Here's a gift link so you can read the whole thing. Excerpt:
It has been only eight years since Donald Trump popularized the term “fake news” as a cudgel to dismiss and attack journalism that challenged him.
That phrase, from the president of the United States, was all the encouragement many would-be authoritarians needed. In the following years, around 70 countries on six continents have enacted “fake news” laws. Nominally aimed at stamping out disinformation, many primarily serve to allow governments to punish independent journalism. Under these laws, journalists have faced fines, arrest and censorship for reporting on a separatist conflict in Cameroon, documenting Cambodian sex-trafficking rings, chronicling the covid-19 pandemic in Russia, and questioning Egyptian economic policy. Trump has effectively championed this effort, as he did when he told Bolsonaro at a joint news conference, “I’m very proud to hear the president use the term ‘fake news.’”
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173 comments:
File under "Free Speech We Don't Like"
Pot, say hello to kettle.
So the Hunter Laptop Story is True? False? Please advise.
The Old Grey Whooah.
Pinch isn’t a serious human being anymore. “Fake news” was pushback against the Russia collusion story which was made up by spies in the employ of Hillary and totally swallowed by the US media. Governmental suppression of media for reporting news is a completely different act entirely. Is telling that Trump took no governmental action against Hillary’s cabal and is pilloried while serious journalists applaud suppression of X in Brazil and the loss of free speech in France and England.
Democracy dies in darkness as a mission statement.
"Popularized", because the truth is Obama coined the phrase. Obama is the same guy that pushed for "hate crime" laws which introduced the notion that "some speech is violence". And like leftist around the world, that opened the door to curtailing freedom of speech.
Sulzberger is the same socialist that claims Trump would ruin relations with other nations, which is to say Trump is anathema to rulers in other countries. If Sulzberger is right about Trump in terms of foreign policy, then how has Trump, while not in office, advanced the "quiet war against press freedom"? Is it by refusing to hold press conferences? Is it by not publishing his schedule? Is it by asking the press to ignore his campaign? Is it by cancelling debates held by the media? Is it by having the DoJ arrest financial backers in the media?
They are frustrated their policies are unpopular so they want to monopolize public and private media to control the flow of information and label anything they do not favor as 'fake news'. In an election year they want to suggest their bipartisan opponents, who are the champions of free speech, are the suppressors of it. What else can they say to defend themselves?
Sure, campaigns against "fake news" are the problem; whereas campaigns against "disinformation" are just fine.
What a jackal Sulzberger is. Surrounded by journalists, even at his own paper, who cheer on the censors, he can openly worry about press freedom and yet somehow manage to blame the other side.
progressives (here and abroad) are cracking down on free speech...and in the editorial blame the tea party-Trump republicans for it. the NYT and WPost are two of the most important/effective purveyors of misleading information. Sulzberger/WPost are using this editorial as a means of attacking the man most likely to protect and defend free speech.
The problem is that we are starting wars all over the world and using them in a divide and rule scheme, and have been since the close of WWII when we told Japan that if they settled their issues with the USSR over those islands, we would annex Okinawa, in order to keep a conflict going there, and soon after when we used military force to intervene in China's civil war and prevent China from re-establishing control over Taiwan. (Straits Crisis if you care to google)
It has been a consistent pattern ever since, and if you are going to follow it logically to our backing a coup in Ukraine, and immediately setting up, as the New York Times has reported, 12 CIA bases on Russia's borders which trained Ukrainians to infiltrate Russia and commit assassinations, as well as produce disinformation, well, if there is a free press, the public may come to the wrong conclusions.
"The truth! We can't handle the truth!" these endless wars are completely necessary, you know, and a truly free press will stand in the way of fighting them.
Is the press actually free when all they do is parrot Democrat / Deep State talking points? Give us all a break. The free press are independent journalists and podcasters operating outside the MSM.
Wait, the Biden censorship initiative was really Trump's fault?
Sulzberger is just pissed nobody except the brainwashed is buying the NYTs bullshit anymore. They only people with more unqualified arrogance than "journalists" are University PHDs.
Does that mean that all those demands from the FBI and myriad other Federal Agencies, to silence people over the past 4 years, were just getting through their Inbox backlog from the Trump Administration before Biden? I never knew what committed professionals fill the chairs for the Executive Branch.
Oh yeah, and Brzezinski's admission that we created the Taliban and Al Qaeda not in reponse to a Soviet Invasion in the 80s, but to provoke that invasion, we trained, funded, and armed the Taliban, trained them to take over Afghanistan. In a way, the Afghanistan war was the one war that was justified, since the goal was to undo the damage that Jimmy Carter did to that country.
A free press is a Debbie Downer for the people running our government, who are not the people we elected to do the job.
Kettle calling pot black. Am I racist?
If Hillary hadn't lost the election, it would not have been necessary to muzzle the press. Obviously.
Like SURJ Madison, Sulzberger is fishing for the bien-pensent midwits in the audience. They are there, and they are numerable. They must know when to look away when they receive information that is unclean, or that disrespects the incantation of doctrine.
Remember - Only accept credentialed information from official sources (we know who they are, and they aren't on Joe Rogan or Elon Musk's thing) and you'll be redeemed from the stain.
Truth is what we say it is.
Good point. "Disinformation" is simply a synonym for "fake news". Once Trump ruined Obama and his supporters' phrase (used to criticize Fox News), they adopted "disinformation" to mean the information they wanted to suppress. "Disinformation" didn't mean a fake dossier. "Disinformation" didn't mean contrary information from medical professionals. "Disinformation" didn't mean planting a false story that Hunter Biden's laptop was a Russian plant. "Disinformation" didn't mean telling a false story of Trump grabbing the wheel of "The beast" on Jan. 6th. "Disinformation" didn't mean saying Biden was in the best of health.
so, Sully is pushing FOR 'fake news'? what are his feelings on 'misinformation'?
Trump never called for the press to be censored. He correctly called the legacy media “fake news.” Trump himself was censored on Twitter. This fantastic lying on the Democrat side is just preposterous.
So the New York oligarchy is terrified that President Trump will be placing them under the same rules they want Julian Assange and Elon Musk to be muzzled by? Imagine that.
Eight years ago I would have been fine with simply developing alternative institutions. Now I realize the deadwood has to be cleared away. It doesn't deserve to stick around anyways.
Sulzberger is playing games here. Trump's many grievances with dishonest reporting from a journalistic cadre that has decided to reject objectivity have nothing to do with totalitarian attacks on honest journalism.
I haven't had time to read it yet, but I see he mentions the previous President in Brazil, but somehow, strangely, he doesn't mention the out-of-control Supreme Court judge that is persecuting X and Starlink and actively silencing public opinion there. What's up with that? Is it because Leftists do all the right things, where Conservative do nothing right?
He called leftist lies - "fake new" Like Russia Russian Maddow and lying Adam Schitt.
Most bad news about democrats is hidden - or called "Russian Dis-information"
Right?
The idea that Putin needed permission from Trump to censor the press is adorable.
Russian propaganda brought to you once again by Tim.
What a clueless dick. All the lying and bias by the Fake News speaks for itself. They brought it on themselves. Just do your jobs!
Hillary was the one actually using rope to corral the press out of the way of her campaign stops. She used a muzzle the way a good trainer does. She wanted her dogs to use their mouth only when she told them to do so. And they are well trained.
You are the brainwashed.
Does Punch really think the American people are stupid? And I like the touch how WaPo and the NYT stand in solidarity against the truth. Total fuckheads.
The current president of Brazil is a crook and a chinese stooge
Did Biden family set up shell companies to hide their international grfiting - or not?
When the Left tells you what they fear, it's something they've already gamed how to use on the Right.
They certainly aren’t those who are information peddling in the interest of promoting Russian propaganda. Discernment has been lacking in Trumpublica.
Well Times adepts like the Bomb worshipers
It would have helped of course if NYT had not done Russia, Russia, Russia. Or the Duke lacrosse hoax, and half dozen others I could name since then that have poisoned the national discourse. The amount of projection on Sulzberger's part here is really quite alarming. Is he really that blind? Or just a plain hypocrite?
LOL Althouse! Wapoo & NYT rubbishler together! Good one.
This is fake news.
Governments around the world have always tried to censor and silence reporting they didn't like. They didn't suddenly get the idea because Trump used the words "fake news" to describe fake news.
Trump has never called for censorship. He's not the leader of some movement against freedom of the press. That is the work of Trump's opponents. The NYT itself advocates for less freedom of the press.
This reminds me of a friend of mine.
Democrats have proudly labeled Denver a SANCTUARY city. Democrats are 100% in charge of Blue City Denver.
DENVER IS a Sanctuary City now.
Trump called Denver a Sanctuary City - and my friend said
"Trump called Denver a Sanctuary City!" How dare he do that. Trump's words made it a Sanctuary city."
That is how the left think.
Precisely
Trump is and has been the purveyor of fake news. Interesting how many have been so unable to disentangle themselves from the cult to recognize propaganda and disinformation.
Inga carries the debunked and untrue Russia Russia Maddow Schiit Hillary lie into the sunset.
As usual, Inga you’re an outright liar. Tell me the fake news Trump purveys.
So much pushing of the idea of a “deep state”, when you have the Russian state and other foreign governments right in front of your face using the right wing to push their propaganda. Isn’t it time to open your eyes?
"Fake news" started as the legacy media's dismissive description of blogs and websites, that contradicted their own version of things. Some of those sources really were "fake." Others just contradicted Big Media's view of the world.
Trump turned the label against the legacy media when they were publishing fake stories of their own (often planted by the Deep State), so they moved on to "disinformation" to attack their competitors. "Fake news" is a big part of the entire news/information universe, respectable or not. To some extent it always was, but it's even truer now.
Don't be fooled. Trump and the NYT love each other. Their circulation spiked when Trump was president. Trump loves seeing his name in the hometown paper, even if he hates what they are writing about him. Remember the phone calls to Maggie Haberman, who hates him? He's not going to shut down Big Media. They're part of the show.
Exactly. Leftist and Authoritarian governments have always censored news.
Democrats are jealous. but they want a scapegoat.
There comes a time even the dumbest of you might need to realize how you’ve been manipulated.
He's not complaining about the willing submission to Leftist censorship of which he approves and in which he will participate again and again. He's complaining about the criticism from the Republican candidate. Criticizing the Press or the Left is off limits in his world view (although I'd bet money he never calls out Biden for all the complaining he did about press coverage, just like he won't mention Obama actually jailing journalists (James Rosin) and spying on others (Sheryl Atkinson) routinely).
You know, like the old saying about the "Dark night of fascism descending..."
You’re an utterly vicious liar, Inga. This sort of lying has become ritualized by Democrats. You’re not even ashamed of it. You revel in lying.
And an actual criminal, convicted under a mountain of corruption evidence that would make Everest look like a hillock.
Americans should know where their information is coming from and if it is being promoted by those they trust (but shouldn’t) to further the agenda of a foreign adversary.
Careful, once you utter the words, "bien-pensent midwits in the audience," they show up. I'm told "Russia, Russia, Russia" has the same effect.
"The NYT itself advocates for less freedom of the press."
Less freedom of press that's not them, certainly. Freedom for we, not freedom for thee.
Talk about missing the point...
The behavior of the media [you know, actually BEING fake news] was the action that drove Trump to call you all out publicly, and rightfully so. To try to counter his pointing this out by "flipping the script" and blaming him for other governments now more publicly doing what OUR government was and is doing (in collusion with the MSM) is just more projecting and gaslighting.
Congratulations, NO. ONE. BELIEVES. YOU. ANY. MORE.
As someone MUCH more famous than I said: No matter how much you hate the media, it is NOT enough.
There might come a time when Inga doesn’t lie in every sentence, but I wouldn’t count on it. As has become common on the Democrat side, she seems to enjoy lying. The woman is a lie factory.
He has to swim in the sea but there be sharks
Trump has effectively championed this effort, as he did when he told Bolsonaro at a joint news conference, “I’m very proud to hear the president use the term ‘fake news.’”
Yes, and now Bolsonaro is censoring everyone who disagrees with him.
Oh, wait, it's Bolsonaro and those who agree with him who are being censored.
The laws, edicts, and decrees around the world are against "disinformation" and they are often applied by regimes to suppress the sort of ideas that the NYT wants suppressed.
7:59 Bob Boyd for the win.
Inga, I’m in favor of hearing the Russian point of view. I’m not a completely vicious idiot like you. I want my grandkids to live. I’d rather they weren’t vaporized in a nuclear exchange. The U.S. has been playing with nuclear war in Ukraine. And, brain dead idiots like you are caught up in the war mongering and Red Scare tactics.
Inga is the only person who was persuaded by the Jesus arm-wrestling Satan advertisement the Russians made for Hillary. Obviously the memory still stings.
There is a faction among the neocons who have been lusting for a nuclear exchange with Russia, in the belief that there is some way such a war could be “won.” You can see this suicidal, ghastly stupidity mirrored in Inga.
And Hillary was the only candidate who teamed up with the Deep State to create and spread Russian disinformation about her opponent. The Steele Dossier was completely faked up Russian propaganda, and of course Inga still believes it was true.
Even worse, press mockery.
How far do you imagine Carlos Slim has his fist shoved up Sulzberger’s ass for him to regurgitate exactly what Carlos wants to hear?
This one is not Punch and not even Pinch, who did so much damage to the newspaper with his politicizing and diversity obsessions. This is Pinch Jr.. The sixth in the family to have this title; the fourth generation since the original. Genes well watered down by now.
Too many cases that prove Inga disregards the myriad instances of disinformation shat out by Democrat operatives, grifters and Sino-suck ups.
The sign of "being manipulated" was those who believed and spread the Russian Propaganda hoax Steele Dossier. My recollection is that very few (very very few) commenters here ever believed that shit.
Yes examples please, Inga - I can't wait to see you represent sarcasm, as if it purported to be the truth. ' Nice weather we're having', said the candidate during the downpour.
Inga is too stupid, too vicious, and too addicted to lying to get this, but here goes: JFK secretly installed a hot line to Khrushchev during the Cuban missile crisis to do an end around his generals who were pursuing him to use nukes against the Russians.
Exactly! These charts* are what is really motivating Sulzberger. Trust in our media elite is low and going lower.
*From Steven Hayward at the PowerLine blog.
Mike - The DOJ/FBI (lol) just discovered a Russian spy facebook account with... wait for it.... 7 followers.
And that makes this a good time to remind everyone that "Neocon" is simply the term for Progressive warmongers cosplaying as "Conservative" for the purpose of keeping the "Democrats are agin' war" myth alive. Later, when it's safe, Neocons like Bill Kristol and Max Boot reveal their actual Progressive bonafides. That's why they support Harris. That's why Liz Cheney does. That's why junior McCain does.
I recall the photo taken on the Pantsuited Pantload’s campaign plane with members of the media looking lovingly - dare I say worshipfully - at their hero Hillary.
Fuck ‘em all.
C.J.Sulzberger, for that matter, had opinion pieces that read like the ruins of Pompeii, said Jean Shepherd in a NYT commercial.
Inga - beyond your insufferable, tired and debunked Russia collusion obsession - you don't have an argument. You are a loyal democrat apparatchik.
Strange how you have nothing to say about Biden family corruption.
Or Hillary's private server used to enrich her coffers with RUSSIAN MONEY.
NYT: Cash Flowed to Clinton Foundation Amid Russian Uranium Deal
He's sharp as a tack, Leland! Say it. Say it! "Sharp as a tack!"
Sulzberger is blaming the victim. The Hunter Biden laptop incident, along with many others, clearly show that dishonest reporting targeted Trump. Somehow it's bad for Trump to say so?
Trump did not introduce the terms misinformation, disinformation and malinformation in order for governments to justify censoring media.
Now would be a good time for Sulzberger to make a futile gesture against fake news, by admitting it was a mistake for NYT to uncritically print the articles that got Soviet apologist, Walter Durant, a Pulitzer Prize.
True fact: God made patchouli oil and turned it on the world so that blind people could hate hippies too.
I didn't read the article. Did he acknowledge that so much of the reporting on the COVID epidemic was factually wrong? The mistrust that so many people feel for the MSM comes from the fact that they have been flat wrong about so much. The hostility that's the topspin on this distrust comes from the fact that not only have they been wrong, but they refuse to acknowledge that they were wrong. Trump is voicing that hostility, not causing it.
"As someone who strongly believes in the foundational importance of journalistic independence, I have no interest in wading into politics. "
LOL. I'm old enough to remember when Leftwing "Big Dan the Reporter Man" rather used to play this game. I'm surprised Sulzberger didn't say he just wanted to "Speak truth to power".
I'm constantly astounded what brazen liars Leftwing/Globalist Establishment Press is. 95 percent of the "Independent media" moves in lockstep on every issue, usually lead by the NYT/WaPo/WSJ. They even use the same buzz words, labels and tone. This 95 percent is firmly in the camp of the Leftwing Globalists and it has zero desire to report fairly anything it disapproves of. Or criticize anything it supports. It lies constantly and reports speculation as fact.
We also have Governments - including Biden - censoring social media. But Sulzberger doens't care about that, the REAL problem is Trump and Orban criticizing the Leftwing press. The MSM cries out as it strikes you. LOL.
How do you breakthrough this rhetorical trick of Gaslighting and constant accusing others of what they are in fact doing? Or "no, there is no leftwing censorship, there is biased lockstep media working with the DNC, that's disinformation. Its the free press, reporting objectively, thats under assault from Trump"
Impeachment proceedings against de Moraes are being contemplated in Brazil, but not assured:
Poder 360
Article is in Portuguese, but I'll cut to the chase. 147 legislators are in favor of impeachment, 273 are undecided, and 96 are opposed.
Sulzberger does NOT include links to his more inflammatory allegations against Orban, in contrast to Sulzberger’s heavy citations to mere rhetorical challenges to Legacy Media.
Even if Sulzberger's allegations against Orban are true, they are not cause to deride Trump's rhetorical challenges to Legacy Media. Trump predictions of the Legacy Media being "scrutinized for their knowingly dishonest and corrupt coverage of people, things, and events" is somehow equated with the 'allegations' against Orban.
Well, Trump is correct that Legacy Media (and social media) are and will be scrutinized for knowingly dishonest and corrupt coverage of people, things, and events (sometimes driven by government (authoritarian?) -- e.g. Hunter laptop story.
Sulzberger pretends that Trump's prediction of scrutiny portends authoritarian actions by Trump. Trump was president for four years!
Where is the evidence of Trump being authoritarian with the press? Sulzberger cites nothing unique to Trump. The citations to criminal prosecutions of leaks is a dicey matter across all recent administrations, including Obama. And, while border screening and recording movements of journalists is a concern, these are policies to which all persons and citizens have been subject, again across recent administrations.
What Sulzberger cites to in most respects is Trump's: SPEECH against speech with which he finds fault; encouraging legal boycotts by the public, while citing cause; or advocating but not executing modification of civil law that would allow greater scrutiny and civil-law ability to demonstrate and remedy damage for false speech.
Sulzberger puts forward a disingenuous >> dishonest argument, pointing toward Trump while ignoring actual threats and government actions against free speech (Twitter files) as well as statements by the mostly-hidden DNC candidate, Kamala Harris, asserting need for government actions against free-speech -- that Trump “has lost his privileges” to be on (pre-Musk) Twitter “there has to be a responsibility that is placed on these social media sites to understand their power. They are directly speaking to millions and millions of people without any level of OVERSIGHT OR REGULATION, and that has to stop.”
https://www.mediaite.com/news/cnns-jake-tapper-smacks-down-false-claim-kamala-harris-said-elon-musk-lost-free-speech-with-trump-twist/
Is Sulzberger really asserting with a straight face, that France took their lead from Donald Trump?
Really?
What to know about Tenet Media, Tennessee company linked to Russian propagandists ~ The Tennessean
One nice thing about this Tenet Media indictment is that MAGA has long accepted, as an indisputable truth, that "Russiagate" was completely fabricated by the deep state, the media, and Democrats, and that there are no Russian interference operations in the US.
Lol Inga. No one thinks Tim Pool and Benny Johnson are journalists.
Yes. Blame Trump! Or maybe wonder why the only fraction of the USA that trusts the press, and even then it's like 65%, is the 1/3 who are Democrats.
Most people already, way before Trump ran for office, dismissed the MSM as hopelessly biased.
I read the Times but i dont take it as legit
Which one are you referencing, Mike?
So much pushing of the idea of a “deep state”
Tell us then, who is running the country right now?
Trump called-out fake news rhetorically in a campaign, which is appropriate.
Trump called-out Hillary's criminality rhetorically in a campaign, which is appropriate.
Trump's never weaponized the power of government to censor or arrest his opponents.
Trump's opponents did weaponize the power of government to censor or arrest their opponents, including Trump and his supporters.
Censorship? See: Biden is fine. Any talk to the contrary is a lie.
Inga is just the frothing at the mouth version of Democrat voters. I appreciate her presence here along with the other propagandists. Yesterday the DOJ started their Russian interference campaign, and loyal followers like Inga believe it. There are a lot of Americans out there like Inga. They are your neighbors that that will make the call for a Tim Walz style "narc on your neighbor program." Also, Inga has stated she lives in a nice safe red town in in Waukesha County, WI. There are plenty of deplorables for her to turn in.
Can anyone identify a single incident where something that Trump labeled as "fake news" turned out to be true? As far as I can recall, Trump was correct 100% of the time when he called out fake news.
“ Americans should know where their information is coming from and if it is being promoted by those they trust (but shouldn’t) to further the agenda of a foreign adversary.”
Out of the mouths of babes (or dried up shrews).
Looking back over the last 8 1/2 years, it would have been nice to have known the source of Inga’s Russian Collusion, the Steele Dossier, that the Hunter laptop was (supposedly) fake, that COVID-19 had zoonotic origins, that the ModRNA vaccines were safe and effective, that ventilators worked and didn’t kill, that masking and social distancing were useful, that herd immunity was possible with those precautions, that the MAL raid was for finding anything except for the binder of documents formally ordered declassified by (then) President Trump, etc. All lies, and all originating either from Trump’s opponents and/or within our own government and former government bureaucrats.
"One nice thing about this Tenet Media indictment is that MAGA has long accepted, as an indisputable truth, that "Russiagate" was completely fabricated by the deep state, the media, and Democrats, and that there are no Russian interference operations in the US."
Which makes me think there is a pretty good possibility that the indictment is bullshit.
Birches, I agree they aren’t journalists, they are right wing influencers being paid big bucks by RT.
"Trump has effectively championed this effort"
The framing is itself misinformation. The left has produced fake news and supports censorship, backed by government power.
Inga, you don't think the Russians are smart enough to make these obscure moves knowing the Biden regime would elevate them to use them politically against their opponents, thus helping the Russian's favored candidate Kamala?
And we’re finding out that it was the “Russia, Russia, Russia” gaslighting that would eventually be proven to be an influence campaign in itself. There has been and continues to be a Russian attempt to push their agenda using the right wing to peddle it. Truth eventually finds a way and the dupes may one day realize just how much they’ve bought into the un American propaganda from a foreign adversary channeled through these right wing influencers.
To wit, what would you estimate as the value of the Garland press conference in terms of an in-kind political contribution? In dollar terms it leveraged manyfold whatever the Russians spent out-of-pocket.
Maybe House Republicans should spend less time promoting right-wing conspiracy theories and more time investigating the Kremlin funding MAGA influencers to spread Russian propaganda.
One thing that tipped me off about the attempt to frame Trump as a Russian agent was the claim that he was using a mail server in a domain that he owns to "secretly" communicate with a bank in Russia. Anyone that knows anything about computer security and the internet can tell you that is both insecure and inefficient. The "researchers" claim that they discovered this by checking DNS server logs. DNS server logs are not exactly classified. You are leaving a record of who you are communicating with as well as the time and how often, which is susceptible to traffic analysis. That's a big no-no in spy craft. Especially since their are way more secure ways to communicate. Hell, you can just open up the tor browser private window that is available in the Brave browser and BAM! you are on the dark web. And since the communication is encrypted and goes through three different relays, called onion routers, you have the same anonymity and security used by dissidents and journalists in some of the most oppressive countries in the world. Or, he could set up a phony Facebook account and use stenography to hide data in pictures that he posts. Or he could not use the internet and go with a good old-fashioned dead drop. Now some TDS sufferers will state that Trump wouldn't know about any of that, but if he was communicating with the Russians they would have known how to set up a secret communications channel. It is obvious bullshit.
Igna: "... the Russian state and other foreign governments right in front of your face using the right wing to push their propaganda. Isn’t it time to open your eyes?" This on the heels of the exposure of Chinese Communist Party influence in the offices of two consecutive governors of New York.
Pointing out the media lies relentlessly in the "news" it prints is not censorship. The only significant push for censorship here in the US and Europe comes from the Left, not the Right. Sulzberger is just lying again by omission.
And yet the twitter files and zuckerberg tell a completely different story.
You believe Putin? Putin was smiling and trolling, we all know that Kamala Harris is not his favored candidate. Trump is Putin’s buddy, he knows Trump will do his bidding. Think back to Helsinki and what Trump said with Putin standing right there next to him.
Wait.......they're blaming Trump for all the stuff they did to try to get Trump?
"In 2022, a U.S. attorney charged 70 individuals associated with Minnesota-based Feeding Our Future (FOF) for their alleged roles in defrauding the USDA of over $250 million in taxpayer funds—money intended to feed hungry children. To date, five individuals have been convicted of fraud that the assistant U.S. attorney on the case called “not just criminal, [but] depraved and brazen.” Charges include federal programs bribery, wire fraud, conspiracy, and money laundering. While dozens are still awaiting trial, questions remain regarding the role of the Minnesota Department of Education’s (MDE) administration of the Federal Child Nutrition Programs and its oversight of FOF."
Has our "media" reported on this?
'tim in vermont' demonstrates his abysmal ignorance of history once again. He thinks we created the Taliban in 1994 and Al Qaeda in 1988 to provoke the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan in 1979 (not "the 80s"). And he totally omits the 1978 pro-Soviet communist coup in Afghanistan (the 'Saur Revolution') which caused the entire population to rise up against it, which in turn caused the Soviets to invade to try to preserve the puppet government they had installed. I've corrected his fraudulent history before, but he keeps repeating it.
Of course, anyone who thinks saving Taiwan from Mao's troops was a bad thing is a swine or a fool. One small part of China avoided the horrors of Mao's rule, saving millions of lives, and has since transformed into a peaceful and prosperous democracy, and 'tim' thinks that's a bad thing! Does he also deplore the division of Korea and wish all of it was under the Kim dynasty?
"when the fake news becomes fact, print the fake news."
Newspaper editor in "The man who shot liberty valence"
(lightly edited)
Great movie, BTW. Starring strother Martin, John Wayne, woody strode, Jimmy Stewart and more.
John Henry
Inga, at this late date do you still deny that the Steele Dossier was produced at the behest of the Hillary campaign and the DNC, with funding funneled through Marc Elias and Fusion GPS?
He never
replied, though once he went to the extent of disburdening his mind to
half a dozen reporters. "Do your damnedest," he told them. "Burning
Daylight's bucked bigger things than your dirty, lying sheets. And I
don't blame you, boys... that is, not much. You can't help it. You've
got to live. There's a mighty lot of women in this world that make
their living in similar fashion to yours, because they're not able to
do anything better. Somebody's got to do the dirty work, and it might
as well be you. You're paid for it, and you ain't got the backbone to
rustle cleaner jobs."
From jack lo dons most commercially successful novel that nobody has ever heard of" Burning Daylight " 1910
A terrific read as well as listen on librivox
John Henry
MAGA has long accepted, as an indisputable truth... that there are no Russian interference operations in the US.
That's completely false. Trump supporters, along with pretty much everybody else, have always said Russia has probably meddled in every US election to one degree or another.
MAGA's position was on claims by Dem and NeverTrump Republicans that Trump was in league with Putin who was able to somehow swing the 2016 election for Trump by purchasing a few ads on Facebook was ludicrous.
And yet HIS paper 3 days ago published an op-ed by Robert "3rd" Reich advocating National Socialist style censorship of American citizens.
John Henry
"Fake News" got Bolsonaro pretty quickly, though. Pretty easy when you've got a communist like "Lula."
"It is obvious bullshit."
And the fact that no MSM journalist asks such an obvious question as, "why would Russian Intelligence use such a ridiculous method to communicate with one of their agents?" Makes me think that they are either idiots are shills.
The problem is about half the people in this country still believe them, including one frantically posting on this thread.
There's nothing new about government censorship of the news in many countries around the world. There is something new about the governments of the western democracies doing it openly and openly advocating total government control of information whether it is a breaking story published by a news organization or the opinion of a little old lady on Facebook.
Trump didn't start that and he doesn't support it. The most we've heard from Trump is a call for Congress to reform libel laws.
Trump's opponents, entrenched in the governments of the US and of the leading western democracies, started it all in response to a guy getting elected that didn't get their stamp of approval and that they could not control.
Do his bidding? You mean like suggest that a 'minor incursion' into Ukraine wouldn't provoke a reaction?
Your density level approaches depleted uranium. No wonder you suck up all the bullshit the fake media feed you.
Since we're on the topic of "Russian interference" in the election:
"Nothing in U.S. history comes close to the interference caused by the letter engineered by Antony Blinken (working for Biden’s 2020 campaign) signed by 51 intel officials falsely claiming Hunter’s laptop had “all the classic earmarks of a Russian information operation.”"
The dullard accuses someone else of being "brainwashed." I might point out that to be "brain washed" you need a brain. You are safe, Inga.
"And he totally omits the 1978 pro-Soviet communist coup in Afghanistan"
What what? Oh, I get it, when you like the outcome, like when the ultranationalist "not sees" took over in Kiev in 2014, it's not a "coup" but when you don't, it *is* a coup.
"Of course, anyone who thinks saving Taiwan from Mao's troops was a bad thing is a swine or a fool"
Not exactly a denial that we interfered in a war that was none of our business, is it. Not exactly a denial that any conflict between Mainland China and Taiwan, which claims to be the legitimate government of all of China is none of our business.
While I feel bad for the Chinese people and what they had to suffer under Mao, I don't think that it is worth the lives of American boys to "right this wrong." There will never be an end to wars that American boys must fight if we are to right every wrong, and correct every injustices real or imagined, in the world. One thing that is certainly not worth an American life is to keep the people living on the other side of the world from speaking the same Russian that they have for centuries, and force those people living on the other side of the world to speak Ukrainian. That is certainly not worth even the 1% risk of a nuclear war.
Inga is still waving the Steele Dossier flag, years after iths been proven fake.
Basically we have condemned Afghanistan to war torn hell since with trained and armed the Taliban in 1979. What business was Afghanistan of ours, and how did we help the people there?
Inga sounds so stupid that I wonder if "she' is a bot.
YOU 🤡 YOU!
The idiot press baron doth protest too much. He and other publishers have let the lefty kids in their newsrooms run wild. And the public doesn't like the dog food, so they are vomiting up his stuff--and cancelling subscriptions. In an introspective moment Sulzberger might think about just why that is happening People will read good honest news, honestly delivered.
I visited Tenet media's youtube page yesterday. I would encourage anyone who thinks the DOJ just proved some podcasters were reciting Russian propaganda should go visit it, too. 1) The Tenet media page appears to repackage a variety of twitter stuff and videos with their network logo and text (purple.) 2) Youtube has not shut it down...why not? 3) Its not very pro-russian. Not much of it is even related to Russia. 4) Tim Pool once was upset that Ukraine blew up the Russian-German pipeline. OK, that might be pushed by Russia, or it could just be actual anger at an environmental catastrophe done by a country that even now allows Russian gas to pass through its lands...for $$$. 5) I think Inga and others have overly believed that the DOJ proved that these podcasters "did russian propaganda" when most of their stories are about....Biden-Harris policy failures. Are Venezuelan gangs in Colorado a Putin inspired story? or a Biden-Harris enabled story?
Anyways, I'd advise anyone believing the DOJ to check out the videos yourselves. I do think its possible they had some minor influence, but probably not over the content creators who were hired to fill up Tenet's channel.
So, the crime was Russians refusing to do FARA and trying to disguise themselves...to...do what? DOJ should show the exact videos they claimed were pushed by Russia.
As a rule, always ask the accuser to show you specifically what the crime is, and what the evidence is. Don't jump to conclusions.
So, if you think Tenet is pushing Russian propaganda, make sure to ask for concrete examples. Ask how content creators were pushed to cover some news stories or use Kremlin spin. Ask for very specific evidence.
Also, realize that every organization has these pressures. NYT has pressures, so does WaPo, so does Daily Show, so does the Lincoln Project. Foreigners like Hans Jorg Wyss spend a lot in America on politics, too. Why do we not care about him? or BBC? or al Jazeera? or Chinese media on youtube?
And here comes 'tim in vermont' to lie again. One more time: the Taliban was founded in 1994, and could not possibly have been "trained and armed" by the US in 1979, unless we had time machines. What "condemned Afghanistan to war torn hell" was the 1978 coup by Afghan communists supported by the USSR and the 1979 invasion to prop them up when the entire population rose against them. Did some of those uprisers eventually join the Taliban? A few did, but the Taliban was mostly students, so still in diapers in 1979. And most of them eventually formed the Northern Alliance to fight the Taliban after the Russians left.
As for Taiwan claiming to be the legitimate government of all China, why shouldn't they? In a free and fair election, they would very likely win.
Of course, his biggest lie is the claim that the popular uprising against Yanukovych in Ukraine in 2014 was a "coup" by Nazis. The fact is that the guy very likely stole the 2010 election, that he locked up his opponent on bogus charges, that he was worth billions when he fled the country, though he'd never had a job outside government, that he betrayed all his promises to the people by sucking up to Putin, and that he was slaughtering demonstrators in the streets. He may (may!) have been elected, but he was in fact a brutal tyrant. Hitler, Mugabe, and Arafat were elected, too, but soon revealed themselves as tyrants. His voluntary departure when he realized that everyone in the country hated and despised him was no more a "coup" than Nixon's resignation.
The only "coups" that happened in Ukraine in 2014 were the Russian seizure of Crimea by overwhelming force, and the Russian invasion of the Donbas, with Russian troops pretending to be local insurrectionists.
"DOJ should show the exact videos they claimed were pushed by Russia."
THIS. And until they do, we have every reason to believe it's the same "Russia!" bullshit they've been pushing for years. You'd really think they'd get some new material.
"DOJ should show the exact videos they claimed were pushed by Russia."
THIS. And until they do, we have every reason to believe it's the same "Russia!" bullshit they've been pushing for years. You'd really think they'd get some new material
The comments over there are absolutely hilarious. Holy cow!
Mark (no, not that Mark)
The British press was pretty well controlled during WWI. The "Defense of the Realm Act" was used to hide the magnitude of the casualties. Douglas Haig tried to use that Censorship To hide his incompetence but was outwitted by Lloyd George who changed the celebration of the Armistice into "Remembrance Day" to mourn the dead. Haig's reputation never recovered.
If Inga or "Rich" are pushing the story, it is most probably bullshit.
One thing I noticed from the FBI's statement was that Russia supposedly was acting to support their preferred candidate, but refused to name that candidate. Now, if that candidate was Donald Trump do you think they would have declined to say so?
And before you answer, I remind you of the 51 intelligence agents who declared, falsely, that Hunter Biden's laptop was Russian propaganda days before the 2020 election.
This stuff is so obvious I'm surprised they continue to do it.
Inga is slowly and inexorably losing touch with reality, like one of the sheep in "Animal Farm". Of course, the sheep were the biggest supporters of Napoleon, the pig Overlord.
There's only one candidate attacking the First Amendment and it's not Trump.
Harris promises to bring the Brazil nightmare to the USA.
I'm glad someone mentioned this, because neither Trump nor anyone else on the right came up with this pejorative phrase. It was a weapon that was forged by Obama and his henchmen, and meant to be wielded solely against Fox News, impudent conservative and libertarian bloggers, unmoderated comment sections on news sites (remember those?) and social-media reposts of articles and video clips from sources that were not under the control of the Gramscian termites infesting our institutions.
In the greatest feat of political aikido I can recall, Trump picked up the weapon forged to harm him, and slapped the mother of all Uno reverse cards on those who forged it. Public trust in the enemy news-media lice was already faltering, especially since Rathergate, but their decline really hit the skids when Trump turned "Fake News" into the first thing the average citizen thinks of when he hears the smug lies from the national TV networks and the major East Coast newspapers.
I'm delighted that this is happening to the enemy news-media lice, and I never miss an opportunity to undermine the socialist scum in any conversation with friends and co-workers. I hope to see the actual bankruptcy and dissolution of their organizations within a few short years, although a Trump presidency may provide them a temporary reprieve as the rabid partisans on the Left seek out pretty lies to explain why their power dwindles and the public regards them as evil incarnate.
Did you know that “Maynard” has a sexual appliance obsession? He’s addressed me numerous times over the years (even in his previous incarnation here) and he mentions sexual appliances. At first I just thought he was a weirdo, but then it became apparent that he may be a deviant, who when drunk reveals his innermost demons to women (who are strangers to him) on the internet. He has said that he once was a psychologist, I suggest he may be in need of a real doctor, a psychiatrist.
ST, has it occurred to you that it’s childish to accuse others of lying when you don’t believe what they say? I don’t believe most of what you say, should I say you’re a liar?
But the whole point of a 'bot' is to either directly influence future events, or to sow confusion when direct influencing won't work. Do Inga's comments rise to that level?
Which makes me think there is a pretty good possibility that the indictment is bullshit.
I'd strongly suspect the whole thing of being a deliberate domestic dirty trick set up by our own FBI/CIA scum. They are nothing but a private Stasi secret-police force for the Democrat Party nowadays. Hope Trump dismembers both agencies.
JournoListic handmade tales are his forte. Journalistic jujitsu is not his stock and trade. Could've been an AI.
He's gone now, Leland. He hit the overnight thread a few times and this one this morning with a hot link to his web url.
Trump was talking about fake news long before he ran for President. He mentioned it several times during an appearance on the Joan Rivers Show in 1990.
There comes a time even the dumbest of you might need to realize how you’ve been manipulated.
Why it's almost as if you have no self-awareness at all.
Hunter just pleaded guilty.
But the Hack-D press and the FBI assured us that all negative info about Hunter is untrue = and planted RUSSIAN DIS-INFORMATION.
Inga, I think everyone here takes it for granted that you own the Ronco Animatronic Obama Doll that sonorously whispers, "Let me be clear, you can slap my ass any time."
Trump acknowledges losing the 2020 election 'by a whisker' ~ NBC
All you morons that cried 2020 was stolen must feel like imbeciles now that Trump is admitting he lost.
Dr Weevil, I think the Ukraine story is more complicated . I also believe that the border dispute could have been settled without war. Trump would probably have done it. The anti Prussian hysteria by Democrats made that impossible.
The Dullard is again trying to spread stupid lies.
Inga, you are too stupid to spread lies, much as you try.
I hear that one of Trump’s buddies Nick Fuentes, is mad at him for ruining the last 7 years of his life based on the lie of “Stop the Steal”.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2024/09/05/trump-admits-lost-2020-enrages-supporters/75086053007/
“White nationalist Nick Fuentes blasted Trump Sept. 4 for admitting that he lost the 2020 election, and said that he will work to get voters not to back Trump.
"So, why did we do Stop the Steal? Why did did anyone go to Jan. 6? Why did any one go to jail? ... It would have been good to know that before 1,600 people got charged," Fuentes said on his podcast, referring to the criminal charges for those who invaded and ransacked the Capitol. "It would’ve been good to know that before (I) had all my money frozen, put on a no-fly list, banned from everything, lost all my bank and payment processing.”
All those dupes sitting in jail now, because thy believed Trump. All those lives ruined because the dumbasses couldn’t recognize a cult leader.
Why would anyone believe Inga about anything ?
Why would anyone believe Inga or "Rich" about anything ?
I tried to follow Althouse's gift link, but the Post wanted me to enter my Email, and that I will not do for them. So can someone please tell me whether Sulzberger apologizes for his and his newspaper's role in creating the current situation. It is not just hard core Republicans who do not trust news pushed by papers like the New York Times and Washington Post, or television news organizations like ABC, NBC, CNN, CBS, and MSNBC. Ordinary citizens have worked it out. Not that Sulzberger or anyone else in any of the organizations I've listed will believe that -- such is their contempt for those they consider to be untermenschen.
It was not the Trump administration that encouraged the media to censor, or attempt to censor, information during the 2020 election (not to mention continuously since 2015). What we're seeing a this unhinged belief from those on the left that anything that goes wrong anywhere in the world must, somehow, be Donald Trump's fault. A child in rural Bolivia gets a hangnail, then by golly it has to be all Trump's fault. It is way past tiresome.
And by the way, Sulzberger publishing in what is ostensibly a rival newspaper does suggest that the "rivals" must surely cooperate at many levels to stifle different perspectives on the same story.
They're there because they wouldn't cop a plea after being told that if the Feds told them it wouldn't go well for them if they refused the offer. Meanwhile, the Feds' prosecutorial overreach has come under scrutiny because they filed charges for merely being present.
A few dissenters don't make a movement.
They are there because they believed the election was stolen based on Trump big lie and went to the Capital at the behest of Trump to stop the certification of the election. Stop giving Trump a pass. Eventually even if he doesn’t accept responsibility for his actions, he will be held responsible by the courts and a jury of Americans.
Yancy at 7:00,
Hilarious!
"The U.S. has been playing with nuclear war in Ukraine."
Weird. When did we invade the Ukraine?
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