Okay. Try again. Here:
The editorial board of the Billings Gazette, a CNN affiliate, retracted its endorsement of Gianforte, stating, "We believe that you cannot love America, love the Constitution, talk about the importance of a free press and then pummel a reporter."The Constitution protects freedom of speech and freedom of the press not just for reporters, but for everyone. And the Constitution guarantees due process for the criminally accused. Someone who would "strongly condemn a politician committing assault on a reporter" might also demonstrate a love of constitutional values by refraining from assuming that a particular individual accused of committing a crime is guilty. The hesitation to condemn Gianforte — I believe, even though I averted my eyes from yesterday's swarming and feasting — had to do with a fear that an audiotape was being exploited and possibly distorted to raise a sudden frenzy just as an election was occurring.
Tapper echoed the newspaper's stance.
"Let us add that those public officials finding it difficult these days to muster the courage to strongly condemn a politician committing assault on a reporter, maybe you need to reexamine how much you truly love the Constitution beyond just saying the words," he said.
You talk about courage, but jumping into a frenzied mob isn't a mark of courage. Show me everyone who without hesitation condemned Gianforte, and I'd like to know whether he or she either: 1. Wanted the Republican to lose the election, or 2. Was afraid of getting attacked for endorsing violence. Is there anyone left? Show me the man or woman of true courage.
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222 comments:
1 – 200 of 222 Newer› Newest»I saw Jesse wrestle in Black River Falls, Wisc. He lost when he got kicked out for slugging the ref. He was quite the showman.
Donald Trump bodyslams, beats and shaves Vince McMahon at Wrestlemania XXIII
The above video must be seen to be believed. Trump is on the floor, hitting a man on the head over and over and over.
Montana is the wild west, he probably gained votes.
I think it was a last minute hit job, Reporters are eager to be part of the story these days.
It's the Woodward and Bernstein syndrome.
The Guardian twerp shoved his way into a private meeting with local press, shoved a camera and microphone into Gianforte's face and demanded answers to questions that were not local issues.
The story I read said the candidate said, "Get that thing out of my face," and tried to grab the microphone or camera. The reporter then did the NBA flop screaming about being injured.
The reporter has a reputation as obnoxious.
And the guy in Montana won!
I'm pretty sure Gianforte didn't "pummel" the asshole Democratic operative "reporter". Although someone should.
a CNN affiliate ... "We believe "
Who cares?
Let's put aside this minor assault. People hate the press today and for good reason. Very biased. Constantly speculating. Pushing agendas (e.g. Global warming). 24/7 attacks on Trump from all sides. Clueless and out of touch. Arrogant. Important stories ignored. Few reports on Venezuela. Many examples like this.
I'll show you the man of true courage. Donald J. Trump.
I voted for Jesse Ventura. Believe it or not, he was the least unattractive of the three candidates. It was also a thumb in the eye of both major party establishments. Sound familiar ?
From the dialogue it appears that Gianforte already had his dander up from a previous encounter with a Guardian reporter. What's up with The Guardian's interest in Montana of all places?
I rather think Jake Tapper is full of prunes. Reporters are not special snowflakes. They should not be subject to abuse any more than other citizens, but nor do they have any special privileges other than that the Government cannot censor what they print based on political opinion.
The only excuse for what Gianforte did was if the reporter assaulted Gianforte and he was defending himself. There is zero evidence that the reporter initiated the assault. Someone being obnoxious does not justify assault.
Apparently, many of your commenters (and you since you are giving Gianforte every benefit of the doubt even after he has admitted he was in the wrong) have not matured beyond the level of a sixth grade bully.
Even if it wasn't as bad as it was made out to be, I find the altercation inexcusable and I'm glad that Gianforte apologized.
But generally, it seems to me that rather than "body slams", reporters have a lot more to fear from the weaponization of the NATSEC espionage arsenal being turned on them as it was during the Obama administration.
Ms. Attkisson also has her own story to tell. Formerly at CBS News, she was one of the few journalists at mainstream outlets who aggressively reported on the Fast and Furious scandal and the Benghazi massacre. In the latter, we recall, Rice and other Obama officials falsely told the public that the attack, which resulted in the killing of four Americans including the U.S. ambassador, grew out of spontaneous protest against an anti-Muslim video (rather than being a coordinated jihadist strike). The Obama administration later used its criminal-prosecution authority to trump up a case against its chosen scapegoat: the video producer. Attkisson’s reporting prompted internal administration complaints that she was “out of control.” As a tale of political spying intrigue, Dennis Kucinich’s story would not be worth telling. But can it so easily be dismissed after the spying on American critics of the Iran deal? Based on examinations by two forensic experts, Attkisson and CBS eventually reported that her personal and work computers were “accessed by an unauthorized, external, unknown party on multiple occasions.” Was this “unknown party” the government? The experts say it was a highly advanced intruder, which “used sophisticated methods to remove all possible indications of unauthorized activity.” Moreover, one computer was infiltrated remotely by the use of “new spy software proprietary to a federal agency.” One of Attkisson’s sources — an unidentified “intelligence-connected” source who suggests that she has been under government surveillance — told her, as she puts it, that “the government has pushed the envelope like never before and that the public would be shocked to ‘learn the extent that the government is conducting surveillance of private citizens.’” According to Attkisson, the FBI opened an investigation of intrusions of her computer. Although the bureau contacted CBS, agents never contacted her, Attkisson reports. In addition, despite her numerous Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) requests, the FBI is said to be withholding investigative information about her.
Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/article/446843/barack-obama-spying-journalists-dennis-kucinich-sharyl-attkisson-donald-trump-campaign-transition
The proper way to deck a reporter is to begin with "I'm tired of your disingenuous assertions."
"jumping into a frenzied mob isn't a mark of courage." Then again, courage isn't the prime virtue for for the people invoking it here. More like a shaming tool.
And the media deliberately stoked racial violence by distorting the facts behind the shootings/desths of Trayvon Martin, Micheal Brown, Eric Garner, Freddie Gray and Keith Scott. Resulting in millions in property damage, dozens injured and the assassinations of several police officers.
If ISIS flew a 747 into the New York Times building, I would have to make an effort to feel bad about it.
"Someone being obnoxious does not justify assault."
-- Most people agree with it, but just a few months ago, we were told obnoxiousness of opinion was, in fact, a way to justify assault. A consistency in the application of this opinion would be most welcome.
The media are terrified that we might hate them.
I wonder why?
"There is zero evidence that the reporter initiated the assault. Someone being obnoxious does not justify assault. "
Shoving a camera/microphone into someone's face after forcing your way through a closed door into a private meeting is getting close to "provocation."
I know this doesn't fit your narrative but some us see things a little differently.
Not to be like a liberal and link unrelated events, but.....the Berkeley Daily Californian editors say its okay to use violence to stop "hate speech". So can't we just say that the Guardian is hate speech?
Someone being obnoxious does not justify assault.
Agreed. But this maxim should apply universally.
@ St George
Awesome! Hilarious. Good find.
"true courage"
Hard to find on the left these days. From my observations, Dershowitz is about it.
I saw a bar spat once between two gals. One gal was a very good actor. When the first lady pushed her away, the 2nd one immediately fell to the floor and started acting like she was injured. Then called 911 to report an assault. The Montana case reminds me of this.
Reporter pushing dubious story to try to swing an election at the last minute.
Talk of "Courage"
Is this an oblique reference to Dan Rather?
I recommend the revival of dueling.
In restrospect, the long term effect of ending the practice has been detrimental. It took a very long time to realize it, but nonetheless it is so.
Tapper used to just be a reporter who was interested in getting the facts. Now it seems he is a personality who must speak on behalf of his colleagues and his profession.
I liked him better before.
Michael K "NBA flop screaming"
I wonder whether this what happened. The reporter shoves in, the candidate tells him to speak to the PR person, the reporter jams closer, the candidate turns into the reporter who is too close, brushes or pushes the reporter and the reporter who is off-balance, falls. Reporter rises, screaming about a body slam. Media plays up story of alleged body slam in order to cause election loss which is The Lewandoski Move aka "NBA flop screaming." Voters vote for Republican, not because they think reporters should be body-slammed but because they do not believe the first accounts in the media. The first accounts turn out not to be true. The Republican wins. The media is hardened in its resolve to distort while claiming First Amendment privileges. The onlookers are hardened in their resolve never to believe the first account in mainslime media.
"many of you have not matured beyond 6th grade bully"
Iterated Prisoners Dilemma
My team has always renounced political violence. '
Your team has always supported political violence.
And now you are outraged we stopped renouncing violence?
Gimme your lunch money.
"Let us add that those public officials finding it difficult these days to muster the courage to strongly condemn a politician committing assault on a reporter
How about:
"Let us add that those reporters finding it difficult these days to muster the courage to strongly condemn a mob committing assaults on Republicans and Conservatives maybe you need to reexamine how much you truly love the Constitution beyond just saying the words."
Late last night while watching FOX coverage of the campaign they were showing shots from the two different campaign rallies as the votes was still being counted (could also have been after the election call). I noted that the shot from Dems had Quist being very buddy buddy with the Guardian reporter.
Someone being obnoxious does not justify assault.
It used to. And there were a lot fewer obnoxious people in those days.
Jake Tapper should read some Mark Twain on life as an itinerant reporter.
Pro tip: unless they are covering the Supreme Court, reporters who bring up the Constitution are pushing an agenda.
Shoving a camera/microphone into someone's face after forcing your way through a closed door into a private meeting is getting close to "provocation."
I guess if you have the moral maturity of a sixth grader it is. Most of us abandoned playground morality years ago.
The only excuse for what Gianforte did was if the reporter assaulted Gianforte and he was defending himself.
Legitimate question and not really about this case because I haven't followed the details. Are you allowed to use physical force when someone is shoving something in your face (finger, cellphone etc) but not touching you?
I had an incident at work many years ago where a man was yelling in my face. Spit flying and his finger waving very close to my eyes and nose. I told him to get the fuck out of my face or I'd deck him. Yet he persisted. I grabbed his finger and twisted his hand away. I guess his finger got broke or sprained or something. That shut him up.
Do we have a right to defend our space?Was that wrong? Was it a crime?
Late last night while watching FOX coverage of the campaign they were showing shots from the two different campaign rallies as the votes was still being counted (could also have been after the election call). I noted that the shot from Dems had Quist being very buddy buddy with the Guardian reporter.
5/26/17, 9:30 AM
Was the "reporter" in a neck brace and a wheelchair?
Most of us abandoned playground morality years ago.
Yeah...tell that to Milo, Coulter and Murray........
You talk about courage, but jumping into a frenzied mob isn't a mark of courage.
Exactly. This is a major drawback of social media. Too many people echo whatever the popular opinion seems to be. It's obvious that they haven't given any independent thought. It encourages the mob mentality. Virtual crowd psychology.
It makes it hard for people to think of any one thing as a big deal when reporters tell us everything a Republican does is shocking!, an outrage!, unacceptable!, etc.
The editorial board of the Billings Gazette, a CNN affiliate, retracted its endorsement of Gianforte, stating, "We believe that you cannot love America, love the Constitution, talk about the importance of a free press and then pummel a reporter."
A bit dramatic, folks.
A guy lost his cool and did something stupid, professional and illegal. The reporter works for a stridently left-wing publication dedicated to advancing certain politicians over others. It's understandable it would provoke someone.
Has Jake Tapper taken time to lecture against the Trump supporters chased down in the street and beaten, their hats torn off and set on fire? How about the left-wing goons beating political opponents on college campuses?
Once you've done that, I'd love to hear what you have to say about free speech.
The college students I was teaching when Jesse Ventura was elected voted in droves for Jesse. They thought it was the cool thing to do.
It was a kind of a lark. They did it in huge numbers and pushed him to victory. We talked about it in class.
"I guess if you have the moral maturity of a sixth grader it is."
I guess you need to see what assault looks like.
That what assault looks like.
You're welcome.
One more busted flush for the Democrats, I hear.
Most of us learned in kindergarten not to act like that reporter.
Freder Frederson said...
Most of us abandoned playground morality years ago.
People who call others [X]ist for disagreeing with them have no maturity to brag of.
One of the "tricks" of professional wrestling is to have a persona that is merely an exaggerated version of your natural personality. Jesse Ventura appears to have followed that recommendation. In the ring and as a wrestling commentator he was cruel and egotistical but also talented and entertaining. The real life version appears to be similar. If anything his real life personality has been migrating to match his wrestling character.
I always liked his mantra: "Win if you can, lose if you must, but always cheat."
Yeah...tell that to Milo, Coulter and Murray........
When did I ever defend threats of violence against these people? The thread here seems to be if a left liberal reporter is being obnoxious he deserves what he gets but threatened violence against obnoxious conservatives(and that is not aimed at Murray, just the other two) demonstrates the evil of liberals.
The Grauniad has a long tradition of unsuccessful meddling in US elections. Is the FBI investigation begun yet?
Apparently, many of your commenters (and you since you are giving Gianforte every benefit of the doubt even after he has admitted he was in the wrong) have not matured beyond the level of a sixth grade bully.
I guess if you have the moral maturity of a sixth grader it is. Most of us abandoned playground morality years ago.
A short time ago, the Bloggress asked that we avoid personal insults. It just doesn't make for a pleasant experience here. Try to make your points without the insults. Just a request.
Precious snowflake journo sought a confrontation and got it. The outcome, however, wasn't what he'd planned. The DemCong candidate lost.
Instead of body slamming, I suggest that in the future, politicians should carry one of those loud air horns. When the reporters get too close or shove recorders into the face of the politician, just bring up the air horn and blast it into the reporters' faces.
Actually, that would be a good tactic for other people IRL. Kid throwing a tantrum.....air horn. Spouse won't stop arguing with you ....air horn. Jerks walking three abreast in front of you at the mall so you can't get around.....air horn!!!!!
Jake Tapper just body-slammed the Due Process Clause.
Try to make your points without the insults. Just a request.
I really don't know how to how else to describe the level of maturity of some of the comments on this thread.
Michael M: excellent video of a Democrat "discussing" things with the public.
I think the new rules for journalists wishing to interview politicians without prior invitation is to have them shout their questions across a ditch filled with alligators. With concertina wire and a warning track. And Claymores.
I felt sorry for Gianforte when he lost his cool, his dignity like that. He's an engineer, a businessman, a job creator. The Dems made him out a young-earth fundie kook and that wasn't right.
But seeing that picture of ol' baldheaded Jesse - I wonder if some of these SWPL CEO's who are also so fitness-obsessed aren't popping some enhancement drugs that may make them more aggressive? The stuff makes your hair fall out too.
Glad he won. I hope he likes Congress.
Anybody that believes the first reports out of the government or a news organization is a patsy:
really don't know how to how else to describe the level of maturity of some of the comments on this thread.
Maybe you should sue whatever college you attended?
Poor Freder appears to be a victim of the postmodernist assault on logic and Reason, thus rendered incapable of appreciating points of view not his own. As such he is a perfect foil for those in the Althouse commentariat not similarly afflicted.
Society is turning into tit for tat. This will not end well.
The assault of a reporter shouldn't provoke any more outrage than the assault at Middlebury College.
Comments I have been hearing is that the punk was lucky he didn't get shot instead. I don't think that this lost Gianforte that many votes. Privacy is a big thing here, and the reporter violated his space. A lot of people think that you should still be able to shoot trespassers (you typically can't, as a guy in Missoula discovered a year or two ago). But should be able to.
I like that Gianforte was an engineer. We already have one tech supporter in our junior (Republican) Senator, who has indicated interest in working with us on patent and privacy issues. I think that Gianforte, with his EE/CS and startup background, will be similarly supportative.
That reporter was truly lucky to be dealing with the current Republican candidate. The previous representative, Ryan Zinke, was the former leader of SEAM Team Six. That would have been a heck of a body slam. BTW, on his first day as Interior secretary, Zinke rode a horse to work in DC.
When he came to Montana, Trump's son gave Gianforte a pro tip, "Next time a pushy reporter is pissing you off, try body-shaming him."
But they were shooting gophers and they had their ear plugs in.
When I was a public official in California in the 90s, I had the pleasure of experiencing press nastiness and aggressiveness firsthand. Although I never had the opportunity to bodyslam any of the perpetrators, I certainly grew to appreciate the urge. The glee with which many of these "reporters"--more from TV than from print, interestingly--sought to torment the comments they wanted out of me and others in the work I was involved in was shocking and quite demented. It taught me the lesson that "the media" are actually in the entertainment and not information business, and to this day I look at their presentations to us as if created by P. T. Barnum.
This may explain their beyond-the-pale hatred for Trump; they hate looking in the mirror.
I see that you are not brave enough to use your civility bullshit tag. Because that's what your post is about, right? Your contention that calls for civility are always bullshit. Or perhaps you've retired it. You've won this argument. Montana meet Middlebury. Tea Party meet Resistance. It's the new civility.
Hagar said...
From the dialogue it appears that Gianforte already had his dander up from a previous encounter with a Guardian reporter. What's up with The Guardian's interest in Montana of all places?"
Perhaps we conservatives should root for Guardian involvement in our elections, given their track record. Remember their infamous stunt in 2004, where they asked their readers to send letters to Clark County OH, pleading with the knuckledraggers there to vote for Kerry? Bush carried Clark County, Ohio and the election.
It's astounding to me that benighted deplorables do not accept the advice of their betters, particularly the representatives of a leftist British publication.
I don't remember all the crying about this...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v60oNUoHBYM Although, I think this congressman lost when he ran again.
Didn't Dave Weigel, when he was the "conservative voice" at the WaPo, get some ire from conservatives for calling a Congressman's assault on student journalists a "bear hug"?
First, isn't it odd we don't have video of the whole thing? Usually, reporters have their video, not just their audio, running in these situations.
Second, isn't it odd that the Fox news chick stated Giafore "chocked and grabbed him by the neck" in her news account and then retracted it hours later.
Third, isn't it odd that the reporter called for an ambulance and was taken to ER, but he doesn't seem to have been treated for any injuries. Nor have we seen any pictures of his bruised, beaten face or body.
Fourth, why are people hysterically calling it "Criminal Assault" and "Body slams" when it appears all he did was push him to the ground. I pushed kids to the ground all through elementary school and was pushed myself. Didn't know we all should have gone to the ER.
Fifth, why do reporters think they're special and not governed by the rules of decent behavior. Or believe any personal attack on them is somehow a constitutional crises?
Tea Party meet Resistance.
I see people are still lying about the Tea Party.
I was glad to hear this didn't derail the Republican guys chances of winning, as it was clearly meant to.
To paraphrase Instapundit here when everyone is getting virtuous and telling us violence in this situation is wrong, "Duh!"
The point here is, where we're all these people shouting down violence when it was ok to punch a Nazi? Hello?
And the desire to just believe whatever they are told by their fellow reporters.
Did we learn nothing from Michelle Fields?
Finally, why aren't people getting more skeptical after the Monica Fields incident? Its like the Wapo and NYT un-sourced stories attacking Trump. How many need to show up false before pundits and writers stop taking them as the Gospel truth?
Remember their infamous stunt in 2004, where they asked their readers to send letters to Clark County OH, pleading with the knuckledraggers there to vote for Kerry?
I had forgotten that stunt. I still think this guy was trying to create a scene and misjudged the effects.
And I agree about the Hypocrisy. Punching someone you labeled a "Nazi" is cute, but pushing a reporter is a constitutional crisis.
"Second, isn't it odd that the Fox news chick stated Giafore "chocked and grabbed him by the neck" in her news account and then retracted it hours later."
-- This is the biggest reason, I think, people are skeptical. Because we got lied to, so now it is put up or shut up.
"But generally, it seems to me that rather than "body slams", reporters have a lot more to fear from the weaponization of the NATSEC espionage arsenal being turned on them as it was during the Obama administration."
This should be, by far, the bigger story. But of course isn't. Queued up behind the Gianforte story, to take everyon's eyes off the gross FISA privacy abuses by the Obama Administration is the fake news story that Jared Kushner is under investigation for (inevitably legal) Russian contacts.
The real issue is the hypocrisy from the left on how to respond to "objectionable" speech, thoughts and yes even physical actions.
It seems to be just fine for the "antifa" to commit terrorist acts, beat people up, burn private property because they don't like the "wrongthink" of others. OK to literally put a professor in a neck brace because she was allowing that horrible Bell Curve guy to escape from their clutches.
Yet. When a conservative pushes back at someone who is verbally and physcially assaulting him by shoving mechanical thingies into his face....all Hell breaks loose.
People can tolerate many things but even two year olds and dogs can understand and resent unequal treatment. Until there is equal treatment and equal disgust at violent actions against people who are merely disagreeing with others, don't expect any sympathy. Expect more retaliation and approval when fight back against the media.
OK, one would hope that a Congressman could deflect an annoying presence with more grace and sang froid than Gianforte showed, but the people have made their choice. At least in Montana, you can body slam a reporter and still win an election. Still, I would recommend restraint while negotiating these encounters. If Gianforte had eaten the children of this reporter, I would not have voted for him. That's about where I'd draw the the line with a Guardian reporter.
"Fifth, why do reporters think they're special and not governed by the rules of decent behavior. Or believe any personal attack on them is somehow a constitutional crises?"
That's the most annoying thing about this. A leftist smashes a bike lock over the head of an ordinary person and doesn't rate a mention in the MSM. Touch a reporter and OMG! The First Amendment is threatened! Here comes Tyranny!
Robert (not Richard) Spencer survived an attempt to poison him after he spoke in Iceland recently about the threat of Islamic terror. One leftist spoke to him in a restaurant while another slipped potentially fatal drugs into his drink. Has that been reported by the non-conservative media?
I would imagine that most people want to punch a hippie communist freak. Especially one that is ranting and screaming in your face. And a British leftist hippie commie freak who, no doubt, has zero tolerance for anything to the right of Mao?
People are supposed to have self control. But when the hippie commie freak is screaming and yelling and shoving things into your mouth... well, why not indulge yourself?
Besides, this guy is a Nazi: a socialist and proponent of everything run by state control. And as the left keeps telling us, punching Nazi's is a-ok.
Poor Fredor; who is coming to the realization that maybe people don't like the left for very good reasons. And punching out a smarmy reporter, one of those kind of people who invade privacy, are ghouls, keep pestering people, won't leave people alone, push agendas that are transparently anti-American... well, why exactly shouldn't a journalist get what's coming to them?
I will bet a whole lot of Norwegians, for instance, would have loved to have punched out Quisling. And since today's reporters are exactly that--Quislings-- then why shouldn't an obnoxious reporter face some consequences?
--Vance
I'm curious why doubt of the truth in reporting of the incident was placed on the victim of the assault, based on an audio recording of the incident. It's common sense to assume the person yelling in a loud angry voice is the perpetrator. Maybe if the victim is a member of the demonized Press, the doubt just manisfests itself in those who have been conditioned by Trump to hate the Press, to consider them the "Enemy of the People".
Trumpists are otherizing all groups that oppose Trump, the constant accusations of Trump Derangment Syndrome. Proudly accepting violence against someone they consider an enemy, a fellow American. Not a good trend for our society. Isn't this what Trumpists claim they were subjected to and fighting against? Now they do it on spades. Just like draining the swamp, it's was not drained, it was just refilled with even worse swamp creatures. There's nothing abnormal in pointing out the abnormality of enabling violence.
He apologized, it seemed sincere, but now the rest of you enablers of violence need to apologize too.
"I'm curious why doubt of the truth in reporting of the incident was placed on the victim of the assault, based on an audio recording of the incident."
-- It wasn't based on the audio recording, it was based on the Fox News reporter walking back her choke-slam description and saying well, maybe he didn't grab the guy like she thought. Once one of your key witnesses backs off, it makes EVERYTHING suspect.
Wasn't it a reporter for the Grauniad who licked the door knob of a Bush campaign office to try to get the candidate sick?
"He apologized, it seemed sincere, but now the rest of you enablers of violence need to apologize too."
-- I was quite clear that no one should be body slammed. But the more that comes out, the more it seems like no serious harm was intended or done. The guy shouldn't have been violent at all, but what we're learning happened is a far cry from the choke slamming someone because they asked you a polite question at a public gathering, as we were initially described the situation to have been.
He had a flu at the time
"That's the annoying thing"
Even moreso because the victim was being interviewed by a reporter. He wasn't trading taunts with Professor Bike Lock, he was minding his own business doing that 1st Amendment thing reporters are wrapping themselves in.'But the media didn't give a damn when their interviewee got his skull cracked, has just a prole, probably a deplorable too.
Hell, we wouldn't even know about it if the 4chan guys hadn't sluethed the douchebag, making the story go viral.
Prediction: Being a left-wing Shit, Jacobs will refuse the apology and sue for every $$$ he can get his grubby hands on.
"Show me everyone who without hesitation condemned Gianforte, and I'd like to know whether he or she either: 1. Wanted the Republican to lose the election, "
Red state
Hot Air's Allah Pundit
Rich Lowry
Erik Erickson
TAC's Rod Denher
"the rest of you enablers need to apologize too"
Take your faux outrage and stick it up your ass. If we were in the same took you would already be on the floor.
Freder Frederson said...
Most of us abandoned playground morality years ago.
5/26/17, 9:32 AM
Statement of facts not in evidence.
As was noted below, the left today (and for quite some time) at all levels is like your baby sister. She commits all range of acts upon her older brother and when he finally has enough and retaliates, he is the one that gets in trouble.
The left is just [more] mad the the right is starting to use their play book. Welcome to the society you wanted.
"I'm curious why doubt of the truth in reporting of the incident was placed on the victim of the assault, based on an audio recording of the incident."
Because the media people constantly lie. All the time. We know that they have biases and are not honestly reporting news. They hide news that conflicts with their agenda. The media is not supposed to have an agenda. The media is the enemy.
When they say X did such and such. We know that it is 95% to be a lie. when a person in your life lies to you 95% of the time, eventually you learn to ignore them. Cut that toxic person out of your life.
So far, we are just ignoring. Cutting, literally, may have to come sooner than later.
Virtually Unknown said...
Wasn't it a reporter for the Grauniad who licked the door knob of a Bush campaign office to try to get the candidate sick?"
That was Dan Savage, grade A asshole.
And really Inga, "enabling violence"... coming from someone like you? Really?
This is proof that Odin is surely dead. Because if not, lightning would have struck you down several times over.
"There was more then 1 witness. Three people in the room aside from the victim."
-- And we haven't heard from them. The only witness I've seen quoted has retracted her statement. Also, from the reports I saw, he got X-Rayed, but no injuries. I saw no reports of him punching him while on the ground, which would have left serious injuries on the victim's face, and if he was wearing glasses, possibly blinded him by breaking glass shards into his eyes.
So... the description of the event has:
A) Changed
B) Does not match with the injuries sustained/viewed
So, I believe that Gianforte probably pushed the guy, which is wrong. But, I'm extremely hesitant to believe that he then proceeded to ground-pound the guy while everyone watched, no one got any video, and only person thought it was worth reporting on (and lying about.)
Release the video!
Oh, and Inga? This guy wasn't an American Citizen, as far as I know: rather a repulsive slimy reporter for the Guardian out of England--the same rag that worships Stalin and hates George Washington. It's rather a patriotic duty to resist them, isn't it?
--Vance
St. George said...
The above video must be seen to be believed. Trump is on the floor, hitting a man on the head over and over and over.
5/26/17, 9:01 AM
Apparantly you did not follow wrestling back then. Tha was the evil Mr. McMahon being pummeled, and he deserved every bit. Had Trump lost the contest, his head would have been shaved. Who knows, maybe McMahon would be Prez if he didn't "lose".
Geez, for people claiming to be "woke", the Left has very little self awareness. Maybe that's why they made the assertion to begin with.
It's rich that Inga is lecturing people about violence. Inga of the "I could watch it all day" fame about the video of the alt-right guy getting cold cocked while he was being interviewed.
How quickly the leftists forget the Bash a Fash craze. Hypocrites all.
No condemnation from the media or Democrats when board wielding moonbats attack Trump supporters and others in the streets.
Maybe the standards are changing. It will take longer for Republicans to be permitted to engage in anti-social behavior without being savaged by the media. However, they accept (or deny without investigating) violence, grifting, leaking classified data, lying, etc., from Democrats, so maybe Repubs will get some slack in the future.
OTOH, Democrats and the leftmedia are like Muslims. If they can't convert you they want to kill or enslave you. Perhaps there will be no slack - ever.
The video would have clearly recorded any provocation on the stringer's part but would end when Gianforte's physical reaction kicked in. So it's probably one-sided and makes the stringer look bad. We'll probably never see it.
Again: I dislike violence.
But, I also don't think that "punching Nazis" is acceptable and that violence, and I disagree about using threats to silence speakers I don't like.
So, I'm consistent here.
"Someone being obnoxious does not justify assault."
So you're coming out as condemning the actions of the antifa cadres?
Jackson fought a duel. The other man--who had insulted his wife--shot first, hitting Jackson in the chest.
Jackson returned fire, killing the other party.
He carried the slug in the chest the rest of his life.
---
Johnson lived to dominate, and he used crass behavior to bend people to his will. At 6-ft., 3-in. tall and 210 lbs., he liked to lean over people, spitting, swearing, belching, or laughing in their faces. Once, he even relieved himself on a Secret Serviceman who was shielding him from public view. When the man looked horrified, Johnson simply said, "That's all right, son. It's my prerogative." His favorite power ploy, however, seemed to be dragging people into the bathroom with him—forcing them to continue their conversations with the president as he used the toilet. (Mental Floss)
This is not new in American politics. And Trump just shoved the Prime Minister of some scruffy NATO country out of his way.
So you're coming out as condemning the actions of the antifa cadres?
How about coming out and condemning Obama and the mainstream Democrats who met with and supported Robert Creamer and his violent attacks on citizens merely attending a political rally?
"I don't think his face was being punched."
-- Wait. You think a guy gets knocked down, the guy gets on top of him and... punches his chest?
Just, diagram that out in your head for me. How are you seeing that happen?
If the reporters felt that the situation was such that they could tweet instead of intervene... that says a lot about their view of life and the severity of the attack.
Again, I don't think the reporter SHOULD have been attacked, but it is not sounding nearly as serious as people are making it out to be. An assault, yes, but this is way different from the mad man, movie villain beat down of the earnest do-gooder that was described to us not too long ago.
I never believe a thing a friend of my wife says about her ex without some kind of corroborating evidence for the same reasons I don't believe the press about anything remotely connected to Trump. It's all emotions and flying off the handle, both cases.
I hear loud chirping crickets from the resident lefties on the Coptic-killing thread. Implicit is their condoning of violence against the "right" people.
The only excuse for what Gianforte did was if the reporter assaulted Gianforte and he was defending himself. There is zero evidence that the reporter initiated the assault. Someone being obnoxious does not justify assault.
Apparently, many of your commenters (and you since you are giving Gianforte every benefit of the doubt even after he has admitted he was in the wrong) have not matured beyond the level of a sixth grade bully.
5/26/17, 9:17 AM
...candidate reached for recorder, reporter grabbed candidate's wrist...
Doesn't the statement that the reporter grabbed the candidate's wrist come from the campaign? That makes it a pretty self-serving statement, and one that if any of the apparently handful of tweeting journalists present had had a journalistic bone in their body and taped it, we'd know what happened.
M Jordan:
I'll show you the man of true courage. Donald J. Trump.
Yes. This is why he was chosen over other Republicans candidates. He was right on the issues. He had a history of standing his ground and following through. He performed remarkably well and took the hill while under fire from the The New York Times, Washington Post, The Guardian, The White House, DOJ, etc.
The Democrats are always using that phrase "zero evidence" but I do not think that they know what it means.
And we know this game too well. It's the usual civility bullshit. The phase of the cycle where Leftists are back on their heels and want to call a time out.
Today you are all sweetness and light. "No Charlie Brown, we should play fair. Give it a solid kick"
And tomorrow it's "Nice try Charlie Brown lol" as we land flat on our back.
We are done with civility. The Left is infested with dishonest violent Marxists who are no longer out countrymen. They will be given no quarter. Neither will the little eichmanns that enable them.
If Gianforte flies off the handle in DC and beats the crap out of a Washington Post Reporter, how much should the medal he gets weigh?
And again, not a single one of you criticizing Gianforte are in the Coptic thread. Funny how violence against Christians and Conservatives is either cheered or ignored by you guys while at the same time it's "OMG! Someone breathed on a leftist reporter who was assaulting people!" You know, since the reporter grabbed Gianforte's wrist and all... classic assault.
--Vance
Dust Bunny Queen:
Air horn or a squirt gun... it works for amorous dogs, too. Down boy.
"It's rich that Inga is lecturing people about violence. Inga of the "I could watch it all day" fame about the video of the alt-right guy getting cold cocked while he was being interviewed."
Actually, I think that was Ritmo.
" he'll likely be convicted of assault."
You do realize the citation is a misdemeanor ?
He'll probably pay a $100 fine and there will be no trial.
If the Guardian dirtbag sues him, there will be a trial, about 2024.
The emerging consensus is that the reporter occupied the other man's personal space, then following a warning, was deflected, and stumbled under his own power.
So let's see. Joe Biden was praised for threatening to take Trump "Behind the Gym." CNN cheered when their guest explicitly wished to harm Trey Gowdy.
Democrat CongressCritter Jim Moran beat up a priest after a sermon because he didn't like what the priest said about abortion. Dead silence from the left. He also beat up a child once. Endless praise from the left about how great he was. His son was caught on video beating his girlfriends heat into a trash can. That was when he was taking time off from committing voter fraud. Anyone remember any Democrat or media person criticizing Jim Moran and his family? Me either.
Cynthia McKinney, Democrat congresswoman, fought with the Capitol police--trading blows. She started it, she's praised by the left.
Democrat congressperson Patrick Kennedy attacked a TSA agent. Ted Kennedy of course killed a girl and got off. Heroes to the left. Of course, someone upthread linked Democrat congressman Etheridge's unprovoked assault on a college kid in the street--and the Democrat party's response? Why, they ran him for governor and when that didn't work, put him in charge of a federal agency. No one on the left had any problems with him physically attacking people.
Far, far more Democrat congress critters physically assaulting people, and yet they are never criticized or face demands to resign.
So pardon me: if Jim Moran can seek out and attack a priest and be praised endlessly by the left, then certainly Gianforte can defend himself against a Guardian reporter attacking him.
--Vance
"The only excuse for what Gianforte did was if the reporter assaulted Gianforte and he was defending himself. There is zero evidence that the reporter initiated the assault. Someone being obnoxious does not justify assault."
Those are your personal biases, and not, I would expect, of many of the voters in MT, who viewed this as a justified response to an invasion of space and privacy. The response I heard several times yesterday (in rural MT) was that the reporter was lucky he hadn't been shot.
And tomorrow it's "Nice try Charlie Brown lol" as we land flat on our back.
Kinda like the last few elections for the Democrats, "Nice try, Hillary. LOL."
I think that a stream of tweets from a bunch of biased reporters who could not actually see much is definitive! I would ask for a jury trial if I were him.
Good news. Tim Kaine's, Linwood, is being charged in St Paul for assaulting Trump supporters and resisting arrest. Actually reading the story on it, it sounds like they are undercharging him, but at least its something.
Linwood received a quarter million dollar liberal arts degree from Carlton College and promptly retired to Minneapolis. Hard to believe he has a brother fighting in Afghanistan.
The GOP will probably award him a set of sighted in dueling pistols.
"He'll probably pay a $100 fine and there will be no trial."
Only if he pleads guilty or makes a plea agreement.
Maybe if he beat the guy with a bicycle lock, the Democrats would just say "that's what democracy looks like," and shrugged, like they did after Berkeley.
"Democrat CongressCritter Jim Moran beat up a priest after a sermon because he didn't like what the priest said about abortion. Dead silence from the left."
Holy hell, I hadn't heard that. Well, I suppose we should be happy he didn't run up to the altar and slit his throat like the Muslim terrorists in France did.
"He'll probably pay a $100 fine and there will be no trial."
Only if he pleads guilty or makes a plea agreement.
I expect that is what will happen. He has apologized and that is a form of confession.
Once again, it is a misdemeanor charge.
He apologized, it seemed sincere, but now the rest of you enablers of violence need to apologize too.
Apologize for wanting to hear both sides before passing judgement? It's called due process, not enabling violence. Perhaps we should get reacquainted with the principle.
According to the Left in 2017 Gianforte need only call Jacobs a "fascist" or "Nazi" and all will be forgiven.
It was Tapper who broke the "Russian Dossier" non-story a few months ago--the one that BuzzFeed responded to by publishing it. Everybody got upset at BuzzFeed, but they at least published what they had, rather than what Tapper and CNN did--talk about it in absolutely slanderous terms without being specific about anything.
At that instant Tapper confirmed himself to be not a legit reporter, but a useless propaganda tool. I have ignored him ever since, except when something like Ann's post forces him into my consciousness for a moment.
As was noted below, the left today (and for quite some time) at all levels is like your baby sister. She commits all range of acts upon her older brother and when he finally has enough and retaliates, he is the one that gets in trouble.
So you claim I have no evidence that many of the comments reflect a sixth grade morality, and as an analogy you liken the assault squabbling between children.
Really?!
Within 24 hours we had everything we needed to make an informed, reasoned judgment on this incident. Not only did we have the audio and the victim’s statement; we had two Fox News reporters as independent witnesses. Critically, Gianforte’s public statement on the incident contained claims that were clearly and directly refuted by the audio and the independent witnesses. As the sheriff (a Gianforte supporter) noted, he investigates stuff like this all the time in his Montana county, and the misdemeanor assault charges are straightforward.
Within 24 hours we had everything we needed to make an informed, reasoned judgment on this incident. Not only did we have the audio and the victim’s statement; we had two Fox News reporters as independent witnesses.
So your court of law doesn't need the defendant to take part in the process before the verdict can be rendered? Good to know.
Again, due process. Look it up. It's part of that Constitution thing that holds the country together.
The news media have destroyed their credibility with a majority of the people it appears.
Twenty years ago, pretty much no one would have questioned the account given by the two people in the room not named Gianforte, but today one simply can't just assume those are truthful- in fact, it would be foolish to do so. I think the real turning point was the Trayvon Martin case where almost every single media story about the case used a picture of Martin taken when he was 12 years old, and the pictures published of Zimmerman was all so fuzzy, it could never be determined whether or not he actually had visible physical injuries from what he claimed was an assault. The media published these same photos over and over for almost a year and half even though they had access to more recent photos of Martin himself and had in their possession the same high resolution photographs that were used in the trial itself. And I haven't even mentioned the deception editing of Zimmerman's phone call made to the police before the altercation and shooting.
Once credibility has been lost, it really is never recovered. That is what you are seeing here, and for me, once the FoxNews reporter started walking back her initial description, I basically gave Gianforte the upper hand on the narrative itself. It doesn't excuse his loss of composure, but I am willing to believe his account rather than that of the media at this point.
Kevin, we have to give Earnest Prole a break: The left doesn't believe in Constitutional Rights for conservatives any more. Things like due process and fair trials do not exist in heavy leftist controlled areas... like colleges.
Just yesterday on the Federalist site there were several leftists arguing that people do not have constitutional rights in public anymore. Really. They specifically stated that women do not have a right to privacy in public, like restrooms, but flat out claimed that no one has Constitutional rights in public. That's like Earnest Prole's argument here.
Note the "Fox News" as supposedly unimpeachable witnesses. Is Earnest unaware that there is nothing that separates Fox from CNN anymore--the Murdoch boys running the place have fired pretty much anyone on the right there.
And apparently Earnest is unaware that the Fox News reporters have backpedaled furiously and said that they didn't see what Earnest says they saw. No matter, in the brave new world, evidence isn't required to convict and punish a Republican.
Right Earnest?
--Vance
People haven't been defending violence here. They've been defending the right to self-defense and the right to due process before rendering judgement. The audio proved nothing and the FOX witness changed her story under questioning from Tucker Carlson.
Lots of courage on this site by Althouse definition!
Lots of don't-trust-reporters syndrome on this site also
Freder Frederson said...
As was noted below, the left today (and for quite some time) at all levels is like your baby sister. She commits all range of acts upon her older brother and when he finally has enough and retaliates, he is the one that gets in trouble.
So you claim I have no evidence that many of the comments reflect a sixth grade morality, and as an analogy you liken the assault squabbling between children.
Really?!
5/26/17, 1:19 PM
As you initially jumped to conclusions with your original comment and as the mountain of "adult" evidence of the larger situation failed to make an impression on you [for if it had, you would not have ever made your initial statement], I felt a more "age appropriate" analogy might be called for and easier for you to understand. I see I was giving you too much credit, again. I will strive to do better in the future.
The left suddenly decrying political violence.
That's rich.
You can literally taste the fear on the Left that they are losing the ability to shape opinion by using "non-partisan" journalism. Just witness this thread- every single of one them keeps trying to fall back to the line that "you just have to believe witnesses" even though one of them has already changed her story significantly.
I'm sorry- a good rule of thumb when dealing with reporters is that anything they report will be influenced by their biases. My pretty safely accurate assumption here is that all the witnesses who were journalists at this altercation wanted badly for Gianforte to lose yesterday. A rational person will take this into account when assessing which narrative is closest to what actually happened. I, for one, think it is now unlikely that Gianforte grabbed the Jacobs by the neck, body slammed him to the ground, and ground-pounded him. I think it far more likely that Gianforte did grab at the recorder, was probably resisted in this by Jacobs, and both men were pushing pulling at each other and fell to the ground. I doubt any punches were thrown at that point, but pictures of Jacob's face could convince me otherwise- broken glasses aren't not good proof of this, but more than one facial bruise would do it for me.
In case anyone is interested, here's other journalists who say they are friends of Jacob's discussing the incident. Note the lack of outrage.
And here you have wwww already holding and adjudicating the court case.
I am curious, wwww, what penalty are you handing down? What penalty is deserved and why?
As the results suggest, the withdrawal of newspaper endorsements is meaningless. Even in a sparsely populated state like Montana, folks have diverse sources and there is no longer a significant "opinion leader" in any single part of the media. Thank God.
You can almost hear a reporter yelling "Are you getting this? Tell me you got that!"
Go to 13:30 in the video. Sorry, forgot about that.
readering said...
Lots of don't-trust-reporters syndrome on this site also"
Gee, I wonder why that could be.
Democrats abhorring violence:
"New York Mayor Bill de Blasio pledged Tuesday to march in the city’s Puerto Rican Day parade June 11 that will honor a terrorist leader.
“I believe this parade is a very, very important part of the life of our city,” de Blasio told reporters at a press conference in the Bronx.
According to the New York Post, City Council Speaker Melissa Mark Viverito came up with the idea to honor Oscar Lopez Rivera, a leader of the Puerto Rican terrorist organization known as the Armed Forces of National Liberation (FALN)."
Lots of don't-trust-reporters syndrome on this site also
Ever been involved in a published news story? I have.
Lot's of critical thinking syndrome, and questioning authority syndrome, and withhold judgement until the facts are known syndrome too.
can say with emphasis that a man should not go into politics if he cannot handle reporters.
That's 'congressman' to you.
Birches said...
"In case anyone is interested, here's other journalists who say they are friends of Jacob's discussing the incident."
I'm interested, but the link isn't right.
DeBlasio might have other things on his mind than the PR terrorist parade right now:
"A leading young Democrat and de Blasio administration employee has a secret taste for sickening kiddie porn that involves baby girls as young as 6 months old, court papers revealed Friday.
Jacob Schwartz, 29, was busted for allegedly keeping more than 3,000 disgusting images and 89 videos on a laptop after downloading the filth from the internet.
The illegal smut shows “young nude females between the approximate ages of 6 months and 16, engaging in sexual conduct… on an adult male,”
According to his online biography, Schwartz got involved in politics at a young age, helping his father campaign for Democratic district leader in Greenwich Village.
The elder Schwartz served as New York counsel to Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders’ failed presidential campaign, and was also the campaign treasurer for law professor and liberal activist Zephyr Teachout when she challenged Gov. Andrew Cuomo for the 2014 Democratic nomination.
Arthur Schwartz also had his own brush with the law in 2015, when he was busted for removing hidden surveillance cameras trained on the front door of a $700-a-month, rent-stabilized apartment occupied by a 93-year-old client battling her landlord.
Prosecutors agreed to drop felony grand larceny charges in exchange for Arthur Schwartz paying $720 in restitution."
It goes without saying that if this were a GOP staffer it would receive breathless non-stop coverage on the networks and in the NY Times and WaPo for at least a week.
My prediction: it will fade from sight rapidly to make way for the Next Big Trump Scandal.
"OMG, he stepped on Theresa May's foot! Impeach!"
apparently Earnest is unaware that the Fox News reporters have backpedaled furiously
The Fox News reporters did not "backpedal furiously." They did clarify exactly how Gianforte grabbed the reporter before slamming him to the floor.
readering: "Lots of don't-trust-reporters syndrome on this site also"
Dan Rather weeps.
So your court of law doesn't need the defendant to take part in the process before the verdict can be rendered?
There are those who believe one must not form an opinion on a crime until the accused is convicted and has exhausted all appeals. By that standard, O.J. Simpson did not kill his wife.
Inga 10:47: "He apologized, it seemed sincere, but now the rest of you enablers of violence need to apologize too."
Or maybe we could wait until reporters, whom we "unreasonably" despise, apologize for enabling treasonous disclosures of classified information and for slandering non-Democrats using anonymous, perhaps imaginary, sources. You know, reporters, like the righteous witnesses of this incident.
"it wasn't legal self defence it was a crime he's going to be convicted of a crime.
Lordy.
reporters put recorders up to pols faces all the time in the House & senate office Blds in DC.
Don't run for office if you can't handle the job."
Still, you need to take into account local norms. Population density is low in most of MT. Really low. #48 out of 50 (barely ahead of WY at #49). Roughly 1/170th of #1 NJ. Somewhere around 7 people per section (square mile), and that takes into account cities. Remove them, and MT probably slips behind of WY in density. What this means to local norms is that the expectation of personal space changes, and, thus, the expectation of what is considered a reasonable threat. We aren't talking the use of deadly force here, but the justified use (in self-defense) of nondeadly force. The standard then is whether the average Montanan would consider what the reporter did a threat, or intrusion into his privacy bubble, and not what the average citizen of NYC or D.C. would think. That is your jury pool, and your local norms. The sentiment I heard from several people yesterday was that the reporter was lucky that he hadn't gotten shot. Anorher was that he was lucky that this was Gianforte, and not his predecessor, Zinke, a trained and experienced Navy Seal. Those are the norms that a prosecutor is going to have to overcome, if the case ever went to trial.
Of course, Gianforte will be living by D.C. norms in the near future, and needs to relearn city slicker ways if he wants to stay out of trouble.
wwww wrote:
"It depends on the evidence, of course. If misdemeanor assault, then it depends on priors.
There's a lot of witnesses. Should be fairly simple for the criminal system to figure out."
But you have already determined that Gianforte committed a crime and is guilty, but no court has actually determined that, and I will note for the record that no one has published the details that the witnesses gave to the police. And I note that the best eye-witness, in the room, has already back-tracked a very, very important detail she initially claimed, that Gianforte grabbed Jacobs by the neck. I wonder what other details she might have given to the police that will be recanted later?
However, there is something else that no one seems to have noticed- the charge was misdemeanor assault. The story told to the press, at first, sounds like clear cut felony assault to me. I wonder why that wasn't the charge? I am guessing the witnesses and the actual evidence told a somewhat different account to the police than "body slam followed by ground pounding".
Inga: "He apologized, it seemed sincere, but now the rest of you enablers of violence need to apologize too."
Has Inga apologized for the lefty improvised metal bludgeoning weapon professor just arrested for blunt force trauma assaults on innocent Trump supporters yet?
I sent him$25 when I saw what he did does that count ann?
E. Prole : "There are those who believe one must not form an opinion on a crime until the accused is convicted and has exhausted all appeals."
Normally, we call those people "Progressive Democrats." Having said that, your analogy is not a good one.
The mediaswine abide and continue to pander to Democrats to the detriment of the Republic.
Tapper seems to labor under the illusion that, despite accepting payment from CNN, he is the man he once was. He is not. Consequently, his drivel has no more credibility than that of other leftmedia toadies.
hombre: "Tapper seems to labor under the illusion that, despite accepting payment from CNN, he is the man he once was."
The man he "once was" is the man he still is today: a democrat operative serving democrat politicians and left-wing activist groups, just like his pre-CNN life when he was a dem staffer and operative for Handgun Control.
You know, just another "right down the middle" "straight-shooter".
LOL
"He's powerful, rich, & he's a big guy. The reporter is a shrimpy nerd who wore glasses."
If I were twerpy little nerd wearing glasses, I might hesitate before barging into a room where I had not been invited and shoving a microphone/camera into the guy's face.
Belligerence by reporters has become the norm in DC and probably London where that twerp usually hangs out.
Ya know what ? Not a good idea in Montana.
We'll see. I'm betting on a $100 fine and nothing else.
that's the point. He's powerful, rich, & he's a big guy. The reporter is a shrimpy nerd who wore glasses
I wish I could buy you guys air time, I really do.
Well, well. In 2014, this very same reporter tweeted this out about a student journalist:
"Left, right and center, straight news and opinion, journalists at CPAC
have one thing in common, the overwhelming urge to punch Benji Backer."
At the time Benji was 16.
The issue is not freedom of speech and freedom of the press, the issue is best described in the question:
Why would anyone vote for an immature adult candidate who engages in an an actual physical struggle with an adversary just 24 hours before election day?
Of course, we have all observed (although some have not come to a perfect understanding) that, lacking any evidence to the contrary, the new Republican populist voter actually prefers immature candidates.
"The reporter is a shrimpy nerd who wore glasses"
Which is undoubtedly why he felt he could express an urge to punch a 16 year old kid at CPAC.
Now, that's bravery!
Gadfly now confirms that this is a proxy battle about impeaching Trump and the facts don't matter. No need to wait for them then.
Yeesh
" the new Republican populist voter actually prefers immature candidates."
Says a guy who wasn't there and who doesn't know what happened.
Nice. The rest of us here (always excepting the lefties ) don't trust the press and consider them members of the other team.
The candidate will, no doubt, figure out that the press is trying to provoke into a soundbite of even a scuffle. I see some mention of the reporter grabbing Gianforte's wrist as he tried to grab the microphone/ camera and shove it away.
I assume you are aware that "assault" does not require contact. Maybe there will be counter charges. We will wait and see.
You sound like a member of the other team and will be considered so.
You are either for decent behaviour or you're not.
I anticipate "whataboutism"
That goes for any situation. End stop.
Presumably decent behavior does not include the expression of the 'wrong' opinions.
Inga said...
. . . the doubt just manisfests itself in those who have been conditioned by Trump to hate the Press,. . .
You spelled have been driven by the Press wrong.
And I'm sure decent behavior standards don't apply to the left, because they are our moral superiors and as such, whatever they do is correct.... like the Democrat aide to DeBlasio caught with a ton of child porn today. It's ok, he's a Democrat! Laws and standards don't apply to them. I'm sure wwww agrees.
--Vance
Funny how the lefties are always the ones running to the defense of the press. Doesn't mean anything.
those who have been conditioned by the press to hate Trump
Recognize yourself anybody?
You sound like a member of the other team and will be considered so.
I think you meant to say tribe.
The Constitution protects freedom of speech and freedom of the press not just for reporters, but for everyone. And the Constitution guarantees due process for the criminally accused. Someone who would "strongly condemn a politician committing assault on a reporter" might also demonstrate a love of constitutional values by refraining from assuming that a particular individual accused of committing a crime is guilty.
The Constitution does not say that courts need to rule on the guilt or innocence of a criminally accused politician before voters take their charges into consideration.
Every day you Trumpians reveal yourselves to be more and more anti-democratic anti-populists every day. It's really remarkable.
It is not normal for a politician to behave the way he did and it is not normal for a candidate to be charged with criminal acts. I don't recall you defending Hillary Clinton's candidacy on account of her being investigated, let alone formally charged, let alone convicted of anything. And daily your readers and commenters reveal themselves to be anti-due process fanatics who still call her a criminal anyway and take it as a matter of faith that she should be doing hard time.
What's going on here anyway? Do you hate your own gender or something?
The incoherence is becoming stifling. It doesn't suit you.
Tapper used to be an actual journalist. His tenure at CNN has converted him to a standard issue urinalist. Somewhere along the way he became, um, let's see (thinks, "how to put this delicately?"): pretty much a predictably leftist a**hat.
Anyone, including any voter, who is not serving on a jury deciding the case of Gianforte's assault of the reporter is under no obligation to abstain from forming an opinion on his heinous and barbarous acts - unbefitting as they were of anyone serving as a congressional representative.
The fact that his despicable act was an alleged crime whose verdict and sentence remain to be decided, does not prevent its reflection on his candidacy from being considered by a voter. Voters take into consideration all sorts of non-alleged criminal behavior all the time. There's no reason to say that alleged criminal behavior can't be considered by them. He will probably now have to serve a trial and if convicted a sentence for this action. Are employers in the private sector prevented from neglecting to hire applicants with publicly known pending charges? Give me a break.
You are asking for nothing less than an effort of thought control over the minds of voters. As if that weren't bad enough, you are giving your Republican elitists a pass when it comes to dismissing their history that would never apply to a "regular" job applicant.
Absolutely shameful. Arguments like yours make it absolutely evident why the people aren't in charge of this republic any more.
Pro-Choice. Presumed guilty. Off with his head! His arms. His legs. And other profitable parts.
heinous and barbarous acts
Is that in the description of misdemeanor assault? Somebody is in his cups again.
"Was that over the top? I can never tell!"
Is that in the description of misdemeanor assault?
If the perpetrator is a legislator? Sure is.
But then, Republicans have been drunk enough to think that being the party of no standards is a good thing.
No standards, and no self-control.
This is the lack of character and decency that defines the Repuppetkin Party.
Wait, knocking a Guardian reporter to the ground is despicable and heinous? Since when? Seems rather honorable to me.
Of course, Ritmo, I presume you fully defend Jim Moran's long career as a Democrat member of Congress and his assaulting various people like priests.
By the way, this same Guardian reporter is on record as wanting to attack a 16 year old boy. I'm sure you have no problems with that either.
--Vance
Oh, and Ritmo? What's your thoughts on Democrat Congressman Mike Capuano's call in 2011 to go out and beat up people, to get bloody? Is that decent and moral?
How about the "antifa" practice of terrorizing and killing cops--I seem to recall you defending that as "Black people being Woke and striking for freedom" or something like that.
How about that Democrat group saying they would go into a parade and drag Republicans out of the parade and beat them to a pulp? You were silent on that.
You support leftist violence. Plain and simple, if a leftist is violent, you cheer. You definitely defended the "John Doe" invasions, didn't you, because when a leftist does it, it's no crime. So when your side gets something back, just take it. This is the world you want, you get to enjoy the pushback against your thuggish criminal leftist behavior that you celebrate.
Oh yes: Weren't you the one who said you could watch someone get cold-cocked all day long? I believe it was you. Thus proving that hypocrisy is one of your defining traits.
--Vance
So, so late for the Media. Too late! Will they learn? I'd bet: no.
Look, maybe Tapper's a good guy. Maybe he's fair--I see his tweets every now and then and he seems a bit on the snarky/bitchy side, but maybe that's for effect and his actual reporting is solid. He should really realize, though, that for many of us the Media just has no credibility anymore. None. CNN? Come on. Many of us feel about CNN the way the rest of the Media has felt about Fox News, ok? The one thing the Media had was credibility (their purpose, in an existential sense, relies/relied on that) and I'm pretty sure most on the Left and the Right can agree that it's gone. We don't believe you!
The narrative-building and storyline-supporting bullshit is so darn obvious now it's as thought they don't want it to work.
This "have people no shame!" crap from a Media dude like Tapper just has 0 weight--we've all seen tons of Media people (on twitter and elsewhere) laughing it up as "mostly peaceful" protesters used violence to attack ideological and partisan enemies. The Media has helped partisans get away with using violence to shut down speech, and to justify violence against political opponents ("oh, it's ok that guy got punched, he was a bad guy/bigot/Nazi, etc..tee hee hee!").
Either violence is an acceptable response to political and/or social disagreement or it's not. If it's ok to throw eggs at people in red hats and to rush a stage, pushing a speaker you don't like out of the room then I'm going to have a hard time working up much outrage when a reporter gets shoved around.
It's hypocritical, sure, but it's not the hypocrisy that bothers me, it's the blatant and incredibly stupid disregard for the role social norms play in holding "us" together. How could these smart Media elites not understand that once you break these rules--once you tacitly endorse and/or snarkily cheer violence as a response to political disagreement--there will be unpleasant consequences?!
If I don't find someone morally credible or I think they're sort of jerks, why would them scolding me and chiding me for not sufficiently criticizing the alleged bad actions of others (others who just happen to be on the "side" these people always seem to oppose) matter to me, at all?
To return to Althouse's original question, shouldn't people be "afraid of getting attacked for endorsing violence," just as they should be afraid of getting attacked for endorsing rape or any other barbarous act? Isn't this fear the foundation of a civil society?
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