Said Chase Iron Eyes, an attorney with the Lakota People’s Law Project, quoted in "'It was getting ugly': Native American drummer speaks on the MAGA-hat-wearing teens who surrounded him" (WaPo).
I am touched by the charity of "They were rambunctious."
But I'm only guessing at what the video sounds like. I cannot bring myself to play it.
[A] Native American man steadily beats his drum at the tail end of Friday’s Indigenous Peoples March while singing a song of unity urging them to “be strong” in the face of the ravages of colonialism that now include police brutality, poor access to health care and the ill effects of climate change on reservations.The phrase "man in the middle" resonates with me. I will never forget the day — at the rambunctious Wisconsin protests — when Meade encountered The Man in the Middle:
Surrounding him are a throng of young, mostly white teenage boys, several wearing “Make America Great Again” caps, with one who stood about a foot from the drummer’s face also wearing a relentless smirk.
Nathan Phillips, a veteran in the indigenous rights movement, was that man in the middle....
[O]ne man — who did not agree with the protesters — decided he would occupy the central spot. To the consternation of the others, he invited people to come talk to him one-on-one....Video at the link.
I started to imagine Wisconsinites coming back to the building every day, talking about everything, on and on, indefinitely into the future. That man who decided to hold dialogues in the center of the rotunda is a courageous man. But it isn't that hard to be as courageous as he was. In the long run, it's easier to do that than to spend your life intimidated and repressed. That man was showing us how to be free. He was there today, but you — and you and you! — could be there tomorrow, standing your ground, inviting people to talk to you, listening and going back and forth, for the sheer demonstration of the power of human dialogue and the preservation of freedom.
Looking for posts about that man in the middle, I see that in 2013 I wrote about the phrase "man in the middle" as it appears in "Atlas Shrugged." Ayn Rand wrote:
There are two sides to every issue: one side is right and the other is wrong, but the middle is always evil. The man who is wrong still retains some respect for truth, if only by accepting the responsibility of choice. But the man in the middle is the knave who blanks out the truth in order to pretend that no choice or values exist, who is willing to sit out the course of any battle, willing to cash in on the blood of the innocent or to crawl on his belly to the guilty, who dispenses justice by condemning both the robber and the robbed to jail, who solves conflicts by ordering the thinker and the fool to meet each other halfway. In any compromise between food and poison, it is only death that can win. In any compromise between good and evil, it is only evil that can profit. In that transfusion of blood which drains the good to feed the evil, the compromiser is the transmitting rubber tube.I said:
Is this cranking you up? It doesn't work on me. I think moderation is a virtue, but in this imagery, virtue is blood, evil is poison, and moderation is a tube. You're supposed to feel this as a flashy display of reason, but it's full of emotional bluster and heavily reliant on metaphor. I'm being asked to regard myself as a rubber tube. No....I was talking about that Ayn Rand passage because Ted Cruz read it — along with "Green Eggs and Ham" — out loud while filibustering in the Senate. The phrase "the man in the middle" grabbed me, and I wrote:
I'm not accepting this picture of life in terms of people with good blood and people with bad blood and everyone else as a bunch of tubes conducting a big old transfusion that's just got to stop....
"Man in the middle" is a phrase that feels like a call to action, because it's a phrase Meade and I have used when we talk about a man we saw as a hero for sitting down in the middle of the Wisconsin Capitol rotunda, in a crowd of sign-carrying, noisy partisan protesters, inviting them to speak, one-on-one, with someone who was not in agreement with the crowd....
Talking, indefinitely into the future... in the middle of a government building. That's what Ted Cruz is doing, but not in the moderate, surely-we-all-can-get-along mode. He's on one side, and he's reviling anyone in the middle. He's reading from Ayn Rand, saying that the moderate is evil, because the moderate is the knave who blanks out the truth in order to pretend that no choice or values exist.
In any compromise between food and poison, it is only death that can win. Oh? But would you like it it in a box? Would you like it with a fox? Would you like it in a house? Would you like it with a mouse?
UPDATE: I still haven't watched the video, but I have watched Scott Adams's strong apology for portraying the Catholic schoolboys in a negative light, and Adams describes the extended video in detail. So check out my new post, which includes quotes from Adams's description.
Posts
164 comments:
Steve Sailer reports that the Native American is a professional offense taker.
He's pulled this stunt before for a compliant press.
Tell us about natives' access to health care before the ravages of colonialism.
Lucky Pierre is in the middle again.
Several videos show the Native American man instigating the confrontation. I figured as much when I saw that a Dem Congresswoman had condemned the boys out of hand. Why look for the truth, when something has propaganda value.
Fake news !
"It was an aggressive display of physicality. They were rambunctious and trying to instigate a conflict.
Did they hit him with a bike lock?
What I saw was this group of students do this "C-C-S! rah rah thing and the Indian walked up to them. Why did he approach them like that? Are they supposed to go all quiet and gooey because he's a Native American?
“Middle” as in “Man in the middle” implies a bipolar world.
Now the world may be bipolar in the psychological sense but not in the political sense.
Middle implies perspective. Who’s perspective?
You should watch the video. It's fairly non-confrontational. And he engaged them.
https://cloverchronicle.com/2019/01/19/exclusive-new-video-emerges-showing-what-really-happened-during-the-so-called-confrontation-between-a-maga-hat-wearing-student-and-native-american-drummer/
The Congresswoman who denounced the kids was Debbie Haaland, btw, who is herself Native-American. She wouldn't be in any way biased, would she?
It's kind of hijacking this post to do a defense of the boys. I didn't attack or defend them and I won't watch the video. I am trying to start a very different conversation. I do see this in the WaPo article:
"School officials and the Roman Catholic Diocese of Covington released a joint statement Saturday. “We condemn the actions of the Covington Catholic High School students towards Nathan Phillips specifically, and Native Americans in general,” the statement said. “The matter is being investigated and we will take appropriate action, up to and including expulsion.”"
I disapprove of the use of children in politics and I don't accept viral video that begins after something has already happened. The starting point is either manipulative (even when it's not intentionally chosen for effect).
I thought it was important that the lawyer was charitable and I wanted to highlight that. I also see Nathan Phillips as a possible "man in the middle" figure, and I am interested in this role.
Two additional comments after watching the video and reading the article:
- he doesn’t appear to be “in the middle” but appears to be face to face with the teens
- can someone please tell me how indigenous rights or “the wall” are related to the March for Life. (Where is the “middle” between those two issues?)
PS Wouldn’t someone supporting Indigenous People’s favor a wall?
Repost
Depressing video of punks wearing maga hats harassing native Americans
That one kid was an asshole, but that "elder" is a superstitious activist clown who wasn't in Viet Nam and who recites self-serving lies and probably deserves to be harassed:
"While I was there singing, I heard them saying ‘Build that wall! Build that wall!’, you know... this is indigenous land! ...were not supposed to have walls here, we never did—for millennium. Before anybody else came here we never had walls. We never had a prison. We always took care of our elders, we took care of our children. We always provided for them, you know. We taught them right from wrong. *Deep Sigh*[!!] I wish I could see that energy of the young mass, the young men, put their energy into making this into a really great country."
Amerindians most definitely did have walls, let their old people, er, "elders", starve to death, kidnapped children, raped women and tortured and enslaved each other and that was what they called "right".
Deep sigh.
The "Lakota People" were among the worst. Ask the "Pawnee People".
Go ahead, Ann. Listen to the soundtrack.
It’s a bunch of kids chanting school cheers.
This reminds me of the boys accused of saluting Hitler a month or so ago.
Incident portrayed inaccurately to portray pro-lifers as inconsiderate fascists.
I also see Nathan Phillips as a possible "man in the middle" figure, and I am interested in this role.
And that is why you are getting pushback. The Indian was the instigator and he is a professional rabble-rouser.
The teenagers were wearing MAGA hats and were in Washington DC to attend the March for Life.
That is ALL you need to know. Don’t bother to look at the video.
The media has already declared the teens suffer from incurable toxic masculinity and should be smacked in the face and expelled from school.
...urging them to “be strong” in the face of the ravages of colonialism that now include... poor access to health care and the ill effects of climate change on reservations.
Yeah, because the healthcare was so much better before colonialism*. Also A) what ill effects of climate change on the reservations and B) in what way would those effects not be happening if there had been no colonialism?
*Granted, they had good access to the healthcare that they had. But that healthcare was basically worthless, as it did not cover birth control, sex changes, etc...
Most of the kids seemed to be chanting with the drum beat, albeit in an irreverent way, but more jocular than threatening.
That's why I'd like to see what's on either end of that edited video clip, especially the genesis and termination of the encounter.
And who was the president that said "I want you to argue with them. Get in their face."?
Uninterested, except for boys at that age wearing maga hats would be rebelling; against what is not discussed.
"It's kind of hijacking this post to do a defense of the boys."
That's a pathetic response, Althouse.
I don't care if the lawyer for Phillips was charitable. I care if he's honest.
“the ill effects of climate change on reservations.”
The Omaha Indian Reservation is just 90 miles north of me. The climate is not causing any ill effects on the Res.
So glad you're adding your 2 cents to destroy these teenagers lives nice job
The two hour video puts the entire thing in perspective and exonerates the boys.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=UQyBHTTqb38
the ill effects of climate change on reservations.
What the fuck could these be? The sour disposition of frustrated lefties wandering the reservation?
"I also see Nathan Phillips as a possible "man in the middle" figure, and I am interested in this role."
And your commenters tell you that this interpretation is mistaken, and you stamp your feet and say "don't talk about that!"
Maybe you should adopt the NYT policy of not allowing comments on posts where your preferred stance is at such odds with reality.
I am touched by the charity of "They were rambunctious."
But I'm only guessing at what the video sounds like. I cannot bring myself to play it.
I'm not touched by your delicacy in avoiding the video. Having taken the trouble to follow up on this alleged instance of horrifically racist bad behavior on the part of horrifically white, horrifically Catholic boys, I'm disturbed by your gullibility and thoughtlessness in passing on this (unfortunately now typical) slandering propaganda.
It's kind of hijacking this post to do a defense of the boys. I didn't attack or defend them and I won't watch the video. I am trying to start a very different conversation.
Yes, I realize that your post was about a "different conversation". I read the whole thing. But I was too disgusted by your obliviousness regarding the material you were using to preface that "conversation" to be interested.
The communism imposed on the Natives - under the Constitution- is offensive.
But that gives nobody and nothing "absolute moral authority".
Institutions are too quick to yield to the concept of "absolute moral authority" instead of saying "I don't know."
A great number of Nathan Glazers are needed.
Given the experiences that Althouse posted about the WI protests, she was often in the se position this guy was in ... surrounded by an antagonistic crowd and at times made to feel less than safe.
The parallels are there, some are just too wrapped up in partisanship to see it.
rhhardin notes the rebellion inherent in the MAGA hat.
Teenagers are rebelling against the sort of people who claim "absolute moral authority".
Among other things!
Do indians have whole drum sets or is it still the tom-tom thing.
"There are two sides to every issue: one side is right and the other is wrong"
Usually not. Generally each side has costs. The devils are the people pushing each side who pretend that only their side has benefits, only the other side has costs.
I'm sick of lawyers and politicians.
Steve Sailer reports that the Native American is a professional offense taker. He's pulled this stunt before for a compliant press.
Lean into the police dog a little more.
Honestly this post is despicable.
The 'anti-colonial' ship left the dock centuries ago. The Native Americans I know who adopted the white man's culture have succeeded in life and those who are on the reservations live in squalor. It's really that simple.
"she was often in the [same]? position this guy was in"
No, she wasn't. That's what people are trying to point out.
Mark came here to scold and chew bubble gum.
He is out of bubble gum.
The problem starts with the first sentence. “It was an aggressive display of physicality.”
He says that about the boys. That was the narrative yesterday. But that’s not what happened. If anything, it was an aggressive display of physicality by the drummer.
It was a display of patience that the boy didn’t push him back, physically. If you came and played a drum in my face, I would not have remained calm.
So my issue is portraying the drummer as they mythical man in the middle when he is apparently the instigator of this mess.
And cloaks herself and high-minded rhetoric but she's just part of the mob
I've never seen an indians dancing around the fire thing with entire drum sets playing, snare drum, bass drum, cymbals. The drum solo bit.
But I'm only guessing at what the video sounds like. I cannot bring myself to play it.
Did you watch them all? Or did you just watch the carefully curated ones? Did only you watch the ones that don’t show him marching into the middle of the crowd beating his drum. Yes, he was mocked by a few of the teenage boys. “Boys will be boys.” They did not harm him in any way and despite the reports that they were ready to bust out into violence at any moment, even though none of them did, he was the aggressor in this case.
What is the proper response when a crazy man beating a drum walks into your peaceful protest beating a drum in your face? Just curious.
""I also see Nathan Phillips as a possible "man in the middle" figure, and I am interested in this role." And your commenters tell you that this interpretation is mistaken, and you stamp your feet and say "don't talk about that!""
How could the interpretation that something is "possible" be "mistaken"? You are misinterpreting me, blatantly. Look at the actual words used and not the words that popped up in your head. Perhaps you are afraid I said something and imagined I said it.
Two threads with nothing but personal attacks, Birkel
Fine, I hear you. You can have your racist echo chamber back.
Conversely, an indian full band with the drum section consisting only of tom-toms.
The guy beating the drum is a far closer analogue to the bullhorn-in-your-ear tactics of the Wisconsin protesters.
“Stop thinking! This noise is to break down your ability to think! Then lay before me and obey my commands!” It’s also. why dogs bark at their prey.
"'But I'm only guessing at what the video sounds like. I cannot bring myself to play it.' Did you watch them all? Or did you just watch the carefully curated ones?"
Huh? I said I didn't watch the video. I didn't watch any video. My sense of decency is (so far) stopping me from looking at these children who are the latest target of viral revenge. I'm not making it my business to judge them.
An Indian chief and a cavalry captain climb to the top of a tall hill and look out upon the entire Indian tribe. The captain says worriedly, "I don't like the sound of those drums." The chief says, "I know. It's not our regular drummer."
The post and thread nicely illustrate how the notion of the "middle" can be used to marginalize the deplorables, including toxically masculine boys irreverently rambunctiously making fun of native-American tom-toms.
Mark hates personal attacks, he says as he calls other people racists.
Mark is confused about logic and consistency.
Give him a safe space to be an ass hole.
"How could the interpretation that something is "possible" be "mistaken"? "
By being... mistaken? Because additional data would show the interpretation to be incorrect?
"Perhaps you are afraid "
Please. I would have thought this sort of thing beneath you.
Does Mark think I am a self-hating Native?
Kind of an odd charge.
I am touched by the charity of "They were rambunctious."
Sorry, I assumed that this was ironic.
When drums stop, bass solo begin.
OWH reports, “The Native American man, identified as Nathan Phillips, drummed on during the Indigenous Peoples March in the face of the students' behavior. Phillips is originally from Nebraska and an elder in the Omaha Tribe.”
This guy is a pro. Been at it for years. Born in Lincoln but a member of the Omaha Tribe.
Media narrative falls apart again:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t3EC1_gcr34&feature=youtu.be&t=4341
"The guy beating the drum is a far closer analogue to the bullhorn-in-your-ear tactics of the Wisconsin protesters"
So that guy wildly outnumbered by people surrounding him is the one making the kids feel physically unsafe? Seriously?
Althouse also chose to wake into the protests despite not agreeing and was vastly outnumbered .... but it's the drum that flips the script?
Hilarious. I am sure a drum would have made her feel so much safer
> Said Chase Iron Eyes, an attorney with the Lakota People’s Law Project,
Defense lawyers gonna defend.
He got your "word of the day" so the defense is good, if not accurate?
If something that might have been possible is shown later to be false, it stopped being possible.
That didn't' tamale it wrong when first posited.
It would make it wrong in light of new evidence if not conceded.
I am touched by the charity of "They were rambunctious."
Ironic is not the right word, I assumed that this was sarcastic. Sarcasm isn’t your style though.
The Indian guy also claims to be a Vietnam veteran.
So the kids should have spat on him and called him a "baby-killer." They would have been heros in the eyes of the left.
I realize Althouse wants to start a different conversation, but unfortunately she wrote this:
"I am touched by the charity of "They were rambunctious." But I'm only guessing at what the video sounds like. I cannot bring myself to play it. "
You are crediting the lawyer with "charity" by saying "rambunctious", implying he probably could've used a stronger word.
However, if you watch the full video you might realize that the charity he supposedly exhibits is not his charity to give.
We get it: the kids are Kavanaugh and the Native American is Christine Blasey Ford; no reason to actually look under the template.
The ones in the 'middle' are the kids.
I am Laslo.
So that guy wildly outnumbered by people surrounding him is the one making the kids feel physically unsafe? Seriously?
Look at the other clips, he crossed the plaza and marched into an unrelated protest beating his drum. Nobody approached him, he waded in, incensed by the MAGA hats, I guess.
I guess they were. supposed to scatter like pigeons before the awesome power of his tom tom.
Early MAGA
Tom, Tom, the piper's son,
Stole a pig, and away did run;
The pig was eat
And Tom was beat,
And Tom went crying
Down the street.
wiki says pig is a pastry.
"Man in the middle" or how "minorities" are exploited for leverage to promote diversity and repression of people of a competing political, economic, or social "color" class. Its genesis to confront the presence of minority diversity and progress to marginalize a majority and certain formerly high status individuals and groups.
It is entirely possible he went to instigate an ugly situation, and to some extent, the kids obliged. It does lessen their total jerk factor, but I've generally been of the opinion if someone comes to instigate a fight or argument, you just walk away.
Here's a fun note though: Being the man in the middle is different from being stuck in the middle. There shouldn't be too much sympathy for someone who just throws themselves into the middle; you might have sympathy for the results of their choice, but the middleness of it isn't that. What you should have sympathy for are people who are stuck in the middle; people who have no choice but to be in a bad position stuck between two bad options.
Kids say they didn’t chant “build the wall” which makes absolutely no sense anyway, chanted to an Indian. His response would be “We should have done it 500 years ago!” one would think, if he had his wits about him. Anyway, the kids deny it, maybe there is some film of it, IDK.
Ann, I came here right after reading https://spectator.us/what-makes-a-liberal-want-to-punch-a-child/ The "I am touched" sentence through me off as well and made me assume you did not know what had happened here. This was an absolute lynch mob trying to destroy these kids lives and futures based on fake news and misleading video excerpts. Hence the overly strong reaction. Everyone needs to be more charitable, including to you. I will tell you, when I first saw the headlines about the students surrounding and taunting the American Indian I just assumed they were probably false. I have no faith left in the media.
A short clip was framed and editorialized to depict something that didn't happen.
Now, the mob is out to destroy these kids, their parents, and their school. Apparently the principle of the school is planning on suspending these kids in hopes that will be enough blood for the mob.
Truly unbelievable.
Lots of fighting over who walked up to whom. Fine. Let’s say it’s not what it looks like. Let’s say the Indian walked up to the white kid and got in his face. In that case, the white kid is doing something admirable and interesting. Standing and staring and smiling and nothing else.
Good for him! HE is the man in the middle, not Nathan Phillips. In which case, the “hijacking” is fully on topic. After all, we can’t talk about the man in the middle until we figure out who he is.
(BTW, the school statement is an irrelevant distraction. They know nothing.)
I love how some are acting as if the drummer was alone. He was part of a March for Indigenous Peoples. Where was the rest of his march?
Reminds me of when Jessie Jackson Jr was the man in the middle who heard the Tea Party yell "N*gger" 13 times.
Also the lawyer lied about the drummer trying to defuse the situation. The Indian activist walked up to the group and started banging his drum in the face of the smirking boy.
The boy stood his ground. Good for him.
One last comment: the Professor implies a similarity between this drummer and the guy who went into the middle of the rotunda crowds to have dialogue.
I don’t see this drummer as having dialogue
Back in the AIM days, Phillips lived in a tepee on the Mall. Squatter. Occupier.
Boys will be boys.
Martha McCallum in place of George Stephanapoulos on ABC just asked a Republican Senator to talk about this video.
Republicans are asked to defend their worst caricatures.
Democrats tut tut.
Several videos show the Native American[sic] man instigating the confrontation.
Several Indians walk across an open space while drummin' 'n' singin' and approach the kids who are apparently also singing (or just yelling) and minding their own business. So I retract my "that one kid was an asshole" statement.
Man in the middle is a method of hacking.
Several Indians at about 0:30 in that video.
The boy stood on the burning deck whence all but he had fled. (Felicia Hemans)
Thurber said that line is the greatest ramshackle in the English language.
We get it: the kids are Kavanaugh and the Native American is Christine Blasey Ford
Yes, precisely. Emotional politics. Furthermore, it's an intersectional enterprise to target and abort the political viability of native Americans (i.e. United States of America) and pro-life/pro-science/pro-human rights people.
Let’s say it’s not what it looks like.
Take two seconds to check!
pic.twitter.com/SRYRJOIoKf
AA: How could the interpretation that something is "possible" be "mistaken"? You are misinterpreting me, blatantly. Look at the actual words used and not the words that popped up in your head. Perhaps you are afraid I said something and imagined I said it.
Wut? This is possibly** the woolliest attempt at defending a post that you've ever produced. You wrong-footed yourself by uncritically employing some ugly propaganda as a segue into a "different converstation". Come on, Prof. (And btw, if you're not attacking or defending the boys, how is "rambunctious" "charitable"? It can only be so if you've already accepted that the boys are guilty of bad behavior.)
**therefore my analysis cannot be interpreted as mistaken in any way.
pic.twitter.com/SRYRJOIoKf
Don’t know why the hot link doesn’t work.
Too bad Breitbart is not alive to offer $100,000 for proof that the boys approached the professional protester.
"inviting them to speak, one-on-one"
Phillips lets his tom-tom do his talkin'.
Matthew Sablan: It does lessen their total jerk factor...
Have you looked at any of the videos?
I've seen a few places claim the same guy did roughly the same thing in 2015, even using some of the same terms and phrases to describe what happened. If true, that greatly undermines his man in the middle-ness. He's got a side.
The indian ought to have been carrying a papoose, not a tom-tom.
A papoose is louder anyway.
@ tim in vermont
The link doesn't work.
They are not "children."
Given the experiences that Althouse posted about the WI protests,
one might hope she would remember that press accounts of such protests can be at odds with reality. Unfortunately she has a visceral trust of the leftist press, especially when it tells her that white men are doing something terrible.
It's kind of hijacking this post to do a defense of the boys. I didn't attack or defend them, just quoted an attack on them.
@Tom's video destroys that narrative. The kids are on the steps watching some Black Israelites (I think) shout all kinds of hateful nonsense at them, calling the kids "incest babies", "dirty bastards" &c. The kids have a moment where they jump and sing the guitar riff from The White Stripes' "Seven Nation Army", which gets played a lot at football&basketball games, then they kneel in a circle facing away from the Israelites. It's at that point that the drummers (more than one) walk up to them. The kids jump up and down for a while. Meanwhile the Israelites are still shouting "America will be destroyed", "school shooters - that's your future", crap like that. I don't see when the drummers leave, but by that point they got what they wanted - a heavily edited video segment for the press to lie about.
That last video by Ferdnandistan at 9:23 settles the argument once and for all. These boys did not “surround” the man with the drum, he came in hot, as it were.
A woman on Facebook in response to the full video told me he was just trying to get to the Memorial. I asked why he just didn't take the empty steps to the immediate right of the crowd of boys?
Going back and looking at the main video from the post with new knowledge, the kids' chant may not be as offensive as it was originally displayed? I'm not sure; I do know that the kid who had the guy get in his face and beat a drum in it seems to be taking it in good humor. Which is not what I thought it would look like when I heard "kids threaten old man."
"A woman on Facebook in response to the full video told me he was just trying to get to the Memorial. I asked why he just didn't take the empty steps to the immediate right of the crowd of boys?"
-- Or, instead of drumming and chanting, say: "Excuse me, I'm trying to get to the Memorial."
I've gotten through political protests of all stripes in DC by saying "Excuse me."
My father died in 2005. I'll never forget when he was watching a news story about the WTO protesters / rioters in Seattle. There had been similar protests/riots a few weeks earlier somwhere far from Seattle. My father asked "where do these protesters/ rioters get the money to travel around the world to act up? I wonder the same about this alleged Vietnam vet/ Indian.
The people behind the instigator that makes him look surrounded is his own group (Indigenous People's March--funded by Black Lives Matter), most of the filming.
The gimps at Splinter are already trying to dox this kid along with his extended family.
If the boys are chanting, that's cultural appropriation. It's an indian thing.
Mark: The parallels are there, some are just too wrapped up in partisanship to see it.
Nobody missed the parallels Althouse was trying to draw.
She's doing a bang-up job of deliberately missing the point of the criticism, so your coming to her aid by bringing more obtuseness to the thread isn't necessary.
Althouse needs to watch the full video beginning about an hour in. These were for the most part really good kids.
The anti-white activists taunted the students, repeatedly calling them "incest babies", "blasphemous", the "real cave men", and "dogs infected with lice" and the "products of sodomy".
It got ugly when the anti-white protesters call out the "n-words" who were among the boys.
The native american drum man approached the kids, not the reverse, when the boys joined in with the beat.
The kids eventually left the area against the taunts and without incident.
Very dishonest reporting from the WaPo.
here's a fun quote:
...were not supposed to have walls here, we never did—for millennium. Before anybody else came here we never had walls.
I'd Really recommend you all go to new mexico and see chaco canyon area, and see " massive buildings of the ancestral Pueblo peoples"; better yet (while you're there) go to see the Aztec ruins (which have NOTHING to do with aztecs); those "ruins" are actually in Much better shape.
But BOTH, and Mesa Verde... Are NOTHING BUT WALLS. a huge pueblo; with only one way in, and one way out; why? because walls protect you from people!!
A-D, SB,
Mark thinks everybody here is racist.
That may color his opinion.
What a truly fantastic way for the media to ignore Trump's immigration offer!
“Perhaps you are afraid I said something and imagined I said it.”
Your rightist commenters do that every single day to anyone they suspect will veer from the rightist path. This isn’t new behavior, but you know that.
News media which ignores and embargoes stories about the March for Life now has to report a bullshit fake news incident at it. An unbiased reader might wonder why the news media embargoes the event until a narrative occurs which the news media endorses.
I've seen a few places claim the same guy did roughly the same thing in 2015, even using some of the same terms and phrases to describe what happened. If true, that greatly undermines his man in the middle-ness. He's got a side.
Eastern Michigan University. Fox2 Detroit has the article.
The last time I saw high school kids in red MAGA hats in public they were getting their asses kicked by Antifa.
The more I'm reading, the worst you can say about the kids is maybe they didn't realize they were being set up and responded poorly. But the one specific kid we get a close up of, grinning nervously as an older adult enters his personal space, seems to be the one people think was "threatening" or "disrespectful," but I don't see it for that guy. He's got a MAGA hat on, but his face says "Get me out of here."
John Borell said...The problem starts with the first sentence. “It was an aggressive display of physicality.”
In the face of such brutality, real men will step up and teach the boys, just like those in the Gillette commercial did. And then they will acquiesce to Nancy's wishes and end their blind support for the bad orange man.
Did I get that right, Althouse?
ill effects of climate change on reservations.
Been on a rez lately? Too many people drinking (firewater) in excess, then there is one of the newest menaces... meth, and if that isn't enough, heroin is causing an overdose epidemic. It just seems like climate change, but it isn't.
It's kind of hijacking this post to do a defense of the boys.
Of course, boys should never be defended, especially when wronged by a SJW.
I didn't attack or defend them
"It was an aggressive display of physicality. They were rambunctious and trying to instigate a conflict. certainly reads like an attack.
and I won't watch the video.
Can't let facts interfere with the narrative, the only thing that matters is how you feel.
I also see Nathan Phillips as a possible "man in the middle" figure, and I am interested in this role.
Ignoring the facts that he clearly instigated the confrontation and has done so in the past.
chickenlittle,
The proper words, in order and capitalized, are Orange Man Bad.
No deviation from the party line is allowed.
Since the media is an arm to the democrat party, I do not trust the reporting.
I think moderation is a virtue, but in this imagery, virtue is blood, evil is poison, and moderation is a tube.
Rand was mingling two different concepts of the man in the middle in that paragraph. One in which the man in the middle is indecisive rather than moderate. In that case, the man in the middle is the good man who stands by and does nothing while evil triumphs. In the other case, the man in the middle is the voice of moderation, splitting the difference between something objectively beneficial and something objectively not beneficial. Moderation isn't seen as a virtue by those being harmed by the compromise, even if they're not harmed as much as they'd been if the man in the middle had sided fully with those trying to cause them harm.
As for Cruz's use of the passage during his filibuster - there was no moderate option on the table. He was fighting against a law that had been forced through without any attempt at moderation, that caused harm to millions. There's no way of knowing whether he'd have been willing to accept a compromise on the issue, because no compromise was ever offered, and every compromise sought by the GOP was rejected out of hand.
When leftists talk about compromise I always think of the Jonathan Coulton zombie song "Re: Your Brains"...
All we want to do is eat your brains
We're not unreasonable, I mean, no one's gonna eat your eyes
All we want to do is eat your brains
We're at an impasse here, maybe we should compromise:
If you open up the doors
We'll all come inside and eat your brains
I don't get it. I watched both videos. In the first one, which was misleadingly edited to make it appear that the drummer was alone and surrounded, the young man just stood there and smiled while the drummer approached him and got in his face. Evidently his crime was that he didn't act like he was guilty of being white. In the second video, apparently taken by one of the Native American activists, we see the drummer wading into the crowd of teenage boys who were not doing anything remotely threatening, and one boy just smiles and stands his ground. His look was not confrontational or threatening, he even glanced down a few times. He just smiled tolerantly but held his spot. How is this a crime?
those "ruins" are actually in Much better shape.
They've been rebuilt by white people. I live in the middle of all that stuff.
Nathan Phillips needs to bang that drum on the rez to stop the drug climate, but he won't because he knows that the drug dealers and users will kill him. ... and, I do mean kill.
"The proper words, in order and capitalized, are Orange Man Bad.
No deviation from the party line is allowed."
-- All caps is allowed for emphasis. Clap emojis between words, optional. Do not use both at the same time.
tim in vermont said...
"Let’s say it’s not what it looks like."
Take two seconds to check!
For the purposes of that comment, I was uninterested in checking, uninterested objective truth. I was addressing the professor's plea that we stick to her topic.
EDH: Very dishonest reporting from the WaPo.
And the NYT, and everywhere else that I can see. The NYT did not allow comments, but the WaPo commenters are slurping it up, and every prog on twitter and facebook has absorbed and is propagating the party line and looking to destroy those boys' lives. Looks like their school will be happy to help with the lynching party, too.
But fuck them, eh? It's not like this sort of destructive, deliberate mendacity is a thing these days, you crybabies. We're trying to have a *different conversation* here, about more important things. And we're totally cruelly neutral on the details of who did what to whom in that video we're too refined to watch. Honest.
I propose Trump as a Man In The Middle figure on a national scale, whose candidacy was an invitation into a conversation with someone who was not in agreement with the crowd.
An Indian, especially, should recognize he is part of a tribe and when he ventures into the middle of another tribe, shit happens. He was looking for trouble - fuck him - the Kentucky tribe did nothing wrong- they simply held their tribe's ground. That is human nature folks.
My sense of decency is (so far) stopping me from looking at these children who are the latest target of viral revenge. I'm not making it my business to judge them.
Except for assuming that they harassed an innocent Indian minding his own business as deplorable boys are apt to do, while admitting that you refuse to look at any of the evidence showing otherwise.
"And the NYT, and everywhere else that I can see. The NYT did not allow comments, but the WaPo commenters are slurping it up, and every prog on twitter and facebook has absorbed and is propagating the party line and looking to destroy those boys' lives. Looks like their school will be happy to help with the lynching party, too."
I ventured to CNN. It is exactly as you would suspect. They called the video "disturbing" which is hilarious. No comments there, either.
"I am trying to start a very different conversation."
Really? I can't imagine why your approach didn't work.
Actually, this is a very good example of what Rand was saying. An evil lie gets on the plane while the lady in the middle tells the truth to "relax while I shine those shoes for you."
And Google is still putting that motto of theirs on hold too.
"...Phillips has his an entourage with cameras. One of the Indian activists argues with a Covington teen, who argues back. This and other clips have shown the Indian activists racially taunting the teens, saying things like “go back to Europe.” Phillips has claimed that the teens were chanting “build the wall!,” but that isn’t in any of the videos that circulated Saturday. Based on what can actually be seen and heard, it’s looks as if Phillips and his crew sought out Catholic teenagers and tried to make them uncomfortable. And of course, they recorded it."
"Man in the Middle", my ass.
From:
What makes a liberal want to punch a child?
(Thanks, FullMoon)
The middleman is the one who finds a way to trade so that everybody comes out ahead, without himself producing anything.
Mike Munger
http://www.econtalk.org/munger-on-middlemen/
one of the best econtalk podcasts.
"we see the drummer wading into the crowd of teenage boys who were not doing anything remotely threatening."
The reports state that the Native American was surrounded by the menacing smirking boys.
It looks like the truth is that the Drummer wandered into the group and got in their faces.
In case not already reported above in the comments, start at 1:12:00 mark on this video to get the full context. Clearly these kids were aggressed upon, not the other way around.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=4303&v=sJ_-JUr22pY
As for the kid who just stood there as the drummer came right up into his face, will he be the victim of a virtuous mob of SJW's (abetted by the mainstream media) or become a hero?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=twrW4uYlN7M
Crazy where we are at.
What's actually great about this is that the media no longer has total control over how to frame a story. There are too many cameras in too many hands -- including those who don't all have the same agenda. Their narratives fall apart rather quickly now.
Luke Lea,
I do not like the passivity.
One side is pushing for the other side to surrender.
The other side declines the invitation.
There is agency in how we got here.
buwaya has warned us repeatedly.
He sees where we are.
I say we are almost out of seed corn.
What's actually great about this is that the media no longer has total control over how to frame a story.
If you can no longer buy ink by the barrel, why would you even try shooting fish?
Sadism is why. Sad.
Great job!
As rabid Trumpets like to say: "never apologize", but you already knew that.
I'm gonna have to just not accept this effort. Go back to the library and try again. I'll give you another chance, but only becuase you are failing so far, and I really want you to pass this class.
My tuppence goes here
Shyster /ˈʃaɪstər/ is a slang word for someone who acts in a disreputable, unethical, or unscrupulous way, especially in the practice of law, sometimes also politics or business
And blogs
Can maninthmiddle be some such?
Can professora be some such?
Ann, there never has been a true "man in the middle"; every thinking person has an opinion on one side or the other. If one denies such he/she is a blatant liar.
But, I forgot. Custer: "Shit men, we are in the middle!"
rhhardin said...
The middleman is the one who finds a way to trade so that everybody comes out ahead, without himself producing anything
Wrong >>> he produces the trade.
Jaysus, will Rod Dreher ever learn?
"...having only seen those shorter videos, I retweeted a condemnation of these boys."
Interesting that the the group of Black Israelites are not mentioned. Typical of todays reporting to leave out how it all started.
Okay, I've watched the video now. As I wrote in the update to the new post:
"OKAY: I've watched the key part of the video, and I think this is a whole lot of nothing. The men making the video remind me of religious ranters I've seen in Madison many times. Ordinary people just ignore them, and that's what I'm seeing in the video. The Catholic schoolboys group is large, and they seem to be taking in the free speech forum and doing some sort of cheers on their own, widely separated from "Black Israelites" group. Then the Native American guy enters the space and walks up to the schoolboys beating his drum. The schoolboys react by bouncing along with the beat in a way that seems to welcome the man and include him in their boisterous fun day out in the public square. Shame on the adult professionals who latched onto this as something to make into the big issue of the day. Total fake news. I ignored this yesterday, but my ignoring something doesn't have any effect on the total amount of noise. So I have to speak up and rephrase my silence into words: This is nothing.
It was nothing until the media made it into something.
It's not nothing to the boys if they get labeled as vile racists, doxed, expelled.
Of course, we assume the MSM will put out any propaganda that serves The Narrative, as in this case.
Of course, we assume Catholic boys will be denigrated, native American professional agitators defended, and homophobic black racists ignored, as in this case.
But politically most interesting is the reaction of Althouse and feminist women like her. Here, she first buys the prog line, then claims she presented the truth as she knew it, and then gets all defensive when called on the BS. Part of of it is a personal quirk: being a diva means never having to say you're sorry. But part of it is political: even Althouse, who likes to think of herself as the rational woman in the middle, is easily swayed when the right buttons are pushed. Sure, sometimes she resists--she is not the easy prey progs count on, to her credit. But her reactions show how progs play on her sisters' feelz.
One question for commenters here. Last night, a commenter named "wwww" appeared in the overnight snow post and made and then deleted numerous comments. What was all that about? Was it about this issue?
Althouse is a credit to all those who move on the first Fake News, refuse to change their minds, and never admit anything but the Narrative.
It's better than the average professor.
It's better than the average feminist.
Both by a mile.
But we conservatives seem not to be conned often.
That is the next question.
chickenlittle,
That is a quirk of that particular poster.
Happens a lot.
I posted some time ago that work had a receptionist who was an english major who reported her classes were filled with future journalists who already had it all figgered out. There is no critical thinking allowed. Future generations pay the price for disinformation.
chickenlittle: One question for commenters here. Last night, a commenter named "wwww" appeared in the overnight snow post and made and then deleted numerous comments. What was all that about? Was it about this issue?
No. Every once in a while 4-dub drops in for an extended post post post delete delete delete freak-out. Harmless idiosyncratic de-stressing exercise? Too many scotch-and-sodas? Psychotic break? Who knows?
The teen "boys" were shown by CNN as Nazis because they are white men. Once again the Dems/Progressive Propaganda operatives are commanding that all unrepentant white men be exterminated. No choice. Just go die.
If that does win elections in the USA, then we are gonna need more than semi-auto AR-15s.
Once again, if you leftists keep blaming people for shit they didn't do, what's to stop them from not giving a damn anymore and doing worse?
"Iron Eyes" -- HAHAHA!
Neither the Catholic boys nor the Indigians instigated this. The Black Hebrews, or whatever those tards call themselves, started it by harassing Indigians, Hispanics and at least oneJew until their vitriol turned to the white students who came along to observe. The Covington students did NOTHING to provoke ANYONE. The Indigians then approached the Catholic students, probably because they were to afraid to confront the Blacks.
This was nothing until it went viral. The boys are being identified by name. The school is identified and the email address is being published on left leaning websites. (and we all know how thoughtful the left is in it's efforts to offer constructive criticism.) These boys will be threatened. Left leaning college administrators will remember their names and find reasons to deny admission.
Ann, here's the young man's statement. I'd I love your thoughts:
Check out this article from Cincinnati.com:
Covington Catholic student from incident at the Indigenous Peoples March issues statement with his side of the story
http://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/politics/2019/01/20/covington-catholic-student-video-issues-statement-his-side-story/2634008002/
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