@avgeek.4life RUNWAY COLLISION AT NEW YORK LAGUARDIA AIRPORT HAPPENING NOW #aviation #news #laguardia #newyork #collision ♬ original sound - AVIATION AND TRAVEL
March 23, 2026
"Stop. Stop. Stop. Stop. Stop truck 1. Stop."
How does this happen?
Posts
97 comments:
Why are you skeptical?
How does it happen?
Mechanical failure, weather failure, attention failure, or communication failure. Let the investigators investigate and provide their report.
Doesn’t need a full 72 hours, but it will take a few hours to determine cause. I’m skeptical that an airport vehicle accidentally entered an active runway with an aircraft on it. I also heard Newark is now at a ground stop.
Two options at this point- a deliberate act on the part of the ground vehicle's operator or they hired a moron to drive it.
Could be both, I suppose but my money is on #1.
"How does this happen?"
DEI? Shortage of controllers?
"...The airport was shut down and air traffic was diverted, and on Monday morning operations also were halted at Newark Liberty International Airport in neighboring New Jersey.....The shutdowns happened during long waits for travelers due to the busy spring break travel season and a shortage of Transportation Security Administration officers because of a lack of routine funding for the Department of Homeland Security....."
Well, since you brought it up, AP, does that mean we can blame the Democrats for the problem? Plus, it's New York City. Can we blame Mamdani, extra hard?
---- Mechanical failure, weather failure, attention failure, or communication failure
..... or Iranian action.
Aggie, you must be new here. Trump is to blame for anything that goes wrong.
"...In the moments before the crash, an air traffic controller could be heard on a radio transmission giving clearance to a vehicle to cross part of the tarmac, then trying to stop it. The fire truck was traveling across the runway to respond to a separate incident aboard a United Airlines flight, whose pilot had reported “an issue with odor,” ....".
Regional jet, small.
I suspect ATC error. I heard an audio with the controller first saying to the truck "Go ahead." Then "Stop, stop, stop!"
If we hear nothing further about the ATC, does that mean it's a diversity hire? If funding suddenly appears for TSA, Magic 8 ball says 'Probably'.
Speculating this soon is not helpful. So let's get it over with:
We clearly hear the controller yelling for the fire truck to stop before it entered the runway. The driver must not have heard the transmission for some reason.
Doesn't sound like anything more complicated than that, right now.
It happens because there's complicated stuff going on at full speed all the time and from time to time it doesn't work out.
I always looked both ways before entering a runway but that's just me. A non-controller safety check.
Our ATC systems are decades behind what we have the technology to do. Our federal government lacks the project management prowess to keep our systems cutting edge. That and the mostly unnecessary burdens that FAR/DFARS imposes on suppliers.
It does seem the controller may have cleared the fire truck onto the runway. Flight crew lost their lives but may have saved everyone else.
Althouse, "How does this happen?"
Because Secretary Pete implemented DEI standards and there is a shortage of qualified Air Traffic Controllers. On top of that - and as noted by Quayle above - our ATC systems are from the 60s and Pete refused to upgrade them.
Trump and Duffy are fixing this, but it takes time.
Our failing ATC system is the fault of the Dems. The Dems hate Americans. Look at the TSA lines.
But the Fake News never will report this.
"...Pete refused to upgrade them."
And where did the money go?
It's not surprising that someone whom only ever manipulated words could possibly ask "how does this happen". The reality is why doesn't this happen more often? Just because the US aviation industry is so unbelievably safe and efficient, naive inexperienced office sitters and pontificating intellectuals have the arrogance to stand in judgement when shit happens.
To err is human...
“And where did the money go?”
Probably to feed pretend kids in Minnesota
ATC are undermanned. Remember the shutdown by those clowns in the US Senate? That forced ATCs to work without pay and they've been slow rolling funding to hire more.
I don't know who's dumber the US Senators and their clown show, or the moron Republicans who keep voting the same Goobers into office no matter what they do.
Regarding general aviation safety, how did these devices ever get created and approved? They look absurd, just absurd, when elevated and docked at a gate. Yet, they move among airplanes and luggage vehicles daily.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_lounge
They're saying two pilots were killed. And if you look at the jet the front is completely destroyed. How does that happen considering the plane hit it at 24 mph?
https://www.foxnews.com/us/air-canada-jet-hits-vehicle-forcing-new-yorks-laguardia-airport-close
Physics is hard, Chest
Investigators have unearthed dash-cam footage from the truck cabin.
Caution. This video contains images that may shock the conscience and grate the soul. Viewer discretion is advised.
link to video
From Aviation Week ...
https://aviationweek.com/air-transport/safety-ops-regulation/jazz-aviation-crj-900-hits-vehicle-laguardia-airport
Flight AC8646, operated by Jazz Aviation en route from Montreal with 72 passengers and four crew members, was cleared to land on LGA’s Runway 4, according to air traffic control audio posted at LiveATC.net.
An airport rescue and firefighting (ARFF) truck using call sign “Truck 1 and company,” responding to another incident, asked for clearance to cross Runway 4 at Taxiway D.
Use of “and company” suggests a lead vehicle was requesting clearance for multiple responding vehicles to cross the runway—a common practice for airport first responders.
The controller initially approved the clearance, and someone acknowledged the clearance. The controller then ordered Truck 1 to “stop stop stop,” but AC8646 struck an ARFF truck.
More at the link.
It happens because stressed humans are involved. No mystery.
Planes are made of the lightest materials possible so they can fly. Fire trucks have huge heavy engines, pumps, and water tanks. Basically a giant beer can hit a wall. CC, JSM
"Regional jet, small."
Guess who flies those?
How? He didn't stop.
When Crash Fire Rescue beats the airplane to the scene of the crash.
Either the aircraft was using the wrong runway (easy for pilots or controllers to make that mistake, especially when there are parallel runways) or the truck shouldn’t have been crossing at that time. At this point sounds like the latter.
There's a longer version of this where the controller gives the truck permission to cross, before realizing the error, and then "Stop. Stop. Stop."
Guess who flies those?
Canadians.
JK, it doesn't appear to have been pilot error.
exhelodrvr1 said...
Either the aircraft was using the wrong runway (easy for pilots or controllers to make that mistake, especially when there are parallel runways) .
Not easy. At all.
Fox says:
“That wasn't good to watch,” says the Frontier pilot, who was not involved in the collision.
“Yeah, I know,” the air traffic controller says. “I was here. I tried to reach out. … We were dealing with an emergency earlier. I messed up.”
The pilot responds: “Nah man, you did the best you could.”
Well, Mr. Tryhard should’ve tried harder.
How it happened isn't nearly as important as how Trump can be blamed for it.
It really seems improbable that the ATC who just directed a plane to land on that runway would OK one or more vehicles to cross that runway in the planes path. Was another ATC involved here, one landing the plane and a different one OKing the crossing? Listening to the audio, it doesn't sound like it. The investigation of this will likely take a long time so we won't know exactly what went wrong for quite a while.
Terrible! NY post has it all. The front of the plane is obliterated.
My God. This was a major f up.
Btw … I OFTEN notice bad fuel smells inside the plane during parked plane and plane sitting and waiting on the tarmac situations. It makes me sick but I don’t call the fire department.
Dark, light rain, low winds 4-mile visibility 9,000-ft ceiling. Not horrible conditions.
The Denver airport always reeks of jet fuel, even in The concourses.
You know the buttons on your car dash that offer recirculating air on off versus incoming “fresh” air? Commercial jets need that.
Jet fuel smell is awful.
Years ago, on a flight to somewhere, winter time —-we had to queue up to the de-icing station. The jet fuel smells inside the plane and perhaps the de ice smell were so overwhelming, I thought I was going to throw up.
"How does that happen considering the plane hit it at 24 mph?"
At PPrune, the pilot website, they're saying that Flightradar showed the plane moving at 126 mph.
“…a giant beer can hit a wall”
We already have a movie about a drunk pilot. Just saying.
Here's how it happens:
1) New York Democrats make money when planes land, or take off. That's it. That's how all those Democrat union jobs at the airport are funded. If planes are not taking off or landing, they're not making money. So the incentive is to KEEP PLANS LANDING. Not keep planes SAFE.
2) The same controller who is manning the tower was ALSO the same controller directing aircraft and hundreds of other ground vehicles, including this firetruck (which is not a standard firetruck ... it's 10x the weight due to what it's carrying to the fire ... it's a brick wall.) The airport does this (undermans its ATC tower) to save money.
3) You are cows to be herded through a system designed to shut down the minute a Democrat doesn't like Trump's budget. If they have to kill a few of you to get ICE off their voters, they're willing to kill a few of you.
You would think whoever was driving would stop and look down the runway despite getting the OK and notice the landing lights of plane approaching. "Bad odors" appear to be a common complaint, certainly not a life-threatening emergency.
Curious George,
It absolutely if someone isn’t paying attention/distracted etc.
One would think the landing lights on the nose of the aircraft would noticeable to the truck driver. They are very bright.
I love the smell of jet fuel. It tells me that I am travelling. But then, I also love the smell of diesel exhaust, because it reminds me a of good childhood memories.
We will find out that, like almost all aviation incidents, that there were multiple dings and errors against proper procedures, before the actual collision. And as my father admonished me every time, wait for the NTSB report if you really want to understand. (He had a side specialty doing crash investigation for NASA).
I'd like to think that such incidents, especially with loss of life, would lead to a systemic change. However, I think as noted above, more and more often just leads to blame and knee-jerk reaction and never actually solves the problem.
Almost every accident is due to some form of human error. Indeed, FAA/NTSB specifically tries to avoid prosecution when an accident occurs because of this fact (assuming deliberation was not a factor).
I use the audio and reconstructed video of the US Air crash in the Hudson in my workshops. One point is the importance of written checklists.
But the other is to emphasize how dead calm everyone, controllers, pilot, stayed.
This guy busts my whole narrative.
US air here https://youtu.be/5S5hRRio-E8?si=_ngyIbkPtfvnyQ9D
John Henry
"exhelodrvr1 said...
Curious George,
It absolutely if someone isn’t paying attention/distracted etc."
Millions of landings annually, and this happens how often? It's very rare, so by definition, not easy.
"Old and slow said...
I love the smell of jet fuel. "
It's basically kerosene. Ugh. Now high-octane race fuel, smells amazing.
The committed climate crazies don't want normal people flying, so air travel safety is not a priority. That might be the subconscious thought behind DIE hiring and unimproved computers.
It’s probably not a good idea to yell “I f-ed up!” On the radio after a crash, wait for the investigation.
The U.S. has invested scores of billions of dollars to upgrade air traffic control "since the 1960s" and that trope needs to be retired. While contract over-runs and failed or overpromised technologies are hardly unhead of, most of this spending has resulted in tangible upgrades in hardware, software and communications. If I spelled it all out here it'd either be way too long or I'd put y'all to sleep with aviation acronyms.
That being said the system is very stressed for sure and we have a long long way to go. One troubling aspect is that LaGuardia apparently has Airport Surface Detection Equipment (ASDE-X) which tracks the movement of aircraft and vehicles on the ground, precisely to prevent this kind of accident. But my understanding of this system is that it's monitored by controllers, so....
It's supposed to serve as a backup especially with overworked ATC which certainly sounds like what happened here. The pilots appear blameless, God bless them.
Note: I deleted a previous comment when I realized I was mischaracterizing ASDE-X.
There's video now. Looks to be entirely on the controller.
With all the technology involved in airport operations, all we need to do is put Grok or Claude or Gemini in charge. Problem Solved.
how many times per year does an aircraft land on the wrong parallel runway in the US
"Wrong-surface events," which include landing on the wrong parallel runway or a taxiway, occur nearly every other day in the U.S.. These incidents happen hundreds of times per year, with general aviation pilots involved in 85% of cases, typically during daylight hours.
Aviation Safety Magazine
Aviation Safety Magazine
+2
Total Frequency: The FAA reports hundreds of incorrect surface approach and landing events annually.
Wrong Airport Landings: While less common than wrong-runway landings, U.S. commercial carriers have landed at the wrong airport at least 150 times since the early 1990s, averaging a few times per year.
Primary Causes: Complex airport layouts (especially parallel runways), high workload, and expectation bias are primary factors, rather than just poor weather.
General Aviation Joint Safety Committee
General Aviation Joint Safety Committee
+4
Runway Incursion Data
2024: There were 1,474 total runway incursions in the U.S., averaging about four per day.
2016-2022: Data showed over 1,600 incorrect surface approach and landing events
Aviation Safety magazine. A long-time favorite of mine. I used to buy the hardcopy version, a little 8-10 pager monthly, for $100 or so per year (thirty years ago). Zero ads of any kind. Absolutely a steal at that price. I probably read every word of every issue.
Always flipped to the back for the "recent incidents" briefs to see if my aircraft type was in any of them.
"At PPrune, the pilot website, they're saying that Flightradar showed the plane moving at 126 mph."
Yeah, reading the same thing on CNN. No way that much damage and death happens at 24mph.
@Howard "Physics is hard, Chest"
Or you're fucking stupid :)
Brutal
https://www.cnn.com/us/live-news/laguardia-collision-ice-airports-tsa-03-23-26?post-id=cmn3h5k1n00003b6sdyjy8b5l
"Yeah, reading the same thing on CNN. No way that much damage and death happens at 24mph."
There was 80,000 pounds behind that 24 mph.
TobyTucker: You would think whoever was driving would stop and look down the runway despite getting the OK and notice the landing lights of plane approaching.
No doubt they did. The problem is Newark's visual background at night. Regional jet landing lights are pretty close to the ground after touchdown, and almost certainly blended in with city lights.
Fortunately, this sort of thing is very rare, but it does happen: LAX, 1991 and 2024, Tokyo-Haneda
Howard:
Fortunately, GPS is greatly reducing the likelihood of wrong-runway landings. Of the 1474 runway incursions in 2024, I will be most are airport vehicles rather than aircraft. Even GA uses iPads which have moving map displays. It is a *lot* harder to get lost on an airport now than even 15 years ago.
Touche, Chest.
The video (that I have seen) shows a 'high rate of speed'. It looks brutal, and I'm actually surprised the plane showed so little damage (but it did skid over the truck).
Where's Little Excursion™ to wax pathetic on and on and on about how Trump is to blame?
One problem is that ATC speaks with the pilots coming in on one frequency and to ground vehicles on a different frequency, which means the pilots can't hear what is said to the drivers and vice versa.
"tommyesq said...
One problem is that ATC speaks with the pilots coming in on one frequency and to ground vehicles on a different frequency, which means the pilots can't hear what is said to the drivers and vice versa."
I don't think that's a problem. If they were all on one, they'd be stepping all over each other.
24 mph? Looks at least 24 knots. Flight crew are trained to maintain visual separation when possible. Doesn’t always workout as we saw at DCA. I wonder what the firetruck drivers are trained? They should have noticed the oncoming lights of the plane. Did they think the plane would stop prior to the taxiway? Did some communication suggest the plane would be held at the taxiway? I do notice the driver of the firetruck was on the far side of the cab.
As this was a landing, it is unreasonable to ask for the pilots to stop short during the rollout. The calculations on rollout length and decisions necessary to configure the plane for that length are made long before final approach and can’t quickly be changed, especially in wet or icy conditions. That is why the following Delta was told to go around.
"how did this happen?"
The usual way -- someone screwed up.
Now high-octane race fuel, smells amazing.
Nitromethane. Nothing better.
Pretti please?! Good truck.
Gasoline smelled a whole lot better before they replaced the high levels of benzene toluene ethylbenzene and xylenes with ethanol and mtbe
Chest was correct, The collision likely occurred while the aircraft was still going at about 100 knots plus or minus
It may have been worse if the jet’s cockpit had missed the truck and instead clipped it with the wings. Commercial aircraft land with a minimum 30 min of fuel still in the tanks, and likely more for potential delays in inclement weather in congested airspace like NY.
VAS aviation recreation of events including ATC calls. They apparently were working the United emergency with ramp ops by phone as well as emergency vehicles and landing aircraft by radio. The United flight didn’t initially have a gate to evacuate passengers nominally.
Jazz 646 was cleared to land on runway 4 and asked to hold short of Lima, which is not a taxiway that crosses runway 4, so I think that was about stopping on the taxiway to the ramp.
Truck 1 asks for and is initially cleared to cross runway 4 at taxiway delta, which is less than halfway down that runway. At this point, JZA646 is moments from touchdown.
Controller then issues commands to Frontier and then clears United to the ramp. Then it gets back to the events on runway 4 to issue the quote that headlines this post.
It appears to me, in the X video linked earlier, that the rest of the convoy stopped at the hold short to runway 4 but truck 1 proceeded. Both truck 1 and JZA646 were cleared on the runway by a controller that was task saturated with a prior emergency, multiple vehicles in motion, multiple methods of communication, and inclement weather.
It will be interesting what the NTSB recommends, but that report won’t come out for a year per procedure. A preliminary report will be out in about a month which will go over factual details of events.
Concerning me is the last two flights my daughter and her husband where on had inflight emergencies that required similar attention given to the United flight; expedited access to gate upon landing with responding emergency vehicles. Both were in the past 12 months. Both involved passengers having health issues.
Howard said...
It's not surprising that someone whom only ever manipulated words could possibly ask "how does this happen". The reality is why doesn't this happen more often? Just because the US aviation industry is so unbelievably safe and efficient, naive inexperienced office sitters and pontificating intellectuals have the arrogance to stand in judgement when shit happens.
To err is human...
Americans, particularly white female americans, seem to have a certain attitude about how things should be.
Constantly shit on men who made the current system happen.
Then they get mad when their interference makes things blow up.
Leland,
24 kts == 27.6 mph
If you can tell the difference between those two speeds just by looking, all I can say is you have a fantastically calibrated eyeball! ;-)
I can’t. It was just my way of saying I don’t believe the aircraft was going that slow. That reported speed came before they had a chance to analyze the flight data recorder.
Rabel: “ There was 80,000 pounds behind that 24 mph.”
Good analogy for the volts vs amps discussion from yesterday. CC, JSM
The video clearly shows two things: The plane was going much much faster than 20+ mph, and the lead response truck wasn't stopped, it was crossing the runway. And it was separated by quite a distance from the rest of the response team vehicles, behind it on the taxiway.
It will be an interesting report. I would have thought that ER crews with multiple response vehicles would be trained to stick together in a tight group when traversing the tarmac, so as to minimize the confusion in what is already an unusual activity.
I expect the Iranians and their empathic lefty enablers will try to take credit for the accident. In their minds, Trump has already lost the war, or at least they desperately hope so.
The pilots of the Bombardier CRJ700 jet involved in the 2025 mid-air collision at Ronald Reagan worked for PSA Airline, operated from Vandalia, OH which was wearing the American Airlines logo. So Bombardiers are just built by our once-friendly northern neighbors until Trump blew up our trade contract. And the copter that strayed was piloted by his military.
So Trump wouldn't get past his unlawful scheduling work without pay, so he is at fault for not making LaGuardia safe for the Air Canada flight. But our SecTrans will make sure this problem never ever happens again.
How does this happen? Notice that DEI and ATC have nothing in common and never should have. I blame Obama for pushing racial quotas on the ATC training and recruiting process. I blame Trump I for not fixing it; perhaps he would have if not for being pestered by Mueller. How’s the temp where you are Mueller? Warm I’ll bet.
Gadfy
Bombardier sold out to Mitsubishi for 550 million dollars.
That ATC should have handed the emergency truck over the taxi controller. There are ways of getting around an airport that doesn't require crossing active runways.
You knew botfly had to do the bot thing and it was going to suck. The bot can’t help itself from opining on subjects it doesn’t understand.
Aviation is inherently dangerous, as is any form of motion above walking speed. This was a human failure, the emergency on the United plane made them forget Air Canada was landing.
Today, NYC local tv stations have been saying that the plane was traveling around 100 mph.
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