June 25, 2020

"Personally I see no need for presidential debates. I'm voting Biden. Nothing Trump can say will make me change my mind"/"Oh so because you've made a decision that's it? Yea, I need to see these two nitwits make fools of themselves"/"If you have not yet made up your mind, you're the nitwit."

Comments on the WaPo column "It’s time to rethink the presidential debates" by Karen Tumulty. Tumulty is only proposing that the debates take place in a TV studio with no audience, but I expect to see a push to eliminate the debates. Not campaigning has been working well for Biden, and not debating is another step in the do-nothing game. Will he look worse doing the debate or worse avoiding the debate? I think the press will do what it can to make him look especially principled, lofty, and judicious as he declines to appear in the presence of the orange monster.

76 comments:

Sharc 65 said...

Rat Own.

DEEBEE said...

That seems a bit Biden-esque “u ain’t black”

bbkingfish said...

Hasn't the Biden campaign already agreed to three debates?

I looked it up...

The Commission on Presidential Debates announced that there will be a total of three general election presidential debates this year, all taking place in states President Trump won in 2016. The debates will start at 9 P.M. and run for 90 minutes without any commercial breaks.

Sept. 29 at the University of Notre Dame (Notre Dame, Indiana)
Oct. 15 at the Adrienne Arsht Center (Miami, Florida)
Oct. 22 at Belmont University (Nashville, Tennessee)

stevew said...

Absolutely. No debates, no campaign. Let's vote now.

rehajm said...

I like that Ann is sounding suspicious like the rest of us...

n.n said...

The Orange-American is on a winning streak.

Federal Judge Upholds Trump Administration Rule Requiring Hospitals to Disclose Negotiated Prices

Jamie said...

In a non-election year, I'd be willing to entertain the idea that presidential debates are silly, that candidates should simply have to (e.g.) construct written responses to policy questions. I could see that, maybe.

But now? A few months from the election, when one candidate is obviously not just comfortable but eager to be live on camera, and the other only appears in pre-recorded short segments and even then can't hold it together?

That smacks of ex-post-facto. It's hard for me to believe anyone doesn't see through it - but if course lots and lots of people don't, in fact, see through it.

Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...

It is fair to conclude at this point that Trump is unfit for office. It was actually fair to conclude this after Charlottesville. How hard is to say, 'There are no fine people marching with Nazis'.

rehajm said...

Of course Karen is covering for Joe but she's sort of right about not needing debates. They are dated and not constructive. Gotcha TV in the age of social media is a waste...

Yancey Ward said...

Biden cannot win from his basement, and cannot win by debating and campaigning like a normal candidate. This is why I expect the Democrats to replace him at the convention. The Democrats have taken the first step- they are doing what is essentially a virtual convention- this solves the problem of protests on the floor and in Milwaukee itself when it is clear they are ditching Biden for someone who isn't Bernie Sanders.

Wa St Blogger said...

This is the opening salvo to soften the beach on the Island of NoDebate. The left KNOWS Biden's campaign will be decimated by a debate, but his campaign cannot eschew the debates directly. First the debates have to be deemed pointless, and then maybe even racist or "designed to serve Republican interests". The media will push this continuously and any attempts by Republicans to challenge the narrative will be proof that the original premise is right. Otherwise, why would Republicans insist on debates unless they are a tool of Republican oppression, racism and vote suppression?

Unknown said...

KAREN Tumulty?

Skeptical Voter said...


My observation is that Ms. Karen Tumulty knows from nitwits, being one herself. In 2016 I voted "not Hillary". My daughter in 2020 will vote "not Trump". I do plan to vote "not Biden", not that Trump is all that and a bag of chips, but he's better than Biden.

Yancey Ward said...

Updated spreadsheets on Covid-19. First link is US data and Wisconsin data along with a chart for 7-Day moving average of deaths. Second link is a broader range of individual state data.

US Data with WI
Other individual states

Still waiting for the spike in new cases to result in a spike of new deaths. So far, hasn't happened. Beginning to think it won't.

Ingachuck'stoothlessARM said...

there will be no debatin'

...and there will be no (D) Biden

YoungHegelian said...

Will he look worse doing the debate or worse avoiding the debate?

The debates are not for the already converted. The debates are for that slice of the electorate that's undecided. If Biden doesn't do the debates, which by now are a electoral tradition, it'll make him look weak.

rcocean said...

Of course. The media need to push image of Biden as "The Moderate" and "The former VP who can run the country". The more you see of Biden, the more you realize neither is true.

During the D debates, the others rarely laid a glove on Biden, either they were too busy attacking someone else, or they got drowned out in the all the noise. And when they did hit Biden, he wasn't very good at defending himself. In fact, most of the time his responses were incoherent or variations on "Come on, man".

With the media attacking Trump 24/7, and giving Biden literally $Billions in unpaid advertising, Biden can sit back in his basement and say to the media and Trump: "I'll let you two fight".

Ken B said...

Nice to see Karen Tumulty is looking out for those poor benighted undecided voters who foolishly want to see for themselves.

Ken B said...

Of course this is part of a plan to avoid debating Trump. Or avoid having to seem coherent and able to respond sensibly for more than a few moments.

Yancey Ward said...

To make my point more explicit- Today, Texas has had 132,000 confirmed cases of COVID-19 and 2300 deaths, with a 7 day moving average of 27 deaths/day. At the same point of 132,000 cases of COVID-19, New York state already had 4900 deaths and a 7 day moving average of 600 new deaths/day- 20 times Texas' rate today.

In fact, there is no state in the country right now anywhere close to the fatality rates New York observed at the same point of cases. There is no reason to expect it to happen, either.

We are probably doing a better job protecting the most vulnerable, doing a better job of treating the most vulnerable, or the virus is just mutating into a less deadly form. Right now, the real danger is that we get stampeded into another idiotic lockdown.

Ingachuck'stoothlessARM said...

"What I what to know is: What did Biden know,

...and when did he forget it?" --- G.PapaD

rcocean said...

538 had an analysis of why the polls aren't as bad as they look for trump, but the whole thing was so badly written (with a confusing graph) that I doubt it persuaded anyone. This will be a turnout election in key states. Blacks vote 90% D, and Hispanics, Jews, Other minorities vote 2-1 D, no matter what. So it all hinges on who turns out. Being able to poll "Turnout enthusiasm" is very difficult, and doing it in the states that matter is even more hard.

That said, I'm not optimistic. I'd say its a coin toss at this point. Trump is almost battling alone against the Media, the D's, and the RINOs.

Mark said...

No debates.

Look -- BIDEN DOES NOT ANSWER TO YOU.

Who the hell do you think you are, expecting him to answer questions?

You are treading on dangerous ground here.

rcocean said...

If Biden does back out of the debates, he will use CV-19 as the excuse.

"I've come down with CV-19 and at my age, I can't risk a debate. I'll have to suspend the campaign for 2 weeks. See you again in Mid-October!"

Dave Begley said...

Voters wouldn’t stand for it. Biden wouldn’t dare duck out.

Narayanan said...

US HiTech is well positioned to impose a cone of silence on Trump so they can unleash KAOS

MayBee said...

If there's no audience, they don't need to be in a studio together. And if they aren't in a studio together, Joe can be at home talking to his computer screen with someone helping him off camera.

Oso Negro said...

I want to see Joe Biden burst into fluent gibberish while debating Donald Trump. Let the entire country be clear as to what is happening.

Drago said...

It will be important for all the lefties and Beijing Boys to begin jheavy recycling of all the old debunked lie/narratives/talking points in order to help cover for Biden's clear dementia/hiding out in the basement as well as the inevitable refusal to debate.

On top of that, the Covid ploy has already failed twice and we will see if this 3rd go-round with transferring guilt from democrat governors to Trump will work in addition to the protests now going seriously off the rails for the dems.

I wouldn't be surprised if we see our usual suspects revert back to russia collusion, hookers in Moscow, lies about what Trump said regarding Charlottesville, number of scoops of ice cream Mara Lago, how Trump feeds goldfish, Trump made a democrat in AZ poison her husband with chloroquine variants not meant for human consumption, etc.

chickelit said...

Biden needs to present himself like a man or risk looking like the pussy that he is.

Who is Karen Tumulty and why should I even care what she thinks?

chickelit said...

Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...It is fair to conclude at this point that Trump is unfit for office. It was actually fair to conclude this after Charlottesville. How hard is to say, 'There are no fine people marching with Nazis'.

ARM repeats the lie for the umpteenth time. Why not try out a new lie, ARM?

steve uhr said...

Biden will do just fine in the debates. He was ok in the primary debates and trump is close to a nervous breakdown. Much more likely he will spend 2022 in prison than in the White House.

narciso said...

The tenacity of
@SidneyPowell1
is remarkable. If she were defending a leftist client, she would be the toast of the town, profiled glowingly in every corporate media outlet. Remember the amazing work that one determined person can accomplish in the face of media/Resistance mobs.
Quote Tweet

Will Chamberlain 🇺🇸
@willchamberlain
· Jun 24
Reminder that @SidneyPowell1 turned around a case where her client pled guilty in federal court twice, and obtained a full exoneration

One of the best lawyers in the country
Show this thread
12:18 PM · Jun 24, 2020·Twitter Web App

chickelit said...

It would be funny to see Trump drive Biden into a show of televised anger. I think he could do it and I'd love to see it happen.

RK said...

But we'll still have the Vice President debates, right?

Rory said...

Hold the debates outdoors, in rural areas. No moderators, just a timekeeper.

gspencer said...

Biden really is becoming the Being There would-be president. The leftist media will make anything stupid Biden says as having as much deep wisdom as Chauncey Gardiner.

Two-eyed Jack said...

ARM, what you are posing is equivalent to the proposition "Nazis will not march with fine people." Is that hard to say? Is it true?

Why not restrict your attacks on Trump to things he really said or did?

Michael K said...

This is the opening salvo to soften the beach on the Island of NoDebate. The left KNOWS Biden's campaign will be decimated by a debate,

I think so, too. I could imagine some sort of virtual debate with lots of help for Biden out of the TV screen. Sort of like an off-screen Candy Crowley.

I do not expect live debates.

steve uhr said...
Biden will do just fine in the debates. He was ok in the primary debates and trump is close to a nervous breakdown. Much more likely he will spend 2022 in prison than in the White House.


Next Steve will tell us those 16 statues in Boston self destructed.

gspencer said...

"Of course Karen is covering for Joe but she's sort of right about not needing debates. They are dated and not constructive."

No, no, no.

The debates are so needed because they allow us to take the measure of the person when they're in an uncomfortable spot. Like the witness appearing in court, the jury gets to look him/her over, shifty eyes and all. Do they answer confidently, or do they waver on key elements of the case being tried. And the debates show if a candidate is quick on his/her if a curve ball makes its way into the format. For sure Biden's gonna have a hard time with that. But that's the point. To see them in action.

MikeR said...

I too don't see any earthly reason for Biden to debate. He is the empty seat candidate and it is working well for him.

MikeR said...

I too don't see any earthly reason for Biden to debate. He is the empty seat candidate and it is working well for him.

gspencer said...

"Who is Karen Tumulty?"

A frumpy denizen of the leftist DC press (with emphasis on the frumpy part). Played Tic-Tac-Toe on the professional circuit, then moved up to play checkers with Helen Thomas.

Plans to haunt houses part-time when she retires from her full-time job working for Democrats.

JAORE said...

"It is fair to conclude at this point that Trump is unfit for office. It was actually fair to conclude this after Charlottesville. How hard is to say, 'There are no fine people marching with Nazis'."

Ah yes. The (obvious) lie that has been definitively debunked. I see you may be adding an escape hatch with the "marching with". As if sharing a street makes you clones. If you were honest yet still held your burning hatred of Trump,that last line might have been a question, "How hard was it for Trump when he said there are no fine people in the Nazi group"?

By the way, our hostess called this lie "disqualifying" when Biden repeated it.

But, go ahead, Arm. You do you.

Mike Sylwester said...

Democracy Dies in Darkness!

MartyH said...

If Biden does not debate Trump, it will be ridiculously easy to paint Democrats as the afraid party. Biden is afraid to debate Trump. Democrats are afraid to hold a real convention. Democrats are afraid vote in person. Democrats would rather live safely in a cage than risk harm in the wild. Democrats insist that you stay in a cage rather than decide for yourself if you want to risk harm in the wild.

The conventions will be where this contrast is most apparent. There will be a boisterous, energetic, optimistic, traditional Republican convention. After the delegates from each of the fifty greatest states are pledged, Trump will give a rousing speech that will fire up Republicans.

The Democrat convention will be small and drab by comparison. Delegates will vote quietly and safely from home. Everyone will wear masks-maybe even Biden as he takes the podium to give a bland speech, indistinguishable from the rest of the convention. The will be no enthusiasm generated for Biden or the Democrats; it will be a pepless rally.

Hillary showed you could lose a sure thing by not campaigning in key states. We'll see if not campaigning at all yields the same result for Biden.

bagoh20 said...

I agree that nobody needs a train wreck, but if I know when one is gonna happen, I wouldn't miss it.



Bruce Hayden said...

Here is the problem with the Dems bailing on debates. It is an article of faith that debates wi elections for Democrats, starting with JFK beating Nixon, due to the latter’s 5 o’clock shadow. They will, of course, cheat to help them, as they did for Crooked Hillary and St. Obama. And if the Dem doesn’t actually win the debates, they will produce biased polls to declare them the victor anyway. If they ail this time, then what is the incentive the next tie the Republicans are running a incumbent, or even a very strong candidate, to debate the Democrat?

The problem that I see with Biden trying to do a basement debate, is that Trump will call him out for it. Trump is the incumbent here, and if he decides that he doesn’t like the format, if they try to change it on him, he can just walk away, and point out that they are trying to cheat, and are scared to debate him under the normal rules.

NMObjectivist said...

Personally I see no need for presidential debates. I'm voting Trump. Nothing Trump can say will make me change my mind.

So same.

cubanbob said...

steve uhr said...
Biden will do just fine in the debates. He was ok in the primary debates and trump is close to a nervous breakdown. Much more likely he will spend 2022 in prison than in the White House."

You have Trump confused with Biden. Biden can't even speak and Biden is the one who will soon looking for a criminal defense lawyer.

bagoh20 said...

The nation is going through a very tough time right now, but only due to very recent developments after a record breaking, even unprecedented success in Trump's first term by any of a bunch of key metrics. The only reason we are in the current disasters is because 1) Democrats in power over-reacted to a serious, but manageable epidemic. There responses led to thousands of unnecessary deaths during and after the epidemic. 2) Democrats overreacted to a disturbing, but possibly unavoidable death at the hands of police. It's quite likely George Floyd was going to die that day regardless of who arrested him once a man in his physical condition decided to take a near fatal dose of the most dangerous drug ever on the street and then decide to commit a crime that would get him arrested, and then decide to resist the cops. His chances of surviving that are not good even if the officers acted with more restraint. That's at least what the autopsy suggests.

Bottom line is the only real problem we had under Trump was Democrats over-reacting to just about everything, including Trump himself every. single. day. Imagine the last 4 years without the Democrats over-reaching, over-reacting, over-playing every chance they had. If they just accepted a valid election of the President of the United States by the people under their Constitution. That's all we needed to be far ahead of where we are today as a nation.

I don't understand how you can vote for anyone who was a part of that endless clusterfuck of an opposing party.

All the serious problems we are currently in the middle of are actually meeting the long festering desires and hopes of some people. These painful problems you are experiencing are actually a good thing to a lot of people. Those people wanted, encouraged, and helped bring those problems to your door. Now they want you to vote for them, becuase of the those same problems. Do they think you are an idiot?

bagoh20 said...

Democracy dies in weakness.

Drago said...

steve uhr: "Biden will do just fine in the debates. He was ok in the primary debates and trump is close to a nervous breakdown. Much more likely he will spend 2022 in prison than in the White House."

Ah yes. As expected, here comes Li'l Stevie with his warmed over 2017 schtick.

It's like the last 3 years never even happened at all.

Hey Stevie, tell us all about how Trump paying hookers to pee on beds in Moscow disqualifies Trump from serious voter consideration?

LOL

The lefties really don't have anything else anymore, do they? The Narrative cupboard is bare so its time to dig stuff out of the lefty trash pile....

techsan said...

@MayBee
If there's no audience, they don't need to be in a studio together. And if they aren't in a studio together, Joe can be at home talking to his computer screen with someone helping him off camera.

It would be helpful if government officials would publish a safe distance for people to maintain. Then the citizens running for office could follow those guidelines and still provide an important service to the electorate.

Not Sure said...

This Karen is pitching Weekend at Bernie's III to the Biden campaign. I think they might green-light it.

jpg said...

Yeah, easy to say, but I've never believed he'll go through with debates. Trump would shred him. Of course, I'm still doubting he'll be on the ballot on election day.

Rt41Rebel said...

I keep waiting for the critics of Biden to point out the obvious. He's literally Max Headroom running for Potus.

Churchy LaFemme: said...

A guy named Pete gets a job as a switchman with the railroad, and undergoes weeks of training. The supervisor then takes him into the switch booth to test his readiness. The following exchange takes place:

Supervisor: "Imagine you were sitting here alone and you learned there was a train coming from the North on that track, and another coming from the South on the same track. What would you do?"

Pete: "I'd throw this switch right here and put one train on the other track."

Supervisor: And what if that switch didn't work?"

Pete: "I'd go down to the track and throw that big switch lever there, putting one train on the other track."

Supervisor: "And what if that switch lever didn't work?"

Pete: "Then I'd come back here and call the dispatcher to stop both trains."

Supervisor: "And what if the phone didn't work?"

Pete: "Then I'd go to that gas station across the street and use their phone."

Supervisor: "And what if their phone didn't work?"

Pete: "Then I'd go get Uncle Joe."

Supervisor: "Uncle Joe??? What would he do?"

Pete: "Nothing, but he ain't never seen a train wreck."

readering said...

There were no general election debates in 1980. That did not go well for the incumbent.

alanc709 said...

"Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...
It is fair to conclude at this point that Trump is unfit for office. It was actually fair to conclude this after Charlottesville. How hard is to say, 'There are no fine people marching with Nazis'."

It's fair to conclude the ARM is a brainless idiot. Hey, ARM: how many fine people are marching with the violent fascist protesters?

JAORE said...

Headline of August 4, 2020:

Joe Biden emerges from his basement, sees his shadow and returns to the basement for six more weeks.

clint said...

@ readering said... "There were no general election debates in 1980. That did not go well for the incumbent."

You're getting an awful lot of work out of that adjective, 'general'.

Reagan debated Carter. The fact that Anderson wasn't invited to that debate doesn't make it a particularly apt comparison to the situation if Biden refuses to debate Trump.

stlcdr said...

I'm surprised that any poll shows Trump showing any numbers above zero. There is not one thing positive - or even neutral - said about Trump that isn't drowned out by a crazy with a bullhorn.

Jamie said...

ARM leads with a proposition that is - shall we say - not self-evident: "It is fair to conclude at this point that Trump is unfit for office."

Naturally, no support provided; no reasons given. Hey, let me try!

It is fair to conclude at this point that Democrats are not fit for office, as we see how Democrat governors have caused thousands of deaths of the elderly and vulnerable thanks to their own - no one else's - policies during this pandemic, followed by their craven attempts to blame their terrible state-level decision-making on the federal government and specifically Trump, and as we see how Democrat mayors have repeatedly, in Baghdad Bob fashion, "mischaracterized" (to be charitable) protests-turned-riots, destruction of public and private property, commandeering public and private property at gunpoint, and intentional injury of hundreds of cops and innocent bystanders, as "largely peaceful" and even "summer of love" - while their cities burn and their civic history is smashed, and as we see how Democrat lawmakers continue to shoehorn Democrat vanity projects into unrelated bills, block even debate - not just block voting, but block even debate - on a police reform bill they demanded, and slander their Republican colleagues as "getting away with murder" as they themselves fall to their knees, on camera of course, in a show of sanctimonious "penitence" for sins they have claimed for years have been committed only by those same Republican colleagues and their deplorable constituents.

A bit too long for a nice bumper sticker, maybe. Let me try one more time:

Go Democrat - No Peace

How's that?

Sam L. said...

I despise, detest, and distrust the WaPoo. The NYT, too!

mikee said...

Joe Biden has dementia and it will only get worse. Admit it.
Nothing else matters about his campaign.

Iman said...

Tumulty is a flea-bitten hack. And their real problem is that Joe Biden is nearing the end of his twilight years, and no apology chain will change that simple fact.

Bilwick said...

Months ago, when it became clear that Grandpa Simpson would be the Dems' standard bearer, it was predicted by some commenters on Instapundit that the leftist Hive would start calling for an end to presidential debates. Now it looks the prophesy is coming to pass.

PM said...

She's right. Seeing Biden in a debate is just for the lulz.

dbp said...

The MSM will tell us the news, but it needs to be interpreted like the way we used to do with Pravda during the cold war.

If the media try to convince us there is no need for debates, this tells me that they think Biden will get demolished in a debate with Trump.

Bilwick said...

This just in (i.e., I just read it): On Instapundit, "Step One: Nominate a guy who can't complete a sentence. Step Two: Call for the end of presidential debates."

Tyrone Slothrop said...

Even back when he was more or less compos mentis, when debating the gentlemanly Paul Ryan Biden was snarky, vicious, ad hominem and largely substance-free. It was Biden's idea of showing what a tough guy he was, and it worked for some people.

Donald Trump is not Paul Ryan. If Biden pulls this act again, and he really doesn't have the mental wherewithal to instead debate intelligently, Trump will break him into tiny pieces on a national stage. Biden's churlish behavior would play right into Trump's strong points. It would be a massacre.

Biden will not be the Democrat candidate. Democrats have consistently shown they won't let something as small as one human life stand between them and power. Covid-19 can be useful in so many ways.

Douglas B. Levene said...

Ann is of course correctomundo that the press will encourage Biden to forego debates and will portray that decision as wise, compassionate and prudent.

I'm trying to get my head around Vice-President Kamala Harris or whoever it is that will be the real president once Biden is confined to the basement in the White House.

jim said...

I think Biden would come off very well in a debate with Trump. I think he would prefer not to, but not debating would make him look wimpy and panicky.

So, debate Trump and let HIM look wimpy, panicky, and stupid.

jim said...

And, BTW, Trump is losing TEXAS.

hstad said...

Yeah, another self-appointed 'Elite' Ms. Tumulty telling us poor schleps you don't need to hear our anointed candidate - just vote for him. Well, WaPo, I can't expect anything else from this 'rag'. Truly amazing what is being called an election today?

AA - I have to give you credit - your suspicion is on solid ground!