Wrote David Horsey, quoted in "A Pulitzer-winning columnist took jabs at Sarah Huckabee Sanders’s weight and appearance. He then apologized" (WaPo).
I really don't give a damn that he apologized, because — big deal: He got lambasted for writing "Sarah Huckabee Sanders does not look like the kind of woman Donald Trump would choose as his chief spokesperson" and he's doing all he can to save his ass.
"By comparison [to Ivanka and Melania], Sanders looks more like a slightly chunky soccer mom who organizes snacks for the kids' games. Rather than the fake eyelashes and formal dresses she puts on for news briefings, Sanders seems as if she'd be more comfortable in sweats and running shoes."He thought he had Trump-hate privilege. Didn't work out quite that way.
Actually the cartoon is very well drawn and I like seeing women criticized just as sharply as men, and that means the visual depictions should be just as cruel:
“Sanders looks like a chunky soccer mom.”— Brianna Wu (@Spacekatgal) November 3, 2017
What editor published this shockingly sexist piece from @davidhorsey at the @latimes? pic.twitter.com/91mLOqCe4s
It's sexist not to trash women as viciously as men. And to say that we can't is to argue against giving women any power. Can't criticize them, can't make fun of them. Get ready for a long grim future of That's not funny.
Horsey should have defended himself. What apology weasels we've become!
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102 comments:
Trump is miles deep under their skin.
We know. A woman's most important responsibility is to be hot. Especially those brass asses on the sculpture in Las Vegas.
It's sexist to judge professional people on their appearance. Fucking duh, Althouse.
Retired people never apologize. The others would lose their jobs.
It's not apologies you want to go after but mob action.
This culture of people needing to constantly apologize over the slightest offense taken is getting really annoying.
The chief mob is women. The audience for all this stuff.
He should apologize for apologizing.
Women structurally will want contradictory things. You can always play to them.
1. Special protection
2. Equality
Nobody will fire him for apologizing, so he doesn't have to apologize for that.
The funny thing about this is that it is really more complimentary to Trump than anything else, isn't it?
And to Huckabee Sanders, of course. It implies that she got her job on ability rather than looks.
I find all of this very amusing. Given that Trump's last spokesman was savaged for his looks, it does seem as if an equal standard would allow that with Huckabee Sanders. But the joke is that it is really support for both her and Trump, and today I am in the mood to see the joke.
RH, you sure are worried about these mobs.
He had nothing to apologize for. He shouldn’t have.
Really Professor? I’m surprised at your take on this.
The guy was wrong. He should have apologized.
Stick to the issues. What they look like/how they dress is irrelevant.
“The guy was wrong. He should have apologized.
Stick to the issues. What they look like/how they dress is irrelevant.”
Tell that to Trump. Why hold Horsey to a higher standard than the POTUS himself?
Thank you for saying women should be held to the same standard. I had this disagreement many times with female friends. Whether or not I agree with his opinion, he has the right to say it and he should not have apologized. Having said that, I skimmed the story while doing something else. My initial reaction was "Why does he think Bernie Sanders looks like a chunky soccer Mom?"
Trump-hating privilege is a derivative of Progressive Privilege. Until recently, that had held true. Ted Kennedy was responsible for the death of a young woman and walked away because he voted progressive. Kennedy and Chris Dodd would get drunk and assault waitresses and were never held accountable. Clinton had multiple sexual allegations yet walked away due in large part to attacking the women involved. That is changing. Weinstein believed announcing he would take on the NRA would relieve him of sexual assault allegations. SPacey believed saying he was gay would relieve him of his sexual assault allegations. It is not working as well as it used to.
There is a belief that anything done in the name of hating Trump is excused. Horsey found out the hard way that even that has its limits. It is good that progressive privilege is on the way out.
"Horsey should have defended himself."
Easy for us to say. When the vigilantes suit up with the hoods and pitchforks, they are pretty damn dangerous. But you are nevertheless right that Horsey wimped out. He decided to be transgressive without the balls to back it up. It's not transgressive if you are looking for a free pass.
Sarah Huckabee Sanders is refreshing. One has to admire women who refuse to whine, do not put up with crap, and are capable and willing to throw the bullshit flag and tell the entire White House press corps that they can go fuck themselves. Their only response is to whine and make mysognist remarks, which shows she is right.
Sanders is an attractive woman. Nice eyes, good hair, expressive face. A bit zaftig but there's quite a market for zaftig. But she does not choose to emphasize her looks and instead tries to stick with substance. Bully for her.
Wait, so are you endorsing with the ridiculous "Women's appearances shall NEVER be mentioned" standard or disagreeing with it?
I agree with Althouse. We are being conditioned to take offense to nearly everything, often times on someone else's behalf.
Sanders is an attractive woman. Nice eyes, good hair, expressive face. A bit zaftig...
Um, in her case the word is chunky.
Zaftig is for ladies who are less aggressive. Cuddly. Sanders is about as prickly as a pinecone.
Sarah Huckabee Sanders is refreshing.
LOL! Please, give me a nasty, mendacious, scolding fat woman! I'm so sick and tired of all these attractive, in-shape, pleasant, honest, thoughtful women. Who needs them?
Yes but the point of the story, is to recirculate the Russia narrative ignoring uranium one and the dossier.
LOL! Please, give me a nasty, mendacious, scolding fat woman!
Sorry. She lost.
Chunky and zaftig could mean the same thing, physically. But "chunky" is more appropriate for Sanders because it implies blunt. Same with calling her "stout." Sanders doesn't have any grace, she's a chunk of something. Of who knows what? Maybe like the Frank Sinatra character played by the late Phil Hartman on SNL, she's really tough and has chunks of guys like you in her stool.
A chunk is a big, chewy, tough, undigestible thing in your food. But how else would one describe the Republican demeanor?
I couldn't figure this one out either. Soccer mums are a thing and, let's be honest, very few of them are as hot as Stacy's mum.
Very brave of the professor, but your daily newspaper is not the place for that kind of language about anybody, regardless of race, sex, religion, or political affiliation.
And despite the feminista, we all know that women are sensitive about these matters, so Mr. Horsey was doubly wrong, and such caddish behavior is not to be forgiven, regardless of even the most humble apologies.
She's definitely not svelte, but that adds to her authenticity. She's pleasant looking enough to get her message across. Mostly what you notice about good looking women is their good looks.......I think that's why Meryl Streep wins all those acting awards. People notice her talent because they're not distracted by her non extistent beauty.
Did this guy ever make similar comments about Hillary? Hillary: the most corrupt and criminal female politician since Evita.
What's wrong about the commentary is NOT his reference to her weight. It's drawing her as if she were a member of the SS. Calling anyone a Nazi merely because they are associated with Trump has become a cliche. It is boring. Political commentary can be mean, but it shouldn't be boring.
“....so Mr. Horsey was doubly wrong, and such caddish behavior is not to be forgiven, regardless of even the most humble apologies.”
Yet, it’s forgiven in Trump. Will Trump ever apologize?
It's sexist not to trash women as viciously as men. And to say that we can't is to argue against giving women any power. Can't criticize them, can't make fun of them. Get ready for a long grim future of That's not funny.
But do people criticize men for their looks? Or for what they've done or are doing? So I'm going to disagree with you, Professor. If Horsey criticizes Sanders for the job she is doing as spokesperson, that's one thing. Criticizing her because she doesn't look like a swimsuit model seems to me to be a bit different.
Let's apply this to some of the young women who joined my old company about the time I was retiring. It seems to me that complaining that their software did not meet documentation standards nor did it satisfy all of the requirements allocated to it is perfectly fair -- I would criticize any young man (or older man, for that matter) whose code also failed to meet standards or failed to satisfy requirements. Criticizing the woman because she was too busty or too flat-chester or dressed like a frump or dressed like she was thrown out of the cheapest whorehouse in town for dressing to sleazy, ah, no. Appearance has nothing to do with performance anywhere in the workplace. But, according to you, the two forms of criticism are equivalent.
Is he saying soccer moms who make snacks are awful?
"What apology weasels we've become!"
I'm sorry you feel that way.
Denying reality doesn't make it go away.
Looks are important because they are indicators of genetic and developmental health. To look good all you have to do is be reasonably symmetrical and fall within population norms for facial features and body form. Those qualities suggest that you have good genes and developed in a reasonably good environment. That's not nothing when it comes to judging people.
Saul Alinsky's Radical Rule 4: "Make the enemy live up to their own book of rules. You can kill them with this, for they can no more obey their own rules than the Christian church can live up to Christianity.”
I like fat women. There's no better indicator to a male that a mate isn't out to glom onto his resources than GLUTTONY!
That, and being self-absorbed. Which actually most women are.
It's easy to pick on the fatties though because their particular brand of self-absorption simply manifests with getting lost in physical gustatory pleasure - which can be revealed visually.
But if other chicks went around with signs saying, "Money grubber," "Shallow!" or "Flake!" I'd avoid them and take the fatty to dinner instead. And maybe even bed.
But unless she started showing some interest in self-improvement I'd be as turned off in the long term as a chick thought of nothing other than her own self-improvement.
Mary is useful in understanding the obscure and sometimes even inscrutable unspoken secret pathologies common to most women.
The guy did not say his description was wrong. He said it was insensitive.
The LA Times is so deep in TDS that they sound like Ritmo drunk.
Every issue has four of five stories about how terrible Trump is. It's pretty funny.
"SLIGHTLY chunky" soccer mom is not the most vicious description I've ever heard of a Trump appointee. What happened to "Nazi", "racist", "alt-right", "White supremacist"? Maybe we shouldn't refer to the physical characteristics of political figures. Surely no commenter on this blog ever referred to Hillary's hips, The Donald's hair, Mario's hands, right?
That said, this was a self-inflicted wound by Horsey, his blood's on his own hands.
Had can Horsey defend himself? He's a typical fucking liberal. If any Conservative had criticized an Obama spokeswomen's appearance he would've been screeching "sexism" at the top of his little voice.
He's not going to buck the party line, even if its to claim its a higher form of sexism.
But he wasn't even expressing a personal preference, it was 'Which One Doesn't Belong'.
Speaking of chunky, Grudge has Donna Brazille's picture beneath his MLK lovechild headline. Could it be her ?
Why did he apologize to the readers? And seriously, that didn't uphold the standards of the paper?
All this bullshit shows that the sixties aren't even over.
You can't be opposed to the objectification of women if you're still in favor of the objectification of men.
Women objectify men in different ways than men objectify women, but it's morally no better.
The best indicator is wealth/status/material comfort. Bet your bottom dollar Mary approves of objectifying men that way - just not in the way that women are objectified. Which is a moot point because they aren't, by and large.
The hippies knew the limits of wealth and materialism. The feminists don't. And they're allied with the right-wing when it comes to that.
Strange bedfellow? No. It just explains why both movements are collapsing under the weight of their own short-sightedness and hypocrisy.
You certainly sound entitled.
Does the woman have any say in whether she'd fuck YOU?
ROFLMAO.
The fact that you felt a need to ask this question leads me to believe that you must have an interesting and unusual sex life.
In your head. Completely.
Interesting to see the boundaries of "sexism!" being patrolled by pseudo-women.
"Never change, and listen not to family who suggest you stop drinking. They are just jealous."
I KNEW IT!
I am Laslo.
David Horsey.
This guy goes after Trump's hair?
Keep blow-drying those locks, Sparky.
I am Laslo.
It's about fairness.
He can NOT defend himself, don't you know. He would NEVER work again. He is being harassed just as the young starlets are being harassed, just not sexually.
“This guy goes after Trump's hair?
Keep blow-drying those locks, Sparky.”
At least it’s his own hair cut normally, not grown long to wrap around his massive bald spot.
The bigger issue is Horsey's inability to distinguish "arm candy" from staff positions.
Always treat everybody the same, except when you shouldn't.
"The bigger issue is Horsey's inability to distinguish "arm candy" from staff positions."
Exactly. I guess all women are "arm candy" in Horseyland.
Althouse and Meade must be indisposed, lol.
And I say, embrace the concept of "both/and." It's normally wrong to comment on someone's appearance in a negative way, especially when that person is not in a setting where they are expected to have a certain appearance. This goes for both women and men. The press secretary should be judged on his or her abilities and NOT expected to be thin or handsome.
I didn't see anyone mention the truly interesting aspect of this post. Brianna Wu -- anti-gamergate, transitioned-to-woman, Democrat running for Congress in MA -- defended Sanders. Wu hates Trump and savages women on the wrong side of the aisle. Hmm... what's up?
Maybe Althouse got all hot thinking of the big penis airplane.
"Get ready for a long grim future of That's not funny." You sure you want women's "equality"?
“This goes for both women and men. The press secretary should be judged on his or her abilities and NOT expected to be thin or handsome.”
“Look at that face!' he cries. 'Would anyone vote for that? Can you imagine that, the face of our next president?!'”
Donald Trump about Carly Fiorina
“Stick to the issues. What they look like/how they dress is irrelevant.”
The guy is a cartoonist!
What the look like must be part of how he says something about people !
Political cartoons are a grand tradition. Must it end because: women?
Ridiculous!
Double down on ugly !
David Horsey is a piece of shit.
He was a piece of shit at the Seattle PI.
He's a piece of shit at the LA Times.
This is not news.
Way, way, way too many rules on how to behave.
Tell that to Trump. Why hold Horsey to a higher standard than the POTUS himself?
Snort.
Princess Sky Screamer yammering about standards.
You comment simply points out your own hypocrisy. But you're too blinded by partisanship to see it.
“Political cartoons are a grand tradition. Must it end because: women?
Ridiculous!
Double down on ugly !”
Yes indeed! How is it that so many Trumpists are so PC lately, not even mentioning snowflakish, yet they forgive Trump for the same thing. Oh the hypocrisy.
If you say a woman is not pretty it's saying that there's no way you're interested in anything about her, unless she already has a reputation for being interesting for some other reason.
On the other hand if you say she's pretty you're saying you'd bang her but not hang around, the standard for a quickie.
Looks don't get mentioned if you're doing ideas, or for that matter if you're looking for a serious mate.
Mentioning a man's looks is disparaging either way.
Drinking??
Fuck off. I'm stone-cold sober...
I accept that representation. All the worse for you.
People have such fear of Twitter. All it takes to stop this Cultural Revolution is a wee bit of moral courage. Don’t grovel, if you think you did nothing wrong don’t apologize, not even a non-apology apology. To just ignore it is usually the best. The twitter mob does not want the apology, they want the acknowledgment that have a right to demand it. When they don’t, don’t act like they do.
Laslo, we need another picture, likely harder to obtain, to see if Horsey is a real redhead.
Maybe it's because Trump doesn't hire women simply because they're attractive to him. He hides them because they're competent (e.g., Kellyann Conway).
"Must it end because: women?" Women and Muslims.
Ah, he's the north end of a southbound Horsey.
Liberals are constantly projecting their own insane misogyny and bigotry on normal people.
tcrosse said...
LOL! Please, give me a nasty, mendacious, scolding fat woman!
Sorry. She lost.
Bazinga! We have a thread-winner!
"Sarah Huckabee Sanders does not look like the kind of woman Donald Trump would choose as his chief spokesperson"
That seems to be an assumption that tells us more about Mr. Horsey than Trump. His assumption about what type of woman Trump would hire to do a specific job as compared to the reality of who Trump HAS hired. It seem that Mr. Horsey is the superficial one.
"By comparison [to Ivanka and Melania], Sanders looks more like a slightly chunky soccer mom who organizes snacks for the kids' games. Rather than the fake eyelashes and formal dresses she puts on for news briefings, Sanders seems as if she'd be more comfortable in sweats and running shoes."
I'm pretty sure that even Ivanka and Melania would be more comfortable in sweats and running shoes too.
I'm also pretty sure that Sarah Huckabee Sanders is under no illusions about her own appearance as compared to others. She also seems like someone who is more than comfortable in her OWN skin and with her own abundant and evident strengths. Sarah is a lioness. I love the way she swats down the unruly media kiddies.
In fact Sarah said (paraphrasing) "that being the mother of three children has prepared her to deal with the press corps." Them throwing tantrums and asking stupid questions and all and acting like bratty three year olds.
Are we sure that so-called fat-shaming doesn't work re motivating folks to lose weight?
It seems like the further we get away from this sorta shaming, the fatter folks are getting. IMHO.
The only reason I'd opposed fat-shaming would be if it's shown that this results in some sorta reverse-reaction (like the quandary re telling hicks about con-un-wisdom (Kansas), and then this makes hicks vote for con-un-wisdom (Brownback), likewise DJT.)
Anywho, I'd still probably make fun of fat people, even if I knew this made them get fatter. Likewise cons.
Carry on.
Apologize; what is that? Shame, shun and fire. Alinsky #4.
Horsey should have defended himself. What apology weasels we've become!
What the hell, Althouse! Holding the stupid Lefties to the same stupid standards they hold everyone else is SUCH fun! Why can’t we have fun just like the Lefties do?
anti-de Sitter space said...
Are we sure that so-called fat-shaming doesn't work re motivating folks to lose weight?
Fat shaming is all that stands between us and this.
ARM,
A) That was almost ten years ago. Now, the updated version, w/ a better understanding of AI, would probably be more harsh re us (incl fit us).
B) Anywho even though it may have understated the chubby factor, I prefer the pre-Wall vision of our future idiocracy, circa 2006, re circa 2506.
BTW, the problem w all of these dystopian futures via film flam is: what about the rich folks?
If you gots a good bit of billions, none of those movies present something that you can't (and are ready to) sidestep.
IMHO.
It takes exactly zero courage not to criticize everyone associated with the Trump administration. Huckabee Sanders is not great, but she's a hellavu lot better than the knucklehead she succeeded. That's a tough gig with an erratic boss and a mendacious press (seriously - "Does the White House support slavery?"
But, really, if you have issues with her appearance and sense of fashion, how in the actual fuck can you not hit HRC twice as hard: the weight, the mid-century communism fashion (to try in vain to cover up her huge ass, gut and cankles).
Because you'd lose your job that's why. You can only make fun of the appearance of Republicans.
"the mid-century communism fashion"
I dunno, I doubt 12 grand for an Armani jacket was de rigueur re commies.
It's sexist not to trash women as viciously as men.
It's always been OK to trash Republican and conservative women.
Can't criticize them, can't make fun of them.
When has it ever been different?
Looks are important because they are indicators of genetic and developmental health. To look good all you have to do is be is White and have blond hair and blue eyes. Those qualities suggest that you have good genes and developed in a reasonably good environment. That's not nothing when it comes to judging people.
/s
She isn't fat, she's just big-boned.
Trump's press secretary doesn't resemble his wife, who was a fashion model, or his daughter, whose mother was a model. OK. So what?
She is a hideous cow The paint she recently acquired still makes her look like a pig. Typical republicunt women. She is so flyover red state.
And she is fat. Fat people are. So gross
Ok Professor, let’s play it your way. The guy’s a cartoonist. Let’s see how he drew Hillary and Barack and Michele Obama.
Dig up the archives. And pass the popcorn.
The fact that Obama and Biden were the lead recipients of subprime cartel cash and prosecuted practically none of them, doesn't phase him:
http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/opinion/oped/bal-david-horsey-obama-should-stick-to-principle-and-reject-wall-street-speech-money-20170508-story.html
Speaking of joking about a woman's appearance: Canada's Environment and Climate Change Minister has asked reporters (really conservative reporters) to stop referring to her as Climate Barbie. Her point seems to be that appearance (the resemblance is striking) should not be taken to mean she is stupid, poorly informed, should not hold high office etc.
https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2017/11/04/environment-minister-catherine-mckenna-confronts-reporter-about-climate-barbie-nickname.html
Of course there is another point. Some conservatives think the usual "Climate" talk is always a bit vacuous, and it's even funnier coming from a woman who looks like her. Sometimes men get branded as "beautiful but dumb"; Reagan? Governor Rick Scott of Florida? Rick Perry? Dan Quayle a few years ago? All Republicans. OK, Gary Hart? John Edwards?
Apology Weaseling works. That's why it's done. If people stopped accepting weasel apologies, they'd not be offered.
Can't we just quit trashing people of either sex for their appearance. It really doesn't add anything to the debate.
I'm noticing a trend, that liberals can't stay out of trouble.
Ah, so it’s ok to portray her as a nazi because.....equality??
Typical obtuse academic, Althouse.
Brianna Wu isn't a woman, btw. His name is John Walker Flynt.
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