I'm reading "Illeana Douglas Looks Back on Hollywood’s Biggest 'Cat Fight'/After publishing a book about the 1939 classic 'The Women,' the actress and writer talks about her film career and her role in #MeToo" — by Maureen Dowd, in the NYT.
November 7, 2026
"She said she follows the Elaine May rule, that there’s no point trying to disarm men who think you’re scary-smart by trying to be likable."
"(That’s where Hillary Clinton went wrong in her debate with a lurking Donald Trump; as she recently acknowledged, she should have just turned around and said, 'Back up, you creep!') 'You wrap yourself up like a pretzel trying to please people and navigate and then you can’t take it anymore,' [Illeana] Douglas said. 'It’s better to just be unlikable from the get-go.’... [W]hat is her advice for young women trying to make it in Hollywood? 'I think they should be a bitch right off the bat,' she said. 'You don’t have to be mean. You don’t have to say, "Your hair is receding" or anything like that. But I think that being very strong and very direct always works better.'"
I'm reading "Illeana Douglas Looks Back on Hollywood’s Biggest 'Cat Fight'/After publishing a book about the 1939 classic 'The Women,' the actress and writer talks about her film career and her role in #MeToo" — by Maureen Dowd, in the NYT.
I'm reading "Illeana Douglas Looks Back on Hollywood’s Biggest 'Cat Fight'/After publishing a book about the 1939 classic 'The Women,' the actress and writer talks about her film career and her role in #MeToo" — by Maureen Dowd, in the NYT.
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32 comments:
It wasn't Trump who said, "You're likable enough, Hillary."
I wondered what I disliked about Hilary. Turns out she was too nice. "We came. We saw. He died."
Sure Illeanna, great career advice for budding actresses. Never do it the way you did: getting your big break from Director Martin Scorcese, and becoming his "girlfriend."
Hilary tried to be likable?
Hillary just wanted to smile, bake cookies, and be POTUS. Damn that Trump!
The reason Hillary didn't say: "Back off creep" is everyone would've thought she'd gone nuts. The vast majority of people didn't even notice Trump supposedly "getting too close".
This advice assumes a fact not in evidence. Hillary Clinton is not "scary smart". Her first bar examination was the DC bar exam. If your breath can fog a mirror, you can pass that bar exam--and Hillary flunked it.
Later in life Hillary examined a lot of bars. That's why she's the Chardonnay Countess of Chappaqua.
"From 1989 until 1997, Douglas was in a relationship with director Martin Scorsese. On May 16, 1998, she married producer and writer Jonathan Axelrod, the stepson of producer George Axelrod; they divorced in 2001."
So girls, be a bitch. But not to men who can promote you and get you gigs.
The Russian secret service responsible for Hillary wimping out. Yeah, that's the ticket.
Elaine May must be a real asshole. Hey i need a reason to be nice. Especially if they're intimidated by my "super-smarts".
Is my recollection incorrect? Because I recall Hillary deliberately walking in front of Trump, and him not moving from where he had been standing.
Success in politics has a lot to do with likeability.
On the other hand, the unlikeable Dick Nixon was able to send Illeana's kinswoman Helen Gahagan Douglas packing, so maybe there's something to be said for dogged unlikability. Also, something to be said for nepotism and networking, Illeana didn't make it on her looks (if she did make it).
“Hillary Clinton is not "scary smart".”
At one point she was listed as “one of the 100 best young lawyers in America. One crusty old Arkansas legal eagle countered that in his estimation she wasn’t even one of the 100 best lawyers in Little Rock.
Is Hillary claiming Trump was creeping to grab her Ass/Pussy
I don't think May was encouraging women to be unlikable. It was more that she was saying don't turn yourself into a pretzel trying to please people.
A recent development is women, often BIPoC women, who are convinced that they are being held down by mediocre White men, when they have never faced the possibility that they might be mediocre or unqualified themselves.
I want to make a small comment about "cat fight."
My dog, Blue, is 120 pounds. Big dog, massive dog. I'm not a gun guy. (I'm a 2nd Amendment guy, but not a gun guy). I did not get Blue for security, either. I'm a big guy. I usually don't need security. I rarely find myself scared of people. What I have to deal with are people (women) who are scared of me. Especially women with little dogs. Because my dog, Blue, does not like little dogs.
In my last apartment complex, the Mexican family that lived right over me had two tiny little dogs. And they hated Blue. And Blue hated them. And the Mexican and I thought this was hilarious.
"Why do they hate each other?"
"I don't know."
One day, one of the little dogs got away from the Mexican. I was like, oh shit. And I just froze. I was scared Blue was going to kill this dog. Which would be easy. 10 pound dog vs 120 pound dog. And I would feel guilt for the rest of my life. Possibly a lawsuit. Or even a criminal charge. Who knows the shit that will happen to you in your life? God and nobody else.
Anyway, this little Mexican hater dog ran up to Blue, screaming like he was a suicide mission. And Blue put her paw on his head and kept him in place. And my Mexican buddy ran up.
"I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry!"
"Not a problem," I said.
"Why do they hate each other?"
"Who knows?"
Anyway, Blue is constantly accused of being a man dog. People throw around that wrong pronoun all the time. "He is so scary."
"She's actually a girl."
If Blue were human, she would be like Gal Gadot. Blue is gorgeous. Or maybe she would be some scary MMA warrior girl. Anybody runs up to me, Blue jams her nose into her crotch. And sniffs. That's how she ID's the criminal threats. So far, all humans love Blue, pretty much. It's the damn little dogs that hate her guts. And the little dog owners glare at me, like I did this.
You're probably wondering, why is this dog story on the Maureen Dowd thread? Well, "cat fight." But also, the sexual confusion. Everybody assumes Blue is a man. You really can't tell much of a difference with dogs. I have no idea, until I check out their sexual equipment. Otherwise? Dogs are a uni-sex party.
Hillary has the charms of Lady Melissa in the Warner Brothers classic "Scarlet Pumpernickel" (1950)
I don't think Trump's problem with Hillary is that he thought she was scary smart. I don't remember Trump walking behind her, but perhaps he did. The debate where I remember one candidate walking behind the other was Gore behind Bush and Bush handled that with humor that I think helped him a lot.
"her role in #MeToo" I assume that means she slept her way into roles. What other role is there?
Hillary could have Vince Fostered him.
Smart in context, or arrogant for show?
Back in the day I was a graduate student and I was dating a woman working on her Ph.D in chemistry. Her dissertation topic was related to the chemistry of radioactive elements. This was the early 1970s and women were cautioned to hide their intelligence so as not to frighten off boyfriends, but she let slip that her grad course in nuclear physics was an easy A, as were her grad courses in quantum mechanics. At that point I knew I HAD to marry her if ever she would take leave of her senses long enough to accept my proposal. Fifty-second anniversary is coming up
Not every man is frightened of an intelligent woman. Ask Meade.
Actors gotta act, don’t they?
" 'That’s where Hillary Clinton went wrong in her debate with a lurking Donald Trump; as she recently acknowledged, she should have just turned around and said, 'Back up, you creep!' "
Sure. Let the real Hillary come out. That would work? No.
I remember Al Gore closing in on George W. Bush on a debate stage and W. giving him a funny WTF look he probably learned in Texas.
Back in 1970 my sophomore year at PSU I continued my love playing basketball in the evening. Rec Hall was always packed. The girls gym, White Hall, was right next to my dorm. It was normally empty so a group of guys started playing there. That was until the girls found out. From that point forward we had to have a girl playing us.
I would go over early and there was a cute as a button girl playing by herself. We played one on one several times. Started dating. Found out she was a grad student and also Jewish. Wealthy family. Me, a middle class Gentile. Things were going great.
She went home to Chicago one weekend and upon return refused to talk to me. That ended that.
Hillary is one of those women who as girls did well enough in school by outworking the many people smarter than her, it’s fine in high school, but at some point you are going to be swimming with the sharks, and there she was weighed, measured, and found wanting.
"It’s better to just be unlikable from the get-go."
Harrigan Hil's got that one down pat.
Now if would-be Hollywood ingenues follow that advice, they won't even be invited to the casting couch.
Hillary is very smart. The problem with her is she has no heart. And she has to pretend to be human. That's what is really difficult for her. She has to practice being human and nice in a mirror.
Sarah Palin was not very smart. But I definitely would have voted for her. The sexiness of Sarah back then made me not so smart. And so it goes.
The "looming and threatening" gambit was something George W. Bush used against Al Gore years before. How valid was it in 2000 or in 2016? It can be construed as a sign that one is weak, cowardly, and complaining,
People who have a reputation for being "whipsmart" are often only just glib. They have a ready answer for everything, but how good is their reasoning ability? "The West Wing" was based on the Clinton White House: lots of people walking fast, talking fast, and catching the allusions others make, without necessarily being competent.
Hillary Clinton is not smart. She failed the Bar Exam.
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