1. "Israel has decided to approve a petition by U.S. Congresswoman Rashida Tlaib to enter Israel on 'humanitarian grounds' so she may visit her Palestinian grandmother, the Interior Ministry announced Friday, this after it barred her from entering the country due to her support for the boycott, divestment and sanctions movement." Haaretz, this morning.
2. Shortly thereafter, CNN: "Rep. Rashida Tlaib said Friday she would not visit Israel after the country granted permission for her to enter the country on humanitarian grounds to visit her family in the West Bank a day after blocking her and fellow Rep. Ilhan Omar from visiting the country. 'I have decided that visiting my grandmother under these oppressive conditions stands against everything I believe in--fighting against racism, oppression & injustice,' Tlaib said in a tweet."
3. In writing, you should be careful about putting things in absolute terms. Think before using words like "everything," as in "stands against everything I believe in." That would mean that you don't believe in visiting your grandmother!
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212 comments:
1 – 200 of 212 Newer› Newest»Such a fraud. I cannot believe she has constituents.
I'm not sure they got Tlaib's full quote:
'I have decided that visiting my grandmother under these oppressive conditions stands against everything I believe in--fighting against racism, oppression & injustice -- ALLAHUH AKBAR- DEATH TO THE GREAT SATAN"
If she dies, she dies.
Obvious publicity stunt.
In other news Omar's district is the worst in US for blacks.
Too busy with Jew hate to care.
The Jihadist is at war with all Jews and all Christians. She doesn't want a normal life until the infidels are all dead.
"Palestine," such as it is, clearly is not sending us their best.
I'm shocked, shocked to discover Grandma was a ploy.
So it was basically just a publicity stunt? Who could have seen that coming LOL. But it is sad that she won't go visit her elderly grandmother because of politics. That is on her not the US or Israel.
Think before using words like "everything," as in "stands against everything I believe in."
I've always disliked absolutism. I always hedge. I'm a hedger. I'm Hedgy McHedgerson.
Younger people and idiots love Twitter since they can make these sweeping, dramtic statements without real consequences. In this day and age "stands against everything I believe in!" seems like a teenage thing to say, unless you're getting tear gas canisters shot at you in the streets of Hong Kong or something.
Reasoned debate about the US-Israel relationship is nearly impossible in modern America so I don’t really bother anymore. It’s pretty much a matter of faith for most people.
Translation: I'd rather use this a weapon against the Jews than actually see my grandmother before she dies...."
She had no comment about the fact that roughly 50 majority Muslim countries will not allow someone with an Israeli passport to enter their countries.
That's different because....SHUT UP.....!
sounds like Grandma was a prop, like Horndog Clintoon's bible!
In related news, her bestie's congressional district was rated the worst district for black Americans to live. Not that she cares. I'm sure they'd much rather spend their days on Twitter agitating then actually doing their jobs.
From the Israeli interior minister: “I authorized this humanitarian trip, but it turns out that it was a provocation to embarrass Israel. Her hatred for Israel overcomes her love for her grandmother.” https://twitter.com/ariyederi/status/1162353799371079680 …
Just goes to show the depth and ferocity of Tlaib's hatred for Israel and that there is no reason to believe that any gesture of goodwill by the Israeli's would change that. IOW, Tlaib proved Trump was right. She couldn't help herself.
If Saturday Night Live or any of these late night television shows had any balls, they'd have a field day with these idiots.
Man, someone needs to create good television and make making fun of women and minorities great again.
"That would mean that you don't believe in visiting your grandmother!"
So it looks like her "everything" was appropriate.
Throwing grandma under the bus is a well known Democrat maneuver.
Nonapod said: "In related news, her bestie's congressional district was rated the worst district for black Americans to live."
That's what happens when black people vote for the candidate who most looks like them.
Maybe they'll wise up someday.
What vile people.
Winner here? Israel. Shows they have a heart, and put that above politics. Good for them.
When does the BDS against India start over Kashmir? That will let me know that the anti-Israel BDS is a matter or principal and not just Jew hate.
It is just Jew hate.
As soon as I heard about Israel changing to the more accommodating position, I knew it wouldn't go well. I expected her to go, but break every promise she made. None of the four in the squad can be trusted - not by friend or foe.
AOC spent 480K on Facebook ads in 90 days, out-spending the Presidential candidates, and she's not even running for anything. She has only 10 donors from her own district. She will not be reelected, but she also will not go away afterward. Sometimes you just want the bartender to shut up and give you some peace.
Is this one of the grandmothers who died so she could skip high school?
It is just Jew hate.
Once again demonstrating that conservatives turn into SJW’s whenever the subject of Israel comes up.
Crafty Israelis Pull High Ground From Under Tlaib
Tlaib has had her bluff called twice. It's good to see Israel yank her chain like this. She is exposed as a liar.
As usual, Israel being classy, Arab person ..... not.
Mr. Pants is a businessman and needed to go to Saudi Arabi from Dubai. There was a slight misalignment in his visa and he was pulled into a little room and questioned by the Saudis for a few hours. They looked at his passport and demanded, “You were born in New York. Are you Jewish?” Our last name is the most Irish one you could imagine and there was no trace of a visit to Israel in his passport, but still. Geniuses at work!
These media whores will never be asked to explain why it was OK for the Obama/Biden administration to deny entry into the US of other foreign elected persons. I think Israel and India elected representative were denied US entry. Somehow, when Biden approved of a sovereign nation approving/disprove entry visas, was normal, seemed so long ago.
"I've instructed Grandma that it's Allah's will that she stay alive until at least January, 2021, when we'll have a Democrat president. I told her that I would be moving her entire Pali village to the Detroit area. There's a shortage of grifters in that area and Palis are the best type of ingrate grifters to have."
Guess she’ll have to settle for Detroit
As far as i can gather this is where she comes from:
https://web.archive.org/web/20080829185744/http://www.christusrex.org/www1/ofm/mad/discussion/062discuss.html
Visits to grandmothers are boring anyway.
So yesterday, one of the Netanyahu's grounds for rejecting her application to visit was that Tlaib requested to enter Palestine, quote:
they listed the destination of their trip as Palestine and not Israel, and unlike all Democratic and Republican members of Congress who have visited Israel, they did not request to meet any Israeli officials
Yet the application show by Haaretz mentions only Israel and is dated yesterday.
I'm missing information, but I'm pretty sure the initial application was sent before yesterday. So did Tlaib amend her request to say Israel, get permission to visit, and now is turning down the visa?
Farmer 1:
Reasoned debate about the US-Israel relationship is nearly impossible in modern America so I don’t really bother anymore.
Incorrect. I'd be glad to engage you in reasonable debate on this issue. Not sure what your viewpoint is. Whey not state it?
Farmer 2:
Once again demonstrating that conservatives turn into SJW’s whenever the subject of Israel comes up.
Incorrect. While I am a supporter of Israel, I'm not fanatical about it. Stop being coy and tell the crowd what you think about this issue! Nobody will bite. Israel's not infallible.
He seems to have been unstuck in time
https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2019/08/smackdown_joe_biden_gets_owned_over_his_whining_about_israel_and_the_omartlaib_visit.html?fbclid=IwAR30yDYqjdbTVyisdDnuwFfkCU09yiHj4636WgTBOzFCIImNNCMjQGxQO0s#.XVavKLRzJgs.facebook
Once again demonstrating that conservatives turn into SJW’s whenever the subject of Israel comes up.
One problem with the Pat Buchanan conservatives is anti-Semitism. Israel has been a good ally in many ways that are not even public.
Pity that she cannot look past her hatred for Jews and Israel to visit her Grandma. What is not pitiful is her idiot constituents putting up with this insanity. They are just as rabidly insane about Israel and Jews as she is and for that reason, she will be in the House of Representatives until she dies.
Blogger J. Farmer said... It is just Jew hate.
Once again demonstrating that conservatives turn into SJW’s whenever the subject of Israel comes up.
That's a perfect observation.
"everything I believe in--fighting against Truth, Justice and the American Way!" said the green kryptonite.
This was the outfit behind the trip:
https://www.ngo-monitor.org/ngos/miftah/
In volpis season of ash published in 2016, the author still repeats the libel re al dura and the jenin 'massacre'
. Farmer said...
It is just Jew hate.
Once again demonstrating that conservatives turn into SJW’s whenever the subject of Israel comes up.
WTF does that even mean?????
she asked to visit her dear ol' granny and promised not engage in her anti-Semitic activities while she was there. Then they gave her permission and she now refuses to because visiting granny was just the pretext to allow her in to do her Jew hatred/terror sympathizing.
Good job, Michigan.
Howard and Farmer are united to defend their gal pals Tlaib and Omar!
You boys trying for a double-date? Movies, ice cream and unending Jihad against the Great Satan:)
That would require Howard to wake up before Noon.
Just kidding, having a very nice Friday!
I actually do wanna hear your viewpoints on this. I don't feel that Israel is beyond criticism.
I had a big argument yesterday about that word “absolutely.” ;^)
Time for Plan B for Grandma: strap some explosives to her, and have candy ready to give to the children later.
I am Laslo.
Mrs. Pants said: "Geniuses at work!"
I recall reading that the average IQ of Arabs is about 90.
Islam really appeals to the two-digit IQ demographic.
Diversity is our strength.
WTF does that even mean?????
I wonder that too...
If it’s supposed to be pointing out hypocrisy it falls flat, as the subject conservatives are themselves pointing out the hypocrisy.
To understand the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, ya gotta verse yourself in the larger Arab-Israeli conflict(s), beginning with:
1. 1948 - War of Independence after the UN Vote
2. 1967 - 6 Day War
3. 1973 - Yom Kippur War
Lotta BDS morons (like Tlaib) ignore this context. They think history started last week.
J. Farmer, I can appreciate that the Israel-Palestine debate can be one of the feelings over reason subjects. However, there is literally no question that Omar and Tlaib are (a) both vocal anti-Semites, (b) both supporters of boycotting Israel, and (c) both do not have Israel's best interests, by any reasonable definition, at heart. While the word "enemy" should not be used lightly, it is foolish to not apply it when it is obvious.
"I actually do wanna hear your viewpoints on this. I don't feel that Israel is beyond criticism." The second, at least, request to engage, so far greeted by silence.
It would seem the grandstanding is not limited to Tlaib.
The CNN story has a photograph of Rep. Tlaib’s bubba. Where’s the niqab when you need it?
Nonapod said...
Think before using words like "everything," as in "stands against everything I believe in."
I've always disliked absolutism. I always hedge. I'm a hedger. I'm Hedgy McHedgerson.
Younger people and idiots love Twitter since they can make these sweeping, dramtic statements without real consequences.
My sarcasm / satire detector is broken. How serious was this?
I support Israel, in a similar way that I support American allies like the UK, Canada, Australia, Poland, etc, etc.
Each has flaws, each, at times, have done stupid stuff, but, on the whole, when they don't have liberal (or in Poland's case, Communist) leadership, they are good allies.
Tlaib and Omar, however, are jokes. It is amazing that the Democrat party not only tolerates these quacks, but promotes them.
I saw: "Peace will come when Tlaib loves her grandmother more than she hates Israel."
I think her grandmother was "just another typical white person". Tlaib has her Obama street cred down pat.
Nonapod: In related news, her bestie's congressional district was rated the worst district for black Americans to live. Not that she cares. I'm sure they'd much rather spend their days on Twitter agitating then actually doing their jobs.
I clicked over. The article includes a nice example of the "bad neighborhoods/outcomes for blacks are all the result of redlining policies from many decades ago" line, which has apparently become the unquestioned conventional wisdom among liberals.
I recall reading that the average IQ of Arabs is about 90.
84 apparently.
https://brainstats.com/average-iq-by-country.html
Israel being a jewish state puts it in the center of Western culture.
"We have just seen that the Messiah is tyhe just man who suffers, who has taken on the suffering of others. Who finally takes on the suffering of others, if not the being who says 'Me' [Moi]?
The fact of not evading the burden imposed by the suffering of others defines ipseity itself. All persons are the Messiah.
The Self [Moi} as Self, taking upon itself the whole suffering of the world, is designated solely by this role. To be thus designated, not to evade to the point of responding before the call resounds - this is precisely what it means to be Me [Moi]. The Self [Moi] is one who has promised itself that it will carry the whole responsibility of the world.." ("Messianic Texts" _Difficult Freedom_ p.89, Levinas)
This is the human position in general. Everybody is a Jew.
In case you wondered why Israel treated arabs in its hospitals.
"In writing, you should be careful about putting things in absolute terms. Think before using words like "everything," as in "stands against everything I believe in." That would mean that you don't believe in visiting your grandmother!"
You should, shouldn't you. But then, these are progs we're talking about. They have other things to think about than the instructions of nice midwestern schoolmarms.
Anyway, they absolutely believe in the primacy of the struggle more than in visiting grandma. Sure, grandmas can be politically useful, either to try and shame Israel or to throw under the bus, but the family is a bastion of patriarchal oppression, and proper leftists have wanted to see it undone for a couple of centuries now.
In other news Omar's district is the worst in US for blacks.
Too busy with Jew hate to care.
For the very first time in recorded history, Jews are scapegoated for the failings of an areas leaders.
Whitey too.
First time.
The Democrats and their allies in the media are true visionaries. They have the ability to see the world as it is not and say why not. In their vision of the world, Trump is an anti-semitic and Tlaib is, in her way, the true friend of Israel.....I have my objections to Israel but their transgressions are more like zoning code violations as opposed to atrocities. I don't think the Palestinians would treat the Jews any better than Isis treated the Yakidizis. So far as I know, I don't think Tlaib has ever spoken out against the way the Palestinian Christians are being forced to emigrate due to disriminatory treatment by the Muslims. Some forms of oppression are more oppressive than others.
Everything is an expression that will forever remain vague and I'd use it as such agreeably if I did not get to visit my grandmother an traded my precious life time for political failure.
In actuality, everything is non existent an to categorize everything is pointless. We all or some but not all sacrifice somethings much dearer to us for a change within the confines of the continual injustice, oppression & racism to name a few.
Good to redirect any hate towards will for one's path in life. Good to have made a lot of money in the process. Not good to regret not visiting Grandma because the a lot of money will not substitute any grandmother.
But may dominate the planet and that may be a something in everything. Hi Grandma!
"So far as I know, I don't think Tlaib has ever spoken out against the way the Palestinian Christians are being forced to emigrate due to discriminatory treatment by the Muslims."
It is hardly to be expected that a Muslim will speak out against Islam.
"Once again demonstrating that conservatives turn into SJW’s whenever the subject of Israel comes up. "
The other side of that coin would be leftists turning into Nazis whenever the subject of Israel comes up.
The thing is that Jews actually are victims, hated with genocidal passion just for being Jews and wanting to live in peace and safety. So now it's the Left's turn to explain why they turn into Nazis over them. I grant the honorable gentlemen the remainder of my time.
My sarcasm / satire detector is broken. How serious was this?
In terms of what? My feelings about absolutism? Or Twitter? Or did you find my feelings on Twitter too absolute?
I believe Twitter is a cesspit. I believe that a sizable portion of people who use it enjoy being provocative and dramatic since there's (usually) little risk to themselves, meaning there's no negative real world consequences. Sure... they could be potentially be doxxed, but if they're on the SJW side of the issue that far less likely to happen than any other position. And, as has been seen, people who demonstrate a conservatives point of view are far more likely to be blocked, shadow banned, or deplatformed by the Twitter overlords.
What's worse is that by design it discourages actual meaningful debate. You're limited to 280 characters per Tweet, which can make it a bit more difficult to make a substantial argument. With it's retweet and "like" system it rewards mob behaivor, quick snarky replies, dismissive attitudes, and substanceless drama while discouraging reasoned, long form debate.
In short, I believe it is essentially making certain people (not all) more stupid, less inquisitive, and more likely to engage what I believe is destructive behaivor.
Literally.
"In writing, you should be careful about putting things in absolute terms. Think before using words like "everything," as in "stands against everything I believe in." That would mean that you don't believe in visiting your grandmother!"
Think before using words like "everything"
Pro-tip: virtually Every time you use an absolute, modify it with a qualifier.
This will make any phrase nearly Foolproof. You will have practically NO problems with absolutes, if you follow this seemingly Ironclad rule.
Extra Pro-tip: to add reinforcement to your apparently forceful Absolutes, Capitalize the absolute. People will see the Capitalized word, and most of the time EVERYONE will not even see the modifier
Tlaib is a piece of shit. The Israeli's were smart for banning this anti-semetic whack-a-doodle. Isn't it strange how american media refuses to look at polls in Israel regarding how popular the banning was? Hmm strange....
It is hardly to be expected that a Muslim will speak out against Islam.
Especially since it has a good chance of getting them killed.
Just shows that it was and always was a political propaganda visit.
Hey.. you folks is sleepy? Whattabout Moby Grape? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jdI7uqCBKd0
Hey Grandma in American! PLAY IT LOUD... DROWN THE COW OUT!
3. In writing, you should be careful about putting things in absolute terms.
It’s funny how Althouse has these quaint little rules and niceties for language usage. She’s good about applying them to Congresspeople of both parties and all persuasions. And especially to journalists.
But never, ever to Trump.
Nonoapod, Re: absolutea:
I've always ...
I always (hedge)
Younger people and idiots ... make these sweeping, dramatic statements without real consequences.
And this whole story is all Trump, isn’t it?
Israel would never have barred entry to the two US Representatives on their own. AIPAC sure as hell didn’t want it and thought it a terrible idea.
Trump said that he thought Israel would look weak if they allowed the visit. So the Netanyahu government acted. In concert with Trump’s domestic politics.
As long as that is the game, I think Democrats will look weak if they don’t impeach the motherfucker.
It’s a shitty game for sure. But it’s the Trump era.
Would a gin and tonic buy another 50 comments, sans Althouse and Trump?
Chuck -- put down the Gin bottle! It's still only lunch time:)
If you had guessed that LLR and Noted Liar Chuck would happily stoop to deflecting for the worst of the far far left lunatic anti-semitic fringe, as he does for all dems, congratulations.
You fully understand LLR Chuck and his purpose at Althouse blog.
Resolved: there is no marxist/pro-terrorist/anti-American leftist/dem for whom LLR Chuck will not go to bat.
None.
"Unexpectedly".
Israel would never have barred entry to the two US Representatives on their own.
Israel passed a law 8 years ago, you idiot.
Wait, just last month Trump was getting walked on a leash by Bibi.
But this month Trump's the reason for internal Israeli politics?
Nope.
That won't track.
MK: "Israel passed a law 8 years ago, you idiot."
LLR and Noted Liar Chuck likes to combine lies of omission with his torrent of pro-dem direct lies.
He clearly believes that is a more effective tactic in support of Team Left/LLR-left.
Two Muslim Congress women deeply involved in the politics of another country/territory.
Faker name Omar in Somalia and Tlaib involved in the Palestinians who refuse to accept that they lost three wars, all of which they started.
Recall, LLR Chuck's "magnificent" obama denied entry in 2012 to an Israeli Knesset member.
Btw, anyone else catch Ronna Romney McDaniels total smackdown of LLR Chuck-approved loser hack Amash!
A glorious smackdown as Amash's entire district kicks his Chinese-owned butt to the curb!
Younger people and idiots ... make these sweeping, dramatic statements without real consequences.
In my defense, that's not necessarily what I personally would consider some absolute statement, or something that required an explicit hedge. Perhaps I need to be more absolute in my non absolutism, hedging at every possible inflection point. In which case I should have said something like:
"I might be wrong, but it seems to me like many younger people and foolish people tend to make these statements that (to me, anyway) seem sweeping and dramatic when they're on Twitter and other social media sites without an expectation of any real conseqeunces. Keep in mind, this is just an anectodal observation."
But, I get it. This is the internet. You can't declare that you're all about hedging in one sentence, and then immediately follow up it up with some broad generalization about "young people and idiots" that isn't properly hedged and expect to not have it be pointed out. That was sloppy.
"I have decided that visiting my grandmother under these oppressive conditions stands against everything I believe in--fighting against racism, oppression & injustice"
"Plus, she's always trying to set me up with Aziz Haddad. I don't care if the Haddads are old family friends and Aziz owns an olive grove, I'm not interested. I have my own life and I'm doing just fine, alhamdulillah. But I will miss Taata's backlava...."
I discovered a new word in the email to “Blue Stalwarts”. Rolcon is the practice of playing the role of a conservative while you toss out the Media Matters talking points on Twitter or in blog comments. Hmmm... Does that sound like anyone you know?
Amadeus: "Rolcon is the practice of playing the role of a conservative while you toss out the Media Matters talking points on Twitter or in blog comments."
Indeed. We find every non-leftist blog (those are the only ones that allow republican/conservative commenters) has a number of these RolCon types, many if not most of whom are part of coordinated dem/left operations, like the ones lefty billionaire Reid Hoffman admitted to running.
However, nothing says VichyCon more than a supposed "conservative" who performs these same pro-dem/left tasks of their own volition.
The people who elected her look like idiots.
Omar’s district has lots of Jews - which is why she said she was against the BDS movement - till she got elected. I expect a strong challenge in the dem primary next year Two years about 10 too many
Babylon Bee headline concerning story on you-know-who:
Women Who Don't Believe Israel Has Right To Exist Not Sure Why They Got Banned From Israel
https://babylonbee.com/news/women-who-dont-believe-israel-has-right-to-exist-not-sure-why-they-got-banned-from-israel
Roughcoat: "Babylon Bee headline concerning story on you-know-who:"
Steady now.
Quoting the Babylon Bee to call out far left marxist anti-semites is very very triggering for our LLR and #StrongTlaib&OmarDefender Chuck.
Drago:
I know, I know. But it's a risk worth taking, I think.
Waiting for Farmer or Howard to assert that they never said Israel doesn't have a right to exist in 5 ... 4 ... 3 ... seconds.
Okay Roughcoat.
But I warn you, "Sheila Jackson Lee"-"republican" Chuck often tends to shift his focus and vitriol to the children of conservatives with whom he disagrees.
Politics before grandma. Politics before American citizens, asylum seekers, and emigration reform. We're not that green.
She just wanted to push grandma over a cliff...
@Skippy Tisdale:
WTF does that even mean?????
A person criticizes black culture. SJW responds, "You racist." A person criticizes feminism. SJW responds, "You sexist." A person criticizes the gay lobby. SJW responds, "You homophobe." A person criticizes immigration policy. SJW responds, "You xenophobe." Someone says that a man in a dress taking hormones is not a woman. SJW responds, "You transphobe."
Responding to criticisms of Israel or Israeli policies by calling people antisemites is right out of the SJW playbook. That's what the fuck I mean.
@Static Ping:
J. Farmer, I can appreciate that the Israel-Palestine debate can be one of the feelings over reason subjects. However, there is literally no question that Omar and Tlaib are (a) both vocal anti-Semites, (b) both supporters of boycotting Israel, and (c) both do not have Israel's best interests, by any reasonable definition, at heart. While the word "enemy" should not be used lightly, it is foolish to not apply it when it is obvious.
a) what are some examples of this "vocal" anti-semitism?
b) I don't participate in BDS but people are quite free to do so if they wish.
c) I don't expect American politicians to have the "best interests...at heart" of a foreign country.
’I think Democrats will look weak if they don’t impeach the motherfucker.’
Didn’t you vote for the ‘motherfucker’?
Farmer: "Responding to criticisms of Israel or Israeli policies by calling people antisemites is right out of the SJW playbook."
If LLR Chuck-approved Tlaib and Omar are not anti-semites than there is no such thing as anti-semitism.
@Bay Area Guy:
I actually do wanna hear your viewpoints on this. I don't feel that Israel is beyond criticism.
My position is rather simple. I'm a nationalist, and I believe in national self-determination inside of sovereign borders. I support it for the Israelis, and I support it for the Palestinians. I do not support the Israeli occupation. But regardless of my personal opinions, I do not support the US being involved at all in this process, and I think we should stay out of the conflict. I also support ending all military aid to foreign countries, including Egypt and Israel.
Beasts (to LLR Chuck): "Didn’t you vote for the ‘motherfucker’?"
There is zero evidence to even suggest that he did and mountains of evidence that he did not.
@Drago:
If LLR Chuck-approved Tlaib and Omar are not anti-semites than there is no such thing as anti-semitism.
In that case, there must be copious evidence for this anti-semitism. Present some.
And of course, I'm much more interested in if what someone says is true or fale, logical or illogical. Two plus two equals four even if an anti-Semite says it.
@Roughcoat:
Waiting for Farmer or Howard to assert that they never said Israel doesn't have a right to exist in 5 ... 4 ... 3 ... seconds.
I think "right to exist" is a moronic phrase, and I never use it. No country has a right to exist. Countries have a right to defend themselves.
Bay Area Guy said: "Chuck -- put down the Gin bottle! It's still only lunch time:)"
Gin: It's Not Just For Breakfast Anymore.
Hey, it's 7 AM somewhere, right?
Separately, I liked the Fever Tree. Bought a case. Hat tip to the Chuckster for that.
J farmer. Don’t play dumb. Given your extreme interest in the topic surely you have read Omar’s antisemetic tweets? like israel hypnotizing the world. And American Jews aren’t loyal Americans. ... If not then your opinion isn’t worth much.
@steve uhr:
J farmer. Don’t play dumb. Given your extreme interest in the topic surely you have read Omar’s antisemetic tweets? like israel hypnotizing the world. And American Jews aren’t loyal Americans. ... If not then your opinion isn’t worth much.
First, I don't have an "extreme interest in the topic." Second, as I've said, I don't consider criticism of Israel to be anti-Semitic. You'll have to provide a source for the quote about "American Jews aren't loyal Americans." Third, to increase my vulnerability further, I don't really care if someone is racist, sexist, homophobic, anti-Semitic, blah blah blah. It's the argument that matter, not why someone is making the argument.
When I said "they" I was referring to Tlaib and Omar, not you, Farmer.
Farmer IS playing dumb. Either that, or ...
"Tlaib Bumbles Into Revealing Her Undeniable Priority: Bigoted Anti-Israel Propaganda"
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/guybenson/2019/08/16/tlaibs-bigotry-and-idiocy-reveals-her-true-intentions-n2551810
It’s useful to understand motives when evaluating an argument and the “facts” put forth in support of the argument, and the facts omitted.
It doesn’t take a genius to disguise antismetism as anti-Israel. Nor does it take a genius to figure out what’s really going on.
@Roughcoat:
Farmer IS playing dumb. Either that, or ...
To quote my first comment to this post: "Reasoned debate about the US-Israel relationship is nearly impossible in modern America so I don’t really bother anymore. It’s pretty much a matter of faith for most people."
Thank you for illustrating my point.
@Steve uhr:
It’s useful to understand motives when evaluating an argument and the “facts” put forth in support of the argument, and the facts omitted.
Facts are true or not regardless of who put them forth. If someone left out important context, that's part of a counterargument. The motives' make no difference. That's the essence of the ad hominem fallacy. Attack the argument, not the person.
Islamic Terrorism: The Group Sponsoring Tlaib and Omar's Trip Celebrates Suicide Bombings, the Murder of Israeli Children
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2019/08/16/surpise-the-group-sponsoring-tlaib-and-omars-trip-to-israel-is-tied-to-islamic-terrorism-n2551824
Have they crossed the threshold of antisemitism yet?
To quote my first comment to this post: "Reasoned debate about the US-Israel relationship is nearly impossible in modern America so I don’t really bother anymore.
And yet you're bothering now.
Your approach is fine if you have unlimited time to understand an issue. I like to know upfront whether I’m dealing with an honest broker or not.
I believe HE believes he's an honest broker. I'll say that much for him.
"But it is sad that she won't go visit her elderly grandmother because of politics."
If there is a grandmother.
@roughcoat:
And yet you're bothering now.
And am quickly reminded why it’s so futile.
Farmer speaks!
My position is rather simple. I'm a nationalist, and I believe in national self-determination inside of sovereign borders. I support it for the Israelis, and I support it for the Palestinians. I do not support the Israeli occupation. But regardless of my personal opinions, I do not support the US being involved at all in this process, and I think we should stay out of the conflict. I also support ending all military aid to foreign countries, including Egypt and Israel.
This ain't a bad GENERAL proposition. But it's kinda thin gruel when applied to the real world of the Middle East. But I'll play along slowly.
You write: "I'm a nationalist, and I believe in national self-determination inside of sovereign borders. I support it for the Israelis, and I support it for the Palestinians."
Great. And what is that country supposed to do, when 3 surrounding countries invade its sovereign borders with tanks and planes? (See, 1967 Arab war against Israel).
And am quickly reminded why it’s so futile.
So then shut up, already. Be true to your word: stop bothering.
"One problem with the Pat Buchanan conservatives is anti-Semitism. Israel has been a good ally in many ways that are not even public."
Pat Buchanan? He was kicked off TV & the MSM about 5 years ago - at least.
As for Israel, they owe us 100x times more then we owe them. I have no objection to our allying ourselves with them, or giving them $billions for defense. I just see no reason to pander and go overboard about it. Like when Congressmen cry with tears of joy at seeing Bibi or the Israeli flag. Of course, maybe those "tears of joy" are really about the Big Donors $$$.
Two plus two equals four even if an anti-Semite says it.
That’s undoubtedly true.
But the question was whether Omar has said things that demonstrate that she is an anti-Semite, and by her own admission, she has. That doesn’t mean that she’s wrong about everything, either. But it demonstrates her bad faith.
There’s lots to criticize about Israel, this decision was probably dumb, and it was definitely made in an even more dumb manner.
But I think requiring someone to sign an affidavit affirming their anti-Semitism, rather than using common sense when looking at their commentary about Jews controlling (or “hypnotizing”, in this case) the world, isn’t a particularly useful approach to identifying anti-Semitism.
Or is your concept of not bothering anymore more like Dr. Venkman's "it's more of a guideline than a rule"?
PN2: "But I think requiring someone to sign an affidavit affirming their anti-Semitism, rather than using common sense when looking at their commentary about Jews controlling (or “hypnotizing”, in
this case) the world, isn’t a particularly useful approach to identifying anti-Semitism."
On the contrary, its absolutely the best approach imaginable if your objective is to make it impossible to categorize anyone as an anti-semite.
Farmer: "I support it for the Israelis, and I support it for the Palestinians."
There is no such thing as a "palestinian" people. That was launched as a PR poitical tool by the Arabs in the 1960's.
Israel is an ally of the US, and like any other ally, is a sovereign nation whose interests do not always coincide with ours, and vice versa. No big news there I trust.
If anything, from what I know at least, Israel is a better-than-average ally of the US, especially compared to such shining stars as France and Germany.
Just the same, I can't help but notice that for reasons I haven't figured out, some people on the Left and on the Right (just read The Unz Report some time) seem to suffer from what Derb calls "The Jew Thing". This Thing manifests itself in (among other ways) what appears to be an excessive degree of suspicion over what Israel, or American Jews, are "up to" for want of a better way of putting it. Particularly as compared to the suspicion that many hold over say, the Chinese, who make very little effort to conceal their comprehensively anti-US agenda. The contrast there seems striking to me.
Naturally, Muslims and the American black race-baiters take the Jew Thing to an extreme, but we have to consider the source there before giving too much weight to it.
Is it because the Jews are survivors, with a strong ethnic self-identity and lack of any need for approval from others? Their annoying habit of being an SD or two higher in IQ than whites in general, with concomitant outsize positive contributions to Western Civilization compared to their numbers? Is it the hats?
I am honestly baffled. As a lifetime, card-carrying goyische misanthropist, I never have been able to comprehend this widespread dislike and suspicion of Jews and all things Jewish (except sometimes pickles and rye bread). I welcome any insight others may have here.
I find an obsession with Israel among Non-jewish Americans very odd. Maybe they should care more about Ireland. At least they have good music and pubs.
As a lifetime, card-carrying goyische misanthropist, I never have been able to comprehend this widespread dislike and suspicion of Jews and all things Jewish (except sometimes pickles and rye bread). I welcome any insight others may have here.
Rye bread is just something we picked up in Eastern Europe. Pickles may owe something to religious law.
But the bottom line is that people are tribal and suspicious of “others”, and Jews have a long and global history of being the other.
I just want to say that Israel is the greatest country in the world ever, ever. And Jews are absolutely fabulous, and I really, really, hate Nazis. Oh, and the Holocaust should NEVER happen again.
Thank You!
Sorry, I forgot to say...I hate Hitler. He was one bad dude.
’Maybe they should care more about Ireland.’
Yeah, but have you ever been to an Irish deli? 😜
If Omar and Tlaib are banned from all the countries they hate, they're gonna have to serve out their terms in the Canadian parliament or something.
I am honestly baffled. As a lifetime, card-carrying goyische misanthropist, I never have been able to comprehend this widespread dislike and suspicion of Jews and all things Jewish (except sometimes pickles and rye bread). I welcome any insight others may have here.
My step father hated jews. Of course , he pretty much hated everybody.
Personally, I have been wondering lately why I have never felt any aversion. I think Farmer got me questioning that. Anyway, for me, I think seeing a bunch of pictures as a kid in some WW2 books of the bodies stacked up and the skin and bones prisoners made a life long impression. Add in movies like Exodus and Schindlers list and I have been brain washed for life.
"I am honestly baffled. As a lifetime, card-carrying goyische misanthropist, I never have been able to comprehend this widespread dislike and suspicion of Jews and all things Jewish (except sometimes pickles and rye bread). I welcome any insight others may have here."
It's not so complicated. I can't speak to the sort of anti-semitism that hates Jews because they're Jews. But it is certainly not difficult to see how a patriotic American could be deeply suspicious about what American Jews, particularly secular American Jews, have in mind for America. American Jews have wealth and influence vastly disproportionate to their numbers, and they mostly use them in the service of Progressivism. The Jews want Israel to be a Jewish nation, but they don't want America to be a Christian nation. At least they aren't Muzzies.
Hawkeye: "If Omar and Tlaib are banned from all the countries they hate, they're gonna have to serve out their terms in the Canadian parliament or something."
Nonsense. As seen earlier on this thread, there is a significant number of LLR's who will bend over backwards to obfuscate and deflect for these far left anti-semites.
Of course, maybe those "tears of joy" are really about the Big Donors $$$.
Best I can tell, there have been no Israeli terror attacks here,
I don't know the balance of payments. Maybe you do. I do know that we don't get much for our billions to China or Germany, or even UK lately. I know about Stuxnet and there are probably other things I don't know that are positive.
I guess you prefer 84 IQ Arabs to 125 IQ Israelis.
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But it is certainly not difficult to see how a patriotic American could be deeply suspicious about what American Jews, particularly secular American Jews, have in mind for America. American Jews have wealth and influence vastly disproportionate to their numbers, and they mostly use them in the service of Progressivism. The Jews want Israel to be a Jewish nation, but they don't want America to be a Christian nation. At least they aren't Muzzies.
Secular progressive Jews have the same political ambitions for Israel as they do for America.
But to your first point - suspect away. It’s a free country, both for the misguided progressives and their opponents.
In related news, her bestie's congressional district was rated the worst district for black Americans to live.
"To determine the 30 worst congressional districts for black Americans, 24/7 Wall St. created an index consisting of six measures to assess race-based gaps in socioeconomic outcomes in each of the nation’s congressional districts. Creating the index in this way ensured that districts were ranked on the differences between black and white residents and not on absolute levels of socioeconomic development."
So I wouldn't take that ranking very seriously. It's more like a measure of jealousy rather than wellbeing.
@Drago:
There is no such thing as a "palestinian" people. That was launched as a PR poitical tool by the Arabs in the 1960's.
I don't really care about semantics or nomenclature. Call them whatever you like. The point is that between Gaza and the West Bank, there are nearly 5 million stateless people whose fate is controlled by a country they have no democratic say. This is a feature, not a bug. Israel cannot annex the land, because then the population would become Israeli citizens and would demographically put an end to Israel as a Jewish state.
@Roughcoat:
So then shut up, already. Be true to your word: stop bothering.
With you, gladly.
@Bay Area Guy:
Great. And what is that country supposed to do, when 3 surrounding countries invade its sovereign borders with tanks and planes? (See, 1967 Arab war against Israel).
Israel has signed peace treaties with two out of those three countries, Jordan and Egypt.
"Secular progressive Jews have the same political ambitions for Israel as they do for America."
I suppose that is possible. My impression is that many secular Jews in the US are in favor of opening America's borders, but not Israel's.
I don't think Jews are particularly good judges of anti-Semitism. I submit the Rosenbergs who cheerfully gave up their lives in order that Stalin might prosper. I think this was a year or two before he plotted the mass pogrom, but he certainly had a proven record of anti Semitic acts. Nowadays we see all these Jewish Democrat members of congress denouncing Trump and supporting the Squad. Get a clue, assholes.
@Pookie:
But I think requiring someone to sign an affidavit affirming their anti-Semitism, rather than using common sense when looking at their commentary about Jews controlling (or “hypnotizing”, in this case) the world, isn’t a particularly useful approach to identifying anti-Semitism.
The tweet was about Israel hypnotizing the world, not "Jews." The insinuation that criticism of Israel (valid or invalid) is anti-Semitic is rather silly. I criticize Saudi Arabia all the time, and yet no one ever jumps to the conclusion that my criticisms must be motivated by anti-Arab sentiment.
But let me give you a thought experiment. Suppose two people make an identical criticism of Israel. You can know for a certainty that one person is anti-Semitic and the other is not. How would this information change how you responded to that criticism?
Israel cannot annex the land, because then the population would become Israeli citizens and would demographically put an end to Israel as a Jewish state.
I thought that you were smarter than this, Farmer. Bush convinced Sharon to evacuate Gaza as part of an attempt at reconciliation.
Obama , of course, disavowed the whole thing and we have Hamas shooting rockets from schools and hospitals,.
@Farmer:
Me: Great. "And what is that country supposed to do, when 3 surrounding countries invade its sovereign borders with tanks and planes? (See, 1967 Arab war against Israel)."
Farmer: "Israel has signed peace treaties with two out of those three countries, Jordan and Egypt."
Non-responsive. Those treaties were signed 10+ years after the 67' invasion by the Arab states, with another invasion in '73.
I will be more precise: In 1967, What was the proper response by Israel in 1967 when 3 surrounding Arab nations declared war on Israel and invaded and/or prepared to invade her sovereign borders with tanks and planes?
Same question for 1973 Yom Kippur War.
@Michael K:
I thought that you were smarter than this, Farmer. Bush convinced Sharon to evacuate Gaza as part of an attempt at reconciliation.
Bush did not "convince Sharon to evacuate Gaza" and Sharon did not support the Gaza evacuation as "an attempt at reconciliation." Demographics were the primary concern.
@Bay Area Guy:
I will be more precise: In 1967, What was the proper response by Israel in 1967 when 3 surrounding Arab nations declared war on Israel and invaded and/or prepared to invade her sovereign borders with tanks and planes?
I doubt very much that you and I would agree on the historiography of the Six Day War, and I have no desire to open that can of worms. But even if I accept your version of events, that still would not give Israel the right to annex West Bank territory and move its civilian population into the area. But again, what do I think the US should do about the settlements? Nothing. What do I think the US should do about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict? Nothing.
Farmer: "You can know for a certainty that one person is anti-Semitic and the other is not."
Thats quite a hypothetical considering its apparently impossible to identify any anti-semitic people anywhere.
Howard said...
Blogger J. Farmer said... It is just Jew hate.
Once again demonstrating that conservatives turn into SJW’s whenever the subject of Israel comes up.
That's a perfect observation.
8/16/19, 11:18 AM
No, it's a dumb one. Farmer can be very sensible, but he has a blind spot when it comes to Israel.
Miftah, the group who organized Tlaib's visit, is a vile Jew-hating organization. They support suicide bombers and repeat the ancient blood libel - the accusation that Jews kill non-Jewish children and use their blood to make matzoh.
Howard, Tlaib said "There’s always kind of a calming feeling I tell folks when I think of the Holocaust."
Nice of you to champion her. You leftists call everyone Nazis but people who actually talk like Nazis.
Farmer: "I don't really care about semantics or nomenclature."
You have adopted the historically inaccurate description of the Arabs....which just so happens to align with the Arabs political objectives.
Who didnt see that coming?
The point is that between Gaza and the West Bank, there are nearly 5 million stateless people whose fate is controlled by a country they have no democratic say.
Easy peasy. Kick 'em out!
Transfer Is The Answer.
William said...
I don't think Jews are particularly good judges of anti-Semitism. I submit the Rosenbergs who cheerfully gave up their lives in order that Stalin might prosper. I think this was a year or two before he plotted the mass pogrom, but he certainly had a proven record of anti Semitic acts. Nowadays we see all these Jewish Democrat members of congress denouncing Trump and supporting the Squad. Get a clue, assholes.
8/16/19, 7:01 PM
They really aren't. I'm astonished to hear Jews defend Tlaib. Leftist Jews hate Trump so much they defend someone who supports murdering Jews. They're also eager to be more PC than thou.
rcocean said...
I find an obsession with Israel among Non-jewish Americans very odd. Maybe they should care more about Ireland. At least they have good music and pubs.
8/16/19, 5:02 PM
Tel Aviv has great bars. And it doesn't rain every 5 minutes there.
@Drago:
Thats quite a hypothetical considering its apparently impossible to identify any anti-semitic people anywhere.
Congrats on attacking an argument nobody has made. There are obvious examples of anti-Semitism. Anti-Jewish pogroms, for one, Nuremberg Laws, for another. Considering Jews, as a whole, a malignant influence who are somehow less than human. All examples of anti-Semitism. Criticizing Israel is not one of them.
You have adopted the historically inaccurate description of the Arabs....which just so happens to align with the Arabs political objectives.
Who didnt see that coming?
"If the Israelis and the Palestinians want one state, that's OK with me. If they want two-state, that's OK with me. I'm happy if they're happy."
-Donald Trump, adopting "the historically inaccurate description of the Arabs....which just so happens to align with the Arabs political objectives. Who didn't see that coming?"
Thanks to folks for their thoughts.
To me, Progressives are Progressives. Nobody talks about Mexican, or Italian, or WASP Progs as such. Of course they are anti-American, that's what Progressives are. They are so much smarter than our Founders were. And to be fair, as the saying goes, the Jews earn like Episcopalians and vote like Puerto Ricans. I'll grant there's some truth in that, and it's quite a mystery in itself. But on balance, the Jew Thing is still a puzzle to me. I will continue to ponder it.
Regarding the Irish (from whom I am descended, God help me), they sat out WWII and basically denied the British a pretty good strategic base as the Germans were sending U-boats out blowing up anything that floated. As Churchill tells it, anyway. So while I love the music, and the style of speech, and so on, they've got their issues.
@exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil:
No, it's a dumb one. Farmer can be very sensible, but he has a blind spot when it comes to Israel.
I have no blindspot when it comes to Israel. I'm for treating it like a normal country, not elevating it to some special status among the society of nations.
@Nichevo:
Easy peasy. Kick 'em out!
Transfer Is The Answer.
So if transfer is the answer, what was wrong with other countries choosing to expel European Jews from their homeland as a solution to a political problem? Thank you for demonstrating what a morally sick person you are.
" I'm for treating it like a normal country"
I think Israelis would love to live in a normal country. As it is, they are sitting on a potato chip sized sliver of land surrounded by hostile countries who want to finish what Hitler started. Oh, and they have to deal with suicide bombers who blow up buses, restaurants, and hospitals. Israel isn't a normal country because Israel's enemies won't let it be one.
Candid farmer is best farmer.
Transfer Is The Answer.
So if transfer is the answer, what was wrong with other countries choosing to expel European Jews from their homeland as a solution to a political problem? Thank you for demonstrating what a morally sick person you are.
Wow, nurse Ratchet appears. How about the Sudetan Germans and the East Prussians? They should have taught you that starting a war and losing it affects your moral credit when refugees are concerned. The Arabs chose to use the Palestinians as ciphers in the Jew Arab struggles.
@exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil:
I think Israelis would love to live in a normal country.
They do live in a normal country, within their internationally recognized border. The Gaza and the West Bank are not their country. And Israel has signed peace treaties with Egypt and Jordan.
@Michael K:
Wow, nurse Ratchet appears
Yes, I think forcibly expelling people from their homeland as an act of collective punishment because they present a political problem to you is morally sick. Others disagree.
Well the arabs could have integrated their brethren into their society, jordan lebanon ey al, but they dont
"So if transfer is the answer, what was wrong with other countries choosing to expel European Jews from their homeland as a solution to a political problem?"
Hey, look, it's Dumbo! Uh, Inga, pray tell, what "political problem" did the European Jews create? Those 6 million Jews weren't suicide bombers or terrorists, they posed no threat to Germany at all. In fact, many German Jews were so tragically patriotic they refused to believe their nation would turn on them. The Jews were murdered because of the delusional belief that Germans were a Master Race and Jews (and Slavs) were subhumans with no right to live.
The Palestinians pose a very real threat to Israel. And the Palestinians say openly that they want the Jews driven into the sea. I doubt you know that there was actually a Palestinian SS unit. Perhaps you should try reading some history before airing your ignorant opinions.
because they present a political problem to you is morally sick. Others disagree.
"political problem?" How about if they want to kill you and, in spite of a wall, they spend millions that could feed their children building tunnels to kill you all? The last time that happened it was the Maginot Line and it didn't work. Bad analogy.
@narciso:
Well the arabs could have integrated their brethren into their society, jordan lebanon ey al, but they dont,
Right, how dare the populations of the Gaza and the West Bank not abandon their homelands to make room for refugees from a European war.
They cleansed the jews out of iraq by 55, yemen by 67, ethiopia well you get the idea.
@Michael K:
"They" want to kill you? That's an argument for collective punishment. Occupying forces always face resistance from the people they are occupying. American and European Jews made the decision to move to Palestine en masse for the purpose of establishing a Jewish state. It's a political project known as Zionism. If they now find themselves living in a dangerous neighborhood, that's their problem.
@narciso:
They cleansed the jews out of iraq by 55, yemen by 67, ethiopia well you get the idea.
So two wrongs make a right? If you support expulsions of populations by states, then why complain about Iraq, Yemen, or Ethiopia doing it?
No thats just tbe stone cold reality, farmer, its always been a tough neighborhoof.
narciso:
No thats just tbe stone cold reality, farmer, its always been a tough neighborhoof.
Then what was your point? I say that expulsion is not morally tenable and then you bring up some other expulsions. Guess what? I think they're morally untenable as well.
So if transfer is the answer, what was wrong with other countries choosing to expel European Jews from their homeland as a solution to a political problem? Thank you for demonstrating what a morally sick person you are.
The moral outrage shtick isn't a good look for you either. It's a good laugh though. If all that Hitler had done was to expel Jews from Germany, nobody would remember his name. But like I said, you don't believe the things that you say.
American and European Jews made the decision to move to Palestine en masse for the purpose of establishing a Jewish state.
So, you agree that the area now called Israel was Judenrein before 1948? Good to see you declare yourself.
If all that Hitler had done was to expel Jews from Germany, nobody would remember his name.
8/16/19, 9:17 PM
Good catch. Yeah, Inga, Hitler "expelled" the Jews of Germany. Through chimneys.
There is nothing I could say here that hasn't already been said above, and I'm not going to go back and read the whole thread.
So may I just say (and I'm about to) "Professor Althouse, you run a fine blog here. I especially like that fact that if I close my eyes on a given day, I'm not quite sure if you are a LIBERAL or a CONSERVATIVE. So are you the golden mean, or......."
@nichevo:
The moral outrage shtick isn't a good look for you either
Your morally degenerate shtick is even worse.
If all that Hitler had done was to expel Jews from Germany, nobody would remember his name.
I wasn't referring to Hitler. I was referring to he history of expelling Jews from European countries. See, for example, the Edict of Expulsion, the Allhambra Decree, the Caeca et Obdurata, and (though it wasn't European) Grant's General Order #11.
But like I said, you don't believe the things that you say.
I believe everything I say. I have no desire or motive to make up what I think to anonymous Internet blog commentators. But here's the thing, even if I believed nothing I said, it would make no difference to whether or not what I said was right or wrong, valid or invalid. That's basic logic.
Michael K:
So, you agree that the area now called Israel was Judenrein before 1948? Good to see you declare yourself.
I would expect a man of your age and education to be capable of reasoned argument. That all you can do is hurl invective is childish. And pathetic.
Approx 25% of the population of what is now Israel (including the West Bank) in 1939 were jews who had suffered repeated pogroms at the hands of the Arabs for hundreds of years.
However, since no one called that a holocaust and the "rules" around these anti-jewish pogroms were not called "Nuremburg Laws" its all good.
Plus we get to pretend that all the jews in Israel just got there!
Farmer suggests the Israeli's adopt a national suicidal posture in terms of geography and policy. Anything less is unjust.
Something tells me such ahistorical virtue signalling will continue to fall on deaf ears.
all you can do is hurl invective is childish. And pathetic.
Creative use of "invective." Good to see you declaring yourself. Not all antiSemitism is left wing,.
@Drago:
Approx 25% of the population of what is now Israel (including the West Bank) in 1939 were jews who had suffered repeated pogroms at the hands of the Arabs for hundreds of years.
What is your source for this claim? The majority of the population that moved to Israel were refugees first from the Russian Empire and second from the Holocaust. The Jewish population in 1920 was around 80,000. By the late 1940s, it was over 600,000. That's an almost 800% increase in the population.
For a detailed discussion of the matter, see Demography in Israel/Palestine:Trends, Prospects, Policy Implications
@Michael K:
Creative use of "invective." Good to see you declaring yourself. Not all antiSemitism is left wing,.
Blah blah blah...anti-Semitism...blah blah blah. Thanks for proving my point, Mike.
@Drago:
Farmer suggests the Israeli's adopt a national suicidal posture in terms of geography and policy. Anything less is unjust.
Right, civilian settlements in places like Hebron are designed to protect Israel from destruction. And I don't suggest Israel do anything. As I've said repeatedly, I think we should stay out of the conflict. But you know who else has a lot of criticisms of Israeli policies in this regard? Israeli Jews. I guess they need you and the Doc to go over there and explain their national and security interests to them.
And what could have driven that much settlement, six letters atarts with an h, also remenber the hebron massacre of 29.
The moral outrage shtick isn't a good look for you either
Your morally degenerate shtick is even worse.
I get it. You are the moral degenerate and because you don't like this truth you need to maneuver around to where you can call other people morally degenerate. So, now you have. Do you feel better? I hope so, but, as you have said to many other people, I don't care what you think of me.
If all that Hitler had done was to expel Jews from Germany, nobody would remember his name.
I wasn't referring to Hitler. I was referring to he history of expelling Jews from European countries. See, for example, the Edict of Expulsion, the Allhambra Decree, the Caeca et Obdurata, and (though it wasn't European) Grant's General Order #11.
That's what I mean. We're used to it. It's not that big a deal. Generally speaking the expelling countries suffered for our absence. Would Israel suffer from the absence of Arabs? What do you think?
But like I said, you don't believe the things that you say.
I believe everything I say. I have no desire or motive to make up what I think to anonymous Internet blog commentators. But here's the thing, even if I believed nothing I said, it would make no difference to whether or not what I said was right or wrong, valid or invalid. That's basic logic.
Well, your views on my moral degeneracy make no difference to whether or not transfer or exile would solve the problem.
But you know who else has a lot of criticisms of Israeli policies in this regard? Israeli Jews.
You know who thinks the United States should have open borders and let all your friends from down south in? Probably those particular Israeli Jews.
@narciso:
And what could have driven that much settlement, six letters atarts with an h
Read what I wrote three comments above your own: "The majority of the population that moved to Israel were refugees first from the Russian Empire and second from the Holocaust."
Tlaib. Meh. Photo-op-chasing, headline-hunting, YouTube-yammering sometime-socialist.
@Nichevo:
I hope so, but, as you have said to many other people, I don't care what you think of me.
I've never asked you to care. And I don't consider opposition to mass ethnic cleansing to be moral preening.
Well, your views on my moral degeneracy make no difference to whether or not transfer or exile would solve the problem.
Rounding up African-Americans and expelling them would reduce social ills in the United States, too. But I don't support that, because I don't believe the ends justify the means.
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