I grew up firmly in a matriarchy. My grandmother divorced my grandfather when she was 31 and had four young daughters. She wanted more kids, so she very briefly married a man she had met at the neighborhood plant store in order to get his sperm to have a fifth child. She raised her five girls mostly by herself. My mom chose to be a single mom and also had five children: My older siblings and I have donor dads, and my two younger siblings are adopted from Guatemala.Greenberg's message is that there are women without fathers, and when you encounter one, you need to take it in stride. Men who don't, who go poking after what remnant of a father this woman might have somewhere, are going to get summarily cut from the woman's life. Which seems to suggest that living without a man leads to more living without a man, but don't you dare pick up that clue or you won't even have a ghost of a chance.
When I tell my dates I grew up without a dad, I can see the synapses in their brains begin to spark. The first question that comes up for them is, I think, simply a curious one: What would a life without a father look like? And then panic sets in: Where did the father go? Were there no men? What happened to the men? Does she hate men? And then, the rational and generous part of the brain re-enters and produces a soothing idea: It must have been a weird and almost inexplicable life, which I can try to excavate through my clever questions....
August 4, 2018
It was cowardly of the NYT not to include a comments section on this one.
"A Guide to Dating Women Raised in a Matriarchy?/Yes, I have a single mom. Don’t panic," by Zoe Greenberg — a member of the editorial staff of the Opinion section. I guess membership has its privileges.
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You will still be a subscriber though.
This woman thinks she knows what a man thinks, because she thinks that's what she would think if she were a man. This leads to her finishing his sentences for him.
Their comment sections are cowardly in general, either not having them or closing them after short periods.
Men who don't [...] are going to get summarily cut from the woman's life.
Men who do will get cut too, but after she gets a claim on their wallets.
Both her grandmother and mother used "donor dads" for sperm?
That's seriously fucked up. No wonder she works for the NYT. Those people are sick freaks.
What does plant store guy think of all this is my first question.
Second question: Plant store guy?
Both her grandmother and mother used "donor dads" for sperm?
That's seriously fucked up. No wonder she works for the NYT. Those people are sick freaks.
Apparently the Grandmother married a man simply to get pregnant and then quickly divorced him...want to bet on whether of not she got child support?
Good grief. She could simplify her search process by subscribing to a sperm bank. Lot less icky than telling live donors they will be used and discarded. She does get points for honesty, but still. . .
I have some good dating advice: Don't sleep with Leftwing women - even the good-looking ones. They are crazy and will make your life miserable.
Go for apolitical, Libertarian or conservative women. Much less drama, much more stability and sanity.
My plan was to meet a hot babe who came from a family with a mom and a dad and take her away from all that stability. Worked like a charm. Now will it last? Who knows? It’s only been 55 years.
Good grief. She could simplify her search process by subscribing to a sperm bank. Lot less icky than telling live donors they will be used and discarded
Sperm donors usually don't have to pay child support or alimony.
Althouse's Dating Do's and Don'ts.
Firmly raised in a Matriarchy is a new one for me. This seems more like that trend of people taking things that are bad to have or to have happened to a person and claiming they are empowering or good or whatever. It strikes me like that Autism Pride thing. You don't have to feel bad about not having a dad growing up and you certainly don't need to let it limit you in life, but you also shouldn't pretend it is somehow a good thing.
"... don't you dare pick up that clue or you won't even have a ghost of a chance."
Otherwise known as dodging a bullet.
Were the mothers independently wealthy?
If some of the daughters had been boys, they'd be door mats or train wrecks.
Why does she even bother interacting with men on a social or dating basis?
She should just buy a robot. Or some other electrical/mechanical device and be done with it. She works for the Times. What else does she need in her life? Children? Why bother? Not worth the trouble.
Actually, when men hear that, they gonna think "easy" and "no way any commitment". And "make sure to keep the condom."
Single mothers and their kids are the absolute worst. And just how delusional are these women? No rational man would get involved with a single mom or their kids. There are way too many nice, highly educated women without this sort of ridiculous baggage. Some are even attractive. So thanks but no thanks.
> I can see the synapses in their brains begin to spark.
Lefty superpowers
Bay Area Guy is correct though I would suggest having fun when you're 18-22 with weirdos and oddities, as long as they can be kept at arms length. Marry a good conservative woman, though, for the rest of life happiness. We've been married almost 30 years, and just shared a Boddington's. That's how you ease into your 60s. Boddington's and homemade chili on a Saturday night waiting for the Phillies game to come on the TV.
Can we get any more dysfunctional?
Single mothers are always finding perfect husbands in romcoms. It's a standard difficulty. Hollywood at work.
"a man she had met at the neighborhood plant store"
Laslo's father helped her get started growing her own cucumbers. A terrific guy, by all accounts.
Single mother lawyer, on lawyer probation after alcohol problem, tries to get visitation rights with her child. I don't know how that one comes out. It's a drama.
A murder case is going on too, but I bailed out.
Oh, gawd, yet another gurl with a message mission?
Get help, please, Zoe...!
A child needs a father like a fish needs a bicycle. Or something like that. You can see how well father-less family units function by a quick drive to your nearest "inner city neighborhood" (to use the euphemism).
See this a lot. Find sperm donor, have your kids, and dump him. Get welfare and section 8. No child support. The kids are "hers" with no man to answer to.
To be fair, many were able to go to work later and even remarry. But without having to share the kids.
Most guys don't want to be tied down anyway, so what the heck.
"When, for some reason I tell my dates I grew up without a dad, I imagine I can see the synapses in their brains begin to spark, but of course I really can't do any such thing."
I come from a long line of ancestors with kids.
A dyslexic mind reader.
I understand that there have been several major wars that were quite productive of matriarchal families. The women involved considered it a deprivation rather than a privilege, but those were less enlightened times.
I can see the synapses in their brains begin to spark.
Based on experience and observation, most men would be thinking about their chances of having sex.
The girls may have been raised by women but I'll bet we taxpayers supported those 10/11 children!!
Isn't it a form of child neglect to purposefully create a child without a father. The only way it would not be would be if you put zero or little value on the presence of a father in a child's development and life. It seems seriously selfish to me.
Modern Feminism has ruined the world for women.
The *only* people that benefit from Modern Feminism are rich women (which means a largely White cohort) that can afford to pay monies for the things they are otherwise denined because of the new hen pecking order.
My guess is that the men are rapidly thinking through the following: that two generations of divorcees when divorce was hard suggests the daughter/granddaughter is a high divorce risk, and therefore definitely not a good prospect if you are looking for a serious relationship.
What man would ever marry into this family? Could you imagine holidays?
When comments aren't allowed readers are not getting the truth. When a web publisher disables comments I'm immediately suspicious that the author/publisher has an agenda. And more often than not it's lefty sites that more likely to close comments.
"You will still be a subscriber though."
Despite overt unrepentant racism as well. Is there any other major news outlet with that level of bigotry and bias? Isn't there some level of responsibility by supporting such an entity?
She was misreading the questions about her family history. The men were simply trying to calculate the odds that Zoe's gigantic honker would be passed on to their offspring.
You could raise a family of badgers in that thing.
She didn't have to marry a guy to get his sperm, but it does help with getting the guy to unwittingly pay child support. So by donor dad, she means financially.
Anyway, like the NYT coming out loud and proud with its racism; it's great they are coming out proud of their hate for men. It will just make it easier to marginalize them.
"When I tell my dates I grew up without a dad..."
She must have told them for a reason. My thoughts are, that she is a retard.
The funny thing is, even those with fathers, hardly ever saw them.
My dad worked all week, drank all weekend, and for years I thought he was my moms brother, because they never played grab-ass on the sofa.
My parents divorced when I was 2. My dad lived in the same town and I saw him often but I never lived with him. I've told my spouse multiple times that I would never do to my kids what happened to me.
The acorn does not fall from the tree.
30 years ago I dated a woman with two daughters by two different men, both without benefit of marriage.
Consequently, the two daughters each had(last I heard) two children by two different men again without benefit of wedlock.
Nature has little to do with it, it's all Nurture and what you're used to in being raised.
The women in the story obviously have issues with men, so does the writer and so will her daughters. Run, don't walk, as fast and as far from them as you can.
I have since learned that it is a shocking amount of trouble to tell men on first dates that I was raised by a single mom.
These people are beyond parodying.
Three generations of imbeciles is enough?
Years ago, the USC medical school had a sperm bank run by a faculty member (not a joke) and using medical students as donors.
About 30 years ago a 35 year old woman social worker spent a couple of years trying to track down her sperm donor so she could sue him for child support.
Thank god that sperm bank was before my time and I had a kid anyway.
It must be fun to hear: "I didn't want you to have a father."
Despite overt unrepentant racism as well. Is there any other major news outlet with that level of bigotry and bias?
MSNBC?
Isn't there some level of responsibility by supporting such an entity?
Yes.
Next up from Zoe - The Manservant’s Tale?
“If some of the daughters had been boys, they'd be door mats or train wrecks.”
Or, maybe just as likely, maybe even more so, dead or in prison. The sad reality is that most women cannot adequately raise boys, without help by their fathers or other close male relatives.. Loving them is great - until they hit puberty, and then they need to get their asses kicked by their fathers. Or, at least learn to live within the limits that male society sets for them, and that is most effectively done by male relatives.
But girls raised without fathers don’t do that much better. Without the unconditional love of a father, and in his absence, other close male relatives, girls tend to learn only to deal with males on a sexual basis, trading access to their wombs for short lived male attention.
As noted above, all you need to do is look at the pathology of lower income inner city, esp Black, communities in this country to see why having kids out of wedlock, and then raising them without their fathers having a significant role in their lives, is so dysfunctional.
",After dinner we made our next to his car, and I told him I did not want to go on a second date."
At which point he no doubt breathed a sigh of relief and Ubered the heck out of there.
Seriously, that sentence of hers tells you everything a man needs to know about her.
Let me add that while the liberal clientele of the NYT may applaud fatherless child rearing, they are some of the last to participate in it. Rather, they very likely have a very high likelihood of having been raised by both parents, and endeavored to do the same with their children. In short, politically left wing, but very conservative in their own life choices. In other words, a bit of cynicism, if not hypocrisy. Do as they say, but not as they do themselves.
I don't know if living without fathers is likely to lead to more living without fathers, but living without breeding is likely to lead to less breeding, which is what we need.
Back when I was a few years younger and still dating the women I met tended to be of an age where there had married in their thirties, yet were divorced with young children. They tended to be established professionally and should certainly have been mature enough to have made their terminated marriages work. I started to wonder if I was attracting women who married in order to have a child, didn't really want husbands, but liked playing the field. Since then I've aged out of the market and shall remain single.
When I tell my dates I grew up without a dad, I can see the synapses in their brains begin to spark... It must have been a weird and almost inexplicable life, which I can try to excavate through my clever questions....
Well, gee. She brings up a major biographical detail on a date, her date asks a followup question, and this is somehow a major faux pas? Talk about your no win scenarios.
"In short, politically left wing, but very conservative in their own life choices."
Liberty sux.
My son escaped such a woman and, by great good fortune for his entire family, without children. I could have told him about her but I knew better than to try. I consider it the luckiest day of his life when she spotted his successor and ended it. This includes the day he ran off the road on a motorcycle and into a culvert, suffering only scratches and a black eye. He's safely married now to a woman with at least half a ration of sense. It was a very close call.
The NYT is getting to be like a zoo where you see all sorts of strange lives on display.
It must have been a weird and almost inexplicable life, which I can try to excavate through my clever questions....
The number one clever question he's trying not to ask is: "Do you have weird and almost inexplicable hostility to perfectly normal male behaviors, which will surface at unpredictable times and in unpredictable ways?"
Putting that one down as a yes.
As noted above, all you need to do is look at the pathology of lower income inner city, esp Black, communities in this country to see why having kids out of wedlock, and then raising them without their fathers having a significant role in their lives, is so dysfunctional.
Added to this pathology is the reality that those having those babies are also at the bottom quintile of the IQ scale.
True re the NYT.
Its been so for some time.
A staple of journalism since newspapers were popular. Prodigies and scandals, two-headed calves, crimes and murders and the careers of famous bandits and notorious women.
There has always been a part of them with what would otherwise be PT Barnums establishment.
My great-grandmother (great-grandfather shot) raised my grandmother. My grandmother (grandfather had cancer) raised my mother. My mother (alcoholic father) raised my sister and I. When my husband and I were dating I told him that I thought it didn’t make any difference whether a child had both a mother and a father to raise them. So two things...
1. Thank goodness he married me anyway, and
2. After raising our son together I can say I was absolutely wrong.
I mean, the only real question you're trying to answer on the first date is whether you're compatible enough to bother with a second date.
Biographical details aren't major roadblocks. The emotional consequences can be, though.
Growing up without a father isn't a deal breaker. There are lots of people who grow up in nontraditional living arrangements.
Having deeply buried hostilities and resentments traceable to growing up without a father -- that's what you have to look out for.
re the NYT- who the fuck are we all kidding at this point?
Mrs. McG was raised by a single (divorced) mom. Her relationship with her dad was pretty toxic when we met, but it's gotten a lot better in the last few years. Now they talk pretty regularly, we visit with him at least once most years, and she's even Facebook friends now with her half-brother.
I wonder what Agenda the NYT has?
Now that God is dead,
the new Bible is a Cosmo style listicle of "tips"
about how to live
Yet how many dudes are studying the NYT
to get in the pants of lower ranking matriarchy members?
"Hey, I bagged a pretty little Jewish Princess from NY who blogs for the NYT about how to date her... as a member of an approved non-traditional family... yah I told her Trump is Hitler..."
"But then OMG I had to listen to her... and listen... and listen..."
I wonder what Agenda the NYT has?
And all blithely unaware of how much damage this does to the kids. Just because it is your choice does not make it a good choice. Such people want to be applauded for their wonderfulness and never criticized. boohoo
Now this is a song to celebrate
The conscious liberation of the female state!
Mothers, daughters and their daughters too
Woman to woman
We're singin' with you
The inferior sex got a new exterior
We got doctors, lawyers, politicians too
Everybody, take a look around
Can you see, can you see, can you see
There's a woman right next to you
Sisters are doin' it for themselves
Standin' on their own two feet
And ringin' on their own bells
Sisters are doin' it for themselves
anti-de Sitter space said...
"In short, politically left wing, but very conservative in their own life choices."
Liberty sux.
8/4/18, 7:19 PM
This has nothing to do with liberty, birdbrain.
One thing I try to remember when I contemplate how much leftist feminists hate men is that many of the males they know are leftist cucks like PB. Who wouldn't despise such creatures?
Worth remembering tha a pile of modern psychiatry is based on Sigmund Frauds analysis of five thousand upper class Jewish families in Vienna. Or something.
One thing I try to remember when I contemplate how much leftist feminists hate men is that many [read All - Ed] of the males they know are leftist cucks like PB.
Yep.
Having deeply buried hostilities and resentments traceable to growing up without a father -- that’s what you have to look out for.
Yep.
“One thing I try to remember when I contemplate how much leftist feminists hate men is that many of the males they know are leftist cucks like PB. Who wouldn't despise such creatures?”
Especially when they are like that Eric what’s his name. With the paint chips. “If you are darker than this I get to beat the stool out of you”
If we could only restrain single mothers it would go a very long way toward reducing or eliminating every problem the country has. I can't think of a single exception. Yet the cultural elites, who can't preach what they practice - as someone already said above, have made single mothers into exemplars of innocence and virtue under the partiarchal yoke. Will they ever get a clue at the Times - which is a useful stand in for the whole lot. How much damage will it take?
People seem to be missing the primary phoniness of the NYT article, which is a lie from top to bottom. Accepting her own figure, 40 per cent of the men she tries to go out with were raised by single moms themselves, and/or 40 per cent of the friends they grew up with were raised by single moms. There is not a chance in hell that the fact of being raised by a single mom completely gobsmacks them, throws them for a loop, and leads them to speculate that all the men in her life have been killed and eaten. What the writer only lets on, deep into the article, is that she was raised in a lesbian commune. While it would still be rude to barrage her with questions about this on short acquaintance, it is much more believable that a generation raised on the no-private-relationships world of TV would give in to that temptation. But the writer is not honest enough to tell us what it's all really about.
Talk about Chick (click) Bait.
I just wanted to pop into to say that I NEVER dated a woman who was "raised by the matriarchy" and given my age, never will.
Thanks God.
Carry on.
Women who love men are the luckiest women in the world. But getting to really know others is a a skill that has a long learning curve.
reader,
I hope your comment is true because I don't wish your ancestral history on anyone, but I'd wish your personal experience on everyone.
"Which seems to suggest that living without a man leads to more living without a man, but don't you dare pick up that clue or you won't even have a ghost of a chance"
Why would you want one?
Correction: what kind of chance -- just to get laid or to have an actual relationship? No wonder the synapses get busy.
,"married in order to have a child, didn't really want husbands"
This. Is it. They want kids but don't want a husband. They interfere with her fun.
I never would have believed something so unromantic when I was young, though my parent did the same thing. She stayed unmarried the whole time I was growing up.
Never saw a real marriage, close up.
Run don't walk away from this hapless liberal feminist cunt.
Get yourself a normal wife.
Not one that come broken in the package.
,"married in order to have a child, didn't really want husbands"
This. Is it. They want kids but don't want a husband. They interfere with her fun.
I never would have believed something so unromantic when I was young, though my parent did the same thing. She stayed unmarried the whole time I was growing up.
Never saw a real marriage, close up.
That matriarchy she was raised in sounds like a barrel of laughs.
Why would anyone volunteer to be her splooge stooge?
This the arch-typical New York single bitch. Her only dating pool is limp dick beta's with a man bun. Don't give it a second thought. I doubt she ever gets a second date. At least not if she acts as her true self. She might be able to fake being a normal woman but that is doubtful.
Of course there are no comments.
What a c*nt.
I wonder how much the state chipped in to raise three generations of emotional landmines.
Was the plant store guy Rick Moranis?
What’s going on here?
"Having deeply buried hostilities and resentments"
Deeply buried would probably mean they don't come up on the first fucking date. That's seething hostility right on the surface.
"Sperm donors usually don't have to pay child support or alimony."
And yet, sometimes, somehow, feminists who are totally independent and self-empowered will still find a way.
Will the NYT give me some inches
I would write
"How to get an anonymous poster to fuck you"
Everyone should publish their inner bias as a personal guide to themselves for others
"Especially when they are like that Eric what’s his name. With the paint chips."
How dare you call coach Arians a cuck!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=69F7QJWLkRA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4FL6b4xL20
this chick likes gobsmacking unsuspecting men. meeting men in person to disqualify them over the same issue again and again is inefficient compared to what can be accomplished with a well thought out profile on a dating site.
I will add that I think my mom did a fantastic job raising us. But I do have an anxiety problem with men that I don't want my kids to have. I remember being so nervous when I was at a friend's house and their dad would come home from work. This never really went away, even as I have a husband and a bunch of kids of my own.
AA wrote: "It was cowardly of the NYT not to include a comments section on this one."
After firing NYT Public Editor Liz Spayed in May 2017, Pinch 'Sulzberger argued that the Public Editor is now superfluous because “our followers on social media and our readers across the internet have come together to collectively serve as a modern watchdog, more vigilant and forceful than one person could ever be. Our responsibility is to empower all of those watchdogs, and to listen to them, rather than to channel their voice through a single office.”
The publisher listed several measures to achieve that goal, notably expanding the paper’s online commenting platform to permit readers to register their reactions to most articles; and the creation of a “Reader Center,” which Sulzberger called “the central hub from which we engage readers about our journalism.” Critics might be forgiven if they confuse that description with yet another newsroom bureaucracy.'
https://www.thedailybeast.com/why-the-new-york-times-fired-its-public-editor-in-favor-of-a-reader-center
"...expanding the paper’s online commenting platform to permit readers to register their reactions to most articles" turns out to have been an outright lie, especially when the NYT blatantly slants articles in their usual way that may contain negative information about the machinations by the left. Prime example, Russiagate.
This is not the case for WaPo, which (like the NYT also slants political articles and opinion pieces) but offers its readers the opportunity to comment on most of them. Unlike the NYT, WaPo also publishes comments immediately and without moderation. WaPo even offers a 5-minute window to edit a comment after it is published!
What the writer only lets on, deep into the article, is that she was raised in a lesbian commune.
That happens to be EXACTLY what i figured the code phrase raised by the matriarchy" meant
A lesbian commune?
Who would want to date someone who was raised in a fish store?
"When I tell my dates I grew up without a dad, I can see the synapses in their brains begin to spark."
Zoe, they are thinking: "How can I use this information to get into her pants quicker; Nothing more, nothing less.
"She raised her five girls mostly by herself."
Mostly. So the fish did need a bicycle or the village after all.
I am donor-conceived and an active part of the community that has started to emerge of such people.
Many, many, many people are very not fine with their mothers' selfish, narcissistic choices.
Using a sperm seller ('donor' is almost always a misnomer created by the fertility industry) to deliberately make a child deprived of acknowledgement by his or her father, or even with an infertile husband, is ALWAYS a selfish act that creates an existential debt that the resulting child must always bear and from which the child cannot escape.
Using a sperm seller is the act of a selfish, narcissistic, spoiled person who is stomping her (always a her) feet and refusing to accept the reality of an infertile mate or lack of one altogether. Foisting the lack of a father on an innocent child who had no choice in the matter is an evil thing to do.
Years ago, the USC medical school had a sperm bank run by a faculty member (not a joke) and using medical students as donors.
About 30 years ago a 35 year old woman social worker spent a couple of years trying to track down her sperm donor so she could sue him for child support.
Thank god that sperm bank was before my time and I had a kid anyway.
There has never been a court case where child support was awarded to a sperm seller who did not have a parental relationship during the child during his or her upbringing. So your pals' wallets are safe. That said, now that we have DNA testing, not a single one of them is going to remain anonymous, so I hope your colleagues who made money that way expecting lifelong anonymity are developing a plan for when their biological children find them. It's not an if, it's a when.
Sperm banks preferred sperm sellers with children as it demonstrated that they had good quality sperm with high motility. My biofather had four children he raised with his wife, a couple of whom are older than I am, and continued to sell his semen through the time when he sent them off to college. My half-brother (the only one of them I'm in touch with) is six years older than I am.
refusing to accept the reality of an infertile mate
I didn't realize that that would be different from adoption or (early) step-children, but I guess it could feel like an affair.
The obsessive wanna-be-mom is a staple of TV crime shows, even when they're not directly involved in the crime. The female victims in L&O SVU don't make women look good, either.
Millions of children lost their fathers in the World Wars and they turned out OK. I think a bigger factor is that the guy who promises to love and cherish you unto death and the guy who bangs you in the nightclub bathroom then deletes your number are very different sorts of men, and much of that difference is genetic.
Of course, if you are separated from your father only by his untimely death, his relatives will still love and support you, something that anonymous-sperm-donor kids don't get.
I hesitate to mention this, since I was attacked by several commenters for being a bad mother (no prizes for guessing which ones) but I had a baby and gave her up for adoption when I was 19. I not prepared for motherhood at that point and the baby would not have had a father in her life - and since I loved my dad very much, I felt my daughter deserved one.
My biological daughter found me several years ago. She was adopted by good people (who are deceased now) and is married and a mother of 3. I'm glad she had the experience of having a mom and dad. My own parents - especially my dad - supported me though a very difficult time.
When DEm Sen. Patrick Moynihan talked about "defining deviancy down", he had no inkling that the Left would define it all the way down.
All...the...way.
What's next? Cannibalism, to thin the herd of useless males?
exiled ~ God bless you.
Of course, if you are separated from your father only by his untimely death, his relatives will still love and support you, something that anonymous-sperm-donor kids don't get.
Bingo. Legitimacy and acknowledgement is truly important to humans, even when they pretend otherwise.
I and my also donor-conceived brother were my mom's project, and her husband at the time (the man I thought was my father until I was 35 years old and was finally told) wandered off after their divorce. I never really had a father, one way or the other. I found out through DNA testing who my biological father is, and while I have some medical history and I know who his people are, I can never claim or be claimed by them. I'm not even supposed to know the names of my own grandparents, although I do (my half-brother is not as secretive as he probably should be and I'm a good sleuth). I can look at pictures of my grandmother and her parents that a distant cousin uploaded on Ancestry.com, I have my great-grandparents wedding photo saved on my hard drive, but it's like a shameful secret and I can't let anyone know that I essentially stole the facts of my own heritage.
What kind of fucked up bullshit is that to subject a child to?
There has never been a court case where child support was awarded to a sperm seller who did not have a parental relationship during the child during his or her upbringing.
Technically correct..so far.
But there have been cases where men either donated sperm or impregnated a woman with the agreement that he would bear no financial liability, and these agreements were later overturned by the courts and the men forced to pay child support.
Chris N said...
Was the plant store guy Rick Moranis?
What’s going on here?
************
Maybe an oblique reference to the movie, "Little Shop of Horrors"?
(the scene with Steve Martin as the sadistic dentist doing terrible things to the masochistic patient Bill Murray is just the best, the best evah.)
But there have been cases where men either donated sperm or impregnated a woman with the agreement that he would bear no financial liability, and these agreements were later overturned by the courts and the men forced to pay child support.
Unfortunately yes. Clearly not fair to the man. I hope for a future in which no man will give anyone his sperm in order to make a child he does not intend to parent, and I hope that the silver lining of such cases (which are indeed unjust) is that they will scare off men from providing sperm.
It's nice of her to be honest. She's looking for someone who won't be flustered by it. May be she will find that man and live happily ever after.
Maybe he won't.
Wednesday: Fuck those people, you did the right thing by your daughter and grandkids.
Thank you, Howard and Pants.
And Pants, I appreciate the clear-headed wisdom of your comments.
There's no shame in putting a child up for adoption, and there's no shortage of wonderful couples who can't have children of their own.
Do people think that way in this day and age? They run because she doesn’t have a father? I call bullshit.
Harry Burns: There are two kinds of women: those who want a man and those who don’t.
Sally Albright: Which one am I?
Harry Burns: You're the worst kind; you don’t want a man but you think you do.
Sally Albright: I don't see that.
Harry Burns: You don't see that? You begin by telling me you grew up just fine without a father. Your mother had children, but with a man on the side. And when he didn’t want more children, she went to another man on the side. "On the side" is a very big thing for you.
Sally Albright: Well, I just want it the way I want it.
Harry Burns: I know; without a man.
“Do people think that way in this day and age? They run because she doesn’t have a father? I call bullshit.”
I would run. Knowing what I know now, I would run before I had a one night stand. Back 40+ years ago I would have snuck in a little s3x first. As one guy my partner knew well used to say, the best sex is with crazy women. The reason that I would balk now is that I know of guys who got taken advantage of by this type of women. One guy I know had unprotected sex, she ended up pregnant, and he ended up paying for that mistake for almost 30 years, as she was able to blackmail him into a second kid, who seems to have learning issues due possibly to parental age. And this cost him his marriage to the dream wife, which may have contributed to his daughters ending up in prison. Her previous attempt at blackmail didn’t end as well, since he had been a litigation attorney. She got nothing from him, except the treat that he would ruin her if he ever heard from her again. His kid, a daughter, left her mom at age 18, communicating every year or two with her mother, if that.
The reason to run is that, statistically, this woman is going to be a horrid mother of her victims’ children. Her daughters are likely to end up either sponging off the state, or living off the work of her baby daddies. And her sons are likely to end up as criminals of some sort. I say run, and run quickly, away from her, because that one night stand with her is likely to end up costing you for the next 20 years. And three generations into this pathology, and this woman likely has little experience seeing how successful marriages are made. And apparently no desire to learn.
And if she wants kids, she's likely to lie about birth control or claim she physically can't have them.
A woman that wears her fatherless upbringing like a badge of honor seems to me unlikely to enter into a long lasting relationship with a man. Perhaps that's what these guys with all the questions are trying to figure out.
-sw
Well, it is nice for the NYT to run an unambiguous public service warning about this crazy woman totally unqualified for a relation...(Whisper whisper)
Hang on a minute.
(Whisper whisper)...This isn't a public serving announcement warning men against this woman?
(Whisper Whisper) T
hey are trying to NORMALIZE this and seek out people to try to date her?
(Whisper Whisper)
So...the NYT's, instead of seeing ANYTHING wrong or offputting by this...is now functioning as a DATING service for their reporters?
(Whisper...slides picture)
(Looking) Ah...well...normally, she's a solid five. Maybe she can dress up to a six and a half in good light. NORMALLY she'd have no problem. She could find a nice Five of her own, or maybe a Sympathetic Six and raise her little babies with him...but Lesbian Colony and NO men in the lives of her abusers?
(Whisper)
Ah...so blow jobs are RIGHT OUT!
(WHISPER)
Good luck. Maybe instead of a dating ad, they should run an ad requesting cats for her. I think in the long run, it will be more fruitful.
Do people think that way in this day and age? They run because she doesn’t have a father? I call bullshit.
Well, Kelly, since you seem to have as much insight into men that Zoe Greenberg has, as a public service, let me break things down.
He wonders if she EVER had a normal relationship with any man. He wonders about her dating history (most likely very short term...I didn't read the article)
He sees that she has had ZERO training in learning the various compromises that men and women go into cross gender. Because it's not like she had a father still connected by the third weekend of every month and two weeks in the summer. SHE HAD ZERO TRAINING.
He has to wonder if these dykes as her mother and grandmother has a prayer of POSSIBLY liking him.
There is a vast difference between a widowed mom and this girl. The widow WISHED her husband was still there.
There is a vast difference between a divorced mom and this girl. A divorced mom still has to compromise with dad, liked dad once, and probably wants to get another man in the future.
This girl had none of that. The men were treated like Tampax, a useful item to deal with a messy situation, but disposed of at the first possible opportunity once the job is done.
This is almost a cry for help by this woman. She knows she is missing something but has no idea what.
She is a writer in New York City and maybe a Five. (A Six in good light and with some strong preparation)
Anyone who has read Date-Onomics knows that she's fucked, and not in a good way.
There are 5.5 million college educated women and only 4.1 million college educated guys.
You think this woman is going to lower her standards to date a plumber?
That is four women to three men. Yet she is a Five...and she has a family which would make thoughtful men run for the hills.
New York has 38% more women than men in that cohort. Men know the market. Those who want to be married did...and they probably pulled a girl at least a number higher than they are.
Those who want to play the field can because a lot of women want to change his mind.
It reminds me of Amy Horton, who goes on and on about her dating life including her infidelity (twice) and genital warts thinking it makes her interesting.
Well, maybe interesting, but not exactly dateable.
So yes, I think this woman is interesting. We'd have to have a White Plague or The Handmaid's Tale to make her partner material, with a pre-nup and a vow to NEVER make me see any of her relatives.
She should get some face tattoos. That's the ticket.
She'll never have to deal with those questions again.
I hope that the silver lining of such cases (which are indeed unjust) is that they will scare off men from providing sperm.
With respect, Pants, perhaps then you would never have been born. That would be unfortunate.
Kelly said...
Do people think that way in this day and age? They run because she doesn’t have a father? I call bullshit.
8/5/18, 3:39 AM
They run because she is a dumpster fire visible from space. Is she that way because of no father, or what? Is a fair question.
Cowardly, and in the service of perpetuating their own idiotic blind spots. It's like how they totally ignored the 9 to 1 pro-Bernie Sanders comments in D primary pieces when deciding what to cover for the rest of the campaigns leading up to and after Hillary Clinton's nomination.
You'd think someone would realize that an inability to live with or probably even relate to the entire half of the species that she's supposed to be attracted to would disqualify her from participating in perpetuating it, but these are crazy women. Absolute nutters and irrational as hell. I can't help but wonder if there won't be some horrifying evolutionary dead-end that they're creating - as if a human existence that viewed its own basic capacity for sexual and social cooperation with horror could have any other outcome.
I'm grateful for Misplaced's story, and even "exiled's" - despite how crazy and occasionally evil exiled otherwise is. Sounds like the right choice was made for the right reasons.
I can say that without a doubt my father was an incredibly maturing and calming influence in my own life and upbringing. My mom is colorful as hell, afraid of no one and doesn't take anything from any guy - but would never have imagined doing something like what's described in the article. If she'd raised us alone we may have either grown to be as crazy as her or possibly developed the psychological distance to at least put her craziness into better perspective. Either way, my dad still loved/loves her crazy ass, and provided the vast majority of the necessary psychological assets into the raising of that family. But at least she wasn't narcissistic enough to think her own nurturing drive was more important than the entire framework into which that's supposed to fit. Just buy a fucking pet instead, or adopt, or give Sally Struthers the cost of a cup of coffee a month to save a starving child in Africa.
But the idea that making people come out of your own vagina is so important and overwhelming a goal that it should take an end-run around the whole reason for why they should have gotten there in the first place is just Grade-A insanity. It's so loopy as to basically constitute a sort of personal eugenics experiment.
Lady, if Darwin couldn't get you the man you want, or at least provide you one who found you worth reproducing with, then TAKE A FUCKING HINT.
For this reason I'm not as willing to let the donor dads as easily off the hook, either.
Donor Parenthood:
Procreative masturbation.
The masturbation of procreation.
Another person, like the "Your Black Friend" guy I just commented on, who needs to get a life.
Solipsism is NOT an attractive lifestyle.
Another crazed jewess. Chalk up another one to the jew nation-wreckers.
My only question is if any of her 5 siblings are male. I would hate to have been bereft of familial male role models.
And yet again, there seems to be a gap between what men are supposed to find attractive and what men actually do find attractive.
And yet again, the solution offered by the New York Times: Men must change!" (And if they won't change, perhaps they could be, umm, changed?).
"He wanted more kids, so he very briefly married a woman he had met at the neighborhood plant store in order to put his sperm in to have a fifth child."
Probably wouldn't have been published like that.
rofl your terrible upbringing destroyed your ability to think rationally.
They ask questions about your dad because having two parents is how kids are raised, it has nothing to do with something wrong with them. You thinking all of this is a reflection on something wrong with you... because none of it is accurate.
Clearly, growing up in a "matriarchy" aka a psychologically damaging environment with a mentally unstable mother, is not the answer. You CLEARLY needed a father to straighten you out. Marrying solely as a sperm donor? And you think this is healthy, rational behavior? Seriously, your entire family probably needs help.
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