people -- and it was a very intentional corruption of the vote by the Dane County government.
I recall reading Burr in high school and liking it. It’s on my Kindle for a reread. Might add the 1876 one.
Vidal's Lincoln is good too.
We learned that stuff in in high school in American History. Standards seem ... different ... in your country.
4) And then on top of that there is the whole issue with Dominion Voting Systems in Wisconsin, which I do believe is a real thing, but I can understand why the typical person really doesn't understand this or want to believe there is a problem here.
So regardless of how strong the evidence is that there is a huge potential for fraudulent voting created and enabled by the voting software, this is still the last thing to go to from the practical perspective of persuading most people that there is something hugely wrong about our elections.
“1) Were the laws that the Wisconsin State Legislature passed that govern how the election was to be conducted obeyed?”
Yes.have you listened to the Arguments presented before the Wisconsin Supreme Court? That’s a good place to start.
“And I will guess that the answer is no. And it's a really big no with a lot of votes impacted. And I will also guess that the violations were inordinately concentrated in the City of Milwaukee and Dane County.”
Wrong. Dane County and Milwaukee County followed election laws that had been in use for years, as did every county in Wisconsin.
“2) The City of Milwaukee has a number of districts where somehow an inordinate percentage of the voters 'voted' that is totally out-of-line with what other counties around the state reported and it is also even more out-of-line with other indicators of civic participation in these districts that we would expect to see if those votes were legitimate.”
Where are you getting this from. Name sources, cites, proof.
“3) (Now I heard about this one.) Every voter is supposed to present some minimal evidence as to who they are and where they reside in Wisconsin, but there is a special category which amounts to basically anonymous voting, which I forget the rationale for, but it's supposed to be a tiny number of people, except in Dane County it blew up into a huge number of people -- and it was a very intentional corruption of the vote by the Dane County government.”
Wrong again. Wisconsin has “absentee in person voting” which is just another name for early voting, if this is what you are referring to. The early voter presents ID to the Municipal Clerk before casting their vote.
In-Person Absentee (Early) Voting Starts Today
Blogger Lem said...
I haven't heard anybody refute the stopping of the ballot count in a number of crucial states the night of the election. Is stopping the count on election night and going home a regular thing?
A most uncurious press.
I was up still at that hour and was astounded to hear that they were doing it. Add to that the water leak in Atlanta that was supposed to hold up the count for 4 hours but apparently ending up being a single leaking toliet. Lots of little stories that made no sense but with no one following up on them.
My expectation is that some of the actors in this scenario will not be able to keep the secret for long and we will start hearing the "rest of the story" in a year or so as they brag. Think of how Ben Rhodes just had to tell everyone how young reporters only knew what the administration told them in the Iran deal. Or the reporter who followed the Clinton campaign in 2016 but waited to her book came out a year or two later to mention that Clinton's "deplorables" comment was used frequently prior to it blowing up.
This whole election has been so bizarre, I half expect "them" to make their move to get Joe Biden to step down and accidentally ensnare Kamala Harris in the fallout so neither is president at the beginning of 2024. Who become the Gerald Ford then?
Blogger Lem said...
I haven't heard anybody refute the stopping of the ballot count in a number of crucial states the night of the election. Is stopping the count on election night and going home a regular thing?
A most uncurious press.
I was up still at that hour and was astounded to hear that they were doing it. Add to that the water leak in Atlanta that was supposed to hold up the count for 4 hours but apparently ending up being a single leaking toliet. Lots of little stories that made no sense but with no one following up on them.
My expectation is that some of the actors in this scenario will not be able to keep the secret for long and we will start hearing the "rest of the story" in a year or so as they brag. Think of how Ben Rhodes just had to tell everyone how young reporters only knew what the administration told them in the Iran deal. Or the reporter who followed the Clinton campaign in 2016 but waited to her book came out a year or two later to mention that Clinton's "deplorables" comment was used frequently prior to it blowing up.
This whole election has been so bizarre, I half expect "them" to make their move to get Joe Biden to step down and accidentally ensnare Kamala Harris in the fallout so neither is president at the beginning of 2024. Who become the Gerald Ford then?
“4) And then on top of that there is the whole issue with Dominion Voting Systems in Wisconsin, which I do believe is a real thing, but I can understand why the typical person really doesn't understand this or want to believe there is a problem here.”
Dominion machines were not used in Dane and Milwaukee Counties.
“US Rep. Gallagher also knocked down baseless claims that Dominion Voting System machines somehow flipped votes from Trump to Biden.
"We have 19 counties that use Dominion systems, Trump increased his vote by about 60,000 in those counties and Biden increased them by 47,000, so Trump netted about 15K votes," Gallagher said. "So if Dominion was tampered with in Wisconsin it didn't help Biden all that much."
Jake Tapper is part of the cover up. You'll never see him, or anyone else of the MSM say "Republicans say that [fill in the blank] happened. Here's why that's not true..." All they say is [fill in the blank] is baseless. Well, Joe Biden won a baseless election.
"Wrong again. Wisconsin has “absentee in person voting” which is just another name for early voting, if this is what you are referring to. The early voter presents ID to the Municipal Clerk before casting their vote."
I'm not talking about early absentee voting or anything where an ID was presented.
So you live in Wisconsin. You talk about politics all the time. And somehow you've never heard of this?!!
Now let's suppose you've heard of it. Will it change your mind in any way if I show you that you've got it wrong? Or will you just immediately drop the subject, go on to something else, and worse, a month from now you will be back to talking like you never ever heard of this.
Because that would be my prediction. It is what I expect to see.
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