August 14, 2020

"That’s what real leadership looks like. We just witnessed real leadership, which is Joe Biden said that as a nation, we should all be wearing a mask for the next three months..."

"... so what real leadership looks like is Joe Biden to speak up, sometimes telling us the stuff that we don’t necessarily want to hear, but we need to know. And the need for this mandatory mask wearing will also be about what Joe has articulated....  So again, Joe Biden is about real leadership in our country, and I’m honored to be with you, Joe."

Said Kamala Harris, after taking off her mask to speak into the microphone into which Joe Biden had just spoken. He too took off his mask before speaking. I thought it was funny that she kept saying he's what "real leadership looks like," when we were looking at him without his mask as he was saying "every single American should be wearing a mask when they’re outside for the next three months at a minimum."

Transcript. Video.

To be fair, they were inside. My understanding is that the virus is more dangerous inside, but they want every American to wear a mask all the time when they're outside. I don't know why everyone would be asked to wear a mask everywhere outside in America. What if you're in your own backyard and there's no one else around or working on your rural property or in the backwoods somewhere? I guess they want a simple rule, one size fits all, and they're thinking about the crowded cities where their voters reside. Or maybe they think people are too dumb to apply a standard that's anything but a flat rule. Maybe they're hoping to irritate Middle America and cause the deplorables to act out and say stupid things.

I'll just focus in on Harris's last line. The delivery is astoundingly insincere — the boredom, the smirk, the rush to get the hell out of there...



... so bizarrely inconsistent with the "what leadership looks like" theme.

ADDED: The real reason for the statement "every single American should be wearing a mask when they’re outside for the next three months at a minimum"? I think it's a set up for an accusation that will be made against Trump in the coming months.
If the president had acted sooner, just one week earlier, it would have saved 30-some-thousand lives. Two weeks earlier, I think it was 51,000 or 57,000 lives. I hope we’ve learned a lesson. Hope the president has learned a lesson, but again, this is not about Democrat, Republican or independent. It’s about saving America’s lives, so let’s Institute a mass mandate nationwide starting immediately, and we will save lives. The estimates are we’ll save over 40,000 lives in the next three months if that is done.
That is, Biden said on Thursday, everybody start wearing masks all the time now. He's not President, so we're in imagination land, where everyone took the order from the President and masks were worn, and you can make up the number 40,000 and say that 40,000 people died because President Trump didn't say what Joe Biden said. Watch for that number.

ALSO: Here are Joe and Kamala exposing themselves to reporters long enough to make the shooing away of reporters look awkward. The one question we hear is a ludicrous softball:

193 comments:

Leland said...

Authoritarianism is what leadership looks like to Kamala, see also her record as DA and AG of locking up innocent people with faulty evidence.

Michael K said...

At least we are not in Melbourne AUS. That is the Biden future if it happens.

Lucid-Ideas said...

The kinds of people that cheer something like this are the kinds of people that are wearing masks by themselves in their cars and their homes.

Every time I see these people wearing a mask driving alone I wonder if they lay in bed alone wearing a condom.

rcocean said...

If you maintain social distancing - 6 feet - you don't need to wear a mask, and that's 10x more true when you're out of doors. Masks don't protect you, they protect other people FROM YOU. I see people wearing masks while running or biking alone. I see them wearing masks INSIDE their own cars. I see them wearing masks, while they water their own lawns! What the hell do they think they're accomplishing?

BTW, the POTUS doesn't have the power to require people to wear masks, and the USA is a huge country and one size does NOT Fit all. What's good for NYC, is not good for rural Wyoming.

roesch/voltaire said...

Well yes he should have said when their outside in public, but I am sure there a good people on both sides of this issue.

danoso said...

Back in the 1988 Dem debate Sen Tom Harkin was asked what he'd like to implement as President. His answer - fuel efficient light bulbs. Freakin' light bulbs. And he was so pleased with himself, looked a toddler after dropping his first dook.

So Biden wants to use the power of the State to force people into masks 24/7, several weeks after the virus as peaked. That's his big idea? The real President is making peace deals, and this dim bulb wants to make life more miserable for people without any appreciable benefit. But that's leadership, according to Knee Pads.

Inga said...

I’m going to translate Biden the way some translate Trump: Maybe Biden meant people should wear masks when outside their own homes.

I don’t see the need to wear a mask when outside and following some distancing.

chickelit said...

Mandatory masks for everyone outdoors at all times is an excercise in government control. It's about how Chinese can we be. It's about bringing America to heel, not to heal.

Larry J said...

So, the people of South Dakota (whose nearest neighbor can be miles away) would have to act the same as people in a New York City subway? That's stupid. Risk is relative to many conditions, but ignorant people like Joe Biden want to mandate behavior as if risk was constant everywhere. This is as dumb as that Wisconsin office that wanted people teleconferencing from their homes to wear masks to "set an example". The example they're setting is of epic stupidity.

gspencer said...

This is sooooo serious, and the Democrats have convinced me that the virus is around every corner in my house.

I now wear a mask when I'm sleeping. I'm sure it lurks under my bed.

Kevin said...

Leadership was shutting down flights from China while being called a Xenophobe.

Biden was not up for that.

Ice Nine said...

The word you want here is "perfunctory."

That woman has a constant nasty edge to her. It is the personality equivalent of the physiognomic "resting bitch face." She can't escape it - because *it is her*. It will not sell well...as we already know from the primaries. What were the Democrats thinking?!

Sebastian said...

"The delivery is astoundingly insincere"

This is news? Harris accused Biden of racism and assault, and now happily joins his ticket. Sincerity, schmincerity.

BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

forcing everyone to wear a mask is leadership?

Trump's answer was correct- Let each state governor handle it.

The media will consider Kamala giving Biden a diaper change and feeding him his soft cereal - real leadership!

BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

Leftists are natural totalitarians and tyrants.

Do as they say. Never mind Hunter and the family grift.

Lexington Green said...

This is a way to lose votes.
It’s bossy, it’s idiotic, it makes normal people engaging in normal behavior into c
law breakers, which is the whole idea.
I hope they keep it up.

ConradBibby said...

If the person ostensibly providing the real leadership feels the need to label it "real leadership," then it's not real leadership. Real leadership would speak for itself, right? And it would automatically entice people to go along with whatever plan or idea was being promoted. (I doubt that the mere announcement that Biden wants a nationwide, across-the-board mask mandate will now create a huge groundswell of popular support for that idea.) This is just some banal, transparent attempt at appearing to be relevant -- definitely not real leadership.

traditionalguy said...

Dem Progressive Leaders are all REMFs.

BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

As soon ad Biden and Kamala take over - after lots of extra counting.... the corona virus will be a thing of the past. Even if it's still out there making people sick, or killing them.

Kevin said...

The delivery is astoundingly insincere — the boredom, the smirk, the rush to get the hell out of there...

She ripped him in the debates when he wasn't the frontrunner.

She's said she believes he sexually assaulted a member of his staff.

She has no intention of submitting to his "leadership" for four years.

Her team is working out how many hours after the election results she needs to wait until she can have him declared incompetent.

AlbertAnonymous said...

Everything about Joey an Blowey is fake, phony, inauthentic, political BS. And laughably so.

The country is a mess, systemically unfair and needs to be dismantled, reimagined, fixed, whatever.
But Joe has a 40 year record in the Senate, another 8 as VP. What was he doing? Why isn’t it fixed? But now he’s gonna do it? Is that what “leadership looks like”?

National Mask mandate is “patriotic” but kneeling for the flag and national anthem is fine because “reasons”?
National mask mandate is not about rights it’s about responsibilities but looting and rioting is fine because “reasons”?

Follow the science, but nationwide mandate on masks everywhere because “reasons”?

Joe’s racist, supported actual KKK members in the Senate, but it’s Ok because “reasons”?
Kamala believes the women (maybe not Tara Reade), so Kavanaugh is evil, but Joe’s ok because “reasons”?

They suck.

Andrew said...

Wow. There was zero energy or enthusiasm from either of the candidates. I wonder if Kamala dialed it down because to show enthusiasm would have made Biden's oldness and tiredness even more apparent.

Just listen to the first minute of the video. How could anyone in their right mind, regardless of political viewpoint, believe that this decrepit figure was capable of leading anything at all, much less the entire country? He sounds like a man who needs to be told that it's time for his medication.

I normally wouldn't be so harsh on an elderly person. But he is the one who made the choice of fighting for the nomination. He could have withdrawn at any time. Perhaps he still will. But he is responsible for his own, and his party's, predicament.

Kevin said...

After four years of lax enforcement and sanctuary cities, the Dems want you do know there are some laws they can't wait to enforce.

It's what they mean when they say they're for law and order.

traditionalguy said...

Kamala shows us her higher caste Hindu Leadership. Bow and Worship her all you, soon to be disarmed, Untouchable Caste(horrible white men)or else. That trait is what earned her Trump’s nasty brand.

Johnathan Birks said...

I'm placing my order for the Nancy Pelosi color-coordinated drool cup/mask. Virtue signaling for every occasion!

John henry said...

What authority does the president have to require muffler wearing?

Federal buildings and lands. Federal employees. Perhaps airlines and a few other things.

But generally? How would that work?

Oh. I forgot. "states, if you don't force mufflers, we'll cut off federal funding for (insert program name here)"

Extortion, in other words. It's the Demmie way!

John Henry

Inga said...

Biden and Harris sounded like the serious adults in the room. None of the Trump bloviating and word salad.

Fernandinande said...

Since when do people get their medical advice from politicians?

Dave Begley said...

Pinned to my Twitter profile is the same chart I used when I spoke to the Omaha City Council against the mask ordinance. It shows that covid19 is over in Sweden. Sweden never had lockdowns or a mask ordinance.

The results in Sweden shows how Farr's Law works. I'm now convinced that this mask mandate and the lockdowns just delayed the operation of Farr's Law into the Fall and that's what the Dems wanted all along. If the US was at near zero deaths, we'd have Big Ten football. Things would be normal. The Dems don't want normal. They want to pin this on Trump.

Since Althouse is so smart, I'd urge her to investigate the results in Sweden but stay away from the NYT. The chart - for me - says everything.

Todd said...

"That’s what real leadership looks like. We just witnessed real leadership, which is Joe Biden said that as a nation, we should all be wearing a mask for the next three months..."

LOL!

Sorry, not sorry, no. Real leadership would be what the Trump administration just did in the ME. Something the last [what?] 5 administrations have tried to do and failed? Something Biden could not do in TWO terms.

Biden, leading from far behind and like nearly all of the Democrats, fighting yesterdays concluded battles today.

h said...

Even worse, the "handler" refers to female reporters as "guys".

Milo Minderbinder said...

Real leadership would be to denounce street violence and property destruction when people are outside.

rcocean said...

Yeah, that "I'm honored to be here with you Joe" was almost laughably bad. Guess Kamala needs to go to Acting school. I think Kam, deep down thinks she should be the POTUS candidate and Biden didn't win on merit. Lets see if she can keep the contempt in check.

Its one reason, VP Candidates are rarely one of the runner-ups. Exception? Bush, who was forced on Reagan by the R establishment. LBJ - who JFK expected to turn it down. That's about it.

wendybar said...

So basically, Joe and Kamala are proposing things that Trump is already doing. Can you say once a plagarist, always a plagarist??

rcocean said...

Yeah, that "I'm honored to be here with you Joe" was almost laughably bad. Guess Kamala needs to go to Acting school. I think Kam, deep down thinks she should be the POTUS candidate and Biden didn't win on merit. Lets see if she can keep the contempt in check.

Its one reason, VP Candidates are rarely one of the runner-ups. Exception? Bush, who was forced on Reagan by the R establishment. LBJ - who JFK expected to turn it down. That's about it.

mezzrow said...

I watched the clip. My thoughts?

You can't hide your lyin' eyes
And your smile is a thin disguise
I thought by now you'd realize
There ain't no way to hide your lyin' eyes


So now I have to wear a mask on my morning walk to signal my compliance.

That's what leadership looks like.

Lucid-Ideas said...

@Kevin

"Leadership was shutting down flights from China while being called a Xenophobe."

Tale as old as time, quarantine methodology as old as rhyme. But no...actual scientific methodology and quarantine procedure and actually real 'lock-downs' that matter are racist now.

In my perfect world the people who had a problem with that would've been forced to quarantine Mr. ShaoQi and his family from Wuhan in their guest bedroom for three months, followed by a scheduled 3 month pickup to a loudspeaker call of "bring out your dead!"

Mike (MJB Wolf) said...

That’s just bad epidemiology Joe. The virus is not stoppable. It is going to infect the same number of Americans eventually. We took two weeks to “slow the spread” which is doable. We did it. In April. You can protect the vulnerable, but the locals in charge failed them many places. The continued misdirection by Biden, pretending we can stop or control pandemics, is insincere at best, dangerous in practice. He and every elected Democrat OPPOSED the early moves by Trump. No quantity of lying media gaslighting is going to change the fact that when Trump acted he was universally attacked both for stopping flights to China and to Europe. No leader outside China took ANY positive actions before Trump did on January 31. Least of all Joey sleepyhead. The COVID recommendations started coming from the Task Force pretty early too, while elected Democrats were promoting Chinese New Year and hug-a-Chinaman days to “get” Trump.

We have not forgotten.

Michael K said...

Maybe Biden meant people should wear masks when outside their own homes.

I don’t see the need to wear a mask when outside and following some distancing.


Inga logic.

Swede said...

I don't even blame Joe.

He just says what they tell him to say.

He's basically Ron Burgundy, but with dementia and racism/sexism that has magically disappeared from the media and his running mate.

Remember his meth-head son? The one who got booted from the Navy and then went on to be a millionaire in an industry he knows nothing about? That guy?

Yeah, the press forgot about him, too.

Magical.

Todd said...

Lexington Green said...

This is a way to lose votes.
It’s bossy, it’s idiotic, it makes normal people engaging in normal behavior into c
law breakers, which is the whole idea.
I hope they keep it up.

8/14/20, 9:21 AM


This will make them a lock for the "Karen" vote, but they were probably getting all of those anyway...

Known Unknown said...

Kamala's enthusiasm for Joe knows no bounds.

JPS said...

I'm all for masks when you're inside a building not your home. Or when you're outside, and likely to come within breathing distance of other people.

A three-month national mandate that you have to wear a mask outside no matter what is - well, it's a policy proposal. I don't think it's "real leadership," and they'd better not dare tell me that The Science supports or demands it.

[Senator Harris introduces a bill to condemn the phrases "Wuhan Flu" or "Chinese Virus." I don't support any such bills, but if we're going to treat the First Amendment as a dead letter, can we for the love of God ban "The Science"?]

Our host:

"I guess they want a simple rule, one size fits all,"

That's exactly it. This is where you throw sense and judgment out the window, and you send several sheriff's deputies to nab a guy who's alone on a surfboard a mile out to sea, and transport him to a station where he'll be a hell of a lot closer to others. That, too, I guess, is real leadership.

Big Mike said...

Every time I see these people wearing a mask driving alone I wonder if they lay in bed alone wearing a condom.

Lucid Ideas won the thread at 9:08!

Nonapod said...

I do find it puzzling that the Biden campaign clearly believes this is some sort of powerful mic drop moment that will persuade all the hypothetical suburban fence sitters. And Kamala acting as some sort of goofy hype man only seems to underscore the silliness of the whole affair. I certainly don't think telling everyone to wear masks represents any kind of leadership at all, but then again I'm not the target audience. I can't exactly say how the low info persuadables will respond to this since I don't personally know any of them and I have no idea what their current mindset is.

Qwinn said...

Frankly, it's looking to me like the Democrats completely expect to lose this November, and they picked Biden and Harris precisely because they have absolutely no political future otherwise. Both are an easy sacrifice, as far as the Left is concerned.

It's actually sympathetic with my theory that ONE OF THE POSSIBLE PLAYS the Left is making is that the bosses (Soros, etc.) actually won't intentionally cheat with the mail-in balloting, they know they won't win this time and they want to be able to say "See?! Mail in ballots are fine! No fraud at all!", so that they can get away with the cheating in 2024. What I think they fail to take into account is that the general incompetence of the USPS will easily create errors that will *look* like attempted fraud, not to mention individual workers and activists who will attempt the fraud regardless of what their party bosses declare.

pacwest said...

I think it's a set up for an accusation that will be made against Trump in the coming months

Well, duh. Mark the date. Every. single. death. that occurs going forward will be attributed by the anti-Trump media as Trumpmurders. While constant mask wearing may reduce the death rate by as much as 2%, or as many as 800 deaths, we will be told all 40,000 could have been saved. Why Biden and the MSM would want to mislead the American people is beyond me. Perhaps Inga could explain?

RMc said...

Her team is working out how many hours after the election results she needs to wait until she can have him declared incompetent.

25th Amendment in da house, yo!

The Elder said...

I want to know the name of the "scientist" on which Biden is basing his claim that wearing masks outdoors for the next three months will save the number of lives that he is claiming.

Michael said...

RV
Almost a good one.

Dave Begley said...

Alex Berenson says, "Masks don't work. Lockdowns don't work. Virus gonna virus."

Browndog said...

The funny thing is, everyone knows everyone is already wearing the damn things.

At some point people are going to start wondering why the wonder masks aren't working-

Oh, and before the masktards scream "Not everyone is wearing them!", that bucket only holds so much water--and it's chuck full of holes.

NCMoss said...

Obama's speech about properly inflating your tires was more uplifting. (trolls won't get this)

Hey Skipper said...

@Ferdinande:

Since when do people get their medical advice from politicians?

Let's see what the Lancet has to say on masks:

Systematic reviews of facemask use suggest relative risk (RR) reductions for infection ranging from 6–80%, including for betacoronavirus infection (eg, COVID-19, SARS, MERS). This inconsistency might be a result of different inclusion and exclusion criteria of the type of studies; the type of included population—eg, health-care workers or the general public; possibly the type of facemask used; the outcomes considered, including laboratory-confirmed virus versus symptoms alone, as well as undesirable consequences; and the setting—eg, epidemic versus non epidemic scenarios. For COVID-19, this evidence is of low or very low certainty because it is derived from observational studies with important risk of various biases, or indirect evidence from randomised studies of other (non-betacorona) respiratory viruses with methodological limitations.

If anyone thinks this makes the case for mask wearing, keep reading.

Despite the uncertainty, the range of possible RR reduction must be considered in the context of the local epidemiology and be translated into absolute risk reductions. In Norway, for example, it was estimated that 200 000 people would need to wear facemasks to prevent one new infection per week. They assumed a 40% RR reduction with the use of surgical masks. This large number needed to prevent is due to the low prevalence or baseline risk for infection. From a population perspective, one can argue that wearing a facemask would neither be worth the public's money nor outweigh any potential harms, and the decision to wear a facemask be left to the individual, depending on the values they place on the outcomes.

So, yeah, let's make it a nationwide mandate.

Idiots.

gilbar said...

So, next Wednesday; when i'm hiking up Slough Creek in Yellowstone Park,
4 miles from the trailhead, and 2,000 yards from the nearest human...
I should be MANDATED to wear a mask?

Do Kamela and Jo think that i'll be in danger of getting Covid from a Grizzly Bear?
Maybe, Kamela and Jo think i'm that i'll be in danger of GIVING Covid to a Grizzly Bear?

i was getting my tires rotated last week for the trip
While waiting, an old (60ish) woman came in; wearing a mask
She sat on the other side of the waiting room from me, but to put her at ease; i put on my mask
She kept HERS on, the whole time, except when she'd cough
at Which times, she'd take off her mask, and cough (into her handkerchief)

But, at least (most) people are no longer So STUPID, as to be Washing Their Shoes

Big Mike said...

I should wear a paper or cloth mask if I’m swimming in the ocean? What if I’m camping alone in the back woods, miles from any other human? Is Handsy Joe worried that I might transmit the viruses to bears? Maybe he’s concerned that a Sasquatch might catch it? This past week a Karen got right up in a man’s face screaming at him because he was outdoors eating a burrito, but how does one eat with a mask on? In many locales one cannot yet eat indoors at a restaurant, and now Handsy Joe and the Karen’s don’t want people eating outdoors either?

Democrats, the party of [junk] science and poorly thought through policies.

JAORE said...

"Well yes he should have said when their outside in public, but I am sure there a good people on both sides of this issue."

And I'm sure you can provide a video and/or transcript where, in the next breath, Biden made it abundantly clear that this WAS the intent of his statement.

As an alternate, blow it out your kazoo.

Birkel said...

Real leadership looks like brokering an open and proud Middle East peace agreement.
Iran is more isolated and that is good.

Oh, that was the Trump Administration's victory.
That was leadership from Trump.

iowan2 said...

Flatten the curve, slow the spread.
The area under the curve, the deaths, will be exactly the same.

That’s the science. Most real scientist, those that aren’t dependent on government to feed their family, know this. Have explained, virus gotta virus.

Exactly how Harris has explained, the mask LOOKS LIKE, leadership. It’s a symbol. Leftist are huge on symbols. Like the symbol to ship old COVID infected patients to nursing homes to spread the death. Expose the most vulneralable. That’s a signal that you are looking for a way to reduce the States Medicare exposure.

Masks and 6 feet... to flatten the curve, not save lives.

Idiots

stevew said...

Real leaders lead and by their leading exemplify leadership. If their leading brings about positive outcomes then people are willing to follow these leaders. Real leaders don't blather on incessantly about leadership, that is what people insecure in their ability to lead do.

Hey, Joe, and Kamala, most of us know the mask wearing thing is, at best, our protection for the old and infirm. We also know that wearing a mask outside while practicing social distancing is pointless, virtue signaling nonesense. Oh, and what is the science behind the three month timeline? Wink, wink, nudge, nudge.I

These too are inarticulate, incompetent boobs, aka: political puppets.

wendybar said...

What happens in 3 months...OH AN ELECTION!! Will it magically disappear then??

Birkel said...

Leaders, by definition, must have followers.
Forcing people to do things, thus, cannot be leadership.
Forcing people is about using the monopoly force of government to control people.
Forcing people is about power.

Democratics have the Will to Power.
Americans have the Second Amendment.

rcocean said...

Trump didn't mandate masks in march because Dr. Fauci and the experts wanted to save them for the 'front line workers' and didn't really know if the masks worked. Its still not clear if they work.

BTW most of the deaths have been in people over 65, many in large care nursing homes, and with other serious medical issues. Why does this have to be constantly repeated? Why is Biden pulling numbers out of his ass and blaming Trump? Its the Democrat Governors of NY,NJ, Mass, Mich,RI, and Illinois who are responsible for the vast majority of deaths.

Temujin said...

Joe just lost the South and parts of the middle of the country where they'll be playing college football this fall. Some will even have scattered fans in attendance. While those in the Northeast who could care less about college sports, and those in the upper Midwest, who are stuck in a fetal position waiting for Dr. Anthony Fauci to tell them when they can stand up again, and those on the Pacific coast who are too busy burning down their cities to realize its time to go back to school and learn more Marxism Now!, are just fine destroying football and every other college sport it pays for.

I'm gonna start walking around my neighborhood with my mask worn as a codpiece. If I have to wear it outside while on a walk by myself, I might as well protect my best parts from the sun. It gets hot down here.

gilbar said...

"what leadership looks like"

Asking the Nation's Governors to do something
THAT is "what leadership looks like"

pacwest said...

Real leadership would be what the Trump administration just did in the ME.

But if Obama/Biden hadn't put Iran on a glide path to nuclear weapons and financed their regional terrorist operations Trump wouldn't have been able to get these agreements, so really this is a win for Biden, not Trump. Isn't that right Inga?

rcocean said...

One thing I've noticed about Radio Sports talk is the hosts have zero understanding of CV-19 and who gets infected and how. The death rate among healthy males under the age of 40, is almost zero. Yet, they cheered when the Pac-12 and big-10 cancelled Football because of 'safety'.

The real reason was fear of lawsuits. The College presidents were scared to death that some football player would sue if he got sick or hospitalized.

Jersey Fled said...

I am reposting a comment I made earlier today in another thread.

"My neighbors are both doctors. She is a family doctor and he is an epidemiologist/infectious disease doctor. I see them outside frequently and talk to them two or three times a week outdoors. They have two children under the age of three.

I have never seen either wear a face mask. Not working in the yard, not walking the babies, not speaking with neighbors or family.

They do practice social distancing, but not the "look at me" 10 feet apart variety. More like the comfortable 4-6 feet variety.

They are very nice people."

holdfast said...

So how does one in force this mandate? Call the cops?

I thought the cops were irredeemably racist. And the Dems want to defund them anyway?

What happens the first time a cop “accidentally” chokes to death a Black man for not properly wearing a mask?

Or is this a mandate that will only be enforced against white people? So many details to flesh out.

Bob said...

"Inga logic."

I noticed that, too. Maybe she'll end up voting for Trump.

285exp said...

3 months at a minimum, hmm, what could happen in the next 3 months that would make it ok to stop wearing masks? The same thing that would make it unnecessary to keep the economy locked down I suspect.

gilbar said...

Mike (MJB Wolf) said...
That’s just bad epidemiology Joe. The virus is not stoppable. It is going to infect the same number of Americans eventually


Serious Question
if for the next THREE months; i wear a mask, and Don't Leave my home...
When i come out, will i be susceptible to the virus?
if for the next THREE years; i wear a mask, and Don't Leave my home...
When i come out, will i be susceptible to the virus?

WHAT IS the length of time, that i'll need to wear a mask, and stay in my home;
to NOT be susceptible to the virus when i come out?

As a young(ish) person, without (a large number of co-morbities), shouldn't i go out and get it NOW, before i get older and fatter?

Tom T. said...

The optics are awful that right as Trump is bringing peace in the Middle East, Biden is saying that leadership is just a petty example of covering his mouth. Real accomplishment vs symbolism.

Temujin said...

As this race tightens- and it will- you will see foaming at the mouth commentary all over the landscape. From blog commenters to bloggers themselves, media talking heads, and Serious Network News Anchors (heh). You will see scientific studies about the intellect of Trump voters vs. Biden voters. And many Serious Academics who use the word 'intersectionality' multiple times in their articles.

You will see pre-election foaming and post election? Hoo-boy. If Trump wins reelection, there will be a Howl that will wake up Allen Ginsberg. The left lost their sanity in 2016. I'm not sure what they have left to lose other than their own lives if this happens again in 2020. (I'm not encouraging it. I'm actually worried for them.)

It'll be amazing! It'll be on the level of the Lions winning a Super Bowl. No, better than that. And abundantly more plausible.

Bob said...

I wonder who would enforce a "national mask mandate". Especially in South Dakota.

Eric said...

Will wearing a mask outside when you're 40 feet from the nearest person now be a political statement?

Craig said...

I too noticed the incongruency of Biden mandating that everyone where a mask, WHILE NOT WEARING A MASK! I can't believe this kind of hypocrisy sits well with most Americans.

But it doesn't matter, because the tech and media elites have figured out how to brainwash 54% of Americans into doing as they're told, no matter what their lying eyes tell them.

Darkisland said...

How come they are not wearing mufflers?

they aren't even outside.

Shouldn't they be setting an example?

Like those Wisconsin employees who are required to wear mufflers on Zoom calls. And why only on Zoom calls? Why not on every call since most people can tell from the sound whether someone is wearing a muffler or not.

John Henry

CWJ said...

"That’s what real leadership looks like. We just witnessed real leadership,"

Not only was it authentic frontier gibberish, it expressed a courage rarely seen in this day and age.

Balfegor said...

Well, yes -- if the President had recommended that people wear masks on March 1, I do think tens of thousands of people who died would still be alive. The problem is our shitty experts inside and outside the civil service were all telling people masks don't work, don't wear masks. I'm really quite angry that there's been no accountability for that colossal fuckup. Or the CDC's test kit contamination fuckup. I don't even need people to be fired (as though civil servants could be fired for gross incompetence - la!) I just want the bureaucrats and experts involved to show some contrition, to apologise for giving bad advice and show some basic recognition of the awful human cost of their incompetence.

Look, I know Trump isn't ever going to apologise. Few of our Presidents have ever been willing to apologise for their own screwups. But his biggest mistake early on was trusting our garbage experts and allowing our bureaucrats at the CDC to squash private and local efforts to deploy effective testing. Should he have known they were trash? Eh, he kind of campaigned on that message so probably yes, he should at least have been more skeptical of the bullshit from the CDC. And maybe he ought to apologise for his messaging since May or so. But I don't need to hear that from the people who fucked up the US response all the way until April, when suddenly we had always been at war with Eastasia. Especially the journalists who uncritically parrotted CDC's and WHO's anti-mask line.

Fauci, the surgeon general, whatever pettifogging CDC bureaucrat drafted the guidance on masks -- have any of them shown any recognition of the enormous gravity of the bad advice they gave? All I've seen is the pivot to smarmy self-justification: that they lied to you for your own good so masks could be kept for healthcare workers. Or the bold lie: that they actually never said what you heard them say on masks. It is genuinely, genuinely repellent. It makes me mad.

danoso said...

I’m old enough to remember the government telling us not to bother with masks. Now a guy reading a script someone gave him says they should be mandatory. Very confusing.

sparrow said...


Here's a Johnny Paycheck parody for the occaision:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHCaECsY_rs

mccullough said...

Biden should tell his 50 year old son to pay his taxes. And child support.

sparrow said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Darkisland said...

Blogger pacwest said...

While constant mask wearing may reduce the death rate by as much as 2%,

Where's the evidence for that? Or the evidence that mufflers do any good at all in either preventing spread to others or protecting oneself?

People keep asking that and nobody ever answers. Looking for more than something like "It's just common sense", "everybody knows", "Dr Fauci says so" or the like. Something like a rigorous scientific study.

Got any of those, Pacwest? Or other muffler fans?

Here's a study, fairly rigorous it seems, in the CDC's on scientific journal, that claims just the opposite. It claims that mufflers protect neither the wearer or others.

John Henry

Friendo said...

She's a disaster, except for the potential silver lining for Biden that she may already have sucked his dick.

Mattman26 said...

"The delivery is astoundingly insincere"

I love that video of Kamala's wrap-up, almost as much as I loved learning that Joe had to repeat third grade. She actually resembles a third-grader wrapping up a presentation (while trying to get back to her seat at the same time): "And that is why I think Green Eggs and Ham is a better book than One Fish Two Fish Red Fish Blue Fish."

Bay Area Guy said...

When I think of "outside", I think of sunshine and fresh air and not wearing a mask, sorry Kammy.

Jupiter said...

"mandatory mask wearing" says Queen Kamala. She hasn't even stolen th4e election yet,m and she's already running the country. What a charming little totalitarian mind this DFC has.

BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

What monolithic leftwing politics brings to a town controlled 100% by leftists: (Boulder, CO)

Small businesses everywhere in town are on the ropes, with many closing up shop for good.
Why? Crippling property taxes and other fees and business taxes make it impossible for mom and pop shops and other small businesses to stay afloat. . (this was before covid, too)(covid pushed many over the edge)(thanks Chi coms!)
Meanwhile, Google and other mega-corporation are moving in because they can absorb the ultra high taxes and are even given tax breaks for moving here. The small town feeling that used to thrive here is drying up, replaced by ultra left mega corporations and crime.

Democrats fail to see the connection.

Sherman Broder said...

Three months "at a minimum?" Typical Democrat power grab.

CDC Director, Dr. Robert Redfield, assured us in July that one or two months would do the trick.

Birches said...

Both of those videos were stunning. I thought you must be exaggerating Kamala's indifference in reading the last line. It looked even worse honestly.

I can't make out what the Democrats play is... this looks like a zombie campaign, not a campaign everyone expects to win.

Drago said...

wendybar: "What happens in 3 months...OH AN ELECTION!! Will it magically disappear then??"

Just a week or so ago Tom Friedman gave the game away in an interview when he was asked how this would all come to an end.

Before thinking about he blurted out the truth. He said "the election".

Exactly.

If Biden were to win we would find Fauci and the media and the experts suddenly pleased to report that we were past the worst and we could open up again!.....except for all the new found government power grabbed due to the "crisis"......that would stick around and be deployed just the way the dems want.

And how do we know what they would do? Because they have already done it.

Lefty gatherings are all a-ok. Gun shops? Gotta stay closed. Churches? Gotta stay closed. Synagogues? Gotta stay closed. Sex Shops? Free to open. Casinos? Free to open.

rehajm said...

Starting to look like it's kind of run its course...

You hear that from the kooks in the interwebs. This morning I'm quietly, privately hearing it from front line workers in the snooty Boston hospital. Cautious, but the murmurs are there...

walter said...

One size fits all policy. Of course..
Meanwhile, my county refuses to post ages of the 5 total purported covid deaths.
"No context for you!"

Francisco D said...

I am not expecting our resident leftists to answer these questions, but they are obvious questions that any semi-intelligent policy wonk would ask before proposing a national mask mandate.

What metric will we use to decide that masks are no longer mandatory?

Why should states and counties with minimal Wuhan Virus cases be forced to act like NYC?

pacwest said...

I've got an idea! Harris and Biden could come out onstage and do a Dancing With the Stars routine. I bet that would wow the crowd.

Darkisland said...

I mentioned that I had taken to wearing this muffler when I was in North Carolina for the past 2 weeks. It satisfies the wording of the face covering EO.

"Face Covering" means a covering of the nose and mouth that is secured
to the head with ties, straps, or loops over the ears or is simply wrapped around the
lower face. A Face Covering can be made of a variety of synthetic and natural fabrics,
including cotton, silk, or linen. Ideally, a Face Covering has two (2) or more layers.

A Face Covering may be factory-made, sewn by hand, or can be improvised from
household items such as scarfs, bandanas, t-shirts, sweatshirts, or towels.


Strangely, many of the people I observed wearing mufflers in the Charlotte area and out in the boonies where I was working were wearing paper mufflers even though the the EO does NOT seem to approve of them. Paper, cloth, whatever. Both have the same effectiveness according to the CDC study. Forgot to link before. Study is here:

https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/5/19-0994_article

Anyway, I was wearing this muffler https://amzn.to/3iEFCRO (Available via the portal) which is a nylon mesh (Fabric!) with an elastic around the head. Technically legal and I could breathe.

I am back in Puerto Rico and on strict lockdown because PR EO says that anyone coming to PR must have a PCR test proving they are free of Kung Flu or stay in isolation for 14 days. I am not allowed to leave my house at all. Not even sure I am allowed in my yard.

So I've not tested it here yet but I will as soon as I am released.

I could get released by taking a PCR test. Fat chance of that happening.

John Henry

Fernandinande said...

Mask and you shall deceive.

gilbar said...

The Elder said...
I want to know the name of the "scientist" on which Biden is basing his claim that wearing masks outdoors for the next three months will save the number of lives that he is claiming.


from the transcript:
"There is Overwhelming Evidence Overwhelming Evidence that the mask and depending on the type of mask you wear increases exponentially the prospect that you if you are a carrier and you don't even know it That You Will NOT infect ANYONE when you cough sing sneeze shout"

i Wonder What that "exponent" is? One? Zero?

Nothing the less, we have "Overwhelming Evidence Overwhelming Evidence" ! ! !
If you Say Something TWICE, it is; BY DEFINITION, TRUE

MayBee said...

I am waiting for my Governor, Gretchen Whitmer, to fall in line and issue this outdoor mask mandate. Or outside your own home mask mandate, whichever it is.
Thank GOD he issued this after she already knows she isn't getting the VP slot.

But what is a Democrat governor to do now?

Darkisland said...

I suspect that they are tracking my phone to see that I stay in my house but I don't know that for a fact. I do get a text message daily asking me if I have had any coughing, sneezing etc and so on.

I am expected to reply yes or no.

I am tempted to reply "Probably not".

I probably won't as my wife is a teacher and they might take out my snarkiness on her.

Fuck you Joey&Blowey. They have nothing to do with my situation at the momnent, I just throw that in on general principals.

John Henry

Jake said...

Why should only public health professionals be leading? Would a Biden/Harris administration simply cede all control to Fauci-like people? That's doesn't seem like leadership to me. Moreover, there are concerns other than that some people are going to die or get very sick from Sars-Cov-2. It's about balancing competing interests. People at heightened risk should isolate. Those that are not at a heightened risk should take reasonable precautions. Wash your hands, don't touch your face, etc. Sure, wear a mask. But let's not pretend it's anything other than a talisman to ward off the Karens of the world.

Drago said...

Inga: "Biden and Harris sounded like the serious adults in the room. None of the Trump bloviating and word salad."

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

Todd: "Sorry, not sorry, no. Real leadership would be what the Trump administration just did in the ME. Something the last [what?] 5 administrations have tried to do and failed? Something Biden could not do in TWO terms.

Biden, leading from far behind and like nearly all of the Democrats, fighting yesterdays concluded battles today."

Exactly.

Trump just delivered ANOTHER deal that the dems/LLR-lefties said was impossible!

The way Inga usually deals with the reality of results such as this is to deny it ever happened.

Remember, Inga STILL denies that Christopher Steele gave under oath testimony in a London court that NONE of his hoax dossier was verified.

None. Nada. Zero.

But Inga still believes in it......with all her passion and might!

It's truly sad in a very fundamental way, isn't it?

Darkisland said...

Michael K posted a link to the Melbourne incident earlier in the comments. I had seen it a few days ago. For those who did not follow the link, it is a video of a young woman 20ish, who did not have a muffler as required by law. She did, apparently, have a permit not to use a mask for medical reasons.

The cops were having none of that. The male cop tried to arrest her and when she objected, he put his hands around her neck in a classic stranglehold. Both hands around the neck, both thumbs pressing the windpipe.

After about 30 seconds of struggle and choking, he finally manages to wrestle her to the ground. I think, but don't remember for sure, that he then cuffed her.

A female cop was nearby but didn't seem to be doing anything to aid her partner or stop the strangling.

That is our future under Joey&Blowey.

John Henry

Bilwick said...

To a State-fellator like Kamala, tyranny equals "leadership."

Darkisland said...


Blogger Birkel said...

Real leadership looks like brokering an open and proud Middle East peace agreement.

Ahhhh.... blow it out your shorts, Birkel. Everybody knows that this was Obama and Biden's doing.

Everybody knows. Joe said so.

Blowhard that Trump is, he now jumps in to claim credit. And even if he did have some modicum of participation, it is nothing like the leadership of an out of power, failed politician threatening to make everyone where mufflers if he is elected.

Everybody knows that, too. Kamala says so.

John Henry

Beth B said...

Ugh, that woman's voice. Am I supposed to want to listen to her lecturing us for the next 4-16 years? No thanks. And has it ever occurred to these two geniuses, in America's especially polarized atmosphere, Joe telling citizens to wear masks for the next few months may have exactly the opposite affect? The rest of 2020 is shaping up to be an absolute horror show.

Bilwick said...

"It's not about your rights . . ." should be the Biden-Harris campaign slogan.

Tyrone Slothrop said...

Here in semi-rural southern California I see virtually everyone wearing masks when I go to Costco or Home Depot or Stater Brothers. Very rarely I'll see someone going without, but that is the exception that, to me, proves the rule. The rule is, people have judged on their own that it is prudent and polite to wear a mask. No mandate necessary.

It's no surprise Biden/Harris want a federal mandate. That's who they are. Government is for forcing people to behave in ways they approve of. If you don't get this, you're probably a Democrat.

The wife and I take a two-mile walk every day. We don't wear masks. Everyone we encounter gives us, and we give them, a twenty-foot distance. Prudence and politeness. It would never enter the heads of Biden/Harris that their citizens can think.

Darkisland said...

At the risk of sounding like a broken record:


Blogger Balfegor said...

Well, yes -- if the President had recommended that people wear masks on March 1, I do think tens of thousands of people who died would still be alive.


On what evidence do you base your thinking here?

On what evidence do you think that mufflers do any good for anyone in the general public?

Studies, journal articles, something please.

John Henry

Char Char Binks, Esq. said...

Biden declined to be interviewed until he had counsel.

The Godfather said...

I saw Dr. Fauci on the tube this morning saying that we can either open the schools or open the bars; we can’t do both. I’m trying to figure that out. Does it mean that if we don’t open the schools the kids will all be in the bars, and if we don’t open the bars the rummies will all be in the schools?

Original Mike said...

"I'll just focus in on Harris's last line. The delivery is astoundingly insincere — the boredom, the smirk, the rush to get the hell out of there..."

Sarah Palin she ain't.

I Have Misplaced My Pants said...

Funny how masks are such a magic bullet that will solve all our problems, yet we still have cases and delayed school and media hysteria and general bullshit in Texas despite six weeks of a statewide mandate.

Almost like they are about as effective as rain dances and rabbits feet.

rcocean said...

C'mon guys lets go. C'mon lets go! [Reporters meekly leave] - LOL!

And that's the kind of questions the MSM gives D politicians: "Hey Mr./Ms. X what do you think of Trump's horrible actions?"

If want to see how biased the media is, go watch today's clip of Mika Berzinksi on Morning Joe ranting against Trump and accusing him of DELIBERATELY killing Americans during the CV-19 pandemic for political reasons.

rcocean said...

Well, yes -- if the President had recommended that people wear masks on March 1, I do think tens of thousands of people who died would still be alive.

Well you can THINK anything you want. You can THINK (aka BELIEVE) the moon is made out of cheese, if you want.\

Everyone is wearing masks now and 1,000 people a day are dying. Where is the proof that mask wearing would've saved "Tens of thousands". Does anyone believe "mask wearing" would've cut the death rate in April/May 2020 by 50%? Why didn't Cuomo and the NJ/New England Governors mandate masks in March/April, because thats where most of the deaths occurred.

people can BELIEVE anything. I want stats, facts, and science.

walter said...

Wisconsin Rally-Goers Protest Mask Mandate And Punishing Dissent From Doctors

Mike (MJB Wolf) said...

Starting from the bottom up for Gilbar, YES go out and live it up without a mask if allowed by law or you DGAF. Young and no co-morbidities means you have some inherent immunity and even those who test positive 99% will be asymptomatic or mild sniffles for two days. Then you are an effective virus killer. Same for kids. Then you should never wear a mask because you cannot spread the virus only contain and kill any future COVID-19 that happen upon you.

Staying indoors statistically makes you more likely to encounter virus. Outside in warm or hot weather the environment is very hostile to viruses. Not like bacteria. Viruses die in sunshine or above 80 degrees in seconds. In general wearing a mask is not good for dental health because bacteria (heat and moisture loving bacteria!) accumulate in fabric masks and can be inhaled into the trachea and lungs. Ewww!

RNB said...

"From this day on, the official language of San Marcos will be Swedish. Silence! In addition to that, all citizens will be required to change their underwear every half-hour. Underwear will be worn on the outside so we can check."

tim in vermont said...

"My neighbors are both doctors. She is a family doctor and he is an epidemiologist/infectious disease doctor. I see them outside frequently and talk to them two or three times a week outdoors. They have two children under the age of three.

I have never seen either wear a face mask. Not working in the yard, not walking the babies, not speaking with neighbors or family.

They do practice social distancing, but not the "look at me" 10 feet apart variety. More like the comfortable 4-6 feet variety.


Exactly what I do. The only time since this started that I have worn a mask outside unless I was heading into a store or something was at an outdoor wedding during the ceremony especially since there were people who traveled there from affected areas. Biden is giving the kind of ridiculous advice that’s all about the politics and none of it about the science that just drags this pandemic out by destroying the credibility of any advice that a person doesn’t want to hear in the first place. The arguments against wearing masks indoors are emotion based and discussion is pointless. This just re-enforces the negative emotions centered on masks like it’s probably designed to do by whoever puts the words in Biden’s mouth.

pacwest said...

Got any of those, Pacwest? Or other muffler fans?

Read it on another site. Not really interested in doing the leg work to back it up for you. Not sure how "up to 2%" (in other words - statistically insignificant in this regard) makes me a mask fan. Go with 0% if you like. My point about the Biden 40K Trump murders stand either way. Go with 100% fecal transmission if you like. That's out there too.

Jesus you guys are touchy. You forgot the link btw, which I'd like to look at. One among many that have a wide range of conclusions and "CDC study" doesn't really install a great deal of confidence after what has transpired. Not being a statistician or epidemiologist I'll navigate the crapola as best I can. And, yes, I will rely on informed common sense whenever I find it applicable. It's served me well for near 70 years, and the main reason I support Trump.

walter said...

I should, my county IS more than happy to post ages of cases in colorful circle charts according to each month..as well as NEW heat zones over the map.

chuck said...

Biden's eyes ask, "Where am I?". Poor things, they deserve better.

Rabel said...

They were both very downbeat in that first joint appearance. Weird.

The emphasis on outside wear while ignoring inside wear is similarly weird.

My guess, Kamala spent her first recent face-to-face time with Biden when he was having a bad day and came to realize the serious nature of his mental problem.

Also, Joe said "expidentially" not "exponentially."

Yancey Ward said...

"Every time I see these people wearing a mask driving alone I wonder if they lay in bed alone wearing a condom."

Hey, unless your hands were with you all day long, you should.

n.n said...

The real greenhouse effect.

For COVID-19, this evidence is of low or very low certainty because it is derived from observational studies with important risk of various biases, or indirect evidence from randomised studies of other (non-betacorona) respiratory viruses with methodological limitations.

The directive, or rather general directive, was justified through an em-pathetical appeal to intuition and fear (e.g. bullying, labels) backed by an elevated risk of lawsuits. They spread the disease over a longer period, increased the collateral damage, and delayed the virus's evolution. That said, they could have reduced the body count through proactive treatment of the virus, which would aid normal body function and enhance immune system response. Instead, they demonized an affordable, available, low risk treatment, exacerbated the conflict through protests and cross-contamination (e.g. Planned Parent), and defended immigration reform (e.g. illegal aliens, high foreign tuition students) in a time when external factors caused spikes in infections and disease progression.

tim in vermont said...

Meanwhile, my county refuses to post ages of the 5 total purported covid deaths.

In Florida, the infection fatality rate for people 0 - 50 is about 1 in 600 or 0.16%. Once you get over 50, the fatality rate climbs quickly. Does that help? Probability suggests that the 5 deaths were elderly, and their lives don’t matter, right?

Remember when comparing to flu stats for people under 50 that you have to compare deaths of people under 50 For example notice how during a normal flu year the vast majority of the deaths are people over 50 so you can throw those out when you compare, last year wasn’t a bad flu year, this is just about comparing ages of people who died.

Age Group Estimated % of deaths Estimated actual deaths
0-4 0.8 270
4-17 0.6 200
18-49 7.2 2,460
50-64 16.6 5,670
65 + 74.8 25,550

tim in vermont said...

It will be a lot less stressful, I suppose, once the press starts downplaying COVID if Biden wins, and once they start starving the rioters of the oxygen of the press.

Yancey Ward said...

"It'll be amazing! It'll be on the level of the Lions winning a Super Bowl. No, better than that. And abundantly more plausible."

I surely hope that Trump winning isn't on that level of amazing. More like the Chiefs winning.

Tom T. said...

Balfegor, if you were capable of figuring out mask usage without a politician telling you what to do, other people would have been able to do so as well. You're not special.

boatbuilder said...

If wearing masks outdoors was known to be they way to contain the virus (which it isn’t) then why didn’t all of the dem governors issue that mandate?

Nonapod said...

Balfegor said...if the President had recommended that people wear masks on March 1, I do think tens of thousands of people who died would still be alive.

pacwest said...While constant mask wearing may reduce the death rate by as much as 2%, or as many as 800 deaths, we will be told all 40,000 could have been saved.

I think there's just too many unknowns at the moment to quantify how many people may have been saved by mandating mask wearing from day one.

I not a doctor. I'm not an epidemiologist. And I'm not any kind of expert on infectious disease transmission. I'm just some idiot on the internet.

All that said based on what I've read and my general understanding of highly infectious viral respiratory diseases and their mechanics of infection, I suspect that wearing masks is generally better than not. It's currently believed that Sars-Cov-2 is primarily transmitted via respiratory droplets expelled from an infectious person that are then inhaled by an uninfected person. There are most likley other vectors too (fomite transmission? fecal oral?) but much of the literature that I've seen is unclear and sometimes even contradictory on those routes.

Given all that, it seems to me that an infected person wearing a mask is going to be less likely to expel a large amount of respiratory droplets across a wide area via sneezing, coughing, talking, or just breathing than an infected person not wearing a mask. It just makes logical sense to me. Of course there may be other factors at play that we don't yet fully understand with mask wearing and viral transmission, but so far I personally haven't seen a very convincing argument that suggests that mask wearing is definitely harmful somehow.

To be clear, I don't believe that wearing a mask alone (that is, without social distancing and general common sense behavoir) will significantly reduce a person's risk of becoming infected or infecting others. I don't believe that masks are magic. I just believe that they're either somewhat effective or at the very least that they're not harmful when combined with behavior.

Left Bank of the Charles said...

Under Althouse's "very fine people" standard, this post is a lie, and Althouse is disqualified from being taken seriously until she tracts her lie.

Iman said...

Do Kamela and Jo think that i'll be in danger of getting Covid from a Grizzly Bear?
Maybe, Kamela and Jo think i'm that i'll be in danger of GIVING Covid to a Grizzly Bear?


What’s teh over/under on you gettin’ et by a Grizzly Bahr?

Narayanan said...

Camelot was big with D.

in India Harris name rhymes with cum-a-lot

bagoh20 said...

"He sounds like a man who needs to be told that it's time for his medication."

I'm sure he's told that many times a day, but drugs can only do so much. Doesn't being propped up by drugs make him more like Hitler than Trump is? That didn't turn out so well for the Germans. The drugs might be what led them to bomb Pearl Harbor.

I wish someone would tell me it's time for my medication. They don't give it to you if sound like you really want it. That's why I like to say: "stay off drugs, kids", but old guys are cool.

Narayanan said...

chuck said...
Biden's eyes ask, "Where am I?".
---------=========
post orgasmic?

JaimeRoberto said...

It's amazing to me how many people like to be told what to do. They seem to like the theater of it.

Greg Hlatky said...

We've had the TSA for almost 20 years. Why can't masks and distancing mandates last as long?

walter said...

Tim,
My concern is less about the exact fatality rate and more about the county not providing data other counties do, claiming "privacy concerns".

Bob Loblaw said...

If the president had acted sooner, just one week earlier, it would have saved 30-some-thousand lives.

Every time the president has made a decision in this crisis the Democrats have criticized him for jumping the gun.

Yancey Ward said...

I will just point out the obvious since no one else has in the comments:

If masks are going to be mandated for COVID-19, then why not year round for every other respiratory illness?

Enjoy wearing your face diapers for the rest of your lives.

Earnest Prole said...

If only Trump had jumped on recommending masks for all Americans early on — say, mid-March — then the dopey logic of American politics would have required Democrats to oppose masks, and Trump would now be laying the carnage at the feet of Democratic politicians. If only we had a leader who played fourteen-dimensional chess.

Roy Jacobsen said...

No, really! "Real leadership" is all about issuing absolutist, one-size-fits-all, science and separation of powers be damned orders DEMANDING compliance from everyone.

Honest! That's what "real leadership" looks like.

Todd said...

Darkisland said...

I suspect that they are tracking my phone to see that I stay in my house but I don't know that for a fact. I do get a text message daily asking me if I have had any coughing, sneezing etc and so on.

8/14/20, 11:11 AM


Have some fun with them, text back asking if bloody stool is a problem?!?

Roy Jacobsen said...

No, really! "Real leadership" is all about issuing absolutist, one-size-fits-all, science and separation of powers be damned orders DEMANDING compliance from everyone.

Honest! That's what "real leadership" looks like.

Roy Jacobsen said...

bagoh20 said...
"He sounds like a man who needs to be told that it's time for his medication."

I'm sure he's told that many times a day, but drugs can only do so much. Doesn't being propped up by drugs make him more like Hitler than Trump is? That didn't turn out so well for the Germans. The drugs might be what led them to bomb Pearl Harbor.


"Patterns of Force," Star Trek, season 2.

Todd said...

rcocean said...

people can BELIEVE anything. I want stats, facts, and science.

8/14/20, 11:55 AM


Well look at you, the out and proud CIS white male racist! You with your math and science and facts n shit. At least that is what all the Woke folks are saying.

Todd said...

tim in vermont said...

Biden is giving the kind of ridiculous advice that’s all about the politics and none of it about the science that just drags this pandemic out by destroying the credibility of any advice that a person doesn’t want to hear in the first place. The arguments against wearing masks indoors are emotion based and discussion is pointless. This just re-enforces the negative emotions centered on masks like it’s probably designed to do by whoever puts the words in Biden’s mouth.

8/14/20, 12:11 PM


You mean similar to when Biden told the country to fire a shot-gun warning blast into the air to protect yourself, thereby causing folks to violate a number of laws? Like that?

Jim at said...

"every single American should be wearing a mask when they’re outside for the next three months at a minimum."

No. And not just no, but fuck no.
And fuck you for demanding it.

Gilligan said...

The mask mandate justified as "regulating commerce"?? That sounds wildly out of sync with the traditional understanding that health/welfare are state government powers.

Drago said...

Left Bank of the Charles: "Under Althouse's "very fine people" standard, this post is a lie, and Althouse is disqualified from being taken seriously until she tracts her lie."

Hmmm, going full speed over Stupidity Cliff to own Althouse.

Its a bold strategy Left Bank. Lets see if it pays off.

Bilwick said...

"Authoritarianism is what leadership looks like to Kamala, see also her record as DA and AG of locking up innocent people with faulty evidence."

Indeed; but what is the party line this week? I have a friend, bright woman but as dumb and uninformed as Inga; and so, like Inga, just regurgitates the party line in a zombie-like belief that it must be the truth. One week Trump is Hitler; the next week, not Hitler enough. If Grandpa Simpson gets elected and then "unexpectedly" has to step down, leaving Kamala or Hillary or Big Mike in charge, authoritarianism will be back in favor.

n.n said...

There is no evidence that the masks work to mitigate spread of submicron viruses through all conditions (e.g. symptomatic vs asymptomatic, fecal (a la HIV/AIDS) transmission modes) and in isolation (e.g. laboratory), let alone in general use by the population. In fact, when used improperly, they act as collectors, create a false sense of security, and are counterproductive to sustaining a healthy body and environment. At best, they create a placebo effect, and normalize political leverage, and, at worst, they flatten disease progression, force recurring spikes (until so-called "herd immunity" reduces statistical spread, or the virus evolves), and increases collateral (e.g. economic, social) damage. That said, the Covid-19-caused deaths could have been mitigated through preventing Planned Parent, proactive measures (e.g. HCQ/border control, Zn/Planned Pathogen) to aid healthy bodies and immune response, and special precautions for at risk individuals (e.g. seniors, cardiac and respiratory comorbidities). They could have also dropped resistance to mitigating immigration reform and unrestricted international travel.

n.n said...

One reason for the acute reaction was, not misinformation, or disinformation, but lack of scientific knowledge. The assumption of a high body infection rate may be true (notably asymptomatic through contact (e.g. fecal a la HIV/AIDS)). The assumption of a high cellular infection may not be and disease progression was likely overestimated. Today, it is estimated that a majority of the population exhibits innate or cross-immunity to SARS-CoV-2. An affordable, available, low risk disinfectant cocktail (e.g. HCQ+Zn+AZ) would have been an effective Planned Pathogen protocol. Also, preventing Planned Parent and addressing other high risk profiles.

wildswan said...

Public health policy can either take the "high risk" approach which tries to protect susceptible individuals or the population approach which tries to control causes. For instance, in the case of flu public health tries to get older people vaccinated but in the case of tobacco public health tries to limit smoking by all. So the public health experts initially saw the China virus as an event similar to the 1918 Spanish flu which killed more people than WW I. So they (Fauci, Birx) advised Trump to use the population approach, the lockdown. Over time it became apparent that China flu was not the Spanish flu then Trump began to move toward the high risk approach while some Governors (Whitmer, Cuomo) stayed with the population approach. Over time the two different approaches have become associated with the two parties so that, for example, the Dems want to close schools if there are any instances of China virus while Republicans want schools to open while trying to protect those at high risk from exposure since there is no vaccine. High risk groups are those cities (especially those in or near New York, Detroit, Boston and New Orleans) who are over sixty with hypertension or diabetes. The Republican approach acknowledges our present understanding of the China flu as centered in certain groups and so supports the high risk approach. By opening schools and businesses that approach would substantially benefit public health and economic health. Republicans also think that it makes sense to treat members of the high risk group with hydroxychloroquine very early if they have are known to have the disease or even the symptoms. Under Republicans cases would increase a lot and deaths connected with the China flu would increase somewhat. The Dem population approach based on preventing cases, not deaths, will cause closed schools, ruined businesses, unemployment, city budget failures. It will not save lives even from the China flu since it does not address the reasons why the high risk groups are high risk and, in addition, lives will be lost to due to unemployment and closed schools. Masking was used in the old people's homes in NYC and Detroit where thousands died and it didn't save them the last time, nor will it this time. The Dem population approach to the China flu is approach is both callous and ineffective like their police reforms, like socialism everywhere, and, above all, like Joe Biden and Kamala Harris, Coma and Comma - the 2020 Dream Team and Cuomo, their trusty sidekick.

hstad said...

"...I guess they want a simple rule, one size fits all, and they're thinking about the crowded cities where their voters reside..."

No I think 'Elites' like Drs. Fauci and Birx want to see how far they can push the voters for control and power. You seen it in several states of Governors going crazy. The CCP doesn't dare pull off some of these stunts pulled by the power hungry Liberal Totalitarian Governors. Dry run for the next political opportunity to enlarge the government apparatus.

MeatPopscicle1234 said...

For those of you who think a Biden win means they are suddenly going to re-open the economy and say that the danger has passed, you are deluding yourselves. This "crisis" has been their wet dream, giving them an unprecedented level of power they can use arbitrarily as a club to control people like never before. Your rights are now subject to a capricious barometer that points ever leftward (Casinos but not Churches... BLM Protests but not In-Person Voting). This virus has single-handedly given them almost EVERYTHING they have wanted for the past 3 decades (cashless society, monitoring of our every movement, ability to tell us where / when we can go and who we can associate with, shuttering of churches, stifling of legitimate peaceful political gatherings, mail-in voting, massive new spending, social shaming, and instilling a mindset that you have to ask the government for PERMISSION to do just about anything...).

If Biden wins in November, you can expect this type of thing to become the new normal and for the current soft-tyranny to become ever more intrusive and draconian.

Inga said...

“Sarah Palin she ain't.”

True, Kamala Harris is intelligent.

Roy Jacobsen said...

Inga said...
“Sarah Palin she ain't.”

True, Kamala Harris is intelligent.


Show your work.

Darkisland said...

Pacwest,

Apologies, I thought you were saying that mufflers did some good. I thought you were arguing that a 2% reduction was measurable and worth the pain.

I misread you and am sorry.

I did post the link in another comment a few minutes later, having realized I had forgotten it. In any event, here it is again:

https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/5/19-0994_article

EID is the journal Emerging Infectious Diseases.

John Henry

Darkisland said...

Blogger rcocean said...

Everyone is wearing masks now and 1,000 people a day are dying.

Really? You say you want "stats, facts, and science." but post this bullshit? 1,000 people a day are dying?

Not even 1,000 a week. the week ended 8/8 it was 438 people total. ZERO deaths under 24 years old. 29 total under 55. More than half over 75 and half of them over 85.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm#AgeAndSex

I suspect, due to bogus reporting, it is much lower than 438. I would not be surprised if the actual deaths from kung flu are 75 or even 50% of the reported deaths.

We won't find that out except by reading footnotes in obscure publications 5-10 years from now.

John Henry

JML said...

I was camping in the Jemez Mountains of New Mexico. Many of the people out there were wearing masks...very sad.

Rush was saying today that Biden suggested the mask mandate as a way to avoid being seen in public. It is too dangerous to do a press conference or campaign.

JML said...

I was camping in the Jemez Mountains of New Mexico. Many of the people out there were wearing masks...very sad.

Rush was saying today that Biden suggested the mask mandate as a way to avoid being seen in public. It is too dangerous to do a press conference or campaign.

Darkisland said...

Someone mentioned that govt might require kung flu restrictions beyond the pandemic. I got the impression they thought they were kidding.

New Mexico Gov Grisham doesn't seem to be kidding:

“Let’s hold these behaviors beyond the vaccine, because these are good public health behaviors that will prevent the spread of influenza, that will prevent the spread of colds… we should start thinking about this as the right public health path forever irrespective of COVID.”

John Henry

tim in vermont said...

Kamala was the whore in the novel Sidhartha, BTW.

tim in vermont said...

"Show your work.”

She just repeats what she’s told to say, You will have to find the person who tells her what to think if you want a real discussion. Kind of like with Joe Biden.

pacwest said...

Echoing YW:
"If masks are going to be mandated for COVID-19, then why not year round for every other respiratory illness?"

And cameras to make sure you wash your hands properly after wiping your ass, because we just don't trust you comrade. Mandate everything. Wipe out all disease carrying animals and poisonous plants. Make all government non-approved actions felonies. Sterilize the entire planet. It's dangerous out there and life should have no risks. I'm beginning to think this is just a test run by China for when they release the real nasty on us. This time it was just a bad flu. Next time?

@John Henry
The study you cited is not from the CDC. It's from a university in Hong Kong. It's a conglomerate of other studies that says mask wearing, hand washing, and surface cleaning has little effect in stopping influenza. It provides lots of caveats, says that more study is needed, as well as saying that better instruction on mask usage is necessary. Disclaimer: I can't do the math to break it down into something I can understand, like percentages, or RO's. Did I get it right? I'm getting leary of accepting any study at face value. Another data point in the twisty maze. At some point we all have to take it on semi-informed faith that the person doing the talking, be it the plumber, the computer geek, surgeon or statistician knows what the hell they are doing, and we can benefit from taking their advice. The only people I exclude from this are Democrats with an agenda. And Howard of course.

Mattman26 said...

Hey, what ever happened to bodily autonomy?

tim in vermont said...

I was thinking about Inga's comment on HCQ and how we don’t have a “gold standard” double blind test on it, just case studies and surveys of where it has been tried and hasn’t that show it works. It led me to a question, Do we have a "gold standard double blind test” of how long it takes people to die of starvation? Or do we just look at case studies? Wouldn’t such an experiment be unethical given all of the case studies that have been done over history?

n.n. uncharacteristically made a stupid comment about requiring complete proof that masks work in a general population when studying it is impossible, and we have many studies, in laboratories and in the real world, that show they do work. If people are worried about the improper use of masks, then it is time for public education on the proper use of masks, not to throw the baby out with the bath water.

pacwest said...

@John Henry
No apology necessary. I understand your position and agree with it to a large degree. The only thing that really makes any difference is getting the RO to zero. Be it herd immunity or vaccine. To me it seems that the best any prophylactic can do is delay, and I don't see convincing evidence that masks even do that, although intuitively I think they should. Here's a solution. We all stock up on groceries, lock ourselves in the basement for two months, wait to collect the bodies and seal our borders forever... Or get on with life and some people die in the process. Life is a risk and self serving politicos are a plague. I try to mitigate them both as I can.

Original Mike said...

"True, Kamala Harris is intelligent."

Not from what I've seen. Her cross examination of Brett Kavanaugh was cringeworthy. At one point she went on and on asking him if he had recently talked to some lawyers at a particular law firm about "something", she wouldn't say what. It was baffling. She was clearly trying to catch him in some kind of gotcha moment, about what I couldn't tell, Kavanaugh couldn't tell, and I don't think to this day has ever been explained.. She came back to it, using the same unfruitful tactic, the next day. Again it went nowhere. If that was an example of Harris' lawyerly acumen, it was embarrassing.

And then there was her badgering of Mike Pompeo during his CIA Director confirmation hearing over climate change! Of all the dangerous things going on in the world in the CIA's portfolio and you want to waste everyone's time asking him how he's going to reduce the CIA's carbon footprint?

Kamala Harris is dumb as a box of rocks.

Browndog said...

Go watch Sarah Palin's convention speech if you want to know who Palin is-

That happened before McCain's handlers got a hold of her. Those handlers?

Steve Schmidt and Nicole Wallace.

Francisco D said...

I would love to give Kamala Harris and Sarah Palin the WAIS-V.

My guess is that they would both score in the 105-110 IQ range which is a bit above average. However, it is nothing special. That is the range for the average college graduate.

Many of the commenters here have IQs a few standard deviations above those two.

Francisco D said...

I would love to give Kamala Harris and Sarah Palin the WAIS-V.

My guess is that they would both score in the 105-110 IQ range which is a bit above average. However, it is nothing special. That is the range for the average college graduate.

Many of the commenters here have IQs a few standard deviations above those two.

Drago said...

Browndog: "Go watch Sarah Palin's convention speech if you want to know who Palin is-
That happened before McCain's handlers got a hold of her. Those handlers?
Steve Schmidt and Nicole Wallace."

The McCain campaign, like the Romney campaign, was a dream come true for the democratics. The dems were in complete control of both major party tickets.

Pretty amazing really.

Well, we won't be doing that again.

Gk1 said...

What polls are democrats injecting that tell them being liberal scolds, wagging their fingers at the rest of us for not wearing masks outside, tattling to the teacher and brown nosing the principal is a popular position?

Are they that drunk on power they think this will get them more votes? Its almost like they are actively trying to drive people away like Max Bialystock and Leo Bloom in the Producers.

n.n said...

and we have many studies, in laboratories and in the real world, that show they do work

Any many studies, in ..., that they don't work, and may be counterproductive in general use. One submicron virus is not like another is not a water droplet etc. At best, they influence statistical spread a la "herd immunity". At worst, they contribute to it.

on HCQ and how we don’t have a “gold standard” double blind test on it, just case studies and surveys

HCQ, Zn, have been tested and effective in vitro. Each has a well-established risk profile in vivo. HCQ acts as a border control. Zn is Pro-Choice and inhibits cellular appropriation for viral reproduction. Together they enhance body function and immune system response in a Planned Pathogen protocol.

n.n said...

The inflection points of viral spread and disease progression are either after or mismatched with mitigation efforts. The likely explanation is the current observation that the population has a higher innate or cross-immunity than assumed in the models and intuition, which has flattened the curve a la "herd immunity". Simply put, the virus does not have safe sanctuary and lacks opportunity to migrate, so it evolves and becomes less viable. This number, in particular, limits the prediction skill of the R0 model.

n.n said...

My guess is that they would both score in the 105-110 IQ range which is a bit above average.

Perhaps, but IQ is only tangentially correlated with judgment, execution, socialization, and other leadership qualities. Many people are intelligent, perhaps smart, but fail to execute.

Gahrie said...

The estimates are we’ll save over 40,000 lives in the next three months if that is done.

If we banned abortion we'd save 360,000 lives in the next three months.

Lewis Wetzel said...

Tim in Vermont wrote:
If people are worried about the improper use of masks, then it is time for public education on the proper use of masks, not to throw the baby out with the bath water.
This is bad reasoning. The real world is not like a lab, real people are not like people who work in a lab. Requiring Americans, who own this country, to treat the world like a lab and themselves as lab employees, is a non-starter. It will not happen, it should not happen. .
And, uh . . . maybe there wouldn't be as many unwanted pregnancies if people were given instruction on how to use birth control?

Take common-sense precautions. Wash your hands frequently. Protect at-risk populations. Do that, and we will all be as healthy as the Swedes.
Stop blaming the healthy for the spread of the disease.

gilbar said...

we should start thinking about this as the right public health path forever irrespective of COVID.

If you want a vision of the future, imagine a mask strapping on a human face - forever.
George Orwell

gilbar said...

Iman said...
What’s teh over/under on you gettin’ et by a Grizzly Bahr?


you need to talk to my twin sister, Jen; she's the one taking the bets and holding the cash

Bunkypotatohead said...

Those two should be wearing masks every time we see them, until they lose the election. And the press should be challenging them when they don't wear them.
That is, if they are actually serious about the necessity of it.

320Busdriver said...

This, I think, is a symptom of their desperation. One just needs to see how liberal policies are truly destroying our large liberal metro areas.

It’s all they got. The mask is off. I’ve never been more concerned for my children’s futures. Prepare yourselves, be ready. Above all, VOTE.

cyrus83 said...

Leadership is not about saying things people don't want to hear or even about taking unpopular positions. Leadership is getting people to buy into your message so that they want to do what you are proposing they do. Much of the current mask business doesn't really have people convinced, they're just doing it to get on with life and run a business without the bully government trying to shut them down.

In that sense, this announcement is a failure of leadership because there is no serious effort to convince the people that this is a wise plan, no respect given to the agency or needs of the citizen as an individual, and there is an appeal to force rather than to debate.

Although the Democrats won't publicly say so, it wouldn't just be for 3 months, that's as big a lie as the couple-week shutdown to flatten the curve that turned into a months-long and indefinite lockdown that won't end so long as even one person anywhere tests positive even though false positives in testing guarantee that there will always be positive tests. I think Democrats fully intend to make COVID policies permanent and use them to wipe out civil rights they find pesky to deal with.

The Godfather said...

@Dark Island: What's your basis for disputing the claim of 1,000+ Coronovirus deaths per day? I've been following the data on the NBC News website for several weeks, and the daily deaths reported have been at or above 1,000 for about 18 days. Do you have a better source? [I've always found you a font of useful information, so I hope you can help me out here.]

exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...

Rush was saying today that Biden suggested the mask mandate as a way to avoid being seen in public. It is too dangerous to do a press conference or campaign.


8/14/20, 3:58 PM

The mask is a good way to keep Biden from drooling all over his shirtfront.

Big Mike said...

One week Trump is Hitler; the next week, not Hitler enough. If Grandpa Simpson gets elected and then "unexpectedly" has to step down, leaving Kamala or Hillary or Big Mike in charge ...

@Bilwick (2:20 yesterday), you would be extremely fortunate to find THIS Big Mike in charge, if I do say so myself.

Bilwick said...

I know a lot of it is simple party-line-ism; but people who are dissatisfied with Trump's handling of the Kung Flu probably can take some comfort that if Trump is defeated in November, we can then unleash the genius that is Joe Biden to eradicate the plague. Or Queen Kamala could follow what seem to be her natural proclivities and lock us all up. Not only would we be quarantined, but we would get that free health care that Democrats are always promising us in exchange for that insignificant "mess of porridge" called "liberty."

hstad said...


Blogger Inga said..."...I’m going to translate Biden the way some translate Trump: Maybe Biden meant people should wear masks when outside their own homes. 8/14/20, 9:15 AM

"Inga" you do know that masks don't work on viruses - or maybe where you live they do?

"...Humanity’s record against viruses is poor. Only one virus has been fully driven out of existence in humans – smallpox. The rest are managed, with brushfires stomped out when they flare up..."

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/other/covid-19-shaping-up-to-be-battle-for-years-even-with-vaccine/ar-BB17VVTN