"... leading to the recent killings of Kenosha area men in the city she was born and raised in. At a peaceful gathering, that included barbecue for anyone at Civic Center Park Wednesday night, Porche Bennett, 31, a Kenosha native and local business owner, honored the memory of two Kenosha-area men who were shot and killed Tuesday. The men were allegedly shot and killed by a 17-year-old Antioch boy who came armed to the city amid the organized protests and later rioting that has broken out since Sunday night after the Kenosha Police officer-involved shooting of Jacob Blake. While Kenosha police did not name the boy, he was identified as Kyle Rittenhouse by Antioch authorities. A third man who was shot suffered non-life threatening injuries.... 'Now I need everybody to put a fist in the air for our boys that we lost,' said Bennett.... 'They came out here every time with us. Sweet. Loving. They were the sweetest hearts, souls. I called Anthony my hippie guy... They were sweet guys. We knew all three of them, but he [Anthony Huber] was the one who would always come up to me. Always would be right by me.... [I]f you’re here after curfew, we’re not going to have anything to do with you... Point blank. Period. So, if you’re out here after curfew, that is on you with those on. They’re not associated with us. If you’re out here after curfew, you are not associated with us. This is what we do. Peaceful stuff... We get out here hang out together and be peaceful and demand justice. So, if you want to remain safe, we’re asking you all, please we’re asking you all we don’t want to have what we had last night.... If you’re out after curfew … we’re not responsible for whatever happens to you.... I hate to say it that way, but it’s reality.... I don’t want to see that with nobody else. Yes, I’m happy the young man got arrested. It shouldn’t have gotten to that. I don’t want to see that no more.... We’re already protesting for Jacob, now we got to deal with this … I’m tired of all of that.... Whoever stays out here, you’ll learn the difference.... There are two different types of people.... That ends today. Either you’re here to be peaceful and do that for the cause and do what’s right or just don’t come because we’ve got to rebuild this. We live here, you guys get to go home to a pretty little city.... We’ve got to wake up to this now."
The Wisconsin State Journal reports.
The word "boy" is used twice to refer to Rittenhouse — by the newspaper — and the "organizer" uses the word "boys" to refer to the men who were shot to death.
Bennett obviously realizes that those who want to be known as peaceful protesters must disconnect themselves from the violence that takes place after curfew. But notice that she did not say If you’re out after curfew, we’re not responsible for the things you do. She said, "If you’re out after curfew … we’re not responsible for whatever happens to you." She's referring to people like Kyle Rittenhouse who might show up in an unpredictable effort to do what the police have failed to do and protect the town's businessowners.
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
114 comments:
Is she aware of the history of those sweet boys who were shot?
Commentary is annoying but these videos show the sequence of events.
https://youtu.be/rdMTghlrFiw
To us law and order types you're not supposed to be there after curfew, either.
Says to me the government officials calling for curfew mean to signal to law and order types to stay home so the rioters aren't inconvenienced...
I'm intrigued that a juvenile perpetrator has been identified by name. Are they prosecuting him as an adult? What about Roper v. Simmons, 543 U.S. 551 (2005)? - yes, I know that's only for death penalty cases, but I thought the evolving standards of decency meant we were protecting those under 17. Very curious.
Porche Bennett and Kyle Rittenhouse represent the diversity of deterrence.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/27/us/kyle-rittenhouse-kenosha-shooting-video.html NYT appears to be fair here. My take from watching the videos is self defense for all three hits. Not sure if you can use that defense if you broke the law prior (17yo can't open carry in WI etc.) So far worst association with this guy is "pro cop" so he might get a fair trial.
It would be nice if the peaceful lady could somehow find out about the hoaxes at the bottom it.
Women believe in the fantasy they find most interesting to them. It used to sell gossip rags, now it's TV and youtube.
"If you’re out after curfew … we’re not responsible for whatever happens to you"
Except that all leftist "protest" everywhere, inevitably, leads to violence, justified by claims of social injustice and the "cycle" of systemic racism, affirmed by Dem office holders, and abetted by the MSM.
"We’re already protesting for Jacob"
What does it mean to protest "for Jacob"? A guy with a rap sheet and a warrant out for his arrest bothers a woman to the point that she calls for protection, then fights with officers and reaches into his car after ignoring commands. And "for Jacob" the "protesters" say ---?
She's apparently a terrible judge of character. Andy Ngo has identified the three shooting victims here, because someone has to perform journalism these days:
https://twitter.com/MrAndyNgo/status/1298833015548739587
To include it here if you do not want to click the link:
- Rosenbaum (deceased): Registered sex offender involving a minor.
- Huber (deceased): Criminal history of battery and domestic abuse. Apparently a lot of domestic abuse.
- Grosskreutz (survived): Member of the People’s Revolution Movement. Been previously charged with at least one gun crime. (If I read it correctly, he was charged with possession of a gun while being intoxicated.)
These were not nice people. These were never going to peaceful protesters and they proved that they were not. The warnings were out there that eventually someone was going to get fed up with their violence and things were going to get ugly, and, most unfortunately, that prophecy has come true. Alas.
[I]f you’re here after curfew, we’re not going to have anything to do with you... Point blank.
Interesting word choice.
"They came out here every time with us. Sweet. Loving. They were the sweetest hearts, souls."
For those interested, Andy Ngo has info on their rap sheets.
Democratics hate the truth, especially about how violent and hateful the Marxists they provide cover for are, including over 100,000,000 deaths in the previous century alone. I wonder how people determine spreading blatant lies 100% refuted by video helps them? Do they assume the audience that they target are 80 IQs, or is the target audience just so full of hate that their rage literally blinds them?
How many peaceful boys have 40+ infractions in prison after being convicted of sexual assault of a minor? How many peaceful 36 year old boys trying to martyr themselves scream "shoot me ni&&a" at a true minor of only 17 years of age?
How many peaceful boys chasing down (with a mob) a fleeing minor and swinging a skateboard at his head have domestic violence convictions and then numerous parole violations?
How many peaceful boys have their handgun pulled as they chase down (as part of a mob) a fleeing boy running toward police?
I wonder if anything will ever happen to people who lie on record and cause all this mayhem?
This young man is a worthless prick. High school dropout, gun nut, a fat pig and unemployed. Nice!!! But the (awful) video does look like a Jim Crow lynch mob. The "victims" were throwing molotov cocktails at him and were armed (with pistols).
The real issue? The criminal justice system’s failure to prosecute crimes perpetrated against businesses and people ("punch a nazi") is encouraging extralegal violence. We must put the looters and arsonists in prison for looting and arson. No catch and release. We should also set up a registry.
Why don't you break up your quotes into paragraphs?
Is there some reason?
Kyle Rittenhouse, super MAGA fan, Trump 2020 supporter:
Joseph Rosenbaum, registered sex offender for a sex crime involving a minor.
Anthony Huber, criminal history that includes charges of battery & repeat domestic abuse.
Gaige Grosskreutz, criminal record that includes being intoxicated & armed w/a gun.
Chuck really, really, really, really doesn't understand the moment we are in.
Chuck, as Althouse pointed out in the previous post, it wasn't what Trump did or said that motivated Rittenhouse to take up arms in place of the authorities, it's what Democratic officeholders failed to do to protect the people.
The entire Pelosi+ corruption excusing left don't have a word to say about all the arson and destruction of property done in the name of the democrat party.
From what I can see on the videos, the guy defended himself against an attacker and then a lynch mob.
Chuck's Buzzfeed article (7:56) says Kyle was "a police safety cadet" and a "fire safety cadet." Worse, he once went to a Trump rally!!
Now that I know this, I completely hate Trump and I'm totally in favor of the rioters. Defund the police! And while we're at it, defund the fire department, too!
And sure as clockwork, here's LLR Chuck reminding us of the real crime: supporting Donald Trump, as opposed to the pedo and criminal charges against the dead goblins.
Was the adolescent from Antioch really trying to help someone defend their business or just there to see a riot? We’re the guys he shot chasing him and beating him justified or was it a mob attack? Was he justified in shooting the guy hitting and/or kicking him? Was that him or someone else firing the other shots heard? Are there any actual fucking reporters working on this story? Or is the focus of every story “oh no this might help trump!”?
Black Lives are too expensive.
Yo Chuck
The 3 shot (2 killed) in #Kenosha, Wisc. at the BLM riot have been identified.
Joseph Rosenbaum, 36, was the first one killed. Video allegedly shows him chasing teen shooter & throwing something at him. Rosenbaum was a registered sex offender for a sex crime involving a minor.
Anthony Huber, 26, was shot & killed in Kenosha, Wisc. at the BLM riot. He was filmed chasing down the armed teen and hitting him when he was on the ground with a skateboard. He has a criminal history that includes charges of battery & repeat domestic abuse.
*****But according to assholes Chuck and Inga- If Rittenhouse supports Trump, then the 17 year old had no right to self-defense. He should have let the sex offender leftwing Biden supporting Nazi and the other antifa terrorist criminal goon mow him down and do whatever they wanted. Then the leftwing Biden supporting terrorists could carry on with their democrat party approved destruction of property.
Do I have that right, Chuck?
What was the 17 y.o. doing out there alone? I blame the parents. They should have sent his younger sister with him.
"Rosenbaum...Huber....Grosskreutz..."
Guys with their records in close proximity can only be recruited enforcers.
17 year old doing what cops should be doing.
I have no sympathy for dead leftwing Nazi antifa Biden/Hillary/Bernie supporting terrorists/arsonists with criminal histories.
I'd like to see more dead leftwing antifa terrorists.
However it happens.
Registered sex offender for a sex crime involving a minor and criminal history that includes charges of battery & repeat domestic abuse?
Well.
No wonder LLR-lefty Chuck, known for threatening women and attacking children at Althouse blog, likes these guys so much.
The only thing that could make these 3 bigger heroes to Chuck would be if they had a history of attacking conservatives with strong military records.
Because Chuck REALLY hates those guys.
Porche Bennett, 31,
Someone with that same amusing name, Porche Bennett, born 9/24/1985, has a pretty extensive criminal record; while trying to verify it's the same person (I think so), I found this amusing article from a REAL fake-news outfit, in India ("Cash Up Front"), which takes legit fake-news and changes some of the words using a computer so they don't get caught plagiarizing;
Wisconsin Town Heart Burns Amid Protests Over Police Taking pictures Of Black Guy
"Video displays Blake strolling towards the driving force’s aspect door of his automobile, clear of two officials who had been pointing weapons to his again. After he opens the door, seven photographs ring out with one of the crucial officials tugging at his blouse."
Chaucer wrote when a judge fails to condemn violence, he is effectively ordering violence.
The Democratics in charge or the cities and areas allowing this are directly responsible for this.
Can we all agree a 17 year old has no business getting a rifle and going to a city where he doesn't live to confront a mob?
Who thinks this is a good idea?
He absolutely did not deserve to be assaulted. I think he may have a reasonable argument that he acted in self defense.
But he should never have been there in the first place!
Clear pictures show one of the attackers Rittenhouse shot was holding a Glock.
https://twitter.com/cassandrarules/status/1298607523935682561
shall we all shed some tears for DEAD WHITE LEFTIST terrorists?
None from me.
Oh oh, the polls are hurting. Need to change commentary.
There was an outspoken young art prof on our campus, very left, very loud and a constant complainer about all that is.
He was fired a few years ago after being physically abusive to his wife.
Narr
No surprise to me, anyway
The guy that got shot in the head was trying to start another car dealership on fire. But I guess that’s beside the point. The other idiot attacked a person holding a rifle….with a skateboard. That’s just stupid. Really stupid. The guy that got shot in the arm, was carrying a handgun. I don’t agree with the adults that let a 17 year old out with a gun, but since Evers failed to do his job, it took a 17-year-old from Antioch to do it for him. Evers is worthless.
Is it common to refer to 36-year-old men as boys?
Ralph L said... "What was the 17 y.o. doing out there alone? I blame the parents."
What I'm seeing is that he's originally from the area and was there with a large group, but "somehow" got separated. There's a big piece of the story missing there -- how and why he got separated and what immediately preceded the chase in the first video. But take all that with a grain of salt. It's from the internet.
Then again, there's another video showing both of the deceased confronting the armed group earlier that night. The first guy who got shot is pretty aggressive here, having to be held back by friends and shouting for people to shoot him.
Here: https://twitter.com/Natsecuritynews/status/1298838931488698368
Is she aware of the history of those sweet boys who were shot?
They might think the bald 36-year-old sex offender was a boy because he was only 5'3" tall.
Spiros said...
This young man is a worthless prick. High school dropout, gun nut, a fat pig and unemployed.
Spiros knows all about this kid, who should not have been there, but you must know him pretty well Spiros. Do you hang out with the neo-Nazis ? I wonder how you know so much about them.
"Words, words, words, I'm so sick of words.
- Eliza Doolittle, in "My Fair Lady"
And note how "do little" seems appropriate for certain Democrat governors, Tony Evers not least among them. Alleged or self-proclaimed leaders "condemn" this or "deplore" that. Don't talk about it; do something about it. Or shut up and go home.
She knows them and they're "sweet" which suggests they were fully welcomed and involved. But somehow they're different as soon as they do something she wishes people would not recognize as part of her movement.
Wishful thinking.
I do agree with MJB Wolf's assessment. The details make a big difference. If the kid came to the riot and started shooting (definitely a murder charge), that is different than if he came and threatened to shoot everyone (almost definitely a crime, but which ones is dependent on what happened exactly), which is a lot different than if he got into an argument and things escalated (may or may not be a crime), or he was just there trying to protect property and the mob took exception (unlikely to be a crime), or if he was an armed gawker that the mob decided to target (almost certainly not a crime). (He is guilty of an illegal possession of a weapon crime, but they charged him with first degree murder which seems... stretching given the video evidence we have seen.)
As usual, our journalist class does not care. They have a narrative and are sticking to it.
The democrats and the media (but I repeat myself) do not care at all about the destruction of property..
No - they care about the power of the corrupt democrat party. That's it.
Sweet. Loving. They were the sweetest hearts, souls. I called Anthony my hippie guy... They were sweet guys.
"In 2012, [Anthony] Huber pled guilty to false imprisonment with a dangerous weapon and strangulation as domestic abuse. He appears to have violated the terms of his probation in 2016 and was sentenced to two years in state prison, most of it with time served. Huber was arrested again in 2018 for battery."
Of course, that might be considered sweet 'n' loving compared to other people she knows.
> https://twitter.com/Natsecuritynews/status/1298838931488698368
That's terrifying. Are the local governments really powerless to stop this? I have a hard time believing they are afraid of the rioters or want the riots to continue...
"NYT appears to be fair here." Agree on the factual reporting although there are more details on YouTube. But the NYT comments are very much the "view from 9th avenue".
Lileks:
"Finally I see the vandals work on a door I used that very day. How about that.
A suspect in a murder shot himself, false rumors spread that he’d been killed by cops, and hello it’s time to start looting the Target."
Rittenhouse missed the trifecta, but two out of three in his circumstance wasn't bad. Does the catch and release program apply to him?
The pack of rabid hyenas would have probably beat him to an inch of life had he not answered with his rifle.
"But he should never have been there in the first place!"
We've had a left wing mob-on-demand for ten years. Other people have a right to share the public square.
Ron Winkleheimer: "Chuck really, really, really, really doesn't understand the moment we are in."
Not only does he not understand the moment, but Chuck doesn't understand the moment from his pro-dem/socialist perspective, which compounds the problem.
If LLR-lefty Chuck were an actual conservative, he would employ rational frameworks to make sense of what he is seeing and adapt to it.
But LLR-lefty Chuck's feet are and have been deeply stuck in democrat concrete and he can't move, he can't adjust, he can't maneuever.
And that's how you confirm he has always been a man of the left who play acts at being conservative which is why he it required no effort at all for him to climb on board the AOC/Pelosi train.
Evers is worthless.
His claim to fame is being associated with Milwaukee's outstanding school system, which is a totally fucked-up mess and hurts the blacks in the school district and leads to even more inequality.
This is all speculation since no reporter seems to want to do the work to actually find out:
I think Rittenhouse was with a much larger group of armed men protecting some businesses from looting and arson, but at some point got separated from his group- maybe he wandered too far afield, or they left him behind. In any case, the videos we have are pretty clear- he was being chased long before he shot the first guy in the head. I think all three shootings were legitimate self-defense, though he will probably face other charges for just being there with the rifle from out of state.
What is interesting to me is that all three shooting victims had pretty serious criminal records- with convictions unrelated to protesting. It will be interesting to see what the NYTimes and WaPo choose to tell us about the innocent, nice boys. I suspect their actual pasts are whitewashed.
It is a shame that comments are not allowed by the newspaper - it would be interesting to see what the good people of WI say about it.
The media reports upon which Spiros bases his comments are starting to give of a odor of a Richard Jewell scapegoating. I guess white kids with below average IQ who like police rank lower than convicted felons in PC hierarchy.
"There's a big piece of the story missing there -- how and why he got separated and what immediately preceded the chase in the first video."
That's what the criminal case is going to hinge on. He was running from them before he is shown firing any shots, they fired a pistol at him, and he turned to face his attackers.
Why was he running? If he had done something - other than merely being there - to incite the chase, he might be convicted of murder. If the rioters initiated contact, he walks. He'll probably be convicted of any firearm possession charges that may apply in Wisconsin.
Holy cow! The New York Times - yes, the New York Times - is actually doing real journalism!
https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2020/08/27/prosecutors-might-want-to-rethink-murder1-nyt-praised-for-detailed-report-on-kyle-rittenhouses-movements-before-and-up-to-the-shootings/
"Can we all agree a 17 year old has no business getting a rifle and going to a city where he doesn't live to confront a mob?"
Yeah, I can agree with that. If my offspring announced they were going to do such a thing, I would hope that I could talk them out of it.
However...
which part of that situation puts it over the top? Is it the "rifle" part, the "city where he doesn't live" part, or the "confront a mob" part? If he were a resident of Kenosha, would his actions be more valid? What about if he traveled to Kenosha to confront the mob (minus the rifle), and got severely beaten or killed himself?
Rosenbaum looks like your typical white left nazi skinhead
...
At a peaceful gathering, that included barbecue for anyone at Civic Center Park Wednesday night, Porche Bennett, 31, a Kenosha native and local business owner, honored the memory of two Kenosha-area men who were shot and killed Tuesday.
-----------++++++
the men honored have been identified
The whole point of giving government a monopoly on violence is to avoid the sort of free-for-all that we've been seeing in these communities and the unpredictable (in the specifics--totally predictable in the general) violence and death.
This is what happens when local government abdicates its responsibilities.
"But he should never have been there in the first place!"
He was there because the police weren't.
The criminal record for Porche Bennett referenced above is from Nashville TN. The Wisconsin circuit court record for Porche Bennett consists only of 2 evictions in 2011.
DanTheMan said...
Can we all agree a 17 year old has no business getting a rifle and going to a city where he doesn't live to confront a mob?
------
How many 16 year olds left home to defend the Republic against the tyranny of the British? How many crossed state lines to defend their neighboring allied states in the Civil War?
Getting really sick of people acting like this guy shouldn't be willing to defend his country and the rule of law and order simply because he's a few months shy of his 18th birthday.
If you watch the video, this "kid" has better control and training than most adults I see at the range. He's also an EMT with plans to become a police officer, and was part of a group who went to Kenosha (which was barely 20 minutes away from where he lived) to help defend property and provide medical assistance as needed.
They brought rifles SOLELY for protection and self-defense, and were attacked by a mob of Antifa / BLM terrorists trying to burn shit down.
Kyle somehow got separated from his group, and a handful of criminals from the mob chased him for blocks, trying repeatedly to assault him with bricks and metal poles. A few were also armed with handguns.
Kyle did everything he could to try and get away from them, but ended up having to use deadly force to protect himself when they caught him.
If there was any justice left in America, this kid would be lifted up as a hero who put his own life on the line to take a stand against the evil and chaos that is destroying this country.
IMO, he is a true patriot, and we are going to need many more like him very soon...
DanTheMan said...
Can we all agree a 17 year old has no business getting a rifle and going to a city where he doesn't live to confront a mob?
Who thinks this is a good idea?
He absolutely did not deserve to be assaulted. I think he may have a reasonable argument that he acted in self defense.
But he should never have been there in the first place!
Actually, we can't. At 17, he's a member of the federal militia by law. He's from Illinois, and their state constitution is even more expansive- SECTION 1. MEMBERSHIP The State militia consists of all able-bodied persons residing in the State except those exempted by law. I haven't looked to see who they've exempted. But- there's a difference between "exempted" and "forbidden". Wisconsin refers to the unorganized militia in laws, but never defines it- so my best guess is it defaults to the federal definition.
But let me ask you this- if your house, your individual home- was under attack by rioters, and you had yourself and 5 children at home, 3 under 18, would you you tell your younger ones- "No, you can't use those guns to help protect us! You're too young!"?
If the authorities in Kenosha go through with prosecuting Rittenhouse for murder, or for possession of the rifle, I hope the sane citizens of the city do the right thing. Acquit him and tell the judge, the prosecutor, and the state to get fucked. Until and unless they start arresting, prosecuting, and imprisoning rioters, looters, arsonists and thugs in huge numbers, I don't want to hear a goddamn word about regular citizens carrying weapons to defend themselves.
Thank you Narayanan for the link to Andy Ngo's twitter.
Here's the information about the three guys who were shot:
Joseph Rosenbaum, 36, was the first one killed. Video allegedly shows him chasing teen shooter & throwing something at him. Rosenbaum was a registered sex offender for a sex crime involving a minor.
Anthony Huber, 26, was shot & killed in Kenosha, Wisc. at the BLM riot. He was filmed chasing down the armed teen and hitting him when he was on the ground with a skateboard. He has a criminal history that includes charges of battery & repeat domestic abuse.
The third who was shot (& survived) is Gaige Grosskreutz, 26. He's a member of the People’s Revolution Movement. He was filmed chasing after the teen w/a pistol. He was shot at close-range in the upper arm. He has a criminal record that includes being intoxicated & armed w/a gun.
So, those are the three "mostly peaceful protesters" who were "senselessly murdered".
Porche Bennett had a great start. But the second she defended the three thugs who were correctly shot by a public spirited citizen, she lost all respect.
If you can't tell the difference between good people and bad people, your'e one of the bad people. And your political movement should fail
Mark Jones said...
If the authorities in Kenosha go through with prosecuting Rittenhouse for murder, or for possession of the rifle, I hope the sane citizens of the city do the right thing.
It's a 50 - 50 area. He's going to have difficulty getting a jury with 12 decent human beings on it, so he's unlikely to be found not-guilty.
But, it's a 50 - 50 area, and he's clearly in the right with what he did. So the prosecution has little chance of getting a guilty verdict, on anything.
Were I his defense attorney, I'd advise the kid to go for a low key and less expensive defense, and a series of mistrials. It's a 50 - 50 area. If the prosecutor keeps on abusing a kid for defending himself, eventually the area is going to vote in a new prosecutor
The disarmed medic went to Kenosha to F@k Sh#t up ... see
https://www.facebook.com/The-Peoples-Movement-of-Milwaukee-106923321057366/
As far as I can determine, there was no looting or burning in Kenosha last night, even after midnight. It was said on a livestream that were 100 FBI agents there and that the police were arresting people. Can't find any info on that. I saw a livestream. The masked, dressed-in-black, goggled, knee-padded types were MIA and the protestors marched here and there, looking for Antifa, perhaps, to start trouble. But they didn't find it. When I stopped watching they were sitting in park, utterly exhausted.
DanTheMan said...
Can we all agree a 17 year old has no business getting a rifle and going to a city where he doesn't live to confront a mob?
Who thinks this is a good idea?
He's an American citizen willing to step up to protect innocent people from abuse by a mob. He should be celebrated, not condemned.
There's lots of 20 year old children wandering around, it's nice to see a 17 year old who's an adult.
He absolutely did not deserve to be assaulted. I think he may have a reasonable argument that he acted in self defense.
But he should never have been there in the first place!
He has an entirely legitimate self defense case.
The people who shouldn't' have been there are the rioting thugs. Rittenhouse? I'm glad he was there, he made the situation better.
But let me ask you this- if your house, your individual home- was under attack by rioters, and you had yourself and 5 children at home, 3 under 18, would you you tell your younger ones- "No, you can't use those guns to help protect us! You're too young!"?
I think he was asking for trouble to go there but we are going to see more pushback like this as violence is allowed by the Democrat officials. Including the Soros DAs.
A white guy from South Africa was calling mer "Boy" all this morning.
White people are weird.
Looks like the two dead men got what was coming to them. Note to self: Don't chase a man with rifle and threaten to brain him to death or shoot him. Hopefully Rittenhouse will get off, since it was obvious self-defense, but left-wing Judges don't seem to follow the law.
Funny how you can be attacked while having a gun (cf: Rittenhouse) or have someone grab your gun and try to take it away (cf: Georgia "Jogger") and if you shoot its not self-defense, its 1st degree murder.
If this 17 y/o boy gets convicted, he should get the same sentence as the 3 boys who murdered a College Co-ed in NYC, that is, probation.
There's s video of the boy and some others having an argument with the Antifa types, before the shooting. What was that all about? Again, its amazing how we don't get the BASIC FACTS from our DNC-media. They don't care to give us the WHO, WHAT or WHY of the riots, but the second they learned of the Rittenhouse's name, they went through every damn thing they could to find any linkage to Trump or the Republicans.
Do bullies respect those who kowtow to them? Of course not. And will they be back to bully the same victims over and over? Of course they will. As Chamberlain learned from Munich, appeasement simply doesn't work. It never works.
As the facts become more clear it is increasingly obvious that the hot takes the morning after the shooting were completely wrong. Now that we know who was killed and a bit of their history with law enforcement Porsche Bennett might want to tone down the "honoring" of the dead men. At least until the situation that lead to their deaths is completely understood.
I predict over the next days and weeks we will hear less and less about Kyle Rittenhouse, just has we've not heard an update on Umbrella Man, and the update on George Floyd's cause of death was barely covered by the main news outlets.
>>He was there because the police weren't.
I agree COMPLETELY that the police AND the National guard should be there. In force, and putting down that riot immediately. That's what they are for in times like this.
But that doesn't give a blank check to every teenage wannabee to grab a gun and go to Kenosha and "protect" random businesses. If it was his parent's place, I'd be right there reloading his magazines for him. But he had NO REASON AT ALL to be there.
>> How many 16 year olds left home to defend the Republic against the tyranny of the British?
Oh FFS. He's wasn't a soldier storming the beach at Normandy. He wasn't a minuteman at Lexington Green. He was a random teenager with NO CONNECTION AT ALL to the business he went to "defend". He's just a kid in WAY over his head.
>>Actually, we can't. At 17, he's a member of the federal militia by law.
Oh Please. Did I miss the part where the Feds called up the militia and said "Every teenager grab a rifle and go defend some random store in Kenosha"? Being in a militia is not a license to go to a riot and shoot people. Again, he may have had reason to shoot, but he should not have been there at all!
>But let me ask you this- if your house, your individual home- was under attack by rioters,
... then they would regret picking on me, my home, and my kids. And if they had rioted at his house in Illinois, I would defend his right to shoot them as many times as it took for the rioters to stop attacking his home or the family store.
If you think he's a hero or a patriot, you are deceiving yourself; he's a vigilante. And I suspect you, like me, are furious that riots are now apparently justifiable and allowed if the cause is politically correct.
I don't want to live in a country where looters and vandals get to riot for months on end and burn our cities to the ground.
I also don't want to live in a country where random 17 year olds decide it's up to them to arm up and restore order.
The useful idiots, aka peaceful protesters, sure do make a nice picnic to fill the hours before the nightly riot.
DanTheMan said...
Can we all agree a 17 year old has no business getting a rifle and going to a city where he doesn't live to confront a mob?
No.
17 years
(a) The militia of the United States consists of all able-bodied males at least 17 years of age and, except as provided in section 313 of title 32 , under 45 years of age who are, or who have made a declaration of intention to become, citizens of the United States and of female citizens of the United States who are ...
House.gov › uscode › view › chapte...
[USC02] 10 USC Ch. 12: THE MILITIA - United States Code
Was it imprudent? Maybe so. Prudence is submission, raising the fist, heiling the Hitler, taking the chocolate, huddling in bed at night while the mob rages and sweeping up the rubble of your life in the morning. This country wasn't founded on prudence.
All three shootings were righteous. I've seen no clear evidence that even the possession of his weapon was illegal. Kid did good, it's regrettable that a) that the authorities are evil and b) he didn't wear a mask and avoid being identified.
Young Kyle did good work that night. The three people he shot were hardened criminals, very likely enforcers for antifa, which is why they were the ones chasing him.
Note that all three of them were identified in the opening scene where Rosenbaum demanded someone shoot him. Coincidence, or was that the phase of the riot where they put their hard cases up front looking to start a mill?
Maybe they were there to look over the opposition and identify weak ones to cull from the herd. Maybe they targeted Kyle and he was on the list for that night. Like the Nazi in Indiana Jones: The Last Crusade, they chose poorly.
No Dan,
But that doesn't give a blank check to every teenage wannabee to grab a gun and go to Kenosha and "protect" random businesses. If it was his parent's place, I'd be right there reloading his magazines for him. But he had NO REASON AT ALL to be there.
US foreign policy for the past 75 years has consisted of fighting them over there so we don't have to fight them over here. The kid is an emblem of all that's right with the world. It's disgraceful that he should be getting any flak whatsoever.
"I don't want...... I also don't want..."
You seem confused.
The first thing you don't want is happening.
That choice was made by others.
And they don't care what you want.
The second thing you don't want is inevitable because the first thing you don't want is happening.
That choice was made by others.
How did you come to the idea that what you want is important when facts to the contrary exist?
When are you going to recognize that nobody cares what you want?
Maybe when you turn 17 you will put aside those childish things.
Dan,
Oh FFS. He's wasn't a soldier storming the beach at Normandy. He wasn't a minuteman at Lexington Green.
He kinda was, actually.
He was a random teenager with NO CONNECTION AT ALL to the business he went to "defend". He's just a kid in WAY over his head.
No, he was asked to take part, not sure of the connection but it was not random. As for over his head, he seems to have done well. Three of the enemy are out of action, their absence a boon to society.
I don't want to live in a country where looters and vandals get to riot for months on end and burn our cities to the ground.
I also don't want to live in a country where random 17 year olds decide it's up to them to arm up and restore order.
The pity is that this is your binary choice. I'm sure that Lucky Ned Pepper liked neither of the alternatives of being killed by Rooster Cogburn in one minute, or being hanged at Judge Parker's convenience.
Yet he must needs choose.
So we must all needs choose.
"If not me, who? If not now, when?"
Birkel,
Your insults aside, I came to the ideas I have by experience and training. As a police officer, I worked in a part of town that most people wouldn't go into for a million bucks. I did it for a lot less.
My training and experience suggests that there are proven ways to put down a riot. These techniques were learned the hard way during the 60's.
Hoping random teenagers will show up and defend random businesses is not how you put down a riot.
I agree completely the rioters don't care what I want. They are adult children having temper tantrum, and breaking things.
I am not saying that the facts don't matter. I'm saying the facts of this particular case should be a cause for alarm, not celebration.
Since you like facts so much, please try to stick to them, and skip the gratuitous insults. They say much more about your maturity than mine.
>>The pity is that this is your binary choice.
I didn't present this as a choice between two alternatives! I said it was two possible futures, neither of which I want.
>>"If not me, who? If not now, when?"
As for who: "Not you. The Kenosha PD, the state police, and the national guard" Our horrible political class is allowing this to happen. That's who we should all be furious with.
As for when: "Not after months, but the day the riots start. Put them down."
>>No, he was asked to take part, not sure of the connection but it was not random.
That would change things a bit, I agree. I'll go google and see if he was indeed responding to a specific request for help.
"I don't want to live in a country where looters and vandals get to riot for months on end and burn our cities to the ground. I also don't want to live in a country where random 17 year olds decide it's up to them to arm up and restore order."
Guessing a lot of folks agree with that, but, here we are. So long as we have the former we are at risk of getting the latter.
Vote the bums out that won't put a stop to the violence. Your life depends on it.
DanTheMan,
Nothing you just typed mattered.
You want things that are not.
I see the world as it stands.
What I want cannot matter less.
The people who want and are acting (rioters) have the initiative.
The elected officials want those same things.
The police are frozen by a lack of institutional support.
Now we are down to what options actually exist.
What you leftists are failing to recognize in your zeal to hang a 17-year-old kid is ... he was just a 17-year-old kid ... who took down two of your thugs and winged another.
Just what the fuck do you think is going to happen when those of us who are older, more experienced and better trained get tired of putting up with your shit?
Crack
“A white guy from South Africa was calling mer "Boy" all this morning.
White people are weird.”
Did. Not. Happen.
"Hoping random teenagers will show up and defend random businesses is not how you put down a riot."
Well, it's certainly not optimal. But given that the (Democratic) authorities refuse to do anything about wanton thuggery, looting, and arson, what do you expect to happen? People aren't going put up with that shit indefinitely. If the authorities refuse to act, individuals will.
That kid did nothing wrong, except refuse to be interviewed and wear a mask so he, like the antifa shits, could disappear afterwards.
wildswan said...
As far as I can determine, there was no looting or burning in Kenosha last night, even after midnight. It was said on a livestream that were 100 FBI agents there and that the police were arresting people.
Gosh. Do you mean that, if the political will to stop the riots is there, the riots get stopped?!?
Inconceivable!
I’m afraid DanTheNan is right. The kid should have stayed home. That said, based on the video I saw, I would vote to acquit if on his jury, on the grounds that we all possess a natural right of self-defense, and as a natural right it is utterly unalienable. Just because you went looking for trouble doesn’t mean you can’t defend yourself when it finds you.
DanTheMan said...
I came to the ideas I have by experience and training. As a police officer....
Hoping random teenagers will show up and defend random businesses is not how you put down a riot.
Ah, so you're one of the horrible "professionals" who gets upset when normal people show you up by "doing your job" better than you.
So much is explained
I agree COMPLETELY that the police AND the National guard should be there. In force, and putting down that riot immediately. That's what they are for in times like this.
But that doesn't give a blank check to every teenage wannabee to grab a gun and go to Kenosha and "protect" random businesses.
Yes, it does. You don't want the rest of us "doing the job of the police"? Then do your job, every time, everywhere.
When politicians chose to restrain the police and keep them from protecting the populace from their thugs, it is not just the right, but the duty, of real American citizens to band together and stop those thugs.
By Any Means Necessary
'A white guy from South Africa was calling mer "Boy" all this morning.'
Why do you hate African-Americans, kaffir?
"As far as I can determine, there was no looting or burning in Kenosha last night, even after midnight. It was said on a livestream that were 100 FBI agents there and that the police were arresting people."
Evers saved Kenosha! {/sarc}
Free citizens should not wait for authorities to solve their problems, DanTheMan.
Government is a necessary evil, at best.
Depending on it has proven a bad idea.
Disagree?
Be specific as to why.
"Hoping random teenagers will show up and defend random businesses is not how you put down a riot."
True. Here's how you put down a riot:
1: Vote straight ticket GOP every election
2: Never, ever, vote for anyone backed by Soros
3: When you have a gov't controlled by Democrats, all good people should show up with guns and shoot anyone who is rioting
What do you say? #3 is illegal? So is rioting.
If you're not going to enforce the law on your favorites, we're not bound, either
If you are part of a mob chasing someone down, and then beat him over the head with your skateboard while he’s on the ground, I am not going to mourn when you get shot.
>>Ah, so you're one of the horrible "professionals" who gets upset when normal people show you up by "doing your job" better than you. So much is explained
First of all, I'm no longer an officer and haven't been one for quite a while.
I disagree with what you imagined my motive to be, but in fairness I am in complete agreement with you that the police are not doing their jobs, one of which is to put down riots and stop looting and arson. Why they are not is a separate question.
Where we part company I suspect is that this means that well-intentioned kids with guns should go do what the police will not.
Driving down the street in an armored car gassing people isn't my idea of good police work. You could have dozen armored cars driving 24x7 and it will not stop a riot.
In battle, they say tanks can take anything but hold nothing. We are seeing something similar here. Armored cars can temporarily move rioters from one block to the next. Nothing more. But they look impressive and are really cool toys. :(
>>When politicians chose to restrain the police and keep them from protecting the populace from their thugs, it is not just the right, but the duty, of real American citizens to band together and stop those thugs.
I agree, with the additional requirement that you are protecting something tangible that is yours. Other people, with much less noble intent, can arm and band together, too. Public shootouts between armed factions is Somalia, not the USA.
>>I’m afraid DanTheNan is right. The kid should have stayed home. That said, based on the video I saw, I would vote to acquit if on his jury,
Based on what I've seen, the only question would be why he shot the first guy. If he had some reasonable basis for doing that, I vote with you.
The others seem to be very clearly self defense.
Larvell,
And I am not going to cheer.
Or criticize the person who acted in fear of their life.
From the article:
"This is what we do. Peaceful stuff... We get out here hang out together and be peaceful and demand justice."
So "No justice, no peace" isn't a thing any more?
>>Free citizens should not wait for authorities to solve their problems, DanTheMan.
>>Disagree? Be specific as to why.
In a general sense, I agree. Specifically, if rioters are threatening your business or your home, then take the action you need to to protect what is yours. I'll be right there with you if you need me.
As citizens, we have decided that we will have an rational system of law and order, where those accused and arrested get a fair hearing and trial. We have decided that is better than armed gangs dispensing 'instant justice'.
You seem to be proposing teams of vigilantes, who arm themselves and "solve problems" (like riots, I assume). This would have the unintended consequence of opposing teams arming and fighting back. Riots are horrific breakdowns of social order. Worse is armed factions going to war in our cities.
Protecting us from such nightmares is job #1 for our police, and that's not happening. Why not is an excellent question.
I would support your armed bands of "problem solvers" as an absolute last resort. Hell, I might even join up.
I just don't think we are there yet, and I hope that we can find our way back.
Is that specific enough?
"...we have decided that we will have an rational system of law and order,..."
Be specific about who this "we" is.
Because I doubt seriously I agree that the "we" currently exists.
You needed to pay more attention to buwaya and me these last few years.
You and Althouse are living in the distant past.
The past is a foreign country.
Sorry, but it's true.
DanTheMan,
This is an example of "we"
https://www.wsls.com/news/virginia/2020/08/26/virginia-senate-passes-bill-allowing-assaulting-a-police-officer-to-be-a-misdemeanor/?outputType=amp#click=https://t.co/3bFKHVNk9G
Virginia legislature reduces penalties for attacking police officers.
I wish we were living in the world of 20 years ago.
We ain't there.
DanTheMan said...
>>When politicians chose to restrain the police and keep them from protecting the populace from their thugs, it is not just the right, but the duty, of real American citizens to band together and stop those thugs.
I agree, with the additional requirement that you are protecting something tangible that is yours. Other people, with much less noble intent, can arm and band together, too. Public shootouts between armed factions is Somalia, not the USA.
A society that is free from rioting and political intimidation by the Left is something that should be mine, and that I am willing to fight to keep.
The Democrats want to turn the US into Somalia. Letting them get away with their rioting is a step along that path.
Kyle showed up there with a group of the unorganized militia. He got separated from them, and was forced to defend himself, which he did admirably.
His, and their, actions were in the finest traditions of our founders. He, and they, shoudl be celebrated, not castigated
DanTheMan said...
>>Actually, we can't. At 17, he's a member of the federal militia by law.
Oh Please. Did I miss the part where the Feds called up the militia and said "Every teenager grab a rifle and go defend some random store in Kenosha"? Being in a militia is not a license to go to a riot and shoot people. Again, he may have had reason to shoot, but he should not have been there at all!
The militia CAN be called up, but it is also part of our history that the militia be self organizing when necessary. Calling them by the negative term vigilantes allows you a professional to feel righteous. But you admit the police- the politicians- aren't doing their jobs. That's when citizens take action.
It's been a while since we've had a successful armed revolution in America. The last was in 1945. Do you the returning GIs at Battle of Athens were wrong for taking on corrupt law enforcement by armed revolution? I think this particular episode in US history isn't taught in schools because it expressly demonstrates the meaning of the 2nd amendment.
Now when the people get downright tired of the authorities not protecting them from a mob, or even an individual the people will get together and do something, unless they're complete sheeple. This was in 1981- and I seem to recall reading about a similar incident while in HS- and I graduated in 1973.
The militia is not an outdated concept. But we've been a peaceful nation for so long people have forgotten both it's existence and why it existed. It was the militia refusing to give up their arms to the regulars that started the shooting part of our Revolution. And looks like the Democrat platform of this year wants to repeat that.
>>Virginia legislature reduces penalties for attacking police officers. I wish we were living in the world of 20 years ago. We ain't there.
You may well be right. We are all victims of our experience. Mine suggests this great country can survive this madness.
But I am open to the idea that I could be completely wrong, and I have prepared accordingly.
>>He, and they, should be celebrated, not castigated
I'd suggest neither one. He should be treated as warning of worse to come when politicians decide to let their cities burn.
DanTheMan said...
>>>>He, and they, should be celebrated, not castigated
>>I'd suggest neither one. He should be treated as warning of worse to come when politicians decide to let their cities burn.
The way you do that is to celebrate his actions, fight to protect him, and in general work to make sure the politicians know that calling off the cops just gets their footsoldiers shot, instead of merely arrested
We agree on that, if we knew what the politicians' goals were.
Perhaps they are succeeding beyond their expectations.
Another senseless skateboard incident.When are we going to get common sense skateboard control?
Post a Comment