April 28, 2020

"For more than a month, governors in a vast majority of states have urged people to stay indoors and away from one another, critical measures needed to slow the spread of the coronavirus."

Asserts Mihir Zaveri in a NYT column, "‘Quarantine Fatigue’ Has More People Going Outside/New research shows that people are venturing out more frequently, and traveling farther from home."

There's a link on "vast majority of states" going to a map that shows that the vast majority of states have a "statewide order," but how many of these states are telling people to "stay indoors"?

I know my state is one of this "vast majority," but we weren't told we needed to stay indoors. I know there are some cities, including, notably, New York, where it's hard to do social distancing if you go outdoors, but most places in America, you can get outdoors and do social distancing just fine.

I'm in a city, Madison, Wisconsin, where there's no problem at all keeping the recommended distance and enjoying the mental and physical benefits of being outside. If you can do that, there's nothing preferable about hiding indoors.

It's really annoying to see concern, outrage, or scolding from people who act like we're being disobedient or science-ignorant if we won't stay inside! I support government orders that are fine-tuned to the danger at hand, but some people seem to love excessive restrictions on freedom and to deplore the incorrigibles who won't just stay in their house.

133 comments:

Oso Negro said...

We have them right here in Galveston, Texas. We allow the congregation of people on the Seawall, but not on the beach. It's absurd.

DanTheMan said...

>>government orders that are fine-tuned

There's your problem, right there....

I Have Misplaced My Pants said...

but some people seem to love excessive restrictions on freedom and to deplore the incorrigibles who won't just stay in their house

Yes, we've noticed.

Lucid-Ideas said...

"It's really annoying to see concern, outrage, or scolding from people who act like we're being disobedient or science-ignorant if we won't stay inside! I support government orders that are fine-tuned to the danger at hand, but some people seem to love excessive restrictions on freedom and to deplore the incorrigibles who won't just stay in their house."

“Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.”

― C. S. Lewis

I Have Misplaced My Pants said...

Also, it seems that while we're seeing more people relaxing their obedience to these orders we are not seeing the disease come roaring back or whatever scary phrase journalists want to use. I hope this continues to be the case.

TML said...

Tennessee is being sane and cautious in the correct proportion.

Shouting Thomas said...

I’m done being a serf.

I don’t know how I’ll break out of jail, but I’m fed up with the tyrants.

There is no argument that justifies the revocation of my civil liberties and placing me under house arrest.

How I will break out of jail is TBD. But, I refuse to play any longer.

Big Mike said...

I support government orders that are fine-tuned to the danger at at hand, but some people seem to love excessive restrictions on freedom and to deplore the incorrigibles who won't just stay in their house.

Those “some people” belong to your side of the political spectrum. It would be honest if you to acknowledge that.

My next T-shirt is going to say “I’m Deplorable and Incorrigible”

Tommy Duncan said...

Sunlight is the best disinfectant. Influenza season occurs when we are trapped inside by winter and it ends in the spring.

The fact that government is big doesn't make it competent.

rcocean said...

If people had watched Trump's briefing last week by the Undersecretary of DHS, they would've seen that in sunlight and high temps, the virus dies quickly. Even if you are closer than 6 feet, say say 2-3 feet, you should have no problem avoiding CV infection, unless you stop and talk to the infected person. Personally, I hope they keep the scare up, because its cut down on the crowds at our local hiking trail.

Cameron said...

Even in NYC we're not being told we can't go outside, we just steer clear of each other on the streets and sidewalks. It's not too hard to do most of the time.

Sebastian said...

"For more than a month, governors in a vast majority of states have urged people to stay indoors and away from one another, critical measures needed to slow the spread of the coronavirus."

So much BS, so little time.

1. Whether the more drastic shutdowns and lock-ins had any marginal utility is not clear. For example, as Althouse notes, outdoor distancing in perfectly feasible in most of the U.S. Indoor lockdowns endanger the vulnerable if they are ear infected companions. And the most vulnerable groups are old, sick, and fat people in residential or healthcare facilities, whose risk is not significantly affected by locking down the healthy.

2. Even if shutdowns and lock-ins "slowed the spread," that turned out to be a marginal benefit in any case: even uncontrolled spread did not produce the projected spikes in healthcare demand, curves flattened as they always do in epidemics, and excess capacity was ramped up quickly and then could be quickly taken down. Of course, prog governors are furiously moving goalposts, and this sort of article helps their devastation project, but the measures were supposed to be 'crucial" for a goal that has already ben achieved. Honest people would declare victory and stop.

3. "Critical" measures to slow the spread were misguided by traditional epidemiological standards: herd immunity is important, and, short of a vaccine, it ultimately protects the most vulnerable best. Panicked this-time-is-different we-don't-know-anything alarmism inspired a deviation from the sensible approach, and delaying immunity carries major costs. Of course, even the alarmist shutdown project could only claim to slow, not stop the spread.

4. Advocates for the critical measures never carefully assessed cost and benefits, in particular the health effects of lock-ins. Those effects are severe, especially for many people now delaying normal life-saving care. We are sacrificing younger, somewhat healthier people in a vain attempt to save very old, sick, and obese pope with limited life expectancy.

JPS said...

"I support government orders that are fine-tuned to the danger at at hand,"

The heavy-handed, overly broad restrictions and shaming are a symptom of a broader tendency especially among us Americans: "The only safe level" – of being out and about, of whatever hazard or behavior – "is ZERO!"

And by safe, they mean, conveniently enforced without having to use judgment or discretion.

Some here are familiar with General Order Number One. Would it harm mission readiness if any given Soldier had one drink, off duty in the evening, during an exercise or (heaven forbid) a deployment? Of course not. The assumption, and it's born of experience, is that if you allow any at all, at least a few people will get all hammered and be NMC when needed. It's easier to enforce ZERO (and we will crush you if we catch you with even one) than, Be reasonable.

Speaking of drinking: In the past, some women drank during pregnancy. Then we learned about fetal alcohol syndrome. Now a woman gets the stink-eye if she has a bulge in her belly and half a glass of wine in hand. Sound scientific evidence that little bit of alcohol will harm her baby? Roughly zero. She just has to not get hammered. But we decide The Only Level We're Sure Is Safe Is Zero! and now women who never have more than an occasional glass of wine with dinner think they have to do without, or they're awful moms.

It's not a big logical leap from these tendencies to, No, you can't buy seeds to plant in your garden; or, Park's closed! Get out or I hope you die painfully from Coronavirus!

Lucien said...

There are no government orders that are fine-tuned to the danger at hand. The statists can't articulate a rationale for continuing radical infringements on the liberty interests of hundreds of millions of Americans. There never was any basis for asking anyone to stay more than six feet from anyone else outdoors (except perhaps for those standing in lines).
The danger lies in continuing damage to the world's economy, which the governors should be trying to ameliorate, not angling for federal aid money.
We are all America FIrsters now; but soon enough the woke population will start thinking about the damage to the developing world from a global depression. A strong US economy would put us in a position to provide aid and other assistance to struggling countries throughout the world, where poverty threatens millions, not thousands. If the US continues adding to its self-inflicted wounds, it will be in a far weaker position when it comes to helping others.

Francisco D said...

Ann Althouse said ... It's really annoying to see concern, outrage, or scolding from people who act like we're being disobedient or science-ignorant if we won't stay inside!

Do you mean that what may work for NYC may not work for others? I am shocked.

I don't think you have been listening to some of your commenters who believe that this super virus will devastate us unless we completely lock down until November.

Ken B said...

I agree with Althouse here, obviously.
This is the right way to protest the Whitmer approach. Parks, beaches, golf courses are safe if people keep a little distance. Most parks here are open (the facilities are closed). People here are planting their lawn or landscaping. And seeds are not dangerous. But we have distancing orders, and prohibitions on gatherings, etc. Tuned to our circumstances.

Shouting Thomas said...

I support government orders that are fine-tuned to the danger at at hand

The danger at hand in Wisconsin is close to zero. 281 deaths in a population of 8 million.

What danger are you facing, professor? There isn't any.

Same is true where I live.

Will you support the suspension of civil rights and house arrest until you have absolute assurance that a bridge won't collapse under you while you're driving across?

You're being silly here, and I mean very silly. If you'll surrender to tyranny over this, there is no such thing as freedom.

RK said...

A nice thing about having 50 states is that we can have 50 separate experiments on how to deal with this. Georgia is now experimenting with opening gyms.

Gusty Winds said...

The motivation for the forever lock down people is 1) crash the economy because of TDS, and 2) pat themselves on the back if they have finally been deemed essential in their lives. Lot’s of teachers, public employees, and Nurses. Oh God….has this gone to the heads of the nurses.

We have teachers in Sussex supporting boycotts of businesses that want to reopen and are complaining about Evers. Not just boycotts. Boycotts and close them down. I challenged one of them, a ‘friend’, and his only reason for promoting the boycott was because the owner was disrespectful to the Governor.

I have a Karen that lives next door to me in Sussex. I had two people over for dinner Friday night at my house to grille out. She kept giving me the evil eye while she was moving her lawn at 7pm (which is past the lawn mowing ordinance).

Original Mike said...

"I support government orders that are fine-tuned to the danger at at hand,…"

Government doesn't do fine-tuning.

Quayle said...

Let's do a case study of Utah.

No order ever issued by Governor.
4,233 confirmed cases
41 deaths
Deaths per 100,000 of population: 1.3
(80% of population, or about 2M people, concentrated along the Wasatch Front.)

How does that compare with Colorado
Order to stay at home, expected to end April 11, was extended.
13,411 confirmed cases
680 deaths
Deaths per 100,000 of population: 11.8
(60% - 70% of population, or about 4M people, live along the Front.)

Lewis said...

LOL! Us hillbilly redneck dumb asses in Alabama do things like walking around the neighborhood, running, biking, and hiking. We also like going on long car rides on back roads through the beautiful countryside. Staying inside your car and never getting out until you get home. Them NYC city slickers sure are ignorant about country living.

Original Mike said...

"I know there are some cities, including, notably, New York, where it's hard to do social distancing if you go outdoors, "

Incredible {shudders}

Fernandinande said...

I support government orders that are fine-tuned to the danger at at hand

There's not enough information for such orders to exist.

Sally327 said...

I wonder if part of the effort to keep us inside is because that's what government is used to when there's a crisis where we're supposed to shelter in place, the danger is usually outside, a hurricane or some other natural disaster or there's a criminal on the loose.

In my area there's a curfew from 11 PM to 5 AM. I don't really know why though. Like what does that accomplish?

tim maguire said...

When the orders were originally put out, we knew very little about the virus, so a maximal approach was theoretically justified. That time has passed. We know more. And one of the things we know is that transmission is primarily an indoor event and that the virus dies very quickly under summer conditions. We also know that the sort of co-morbidities that complicate infection are exacerbated by being in doors for extended periods.

There is no scientific justification for stay at home orders and it is well past time to do away with them. Mental and physical health issues both demand that we open up the parks and beaches.

Shouting Thomas said...

You've got some serious problems here, professor, because your self-interest blinds you to what this is doing to other people.

You've always lived the life of a cloistered academic. You sit at a computer all day, reading and writing. There's nothing wrong with that.

Other people, for instance me, don't live the way you do. My rehearsals and concerts are all cancelled. My church affairs are cancelled. My jam sessions and meetings with other musicians are cancelled. I can't sit in my cafes.

My life and work is social. Yours isn't.

This assault on my civil liberties and my freedom has completely shut down my life. I don't think it's much affected yours.

Big Mike said...

Governors Cuomo, Newsom, Evers, Whitmer, and Pritzker have all been in the news lately for behaving like tinpot dictators and acting like spoiled children that their constituents don’t obediently fall in line. I don’t think it’s partisanship to point out that they all belong to the same party, and it’s not the GOP.

MayBee said...

rcocean said...
If people had watched Trump's briefing last week by the Undersecretary of DHS, they would've seen that in sunlight and high temps, the virus dies quickly.


Yes and you could hear the press really pushing back on the idea that people should go outside. This was before the outrage became that Trump wants people to eat Lysol.

Big Mike said...

@Tommy Duncan, don’t tell Robert Cook!

Wa St Blogger said...

Here in Washington, parks are closed. There is this little sliver of beach near my town of 1200 people that has barricades across the 5 car parking lot. I think the barricades were added because people were using the park. You could fit about 30 people on that park and maintain social distancing. I never saw more than 5 people at any given time.

We are of the "vast majority", me thinks. Sure Inslee could recommend closing Gasworks park, and The one off Denny in Downtown, but the parks and trails in podunksville? Pretty stupid in my book.

Gusty Winds said...

It’s the new virtue signaling self-righteousness. They’re “saving lives”. They’re all Democrats. If you’re on Facebook, the best virtue signalers are the Karens that are making masks. Every day you see how many they made. The new designs etc…

gspencer said...

"I [AA] support government orders that are fine-tuned to the danger at at hand, but some people seem to love excessive restrictions on freedom and to deplore the incorrigibles who won't just stay in their house."

"some people" = mostly Democrats who are generally statist-minded like Mussolini,

"Everything within the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state."

dreams said...

Yeah, our little democrat want-to-be Hitler governor is going to ease restrictions in May but with the requirement that everyone now has to start wearing a mask when they go outside.

Fernandinande said...

“Of all tyrannies,...”
― C. S. Lewis


That's got to be one of the most misused quotes ever.

He was actually arguing for more punishment and cruelty to be directed toward criminals, even if they could be "cured" of their criminal behavior without it. Because religion.

jnseward said...

It seems there are many people harboring secret authoritarian tendencies who are just waiting for an opportunity to unleash them upon their fellow citizens.

Fernandinande said...

Better link: The Humanitarian Theory of Punishment C.S. Lewis

Clayton Hennesey said...

Big Mike said,
"My next T-shirt is going to say 'I’m Deplorable and Incorrigible'"

The Deplorables have become the Non-Essentials as well, a great many of them now broken and impoverished Democrat constituents, a few of them perhaps aware that the trough is not bottomless and that the chemo was worse than the melanoma where a little liquid nitro would have sufficed.

Yet she persists:

A local blogger writes, "Listen to Clay Jenkins. I love this quote from the Dallas County judge: 'The orders have changed, but the science that will save us has not.'"

That's right, Deplorable Non-Essentials, listen to your authorities. They give good quote.

By the way, the non-quote math tells us that Dallas County has had 82 people die from COVID-19 out of a population of 2,622,799 for a fatality rate of .00312%. No, not .312%. I already moved the decimal two places.

Unknown said...

One of the few areas where democrats and republicans have common ground is that neither can stop the spread of a virus. It's remarkably clear, however, how some governors are making the best of a bad situation (Kristi Noem) and some are not (Gavin Newsom).

Bob Boyd said...

some people seem to love excessive restrictions on freedom and to deplore the incorrigibles who won't just stay in their house.


These are Karens.
This is why Karenology isn't inherently sexist. Because there are plenty of ball-bearing Karens out there.

robother said...

" ...some people seem to love excessive restrictions on freedom and to deplore the incorrigibles who won't just stay in their house."

I.e., Democrats. In every case, Democrat Governors are the ones keeping restrictions at the highest levels that "science" (the Imperial College models showing 2.2 million deaths?) might possibly justify. The precautionary principle has been adapted from extreme Climate Change action justifiers to viral epidemiology. "if it even saves one life." Even if the models might be flawed, why take a chance?"

Lucid-Ideas said...

Closing down outdoor activities. A very Karen thing to do.

n.n said...

Sunlight is the best disinfectant.

HCQ+AZ and other disinfectants of the virus have produced optimistic results.

doctrev said...

Shouting Thomas said...

How I will break out of jail is TBD. But, I refuse to play any longer.

4/28/20, 9:10 AM

I'd wait for Friday, just because the President's plan is going to change things around the nation. But I don't blame you for acting sooner, and in fact applaud it. Fight the power, man.

n.n said...

The latest guidance from military scientists in Wuhan is 3 m, 6 if you adhere to the precautionary principle.

Butkus51 said...

Some people get off on telling people what to do. Its in their nature.

Jim Gust said...

Is there one documented case of transmission outdoors? Just one? Of someone who, I don't know, stopped and chatted for an extended period with another who turned out to be infectious? I have not found one such case.

The social distancing admonishes may be appropriate indoors, they are certainly required on mass transit, but so far as I have read they are completely pointless outdoors. You can't pick up this disease by casually walking past someone who had it, unless perhaps they sneeze right into your face.

There is an ironclad Democrat rule that no one can be happy unless everyone is happy. No one can have health care unless everyone has the same health care. And so, since people indoors are unhappy, no one may be allowed to be happy outdoors. This is simply vindictive.

Reminds me of the story of a vindictive man who was granted one wish. As he tried to choose between great wealth and great power, the genie warned him that whatever he wished for, his hated neighbor would get double. The vindictive man pivoted, and wished to have an eye poked out.

He has much in common with Democrats refusing to lift the lockdown.

Original Mike said...

"It's really annoying to see concern, outrage, or scolding from people who act like we're being disobedient or science-ignorant if we won't stay inside!"

You know what's annoying? People who think government can fine-tune. "If only 'government' were smart like me". Where, in a lifetime of observation, is there evidence for this ability? It's not how this works.

I apologize for getting personal. But it Drives. Me. Up. The. Wall.

End of rant.

bagoh20 said...

Sheltering in place weakens the immune system, and leaves it unprepared for exposure to the general populace. Expect additional non-Covid sickness when you do finally crawl out of your holes like frightened mice. The negatives from this shutdown response are going to so far outweigh the benefits that it will be seen as one of the biggest mistakes since Vietnam.

Since Trump was President when it all went down, the Press will uncharacteristically support the truth this time, while being breathlessly on record saying just the opposite for months. What a dilemma!

rehajm said...

There are people so neurotic they need to have control over the daily lives of other people, especially those with whom they don't agree, and the power to punish them if they don't comply.

They're called Democrats.

Temujin said...

Sunny and 75 degrees on the Gulf Coast of Florida this morning. I went for a nice long walk/run. My sister (a healthcare worker in the hard-hit Detroit area) called this morning. She had a day off and was outside planting seeds (illegally, Gov. Whitmer?) in her backyard on a beautiful 60 degree sunny morning up there.

The vast majority of this country does not live in New York, has no desire to live in New York, yet we're filled daily with news from a New York worldview and judgements from the same people there who sit in their closed rooms on top of each other.

This is entirely upside down.

Laslo Spatula said...

If the constraints severely affect the liberals in the cities then the same measures must be imposed on the deplorables that don't live in urban jungles.

Otherwise there is no social justice.

I am Laslo.

Bay Area Guy said...

The best place for a picnic in SF, is the old Presidio Army base, near the Golden Gate Bridge. Blue skies, old red brick army quarters, big, well manicured grass field to sit and eat lunch, a few families with kids running around, laughing, being kids.

Shh. Don't tell anyone. I don't want Governor Blow-dry hair to close it.

chuck said...

Utah is a fine example of model blowup. If your model tries to fit data that it cannot account for, it goes wild. In Bayesian terms, the starting set of possibilities are incomplete. Here in Utah, deaths are few, and the longer they stay low, the more deaths the model predicts as the long term outcome. In this case the range/uncertainties of possible outcomes also keeps growing. Climate models also suffer from this problem.

JES said...

Wisco Gov just announced some State Parks opening May 1. But wash your hands and limit number of kiddos. No restrooms open, only trees available.

AtmoGuy said...

There are two issues:

1) Almost nobody wants to give up power that they have (or think that they have), especially the type of people who run for governor in the first place. You can see that even in the states that are starting to "open up." No one seems willing to just rescind the orders completely. Ohio is opening in a couple of weeks, but everyone now has to wear a mask in public because Mike DeWine can't completely give up all of his power to order people around. Even in Texas, sports will be allowed but only with four or fewer people. So no 3-on-3 basketball, but 2-on-2 is OK?

2) Beyond the love of power issue, some of these governors are "vulnerable populations." Tony Evers is 68 years old and a cancer survivor. Mike DeWine is 73. J.B. Pritzker in Illinois is a big fatty. If they were to let the young and healthy get on with their lives, these governors would be stuck inside, and they just can't abide that. They would rather have "We're all in this together."

Jalanl said...

"I support government orders that are fine-tuned to the danger at at hand..."
So close to a reality based world view yet so far... Prior to the shutdown Wisconsin had over 400,000 businesses, 2.9 million workers, and 5.8 million people. You really believe the governor could ever have a chance of "fine tuning" the objective realities of 400,000 businesses? You think we are one computer model away from efficiently and compassionately running the lives of 5.8 million people?

Leland said...

Yesterday, Texas Governor Abbott announced the plan to reopen Texas in May. I'm amazed by the number of people I know on Facebook that think they are showing great defiance in announcing they will not go back out in public. It would be funny if not so sad they these people have so much fear. They truly are afraid of getting deathly ill. In some cases, I know the person well enough to know they have health issues that make sense for them to self-isolate. A few are usually proud of boasting about their world travelling, taking two or three international flights a year, yet they are afraid to leave their homes now. Sad folks, but I'm not going to let their fear and depression get in my way, no matter how much they say I'll die for it.

Aaron said...

Andre Comte-Sponville, a French Philosopher, recently spoke of those with "concern, outrage, or scolding from people who act like we're being disobedient or science-ignorant if we won't stay inside!" He called their behavior "sanitary correctness." A term I've adopted for that behavior.

The article it's from is quite good - unfortunately in French and I used google translate - but it's still quite good. (https://bit.ly/2S2pPRV)

n.n said...

A nice thing about having 50 states is that we can have 50 separate experiments on how to deal with this

And accountability should be proportional to knowledge, skill, and consequences. Otherwise, people will become too timid to act, or too aggressive thus forcing forward-looking collateral damage.

Greg Hlatky said...

The next Dorothy Thompson essay: "Who Goes Karen?"

Quayle said...

Oh, an regarding the Utah and Colorado comparison: I think we can rule out disparity of international travel or "cosmopolitan society" as a factor. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints pulled in almost all their missionaries at the end of March, so that was an influx of tens of thousands of 20 year-olds to Utah from all parts of Asia, Europe, and other global locations. And still Utah's numbers are close to the lowest per 100K of population, in the nation. So, something else must be the cause of the low numbers; it isn't the existence or lack of state Executive Orders.

Birkel said...

Citizens, not serfs.
Fuck Karen of whatever gender.

Achilles said...

It's really annoying to see concern, outrage, or scolding from people who act like we're being disobedient or science-ignorant if we won't stay inside! I support government orders that are fine-tuned to the danger at at hand, but some people seem to love excessive restrictions on freedom and to deplore the incorrigibles who won't just stay in their house.

Are you helping?

Michael K said...

We also like going on long car rides on back roads through the beautiful countryside.

Yup. We drove over to Florence AZ Saturday and back. That town was founded in 1889 and was featured in the movie "Murphy's Romance." On the way back, we drove past <a href="https://www.roadsideamerica.com/story/2425> the Tom Mix Memorial </a>where he was killed in a car crash in 1940. He was driving home from Tucson and the bridge at Tom Mix Wash was washed out by a flash flood. He could not stop in time. He was the first cowboy movie star.

Nice day and got out of the house.

Sebastian said...

"I support government orders that are fine-tuned to the danger at at hand, but some people seem to love excessive restrictions on freedom and to deplore the incorrigibles who won't just stay in their house."

That's progress. But your panic (11 million!) helped trigger CYA coercion by governors and opened the door to political exploitation by progs eager to tank the Trump economy and stick it to the deplorables good and hard.

Excessive restrictions are prog MO. Treating prog coercion as an unfortunate aberration itself contributes to the problem. Some people seem to love government power, and more power: the same people who always did, the same people who think we are not worthy of our freedom, the same people who could not articulate to you what freedom means, apart from the freedom to smoke dope, have sex, and abort babies.

Moondawggie said...

Prof, the US sure has a lot of Karens out there.

I don't understand why so many Americans are hard-wired to act like a Boy's Vice Principal whose main purpose and joy in life is demanding to see your hall pass.

Where I live (Placer Co, CA), our death rate from Covid-19 is 2 per 100,000. In contrast, the annual US death rate from unintentional injuries (car crashes, falls, etc.) is 48.

During the last 3 weeks, with a population of 400,000, Placer Co. has averaged a little fewer than 2 new Covid-19 cases per day. And our genius governor Newsom is demanding we keep sheltering in place until the end of May.

Idiots. We are governed by idiots.

Freeman Hunt said...

I'm annoyed with the news always making it sound like my state didn't do anything. The state closed the schools and many types of businesses, closed playgrounds, asked companies who were able to have employees work from home, and limited gatherings to ten people or less. That's actually quite a lot!

320Busdriver said...

It’s what’s referred to as “arbitrary and capricious”

We know who excels at that skill set.

320Busdriver said...

“I'm in a city, Madison, Wisconsin, where there's no problem at all keeping the recommended distance and enjoying the mental and physical benefits of being outside. “

Unless you’re on a jogging trail full of clueless millennials

320Busdriver said...

You can get an abortion, but not a vasectomy.

Lucien said...

Meanwhile the WHO continues to cover itself in glory, having to delete a tweet that some in the media read as suggesting that having antibodies to OCVID19 would not confer immunity, and then stating: "Earlier today we tweeted about a new WHO scientific brief on "immunity passports". The thread caused some concern & we would like to clarify:
We expect that most people who are infected with #COVID19 will develop an antibody response that will provide some level of protection."

These guys are real EXPERTS and I will definitely be willing to deprive millions of my countrymen of their freedom anytime the WHO suggests it.

Jim said...

This pandemic has been a terrible experience. But the optimist in me sees good stuff happening as a result. It has become obvious that the government failed, big time. the CDC and the other alphabet agencies failed to do their jobs, and will suffer no consequences. People are seeing this, and reacting. The over reach has been stunning, particularly in liberal states. In my little corner of the world, Hawaii, people who have voted Dem for generations are actually questioning what is going on. thats a good thing, and about time.
It isn't, at least in my circle, about Trump. It's about the capricious way the government tries to control and dictate what we do, say and think. Many people are waking up. Coming to understand why our system of government is good, and where it has obviously failed.
Shutting down the worlds most vibrant economy doesn't have many up sides. But it has exposed the scolds, the wanna be totalitarians, and the elite for what they are.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Lewis said LOL! Us hillbilly redneck dumb asses in Alabama do things like walking around the neighborhood, running, biking, and hiking. We also like going on long car rides on back roads through the beautiful countryside. Staying inside your car and never getting out until you get home.

Yup. Same with us hillbilly rednecks who live in the TRUE NORTHERN California (the Bay Area is NOT northern California)

Now that the weather is good we are outside. Working in our yards. Biking. Hiking/Walking. Golfing. Fishing too! We also go to the stores with impunity. Car rides and get OUT of the damned car to sit on some rocks with a view and have a picnic. (actually the view from the deck of one of our absentee owner clients....better than rocks)

This Corona lock down, while probably a good idea 'for a while' in some areas like NYC....is just insanity for much of the country. This has to end and end soon.

Jon Burack said...

My wife and I - here in East Lansing, MI - drive out to a nearby park, about seven miles out. We then walk a three-mile trail. Then drive back. On the trail we do NOT wear masks, but we (and all others we pass, maybe four to six each hike) keep a wide distance as we pass. So if these numbskulls want to come and arrest me, they better show up with masks on and not come within six feet of me or my wife or I will cough all over them.

Lucien said...

Governors or no, doesn't it seem like the efficacy of lockdown orders depends on the willingness of law enforcement officers at the local level to enforce them? If counties, cities, Sheriffs, Police Chiefs, or individual officers decide not to spend any of their time enforcing this bullshit, who will -- State Troopers?

n.n said...

You can get an abortion, but not a vasectomy.

Human sacrificial rites to keep women barefoot, available, and taxable, and for social progress, are an essential service. Vasectomies are verboten, elective and less profitable, in the progressive religion. Let us bray.

RMc said...

Also, it seems that while we're seeing more people relaxing their obedience to these orders we are not seeing the disease come roaring back or whatever scary phrase journalists want to use.

Some us want the economy to come roaring back, others want the virus to come roaring back. Place your bets.

n.n said...

That's progress.

Monotonic [unqualified] change.

Excessive restrictions are prog MO.

There is the Progressive Church, and at least two discernible sects. In recent times, the more aggressive sect attempted to cancel the other in what may be characterized as a schism. The family feud persists.

bagoh20 said...

96 degrees today here in Vegas, 102 tomorrow. God wants the casinos open.

mandrewa said...

Most people that get the virus get it from people they are living with. That should be no surprise and really there's not much that can be done about it. (This is from a study in China, and from memory it's about 40%).

The second largest source of infection is public transit, as in buses and subways. (From the same study and from memory it's about 30%).

Given the trivial positive impact of the lockdowns, which should be obvious given the trivial differences in mortality per million between those areas that locked down and that didn't, we should shut down all public transit while lifting all the other lockdown measures and we will almost certainly save more lives than the current approach has. Especially if this includes reopening the many hospitals and doctor's offices that have been effectively closed.

Krumhorn said...

This assault on my civil liberties and my freedom has completely shut down my life. I don't think it's much affected yours.

ST, i think you have gone over the edge (again) in addressing our Hostess. Her post clearly reflects the same discontent as that felt by the rest of us....excluding a few resident lefties who need not be named. As I was reading the post, I was thinking that she would be writing essays for American Thinker and regularly contributing to Ace before this is over. I was even picturing Meade and her making trips to the range to blow a box or two of ammo through the barrels of some newly-acquired firearms.

....well, let's don't get carried away.

- Krumhorn

- Krumhorn

I'm Not Sure said...

"I support government orders that are fine-tuned to the danger at at hand..."

Any examples of such that you might be willing to share?

exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...

Our next door neighbor's son stopped by last week when the weather was very nice and sat with his parents in their backyard enjoying a few beers. They did the social distancing. I stood in my yard and chatted with the three of them for a few minutes.

Some Karen (and I'm sure I know who it is) called the cops. They did not bother to come over. My neighbor knows a few cops and one of them told him yesterday that our own local Gladys Kravitz reported them. She was in a self-righteous tizzy because they weren't wearing masks. The cops simply laughed it off.

It's difficult to drink beer with a mask on.

Krumhorn said...

Once again, Laslo precisely nailed it at 9:53. Still, there was no reference to anal sex, bukkake, or the girl with the pony tail on the treadmill (swish swish) so the world is not quite steady on its axis.

- Krumhorn

Drago said...

bagoh20: "96 degrees today here in Vegas, 102 tomorrow. God wants the casinos open."

Careful.

According to the Althouse lefty/dem brigade sunlight, heat and humidity no longer have any effect on viruses for the sole reason that Trump mentioned it.

I am waiting for Trump to publicly advocate for staying hydrated so the lefties will go off water completely.

Brian said...

There's an argument to be made that viral load has more impact with this virus than anything else. Get a little virus and you are fine, in fact may not know you were ever sick. Get a lot and you may feel sick but recover just fine. Get a lot of virus and have comorbidity issues (say like being an occupant of a nursing home) and you are now in heightened risk category.

The above scenario means that we should immediately relax all restrictions. We want people getting this virus, just not a lot of it at any one time. That's the fastest way to developing a herd immunity.

Only based on the science announced last week regarding sunlight exposure and temperatures there is very little risk to having a baseball game for example. Or eating on a restaurant patio.

If this disease were truly as rampant and deadly as the media portrays it we would all be dead already. Walmart would have had to close all its stores because they wouldn't have been able to staff them.

We should open everything up. Now.

JAORE said...

Sure,it would be easy to see which states say stay indoors. But why? If most do the narrative doesn't change. If many do not, the narrative is undermined.

Why take a chance on facts?

Openidname said...

"Leland said...

"Sad folks, but I'm not going to let their fear and depression get in my way, no matter how much they say I'll die for it."

Actually, they say they'll die for it. That's the whole basis of their claim to moral authority.

tcrosse said...

96 degrees today here in Vegas, 102 tomorrow. God wants the casinos open.

Also Gyms, Restaurants, Barber Shops, Liquor Stores, etc. etc. From God's lips to Sisolak's ears.

Openidname said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Ken B said...

“ Any examples of such that you might be willing to share?”

We have a few.

No visits to nursing homes.
No virus positive patients returned to nursing homes.
Trails and parks are open but the park buildings are closed.
No ride sharing except with people you live with.
Stay home if you have a fever or are coughing.
Masks are recommended in stores, and required if you are unable to maintain a distance there.
No fares on buses, enter and leave at the rear, away from the driver.

These are all directly aimed at lowering the chance of infection and the viral load of any contact.

You can buy paint.

Lucien said...

@Jim Gust: "There is an ironclad Democrat rule that no one can be happy unless everyone is happy. No one can have health care unless everyone has the same health care."
While I agree with the spirit of your comment, Congress will never force itself to have the same healthcare that it might force the rest of us to have.

Some animals must always be more equal than others, if only to highlight waht a true sacrifice a "life of public service" is.

Skeptical Voter said...

The Los Angeles Times reported today that Governor Gavin Newsom was "upset" that thousands of people went to the beaches in Ventura and Orange Counties last weekend (the weather was hot). Newsom said that viruses don't take the weekend off.

"Upset" is Times speak for Newsom got all wee wee'd up. He's promised to up his enforcement efforts and those folks are going to get it---good and hard. Los Angeles Mayor Garcetti has played the game as well--all parks and hiking trails etc. have been closed for weeks.

George Skelton writes for the LA Times. He's a political columnist and observer/resident of the Sacramento scene for three or four decades now. He notes that with the Legislature staying out of session, State government these days is one man--Governor Newsom. It's a situation right for a tinpot dictator and Gavin is the man for the job.

Yancey Ward said...

The thing a coward despises above all else is a courageous man, and the thing a liar despises above all else is an honest one. This explains the prevalence of all the social scolds.

Inga said...

The only days I stayed inside was cold rainy days. I have a beautiful area right in front of my house to walk, or my deck to sit on and contemplate the lake, the sky, the ducks, other wildlife and humans who are also outside walking and wave and say hello. My daughters and grandchildren go outside everyday. I never did understand people saying the pro mitigation people were pro staying indoors. I know no one who has stayed inside their house and never venture forth outside.

Inga said...

I’m so glad I don’t have any Karens in my neighborhood. I think Wisconsinites are much friendlier and more neighborly than some other regions.

Yancey Ward said...

Here in Oak Ridge, we have a Democrat as mayor. He has ordered everyone out in public to wear a mask. I was out yesterday- maybe 10% compliance. The people have already decided to not listen to these idiots any longer.

Yancey Ward said...

It is possible to take out an appendix with a hammer, but no amount of fine-tuning can make it successful.

Inga said...

“I don't think you have been listening to some of your commenters who believe that this super virus will devastate us unless we completely lock down until November.”

And just WHO are these commenters you speak of? I haven’t heard one commenter advocate doing any such thing.

bagoh20 said...

I'm pretty sure there is one Karen in your neighborhood.

Inga said...

“Her post clearly reflects the same discontent as that felt by the rest of us....excluding a few resident lefties who need not be named.”

Her post doesn’t veer from the first day of this shutdown that I noticed. She has said that she has not stepped into one public building and continues to go outside and avoid people. She’s doing the SAME thing we “lefties” have been doing, well not exactly, I’ve been to a couple of grocery stores wearing a mask.

Merny11 said...

Unfortunately Inga Wisconsin has its share of Karen’s. We’ve stayed isolated for six weeks now. Live in NE part of state. Drove up to our cottage in Northern Wi - haven’t been there in 6 weeks - chores we needed to take care of there. We were screamed at by a neighbor - told we endangering everyone because we are from the SOUTH and have no right to be there. Evidently anyone living south of hwy 29 is taboo. We will remember that going forward - will spend as little money as possible up there going forward.

Inga said...

“I'm pretty sure there is one Karen in your neighborhood.”

Not that I know of. It’s not my business, nor do I care about what my neighbors up or down our lake road do. I haven’t seen any of my neighbors doing anything differently than I’ve been doing and if I did, it’s not my practice to tattletale on anyone. Life is too short to be overly concerned with what neighbors are up to, I have better things to watch than my neighbors living here in this beautiful area.

KellyM said...

Blogger Bay Area Guy said...
"The best place for a picnic in SF, is the old Presidio Army base, near the Golden Gate Bridge. Blue skies, old red brick army quarters, big, well manicured grass field to sit and eat lunch, a few families with kids running around, laughing, being kids.

Shh. Don't tell anyone. I don't want Governor Blow-dry hair to close it."

Great Highway, on the western edge of the city, has been closed to traffic now for about a month. (It gets closed often at this time of year due to blowing sand from the dunes above Ocean Beach.) Every day the roadway is filled with adults/kids on bikes, roller skates, razr scooters or just walking/running. The winds kick up in the afternoons so it's a constant 10-15 mph - there is no way people could transmit the virus in that sort of sustained wind. Having said that, so many of those people out there are wearing masks! WHY?????

Inga said...

“Unfortunately Inga Wisconsin has its share of Karen’s. We’ve stayed isolated for six weeks now. Live in NE part of state. Drove up to our cottage in Northern Wi - haven’t been there in 6 weeks - chores we needed to take care of there. We were screamed at by a neighbor - told we endangering everyone because we are from the SOUTH and have no right to be there. Evidently anyone living south of hwy 29 is taboo. We will remember that going forward - will spend as little money as possible up there going forward.”

Sorry to hear that. It’s not been my experience in Waukesha County, here at our lake. But then again this is our neighborhood. We do see people driving up and down the lake road, sightseeing. Who cares? It’s not like they’re clogging up the road or spitting or worse.

Lurker21 said...


Utah has a younger population and healthier seniors than other states, but scientists believe the real reason the virus hasn't been as bad there has something to do with the special underwear.

Sorry, couldn't resist.

Yancey Ward said...

Karens are, fortunately, not a real thing here in Oak Ridge as long as I pretend the mayor doesn't exist. However, if I did encounter one, I plan to fake cough on them.

RigelDog said...

Althouse says: ...some people seem to love excessive restrictions on freedom and to deplore the incorrigibles who won't just stay in their house."

Some people yearn for security so badly that they will willingly accept any chains. Bonus points because you can then project your own yearning for this impossible level of security onto the whole society, which allows you to affect superiority over those who don't share your level of concern.

RigelDog said...

Jim Gust asked: Is there one documented case of transmission outdoors? Just one? Of someone who, I don't know, stopped and chatted for an extended period with another who turned out to be infectious? I have not found one such case.}}}

We are all so starved for data and I am starting to wonder how much potential data is not being allowed out to the general public. Do authorities perhaps already know that this type of transmission is either a zero chance, or maybe so unlikely that you are more in danger of falling rocks while hiking than you are of contracting the disease from others who pass near you? It's such an obvious question, but I haven't seen it being addressed by any authorities.

As far as outdoor transmission data, here's what I have seen by reading various articles: China (I think it was China) was able to contact-trace/drill down on infections in a small given area. There were maybe 600+ transmissions identified, involving various numbers of people for each incident. By far the most likely vector was among family in the home. There was exactly ONE incident that occurred "outdoors." The only specific information was that it involved 2 people. The other data I saw was in this fantastic recent article in Quillette: https://quillette.com/2020/04/23/covid-19-superspreader-events-in-28-countries-critical-patterns-and-lessons/

That article identified some outdoor events that were super-spreaders. They involved close quarters such as a stadium, along with plenty of direct physical contact and people speaking loudly and/or yelling/singing and breathing heavily into each other's faces. Think family reunion picnic with lots of hugging and prolonged close-talk, or screaming soccer fans all jumping up and down and grabbing each other in excitement.

Jim at said...

I'm amazed by the number of people I know on Facebook that think they are showing great defiance in announcing they will not go back out in public.

Yep. And the proper response to those people is: Fine. Stay home. And STFU about it.

Original Mike said...

"You really believe the governor could ever have a chance of "fine tuning" the objective realities of 400,000 businesses? You think we are one computer model away from efficiently and compassionately running the lives of 5.8 million people?"

That firm who wrote the democrat Iowa caucus software could do it. Give'em another shot.

RigelDog said...

Inga said: I never did understand people saying the pro mitigation people were pro staying indoors. I know no one who has stayed inside their house and never venture forth outside.}}}

Would have really welcomed your input, then, on our local neighborhood Philadelphia NextDoor if that had been possible. My area is full of people who are very much to the left and it's fascinating how every.single.one.of.them is pro-lockdown and unwilling to discuss the trade-offs. Boy did I go at it with a bunch of them a few weeks ago as they kept insisting that the restrictions should mean staying completely indoors and that it was disgusting to hear others such as myself insisting that going outside was not only permitted but is a great idea. They would say that it wasn't too much to ask that we all just stay inside 4 walls for "a few weeks" and when I would say, NO, being outside is permitted and desirable, they would reply with sighs and with the sad-emoji face. If you had been there, Inga, you would have been the lone progressive voice trying to talk some sense into them. Lately they are focused on not opening anything until there is some enormous level of testing and contact-tracing in place. They are still not willing to admit that to wait for this potential remedy has an enormous price in other ways. I've been accused of being a science-denier and privileged and uncaring because I want to hear more discussion of the feasibility of the testing/contact tracing and how that purported benefit compares to the delay of herd immunity and economic/social misery.

Yinzer said...

enough with the freakin 'Karen' references already. I have friends names Karen that are perfectly nice people, and this makes them sad, which pisses me off. Please strangle this strange derogatory usage in its cradle.

Yinzer

RigelDog said...

We were screamed at by a neighbor - told we endangering everyone because we are from the SOUTH and have no right to be there. Evidently anyone living south of hwy 29 is taboo.}}}

Same situation here with Delaware and people with second homes. Out of state visitors are ordered into strict quarantine (stay inside, can't even get groceries delivered or stop for gas) for 14 days (or fewer if you go straight home). We have a second place in the Rehoboth area and need to get down to check on it. Things are really ugly on the NextDoor loop there as the Delaware residents are furious at anyone coming down even if they quarantine as instructed. Got into it with several of them because they kept insisting that I would be endangering them if I visited my house, although no one would explain how my Pennsylvania cooties were going to jump through the walls of my house and attack them. Finally one woman offered that if I were to have a heart attack or somesuch, I would be overburdening their local health care system. Which at this point is not overburdened. This is the same local health care system that manages to accommodate a sudden influx of several million people every summer.

mandrewa said...

Ken B. said,

No visits to nursing homes.
No virus positive patients returned to nursing homes.
Trails and parks are open but the park buildings are closed.
No ride sharing except with people you live with.
Stay home if you have a fever or are coughing.
Masks are recommended in stores, and required if you are unable to maintain a distance there.
No fares on buses, enter and leave at the rear, away from the driver.

These are all directly aimed at lowering the chance of infection and the viral load of any contact.


That's not bad.

Here are some additional suggestions:

The subways should be closed.

Buses should run with their windows open. This may be cold at times, but people can dress for warmth.

But I question the ride sharing rule. Closing the subways would accomplish far more than prohibiting ride sharing. So if the subways are closed and ride sharing is prohibited, how are people going to get to work? I don't think we should prohibit ride sharing.

But if this is basically the full list, and every other activity is okay and all other businesses can reopen, then this would work.

Ken B said...

Mandrewa
No, not the full list. Gatherings in parks etc above n are not allowed. I think n is 5 but am not sure. Libraries are closed. Restaurants cand do take out (including alcohol) but no indoor seating, barbers are closed etc. They are adjusted periodically. Schools will remain closed for now it was just announced.
The point is that there really are sensible measures that stop short of Whitmerism, and it’s wrong to pretense choice is Whitmer or nothing.

The open windows on buses. Is a good idea.

Inga said...

“Inga, you would have been the lone progressive voice trying to talk some sense into them.”

Probably not, unless they tried to direct me to do something that goes against my own good judgment. Having said that, I didn’t find Wisconsin’s guildlines excessively restrictive and there has been a time limit on them. People in Wisconsin for the most part KNOW they are allowed outside. I’ve learned from being a commenter here for so many years that one cannot talk sense into anyone. As long as people don’t step on each other’s toes, we’re good.

Ken B said...

Inga said “ Her post doesn’t veer from the first day of this shutdown that I noticed. She has said that she has not stepped into one public building and continues to go outside and avoid people. ”

I agree. But as you must know there are posters here who are disconnected from reality, at least as far as what is actually said on this blog!

Gk1 said...

Its hilarious how the democratic party is now identified as the 'Party of Karens'. And well deserved too! These humorless prigs have painted themselves into a corner. They contentedly yell at children minding their own business playing in a park and openly wish death on them. They only have their blue state governors for their plight.

The democratic party= Party of Karens

https://nypost.com/2020/04/27/teacher-hopes-teens-die-long-painful-death-from-coronavirus-report/

JaimeRoberto said...

While the phrase "shelter in place" seems to imply that we should stay indoors, the reality even here in the Bay Area is that lots of people have been going outdoors. In fact, it seems that there are more people outdoors now than during usual times. Or perhaps they are just concentrated in different locations than they otherwise would be.

Original Mike said...

"I’ve learned from being a commenter here for so many years that one cannot talk sense into anyone."

Inga, we're missing you on the Flynn thread.

Beaumont said...

It's really annoying to see concern, outrage, or scolding from people who act like we're being disobedient or science-ignorant if we won't stay inside! I support government orders that are fine-tuned to the danger at hand, but some people seem to love excessive restrictions on freedom and to deplore the incorrigibles who won't just stay in their house.
posted by Ann Althouse at 9:02 AM on Apr 28, 2020

Under the best of circumstances, people are emotionally gratified when they are able to express their sense of superiority and judge others negatively. I am curious? How often have you run into these reactions? I wonder if there are regional (and possibly other) differences in the frequency of these negative reactions to going out in public.

Drago said...

Inga mini-me Ken B: "I agree. But as you must know there are posters here who are disconnected from reality, at least as far as what is actually said on this blog!"

More Breaking News in the 4 year long Russia Kollusion Komplete Konspiracy Kollapse: we now have the documents that conclusively prove Gen Flynn, George Pappadopolous and Carter Page were all set up by the deep staters.

Conclusive proof.

And just today the co-conspirators at the Eric Holder law firm "found" 6,800 additional documents which further exonerate Flynn. (Inga is mysteriously missing from that thread).

This is on top of the complete collapse, in record time, of the Trump Owes Money To ChiCom Banks lie that our lefties have been pushing for a week.

Which is made worse for the Inga/Ken B science deniers by the fact there are indeed companies working to deliver Far UV light (short wavelength) options for interior lighting, delivery of Far UV light for internal human body application as well as Oral Chlorine Dioxide for use against the ChiCom flu and other viruses.

And if thats not enough, 2 more contemporaneous witnesses have come forward against Slow Joe.

And to make it all worse, actions that just days ago Inga and Ken B were calling murderously racist are now being advocated for by dems/lefties.

Quite a week so far.

RigelDog said...

“Inga, you would have been the lone progressive voice trying to talk some sense into them.”

Probably not, unless they tried to direct me to do something that goes against my own good judgment }}}

Well, they would have told you that it was unacceptably risky to allow you or anyone else to be outside of the 4 walls of your house and that you were a selfish Covidiot for doing so. I would normally not tussle with people just because they have a different opinion but their attitude was potentially harmful to me and the cause of reacting to this crisis in a logical way.

Danno said...

Blogger Lucien said...Governors or no, doesn't it seem like the efficacy of lockdown orders depends on the willingness of law enforcement officers at the local level to enforce them? If counties, cities, Sheriffs, Police Chiefs, or individual officers decide not to spend any of their time enforcing this bullshit, who will -- State Troopers?

Where are the sanctuary cities that support distancing but don't send out storm troopers to enforce the many silly governors that are basking in their power?

mandrewa said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Fernandinande said...

Unfortunately Inga Wisconsin has its share of Karen’s[sic].

Here's a post by one of them, who expected other people to walk in a certain manner and to move out of her way.

Howard said...

I'm out and about every day multiple times a day working out hiking looking for a house going to the store running errands, etc. No one bats an eye. Mask use indoors is better than 80% in center Mass. Mask use outdoors at the Harvard arboretum in JP is also >80%. Mask use outdoors in center Mass is <10% (usually just me and Asians)

Yancey Ward said...

Inga must think we were born yesterday.

Inga said...

“Well, they would have told you that it was unacceptably risky to allow you or anyone else to be outside of the 4 walls of your house and that you were a selfish Covidiot for doing so. I would normally not tussle with people just because they have a different opinion but their attitude was potentially harmful to me and the cause of reacting to this crisis in a logical way.”

I don’t know how the people in your neck of the woods would react, except by what you say, but I do know the people here in my area would say no such thing. This is a conservative County, so maybe that’s why. However my daughter who lives in the Madison area is out with my two grandsons everyday. She and her friends on Facebook exchange ideas regarding places in which to go on outings with their children and Madison is a very lefty place, as you know.

Brian said...

Same situation here with Delaware and people with second homes.

I've heard this in other states, MI and Illinois. How is this legal?

It's your property. I would think you have a legal right to use it. I suppose a municipality could create some sort of occupancy permit but "no out of state owners" shouldn't pass constitutional muster.

Tell them to go pound sand.

RigelDog said...

Same situation here with Delaware and people with second homes.

I've heard this in other states, MI and Illinois. How is this legal?

It's your property. I would think you have a legal right to use it. I suppose a municipality could create some sort of occupancy permit but "no out of state owners" shouldn't pass constitutional muster. }}}

I don't know how Michigan justifies it; perhaps through a general ban on driving far from your primary residence? Delaware doesn't forbid, just requires strict quarantine and also the officials constantly beg people to just not come at all. My husband will definitely be going down soon and there may very well be neighbors who are angry about that. He plans to park the car so that the PA license is hidden. I won't be going because we have a dog and we would not be permitted to walk him (even though I walk him in a deserted field).