"... over the weekend after the GOP hopeful slammed the depiction as 'shameful.'
The Quad-City Times executive editor Tom Martin wrote on the paper’s website Friday that the 'inexcusable' cartoon was intended to 'criticize racist ideas and epithets' but instead featured a phrase that 'is racist and insensitive to members of our Indian American community.'... [The cartoon] depicted a campaign rally... Ramaswamy was drawn, saying, 'Hello my MAGA friends!' Three angry White men in the crowd each responded to his appearance with a racial slur. One screamed, 'Muslim!' getting the candidate’s religion wrong. Ramaswamy is a self-professed Hindu. Another [yelled]... 'Get me a slushee, Apu!!!' and a third [yelled]... 'Show us your birth certificate!!'"
The NY Post reports.
Before the apology came out, Ramaswamy tweeted: "It’s sad that this is how the MSM views Republicans. I’ve met with grassroots conservatives across America & never *once* experienced the kind of bigotry that I regularly see from the Left. Iowa’s
@qctimes
absolutely has the right to print this, but it’s still shameful."
Let me connect this post to
the previous one, about the chant at the Drag March — "We’re here! We’re queer! We’re coming for your children!" Somebody thinks they're being very funny and they're cocooned with people who like the direction the satire is going.
Posts
99 comments:
Althouse theme of the day: The left rediscovers humor, nuance, and their own ability to be de facto conservatives and fully wrong.
Maybe Grandpa Joe won't mistake the nuclear football for a toaster oven and start WWIII over Ukraine after all.
>>"We’re here! We’re queer! We’re coming for your children!"
This is not satire. Who would think coming after children is humorous?
When people tell you they are evil, you should probably believe them.
Never apologize.
OMG Quad City is owned by Lee Enterprises, which owns most the Montana papers. So lame. Trying so hard to hang on, not look too deep, not offend anyone local, not lose advertisers. What a miserable end to the newspaper industry.
I'm sure they thought they were punching up.
Leftists are usually racist. The higher on the food chain, the more racist. Upper middle class white leftist think poors are racist because they are competing with the ethnic poors the left is importing. But the poors live amongst those imported poors. They intermarry with them. It is the “college educated” white leftists who are actually racist.
Tom Martin wrote on the paper’s website Friday that the 'inexcusable' cartoon was intended to 'criticize racist ideas and epithets'
Tom's lying. The cartoon was intended to smear Trump supporters as racists and white supremacists. He didn't apologize to the people the cartoon smeared for smearing them. He only apologized to any Indian Americans who might have been offended by how they went about smearing Trump supporters.
Conservatives dislike leftards of all races pretty equally. Buts it's clear that lefties hate non-white conservatives far more than the white ones.
I saw Vivek in Treynor and Sioux City, Iowa speak before packed houses. In Treynor, he got a standing ovation. I've probably seen 50 candidate appearances in Iowa and only one other standing ovation.
It is the “college educated” white leftists who are actually racist.
Yup. "Get me a slushee, Apu!!!" didn't come out of a Trump supporter's mind or mouth. It came out of the mind of a MAGAphobe.
'Get me a slushee, Apu!!!'
I'm certain Joe Biden actually said that once.
Turning and turning in the widening gyre.
Yeah, the centrifuge is spinning, pushing us ever further apart. Without a countervailing centripetal force, our slouch toward Bethlehem will be inevitable.
They got it backwards...it has been Democrats who have been saying RACIAL things about him, not Republican. But then, what else is new. Democrats always blame the right for WHAT THEY THEMSELVES ARE DOING!!
The pigs ARE coming for the children. At least now they admit it. They are groomers, and won't be happy until pedophilia is legal.
So was the cartoonist fired or even suspended?
The editor who approved it?
No?
Then screw their apology.
Burn the paper down, metaphorically of course. Boycott any business advertising in them
John lgb Henry
What Bob said:
"The cartoon was intended to smear Trump supporters as racists and white supremacists. He didn't apologize to the people the cartoon smeared for smearing them."
Progs like argument by smear. But the politics of vilification doesn't work so well when you have White Grandpa Joe running against a very diverse GOP field. Plus Vivek happens to be one of the smartest people ever to run for president, so progs need to proceed with some caution. I think Ron D should be the nominee, but I'd like nothing better than to see Vivek debate Joe. No way Dems can let that happen.
What Wendybar said: Usually, Democrats (and the Press, to be redundant) accuse Republicans of behavior that Democrats themselves are engaged in. See: Russian manipulation.
If there isn’t a bit of truth in it, a joke comes over poorly.
NBC has played this game a few times with NASCAR fans. They’ve sent investigative reporters to races on the premise that they were full of the characters depicted in theIowa commercial. But the premise was flawed, because the fans are more interested in racing than racism. The only people interested in racism were the reporter looking for it where it didn’t exist.
Trump will appoint Vivek to a very high ranking cabinet position.
Muslim is a racial slur?
First they came for MAGA, and I did nothing because I am not MAGA.
They wrote their slogan in the wrong tense. It should read, 'We are continuing to convert your children'.
The slogan is mocking the parents trying to protect their children. Not satire, that would have to come from a third party observer. The slogan is a declaration of intent. The 'it's satire' ruse is a cowardly tactic to deflect.
I was hoping that President Vivek Ramaswamy could meet with Indian Prime Minister Modi and negotiate in the patter’s native language. Alas, Ramaswamy speaks Tamil and Modi speaks Hindi.
As to the racism inherent in the Left, I’ve been seeing it for decades. Lefties have the ability to hate dark-skinned conservatives with a unique fervor rivaling the old-time bigots of the KKK, while simultaneously asserting that they aren’t the bigots — it’s them there filthy Republicans.
Non-apology apology ploy.
Bob Boyd: "It is the “college educated” white leftists who are actually racist.
Yup. "Get me a slushee, Apu!!!" didn't come out of a Trump supporter's mind or mouth. It came out of the mind of a MAGAphobe."
Indeed.
Dog whistles blown by leftists, intended for leftists and only "heard" by leftists....which naturally is the fault of conservatives...somehow.
We're here, we're sure, we are saving our children!
The Freaks think they're being wickedly funny by scaring the Squares with taunts about 'coming for the children'. The Squares are beginning to arouse themselves to the danger, though. What will the Freaks do, as the behaviors manifest and the numbers begin to assert themselves? Not so funny.
I saw a video clip of the people on Main Street, with large groups of children, stood watching, the Pride Parade, as an obese older man in tightie-whities and a rainbow scarf gyrated and twerked in front of them, leering and wiggling his eyebrows, pouched genitals dangling. The Face of Evil. The crowd and the children were mute. I think there is a rage there, building.
He did write a book called "Woke" .
One might think the cartoonist would
know this.
He did write a book called "Woke" .
One might have read it first.
He did write a book called "Woke" .
One might think the cartoonist would
know this.
“MAGAphobe”
Love it. I’m going to use that. Liberally.
"We’re here! We’re queer! We’re coming for your children!"
That quote spread virally all over the MAGAsphere yesterday. It's so far out there that my first thought was that it was a false flag operation- that a Trumpist had done it, so damaging is it to the queer cause.
But, no! No leftist has denounced it- they don't dare. They cannot. They are aborting a good proportion of their potential children, and sterilizing many of the survivors. They have to recruit the kids to survive as a movement.
Serious Question..
IF, a bunch of ultra conservatives Marched down the street past a gay bar, chanting
We're HERE! We're STRAIGHT!! We've Come to CASTRATE!
When they told the police; "Oh! it was OBVIOUSLY satire!!" What would our professor think?
How about, if a bunch of NASCAR mechanics hung an Actual noose by Bubba Wallace's car?
You know.. as "a joke".. Just "satire"
Would they go to prison?
"Leftists are usually racist."
"Usually"? You're being awfully generous there.
Horrible to think that MAGA would stoop so low as to question whether a non-white citizen running for president was in fact born in the US. To even suggest anyone affiliated with MAGA would say such a think is slander in the highest degree.
The left is, and always has been, full of humorless know-it-alls.
No, Meade. UltraMagaphobe.
That's the thing about the majority of us classic liberal/conservative folk. We really don't care what you're ethnicity is. Do not give a shit. So when you leftys comment about how racist the right is we look confused and go WTF are they talking about. I think it's because the left is consumed by race. Making them racist.
Groomer is a technique. Predator is the description.
"... over the weekend after the GOP hopeful slammed the depiction as 'shameful.' The Quad-City Times executive editor Tom Martin wrote on the paper’s website Friday that the 'inexcusable' cartoon was intended to 'criticize racist ideas and epithets' but instead featured a phrase that 'is racist and insensitive to members of our Indian American community.'
...
Before the apology came out, Ramaswamy tweeted: "It’s sad that this is how the MSM views Republicans. I’ve met with grassroots conservatives across America & never *once* experienced the kind of bigotry that I regularly see from the Left. Iowa’s @qctimes absolutely has the right to print this, but it’s still shameful."
So Ramaswamy calls them out for lying, and they "apologize" not for their lie, but for their "jokes" being "too real".
I'm wondering what happens when people start "joking" online about killing specific members of the press. “It’s all in good fun. If you’re taking it like that, then that’s a you problem. Not an us problem."
The left has dog whistles only they can hear.
Gunner wrote:
"Conservatives dislike leftards of all races pretty equally. Buts it's clear that lefties hate non-white conservatives far more than the white ones."
A very concise statement of a fundamental political truth.
Yeah Jim, Republicans were definitely asking Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton and Herman Cain for their birth certificates.Cuz they are racist, you see.
Thanks, Meade. I just coined that. It's likely I'm not the first, but whatever, it kinda has a ring to it. Hope it catches on.
jim5301 said...
Horrible to think that MAGA would stoop so low as to question whether a non-white citizen running for president was in fact born in the US. To even suggest anyone affiliated with MAGA would say such a think is slander in the highest degree.
I'm going to explain this so simply that even a moron like Jim can understand, if he chooses to do so:
1: You do not have a right to run for President of the US
2: There are requirements you must meet. If anyone challenges whether or not you meet the requirements, the burden of proof is on you that you meet them
3: refusing to meet the burden because you claim the demand hurts your feelings is, IMHO, absolute grounds for ruling that you didn't meet the requirements
4: There were legitimate grounds to question whether Obama's rich unmarried mother was in fact in Hawaii at teh time she gave birth. Since it would be trivial to prove that she was there if she was, the attempt to stonewall the question shows that the people of bad faith in this situation were entirely on the Obama side
If you call it "Racist" to demand that people prove they've met the legal requirements for something, then you are the scum
One screamed, 'Muslim!'
Funny. The current cultural and political divide is now between the kiddie transgender supporting left/liberals and Muslim parents who don't want there kids groomed. There have been fights outside school board meetings when ANTIFA shows up to counter the parents, and in the heavily populated Muslim areas of the Detroit Suburbs, school board meeting have again become ugly with lesbians making out in from of the school board and Muslim audience.
I'm currently reading Vivek's "Woke." Excellent book! Very well researched. The second chapter was about the Civil War and how the Lost Cause narrative took hold. The third chapter was on constitutional law and how equal protection law developed after the Slaughter House cases. I thought Ann would enjoy it.
Blogger jim5301 said...
Horrible to think that MAGA would stoop so low as to question whether a non-white citizen running for president was in fact born in the US. To even suggest anyone affiliated with MAGA would say such a think is slander in the highest degree.
jim 1234 is misinformed. The first people who questioned Obama's birth certificate were Clinton campaign operatives. The reason was his false claim in book promotion materials that he was a Kenyan exchange student.
The leftists are racial hypocrites in the way that some on the right are religious hypocrites....We're all endowed by our creator with reptilian brains that think unwelcome and impure thoughts....There are members of both parties who take note of the teen age girl in shorts or feel a bit distanced from the guy in the turban. The historical record shows that Dems have been more apt to act on these thoughts. And in terms of self righteousness no one can beat the Dems......I think a fair number of Republicans would have turned down an invite to the Isle of Orgy. Not so much the Dems though. I would, however, refrain from stereotyping the typical Dem as a depraved degenerate just because that the way God made so many of their leaders.
I was at a Saturday get-together where one nice white lady was going on about the wonders of diversity and her commitment to it. She lives in the whitest part of the whitest suburb in the area. So do her friends. None of them would dream of living in the "other side" of the city, where both minorities and working class MAGA types live.
Martin said...that [the QC Times] will no longer accept any work from the cartoon artist responsible.
Why punish the cartoonist? They liked this cartoon and presumably his other work before, now they're going to cancel the guy? Pathetic.
Why not just do your job as editor and take his cartoons on a case by case basis, Tom?
The Post article didn't mention how many Iowans cancelled their subscriptions to the QC Times, but this cowardly move leads me to believe it must have been quite a few.
jim 1234 is misinformed. The first people who questioned Obama's birth certificate were Clinton campaign operatives. The reason was his false claim in book promotion materials that he was a Kenyan exchange student.
True in all aspects, except that “lim” calls himself “jim5301.”
This is not satire. Who would think coming after children is humorous?
Most members of the MLA claim that satire is not necessarily humorous. But if it isn't funny, what is it? Historically, it was funny. The term comes from satyr, the mythical half-human half-goat creatures often associated with the orgiastic rites of Dionysus and Bacchus.
The great Athenian playwrights of the Classical Age wrote their dramas for a series of competitive stage performances that constituted part of a religious festival called the Great Dionysia. To qualify for the competition a playwright needed to submit a tetralogy -- three related tragedies and a satyr play, basically a raucous parody of the events or characters of the preceding tragedies performed by actors wearing horned masks and fleece-covered trousers, in character, the attendants of Dionysus making sport of the inconsequential concerns of mortals' fleeting, inconsequential lives. In other words, the satyrs put human things into the proper perspective of the immortal gods. Satyr plays were intended to be funny and deemed failures if not by the impaneled judges of Dionysia who awarded the prizes. Requiring a satyr play helped geniuses like Aeschylus and Euripides avoid taking themselves too seriously. The Greeks had some good ideas, I think. The wholly degenerate Oscar night could be elevated to something like respectability if the winners had to knock their own self-indulgent egos down a peg or two before being handed the eponymous statuette.
The modern idea of satire is not humility, far from it. Its intent is to denigrate the opposition by reducing the rival's arguments, beliefs, and values to the lowest level the audience will accept. It is complete intellectual dishonesty that is virtually indistinguishable from the crudest forms of propaganda. By today's standards, the nōn plūs ultra of satire would be Julius Streicher's Der Stürmer.
Reinforcing what Bob Boyd said: “The cartoon was intended to smear Trump supporters as racists and white supremacists. He didn't apologize to the people the cartoon smeared for smearing them.”
In the cartoon, Vivek was a stand-in, a prop, for the smears that the Left throws at its opponents. In Left/Liberal minds, the right is the eternal racist aggressor. Recently “clean, articulate” Obama denigrated Tim Scott’s experience as a black man in the South. Of course, Obama is the son of a white mother, a Kenyan father, went to the best private schools, and has no experience living in the segregated South. Scott is the real Black man and preaches togetherness, not division.
The alternative universe Liberals inhabit is so far removed from reality that I wonder how, when, and in what manner they were transported.
intended to 'criticize racist ideas and epithets' but instead featured a phrase that 'is racist and insensitive to members of our Indian American community.'...
Oh, for f...
That is not what Ramaswamy said. Oh yes, certainly, the racial slur the cartoonist used is offensive. But the point was that only the cartoonist used it, not "MAGA Republicans."
I love the smell of racial healing in the morning...
“…..it's clear that lefties hate non-white conservatives far more than the white ones.”
Because they feel threatened by them.
"Serious Question..
IF, a bunch of ultra conservatives Marched down the street past a gay bar, chanting
We're HERE! We're STRAIGHT!! We've Come to CASTRATE!"
Castrate? Seriously? Seems someone has not been paying sufficient attention.
How about this chant? We're HERE! We're STRAIGHT! We've come to DEFENESTRATE!
Sounds crudely violent, but it's not, really. Even in the famous Defenestration of Prague, the haughty burgers just fell harmlessly into a stinking dungheap. (Which might delight the coprophiliacs among the alphabet perversion brigade.)
Serious Question..
IF, a bunch of ultra conservatives Marched down the street past a gay bar, chanting
We're HERE! We're STRAIGHT!! We've Come to CASTRATE!
When they told the police; "Oh! it was OBVIOUSLY satire!!" What would our professor think?
Ok, gilbar, you don't get me very often, but that made me LOL.
"his false claim in book promotion materials that he was a Kenyan exchange student."
Why couldn't it be true? I mean- I'm told you can choose to be whatever gender you like, why can't you choose where you were born, too?
jim5301: "Horrible to think that MAGA would stoop so low as to question whether a non-white citizen running for president was in fact born in the US. To even suggest anyone affiliated with MAGA would say such a think is slander in the highest degree."
Michael k: "jim 1234 is misinformed. The first people who questioned Obama's birth certificate were Clinton campaign operatives. The reason was his false claim in book promotion materials that he was a Kenyan exchange student."
Similar to 1988 when it was the Algore campaign that raised the Willie Horton/Massachusetts Weekend Furlough program to attack Michael Dukakis in the primary, after which the Bush campaign ran with it in the general.
To this day the jim5301 types swear Algore did no such thing and it was just that darn racist HWBush!
He should show up from now until after the election at every campaign stop or interview with a slushee in hand.
King Greg - who appointed you to set the rules? My rule would be that a mere accusation w/o credible evidence doesn’t obligate the accused to do a damn thing. It does suggest the accuser is a racist however
Michael K - assuming what you say is true, your argument is that because Clinton is a racist everyone else has permission to be a racist?
WAIT, the problem with the cartoon is that it included words that are offensive to Indian Americans??? Not that it depicts Republicans/conservatives/Trump supporters/white people as typically bigoted haters?
What really happened is that they deeply insulted Vivek by ignoring and discounting his actual objection to the cartoon. I guess the opinions of brown people really don't count.
Quaestor said...
Seems someone has not been paying sufficient attention.
How about this chant? We're HERE! We're STRAIGHT! We've come to DEFENESTRATE!
Thank You Quaestor! i was stuck on a rhyme, and took the easy way out.
Defenstrate is So Much better
a) Castrate is what the Woke are doing to gays and lesbians, thru Gender Affirmation; not conservatives
b) Defenstrate is (IS!) what ultra conservative (muslims) ARE doing to gays
c) it scans better, because the 'castrate' really sb castrate YOU
d) gilbar gets paid by the letter, so defenestrate is $0.04 MORE per post! (rolling In Dough!)
jim5301 said...
"Michael K - assuming what you say is true, your argument is that because Clinton is a racist everyone else has permission to be a racist?"
I don't know. You guys are the racist ones. You lot are always using race a a metric of leftist purity. I don't think you guys need permission. You just are. Racist. That is.
Davenport, IA. Aren't they the one's that killed Carry Grant?
When it comes to the far left, being racist is usually OK if you're bashing conservatives. "I'm not being racist. I'm just saying the racist things that I believe that the other side is thinking." I believe that this is called, projection.
Jim5301, did you read Michael K’s full comment? The part where it was Obama’s promotional material that created the confusion. Is it racist to ask Obama to clarify the confusion he created about his birth, since it is a requirement to be President.
I realize people like you think the US is inherently racist, so you may think the constitutional requirement is racist. Still, Obama created the confusion, and then bots like you keep trying to spin it as other people’s problem. The fact that many people here have corrected you with clear explanation should clue you in to how ineffectual your arguments are. Kudos though for at least trying to debate. That puts you ahead of Dr. Hotez, and that’s not nothing.
jim5301 said...
Michael K - assuming what you say is true, your argument is that because Clinton is a racist everyone else has permission to be a racist?
So, Jimbo, you're saying that you're such an ignoramus that you don't know that it is true?
But despite your total ignorance, we should still take your word for the claim that the only reason why someone could say that is because of "racism"?
Is this your way of saying "I'm a scum sucking racist pig, so therefore so is everyone else!"?
jim5301 said...
King Greg - who appointed you to set the rules?
Reality did.
When there are characteristics you have to meet in order to be able to do something, the burden of proof is on you that you meet them.
A bar doesn't have to prove you're under 21 not to let you in, YOU have to prove you're over 21, if they bother to ask.
If you want to run for President of the US, I don't have to prove that you are NOT a "natural born citizen of the US", you have to prove that you are.
And if you dont' provide that proof, then it's entirely valid for me to attack you about that.
Reality check, You DO understand that it's the US Constititon that requires that, not just me? Or are you even more pathetically ignorant than I think you are?
You can not say anything to falsely vilify a conservative that liberals have not done and continue to do. Liberals are despicable, vile and evil. Liberals lie about everything, and blame their opponents for being liars for pointing out how liberals lie. All the phony cruel neutrality in the world can not cover that up.
And then there is this...An EX congresscritter is admitting that feds are infiltrating and stirring up trouble. NOW he is trying to take it back and claim that others are putting words in his own mouth.
Glenn Greenwald
@ggreenwald
·
Credit where it's due:
Yesterday, CNN's @AdamKinzinger broke a major story:
Masked people claiming to be with the crypto-fascist Patriot Front were attacked and unmasked in Boston by Proud Boys protesters.
Kinzinger reported the Patriot Front Nazis were federal officers.
Adam Kinzinger
@AdamKinzinger
These people (all blue checks) are celebrating a seemingly MAGA assault on federal officers. Now i don’t know what this really is, but take a gander at the comments of the “patriots” who “love” America 👇👇
8:57 AM · Jun 26, 2023
https://twitter.com/AdamKinzinger/status/1673044858972393474?s=20
I live in a metropolis of nearly four million people. I visit friends in both rural Wisconsin and Minnesota. And both Dakotas too! And yet, I have NEVER seen anyone in a MAGA hat. Not once! How is that possible?
I think MAGAs are a figment of the fevered Progressive mind. Think, Juicy Smolette. Or Putin and the Ukrainian Nazis.
Putin and Progressives need enemies in order to survive, even if they have to conjure them out of thin air.
"That quote spread virally all over the MAGAsphere yesterday. "
Where exactly is that? The MAGAsphere. Do they have a clubhouse or do they just rent a church basement somewhere?
"They have to recruit the kids to survive as a movement."
Exactly.
That goes back to a proverb I referenced last week (and again, I am not remotely religious). "Train a child in the way he should go and he will not depart from it."
The reason the State wants to start "training" children in State funded daycare centers as soon as they are born is to raise them up to be in lockstep with the State. Too risky allowing the parents to do it.
"Everything within the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state."
Okay, I'm a fan of Vivek. But he's the smartest guy I've ever met. And one of the richest. Also, very nice.
I'm voting for him in the May '24 NE primary.
"Somebody thinks they're being very funny and they're cocooned with people who like the direction the satire is going."
Is it at all surprising that both incidents come from people who are probably not anywhere near the political right wing?
"...Another [yelled]... 'Get me a slushee, Apu!!!'..."
Apu sells Squishees, not Slushees, at his Kwik-E-Mart. If you're gonna channel The Simpsons, at least get the reference right.
Blogger jim5301 said...
Michael K - assuming what you say is true, your argument is that because Clinton is a racist everyone else has permission to be a racist?
Idiot, nobody is a racist who questions the qualifications of some one to run for president. The birth certificate thing began with OBAMA ! His book promotion materials suggested he was from Kenya. The Clinton campaign picked up on it. The Obama campaign chose to play the race card instead of producing the birth certificate.
Reading would be good for you. You might seem less stupid.
Greg the class traitor said...
"I'm wondering what happens when people start "joking" online about killing specific members of the press. “It’s all in good fun. If you’re taking it like that, then that’s a you problem. Not an us problem.""
Jane Fonda would applaud if it were intended for media types who aren't on board with the Narrative.
This is not satire. Who would think coming after children is humorous?
Is advocating taking Irish babies and fattening up so they can be eaten by upper class English people "not satire"? Who would think eating fattened up Irish babies is humorous?
You are a fucking moron.
Horrible to think that MAGA would stoop so low as to question whether a non-white citizen running for president was in fact born in the US.
The Clinton campaign was MAGA? News to me. Good to know.
jim5301 said...
"Michael K - assuming what you say is true, your argument is that because Clinton is a racist everyone else has permission to be a racist?"
Not a racist statement by Clinton or Trump. As it's been stated, the basis was Barack Omama's own claim that he was a Kenyan exchange student. Do try to keep up.
jim 1234 is misinformed. The first people who questioned Obama's birth certificate were Clinton campaign operatives. The reason was his false claim in book promotion materials that he was a Kenyan exchange student.
Actually, as usual, Michael K is full of shit
I've long thought and have commented here and elsewhere over the years that part of the kerfuffle about Obama not being born in the us was a smokescreen around another candidate. A candidate who definitely was not born in the us. John McCain.
He was definitely a citizen at birth. But not being "born in the United States" (14A) he was a naturalized citizen by statute rather than a constitutional citizen like donald trump or Gavin Newsome.
If (and I don't think he was) Obama had been born in Kenya he would have been a citizen at birth because of his mother* just like McCain or Ted Cruz.
So the real question we need to ask is whether a statutory citizen at birth is a "natural born citizen" the way a constitutional citizen, born in one of the United States would be.
I think not. As a long time constitutional law professor Ann and I once discussed this in comments. She disagrees and thinks they are the same.
I've been looking at it since I had a discussion about it in the 80s with my legislator cousin. I even ran for president in 88 to try to get an answer from the FEC.
I still disagree with Ann but it has never come up in a lawsuit and a lot of knowledgeable people on both sides of the question going back to enactment of 14A.
*there may have been some technical reason having to do with the citizenship law at the time of Obama's birth why he didn't have citizenship at birth if born in Kenya. I remember some discussion but don't remember details.
John LGB Henry
How is Michael full of shit, freder?
Hilary & Co didn't raise the issue first?
He was not billed as a Kenyan exchange student in some bio from his college days?
I remember both. Am I wrong?
John LGB Henry
Freder,
Ever hear of Oliver Cromwell? He waged a serious war of extermination against the "Irish vermin" (his phrase, not mine).
I don't think he ever advocated eating them. Perhaps because he really did think them vermin. But it would have been the next logical step.
John LGB Henry
I see Brewmeister Freder is back spreading his good cheer. Maybe you should short your MolsonCoors stock.
The very first paragraph of Field Marshall Freder's link...and most of you will recognize the familiar clinton gang methodology:
"As PolitiFact and Fact-check.org both explain, there is absolutely no evidence that Clinton or her campaign were the source of the idea, though it did spread among some of her supporters during the 2008 primary contest between Clinton and Obama—which would only make sense, in terms of the timing of someone questioning whether someone were qualified for the presidency."
LOL!
Oh no, Hillary and her campaign had NOTHING to do with spreading the idea of obambi's status.
Heavens no!
It was just some of Hillary's supporters! And it was justified for them!
Just like Hillary had nothing to do with the russian collusion hoax, or the hoax dossier, or hiring FusionGPS, etc etc etc.
Good old, straight shootin', just calling balls and strikes here, "objective" fact checkin'dynamos at...(checks notes)...Time Magazine!!!!!
Too funny.
As usual, Freder is more full of shit. The rumor was spread on-line during the 2008 Democratic nomination fight. Now, I don't think this was ever proven to come from the Clinton Campaign, but I think you would have to be a cretin (true in Freder's case) to not consider it highly likely that the rumor was started by Clinton's campaign staff- it was definitely started by her supporters that year.
Gregory. Not sure your head is on straight this Monday afternoon. If you think that mister X doesn’t meet the qualifications to be president then you file a lawsuit so alleging. And the burden is on you to prove your allegations. That’s how it works in these United States bro.
Actually, as usual, Michael K is full of shit
Another Freder comment that has basis in fact. This seems to be a common problem with you. Why not try reading to learn something? Or are you illiterate and dictating these words of wisdom?
You are a fucking moron.
Just in case you (or anyone else appalled by this satire) are an actual fucking moron
Sorry Freder, that was NO basis in fact.
If you think that mister X doesn’t meet the qualifications to be president then you file a lawsuit so alleging. And the burden is on you to prove your allegations. That’s how it works in these United States bro.
So, if, for instance, you're a Democrat and you support the candidate running against Mitch Romney, and you say he didn't pay his taxes, which - though maybe not a constitutional breach - would certainly move the needle among the electorate, you should "file a lawsuit so alleging" (IANAL, but I imagine there would be a question of standing here such that no one could actually "file a lawsuit," so I think the Democrats did exactly what they "should" do in making this allegation very very publicly), and you bear the burden of proof. Right?
Hmm.
Apu was actually pretty funny.
This country has been going downhill ever since we had to stop telling Polock jokes in polite company.
Oh great, the vaunted modest proposal had made its appearance.
Ok, so, to be clear, we can equate eating Irish babies with trans activists' "coming for your children"? Besides Cromwell in his secret heart, was anyone else advocating actually killing Irish babies? (Certainly many were advocating discouraging Irish adults from producing them. But let's stick with the text.)
OTOH, is there anyone in the US today who is actively encouraging kids to run away from home, cross state lines, and seek "sanctuary" (which is a strange way of spelling "easy-access trafficking," but I've been out of school for a long time now) on account of their inchoate feelings of not being the sex their entire bodies down to the individual cells shout that they are? Why, yes! California is. For instance.
And what might make these kids feel so troubled about a lack of coherence, however recent, between their bodies and their as-yet-untested sexual urges? Could it have anything to do with their having been told from very early childhood by their teachers that they should expect to feel such things, and that their feelings define reality?
"Why, yes! California is. For instance."
'Hey, what are we? Chopped liver?' - Washington state.
John Henry,
The way we are heading "metaphorically of course" will be taken to be civility bullshit. Doing it non-metaphorically will have a much bigger impact.
Quastor,
These days we have much taller buildings - - tall enough that we really don't even need helicopters.
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