January 5, 2020

"It is impossible to overstate the importance... It is more significant than the killing of Osama bin Laden or even the death of al-Baghdadi."

"Suleimani was the architect and operational commander of the Iranian effort to solidify control of the so-called Shia crescent, stretching from Iran to Iraq through Syria into southern Lebanon. He is responsible for providing explosives, projectiles, and arms and other munitions that killed well over 600 American soldiers and many more of our coalition and Iraqi partners just in Iraq, as well as in many other countries such as Syria.... [Trump's] reasoning seems to be to show in the most significant way possible that the U.S. is just not going to allow the continued violence—the rocketing of our bases, the killing of an American contractor, the attacks on shipping, on unarmed drones—without a very significant response.... Iran is in a very precarious economic situation, it is very fragile domestically.... It will be interesting now to see if there is a U.S. diplomatic initiative to reach out to Iran and to say, 'Okay, the next move could be strikes against your oil infrastructure and your forces in your country—where does that end?'... Obviously all sides will suffer if this becomes a wider war, but Iran has to be very worried that—in the state of its economy, the significant popular unrest and demonstrations against the regime—that this is a real threat to the regime in a way that we have not seen prior to this.... Yes, they can respond and they can retaliate, and that can lead to further retaliation—and that it is clear now that the administration is willing to take very substantial action. This is a pretty clarifying moment in that regard.... Given the state of their economy, I think they have to be very leery, very concerned that that could actually result in the first real challenge to the regime certainly since the Iran-Iraq War...."

Said David Petraeus in an interview with Foreign Policy.

468 comments:

«Oldest   ‹Older   401 – 468 of 468
Drago said...

Howard: "I didn't really watch any NFL games this year but I'm committed to watching at least half of the playoff games"

Do what I do. Record them and watch them later very rapidly. If you fast forward thru all the dead time you can catch a full game in about 30 to 40 minutes.

J. Farmer said...

@Gk1:

Farmer, so you don't know any iranian's? Check.

Since my answer to this dumbass question won't make any difference anyway, I won't give it. But glad to know that's how you learn about a country. You talk to the family of some people who used to live there, and then you know everything you need to know about a country. Besides, the Iranian diaspora is maybe 2 or 3% of the total Iranian population. The influence of Iranian expats, who tend to be far more hawkish towards the Iranian government than the typical Iranian, have been a pernicious influence on US-Iran relations. This is also another example of how loose immigration policy boomerangs back against us as immigrant communities organize and start exerting pressure on the federal government to behave towards their country in a certain way.

Howard said...

Come on Wednesday. It seems plausible because Trump is a germaphobe and urine is sterile so it sounds like a win-win on first blush. Do you believe the Obama birther swallowers should be laughed off the face of the Earth? Fair is fair

n.n said...

Benghazi was Obama's Libya-Rebel/ISIS Affair. It involved Iranian terrorist proxies in Syria. The question is if Obama's bribe ("JCPOA") to Iran, besides opening the Middle East to greater wars, also funded these terrorists cells. With Suleimani no longer viable, there will be renewed efforts to end Obama's wars and refugee crises throughout the greater Middle East, including Yemen, and Africa.

Howard said...

That's the way to do it Drago. I just really kind of lost interest this year for some reason. However I am enjoying the playoff games so far.

Drago said...

Howard: "Okay Drago I stand corrected that's a very impressive resume."

Its okay. I should have squeezed in a Finance degree somewhere. THAT would make it an awesome skillset.

J. Farmer said...

@Drago:

Do what I do. Record them and watch them later very rapidly. If you fast forward thru all the dead time you can catch a full game in about 30 to 40 minutes.

My family our huge football fans. My mother and sister were over earlier watching the Vikings/Saints game. I've never watched a football game from beginning to end in my life. And I always suggested why not just DVR them and then fast forward through it. They find the whole concept abhorrent. I guess there is just something about being a part of a group of spectators, even if only electronically.

bagoh20 said...

"Benghazi has nothing to do with Iran, shithead."

In precisely the same way 9/11 had nothing to do with Bin Laden. No connection at all.

gbarto said...

Not to the bottom of the thread, but just to chime in that ARM is asking a useful question. Part of the reason to vote for Trump is you knew Hillary would be looking for her justification of go into Syria the second she was sworn in. Trump is supposed to be the alternative to endless commitments in the Middle East.

We should take the Iraqi parliament's vote as our excuse and opportunity to pull out of Iraq. And we should make it clear to the Iraqi parliament that when Iran overruns us, we don't give a damn.

From there, we should keep an aircraft carrier and a few battleships close enough to the Straits of Hormuz that we can close the Iranian oil export spigot at will and let the Chinese and Europeans know that an energy independent United States doesn't really care if oil flows from Iran or shipping lanes from the Middle East stay open, only that we won't deliberately block them as long as our interests aren't threatened.

Drago said...

Howard, I was just in Boston last summer. Next time I go Ill give you a heads up and we will go grab a beer, head over to the Coast Guard base, yell insults at the Coasties and when they chase us I'll pull a hammy, fall down and weep.

n.n said...

Soleimani. How can it be rash? Military Intelligence has been planning this for years.

He was the director of Iranian terrorist proxies. He was in Iraq to coordinate with his allies. He was a burden. He was planned, with, apparently, no collateral damage. This is an opportunity for Iran's full disclosure, abortion of terrorist support, peace for Iranian people, and reconciliation with her neighbors.

Howard said...

Our current predicament with Iran has nothing to do with the Benghazi incident other than it is just one in a long list of Terror and military activities directed by general grease spot.

Also are you comparing the magnitude of the 9/11 attack to the Benghazi fiasco?

narciso said...

Only soviet mouthpieces could be relied on on the cold war, same with the prc, but only israeli leftists tell the truth, only islanist opponents of the saudis. Only the moslem brotherhood regarding egypt and libya

Howard said...

Drago, sounds like a plan I'd like that very much.

Drago said...

Farmer: "And I always suggested why not just DVR them and then fast forward through it. They find the whole concept abhorrent."

I also have the TV on mute so no ine is bothered.

I also really enjoy rugby (i played into my late 30's, my nose reflects that), but you really cant fast forward effectively with that.

bagoh20 said...

"Also are you comparing the magnitude of the 9/11 attack to the Benghazi fiasco?"

Don't play that bullshit. Are you comparing this elimination of a terrorist with the entire war in Afghanistan?

See how stupid that game is?

Howard said...

For several years the NFL had a service called rewind we're for about a hundred bucks per season you could watch all the games the next day. They also included a feature where they edited out all of the huddles and everything else and so you could watch an entire game every single play in about 25 minutes

effinayright said...

Jim at said...
Isn't amazing just how coincidental the Iranian attack on the US embassy in Iraq - along with the intelligence gathered to put Soliemani at Baghdad International Airport - just happened to provide Trump an opportunity to draw attention away from the impeachment papers that have been sitting in the House of Representatives for two weeks?

I mean, it's just like bombing a fucking aspirin factory.
************

All that's needed to get it front-and-center again is for the Dems to formally send those articles over to the Senate.

In addition, the aspirin factory bombing was inconsequential. Killing Soliemani is YUGE.

Original Mike said...

Inga said…"That and numerous other things that are still brewing. Judges keep shooting down Trumps lawyers, it’s going to get even more interesting."

The FBI lying to the FISA court multiple times wasn't interesting enough for you?

Lewis Wetzel said...

So the Iranians put an 80 million $ bounty on Trump's head.
Why not 70 million $? Too little?
Why not 90 million $? Too much? He wouldn't be worth it?

Howard said...

Bag of water you were the one that compared a minnow to a blue whale. Own it

bagoh20 said...

Trump should tell the Iranians that he has captured himself and wants the bounty, in large bills on a pallet sent by plane, but sneak it in at night.

JML said...


So the Iranians put an 80 million $ bounty on Trump's head.
Why not 70 million $? Too little?
Why not 90 million $? Too much? He wouldn't be worth it?

It is because it is all they have left of the cash obama sent them...

narciso said...

How often is it that we lose an ambassador in the line of duty, not since adolph dubs 33 years earlier, embassy bombing 14 years earlier, its kind of a rare thing.

Birkel said...

Howard,
You can be quite entertaining.

But the lie you told above about Cambridge. MA having a lot of beautiful women is an astonishingly bold lie.

Even for the Leftist Collectivists on this board that lie stands out.

Just stop it.

Birkel said...

Maybe by writing "Boston and Cambridge" it wasn't technically a lie.
Boston does have lots of beautiful women.

It's akin to writing Howard and Tom Brady have 6 Super Bowl rings.

narciso said...

https://mobile.twitter.com/GrayConnolly/status/1213972206331584513

Inga said...

“Bag of water you were the one that compared a minnow to a blue whale. Own it”

Indeed he did. I wasn’t even going to bother addressing him over it, it was that absurd.

Rory said...

Star Trek: Yangs v. Koms in "Omega Glory."

Nichevo said...


Howard said...
Okay so now you people are saying that starting a war with Iran will be good. You now support more adventurous endless war. I thought the attack on the Iranian general was to prevent War, at least that's what Dear Leaderhosen said.


If you could stop gaming this and worrying about what other people said, you might be able to offer your own thoughts. Do you have any?

Roughcoat said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Roughcoat said...

I've spent most of the day working with my superiors and government representatives on issues related to the Christian Assyrian population in Iraq. Busy time, as you may well imagine.

So, returning to an earlier subject ... Daylight precision bombing did work. It was costly at first and yielded only marginal successes. There was a steep learning curve. There was trial and error and experimentation and casualties were high. This was especially true of 1943. In April 1944 it was interrupted when Eight Air Force was retasked to use the heavy bombers to implement the "Transportation Plan," the destruction of the France's road and rail infrastructure. After June 6 they were also used in a tactical role, e.g. carpet bombing German troop concentrations prior to the St. Lo breakout and etc. USAAF commanders were not happy about this. But we worked through the problems. The bombing campaign really began to realize its potential when the P-51 was introduced to the mix. By early 1945 the German economy was in freefall because of the bombing campaign.

Another explicitly stated objective was the to use the strategic bomber raids to lure the Luftwaffe's fighter arm into what amounted to a battle of attrition. The P-51 enabled this strategy and it was successful. Big Week 20-25 February 1944 exemplified this effort.

Furthermore, the strategic bombing campaign constituted a virtual "Second Front" well before the Normandy landings. It resulted in the Wehrmacht deploying many thousands of high velocity antiaircraft guns (88s, 120mm) to the West when they could have been more profitably used in an antitank role against Red Army armored formations.. As well the campaigns forced the Germans had to divert the bulk of their fighters to the West. The Germans lost air superiority in the East as a result. The diversion of antiaircraft artillery and fighter aircraft played a critical role in the German defeat in the East.

Read the damn Strategic Bombing Survey.

Qwinn said...

"Okay so now you people are saying that starting a war with Iran will be good."

You guys keep saying things like this.

Name one person here who has said that. Or anything remotely like that.

Just one.

Should be easy.

bagoh20 said...

Nice try at deflection, or maybe you guys can't grasp logic.

I never compared the relative scale of the attacks, but you know that, and I'll be generous and say you chose to play stupid. It very convincing by the way.

Which statement is false?

"Benghazi has nothing to do with Iran, shithead."

or

Bin Laden's relationship to 9/11 is the same as Soleimani's to Benghazi. Which is what I clearly said, and why both deserve to be dead.

Roughcoat said...

I've spent most of the day working with my superiors and government representatives on issues related to the Christian Assyrian population in Iraq. Busy time, as you may well imagine.

So, returning to an earlier subject ... Daylight precision bombing did work. It was costly at first and yielded only marginal successes. There was a steep learning curve. There was trial and error and experimentation and casualties were high. This was especially true of 1943. In April 1944 it was interrupted when Eighth Air Force was retasked to implement the Transportation Plan, the destruction of France's road and rail network. After June 6 heavy bombers were also used in a tactical role, e.g. carpet bombing German troop concentrations prior to the St. Lo breakout and etc. USAAF commanders were not happy about this. But we worked through the problems. The bombing campaign really began to realize its potential when the P-51 was introduced to the mix. By early 1945 the German economy was in freefall because of the bombing campaign.

Another explicitly stated objective was the to use the strategic bomber raids to lure the Luftwaffe's fighter arm into what amounted to a battle of attrition. The P-51 enabled this strategy and it was successful. Big Week 20-25 February 1944 exemplified this effort.

Furthermore, the strategic bombing campaign constituted a virtual "Second Front" that Stalin demanded, well before the Normandy landings. It resulted in the Wehrmacht deploying many thousands of high velocity antiaircraft guns (88s, 120mm) to the West when they could have been more profitably used in an antitank role in the East against Red Army armored formations. As well the campaign forced the Germans divert the bulk of their fighters to the West. The Germans lost air superiority in the East as a result. The diversion of antiaircraft artillery and fighter aircraft was played a critical role in the German defeat in the East.

Read the damn Strategic Bombing Survey.

n.n said...

https://mobile.twitter.com/GrayConnolly/status/1213972206331584513

Green, perhaps. Divergent, in principle. Also, monotonic [unqualified] change, imputed positive perceptions notwithstanding.

Narayanan said...

USA Iraq presence ===>>>> Their current mission is to protect Iraq's Iranian controlled govt as agreed by Obama administration.

Solaimani was "guest."

Trump - USA offed him.

More Obama legacy wiped

FullMoon said...

Inga said:
"Bin Laden was responsible for the 2,977 deaths. Have you people completely lost your bearings? You’re lost."
..................

BinLaden like team owner. Provides the money. Soleimani apparently like coaches and best players in one package.

chuck said...

"This is a good place to sit down and have a drink." Opens the door. "Nevermind."

Narayanan said...

Which is more important to correct.
Past stupidities or currently ongoing?

FullMoon said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Gahrie said...

From there, we should keep an aircraft carrier and a few battleships

The last battleship in active service was decommissioned in the 1990's. I don't believe there are even any in the reserves anymore. World War II brought about the transition from battleships to aircraft carriers. The Marines loved battleships for their fire support, but as far as the Navy was concerned they were just very large targets.

We are now in a similar transition, that will be resisted just as fiercely. We need to transform our Navy from power projection to coastal and commerce protection. Lots of destroyers and frigates, a couple of antisubmarine carriers and whatever support the Marines need. Get rid of the subs and the CVNs. (convert one or two of the CVNs to disaster response ships?) Replace the CVNs with a half dozen escort carriers.

Take the money and resources and invest them in the Space Force. Buy some SpaceX Falcon 9s and Sierra Nevada Dreamchasers. Put some KEWs and railguns on the Dreamchasers. Build and deploy satellites with KEWs. Now you can retire the Air Force's strategic assets and the missile silos. I bet it would be revenue neutral at worst.

Nichevo said...

bagoh20 said... Trump should tell the Iranians that he has captured himself and wants the bounty, in large bills


He should counter with an offer of a nickel apiece for all the Iranian VIPs.

Drago said...

Roughcoat: "Furthermore, the strategic bombing campaign constituted a virtual "Second Front" that Stalin demanded, well before the Normandy landings. It resulted in the Wehrmacht deploying many thousands of high velocity antiaircraft guns (88s, 120mm) to the West when they could have been more profitably used in an antitank role in the East against Red Army armored formations. As well the campaign forced the Germans divert the bulk of their fighters to the West. The Germans lost air superiority in the East as a result. The diversion of antiaircraft artillery and fighter aircraft was played a critical role in the German defeat in the East."

This was absolutely critical because both Stalin and Roosevelt/Churchill were concerned that the other might make a separate peace with Hitler thereby freeing up Hitler to return to the 1-front scenario.

Roosevelt/Churchill paired a strong rhetorical message along with the bombing raids to Stalin by declaring the US and Britain were in this to the end and would accept nothing less than "Unconditional Surrender" of the Germans, Japanese and Italians.

bagoh20 said...

If you think my comparison is off, then you might want to reread the title of this entire post and the point of this discussion.

Or perhaps you are saying that you have to kill thousands of Americans before we strike back and kill you. Killing a few brave Americans, an ambassador, and an entire embassy being destroyed should only get you probation. Is that your take?

Drago said...

Original Mike (to Inga): "The FBI lying to the FISA court multiple times wasn't interesting enough for you?"

Easy there Mike.

Just today, literally just today, we finally got Admiral Inga to admit that the hoax dossier she crowed about for nearly 3 years was a lie. And, mind you, this is after 9 to 12 months where the author of the hoax dossier and the purveyors of the hoax dossier had already under oath declared it all BS.

Inga, why not make it a clean sweep tonight?

Admit that Carter Page was never a russian spy, the FBI lied to the FISA court to get a warrant on Page which enabled them to spy on the entire Trump campaign, Trump did not collude with the russians and the Nunes memo proved exactly correct while the Schiff memo got every single thing wrong.

These are all now documented to be true with many on the left already conceding these points, so it shouldnt be a problem for you to concede these points as well.

Maybe even apologize since you repeatedly called Naval Academy grad/Naval Intel officer/CIA asset Carter Page a treasonous traitor.

We wont even get to the Flynn frameup, Brennans Confidential Human Sources entrapping and framing Papadopolous with FBI help, Nellie Ohr and other democrat operatives access to FISA databases and disseminating that info for leaks to the media, etc.

TJM said...

If Ann wants to lose her readership over Loons like Inga, that’s Ann’s business. Inga is dense, left-wing loon prevaricating ideologue, with the brains of a gnat. Vale atque vale

Original Mike said...

I have a quibble, Drago. Saying the Schiff memo "got every single thing wrong" implies Schiff made an honest mistake. In fact, he was lying through his teeth.

Original Mike said...

"We wont even get to the Flynn frameup, Brennans Confidential Human Sources entrapping and framing Papadopolous with FBI help, Nellie Ohr and other democrat operatives access to FISA databases and disseminating that info for leaks to the media, etc."

Quite right. There'll be time enough for that.

walter said...

TJM,
iirc, she has told us (per analytics) the vast majority of her readership aren't about the comments.

FullMoon said...

Seen elsewhere

Iran has 25 missile sites plus 27 oil refineries . 25+27 = 52 targets.

Lewis Wetzel said...

A few years ago I noticed that certain types of people think that coffee grounds are a miracle cure-all. Gophers raiding your garden? Spread coffee grounds around the root crops. Bad gas mileage? Put some coffee grounds in your gas tank. I think I know where this coming from -- coffee grounds look like coffee, and throwing them away seems to be a waste. So people want to do something with them that seems to recover some of their value.
So, you want to know what I'd do about the Iranian situation?
Coffee grounds.

Michael K said...

My God. Over 400 and Inga probably has 200 of them, No need to read them.

chickelit said...

So people want to do something with them that seems to recover some of their value.

I compost mine but I used to grind them down the sink (which seemed better than throwing into the trash for landfill).

Quaestor said...

Reuters has the scoop.

chickelit said...

@Queastor: Well that contradicts what Chuck linked to this morning about The Hand being on a peace mission.

narciso said...


Quelle surprise

https://www.asiatimes.com/2020/01/article/trump-takes-a-calculated-risk/

Daniel Jackson said...

"What's in it for us?"

Just WHO is going to rebuild what's left of Iran?

Lewis Wetzel said...

My preferred policy would be to bomb the Iranians. Yeah, you need boots on the ground to dictate a nation's politics, but to crash the old regime B2's will do.
So the regime has fallen. What happens next? Iran would become an abattoir until some faction gains control. Iran has oil, natural gas, and can potentially control an important shipping lane. It has x3 the population of Iraq.
So the Chinese, or the Russians (more probably the Russians), would nominally control the government & territory of Iran. Would this be better or worse for the US than the current situation?
I don't know. I don't think that any of the talking heads you see on TV know.

narciso said...

Russians are closer, theyd come across thr caspian from azerbaijan, pakistan would want a piece.

Inga said...

Inga, 23 comments.Drago 56 comments. Michael Kennedy too senile to count.

effinayright said...

Birkel said...
Howard,
You can be quite entertaining.

But the lie you told above about Cambridge. MA having a lot of beautiful women is an astonishingly bold lie
**********

Indeed. I live near there, and when I go down to Harvard Square I think of Captain Kirk advising his crew to "set your phasers on "Shave"".

(with a tip o' the hat to "Bloom County, IIRC)

chickelit said...

Lewis Wetzel said...What happens next? Iran would become an abattoir until some faction gains control.

They could do what the French did after their revolution -- chose someone to unite Dar al-Islam and to oppose Dar al-Harb. Or they could enter the modern world.

Công ty TNHH TMDV Công Nghệ TK said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Công ty TNHH TMDV Công Nghệ TK said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Công ty TNHH TMDV Công Nghệ TK said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Công ty TNHH TMDV Công Nghệ TK said...

Bên mình đang bán [a href="https://tktech.vn/may-can-bang-laser/"]máy laser[/a] với giá rẻ nhất thị trường, cùng nhiều quà tặng hấp dẫn với siêu khuyến mãi

Michael K said...

Thank God Inga counted comments. Something useful for a change.

«Oldest ‹Older   401 – 468 of 468   Newer› Newest»