Writes Jon Lee Anderson, in "Haiti Held Hostage Gangs control the capital. Foreign help is scarce. Can the embattled island nation save itself?" (The New Yorker).
When I was in Haiti, Barbecue agreed to meet me.... For several minutes, Barbecue studiously ignored me, apparently absorbed by his iPad. I asked him what he was reading. “I read the news,” he said, looking up briefly. Any particular kind? “Nothing special,” he said. “Everything.”... He finally put down his iPad when I asked about the allegations against him....
Barbecue became animated as he talked about his heroes.... He mentioned Jean-Jacques Dessalines, Haiti’s iconic first ruler, as well as the Burkinabe revolutionary Thomas Sankara, Fidel Castro, and Malcolm X. “I like Martin Luther King, too, but he didn’t like fighting with guns, and I fight with guns,” he said, with a short, explosive laugh.
Barbecue... had on a large gold pendant and a matching ring with Masonic symbols, which he said marked him as “someone who was seeking the truth.” On his cell-phone cover was a Pop Art image depicting him as Che Guevara, complete with beret. “I’m not a Communist,” he explained. “I just like their philosophy. People who love their country. People who see the need to develop their country.”...
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75 comments:
I wonder if things would have been better if Clinton hadn't meddled in the Island? I thought his intervention was questionable at the time and it certainly didn't help in the long term.
How can this be? The United States threw so much money at the problem? I mean, Sean Penn was there…
"Foreign help is scarce. Can the embattled island nation save itself?"
Send in the fucking Clintons!
Might some of these gang members be among those saved by American do good missions? Bob Geldhof had such a revelation about ten years ago. The boomtown rats member was the founder of Live Aid concerts for Africa in the 80s. It was somewhat despairing for him when he realized that many of those little boys with protruding bellies had grown up simply to machete their neighboring tutsis in the 90s.
". . . with half of Haiti’s population afflicted by acute hunger...."
If only someone, someone important who thought only of others 24/7, would have come up with an idea and the means to put that idea into action, an idea that would help the people of Haiti.
If only that angel existed . . .
https://stories.clintonfoundation.org/president-clinton-and-the-clinton-foundation-background-on-efforts-in-haiti-39e66a51531
Killing off all the whites in 1804 got rid of all the Western traditions.
coming SOON, to a downtown near YOU!
Killing off all the whites in 1804 got rid of all the Western traditions.
it IS odd.. that a nation Founded on MURDER and RAPE; would have a LOT of MURDER and RAPE
Killing off all the whites in 1804 got rid of all the Western traditions.
You mean like chattel slavery?
Freder Frederson said...
Killing off all the whites in 1804 got rid of all the Western traditions.
You mean like chattel slavery?
Freder, I assume you are aware that slavery was a GLOBAL tradition for thousands of years, until WESTERN cultures led the way in abolishing it in the 1800s. You know that, right? RIGHT?
Maybe you don't know that, as public school history classes, CRT and Ethnic Studies courses seem to ignore or gloss over that very relevant fact.
Wait...so it's been 219 years since they got rid of all the oppressive white racists (and non-racists), and they still haven't reached their full potential?
I have worked in Haiti -- ag development -- and my son has worked there with communications development. He and I are totally fluent in French [he natively so] and each of us speaks decent Kreyol. It's a place we care about, and we have friends there. There are many good people, often working quite hard to improve things, but it is a losing battle, perhaps even worse than America's utterly dysfunctional urban cores.
And they don't have the convenience of blaming whites.
Haiti does not have an army to take over and settle things down. There can be no Pinochet, or Fujimori to liquidate the sector of society which seeks personal wealth by becoming powerful.
Haiti NEEDS to be occupied and run dictatorially for a couple of decades to clean things up. It has to be a competent, francophone, majority-black nation [or nations] with a truly effective military unafraid to take on and eliminate the gangs. Ruthlessly and withiut pity.
Sadly, I can think of no such nation. France itself cannot take care of its own considerable problems, and what's available from Africa? Mali? Senegal? Not much hope there, and if you can name a better former French colony, go for it.
Haiti is basically screwed.
I thought the Clinton Foundation already save Haiti?
But but but... the Haitians have GUN CONTROL!
And go look at South Africa... same situation. Same for Zimbabwe.
At least they are not white supremacist!
More than half of Americans donated to Haiti after the earthquake. Virtually none of the money was used to treat, feed, or house Haitians, nor improve infrastructure. Instead, the Clinton Foundation, the oligarchs they propped up, and other NGOs gobbled it up. Cheryl Mills, illegally acting as Hillary's staffer in the State Department while the liaison for Bill's foundation, assisted Mariott, Walmart, the Gap, and foreign investors who absorbed billions in international aid, primarily from us, to rebuild a few luxury settlements and slaves labor factories.
That's why Haiti is not going to survive this time. Hillary, Bill, and Cheryl.
This is one of the best (most grueling) Haiti essays I've ever read--
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/weekly-standard/love-among-the-ruins
Matt Labash, originally published in the Weekly Standard, fortunately still available online.
Haiti is the heart of darkness in the western hemisphere. It's a horrible situation and has been since seemingly forever. Multiple medical organizations have tried to go in there to do work over the years, but it's like trying to stem a massive hole in the bow of a ship with gauze and tape. This nation will not work until some strong arm for good completely takes over and destroys the bad- once and for all. It will take a beneficent dictator to clean up Haiti. After that, it's possible some sort of civil society can be put together. Democracy at this point is an absurd thing to consider.
I know they've had a string of 'beneficent dictators' before. They still need an actual force for good that is greater than the forces for bad. It's out of control.
If the population of Haiti is not growing, then our globalist leadership will call this a "success."
Compare and contrast Haiti with the other side of the island.
I had almost forgotten about the Clintons' Healing Touch.
Haiti has been trying (not trying) to save itself for years. That place is one big slum and that’s despite the efforts of outside forces trying to help. Give up. There has been no evidence of even incremental progress. Got to change the culture before you might change the prospects and to do that would be racist. Leave them alone.
I’m picturing Forest Whitaker in “the last king of Scotland”
It totally sounds like the Americas have their own Idi Amin.
BTW, Islam brought market slavery to Africa, and while this doesn't excuse European involvement with it, the Europeans found mature slave markets when they arrived. Nobody wants to talk about Islamic influence in Africa, but it is very real. Europeans had been sold into Islamic slave markets for centuries, usually after being taken into slavery by Viking raiders.
The Great Slave Lake is named after the "Slavie" Indians, who lived around it, and were frequent targets of slaving parties of neighboring tribes. This was an existing practice encountered by the French, not brought to them from Europe. Most likely "slavic" peoples has to do with the fact that the Vikings had a huge appetite for Islamic gold and silver, and so had a huge appetite for European slaves which they found along the Baltic Sea, mostly, but also the North Sea. Muslims had found a huge silver deposit in Afghanistan, and used to it buy textiles from China, and slaves from Europe.
This is our history, the history of Europeans is pretty execrable in myriad ways, but we were not alone in our unenlightened ways of being.
Islam didn't invent slavery either. Romans and Greeks did it, as did the Israelites, which is about as far back as written history goes in the West, and it's highly unlikely that they invented it themselves. However, we ended it, at great cost.
Lots of people chatter about the laboratory of federalism. Haiti is an experiment gone horribly wrong in the laboratory of internationalism. Compare it to the nation with which it shares Hispaniola -- the relatively functional and prosperous Dominican Republic. Mr. Barbecue and his ilk need to think about a new experiment. Just make sure the experimenters haven't heard of John Rawls or Roberto Unger.
Before the invention of the steam engine - all labor was essentially manually based. Agriculture as the prime example. ( after mechanization 98% of human labor was replaced). So if you wanted a job done - you needed workers back then.
That’s why chattel Slavery in the new world got going in the Caribbean first - sugar! But why did the Europeans pick Africans as the chattel slaves? One word - malaria! Europeans brought it to the new world and it took hold hard there - and in the US south that has high enough temperatures for the disease to thrive. European workers had 70%+ fatality rates or they were out of action for months recovering. Africans had childhood immunity.
So Freder - why is it that you call “European traditions” out when you don’t say a peep about the African tribes that rounded up , enslaved and sold the 14 MILLION plus slaves to the Atlantic and Arab slave routes? The problem starts at the root and that’s pretty much the bottom of it. But do virtue signal for us here.
"...Killing off all the whites in 1804 got rid of all the Western traditions.
You mean like chattel slavery?"
Ahem - you are aware that more people are enslaved today, in present time, then there were at the peak of the transatlantic slave trade during the 1800's? Since you are so triggered by the issue, perhaps you can share with us what your personal commitments are, in the present day, toward ending present-day slavery?
Freder, I assume you are aware that slavery was a GLOBAL tradition for thousands of years, until WESTERN cultures led the way in abolishing it in the 1800s. You know that, right? RIGHT?
And certain sections of western cultures tried to hold on to it as long as possible (read the articles of confederation for the CSA). The British ended slavery, but instead of compensating the victims of slavery, the owners were compensated for the loss of their "property".
And while slavery was widely practiced, the concept of chattel slavery (where humans and even the children are the absolute property was definitely an invention of Western Culture). And don't even point out that the Romans and Greeks practiced chattel slavery. They are supposed to be the cornerstones of western culture.
You know that right? RIGHT? Even the 13th amendment allows forced labor for punishment of crimes. And it was a common practice during Jim Crow to rent out inmates to private entities.
Ahem - you are aware that more people are enslaved today, in present time, then there were at the peak of the transatlantic slave trade during the 1800's?
You are aware that the population of the entire world was about 1 billion people in the 1800's, so comparing absolute numbers is meaningless. Chattel slavery is illegal everywhere in the world, which is the type of slavery I am discussing.
More pronouns and electrification of the energy system. To combat climate change dontcha' know.
The gangster "Barbecue" sounds like a Key and Peele sketch. His right hand man is "Foreman Grill," and his chief enforcer is "A-1 Sauce."
So Freder - why is it that you call “European traditions” out when you don’t say a peep about the African tribes that rounded up , enslaved and sold the 14 MILLION plus slaves to the Atlantic and Arab slave routes? The problem starts at the root and that’s pretty much the bottom of it. But do virtue signal for us here.
Didn't your mother ever tell you "that someone else did it too" is not a valid excuse?
I was responding to Rhhardin's ridiculous assertion that if Haiti had not shed "western traditions" (like being enslaved) in 1804 they would be better off.
PS Whatever you do, don't call Haiti a "shithole country." That would be offensive.
...Killing off all the whites in 1804 got rid of all the Western traditions.
You mean like chattel slavery?"
Europeans retailing what Africans were wholesaling.
Coming soon to America. The Utopia of Progressives is alive and going as planned in Haiti.
Freder Frederson said...
You mean like chattel slavery?
and WHO ended THAT?
was it the africans? where it still is in practice?
was it the asians? where it still is in practice?
was it the arabs? where it still is in practice?
or, was it the White west? hmmm? well? speak Up man, i Can't hear you!
Ironclad writes, "But why did the Europeans pick Africans as ... chattel slaves? One word - malaria!"
It wasn't that complicated. European slave traders conducted their commerce as they did because the west coast of Africa, the supermarket of slavery then and now, was conveniently located with business-hungry slavers willing to deliver their bargain-priced human wares right to the beach. Muslim slave ports like Tripoli and Benghazi were even more agreeably located, particularly for the French ports of Toulon and Marseilles, however, their merchandise was largely white, and therefore more expensive. Furthermore, the Tripolitan slavers demanded payment in gold, whereas the
merchants of the African slave coast were happy to trade for cheaper manufactured goods, muskets and swords being highly desired. Consequently, the longer voyage south was well worth the trip. Europeans generally avoided commerce with the Muslim slavers except to ransom their relations from captivity. Besides, the New World's market for white slaves was already adequately supplied by the European assizes.
I find it curious that little Miss Frederkins chose chattel slavery, an ancient form of human bondage with origins lost in the mists of past ages, and neglected the one uniquely European form of servitude? Just another deleterious aspect of a spotty education, one assumes.
Remember when the Clintons claimed to care about Haiti -then profited off of that corrupt government.
yeah - good times.
Bart Hall -thank you for that.
Little Miss Frederkins writes, "I was responding to Rhhardin's ridiculous assertion that if Haiti had not shed "western traditions" (like being enslaved) in 1804 they would be better off."
That's a malicious mischaracterization of rhhardin's comment, and you ought to know that, but your moral compass always points at yourself, eh?
Little Miss Frederkins writes, "I was responding to Rhhardin's ridiculous assertion that if Haiti had not shed "western traditions" (like being enslaved) in 1804 they would be better off."
That's a malicious mischaracterization of rhhardin's comment, and you ought to know that, but your moral compass always points at yourself, eh?
Only the Haitians can save themselves- no one else can or should try. Bart Hall above is correct- the only outside attempt that would even have a chance of success (and it would still be small even with the perfect, beneficient dictator) would be a beneficient dictatorship installed from abroad that was composed entirely of French speaking black people. There is no such entity that can come to the rescue.
"...You are aware that the population of the entire world was about 1 billion people in the 1800's, so comparing absolute numbers is meaningless...."
Hey Freder, looks like you forgot to answer this part:
"Since you are so triggered by the issue, perhaps you can share with us what your personal commitments are, in the present day, toward ending present-day slavery?"
Arguments about numbers and their relevance not withstanding, what are you doing about it now?
I don't care.
may be French Gendarmeeire can form Foreign Legion come in and practice
after all freed Haitians!! gave slaver French billions in gold in restitution for having been slaves!!
There's a local media (radio, print) guy in the Detroit area named Mitch Albom (written several books as well). After the earthquake Albom opened a charity orphanage in Haiti and often holds fundraisers. I don't care much for his politics but he gets credit for doing some very heavy lifting in Haiti -- as best he can given the constraints. He gets down there every few months and it's amazing that he comes home in one piece. He has a very positive attitude in spite of the conditions.
One Island, two Nations. The Dominican Republic is a relatively healthy/prosperous Nation built on the Spanish colonizers integration with natives. Haiti is a shit hole thanks to the Republic of France's exploitation. That said, the latest explainer is the DR gets more rain.
Any word on whether the Clintons ever finished putting in cell phone service for the island? I mean they did take millions in US "aid" to help Haiti. Did it help?
Nice work althousian commenters! We didn't forget the Clintons' hand in this disaster. It's amazing how "neutral" news stories remind so many of us of the uncovered stories automatically. As if we are reading Pravda or Izvestia between the lines like old iron curtain dwellers. If you can translate those two Russian words you get an additional chuckle from the analogy to American media today.
It’s cultural. After they had gained their independence, after they had won everything they murdered nearly every white in their territory. They dragged sick whites out of hospital beds to behead them in the streets. They raped women and children for days and months until they got bored with them and killed them. Then they invaded their Dominican neighbors and enslaved them and decimated their resources. The Dominican Republic has to keep a tight border control or Haitians will cross over in raiding/rape/murder parties. I’ve know people whose families were the victims of Haitian home invasions. Haitian culture is hot garbage. Why they are so different than Dominicans or Jamaicans IDK but they are. There should be a one strike law for Haitian immigrants. One violent crime and they should immediately be deported. I’ve had multiple Haitians tell me with pride about how their ancestors murdered all the whites and some added that’s what American blacks should have done here. To my mostly “white” face. Not even a threat, just stating their cultural beliefs.
And while slavery was widely practiced, the concept of chattel slavery (where humans and even the children are the absolute property was definitely an invention of Western Culture).
Freder prefers the Muslim tradition of castrating the male slaves from Africa to prevent slaves having children. Or maybe the American Indian practice of ritually killing the slaves and eating them? Or the African tradition of selling them to Europeans?
“ Someone else did it”? Really? I pointed to the SOURCE of the problem - the ones that supplied the slaves - captured, murdered , enslaved and sold millions for hundreds of years and that’s your excuse? That’s like blaming the drug trade on the addicts, “ if they didn’t use it there would be no demand and the poor people FORCED to supply the drugs for them would lead lives as clean as snow”. Africans were the “choice” for labor because they possessed one characteristic the workers brought from Europe didn’t have - they didn’t drop over dead immediately from malaria. ( and btw - indentured servants cost less than half of chattel ones, that’s why the Northern colonies had half their initial population from that group - they didn’t die up there immediately)
England could afford to be “ virtuous” about slavery since they had excess labor that was way cheaper to employ. They only abolished it in the Caribbean colonies where - guess what? - disease created the demand. History is about economics you know ( as a good Marxist) - people are more motivated by greed and desire to make money than to be “ good”.
Haiti is a microcosm of the societies of its origin. Look at satellite pictures of the contrast between the Dominican Republic and Haiti ( same island) and then make excuses about “someone else did it”. - the ones right next door don’t seem to have those problems.
This article could be describing Somalia today, and Mexico and Venezuela tomorrow.
It sounds like affirmative action has been very successful in Haiti. That's because they killed all the white people back in 1804. They've been living in the idyllic future ever since.
Freder said:
"And while slavery was widely practiced, the concept of chattel slavery (where humans and even the children are the absolute property was definitely an invention of Western Culture)."
>>>>Arab slavers routinely castrated their male slaves to prevent the formation of families. Was that a "best practice"? Russian serfdom was essentially chattel slavery---do you consider Russia a "western" culture?
"And don't even point out that the Romans and Greeks practiced chattel slavery. They are supposed to be the cornerstones of western culture."
>>>>If you are saying ancient countries/empires practicing slavery can't also be held up"cornerstones of western culture", you'll have to offer examples of slave-free countries/empires that *were* "cornerstones of western culture."
>>>>Is all of Aristotle, Plato, Homer or Ovid worthless, since they or people around them owned slaves? Howzzat work?
>>>> Or is it like matter and anti-matter: the practice/tolerance of slavery within a country annihilates any claim to it a cultured nation. Like the USA, for example...
I thought once Haiti passed stringent anti-gun laws, the problem of gang and gun violence would disappear. Hmm. Maybe it is due to climate change. I mean look at the negative effects to the Dominican Republic. Oh…. Perhaps White Supremacy? Nope, not that either. How about all that investment by the Clinton Foundation?
Ok, I’ve exhausted all the ways I’m to blame, so I’ll go further than Dave Begley and do a Mike Pence: “Not my concern.”
“name a better former French colony, go for it.”
I’ve noticed that trend amongst former French colonies myself. Last time we went in to fix a former French colony, it lasted a decade, and things ended poorly,
Have a look at Haiti on Google Earth. You will note that the border with the DR is quite evident. The DR side of the border is green, verdant while the Haitian side appears a clear cut desert. The forest gone for cooking fuel. Think about that. Haiti is 85% black, the DR 16% black.
>>>>If you are saying ancient countries/empires practicing slavery can't also be held up "cornerstones of western culture", you'll have to offer examples of slave-free countries/empires that *were* "cornerstones of western culture."
For that matter, point to any countries or empires from back in the day that doesn't have slavery in their backgrounds. Abolition of slavery is the exception, not the rule among humanity.
Let's not forget Jimmy Carter's role in the very early stages of Bill Clinton's failed Haiti Peace Projects. Modest Jimmah' declared himself the leader of the universe of NGO-driven peace, first in Haiti, then Somalia and North Korea through his meddling Carter Center. The staff of The Nation magazine cheered -- because they presciently saw NGOs as the way to erode national borders, leaders, and policies and replace them with a worldwide network of unelected leftists, which would naturally lead to communist revolution, world peace, and mass prosperity.
Haiti was going to be their shining star.
And boy, just like all those other times, they were completely right! Even internicene slavery would be a step up from the violence and murder they suffer at the hands of their countrymen. Slaves were at least valued enough to keep alive, fed, and productive. And that's a terrible thing to say.
World Magazine has very fair reporting on Haiti. They listen to all sides.
Perhaps we should consider Colonel Kurt's suggestion.
"Drop the Bomb. Exterminate them all."
"beneficent dictator"
Best oxymoron ever!
"beneficent dictator"
Best oxymoron ever!
Not by the original meaning of dictator. By that meaning a dictator is exactly what Haiti needs.
I am forced to admire Dave Begley's honesty.
I have to admit, Dave, with the Biden crime family in the White House I have a difficult time ginning up concern for anybody but us.
White House-Coke House. Haha
It was with Haiti, starting in late 1992 early '93, that certain elements of our ruling class really recognized that due to the many-to-one dynamic, even desperately poor countries were worth looting. Even if there aren't any natural resources to extract, or real estate worth owning, and even if most of the people were barely getting by, a skim from the phone monopoly on international calls, or a "processing fee" on bank transfers from expats, or "advisory" investment stakes in the power company produced an income stream worth billions to the few connected people who wet their beaks (jack-o-lantern-grinning Joe Kennedy was one of them).
Then the Haitian earthquake showed certain elements that international aid organizations were the perfect cover for riskier kinds of looting: human trafficking (especially of children) and drug smuggling. All those iso-containers that carry the relief supplies do need to get shipped back, you know. And although containers are sometimes checked, it's the needle in the haystack problem to find the 3 in 10,000 that have people or drugs in them. But you can fit a LOT of people or drugs in a few iso-containers.
We've been fomenting "revolutions" and invading places for the past 20 years because the power-players found a model that worked for both notional "sides." A few "Republicans" got to sell arms (both to the U.S. military and to the victim nation that "needed" to rebuild its defenses) and provide demonstrations of the power of the military as both threat and sales pitch, and a few "Democrats" got to loot the institutions: both directly, and via the salaries of and the contracts paid to the "international aid" bureaucracy.
If you wonder why the U.S. border remains open despite there being statistically zero citizens who actually want a fully open border, notice that every illegal person, substance, and dollar looted from the entire "global south" is at this point more likely to be delivered securely to the office parks and warehouses of Jersey City, the port of L.A., and D.C. than a medium-sized package is to be delivered to a residential neighborhood in San Francisco.
That's a malicious mischaracterization of rhhardin's comment, and you ought to know that, but your moral compass always points at yourself, eh?
Really?! Maybe I am stupid and malicious. Can you explain how I mischaracterized what rhhardin wrote (and while you are explaining away his comment, remember that rhhardin thinks women should not be allowed to vote, but while you're at it, you can also explain away all of his misogynistic comments).
we have open borders. There's no reason why 5-10 million of the law-abiding, "Good" Hatians can't just come to the USA. This should solve the problem.
What ever happened to the neutron bomb?
Ah, chattel slavery, where the children of slaves are themselves slaves. What is unique about is that it can only be practiced where slaves are allowed to breed. Islamic countries castrated most of their male slaves. I don't think that was the custom elsewhere, nonetheless, slaves weren't allowed to breed. If a female slave bore a child, the child would be put to death. So which version of slavery is crueler? The one where all slave offspring are killed, or the one where slave offspring are themselves slaves?
Perhaps Freder has an answer to that since he brought it up. Oh, wait, he does have an answer- he unequivocally condemns it- it is much better to forbid slaves to have offspring and kill all those that are born.
Slavery predates written history- of that much we can be sure. And since slaves are ultimately less productive then free men working for themselves, we must conclude that slaves only exist where there is a surplus of food and labor to be done that free men don't want to do. Without food surplus- there is no slavery. Slaves would always be last in line to get fed.
And slavery practiced in the USA was wholly different in one way then in any other nation. There was a slave code, and slaveowners had to abide by it. One example- they couldn't free slaves who were old and invalid, no loner able to care for themselves. Nope, they were responsible fore their care. They couldn't starve them to death- slaves had to be fed. In Maine they even passed a law that slaveowners had to feed their slaves meat other then lobster... (Yes, lobster was once trash...) I don't know all the rules, but slaveowners had responsibilities that required them to care for their slaves. Responsibilities that didn't exist in South America or the Caribbean. Or among any of the native American tribes that practiced slavery. Well, that would be ALL the native American tribes.
Despite it being illegal, slavery still exists in India. And most of Asia. And open slave markets exist in North Africa. In sharialand...
The Christian West led the way in abolishing slavery. The Protestant part of the Christian West. Interesting though it was the Catholic Louis X who first abolished slavery in any European country, but not the French colonies. Like, for example, Haiti. And in 1807 Britain started anti-slave patrols declaring the slave trade illegal- for anyone. Didn't care what flag a slave trader was flying. Possible to do when you're the leading seapower.
The anti-slavery movement has a relatively short history. And if western culture falls, slavery will reestablish itself in the aftermath.
And while slavery was widely practiced, the concept of chattel slavery (where humans and even the children are the absolute property was definitely an invention of Western Culture).
We invented it eh? History begins anew every day and every time a progressive finds a new western sin to pin on their fellow 'mericans.
But...
If WE invented generationally bonded perpetual slavery then why the fuck did God take the Israelites out of Egypt? Wanderlust? Itchy feet? Wanted better food?
And WHAT were the Israelites doing there for 400 years if they were not chattel slaves? Building pyramids? Hosting ancient aliens?
I read that the US military took over Haiti during WW II, ostensibly to prevent the Germans from making inroads there. Older Haitians said it is the only time Haiti has had peace and prosperity.
"The anti-slavery movement has a relatively short history. And if western culture falls, slavery will reestablish itself in the aftermath."
so much this.
Tina,
"More than half of Americans donated to Haiti after the earthquake."
What?????
Contra Ironwood, there *is* no childhood immunity to malaria.
"And slavery practiced in the USA was wholly different in one way then in any other nation. There was a slave code, and slaveowners had to abide by it. One example- they couldn't free slaves who were old and invalid, no loner able to care for themselves. Nope, they were responsible fore their care. They couldn't starve them to death- slaves had to be fed. In Maine they even passed a law that slaveowners had to feed their slaves meat other then lobster... (Yes, lobster was once trash...) I don't know all the rules, but slaveowners had responsibilities that required them to care for their slaves. Responsibilities that didn't exist in South America or the Caribbean. Or among any of the native American tribes that practiced slavery. Well, that would be ALL the native American tribes."
North America was at the end of the pipeline for the trans Atlantic slave trade. The poor wretches won the lottery by winding up here. Because Brazil, Cuba and the Caribbean sugar plantations were death sentences. Compared to the rest of the slave owning new world the colonies were pikers. The colonies didn't buy that many. The ones they bought were expensive. Hence the rules on treatment.
The US has intervened in Haiti numerous times in the past, and well before any supposed Nazi threat.
The slave population in British North America and the early USA was unique in that its growth was due almost entirely to natural increase, and not the importation of new slaves (though that never stopped completely--the Brits joke that the main task of the American Africa "Anti-Slavery" Squadron was to interfere with the operations of the Royal Navy's West African "Anti-Slavery" Squadron).
There are some sites in Tennessee where slaves were put to open-face mining, and were expected to last seven years at it; other slaves were almost pets to humane owners.
The early modern slave trade and slavery lasted centuries and involved tens of millions of people; other than the core of unfairness, to generalize across all places and cultures is
impossible.
Kirk, I read that in a philanthropy trade magazine. I assume they get some of their metrics from workplace giving -- ie. count in the congregations, the Red Cross, UNICEF, United Way.
Actually,100% of taxpayers contributed billions. But thanks for pointing out a number I should have been more critical about.
Everyone loves the Vikings, but they were slave sellers to the world for as long as they existed. They settled in Ireland, but sold Irish (and all others they could catch) men and women to the Muslims.
The Vikings treated the Irish far worse than any Brit, So go hate the Swedes, Joe Biden.
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