Another commenter said:
It was a bit cringy to me due to having kids on the spectrum. My wife went a bit silent during those scenes and I could tell it was bothering her as well. We struggle a lot with both of them, especially with school. And our lives are really stressful, it's nice to take a break and watch some curb. But then it was a bit of a gut punch seeing comedy based on your children's disabilities. =(
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63 comments:
"It was a bit cringy to me..."
I haven't watched the show in years, but isn't every episode like that?
People fake cancer. And when the community rallies around them to collect money for their legal bills, they keep it.
Given that, why would anyone think their disease is sacrosanct?
I haven't watched the show in years, but isn't every episode like that?
It's the cornerstone of his comedy.
The idea is that you can avoid consequences for being an asshole if people think you have Asperger's.
If this idea caught on, the people who actually have it will face skepticism.
It's like emotional support animals... don't you assume all those people are fakes?
I had a conversation with a guy at the bar a week ago.
He was being purposefully rude and condescending to a woman I know, and I called him on it.
His answer was that he had "low-level autism" that made him act that way.
I told him it wasn't autism, that he was just an asshole.
I've met several (young) people who have claimed to have 'minor' Asperger's or a form of autism like it's an excuse to be odd or, yes, an asshole. A 'Get Out of Jail Free' card for social embarrassment.
A form of narcissism, maybe.
I am Laslo.
If you want cringe-inducing shows about autism watch "Atypical" on Netflix. That was far more painful.
Larry David didn't bother me. I think the point of the show is that being a jerk is being a jerk, and there's not really an excuse.
It's like emotional support animals... don't you assume all those people are fakes?
If you dress up your dog so you can take him with you everywhere your problem is legit.
I thought he was supposed to be an unsympathetic comedy protagonist. We laugh at his stupidity and possibly at his come uppance. It isn't admirable he came up with this lie.
There are plenty of shows that use bad with people means genius yay being on the spectrum or fandom that posits so and so is a genius because of being in the
Being on the spectrum that this seems rather benign.
ASD people should still be expected to follow social norms. I'm responsible for what I say. The idea that a high-IQ person can't learn how to function in society is wrong. It certainly takes longer, but someone in their 40s, for example, really has no excuse.
I'm not talking about low-functioning autism, but what used to be called "Asperger's."
Disabilities are to be overcome, not celebrated.
The idea is that you can avoid consequences for being an asshole if people think you have Asperger's.
The idea is that everything is a disease today, and the assholes of the world might just be walking around undiagnosed.
I'm sure Larry David has been asked time and again whether he is "on the spectrum".
I dunno. I have never got the enthusiasm for Curb. I just don't think it's funny. I loved Seinfeld (still do). So I think I must have liked Larry David's sense of humor. But since season 1 I've tried to watch Curb and tried to like it. I struggle to even make it through an episode. It sucks. Not funny. Mostly an annoying waste of time (as is most of what's on the other 252 channels). I've had friends exasperated with me because 'I just don't get it'. I get it. He's not funny. Can't make him funny just to be part of the enthusiastic crowd.
It's a show based on an asshole. I see and deal with real assholes everyday. They're not funny either.
The key to Larry David comedy is finding the navigable route through treacherous waters. It worked in the Seinfeld days. Now the waters are unnavigable.
Morons stamped out moron jokes too.
I have low-level Patience Interaction Syndrome.
I lose my patience with assholes.
I am Laslo.
Teacher: Larry, was it?
Larry: Yes.
Teacher: Um, I just noticed that you didn't, uh, namaste with the other yogis.
Larry: Yeah, not a namaste guy.
Larry: I don't participate in group activities.
Larry: You know, I don't sing the birthday song.
Larry: "Happy birthday to you", you know, so, you know.
Teacher: Namaste means "the light within me greets the light within you."
Larry: There is no light within me, that's the only problem there.
A lot of people also self-diagnose themselves with Bipolar Disorder.
I ask them what meds they are on to see if they are the same as mine.
They usually respond that they don't take meds, they haven't seen a doctor for that.
I tell them this Bipolar Black Man is going to kick their ass.
They say "You're not black".
Exactly.
I am Laslo.
I have low-level Patience Interaction Syndrome.
Let's not forget your intense "pony-tail swish, pony-tail swish" attraction.
They usually respond that they don't take meds, they haven't seen a doctor for that.
It's another symptom of our society's hierarchy by victimization that people now self-diagnose favorable illnesses for themselves. "Please, my support pig and I must have an aisle seat on this sold-out flight."
If it's a medical condition, I can't be held responsible. And if I can't fix it and you have to accommodate me because of it, my life just got a whole lot easier.
He had Michael J. Fox on an entire episode replete with jokes about Parkinson's disease. People have to stop personalizing everything everywhere about themselves, separate from their world, and maybe just watch television, and then not sit down with the press about their "feelings."
He wasn't even making fun of aspbergers. He's making fun of people not understanding it.
On the Spectrum = fake diagnosis.
@Laslo
Bipolar exists, it's what happens when you have mania for a week or two. If someone isn't running around like a meth head, not sleeping, they aren't bipolar.
"Bipolar II" is the diagnosis given to women for being traumatized. It's a very gendered diagnosis, like borderline.
John Lynch said...
@Laslo
"Bipolar exists, it's what happens when you have mania for a week or two."
I know. I actually have been diagnosed (along with another psychiatric disorder). I know the difference between 'off-meds' and 'on-meds.'
I am Laslo.
@Laslo
Agreeing with you, not doubting your expertise. Sorry to come off wrong.
"The idea is that you can avoid consequences for being an asshole if people think you have Asperger's"
A great premise for priceless comedy bits:
"The idea is that you can avoid consequences for being an asshole if people think you are ____"
1. Progressive
2. A woman
3. An NFL player or commissioner
I get the whole "this is just too damn painful to watch" feeling when your kids are young, and you're nightmare-envisioning your child going through a kangaroo court in college because they are already struggling (and usually failing) to master the expected social interactions of kindergarten. That's a pretty common parent neurosis.
But over time, you drill and drill and drill them on certain basics, and it does begin to stick. The hard part is that, when we were growing up, these missteps meant you're an asshole. Today, the missteps mean you're evil.
Next episode, Larry David has decided to live his life as a gay man.
I thought he was supposed to be an unsympathetic comedy protagonist.
Which was also true of the Seinfeld foursome, and which a lot of people who also found that show "cringy" didn't seem to get. Though I'm sure some people get it but don't care for it. I find Larry David refreshingly non-PC. I'm sure he hates Republicans as much as most in Hollywood but you can't detect it from his humor.
If you find the right angle you can make anything funny. John Cleese says that the Mr. Muckle scene in "It's a Gift" was written by W. C. Fields to win a bet with somebody who said he couldn't make a comedy about a blind man. Cleese: “And he did something very clever: he made the blind man a THREAT.” (Fields even ups the ante by making Mr. Muckle deaf in the bargain). The screenwriter & documentarian (and blogger) David Cairns goes into great detail about exactly how Fields pulls it off.
Larry David claims to have Asperger's syndrome to avoid retribution
Like ("I Love") Lucy, David habitually lies and then lies to hide his lies.
Poor Larry. Brain power gone wild is not autism. It just makes many folks angry who can't keep up with the ideas being expressed.So they call people names for upsetting their view of the world.
For a real Autism learning experience , see the flic, Temple Grandin . It is on all the movie services and worth the time.
So are we about to find out that Bill Clinton is going to the Spacey/Weinstein center to be treated for sex addiction? And we'll also find out how he was able to fight through his pain, and despite having to deal with that horrible affliction, was still able to be the best President EVAH!! Oh, and if Trump hadn't colluded with the Russians, Bill would have been the best Presidential spouse EVAH! Damn that Trump!!
I'm there to watch Lorelai Gilmore swear at me.... rawr!
I had sex with this chick once, and I sperged all over her face.
"Sperg" is a euphemism for ejaculation, right?
Because if it is then I definitely have Spergers.
I am Laslo.
One of Glee's horror-show characters, Sugar Motta, used self-diagnosed Asperger's Syndrome to claim that she can "pretty much say whatever she wants."
The people who I know with low level autism, aka Aspergers, (including several close family members and I suspect myself as well) are high functioning and socially clueless inept dorks. They may come off as being odd, coming from left field in a weirdo way, slightly rude, self absorbed or unfeeling. However, there is no malice, just unable to read the clues or contain their own enthusiasm about various subjects.
Clueless is more the operating mode rather than asshole.
Just my observations.
And yeah. Most comfort animals are a crock and a way for someone to break the rules about bringing pets into public areas. If you need to bring a pet pig with you everywhere you go, perhaps you need to stay home.
"However, there is no malice..."
Yes.
I am Laslo.
Dennis Leary nails it:
I'm an Asshole
I've known guys that clearly had some sort of spectrum disorder and in the end I knew they had it but mostly I just thought they were assholes. And I guess that sucks for them. And probably makes me an asshole too but that's life huh
People complaining sound like assholes. They should claim to have 'spergers.
""Sperg" is a euphemism for ejaculation, right?"
I was once fucking this chick from behind, and I pulled out and sperged all over her ass.
That's right: Ass Spergers.
I am Laslo.
Don't ask me how you make 'sperghetti'.
White sauce joke, that.
I am Laslo.
Earlier in the episode, Leon answered Larry's door and the guy coming over to collect the check for Larry's auto accident told him to forget it when he saw he was black. That guy was an asshole to Larry over the phone.
In Germany they ask "Spergen Sie Deutsch?"
You hear it in a lot of German Porn.
I am Laslo.
"Bipolar exists, it's what happens when you have mania for a week or two. If someone isn't running around like a meth head, not sleeping, they aren't bipolar."
Talking to a woman yesterday, who very likely has Aspberger's. At her age, there would be no reason to do so. Sister was bipolar, not diagnosed until her 30s maybe. Medicine just didn't know that much about either disability at the time. In any case, their mother wouldn't let them help her cook except to knead bread. So, one time, the mother shanghaies the daughters into kneading bread. The bipolar one was excited. The other not so much - a lot of hard work. Mother leaves the room, and when she comes back, the kitchen was a disaster with flour and dough everywhere, including on the ceiling. Apparently, the bipolar one had decided to make pizza like they do on TV, spinning around a crust, throwing it up in the air... After this, only the other one had to knead the bread. Lot of funny stories about growing up with a bipolar sister, decades later, but apparently not so fun to have lived with. One of the bad parts was that the bipolar one would periodically try to kill or maim her sister. Not through physical assaults (though she fought and beat more girls in her HS than any other), but by taking advantage of her sister's gullibility. That's where the Aspberger's comes in - they take things very literally, and that made her overly susceptible to a sister who gets excited about crossing boundaries. For example, the bipolar one talked her sister into drinking paint thinner when they were little by telling her it was milk and good for her. Ended up in the hospital. Did that a lot.
Honestly unless you have a child with a disorder that makes them behave in ways that are very difficult to manage, you can't even imagine it. Frequently kids with Aspergers, anxiety disorders, bipolar, etc, behave exactly like bratty assholes, and normal parenting does nothing to change these behaviors until you can get the underlying problem stablized (and good luck finding decent "help" from mental health professionals.) Meanwhile the parents struggle to create order from chaos at home, they're socially isolated and lack support, and everyone from grandma to the teacher and grocery store checker is blaming them for the kids' behavior.
Sometimes humor helps and you certainly need thick skin, but there are times that other people laughing at the situation that's making your life a living hell is just a bit too much.
It's like emotional support animals... don't you assume all those people are fakes?
Yes, also grown men who follow little girls into the restrooms because they claim to identify as a woman.
Kids with Aspergers have a very tough time of it in school. It isn’t funny from their perspective or their parents’.
I think about David Foster Wallace a lot.
One, I like his writing, how his mind worked.
The other thing is this from Wiki:
"Wallace's father said that he had suffered from major depressive disorder for more than 20 years and that antidepressant medication had allowed him to be productive.[20] Wallace experienced severe side effects from the medication,[21] and in June 2007 stopped taking phenelzine, his primary antidepressant drug, on his doctor’s advice.[20] The depression recurred, and he tried other treatments, including electroconvulsive therapy. Eventually he went back on phenelzine but found it ineffective..."
The idea that the drug that glues you together may not work for you one day scares me.
A little bit like Russian Roulette, mentally.
I am Laslo.
Only liberals can make spectrum jokes, the rest of you well you are evil if you do it, we liberals do it for a higher cause which makes it ok. And that is how they get away with rape, murder, theft and lying, they tell you they do if for a higher cause.
If you have a support animal that belongs on a plate, like pigs, chickens, ducks, goat or rabbit then you should face skepticism. There was a loophole created for people to bring their pets everywhere and now they have pushed it too far, maybe we should have a new gov't agency to take care of that issue.
We had a friend who was an engineer, invented many things including the process of putting the coating on computer discs in the 1950's for those giant discs when he was an engineer for IBM (probably the wrong terminology)....really big ones like this photo......aaaaanyway.
He had a grandson who was autistic, very advanced in math and other science types of studies as a very early age. Those skills seemed to run in his family (genetic?) Already taking college classes. I met the grandson when he was 11 yrs and our friend was watching him while parents were on vacation. This was a party where he was basically the only one under the age of 40. Booooooring for the kid.
Because he was bored (and who can blame him with a bunch of old farts) he started being a little asshole and annoying his grandfather. I saw he was playing a hand held computer game and being a nerd myself who loves gaming, I engaged him in a conversation and we spent about an hour discussing and playing the game. He was so happy to "teach" me the game and actually let me use his game device, which was really unusual as mostly he would freak if someone tried to see it. I was really interested in the game, not just pretending to humor him and I think he could tell.
Finally realizing that I was being rude (clueless remember) to the other people who probably were wondering what was wrong with ME...I thanked him for teaching me and letting me play his game, told him I had to go visit with other people.
Next year when he came to visit his grandfather, he asked if I was going to be coming over because he had a NEW game. Our friend was amazed because his grandson hardly ever interacted with strangers or would remember people outside of his family.
Not an asshole kid on purpose. Just bored, clueless and absorbed by some things like his game. I felt very good that he considered me a friend. Like to like I guess. Nerds and geeks recognize each other :-)
John Lynch – “ASD people should still be expected to follow social norms. I'm responsible for what I say. The idea that a high-IQ person can't learn how to function in society is wrong. It certainly takes longer, but someone in their 40s, for example, really has no excuse.
I'm not talking about low-functioning autism, but what used to be called "Asperger's."
Disabilities are to be overcome, not celebrated. “ 11/16/17, 6:58 AM
In large part, I agree with you but.. it might not be as simple as you think.
My oldest son has what used to be referred to as Asperger’s Syndrome, now called high level autism. He’s been tested to have a 160 IQ, he graduated high school early with a 4.0 with a very advanced course load. He was the starting defensive end on the football team that won the state championship three of the four years he played on the varsity football team. He broke his school record in the 200M dash as a sophomore. He is an Eagle Scout and has been heavily involved with the youth group at our church. Currently he is on an academic scholarship studying petroleum geology and paleontology and in his first semester it looks like he has a 4.0.
He has never had one single friend. Not one, not ever.
He’s had a very few acquaintances but they either tire of him very quickly or worse case, take advantage of him.
His mother and I have done everything we know how to do and continue to try to find ways for him to understand social norms. It’s an astounding thing to repeat again and again things that seem so easy to understand to this brilliant young man and look into his eyes and realize he just doesn’t get it.
As far as the joke on the Larry David show, people need to lighten up. Everything can’t be off limits.
@Unclebilly, at some point the light goes on, and the awkward kid with the high IQ starts to focus his (it's almost always a "him") intelligence on dealing with people and he does very well. Wait, keep helping, and watch for the light to go on.
There's two interesting shows on tv these days that deal directly with disabilities. Well, maybe more, but 2 I've watched that are new or recently new. One, is the Good Doctor, which gets critical acclaim from what I hear, but is so overwhelmingly heavy handed with the "let's include autistic people" that I couldn't watch more than 2 episodes. The writing on the show is "beat people over the head with our message" in just about every way. Freddie Highmore is a good actor, but the writing is just really not good. It's basically the autism equivalent of a Kirk Cameron evangelism movie.
On the other side is the not entirely great, but more honest show Speechless, about a teenager with cerebral palsy. It has some good insights but approaches the topics with humor, a kind of humor that reflects actual experiences with such handicaps in this current world. I have a close family member with severe physical handicaps, so I know what such a family life can be like. The writing isn't great, but it has moments of fun while never making fun of handicaps. It offers a much more human reality and advocacy.
Speechless also stars an actor with cerebral palsy in the main role while the Good Doctor has an actor playing someone with autism. Which says to me that Speechless actually takes its message more seriously in practice.
John Lynch said...
ASD people should still be expected to follow social norms. I'm responsible for what I say. The idea that a high-IQ person can't learn how to function in society is wrong. It certainly takes longer, but someone in their 40s, for example, really has no excuse.
I'm not talking about low-functioning autism, but what used to be called "Asperger's."
Disabilities are to be overcome, not celebrated.
Interesting. We're supposed to excuse the bad behavior of the woman from yesterday's Uber thread because, as a woman, she allegedly felt vulnerable and her feelings and emotions have to be considered when evaluating her behavior. To me that position treats "being a woman" as a type of disability for which the rest of us have to make allowances, and I object to people both doing that AND insisting that all they want is equality/equal treatment.
You're saying that the people with Aspergers--a recognized cognitive disability--should be held to the same standard of behavior as non-disabled people: that we should expect people with that particular (mild) disability to learn to adjust themselves, etc. You're saying that although they have that disability we should still treat them equally--we should hold them to the same standards and use the same standard to evaluate their behavior.
Interesting.
Paddy O,
I have not seen "Speechless", but like you I did give "The Good Doctor" a chance and had the exact same reaction- way too heavy handed and extremely unrealistic about those with autism.
Your comment, though, reminded me the show "Life Goes On" which had as one of the main characters a young man with Down's Syndrome played by an actor who actually had the disorder. My memory is that show was a bit more realistic about the disability.
Yancey, Life Goes On has been on my mind too. It has been a while, but I too think it was more realistic.
The latest Curb Your Enthusiasm season is startlingly mean in a not-really-funny way.
I lose my patience with assholes.
I am Laslo.
And your essence.
Check out Josh Blue on youtube. He is a standup comedian with cerebral palsy who uses the disability in his routine a lot.
Beware the soft bigotry of low expectations.
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