May 23, 2020

"Just so we are clear on this, being black is an immutable characteristic — a physical attribute that is entrenched and innate."

"Blackness doesn’t change based on your income, musical tastes, choice of life partner, intellect or level of education. And it doesn’t fade or disappear based on how you vote. And yet we all know there is often an effort to police blackness … to determine who is really black, fully black, authentically black, conveniently black, naturally black, unapologetically black, conservatively black, asymmetrically black or blackity black. It’s a minefield of emotion, oppression, aspiration, judgment, backlash, pain, history and pride. Really complicated stuff. And so why would Joe Biden decide to step into this space like a deputized member of the soul patrol?"

So begins Michele L. Norris in "Joe Biden’s hill just got steeper. That’s a good thing" (WaPo). Norris is the founding director of The Race Card Project. Is Norris black? I looked at thumbnail photograph of her at the top of the article and it was not obvious, but if she's the director of The Race Card Project and she feels free to write "blackity black," I presume she is black.

Beginning a statement with "Just so we are clear on this" doesn't mean that what follows is true. It's not clear to me that "being black is an immutable characteristic — a physical attribute that is entrenched and innate." Whatever happened to the idea that race is socially constructed?

But what I hear Norris saying is that there's already a question of what part of what we call race is inborn and what is a social construct, and why does anyone think it's their calling to get into the details of what's what and what matters? Why does Joe Biden think he should talk about that?
Democratic candidates who have earned the backing and trust of top black party leaders too often tend to coast on their adjacent-to-blackness bona fides.... Biden’s flippant attempt at humor sounds like it was meant to underscore what’s at stake in the upcoming election, and it is indeed hard to overstate the prospect of another four years of Donald Trump’s bungling and callous leadership. But the “Vote Blue No Matter Who” line of thinking can be dangerous and cavalier. Black votes have to be earned both on the whole and through individual and targeted efforts.....
Interesting that Norris used the word "cavalier." Biden himself called his remark "cavalier" when he apologized for it. She also calls it "flippant." Notice the assumption that Biden was just feeling loose and blabby and splurted it out. I wonder. I think it was a joke somebody wrote for him, and he was looking for the place to insert it. That's why it was so awkward. It didn't fit the conversation that Charlamagne Tha God was trying to have, which was about Democrats expecting black people to vote for them without giving much of anything in return. Biden did not want to have that conversation, cut it off with a joke, and said he had to get going because his wife needed to use the phone.

136 comments:

Crimso said...

"Biden was just feeling loose and blabby and splurted it out"

Thanks for the visual.

Milo Minderbinder said...

Senile, corrupt and perversion are also immutable. And let’s not forget, stupid.

Tank said...

Biden was expressing the standard Democrat expectation that Blacks will vote D regardless of how badly the D policies screw them over. Democrats believe they own the Black vote and they are right.

Kevin said...

Whatever happened to the idea that race is socially constructed?

Folks, the 77 year-old white guy will sort it out for you.

His voters are black enough.

Lucid-Ideas said...

Race, taste, ethics, sex, bubblegum flavors are 'socially constructed' or not socially constructed whenever they need them to be. Whenever or however they are useful. Black Americans want to feel free to whip out the race card or put it away as they please and believe that is a political right, and many of them believe it is the democratic party that provided that right and preserves it politically when nothing could be further from the truth.

This is real politik...you do not get something for nothing. That was why Bidens gaffe was so freudian, he absolutely said what he really thinks. Democrats are 'owed' the black vote just as they are owed the gay vote and they are owed the suburban white book club mom vote because this is f*cling quid pro quo. How dare that uppity house-negro break contract.

Freudian. What cost your soul black America? Sadly, you already sold it.

Georgia Lawyer said...

Splurted? Sounds more virus-y than blurted.

stevew said...

Sigh. Pause. Just letting this all sink in. All this racist talk and posturing, especially the black variety, is exhausting. No true black person would choose to vote for someone other than Biden.

I have it on good authority that Bill Clinton is our first black president, at least until Obama achieved office. But Obama is only half black, so i guess we're still searching.

Fernandinande said...

Is Norris black?

No; she's also not white, and that's close enough for racist work.

Whatever happened to the idea that race is socially constructed?

That idea is still false.

Lucid-Ideas said...

Don't forget LBJs 'Great Society'and his famous quip, "I'll have those n*hers voting Democrat for 200 years."

It was a devil's bargain. They got to lean on the crutch of racism and in return lost a leg, lost black family structure, black land, black wealth, and the final liberation from slavehood by gaining real power the way other minorities had done. Instead they were put right back in chains and lost a leg and gained a crutch at the Sam's time.

Well, at least they got rap and swag and rims and large numbers of their population incarcerated. They got something.

D. said...

>What I find telling, if not even remotely surprising, is the fact that a search for Biden's words already results primarily in references to his apology. See, it's a non-story now. He has already apologized. It would be unfair and wrong to hold his words against him. Besides, it was just a jest, which of course should not be confused with a racist joke.

This is another way to easily ascertain who has taken the ticket and who has not. If you cross a media-declared line, you apologize, and your apology is not only accepted immediately, but results in the instant disappearance of your offense, you have taken the ticket.

If, on the other hand, your apology is taken as a confession of your guilt and is completely ignored as you are beaten over the head with your words until the end of time, you probably have not sold your soul to the god of this world.<

vox day

Ralph L said...

had to get going because his wife needed to use the phone.

That was insulting, too.

tim in vermont said...

"Whatever happened to the idea that race is socially constructed?”

Since it’s obvious bullshit, she rejected it. The law of gravity is a social construct too, we don’t really understand the actual thing that is gravity, but try breaking it!

Dust Bunny Queen said...

So...I don't get it.

Does the color of your skin matter as the defining thing of who you are and who you must be? Or are we supposed to look at the content of the person, their character?

Are we supposed to know that ALL people who are of a certain color...like black, or brown, or white are exactly the same. Think the same, act the same and therefore we don't need to bother trying to get to know them?

Does this mean that ALL black people like ghetto music? are into crime? (insert other bigoted racial stereotype here)

I've always been told that we need to look behind the skin color and be open minded. I guess if that isn't true we should just all become bigots and stereotype by superficial qualities. You know???....that would be much easier. Take less work or intellect.

Go team! but only if you are the same color that is.

Francisco D said...

One sign of dementia = impaired Executive Function = inability to filter one's thoughts

Slow Joe was always a loose verbal cannon, but his dementia makes it worse

Amadeus 48 said...

Wait a minute. This is the guy that said to a black audience about the GOP, “They are going to put y’all back in chains!”

1. He clearly was confused. That was Democrat policy historically up through the Bull Connor (DNC member)/George Wallace era.
2. The chains comment alone should disqualify Biden from high office.
3. Biden is stupid, vicious and increasingly senile.
4. If the Democrats nominate him, they deserve every bad thing that will follow.

Tommy Duncan said...

"Biden was expressing the standard Democrat expectation that Blacks will vote D regardless of how badly the D policies screw them over."

The greatest achievement in the history of American politics has been the snookering of blacks by the Democrats and their media subsidiary. The results delivered to blacks by Democrats have been uniformly negative and crystal clear. It is almost impossible to miss the fact that blacks have languished under Democrat governance. But yet, there it is. The Democrats own the black vote in spite of the negative results. Being a suffering victim must provide perks and benefits I can't recognize.

AllenS said...

Checking Michele L. Norris' Minneapolis Washburn High School yearbook, she be black.

Jupiter said...

Michele L. Norris may be black, but I'd say there was a cracker in the woodpile.

Fernandinande said...

Charlemagne Tha God

Tha God spells his name Charlamagne.

Amexpat said...

I think it was a joke somebody wrote for him, and he was looking for the place to insert it.

I watched the whole interview today and that wasn't my impression. I can't see any political adviser or speechwriter coming up with that "joke".

I think Biden was trying too hard throughout to make his case and to somehow bond with the younger black generation (his heavy handed use of "man" was downright awkward). He was trying to be friendly with the interviewer and the joke looked to me as an off script comment that in that vein.

Meade said...

"That idea is still false."

How so? Because genetics?

In that case there are 7.8 billion races of the species Homo sapiens.

Unknown said...

Well written and appropriately placed your words. There are things like these I mean the social issues that need to be addressed and discussed. All small steps in these endeavours should be appreciated.

Bob Boyd said...

The GOPe took conservative voters for granted and they're still wailing and rending their garments today.
Wake up black voters and seize your power. Stop doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.

How did the lot of black Americans improve in the 40 freaking years Joe Biden was in DC?
In only 4 years Trump brought in prison reform and record high, black employment. Trump is working to cut back the import of cheap labor that drives down all American wages and contributes to black unemployment. Biden wants to ramp that back up.
Just think about it. That's all I ask.

David Begley said...

Biden wasn’t joking. He was serious.

Biden is the dumbest presidential candidate of all time. I bet his wife dresses him.

Unknown said...

Well written and appropriately placed your words. There are things like these I mean the social issues that need to be addressed and discussed. All small steps in these endeavours should be appreciated.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Quayle: Is a person with dark skin from southern India the same race as a person with dark skin from South Carolina? Or are we all of the same race but have different skin colors?

To get all "Physical Anthropology 101". We are all the same species (a group of living organisms consisting of similar individuals capable of exchanging genes or interbreeding. )

Humans are all the same species with different breeds...as in that all dogs are dogs but look different. There are different breeds of dogs that are distinct from others. The breed difference is external...how they look...and can be discerned by internal clues, bone structure. However, even dog breeds are a constantly changing morphology. Meaning you see dogs that cross breed all the time and then wonder...is that a husky? malamute? shepherd? maybe a wolf? or a cross between all of them.

Dog breeds are artificial just as the races are artificial IN THAT, the breeds are created by selective breeding. Humans selective breeding is caused by .............>

FIRST. Eons of geographical separation. Where the same groups only had a limited group to have sex with and any DNA changes that were beneficial for their environment became more common and soon everyone had more or less the same versions of those changes.

SECOND. By self selecting for genetic properties that were attractive or which had survival value. Tall, short, intellect, other abilities etc. Those survival qualities became attractive because, what is more attractive than living in a harsh environment.

Dogs are breeds because we made them. Remove the separation between the breeds and eventually dogs would become Dingos...the generic ancestral dog.

Because we have removed the barriers or separation between humans, we do what comes naturally and breed with each other. It takes a long time...probably thousands and thousands of years, but eventually we will all be HUMAN DINGOS.

In the big scheme of things breeds mean not much. Life will find a way.

Hope you took notes. There will be quiz later.

David Begley said...

And what’s up with the name of the radio guy?

Meade said...

Homo sapiens splurttus gaffeus joe bidens

Bob Boyd said...

Biden was just groping for something, but couldn't quite put his finger in it...I mean, on it.

Birches said...

Charlamagne didn't appreciate the remark, it seems. Chance the Rapper and Diddy also commented on this brouhaha without defending Biden. I don't think that young blacks are nearly as wedded to the Democratic party as their fathers. Things are shifting everywhere.

Wince said...

"...but if she's the director of The Race Card Project and she feels free to write "blackity black," I presume she is black.

Blackity black (Don't Talk Back)

n.n said...

One drop black when politically congruent. One drop white when politically incongruent. Diversity breeds adversity.

Ken B said...

Trump's “bungling”? I thought he was an existential threat to American democracy, literally Hitler, before he became literally Israel's dog I mean. Now he's just an ineffective klutz? It’s so hard to keep up.
The attacks on Trump voters though remains unchanged: subhuman.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

MeadeHow so? Because genetics?

In that case there are 7.8 billion races of the species Homo sapiens.


In reality...We are all mutts. Or becoming so. That is a good thing.

Ken B said...

Meade
There is a first for everything. I am going to defend Fernandistein. He provided a link. That answers your “how so”. If you want more, google the issue on whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com, because Coyne has written several detailed posts.
In short: from a person's DNA you can reliably determine his distant ancestry. You can even do that from his phenotype, as you well know. And that is what a race *is*: a geographically isolated sub population whose genetics differ from other such.

whitney said...

It is unbelievable that people are having serious discussions about what a dementia patient says.

Lucid-Ideas said...

The democratic quid pro quo marginalization strategy has always been to find the latest fringiest thing and promise, in return for their vote:

Blacks - we will protect you from evil racist Republicans. Why are they racist? Because we told you so!

Gays - we will give you power over those mean people in high school who called you a gag or a dyke.

Immigrants - we will put aside the concerns of our constituents and let you freely move back and forth as you wish and grant amnesty at the appropriate time.

Transsexuals - we will grant you free sex reassignment surgery and access to children (eventually...we're working on that).

Asians - you get nothing. You're white now. Fuck off.

Jews - we know many of you have socialist tendencies and secretly hate conservative jews and other supporters of Israel. We will help you hate them too by helping people never forget the holocaust, but it doesn't count for those AIPAC asshats.

White suburban moms - we will help you get back at your husband, who you won't leave, but who we might be able to scare appropriately to keep him on his toes.

Young white women - we will empower you to be as slutty as you want, take no responsibility for your actions, abort your fetus if you want, and eventually turn you into your mom with a husband who we will appropriately scare. YOLO. #metoo am I right ladies?

Pedophiles - see above...we're working on it.

Anarchist,satanist, and other erstwhile edgelords - we don't really know what you want, but we support your edge, you are not 3 edgy 5 us.

White beta guys - we will help you be alpha and 'get the girl' and help you get back at that guy who might've pushed you in your locker in high school. Look at how many young chicks we have! *all getting of girls will depend on your own efforts and we will #metoo you if you get out of line betaboy*

This is the platform of the democratic party.

Bob Boyd said...

I remember when they were saying Condoleezza Rice was not black because she was Republican.

whitney said...

His wife didn't need to use his phone. His wife was behind the camera and she had a signal for him that instructed him to say that to end the feed because she has to control him as best she can. She, of course, is completely aware he is unfit to be president or go to the grocery store by himself.

madAsHell said...

So....Governor Jay Inslee paid for his presidential campaign on the backs of the un-employed.

He appointed a former DNC fund-raising person to manage the Employment Security Department. When the Corona-virus hit, she was sending unemployment insurance to Nigeria. I'm sure that money came back at 50 cents on the dollar.

No wonder he thought he was presidential material. The unemployed of Washington were paying for the delusion.

wendybar said...

If Trump said it, would Michele L. Norris feel the same??? I highly doubt it. She would spend a month calling him a racist, xenophobe and every other derogatory name she could think of. Why do you still read those Tabloid papers. Wapo and NYT's both suck.

rhhardin said...

Political blackness today is based on the plight of lower IQ people. Hence what will democrats give them is the chief lure.

There's lots of social mixing in the upper tail but huge problems in the lower, and that's a lot of votes.

Jupiter said...

"Because we have removed the barriers or separation between humans, we do what comes naturally and breed with each other. It takes a long time...probably thousands and thousands of years, but eventually we will all be HUMAN DINGOS."

Ya think? The present inhabitants of Europe (well, until recently) are genetically very different from those of a few thousand years ago. Strangely, the former occupants contributed a substantial amount of mitochondrial DNA, but no Y chromosomes. This would seem to imply that their women bred with the newcomers, but their men were not interested in reproduction. Funny that, huh?

donald said...

So. You “earn” the votes by “giving” people other people’s wealth. Got it.

Fernandinande said...

"That idea is still false."

How so? Because genetics?


Of course.

In that case there are 7.8 billion races of the species Homo sapiens.

That statement is not true or clever or interesting.

Next you'll be pretending that there's no such color as yellow because colors can be identified by their wavelengths, which BTW, are continuous and don't form clusters like the genetic groups of human races.

Temujin said...

Quoting the article: "Democratic candidates who have earned the backing and trust of top black party leaders too often tend to coast on their adjacent-to-blackness bona fides.... Biden’s flippant attempt at humor sounds like it was meant to underscore what’s at stake in the upcoming election, and it is indeed hard to overstate the prospect of another four years of Donald Trump’s bungling and callous leadership."

Just so we are clear on this...
Democrat candidates have not had to earn anything from the black community for decades. Nothing but lip service and some paybacks to the more local black Democrat office holders who corral their local populace for the major candidate, in this case, Biden. If Democrats were to ever actually have to answer for their work, they'd have to explain Detroit, Chicago, Cleveland, Newark, Baltimore, Washington DC, San Francisco, LA, Gary, IN, South Bend, IN, Flint, New Orleans, Boston, etc., etc. But they've never had to answer for anything to the black community. Not Jim Crow. Not voting against the voting rights act. Not the extreme poverty and horrible school systems the black community continues to be locked into in these cities.

So let's not play that Dem candidates have to earn anything from the black community. They have been bought, sold, and paid for by their 'leaders'. If the black community was actually interested in changing things, they would change things instead of allowing the Dem party to control 'the truth' for them.

Let's also be clear on this: What she calls another 4 years of Trump's bungling and callous leadership was, before the Wuhan Virus, the best economic leadership the black community has seen since...well...forever. That's the reality. Norris is absolutely playing fiction against reality like decades of black leaders and influencers have done to their community.

You cannot keep doing the same things and expect different results. Otherwise you get to the point where a brain-hampered senior aged white guy who has spent his entire life living off the the tax payer can look you in the face and tell you that you're not a real black person if you don't vote for him. This is the end result of decades of bowing to Dems without giving it a second thought.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Blogger Jupiter said...

Me "Because we have removed the barriers or separation between humans, we do what comes naturally and breed with each other. It takes a long time...probably thousands and thousands of years, but eventually we will all be HUMAN DINGOS."

Jupiter Ya think? The present inhabitants of Europe (well, until recently) are genetically very different from those of a few thousand years ago. Strangely, the former occupants contributed a substantial amount of mitochondrial DNA, but no Y chromosomes. This would seem to imply that their women bred with the newcomers, but their men were not interested in reproduction. Funny that, huh?

I know! On a Cultural Anthropology level....this sort of tells us that the new occupants, moving into the previously isolated inhabitants of Europe, were not all that peacefully moving in. Probably many many many years of conflict and to the victor belong the spoils.....the women.

The men, probably dead or enslaved and not allowed to breed.

A million years and human nature hasn't changed much.

Tom said...

He’s Uncle Junior. He’s always been prone to saying offensive things. Now, he’s losing any sense of restraint. We’re less than a year away from Junior losing his uppers.

Sebastian said...

"why does anyone think it's their calling to get into the details of what's what and what matters?"

Exercising prog power means giving things and people their proper names. The social construction of race is a prog political project.

"Why does Joe Biden think he should talk about that?"

Assumes he "thinks" and that he has clear motives for talking about something. In this case, as you say, the joke may have been written by someone else and expressed awkwardly, but of course the jokiness of the joke depends on the common understanding that yes, of course, blacks are supposed to vote Dem, and woe to you, Uncle Tom, if you deviate.

gspencer said...

Michele L. Norris is black; an AA hire at the WAPO,

https://www.google.com/search?q=Michele+L.+Norris&client=firefox-b-1-d&channel=tus2&sxsrf=ALeKk00eNETlQ7gNfg6llJfNH47FtWj0Bw:1590244204996&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwj9lMenmcrpAhUblXIEHavmB68Q_AUoAnoECBsQBA&biw=964&bih=848

Temujin said...

I rest my case.
Paid Biden apologist

If she actually cared about her constituency, she'd get her head around reality. If the people in her district actually cared about themselves and their own welfare, they'd vote for somebody/anybody other than her. Keep re-electing that slug and you'll keep getting more of what you've got. Good and hard.

h said...

We must reject the slogan "blue no matter who" as applied to blacks because it makes blacks look like mindless children who just fall in line. But when it comes to actual voting, we must insist that blacks vote blue no matter who.

Meade said...

"Next you'll be pretending that there's no such color as yellow because colors can be identified by their wavelengths, which BTW, are continuous and don't form clusters like the genetic groups of human races."

You're wrongly reframing the question. "Race is socially constructed" does not mean "There is no such thing as race."

So using your analogy of color vision (the ability of animals to perceive differences between light composed of different wavelengths): If I say, "Color is socially constructed," I'm not pretending neurons, photoreceptors and varying wavelengths of light don't exist. I'm saying canary yellow is my favorite color and mauve gives me a queasy feeling — probably because my 1st grade teacher wore mauve and was always giving me dirty looks because she didn't like my "race" even though she had no real knowledge of my genetic makeup. Canary yellow reminds me of sunshine, something I've always related to the freedom and joy of recess.

Jersey Fled said...

There is a sense of community among Black Americans that I don't see among whites. Maybe because the Irish have a different history in America than the Italians or the Jews or the Swedes.

As I've said here before, I taught at a primarily Black urban university for eight years after I retired from my Corporate job. I taught Economics.

I remember one night we were discussing the economic implications of minimum wage laws. Two Black women were involved in a vigorous discussion with a young Black man. The women were arguing that minimum wages laws had a negative impact on black employment. The young man took the other side of the arguement, and was losing badly. Finally he blurted out "BUT I'M FOR THE PEOPLE". What he was saying was that as a member of the black community, he was obligated to support the concensus views of that community.

He was a very bright young man. But to him the views of his community mattered more than the merits of the arguement.

I saw that over and over in my classroom.

traditionalguy said...

Cavaliers in English history are the Estate owner and courtiers that live off of and fight for the Monarchy. That includes the State Church of England which Presbyterians fought against over there and over here leading to the victory at Yorktown and the First Amendment. But in jolly ole England they Gloriously brought back the Monarchy under Charles II but with a healthy fear of whatever the Parliament ordered him to do.in fact that set up was all the Colonies wanted until April 19, 1775 and a bridge at Concord in Massachusetts Bay Colony .
Biden is one of the Cavalier guys that wants to restore the Monarchy under the Kenyan King he served.

traditionalguy said...

NB: When you go full cavalier you are accepting the British Navy’s Empire and how it treats its sailors and its peasants on its land.

SGT Ted said...

"Whatever happened to the idea that race is socially constructed?"

Well, that's the Identity Politics dodge, isn't it?

We're told by Identity Politics practitioners that a superficial and often biologically determined aspect of being is simultaneously a Construct AND an Authentic, Intrinsically Immutable part of a persons being, as long as that person can portray their identity group to be Oppressed by the majority culture, which happens to be cast as White, Heterosexual and Male.

The wheels really started coming off the the various Identity Politics vehicles when the trans activists started claiming that gender is a construct and sex was biological, but that men who felt that they were women were truly of the opposite sex and were to be treated as such culturally and legally. Such a claim is so obviously and stupidly contradictory that people started figuring out the extreme illogical defect in the argument.

rcocean said...

How absurd. Black people know who they are and are proud of being Black. Its not some mysterious, complicated thing. They're one of the most homogeneous ethnic groups in the USA. Their tastes, voting patterns, cultural views, etc. are incredibly similar despite variations in the income and region.

And no, I"m not saying every black person is 100% like every other one. But compared to other American ethnic groups and races, they are incredible alike. Its why they all vote Democrat 80-90%, no matter what and no matter where they live.

Jupiter said...

"If Democrats were to ever actually have to answer for their work, they'd have to explain Detroit, Chicago, Cleveland, Newark, Baltimore, Washington DC ...".

The reality, of which most blacks are grimly aware, is that all of those places were doing pretty well until the blacks moved in. A lot of smarmy white people want to believe that the problem is Democrats, but blacks know better.

JAORE said...

"Biden was just feeling loose and blabby and splurted it out"...

which is why he's always careful to stand BEHIND the girls/women when he's sniffing their hair.

rcocean said...

As a practical matter, voters who self-identify as Jews vote D, 2-1. Same with Asians, and same with Hispanic/Latino. Blacks have an even higher rate of homogeneity in the voting booth. In the real world, its irrelevant whether race is a social construct or something genetic and inborn. The result is the same.

Meade said...

Bob Boyd said...
I remember when they were saying Condoleezza Rice was not black because she was Republican.

There you go again, man — othering poor Joe Biden.

Bilwick said...

So being Black entails a subservient loyalty to Massa State? That sound you hear is Frederick Douglass spinning in his grave.

JAORE said...

Did anyone note Biden repeated the Charlottesville lie (the disqualifying one) in his "apology" that turned into Trump bashing.

Sure I'm an old, white guy with racist incidents on my record.... but TRUMP!

Bob Boyd said...

There you go again, man — othering poor Joe Biden.

I dint other the muthafucka. Muthafucka othered his own self.

Big Mike said...

Whatever happened to the idea that race is socially constructed?

It’s in the trash can of history, where it belongs. Do try to keep up.

Meade said...

"Muthafucka othered his own self."

Truth!

rehajm said...

I'm not surprised but I am still shocked at the level of double standard. Not a single major race baiter calling for Biden's resignation but plenty of let me explain apologists in the media.

Lurker21 said...

I like the "Black-adjacent" concept. On top of the Democrats' long standing belief that they own the African-American vote, Biden thinks his time with Obama has made him Black-adjacent, like Roger Ebert or Robin Thicke, or maybe Obama himself - close enough to get away with things that other White politicians can't. But it didn't work out that way. There's a thin line between politicians' attempts to be one with the people - to speak our language and to speak for us - and what's condescending or patronizing, and Biden stepped over the line between ordinary pandering and offensive patronizing.

The Democrats have always been the party of outsiders, marginals, and minorities since the days when White Southerners and Roman Catholics dominated the party. One can mock them for that (Martin Van Buren: I will help you to get back at the English for 1664), but Democrats can point out that Republicans (and Whigs and Federalists) performed similar services for the majority (We can keep those pesky marginals down and keep you on top). Reductively unmasking "true motives" is a game anybody can play.

Lucien said...

If being “black” were immutable, then why do “mixed race” humans apparently get to choose which “race” they identify as? Could Tiger Woods tell us tomorrow that he identifies as Thai? Could Barack Obama say he now identifies as white? We know he could decide to identify as a woman, and it would be Hateful for any of us to dispute that.

AllenS said...

rcocean said...
Its not some mysterious, complicated thing. They're [blacks] one of the most homogeneous ethnic groups in the USA

Very true, they even like to shoot each other often [daily].

Meade said...

"It’s in the trash can of history, where it belongs."

Over by the dustbin next to the rubbish heap.

We're gonna need someone to sift through all this trash, dust and rubbish of history — someone to "do the jobs that Americans won't do."

Got any black Irish you can send us?

Lurker21 said...

Notice the assumption that Biden was just feeling loose and blabby and splurted it out. I wonder. I think it was a joke somebody wrote for him, and he was looking for the place to insert it. That's why it was so awkward.

Maybe it was something somebody said in discussions. Maybe Biden himself said it to his advisers. It hung around somewhere in his consciousness, until he blurted it out on the air. Biden probably isn't going to any celebrity roasts, so it doesn't sound like anyone consciously wrote out thinking it would be a good line. More likely somebody said it in conversation and it sounded like a zinger then and there and it was the random gumball that came out of the machine when Biden was talking to Charlemagne.

Norris might accuse others of not being "authentically Black," but not in such blatant terms. There are ways of conveying the concept without using such blunt language. And certainly if a White guy blurts out something so blunt and blatant about what it means to be Black, she's not going to let him get away with it.

Bob Boyd said...

"If you have a problem figuring out whether you're to pay me or not, then you ain't Chinese." - the othered Joe Biden

Bob Boyd said...

Truth!

Don't sound so surprised.

wendybar said...

Democracy died in the Washington Post.

"In case you didn't get it yet, The Washington Post really hates Donald Trump. The paper on Tuesday published a Dana Milbank column that sarcastically proclaimed: “If Trump likes hydroxychloroquine, he’ll love camel urine.” The contents of the article made it perfectly clear that Milbank should seek some type of experimental drug that might cure Trump Derangement Syndrome."

NCMoss said...

Why aren't the media asking the Betos and Petes and other Super Tuesday endorses of Joe Biden if they share his sentiments?

Ingachuck'stoothlessARM said...

just thought we'd splurt out some

"Hot Sauce"

Lookin' for some hot sauce baby this evenin'
I need some hot sauce baby tonight
I want some hot sauce baby this evenin'
Gotta have some hot sauce
Gotta pander to black folk tonight


Hey Joe

Hey Joe, where you goin' with that gaffe in your hand?
Hey Joe, I said where you goin' with that gaffe in your hand?
Alright. I'm goin down to shoot myself in the foot--
you know I caught it steppin' in political doggie-doo, man.

West Texas Intermediate Crude said...

Biden says:
“If you have a problem figuring out whether you’re for me or Trump, then you ain’t black.”
I have absolutely no problem figuring out which candidate I'm for.
Does that make me black?
(I'm as black as Kayleigh Mcenany, BTW. She doesn't seem t have a problem figuring it out either).

Big Mike said...

@Meade, are you sure you know what "Black Irish" means? The Black Irish are not Negroes.

Anyway my ancestors were from the land of the Southern Slavs, and they did the work that the Irish and Colored wouldn't do.

Bob Smith said...

“It’s a minefield of emotion, oppression, aspiration, judgment, backlash, pain, history and pride. Really complicated stuff.”

Or you can decide to ignore all that racialist BS, look around, see what works in America and do that.

Meade said...

Poor souls fleeing the Irish famine. Right? Ancestors of mine.

Howard said...

Some people think that black Irish are actually of Phoenician descent. Black hair and the dark eyes are not what one would expect from strawberry Ginger freckle land.

however when the Irish first immigrated to the states they were not considered to be white.

Meade said...

Feel free to reeducate me if I'm wrong.

The Cracker Emcee Refulgent said...


“had to get going because his wife needed to use the phone.

That was insulting, too.”

Amen. As blatant a condescending blow-off as I’ve ever seen. When you’re Democrat they let you get away with it.

narayanan said...

was Biden calling himself a pony soldier by being cavalier?
was Biden calling himself a white knight riding to the rescue?
was Biden riding a high horse giving him a lofty perch to look down upon from

chevalier [ˌSHevəˈlir] NOUN a knight.
synonyms: cavalier · cavalryman · horseman · equestrian · gallant · champion · paladin · banneret · knight errant · lord · noble · nobleman

Howard said...

Oh, I get it now. You people don't realize that the gaff and the apology were improvised one-two punch against Drumpf

Biden is just making it crystal clear that the Democrats absolutely have to get the black turn out to win. Not only due to apathy and feeling that they're not being represented by either party, but by the active voter suppression scheme as championed by Devin Nunes.

You see the point of the story is never the point of the story.

bagoh20 said...

Now do gender.

FullMoon said...

I think it was a joke somebody wrote for him, and he was looking for the place to insert it.

Nope. Biden expected to elicit a friendly laugh in agreement, or at least a smile. He just messin' around. In a private setting would be acceptable and funny to most Democrats. Joe assumed the other guy was already on board.

White people who have black or asian or hispanic or gay or whatever friends can joke around like that. And vice versa.

bagoh20 said...

Anyone that votes for today's Democrat party isn't really an American.

William50 said...

I wonder if blacks would vote for him if he ate boiled babies?

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/bethbaumann/2020/05/23/progressive-columnist-id-vote-for-biden-even-if-he-boiled-babies-and-ate-them-n2569345

Lurker21 said...

Norris seems to be going against the current orthodoxy. What if she had said:

"Just so we are clear on this, being female is an immutable characteristic — a physical attribute that is entrenched and innate. Femaleness or maleness doesn’t change based on your income, musical tastes, choice of life partner, intellect or level of education. And it doesn’t fade or disappear based on how you vote.

There's a semantic question involved here. There's obviously a difference between genetics or skin color on the one hand and belonging to a subcultural group on the other. But what words do you use for each and where do you draw the line between those who are part of the subculture and those who aren't? It doesn't seem like there is a firm line to draw. People won't hesitate to make distinctions in private, but it's harder to do so publicly and take responsibility for it. And heaven help the outsider who tries to make the distinction.

Richard Dolan said...

"But what I hear Norris saying is that there's already a question of what part of what we call race is inborn and what is a social construct, and why does anyone think it's their calling to get into the details of what's what and what matters?"

Biden's latest McKinsey-gaffe is par for the course, as is the Dem spin-machine's response. If the spin works for you, go with it. I think Biden is just too clueless and too cossetted to know when he's giving the game away.

What was weird in this post was AA's suggestion (quoted above) that it's out of bounds "to get into the details of what's what and what matters," when the topic is race (specifically one race). So what exactly is that about -- best to avoid any discussion of "what's what and what matters"? That is uncomfortably close to the usual shout-down approach to touchy subjects, a category which includes most subjects dear to the hearts of intersectional identarians.

Whenever the conversation focuses on lefty-land's preferred victim groups, the same conundrum about "essentialism" shows up. AA points in the same direction ("what part of what we call race is inborn and what is a social construct"), but takes it in a direction that, to me at least, is weird -- that dismissive bit about a "calling," (a religiously-based idea dear to devout believers, and so definitely NOCD, don't you know!) suggesting that further conversation is best avoided by sensible people. It's not just race as a topic about which lefties can't quite figure out what they want to say is essential and what is accidental, of course: Is there a gay-gene, or is gender preference a social construct? Is it something one chooses or is it part of what one is at birth? The gay vs. transgender teams fight about that all the time, as they must given where they're coming from.

Awkward conversation seems better than embarrassed silence, and fortunately there are a few writers out there (e.g., Andrew Sullivan, Kevin Williamson, Ron Dreher) who are willing take it on (whether or not you agree with their take). Having read this blog for 15+ years, I'm quite sure AA is in that group, too.

Ken B said...

Black Irish are Irish with black hair. They are thought to be descendants of Mediterraneans.

Big Mike said...

@Meade, I was taught that Black Irish were Irishmen whose hair was black instead of red. Hence descended from Europeans brought to Ireland as slaves back in the days when the northern part of Ireland was a Viking colony. YMMV

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

Reparations. The big D-promise that never comes true. and never will.

but keep falling for it!

Howard said...

Sorry Meade, the re-education camps are not deemed Covid-Safe. the instructors are still required to get in your face and scream. Only level "A" PPE well work, but it is too costly for nonprofits to cover

narayanan said...

Blogger Ken B said...

Meade
There is a first for everything. I am going to defend Fernandistein. He provided a link. That answers your “how so”. If you want more, google the issue on whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com, because Coyne has written several detailed posts.
In short: from a person's DNA you can reliably determine his distant ancestry. You can even do that from his phenotype, as you well know. And that is what a race *is*: a geographically isolated sub population whose genetics differ from other such.
-------------=================
also till a sub-population is inculcated with the idea to self-isolate/segregate in a political power relationship (intra and extra) - not exactly geographical as in early human history when choice was not issue at all.

USA which is a political social construct - historically removed the choice element at time of slavery and selectively granted in successive political evolutions called civil rights voting rights etc.

Caligula said...

"being black is an immutable characteristic -- a physical attribute that is entrenched and innate."

So, how does one handle mixed-race persons (which would seem to include practically all those who identify as African-American)? Is the "one drop" rule truly dead and gone and, if so, how many "drops" are enough? What if one has black ancestors yet can, with minimal or no effort, "pass" as white (if one chooses to, of course)- does one still posess that "immutable characteristic"?

And what of the concept of "authentically black": can one fully posess that "immutable characteristic" even if Those Who Judge Such Things have determined that one lacks that authenticity? Is there any validity in calling somone deemed inauthentic an "Oreo"?

I'm not trying to argue that race does not exist, but, this dogmatic statement somehow seems to be lacking something, perhaps something like appreciating some of the inevitable ambiguities inherent here.

And that's before one even gets to assertions such as, "If you are [authentically?] black then of course you'd vote for me."

Nichevo said...


Lucid-Ideas said...
Don't forget LBJs 'Great Society'and his famous quip, "I'll have those n*hers voting Democrat for 200 years."

It was a devil's bargain.


Quite. LBJ cut their nuts off and for six decades the D Machine has been feeding the black populace on Rocky Mountain oysters.

But it was FDR whut roped 'n' branded 'em.


To be fair as I can to Biden, it is tiring to talk with someone who always has their hand out and a sour look, a hand full of More more more! and a mouth full of very little Thank you and lots of Next comes...

FullMoon said...

Ingachuck'stoothlessARM said...

just thought we'd splurt out some

"Hot Sauce"

Lookin' for some hot sauce baby this evenin'
I need some hot sauce baby tonight
I want some hot sauce baby this evenin'
Gotta have some hot sauce
Gotta pander to black folk tonight

Hey Joe

Hey Joe, where you goin' with that gaffe in your hand?
Hey Joe, I said where you goin' with that gaffe in your hand?
Alright. I'm goin down to shoot myself in the foot--
you know I caught it steppin' in political doggie-doo, man.


C'mom, man! You be crazy.

Lucien said...

Why does no one ever approach anything with a Round-head attitude?

Nichevo said...


Howard said...
Some people think that black Irish are actually of Phoenician descent. Black hair and the dark eyes are not what one would expect from strawberry Ginger freckle land.



As explained to me by my gorgeous Black Irish Harvard interviewer, Black Irish is what happens to red/blond Celts/Gaels when the Moors have raided your land for a thousand years, much like the explanation of Sicilian coloring that Dennis Hopper gave Christopher Walken in True Romance.

damikesc said...

So, to check, its OK now for me to hope for massive death numbers in NYC and DC. I'm not even human, right?

I did, admittedly, complain to Samaritans purse about wasting resources helping NYC.

Gahrie said...

There are three distinct genetic populations of humans. In other animals we would call these subspecies. For example, there are Bengal tigers and Siberian tigers. Both are tigers. They can interbred, and do given the chance. But they have different appearances and different DNA. In the case of tigers and other animals we are told that these genetic distinctions are vastly important, and every single subspecies must be saved from extinction. In humans we call these groups races, and are told that they are either meaningless, or don't exist. The term seems to offend, so I'm perfectly willing to use another. But you cannot deny the biological fact that these distinct genetic groups exist.

Amadeus 48 said...

Howard— love the new avatar photo. Do what Bunky say, not what Bunky do.

Jupiter said...

It is interesting to consider what is problematic about Biden's utterance. If he had said that he had been to 57 of the 58 US states, or that he didn't speak Austrian, we would be laughing at his ignorance. But what he said was that you aren't black if you are thinking about voting for Trump. This can hardly be said to indicate ignorance. Nor is it a racial slur to suggest that almost all blacks who vote vote for Democrats. They will proudly say that it is so. I think Biden's sin lies in failing to show proper respect to the unending state of racial grievance that blacks claim, and that all GoodWhites must constantly keep in mind. It's like when white guys think they can say "nigger" in front of black guys, "'Cause we're all friends here". We may all be friends, but only black guys can say "nigger". And only blacks can tell other blacks they are acting white. Whites are OK, as long as we know our place.

The tables have turned. From Jim Crow to Chuck Blow, in three generations.

mikee said...

Well, I've been told for a decade or more that because I'm white, I am inherently, inalienably, irredeemably, unconsciously and invidiously racist, no matter what I think, say, do or feel. And now I'm told that if a person of color doesn't support a dementia-addled Democrat for president, that person is not black.

The proponents of these ideas, which are so lacking in any demonstrable proof that I can only shake my head and mourn their vile idiocy, deserve nothing. Maybe ridicule, if you feel like it. But nothing more.

Their claims are extraordinary, and require extraordinary proof to be accepted.
Until they can prove their vile assertions have a basis in reality, to hell with them.

mikee said...

Well, I've been told for a decade or more that because I'm white, I am inherently, inalienably, irredeemably, unconsciously and invidiously racist, no matter what I think, say, do or feel. And now I'm told that if a person of color doesn't support a dementia-addled Democrat for president, that person is not black.

The proponents of these ideas, which are so lacking in any demonstrable proof that I can only shake my head and mourn their vile idiocy, deserve nothing. Maybe ridicule, if you feel like it. But nothing more.

Their claims are extraordinary, and require extraordinary proof to be accepted.
Until they can prove their vile assertions have a basis in reality, to hell with them.

Ralph L said...

I believe American blacks are overwhelmingly descended from West Africans (and some Europeans). BO's (alleged) Kenyan heritage might not have passed in Black America without Big Mike's help.

Someone studied the genetic history of Northern versus Southern Italians. The DailyMail isn't terribly clear about the findings, but the original article is completely obscure. They may need to rework the "That's Italian!" ads.

What struck me was that some southerners apparently came from Anatolia--maybe the Aeneid isn't totally fictional.

pchuck1966 said...

I watched the whole thing and that wasn't a joke. Stop trying to perpetuate that bald-faced lie.

Clyde said...

Michael Jackson was not available for comment re: immutableness.

walter said...

Joe Biden Just Proved Why He Must Have a Black Woman as VP
"Joe Biden has been making these kinds of gaffes for 40 years because he is a white man in America.
Whiteness supersedes his political position, his station and even his experience. And if he is going to represent a party tasked with dethroning the reigning world champion of whiteness, someone has to stop him from repeatedly doing this.
And it has to be a black woman.
For 400 years, black women have held down families and passed along our history. Even though they are treated the worse, not only have they been required to withstand all of the pain, but they were required to smile through it while staying the hands and soothing the anger of those who were ready to grab machetes.
And they also grabbed machetes.
This unique time in American history requires someone who is familiar with the consequences and can swing a machete. Kamala Harris and Val Demings go to work surrounded by dozens of mini-Trumps every day having to deal with racism and sexism while still passing legislation and proposing policy.
<
There are no white men, white women or “people of color” who are qualified and have the policy experience to be Biden’s running mate. They may have the resume and the bona fides, but they are not black.

narayanan said...

Has Sir Charles Barkeley weighed in on this weighty issue?

he straighten out Jussie Smollet fairly and roundly

exhelodrvr1 said...

He was just saying in public what the Democrats have been saying in private since Pres Johnson

FullMoon said...

Check this Althouse from pre election 2016. Interesting and related..Althouse: Trump speaks in a black church in Detroit and ...

tastid212 said...

IMO the interesting remark - and he used it a couple of times - was that he had to get off the phone so his wife could use it. Think about that. Obviously it's a gambit to end tha conversation with Charlemagne. But it's so patently weak. Uh-oh, the little woman is going to be mad!

The major party nominee, a former veep and senator, says his household only has one secure phone or line or site to do a video call? C'mon on, man! Total. Loser.

FullMoon said...

Comment by well known disgraced LLR prior to 2016 election. May partially explain his decent into insanity, some people cannot deal with failure.

Memorialized on link I posted above.

(LLR) I will bookmark this post, and calendar something like the Thursday after election day, to report back on (a) total turnout in the City of Detroit (I think it will be down, from 2012); (b) the percentage of votes won by Trump (I think Mrs. Clinton will win 97 to 98 per cent of the vote, same as Obama), and; (c) the percentage of Detroit voters who utilize Michigan's "straight ticket" voting option and vote for the entire Democratic slate (I expect that number will be up, because of the recently-publicized litigation over a Republican bill to do away with straight-ticket voting in the state).

Trump will have won nothing in Detroit, and probably not in Michigan. It may not be Trump's goal at all, to win anything in Detroit or Michigan. It may be Trump's goal, to use Detroit as a stage, for a performance intended for other areas of the country that he think he might win.

In any event, the numbers will tell the story in November. I'll get back to you all.
9/3/16


For fun, results of disgraced, racist, sexist,"on the spectrum" LLR prediction above. Just one of his many failures.
2016 United States presidential election in Michigan ...

MadisonMan said...

So many Democrats bending over backwards to provide cover for Biden and the other race-hustlers in the Democratic Party.

walter said...

On Biden's next broadcast he should produce a roach for the camera. I mean, it would be a preserved entymological specimen on a block.

Bill Peschel said...

I love this Twitter thread from a musician named Zuby who isn't cutting Biden any slack.

Sample tweets:

"Left-wing politicians, activists and professional race hustlers have used this psychological warfare to keep black people 'in check' and voting for them for many decades. It’s demeaning, discriminatory, and it strips black people of our agency. (9/14)"

"So, when Biden suggested that 'you ain't Black' if you consider voting for Trump instead of him, he exposed a much deeper form of racism. The sense of 'ownership' of Black people. Unearned allegiance and entitlement. It was a vile statement... (10/14)"

"But it was also honest. Because that's how a lot of these politicians and 'progressives' really feel about black people. Like they own us. (11/14)"

wayworn wanderer said...

Joe is an idiot. I can't fathom four more years of Trump, but I can't imagine four of Creepy Joe. Is this the best we can do.

narciso said...

haven't seem him here:


http://patterico.com/2020/05/23/weekend-open-thread-34/#comment-2363377

JackWayne said...

“Black votes have to be earned both on the whole and through individual and targeted efforts.....”

Now tell us how SCOTUS is completely apolitical.

walter said...

wayworn wanderer,
Vote for The Other Biden.
And forget the MALARKEY

RK said...

"But it was also honest. Because that's how a lot of these politicians and 'progressives' really feel about black people. Like they own us. (11/14)"

They think of blacks as child-like and themselves as parent-like. They know what's best for blacks.

wildswan said...

Voters aren't fans supporting the Cubs for 108 years without a victory. It might be hard to say just what they are but that's because "the times they are a changing." The black community has always favored voting as a block - first for the Republicans, then for the Democrats - as a necessary counter to prejudice. But it can change who it votes for as a block since this happened once already. If that community were to decide that the Dems who have been kept in power by black block voting for the last sixty years in US big cities are not delivering in return for votes, then the voting could change. And Dems have taken to thinking they don't have to deliver on anything - on economic or on safety issues; they think it will be enough to talk the right way about identity politics. Life is very hard for many in the black community and they won't relish the idea of relying on a senile guy and an inexperienced woman (his potential replacement) to make their lives better. There's no real sign that the black community block is going to change how it votes and who it votes for and yet I have sort of feeling that block voting is crumbling in that community as a natural consequence of millions moving to the suburbs. There's a way the middle class is that slopes against block voting or any other social or behavioral pattern solely based on "the way we were"; and the black community is becoming more middle class. This change as a group moves to the city suburbs was the theme of the book, The Last Hurrah which described the Boston Irish. But possibly that theme now applies to the black community. In other words, two things - Dem politicians not delivering and Dem politicians relying on the usual attitudes from a changing community as if Dem voting were the expression of some immutable gene set.

Ingachuck'stoothlessARM said...

narayanan said...
Has Sir Charles Barkeley weighed in on this weighty issue?

he straighten out Jussie Smollet fairly and roundly


better yet-- Dave Chappelle

@Full Moon at 12:31

We cray cray. Gnome sane?

Maillard Reactionary said...

Whenever you hear talk of a "social construct", there is a Marxist nearby.

You're not supposed to notice this, though.

FullMoon said...

Followed nrciso link to pattirico.
Comments about Trump opening churches.
Just realized, some black people like church and believe in God. Not all, but some.Some even look forward to going every week, or more often.Not all, but some.
Wonder if Trump thought the same thing. Probably not, him being a Nazi and racist and all.

Ingachuck'stoothlessARM said...

Blogger walter said...
On Biden's next broadcast he should produce a roach for the camera. I mean, it would be a preserved entymological specimen on a block.


you meant the creepy-crawly kind, or the weedy-seedy O'Bama* kind?

"I got hairy legs
that turn blonde in the sun,
and the kids used to come up
and reach in the pool and rub my leg down
so it was straight
and then watch the hair
come back up again.
They’d look at it.

So I learned about roaches,
I learned about kids jumping on my lap,”
the former vice president told the audience in Delaware.
“And I loved kids jumping on my lap.”

* O'Bama-- isnt that black irish?

FullMoon said...

Reuters cuts feed just as Donald Trump is being blessed by Bishop Jackson

Camera man ordered to cut feed, resists, shut down anyway...
praise of Trump by black leaders not allowed by MSM..

Typical leftist censorship. Disgusting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MM7oPN2g1ig&feature=youtu.be

brylun said...

At 2:48 above, FullMoon links to an Althouse post on 9/4/16. Interestingly, someone in the comment section is named "Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together". This person is later referred to as "Ritmo".

I guess the way Blogger works is that it updates to your new handle even in older posts.

Lurker21 said...

Some Johnson loyalists dispute that he ever made that comment, but in any case you have to consider who LBJ was talking to. He was talking to Southern governors who had records of opposing integration. He was trying to speak their language and tell them that if they played their cards right they would benefit from African-Americans new loyalty to the Democratic Party. It doesn't seem to have worked out so well for Southern Democrats, though. Johnson was ever the salesman, ever trying to get what he wanted. Whether what he said reflected what he thought or felt and revealed his true motivations isn't always easy to say.

The Crack Emcee said...

Being black is a social construct that's become an immutable characteristic — a physical attribute that is entrenched and innate.

Discuss.

Derek Kite said...

It seems to have caught the Democrats by surprise. It took a day or two for the justifications and explanations to start dribbling out.

Maybe it is very simple.

Maybe Biden is racist and views blacks as a bit dumb, and needing someone like him to tell them what to do.