From "New York Appears to Be ‘Past the Plateau,’ Cuomo Says: Live Updates/Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo backed away from his conflict with President Trump but emphasized that the state would need federal help on testing" (NYT).
I think Cuomo was showing signs of stress yesterday. Who knows what happened behind the scenes, but there are so many reasons for toning down the public emotions. I went to the transcript to see the whole context, and this phrase jumped out at me: "If you’re in public, you have to wear a mask." He was talking about the actual physical masks that people are told to wear, but I thought the phrase worked well to express the demeanor a leader needs to display to maintain confidence and morale.
Anyway... here's the context I was looking for:
This is not a fact. This is just my opinion. You can throw it in the garbage. The emotion in this country is as high as I can recall. People are frustrated. We’re anxious. We’re scared. We’re angry. We’ve never been through this before. And, on every level, this is a terrible experience. It’s disorienting. It threatens you to your core. It makes you reflect on your whole life. It’s mentally very difficult. It’s emotionally difficult. Economically, it’s disastrous.... But, in the midst of this, there is no time for politics. How does this situation get worse and get worse quickly? If you politicize all that emotion. We cannot go there. That’s why I work so hard. When anyone raises any political agenda to me, I work so hard to distance myself from it... And I’ve stayed a hundred miles away from politics, just so people know that there is no possibility of a political distortion here. Because it’s no time for politics. And, look, if you have partisan division splitting this nation now, it’s going to make it worse. Abraham Lincoln, 'A house divided itself against itself cannot stand.” 1858. Where did Abraham Lincoln get it from? “If a house is divided against itself, the house cannot stand,” Mark 3:25. Okay, so this is accepted wisdom, let us say. House cannot stand. Not to mention, a house cannot rise up from the greatest challenge it has seen since World War II. This is no time and no place for division. We have our hands full as it is. Let’s just stay together and let’s work it through. That’s why we’re called the United States. And the unity was key. Going back to Abraham Lincoln, it was always about the unity. Going back to the framers of the Constitution, it was always balanced of power to ensure unity. And we need that unity now more than ever before.
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153 comments:
We certainly know that a George divided against itself cannot stand.
It seems that we are slowly but surely finding our footing, ordering our priorities, and reconciling our objectives. Americans are, as a matter of principle, prudent and bold. The times are a little less interesting. Good luck.
Cuomo is still better than our buffoon, Jay "Green New Fiasco" Inslee.
A George?
Cuomo is calling for civility. Let’s call bullshit on this “this is not the time for politics” bullshit.
Good for him.
Still - Fuck Chi Com Hillary and Chi com biden.
In the transcript, Cuomo sounds like Trump (not that Trump would ever walk a dog):
"When I am in public and I’m walking the dog down the street and there is a place where I could come in contact with other people and I can’t maintain social distancing, I am wearing a mask. If I’m walking through the backyard alone and nobody’s around me, I don’t wear a mask. Wear a mask in public, if you are in a situation where you could encroach on other people without maintaining social distancing. That’s when you wear a mask. Here, I’m not going to come any closer to you than I am. There is no possibility that you and I, John, violate the social distancing guideline. I’m socially distanced from Howard. I’m socially distanced from Melissa. I’m not in public. I’m not staying in your home. In public, that, I think, is a small inconvenience that has a tremendous benefit for people. And you want to go walk the dog with me? I’ll walk the dog with you. I wear a mask and my daughter wears a mask. Dog doesn’t wear a mask. I’ve not heard any data that suggests pets should wear a mask. So Captain’s not violating anything. But, we’ll walk the dog, I wear a mask. Not as attractive as your mask, by the way. You have a very stylish, fashion forward one."
The ending is so Trumpy!
He sounds like he needs a good cry.
"If you’re in public, you have to wear a mask."
Fair compromise -- you reopen your State, I'll wear a mask in public. Heck, I'll wear gloves, a hazmat suit and multiple condoms too.
Just reopen the Big Apple!
Maybe what's weighing on Cuomo is New York intra-state politics?
Here’s How Much Downstate New York Is Skewing the United States’ Coronavirus Numbers
Trump is dying to be able to call Cuomo "a friend. I think we're friends. I like him. We'll see what happens, but we get along." That's what Trump does.
But that would kill the Gov's credibility on the Left.
Not by much - though I will concede Cuomo is much better at public speaking. The Inslee can put rocks to sleep in 30 seconds or less when he opens his yap. I actually tried to watch one of his China Flu pressers and only made it about 10 seconds in before I turned the set off. How the man manages to get out of bed, dressed and to work every day is a marvel.
Trump can't win NY, and Cuomo can't lose it. Throwing insults at Trump may help Cuomo with his left-wing base, but it doesn't win him any friends in the White House. Trump only attacked Cuomo in self-defense.
You can verify that by the MSM headline. When Trump starts something its "Angry, Crazy, Trump viciously attacks so and so". When someone attacks Trump and he defends himself its" Trump and so and so trade barbs".
"faire le beau!",
Mr. Cuo-mo
George? Maybe its the Benjamins he's after
there is no time for politics
And of course he would get wearied and subdued by a press that universally wants to keep poking that bear to try to gin up the appearance of conflict between the President and every other person in the world.
I certainly find such people tedious.
Well, the Democrats are the ones who have consistently tried to politicize this- I applaud Cuomo for trying to dial it back, but that horse is out of the barn.
Cuomo wants that money from the inflated numbers of "suspected" deaths.
Play nice and maybe they won't look too deep.
The horse is six counties over and the barn burned to the ground yesterday.
The blue state governors are on the spot. Within a matter of days, red states will start to open up. People will notice. There are 30,000 dead from this virus, but 20 million out of work. Even the MSM is beginning to focus on the single moms with two kids at home and no way to pay the bills.
Cuomo seems to be a pretty rational guy. Is he really going to let his state go down the drain just to get Biden elected?
Its no different than when the DNC-media describes political violence. If conservatives or Right wingers start it, the headlines is "Right-wingers viciously attack XYZ activists" when Antifa attacks anyone - even peaceful Trump supporters - its "violence breaks out"
Just reopen the Big Apple!
Well, I'm fine with people checking in there. But I've got big problems with them checking out.
The bridges and tunnels are one way only. No way they should be spreading their poison to the rest of the world.
The first paragraph in the transcript you linked sounds very, very Trumpy. Read it in his voice.
Trust a Democrat.
Get screwed.
Yes, there is time for politics.
The infections are almost entirely localized in metro NYC.
Here in upstate NY, the shutdown is an absurdity.
16 fatalities in my county of 184,000 souls. And the fatalities numbers are tainted by failure to test and the financial incentives to overreport.
The panic in upstate NY has no foundation in reality. The economic devastation is pointless and stupid.
Cuomo should immediately end the shutdown outside of the NYC metro area.
Well, we are finding out who the empty suits are.
I read a study yesterday that showed you have a miniscule chance of being infected outdoors. From the study, you get infected indoors,off of surfaces, or from long exposure to someone else who is infected. The home was number one for infection, mass transit, then other indoor spaces.
Wash your hands and stop touching your f$%king face.
One comment that made me chuckle: thinking a cloth mask will stop microscopic particles is like throwing a goofball at a volleyball net and expecting a rebound.
By early May, Trump is gonna make Andy Cuomo his bitch. The money guys of NY run the city, and the state, and fund a lot of the DNC. They're tired of this bullshit. They wanna open up.
Cuomo as the prospective nominee to replace Biden has some serious problems.
He's kinky, as the nipple hardware demonstrates.
NY Democrats have the Epstein biz hanging over them. Also, the NXIVM sex cult in Albany played a big role in Democratic Party financing.
Of course, we have a very compliant media covering for the Democrats in NY.
But, if Cuomo runs, look for the kinky shit to come out. I assume he's been connected in some way to NXIVM.
CORONAVIRUS
4/16/2020
TAKING NO DOGGONE CHANCES!!!
Dogs sporting medical-grade snout masks would have turned heads 2 months ago -- now it's becoming a common sight amid the global coronavirus pandemic.
These shots aren't just from pet-crazed USA ... the gallery shows dog owners all around the world -- countries in Asia, South and North America -- want to make sure their pets do NOT have a nose for COVID-19.
There is reason for some concern. As we reported, researchers at the National Institutes of Health have seen evidence of humans transmitting the virus to their pets -- cats and dogs.
So far, there have been 2 known cases of dogs testing positive ... both in Hong Kong. The masks on dogs couldn't hurt ... plus, most of 'em look kinda cute. Think Doggie Howser, M.D.
There's no evidence pets can transmit it back to humans, but scientists say the best advice is to stay away from your pet if you're experiencing any COVID-19 symptoms.
https://www.tmz.com/2020/04/16/dogs-wearing-masks-coronavirus-photos/
Reading Cuomo, I could not stop thinking of the New Yorker magazine cover depicting civilization ending at the Hudson River.
What he doesn't recognize is that it does end, but in the inverse.
Are the NY subways still running? Last I checked, they had 5.4 Million daily riders. But that was in February.
Ever take the Lexington ave train uptown during rush hour all the way to Pellham Bay? Lotta dudes & gals all co-mingled together for miles. It's kike a platonic orgie of heat, sweat and funk.
@Ann,
"He was talking about the actual physical masks that people are told to wear, but I thought the phrase worked well to express the demeanor a leader needs to display to maintain confidence and morale."
That reminds me of my favorite poem. It seems apt. I never thought of this poem (or excerpt) as political before, but it definitely works in that context. Who knew?
There will be time, there will be time
To prepare a face to meet the faces that you meet;
There will be time to murder and create,
And time for all the works and days of hands
That lift and drop a question on your plate;
Time for you and time for me,
And time yet for a hundred indecisions,
And for a hundred visions and revisions,
Before the taking of a toast and tea.
I think Cuomo was showing signs of stress yesterday. Who knows what happened behind the scenes, but there are so many reasons for toning down the public emotions.
Cuomo was likely confronted by the reality that NYC will be in lock-down for a long time, just when most other regions are moving forward to open. Cuomo has to know a huge federal bailout will be necessary because the rest of New York state ain't willing to pay.
Also my favorite poem.
"How does this situation get worse and get worse quickly? If you politicize all that emotion."
Democratic policy for at least 30 years.
Ah. Costanza.
a huge federal bailout will be necessary
Oh hell no. They chose to live like rats in that packed city. They chose to put political correctness above science. They fought Trump when he wanted to Quarantine the city.
Quarantine the city and let everyone else get back to work. No one in or out until transmission rate is down to .3 like Como wants. Then we can talk about bailouts.
"We’ve never been through this before. And, on every level, this is a terrible experience."
Which? The virus or the governmental reaction.
Excellent article by Matt Margolis at PJ Media on how NYC is skewing U.S. numbers and leading to tragic policy decisions.
https://pjmedia.com/trending/heres-how-much-downstate-new-york-is-skewing-the-united-states-coronavirus-numbers/
"Cuomo has to know a huge federal bailout will be necessary because the rest of New York state ain't willing to pay."
If the rest of New York isn't willing to pay, I'm quite sure the deplorables in flyover country won't be any more inclined to want to "contribute" to the bailout.
@Yancey,
Thumbs up emoji.
@Meade,
That reminds me of, "Ah. Bach."
https://youtu.be/aYSG8AQO3tw
You guys are being too harsh on NYC.
It is a fabulous place to visit. You can really trip the light fantastic there.
I look forward to visiting it every 3 or 4 years for a couple of days. Mingle with neurotic folks. Maybe, I'll have to skip a visit this decade, but nonetheless a great place. Fuhgeddaboudit!
@wince: Thanks for your link at 5:52pm. There's NYC and the rest of the country. NYC is apparently the hardest hit region in the world. I've seen Trump get criticized for lack of ventilators and inadequacy of testing, but I've yet to see any criticism of DeBlasio or Cuomo. I presume they did a few things wrongs.....I've seen some of Cuomo's pressers. He takes his sly digs at Trump. Politicians politicize issues. Nice that the press is letting him pretend to be some kind of philosopher-kings who's above such petty concerns.
I would definitely vote for Trump above Cuomo, but I'd much rather see Cuomo in the Oval Office than Biden.
"Do The Reich Thing"
‘Enforcement Will Come’ — De Blasio Encourages New Yorkers To Snitch On Each Other For Not Social Distancing
“And now, it’s as simple as taking a photo,” the mayor said. “All you’ve got to do is take the photo and put the location with it, and bang, send a photo like this and we will make sure that enforcement comes right away.”
hmmm. Just from a photo?
Di Bozo locked up a woman for not SD'ing, put her in a crowded cell w/ 24 others!!
Here in Hawaii, a leak outlined the possibility of the State cutting salaries 10% across the board. It was most likely one of many options being considered, and the governor tried to communicate that even as the government unions raise an uproar. But the reality is that the State is facing major shortfalls in tax revenue as the shutdown continues. And Hawaii can't be the only State facing this issue. Calls for assistance from the Federal Government are already being made by States. Whether, when, or how sufficient such bailouts may be have got to be on the minds of all governors, Cuomo included. So perhaps Trump was right when he talked about increasing pressure to open up. Assumptions that the pressure would come from Trump or from "supporters" may be missing bigger sources of pressure from State government unions.
"Di Bozo locked up a woman for not SD'ing"
They're far less interested in social distancing than they are to having their authoritah disrespected.
Howard (not that Howard) said...
Which Howard are you?
Howard #1 makes some interesting comments, despite being a lefty.
Howard #2 is a lefty obsessed with calling people cucks and snowflakes.
While I am at it, what is the story with the two Marks?
that reminds me how is Wilhelm's fave Nicaragua, is doing
Cuomo's got the Corona tiger by the tail. New York City is by far the densest population in the country, which is completely dependent on mass transit. Social distancing is impossible on a subway car or crosstown bus, or on sidewalks at rush hour. Upstate New York is like flyover country in comparison. But he's Governor of both. Relaxing shutdown for upstate while continuing the shutdown for months in NYC is going to a bitter pill for any governor to swallow. (The rising numbers of Wuhan Flu in Tokyo are just what you'd expect from a dense populated city dependent on crowded subways.)
The United Nations said an estimated 42 million to 66 million children could fall into extreme poverty as a result of the coronavirus crisis this year, adding to the estimated 386 million children already in extreme poverty in 2019.
Not the disease, but the economic consequences of the disease.
We have to accept the reality that people are going to die from this disease. But we can't destroy the the world economy in the process of trying to mitigate its health effects at the margins. We have to make the hard choices.
Someone told him about the "Pottery Barn" rule?
And Hawaii can't be the only State facing this issue. Calls for assistance from the Federal Government are already being made by States.
"As, on the one hand, it is certain that we all address some such request to the state, and, on the other hand, it is a well-established fact that the state cannot procure satisfaction for some without adding to the labor of others, while awaiting another definition of the state, I believe myself entitled to give my own here. Who knows if it will not carry off the prize? Here it is: The state is the great fictitious entity by which everyone seeks to live at the expense of everyone else." - Frédéric Bastiat
DiBlasio does remind one of Cartman and his 'respect my authority' schtick.
I have been wondering how long before all of the public sector unions and the state penny pinchers would notice the lack of revenue coming into the states because most everybody is not working or buying much other than food. So maybe more pressure to open up for dogs sake? Faster please.
a "noticeably subdued" Mr. Cuomo
...maybe someone hooked up those piercings to a car battery
Cuomo just realized that people who aren’t working can’t pay taxes. He threw up.
Covid spread by coughs and fingerprints in the NYC subways; it will recede by erasing fingerprints (cough) higher up.
"Blogger Bay Area Guy said...
Are the NY subways still running? Last I checked, they had 5.4 Million daily riders. But that was in February.
Ever take the Lexington ave train uptown during rush hour all the way to Pellham Bay? Lotta dudes & gals all co-mingled together for miles. It's kike a platonic orgie of heat, sweat and funk."
That word in regards to NY isn't acceptable, Freudian type or not. Let's delete it, shall we? And orgie? Maybe you've had a little too much Althouse for one day?
“The emotion in this country is as high as I can recall. People are frustrated. We’re anxious. We’re scared. We’re angry. We’ve never been through this before. And, on every level, this is a terrible experience.”
I blame the Fake News after China for this disaster. This nationwide shutdown has gone on too long.
cant watch Cuomo without thinking of SNL's
"House of Buttafuocco" skits
(Jan Hooks U rock'd!! RIP)
Francisco D: "While I am at it, what is the story with the two Marks?"
Mark the law guy from VA is the conservative.
Mark the hidden profile guy is the typical leftist.
Oh hell no. They chose to live like rats in that packed city. They chose to put political correctness above science. They fought Trump when he wanted to Quarantine the city.
Bingo ! Give that man $500.
Chicagoboyz has a nice piece without the Althouse trolls.
I just noticed that Matt Margolis of Pajamas Media made my point much better. Using latest statistics, NYC and immediate environs lead the world by several factors in per capita cases and deaths. Considering the USA ex NYC and environs, it drops out of top ten in each category.
Reopening NYC without a vaccine will be ugly for any politician in the direct line of responsibility. Trump has effectively maneuvered Cuomo (with an assist from Cuomo's rash Italian tongue) into that very position.
"The state is the great fictitious entity by which everyone seeks to live at the expense of everyone else." - Frédéric Bastiat
Well, unless we transition to an anarchic society, this has been a fact of life since the beginning of civilization.
"While I am at it, what is the story with the two Marks?"
There are two people, I trust you understand two is not one?, who post under the same name. What, if anything, do you think I am missing about the (deuce) Marks? Or as you may like the Mark deuce?
One of my favorite Atlthousisms* is "You post under different names you liar" like was said about Fred4prez(?) and many others as the years have accumulated.
It is real simple to most folks, even those who have done or do menial tasks like change bedpans, but you seem perplexed without reason. You seem like those you used to treat, as it were.
*Not a reflection of Althouse the person, but the (shit I just used "denizens" and that would work here but) people whom comment.
"(Jan Hooks U rock'd!! RIP)"
Mrs. Apu is dead?????? When?
I'd consider a bailout for the States on one condition.
China pays for it.
It's not emotional politics. It's emotional audiences. They're played to. As Cuomo is doing anyway. "As you can see, I'm a leader."
The non-emotional way is don't play to any audience. Have a confidential conversation with the people you have to have a confidential conversation with and shut up.
More economic aid from the federal government is inevitable. The PPP will need more funding, and another rand of direct payments to citizens probably should occur, too.
@Yancy
2014, throat cancer.
This remarkable article shows how much city of NY is skewing US statistics. If we include "downstate NY" as part of the US, the US ranks 7th in the world in cases per capita. If we treat "downstate NY" as a separate country, it is first ( by a wide margin with 4 x the incidence of 2nd place Spain) and the "US excluding downstate NY" drops to 13. SImilarly with COVID deaths per capita, including DSNY we have the US as 8th worldwide. Separating out DSNY as a separate country it's number 1 in the world, about 2x second place Belgium, and "US excluding DSNY" is 11 on the worldwide list.
https://pjmedia.com/trending/heres-how-much-downstate-new-york-is-skewing-the-united-states-coronavirus-numbers/
We will never know, but this keeps looking more and more like coup 3.0. The way this was hyped as worse than Spanish flu. The lies about not needing masks. The lies that masks didn't work. Not revealing we drew down the mask supply in 2009, and never replenished, so we had no reserve. The lies about needing to shelter in place, and close everything down. The lies that nothing helped fight the virus. The assumption the number of positive tests was a useful number. The MSM glad the market tanked, glad so many lost their jobs. Nancy already having her 1400 page "bill" ready for action. Not willing to save businesses and jobs when the money ran out in the relief program.
China's lies. The wet market lie. Ignoring, and denying, info about the probable source being the "research facility". China in January buying up PPE supplies around the world, and shipping to China. China's lies about the disease. China's lies about how many are dead. So many here supporting the lies, not wanting to "offend" China, or was it losing their paycheck. So many lies. This is not a complete list of lies.
The most probable explanation is that China and its agents here in America conspired to cause a recession by crashing the economy, and it would be worth it to get rid of Trump. This keeps looking more and more to be the best explanation. So similar to the FBI claiming it was just a bunch of errors in judgement that all happened to lean the same direction, concerning that "Russian" agent Page.
Their problem is that like trying to kill Rasputin, it doesn't seem to work. What should destroy a normal politician just makes him stronger. Or did it just keep the margin within the margin for cheating with fraud by mail?
So Cuomo has to work with the guy he tried to "kill". It makes for interesting times, as the Chinese curse goes. This plot makes the Suprano's look like a fairy tale.
Trust is the most important aspect of civilization. Trade requires trust. To send your kid to school requires trust that a teacher will educate your child, not indoctrinate them. Relationship requires trust. If you don't trust the baby food you are sold, China can go to Australia. We have no place to go.
We have cut a lot of cords. How many more before civilization crashes? Will the cut in American food production, because of this hoax, mean we have no food to sell the world? If there is no more food, who dies?
Wow, 6 years ago. I never knew until now. I liked Hooks a lot on SNL- the shows second golden age- that period of Hooks, Carvey, Hartman etal.
>>when Antifa attacks anyone - even peaceful Trump supporters - its "violence breaks out"
You have much to learn. The narrative for Antifa rioting and violence is: "mostly peaceful".
As in "The play at Ford's Theater was mostly peaceful."
Several years ago Yancey. Great Decatur girl, went to Towers High.
Bill, Republic of Texas said...
I'd consider a bailout for the States on one condition.
China pays for it.
4/18/20, 7:22 PM
This. China has a large bill coming.
People have been discussing their reading, lately to include the Asian Saga of the magnificent James Clavell, alas. In his Tai-Pan is discussed the cession of Hong Kong by China to Great Britain.
Allow me to attach a piece regarding negotiations, propounded by the hero Dirk Struan to the hapless plenipotentiary Longstaff; I have now been reminded that they faced an epidemic too, of malaria, then incurable...
http://www.myths.com/pub/fiction/general/Clavell/Tai-Pan.html
“Now all you have to do is to save Hong Kong, Will. Only you can do it,” Struan said, praying that once more he would make Longstaff put into effect the plan he had eventually devised as the only way to save the necks of all of them. “I think it advisable for you to order an immediate abandonment of Happy Valley.”
“Bless my soul, Dirk,” Longstaff cried, “if I do that, well—that’s tantamount to abandoning Hong Kong!”
“Queen’s Town’s malarial. At least Happy Valley is. So it has to be abandoned.”
Longstaff shakily took some snuff. “I can’t order the abandonment. That’d make me responsible for all losses.”
“Aye. You’ve decided to use the six million taels to reimburse everyone.”
“Good God. I can’t do that!” Longstaff burst out. “The bullion belongs to the Crown. The Crown—only the Crown—can decide what to do with it!”
“You’ve decided that Hong Kong’s too valuable to risk. You know you’ve got to move quickly. It’s a gesture worthy of a governor.”
“I absolutely can’t, Dirk! Not at all. Impossible!”
Struan went over to the sideboard and poured two glasses of sherry. “Your entire future depends on it.”
“Eh? It does? How?”
Struan gave him a glass. “Your reputation at court is tied to Hong Kong. Your whole Asian policy—and that means the Crown’s Asian policy—is focused on Hong Kong. Rightly. Without Hong Kong safe the governor, on Her Majesty’s behalf, will na be able to dominate Asia as he should. Without a town built there’s nae safety for you or for the Crown. Happy Valley’s dead. So a new town must be built and quickly.” Struan drank the sherry and savored it. “If you immediately reimburse those who’ve built, you’ll restore confidence at once. All the traders will rally to your support—which you’ll need in the future. Dinna forget, Will, many have considerable influence at court. It’s a grand gesture, one worthy of you. Besides, the reimbursement is really being paid for by the Chinese anyway.”
“I don’t understand.”
“Within three months you’ll be at the gates of Peking, commander-in-chief of an invincible force. The cost of the expedition will be, say, four million. Add six million for the damage to the Settlement. Ten million. But you ask fourteen million, which would be fair indemnity. The extra four million will be the basis of your Hong Kong government treasury—and thus one of the richest colonial treasuries in the Empire. Actually, instead of fourteen you will demand twenty million: The extra six repays the six you—in your shrewdness—‘invested’ in Hong Kong on the Crown’s behalf. Dinna forget, without a safe base you canna dare make the attack north. Without Hong Kong safe, England’s dead in Asia. Without Hong Kong safe you’re dead. You’re thinking of the whole future of England, Will. It’s that simple!”
so, $20T should cover it.
That's our end. Be interesting to see what the rest of the world regards as fair.
The book also demonstrates how easy China is to roll if you're serious about it.
Cuomo noted that New York had 15 times the coronavirus cases of California and other states and offered his opinion about why that was the case.
“Because we welcome people from across the globe,” he said.
"Activist Judges Blocked Trump’s Iran Travel Ban, Now NYC’s Outbreak is Due to Travel from Iran"
@PresbyPoet:
The most probable explanation is that China and its agents here in America conspired to cause a recession by crashing the economy, and it would be worth it to get rid of Trump. This keeps looking more and more to be the best explanation.
That's insane. For one, the damage done to China far outstrips any threat Trump posed to them.
Well that was a china, wracked by the taipeing rebellion, with all the attendant chaos.
"the phrase worked well to express the demeanor a leader needs to display to maintain confidence and morale."
Except Trump doesn't have too.
"The emotion in this country is as high as I can recall. People are frustrated. We’re anxious. We’re scared."
Who dat we?
"We’re angry. We’ve never been through this before. And, on every level, this is a terrible experience."'
Angry at the alarmists. No, we've never been through the deliberate, wanton destruction of the economy on this scale before.
"Well, unless we transition to an anarchic society, this has been a fact of life since the beginning of civilization."
George Washington sought to live at the expense of everyone else? He didn't actually pledge his sacred honor and fortune then I suppose, because why do that if you seek to live off of everyone else?
@Yancy
our faves also (sniff). If you can find it, look up "Love is a Dream" with Hartman & Hooks-- a touching gem.
Did, your term, "everyone" in the wild west of 1850 America want to live at the expense of everyone else?
That's insane. For one, the damage done to China far outstrips any threat Trump posed to them.
What damage?
"Even the MSM is beginning to focus on the single moms with two kids at home and no way to pay the bills."
If the SJWs had any sense and could let go of their TDS and racial obsessions for a moment--I know, I know--they could make hay with the outrageous injustice that has been committed against poor schlubs thrown out work for no good reason and poor kids deprived of the quality education to which they have the right under every state constitution.
Someone had to do this: a George divided against himself.
Andy figured out that the rest of us have figured out that not only is NYC not the entire US. He just can’t tell anybody else.
I preferred Liar George- Bawdy George was good, too.
"Well, unless we transition to an anarchic society, this has been a fact of life since the beginning of civilization."
Yep. The takers are awfully invested in ensuring the makers continue to provide.
@Yancey
for now:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1gC912LUq0
Mr. "We need $30,000 ventilators!!" steps it down a few.
With a 6 bill budget shortfall, He wants "unrestricted" assistance $$ from the Feds.
I hope the solar panels are working out.
Santa Clara Cty results and discussion. Fatality rate slightly higher than flu? Other test results next week:
An Update from Dr Jay Bhattacharya
Guildofcannonballs said...
George Washington sought to live at the expense of everyone else? He didn't actually pledge his sacred honor and fortune then I suppose, because why do that if you seek to live off of everyone else?
Did, your term, "everyone" in the wild west of 1850 America want to live at the expense of everyone else?
"Everyone" wasn't my term, it was Bastiat's. He was giving a general definition of the state.
Love that section about how easily he beat her. Made me think of Hillary!!!
@Nichevo:
What damage?
One, the economic damage resulting from the pandemic. Two, the fact that China's response has spurred skepticism about supply chains in China.
Karens get stitches. So do Beckys. Or is that "Beckies"?
Also, Sharon is Karen, so she gets them too.
Taking time off from the Godfather, Goodfellas, and the Sopranos, the Cuomo Family wandered into politics and thug media where none of them did any good.
"That's insane. For one, the damage done to China far outstrips any threat Trump posed to them."
You are insane, as Trump breaking China obviously has lead to America becoming shut down, for the first time.
China doesn't understand what you might mean as "damage." China is now winning, idiot. They have spent billions over decades to be in this position. Trump, God, and God alone, willing, will help American beat the Commies.
100,000,000 old Chinese men dead is Christmas to Communists. You can't, because of being born American, begin to start to understand without more effort.
I stopped for ice cream on the way home last night instead of milk. At least 8 customers in the store, only 2 in masks. Curiously enough, it was the couple who are both health care workers who told me a few nights earlier they take their masks off as soon as they hit the parking lot to head home. On the way to work today stopped at two places, a big box for some electrical work stuff, and Walmart for some food. There were more masks than in the pa, but the majority were ignoring Dictator Cuomo’s mask edict. Workers were all wearing them, likely in order to keep their jobs. Some of them were even wearing them correctly.
At the big box checkout went slowly. The checker between each customer wiped down the whole register horizontal surface AND the plexiglass screen between her and the customer as if the virus was like a Mexican jumping bean and could fly off the screen that nobody touched and attack me.
One new really irritating element at Walmart and Wegmans. I normally shop with a carry basket, not a cart, as I’m normally buying just a few items. They must endanger people’s lives because they’ve been hidden away. Can you say “Completely ridiculous posturing?”. I can.
The Morlocks are just getting nervous.
This has been a sham from the start and the numbers were just never there. It has been clear this has been widespread for a long time and the death rate was massively exaggerated.
Are you helping?
@walter:
Santa Clara Cty results and discussion. Fatality rate slightly higher than flu? Other test results next week:
An Update from Dr Jay Bhattacharya
It's a piece of the puzzle, but the study was too limited to draw any broad conclusions.
So a lady by the name of Kim Pagan was arrested yesterday Friday by the New Jersey Police for organizing a non-approved protest of the state government. Any thoughts?
J. Farmer said...
That's insane. For one, the damage done to China far outstrips any threat Trump posed to them.
4/18/20, 7:40 PM
Admittedly, the plan is so completely in President Trump's wheelhouse that if you told me that COVID-19 was created in an deep state bioweapons lab, I'd believe it. Any "success" their plot has had is just about coincidental, and its obvious failures were obvious to anyone who has observed the last few years.
1) Donald Trump is an effective crisis manager who has managed to survive overwhelming odds on everything from the Mueller inquiry, to ISIS, to rebuilding the economy, to staffing the judiciary, and now mitigating the consequences of the coronavirus.
2) Conversely, the Democrats could mess up a wet dream, and only relentless New York media elitism prevents most of the country from realizing that New York has more than a third of all national deaths from coronavirus!
3) I'm actually surprised the sheer grassroots hatred for China hasn't resulted in real reprisal attacks on Chinese-Americans, but the year is still young. The only media outlet that has been relentlessly pro-China is Bloomberg News. No surprise there.
4) China, for all their flaws, generally comes up with competent plans that don't backfire on them horrendously. The Chinese version of the Korean War, where they refrained from wiping out the entire UN force when they obviously had the power to do so, made a lot more sense than whatever jingoistic American explanation was given.
But a plan being insane and desperate hasn't stopped nations from trying them before. The Democrats didn't expect Donald Trump getting to the bottom of their coup attempt, and the Chinese probably didn't expect this much ferocious blowback from their response to the virus. While I don't think this whole thing was a specific plot from start to finish, China's attempt to expend all their political capital to blame the US has a certain level of culpability. Go out being too much of a pro-China agent, I doubt many Americans around you will be too happy.
@Guildofcannonballs:
You are insane, as Trump breaking China obviously has lead to America becoming shut down, for the first time.
In what way was Trump "breaking China"? The US is the number one purchaser of Chinese goods. Economic damage here will affect them negatively. China's coronavirus response has greatly increased mistrust towards China and prompted reconsideration of supply chains. In what way is China "now winning"?
Char, "thinking a cloth mask will stop microscopic particles is like throwing a goofball at a volleyball net and expecting a rebound." is the wrong way to look at it. The cloth doesn't have to stop individual viruses, only the expelled globules of saliva and phlegm that carry them. Even so, I don't wear a mask, and I don't plan to.
Cuomo better be subdue.
If the rest of the country was told the whole truth...
How Much Downstate New York Is Skewing the United States’ Coronavirus Numbers
@doctrev:
While I don't think this whole thing was a specific plot from start to finish, China's attempt to expend all their political capital to blame the US has a certain level of culpability.
I don't doubt that China prefers a scapegoat for their mismanagement of the outbreak. That would be totally unsurprising. But that's not even on the same level as: "The most probable explanation is that China and its agents here in America conspired to cause a recession by crashing the economy, and it would be worth it to get rid of Trump. "
Pandemic Hits Globalist Hub Hard - Globalists Seek Bailout From Nation
The Stones were splendid Mick still rolls
J. Farmer said.
It's a piece of the puzzle, but the study was too limited to draw any broad conclusions.
--
Maybe watch the clip.
@walter:
Maybe watch the clip.
Not in a position to watch a 42-minute-long video at the moment. The answer to the question you posed is, "we don't know."
J. Farmer said...
I don't doubt that China prefers a scapegoat for their mismanagement of the outbreak. That would be totally unsurprising. But that's not even on the same level as: "The most probable explanation is that China and its agents here in America conspired to cause a recession by crashing the economy, and it would be worth it to get rid of Trump. "
4/18/20, 8:25 PM
At least as many Americans will be looking for scapegoats as the Chinese are, and the results will be catastrophic for China's international ambitions. As a small example, I can see President Trump pressuring the IMF to "forgive" China's loans to African nations, citing coronavirus poverty. Great for mushy-minded suburbanites who want to Help The Poor, terrible for the default risk of those organizations and future funds to Africa. I heard it on leftist radio just a short time ago. Over time, the Bloombergs trying to Blame Trump and Exonerate China will fuel people's certainties that either China or the Deep State is using the crisis to tyrannize Americans. It may even be true, to some extent, but when universities are shutting their Confucius Institutes, things are looking worse for China than they are for America.
Farmer
You know the joke about the two Russian peasants? Ivan and Boris are two peasants, both poor, in the same town, they see each other every day, labor in the same fields, but Boris owns a goat. Ivan finds a bottle in the woods and opens it. A genie appears and grants Ivan one wish. “I wish that Boris's goat should die.”
You are debating China with Ivan.
@doctrev:
hings are looking worse for China than they are for America.
Agreed. I've been saying that the crisis will hopefully begin a fundamental shift away from China, something none of the last four presidents have been able to achieve.
"It's not emotional politics."
Even though it is, because contained within the definition of politics are things you willingly/willfully/woefully make yourself unaware, which doesn't count for the rest of us guys.
You are debating China with Ivan.
"It is not enough to succeed; others must fail."
"'Everyone" wasn't my term, it was Bastiat's."
Apologies, please list all terms yours that you use that aren't others so when you quote them I may also apply the use of the term to your meaning.
Farmer
I wonder about the China disengagement. Obviously this makes the case pretty damn well. Do you think that will convince Disney or Time Warner, or the DNC? We see hear a lot of heads in the sand about the virus. Will it be different with China? Different heads perhaps but the same sand. I see so very much ass covering for China on the left these days.
The pandemic in NYC is already over. Consider:
1. The few antibody studies we've seen so far indicate an IFR (infection fatality rate; the percentage of infections that are fatal) of 0.1 to 0.15 percent. NYC deaths so far are 8893, and assuming that it takes 14 days from initial infection until death, that implies that by April 4'th, somewhere between 8,993,000 and 13,489,500 NYC area people had already been infected. Since there are only about 8 million people in NYC, the implication is that just about everyone there has already been infected.
2. Between March 22 and April 4'th, some 15 percent of the pregnant women admitted to two NYC hospitals for delivery had Covid antibodies. There's no reason to think that these women are very unrepresentative of the general population. But if we allow for one week to develop antibodies, and pretend all of those women were tested on March 28'th (midway between 3/22 and 4/4) we're led to estimate that by March 21st, 15 percent of Big Apple residents had already been infected. That's 1.2 million people. By way of contrast, the confirmed cases number for the entire state on that date was 10,356, less than 1 percent of our estimate. The confirmed case number has since doubled five times. The number of actual NYC infections could not have doubled even three times before everyone was infected.
3. I can't find the number of people tested in NYC, but the NY State numbers at The Covid Tracking Project show that while the number of people tested per day is pretty stable, the percent of those RNA tests coming back positive has been falling. Fewer people are getting sick. Considering points 1 and 2 above, it's clear that immunity, not social distancing, is why.
@Ken B:
I wonder about the China disengagement. Obviously this makes the case pretty damn well. Do you think that will convince Disney or Time Warner, or the DNC? We see hear a lot of heads in the sand about the virus. Will it be different with China? Different heads perhaps but the same sand. I see so very much ass covering for China on the left these days.
Even under ideal conditions, decoupling from China will be a lengthy and somewhat painful process. Our political system is not well established for such a problem. The recent phase one deal moves us in the opposite direction. A lot of power centers in the US have incentives to accommodate China, and they will fight decoupling tooth and nail.
Even under ideal conditions, decoupling from China will be a lengthy and somewhat painful process.
For Jeff Bezos, perhaps. For others, not so much. At any rate, we'll see.
Our political system is not well established for such a problem.
And that's your problem in a nutshell. It isn't a political problem. It's a business problem, albeit one that applies to far too many businesses.
I posted the current as of then numbers last night on another post. 12,192 CoVID19 deaths in NY, 9273 in the 12 contiguous counties that comprise the NY metropolitan area. The only county outside that area with triple digit deaths is Erie County with 109 deaths. Buff, NY’s 2nd largest city, is in Erie County. My county and the 4 surrounding it have 50 de, 44 in Monroe County, home of Rochester, the 3rd largest city, leaving 6 deaths for the other 4 of us. Accounting for the total population of the 4 counties vs Monroe, the death rate is 3 times as high in Monroe. I’m using deaths by county residence, not where the death occurred.
Seems to be a city problem looking at the death rates. Leads one to wonder how many of the rural county deaths were big city workers. A great number of people in my county work in Rochester or other areas of Monroe.
I travel to NY every other week, or used to for work.
NYC used to be special. Just like the Bay Area and Seattle and such used to be special.
There is nothing you can get in NYC that you can't get in any mid-size city or larger in America anymore, except broadway theater, and even that, Chicago's theater is just as good or better.
There's no reason to stop the country for NYC. Period.
@Big Mike:
For Jeff Bezos, perhaps. For others, not so much. At any rate, we'll see.
Reshoring will be a long, drawn out process. No way around that.
And that's your problem in a nutshell. It isn't a political problem. It's a business problem, albeit one that applies to far too many businesses.
Trade terms with China are a political problem. US government policy will have to be involved in reshoring manufacturing out of China and back to the US. China's value in the supply chain cannot be easily duplicated in other countries.
I think the constant anti-Trump outrage you hear from Democratic politicians is just as much the mask as the cooperative front. I'm sure there are some who genuinely feel outrage -- politicians are drawn from the same professional class who still feel personally wounded and humiliated by Trump's victory four years ago -- but most of them seem to be play acting at outrage to appease the loonies in their base.
Re: Jeff
I haven't checked the NY numbers at the site you mention, but the numbers at the NY health department tracker suggest that most of the ups and downs in daily new case figures have been an artifact of ups and downs in daily test figures. The first day in the past week with an increase in tests but a drop in positive cases looks to be yesterday.
@Jeff:
Considering points 1 and 2 above, it's clear that immunity, not social distancing, is why.
That's certainly possible. But the first two points have a lot of qualifications. We can't really draw very broad conclusions from the Santa Clara Seroprevalence study. We also can't generalize much from the pregnancy survey, which included 225 women.
Metro New York has the worst coronavirus epidemic in the US -- about a third of all cases and deaths in the entire nation. Yet that's where we get 90% of our news from. And when the TV newsies DO cover other parts of the country, they focus on where the conditions are worst -- or when they cover those places where things aren't so bad, it's to mock the protesters that want to open things up. It's almost enough to make you wish for a return of the Fairness Doctrine. Almost.
"He sounds like he needs a good cry."
Maybe he should get into bed with Brian Stelter.
But the first two points have a lot of qualifications. We can't really draw very broad conclusions from the Santa Clara Seroprevalence study. We also can't generalize much from the pregnancy survey, which included 225 women.
There are also seroprevalence studies from Europe. Paunio is one example. Again this is a small sample, but so far small samples are all we have for antibody tests. But Paunio estimates an IFR of 0.13 percent.
What is really inexcusable is that we are making huge political decisions without the basic seroprevalence data we need. Antibody tests have been available for at least a couple of weeks already. Why isn't anyone doing something obvious like testing all the blood donated in New York? It might take two days to do this if you're competent.
The willingness of the powers that be to make very costly decisions without expending the trivial funds they would need to get decent data makes me wonder if perhaps they don't want to know, for fear their power trips would come to an end.
Re: Balfegor
Look again at the NY health department tracker you link to. Set the time period to "All" and then click on the big counties on the right, especially Nassau, Manhattan, Kings, Queens, and Bronx. Notice that, as you move from left to right, the blue parts of the bars grow relative to the orange parts. Look at Nassua. In the first days of April, more than half of the tests were positive, but for the three most recent days, only about a third are positive. The trend is even more obvious for Queens, but it's also there for the other counties.
The percentage of positive tests is going down even as the number of tests is not growing very much. This is exactly what you expect to see as a pandemic is dying down.
Trade terms with China are a political problem. US government policy will have to be involved in reshoring manufacturing out of China ...
Not hardly. We got where we are by thousands of businesses making decisions for the benefit — or hoped for benefit — of the firm. Each business will have to make their own decisions in the other direction. If we let politicians and federal bureaucrats get involved, they’ll just screw it up. Surely you can see that?
Trade terms with China are a political problem. US government policy will have to be involved in reshoring manufacturing out of China ...
Not hardly. We got where we are by thousands of businesses making decisions for the benefit — or hoped for benefit — of the firm. Each business will have to make their own decisions in the other direction. If we let politicians and federal bureaucrats get involved, they’ll just screw it up. Surely you can see that?
What I see is that a lot of government officials aren't interested in seroprevalence tests, which is a kind of tell. The only tests a good portion of them are interested in are the RT-PCR tests, and nothing else.
I said it before- there is an enormous amount of political capital now invested in the shutdowns, and if the true fatality rate of this disease turns out to be under 0.5%, there will be hard questions asked by the voters across the world. And it won't be just about the shutdown, but it will also be about the deaths that could have been prevented if the health authorities had taken the protection of hospitals and nursing homes seriously right from the start.
I wrote a comment about a month ago now that all the RT-PCR testing should have been devoted to hospital patients, hospital staff, nursing home patients, and nursing home staff- the testing in those should have been relentless. Additionally, COVID-19 patients should never have been admitted to hospitals containing other kinds of patients- that was just staggering stupidity. They needed to be housed in complete separate buildings with dedicated staff to avoid cross contamination. Lots of someones are responsible for this part of the disaster, especially in New York and New Jersey, and a few other isolated places in the US, but then also almost all the countries in Western Europe.
Well John Prine, he done passed a few decades ago.
He well told you that and we all love him for it.
J. Farmer said...
@PresbyPoet:
The most probable explanation is that China and its agents here in America conspired to cause a recession by crashing the economy, and it would be worth it to get rid of Trump. This keeps looking more and more to be the best explanation.
That's insane. For one, the damage done to China far outstrips any threat Trump posed to them.
I agree with Farmer. They didn't plan this together or from the start.
In the beginning China was just doing communist tyrant shit killing doctors and suppressing the truth.
Then the democrats and the media had a chance to call Trump racisssss and they did.
Then the democrats an the media saw people dying and wanted to blame it on Trump and tried.
Then Governors and tin pot bureaucrats all over the country saw an opportunity to do what they have always wanted to do. Attack their political opponents and take freedom away from citizens.
And now that people have seen them with their asses out for the last 2 months they are covering their asses by fraudulently boosting the numbers of deaths. They throw out the intermittent China talking point because they are paid to. Both politicians and media conglomerates are on team China in this country.
They didn't plan to be pieces of shit.
This was just another opportunity for them to show their true colors is all.
Decoupling from China will be made much harder when one considers the bribes paid by criminals who profit from the trade to politicians who are mostly cheap whores.
That's the answer as to why it will be difficult.
Otherwise it would be perfectly simple. To wit: an American law that prohibited technology transfers to foreign governments. Prohibitions on exchange listings under XXX criteria. Banking restrictions. Underwriting restrictions. All those laws and many more could be easily passed and enforced except for the corruption. A proper FBI investigation of, say, Warner and Burr would do wonders, for example.
Big Mike said...
And that's your problem in a nutshell. It isn't a political problem. It's a business problem, albeit one that applies to far too many businesses.
No. This is a political problem.
Businesses make rational decisions based off of the environment they are in.
"Free Trade" was a con job from the start and it is still being pushed by the globalist stooges.
A real free trade agreement between two countries would fit on one page 12 font double spaced. I am all for those. NAFTA and TPP were certainly not that.
And any country that taxes things produced domestically at a higher rate than things produced abroad is committing economic suicide. Tariffs are Taxes are Tariffs are Taxes.
J. Farmer said...
@walter:
Santa Clara Cty results and discussion. Fatality rate slightly higher than flu? Other test results next week:
An Update from Dr Jay Bhattacharya
It's a piece of the puzzle, but the study was too limited to draw any broad conclusions.
Or you can use some common sense and look at how widespread this was in February. That means it started in December. If you extrapolate the results from the Diamond Princess this study just fits right in.
The conclusions from the study just make sense.
A lot more sense than all of the "models" that have been wrong about everything.
A lot more sense than all of the idiots spouting "exponential growth!"
If Cuomo or any Democrat pol faced the onslaught of media hate Trump faces every day he would crawl under his desk, go fetal, and whimper about the beetle-headed people coming to get him (see Jim Bakker). He’s a bully who tries with great effort to act fair. He’s also, like they tell us about all bullies, a coward.
I truly wish Fox News would live up to the smear tarred on them as being right-wing Trumpists and treat these Dems like the rest of the media treats Trump. It would be shocking and deeply satisfying.
M Jordan,
OANN is trying to step into the breach.
Not sure how well they do in that regard.
1. The Fillmore County News (MN) has a headline about the increased calls to the county sheriff for domestic violence during the unnecessary MN lockdown. Our Dem governor is, I think, about to reverse his field and begin opening business soon. As of Saturday he told us we could hunt, fish, play golf and shoot skeet. Why the hell not be able to go to my local pub and get a burger?
2. A month ago I predicted the governors could not hold out for any length of time for two reasons: most state constitutions require that the annual budget be balanced; the governors can not print money. The loss of tax revenue has probably gotten through to Cuomo and made him realize that he is now the Federal government's "bitch". Without some kind of federal backup NY state is going to be a disaster financially. What percentage of its revenue comes from NYC? ST is absolutely correct that the citizens of upstate are not going to stand for being penalized more ( see fracking) to make NYC whole.
I would like to remind Farmer that the current lockdowns are based on even less factual data/samples than the Santa Clara study. Note the practically daily downward revisions to all these "models".
"If you’re in public, you have to wear a mask." He was talking about the actual physical masks that people are told to wear, but I thought the phrase worked well to express the demeanor a leader needs to display to maintain confidence and morale.
See Erving Goffman, The Presentation of Self in Everyday Life.
And, look, if you have partisan division splitting this nation now, it’s going to make it worse. Abraham Lincoln, 'A house divided itself against itself cannot stand.” 1858. Where did Abraham Lincoln get it from? “If a house is divided against itself, the house cannot stand,” Mark 3:25. Okay, so this is accepted wisdom, let us say. House cannot stand. Not to mention, a house cannot rise up from the greatest challenge it has seen since World War II. This is no time and no place for division. We have our hands full as it is. Let’s just stay together and let’s work it through. That’s why we’re called the United States. And the unity was key. Going back to Abraham Lincoln, it was always about the unity. Going back to the framers of the Constitution, it was always balanced of power to ensure unity. And we need that unity now more than ever before.
Not exactly Lincolnesque, but surprising and welcome coming from ego-driven Governor "America Was Never Great" "God Did Not Do This." That is the problem with politicians. They all drop bricks -- "Bitter clingers," "47% Percent," "Irredeemable deplorables" -- and then the rest of us have to figure out whether those comments reflect who they really are. Eventually, some of us eventually give up and assume the worst about all of them.
Jay Inslee got on tv and ran his mouth this morning claiming Trump is encouraging insubordination.
Insubordination.
Let that sink in.
This is typical Farmer:
"J. Farmer said...
"The state is the great fictitious entity by which everyone seeks to live at the expense of everyone else." - Frédéric Bastiat
Well, unless we transition to an anarchic society, this has been a fact of life since the beginning of civilization."
He post others thoughts, and states his opinion that they are universal FACT! But when he gets called on it here:
"Guildofcannonballs said...
George Washington sought to live at the expense of everyone else? He didn't actually pledge his sacred honor and fortune then I suppose, because why do that if you seek to live off of everyone else?
Did, your term, "everyone" in the wild west of 1850 America want to live at the expense of everyone else?"
He bails:
"J. Farmer said..."Everyone" wasn't my term, it was Bastiat's. He was giving a general definition of the state."
What a blow hard. No pun intended.
>>"House of Buttafuocco" skits
Late to the party, as usual, but the "House of Buttafuocco" thing was hilarious. It's about the only thing I remember about that SNL episode, beyond the fact that the whole show was devoted to the saga of the Long Island Lolita.
--gpm
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