Tara Reade just said the default crisis was a distraction manufactured to divert attention from the money being spent on supporting Ukraine, which she called a “money laundering operation.” Yes, she is actively helping Russian disinformation efforts. https://t.co/WoITayYxvy
— David Corn (@DavidCornDC) May 30, 2023
May 31, 2023
Is Tara Reade part of Russian disinformation?
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No. James Comey, Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama, Joe Biden and the rest of the left are, but they are blaming others like Progressives ALWAYS do.
Tara Reade is trying to save her own life, staying out of the Political Prisoner Gulag as long as she can. I don't blame her. Fairness in this country is gone.
Stop listening to their propaganda and listen only to our propaganda…
I love their "falsely"s.
I think "Russian disinformation" is now a thoroughly discredited term, which might have been the true goal all along? As in "the greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist."
I wonder if Edward Snowden is annoyed. The quality of defectors to Russia has certainly gone downhill.
Well let’s break it down.
1. The debt ceiling issue is “manufactured”?
2. The debt ceiling issue is nothing more than a “distraction “?
3. The purpose of the distraction is to “divert attention” from U.S. involvement in Ukraine?
4. The nature of the U.S.-Ukraine distraction is “money laundering”?
I wanted to see the video for myself. The entire press conference is in Russian with live translation. It’s on YouTube. It appears to stretch for more than nine hours and twent-four minutes. The usual state-run media; Maria Butina; and basically unlimited conspiracy rambling from Tara Reade. From what I could see, it’s hard to pick out the worst of it.
To answer Althouse’s question directly; “Is Tara Reade part of Russian disinformation?” The answer is, “Yes, that is exactly, precisely what she is. And not any ordinary Russian disinformation. She is part of a “targeted, coordinated, 2024 election-interference and anti-Biden propaganda” subset of Russian disinformation.
I had never realized it, that Tara Reade was George Santos before Santos was George Santos. Lying about college attendance and degrees; past employment; going after the true crazy elements such that her own lawyer dropped her. E. Jean Carroll she ain’t.
Judge for yourself from the video, however much you can stand:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sXgazjmT0-c
ISN'T the Ukraine, Just a money laundering scam? Isn't IT?
The Soviets/Russians have a long tradition of using naïve westerners. Lenin's term for them was a "useful idiot".
If true, this gets even more insane.
But I'm not sure it means he didn't rape her.
Russia is the new Covid.
Does David Corn have any evidence showing Zelenskyy is not laundering and repurposing the money we have sent to Ukraine? He also leaves out the context of an ABC news producer who “went missing” last year after saying he’d found evidence of corruption in Biden’s administration and the former partner of Hunter who disappeared from Turkey after our State Department had him released from custody in Israel. Tara made a point of saying she was not suicidal and that the Biden family had threatened her life. But sure Russian hoaxer Corn who assisted the FBI in spreading disinformation about Trump is a “journalist.”
She's not wrong. A whole lot of politicians are financing their summer homes through the war in Ukraine.
Just when you think the simulation is finally up & running fairly smoothly, at least acceptably free of twitches and glitches....
Calling Ukraine a money laundering operation is like calling D-Day a beach excursion, it's true, but it's a tiny part of it. Ukraine is about wresting control of the Black Sea from Russia, containing it forever, and hopefully causing the Russian Federation to splinter, so that we can move in and divvy up her $72T in resources, which will be split between smaller and more pliable powers, divvy these riches up among Joe Biden's friends, maybe create some trillionaires, and putting China in such a weak position that it will be forced to accede to any demands we make.
Once we have eliminated all possible strategic rivals, places like Africa and South America will be forced to eat the shit sandwiches we are handing out. If they want to build a cement factory? Sorry, we won't allow you to finance it, too much CO2, you will keep your oil in the ground and like it, etc, etc... You know, the way we treat Canada, which is totally whipped.
This is, at bottom, a climate war, which is why the US is willing to risk it going nuclear. That's Soros's motivation. We have ideologues in contro who are still cold warriorsl. Is it disinformation to reveal the true motives of the United States, as opposed to parroting US propaganda? Money laundering is a tiny part of it, but when you have a president as cravenly corrupt as Joe Biden, who took a no-show teaching job at Penn that paid him a million dollars from the guy he appointed Secretary of State, you have to wonder whether, in Joe Biden's mind, and given the stuff we know from the laptop, money laundering doesn't loom pretty large in our POTUS's list of reasons for welcoming a war with Russia rather than negotiating a lasting peace.
@Althouse, answering your question. F*** no.
Keep in mind that back when Tara Reade’s encounter with Joe Biden is alleged to have happened was also the era of Ted Kennedy and Chris Dodd making a waitress sandwich in an upscale Washington restaurant and Bill Clinton was receiving special oral services from Monika Lewinsky. It was the era when feminists demonstrated their adherence to proper feminist principles by letting senior Democrat politicians get away with sexual assaults.
david corn has laundered so many lies from danchenko from deep state players in europe, who says her claims were false, the 300 million from the wife of the mayor of moscow to hunter, the 750 k from Gazprom to dem players including the big guy, to shut down the us and canadian pipelines,
I wonder to what degree our collective consciousness is shaped by the stories we tell. Now it’s Succession, Game of thrones, house of cards, breaking bad. The stories we tellrevolve around anti heroes behaving badly and suffering no consequences. There’s no john Wayne, Jimmy stewart or Gregory peck sacrificing themselves for the greater good. No Greer Garson or Myrna Loy to show that steely, ladylike grit that inspires her husband to be a better man.
We are listening to nothing but our lower angels, and it shows.
of course, MEANWHILE...
China keeps building coal fired powerplants
China keeps building fighter planes
China keeps building bombers
China keeps building ICBMs
China keeps building, building, building
i for one, Welcome our chinese overlords.. They're not half as fucked up as the americans were
Is David Corn trustworthy? Well, no.
i for one, Welcome our chinese overlords.. They're not half as fucked up as the americans were
As fucked up as the US is, and it's pretty fucked up now, it's a hell of a lot worse in China or Russia.
Money laundered with blood to be exact and as always!!
Considering The Nation and David Corn are Soviet style leftist liar enterprises - it's hard to tell what the truth is.
I trust Maddow- /The Nation as far as I can throw them.
containing it forever
Tim WTF kind of plan is going to contain Russia? For “ever”? Do you have any historical examples of such a successful “forever” containment? This is the kind of stupid crowdsourced propaganda that has resulted in huge untraceable transfers to a military that has an accountability problem even worse than our own military complex which cannot account for MOST of the money and assets our country has entrusted them with. Having pie in the sky objectives is how we end up in decades long quagmires. Biden has resisted the exact aid necessary for Tim’s plan to work, slow-walking every step of the way since before the invasion when he cancelled the weapons Trump agreed to send. Don’t forget Biden also gave public permission for Russia to do a “little incursion” at the same time our idiot Chiefs of Staff declared that Kiev would fall over a weekend and the war would be over AND he offered to fly Zelenskyy to a safe haven to wait out the destruction of Ukraine.
Why does it take a fucking YEAR to ship misslies? The Air Force doesn’t have to wait for UPS. Allegedly they can be ANYWHERE on earth in 24 hours except the Ukraine where it takes 9 months minimum to get a C5 Galaxy halfway to China.
Amexpat: "The Soviets/Russians have a long tradition of using naïve westerners. Lenin's term for them was a "useful idiot"."
Alternatively, Reade might have looked around and noticed what has happened/is happening with anyone else who is in possession of information detrimental to the Biden's and made a strategic decision to move elsewhere outside the range of a Garland's Archipelago.
There may very well be some naivete being displayed here, but I wonder if its all on the Tara Reade side...........
Let me clarify that Tim’s conclusion and mine are the same. His set up was excellent but at first I missed the mocking tone as he recited the lame excuses the current regime is making. So weird to see so many arguing in FAVOR of forever war again so soon after the Afghan debacle but here we are.
Nice take Tim in Vermont.
Was it his daughter, granddaughter, or niece who filed a similar complaint about Joe in Spring, Joe without borers, Joe in transition, Joe of the House of Liberal and Groping hands?
Perhaps, and so were the multiple prosecutions of Trump by Social Liberal Club, the two impeachments by Congress of Democrat deflections, New York in diverse attempts, and the defamation lawsuit for having the audacity of denying unrequited rape... rape-rape h/t Whoopi.
Mike saide "Does David Corn have any evidence showing Zelenskyy is not laundering and repurposing the money we have sent to Ukraine?"
Maybe should stop relying on Marjorie Green Taylor for your version of the truth. The U.S. is doing a great deal of oversight on the resources it is providing to Ukraine.
See eg., https://oig.usaid.gov/sites/default/files/2023-01/Joint%20Strategic%20Oversight%20Plan%20for%20Ukraine%20Response_0.pdf
Would that not be considered "any evidence"? What is your evidence that all of this oversight is a sham?
Tim said "Ukraine is about wresting control of the Black Sea from Russia, containing it forever, and hopefully causing the Russian Federation to splinter ..."
Maybe you should take your head out of your ass for a moment, or should I say Putin's ass, and look at a map. Russia has over 200 miles of Black Sea coastline excluding what it is trying to steal from Ukraine. What is your evidence that Ukraine is trying to take that from Russia?
But I know the comment section on this blog is a "fact-free zone."
More evidence that the hard left is out to destroy the US. David Corn is an excellent example. Has he ever been right about anything ?
This week, my colleague, DC Bureau Chief David Corn, released his new book, American Psychosis: A Historical Investigation of How the Republican Party Went Crazy. And early reviews are coming in.
“I have been dying to read [American Psychosis] since I heard it was coming out,” MSNBC host Rachel Maddow raved during Monday night’s broadcast. “What David Corn is writing about—in his irreducible, ineffable David Corn way—is this cautionary tale for what’s happened today. And also a reminder that we’ve dealt with some of these dynamics before.”
yes, all the normals are crazy and the crazies are sane. Black is white; up is down. The usual lefty stuff.
The disinformation is coming from left-wing Americans, mostly.
Think about how Ukraine looms large in Biden/Democrat corruption. Burisma enriching the Biden's. Biden paying off Ukraine to protect Burisma. Democrats impeaching Trump for asking Ukraine to investigate Biden paying off Ukraine to protect Burisma.
Biden paying billions to Ukraine's war effort for more illicit purposes is not beyond the pale.
Nobody in the US public knows what is going on in Ukraine, and David Corn is unlikely to help solve that.
Blogger narciso said...
david corn has laundered so many lies from danchenko from deep state players in europe,
David Corn, who brought us the Joe Wilson story that Comey was partly the hero of. I really would love to know sometime what is going on.
Oh. So not Tara Reid.
Spelling matters.
‘“As far as like going to another safe haven, I mean, there are many Americans here, and I don’t want to out a bunch of Americans, but there are people here that are coming to Russia,” Ms. Reade said.
She added that “luckily, the Kremlin is accommodating.”
“So we’re lucky,” she said.“
NYT
Already spreading Russian disinformation? Putin wants Americans to think there are many Americans who have gone/are going to Russia to seek a new life of freedom of speech, prosperity in Russia? Or maybe these Americans are seeking traditional Russian life in high rise apartments or a quaint ramshackle dacha in the countryside. A large community of Americans…hahaha, okie dokie.
Oh my, this is interesting…
Tara Reade’s Possible Russian Connections Outlined
“Over the course of the past couple of years, Tara Reade has gone from praising Joe Biden for his honesty, to last year alleging that he sexually harassed her, to now claiming that she was sexually assaulted by the former senator and vice president.
While every woman’s claims should always and absolutely be heard, as with any allegation, all of the evidence should be evaluated as well. In Reade’s case, there is plenty of evidence that casts doubt upon her claims — claims which seem to evolve with the weeks. Some people believe her accusations without even considering the alternatives, while others believe that there is something more sinister driving her. There are plenty of theories out there, many of which are just pure speculation or even border on conspiracy theory. One theory that has arisen is that Russia could somehow be orchestrating at least part of what has been going on. While we certainly aren’t making this claim, the links between Reade and Russia appear to be plentiful. This article will focus on them.”
Falsely accused? Misinformation, disinformation, or a handmade tale?
#MeToo was not viable because it hit on liberal touchstones. Something similar happened with a diverse gang rape of a trans/homosexual female. Also, the serial trans/homosexual male rape... rape-rapist across the southwest.
Next, former JournoLists defecting after being hunted by Democrat congresspeople... persons.
the 750 k from Gazprom to dem players including the big guy, to shut down the us and canadian pipelines,
Shutting down pipelines, increasing rail traffic... to East Palestine.
I see Russia Russia Russia is back.
Russia May Build a Village for American Conservatives
Maybe Putin needs more dumb Americans to populate his new village for asylum seeks from the US.
Alternatively, Reade might have looked around and noticed what has happened/is happening with anyone else who is in possession of information detrimental to the Biden's and made a strategic decision to move elsewhere outside the range of a Garland's Archipelago.
I don't like Biden, but suggesting that Biden liquidates people that are detrimental to his interests is just as absurd as all the nonsense the left blames Trump for.
jim5301: "See eg., https://oig.usaid.gov/sites/default/files/2023-01/Joint%20Strategic%20Oversight%20Plan%20for%20Ukraine%20Response_0.pdf
Would that not be considered "any evidence"? What is your evidence that all of this oversight is a sham?"
LOL
Did you even read this "report"? Talk about bureaucratic gobbleygook BS from start to finish.
And if you read it closely enough, you laugh till you have to cry.
Here's a sample of jim5301's solid "proof" of auditable findings from his a link:
"The DoD OIG published a report in October 2022 that evaluated the extent to which the DoD developed plans to provide and account for security assistance to the Ukrainian government authorized by the FY 2022 National Defense Authorization Act. The evaluation determined that the DoD was unable to provide end-use monitoring in accordance with DoD policy because of the limited U.S. presence in Ukraine. The report identified the challenges that DoD personnel responsible for conducting end-use monitoring and enhanced end-use monitoring face when there are limited or no U.S. personnel present.
The DoD OIG identified the requirements for conducting end-use monitoring and enhanced end-use monitoring and outlined the actions the DoD is taking to account for the U.S. equipment provided to Ukraine when there are limited or no U.S. personnel present.19 In July and September 2022, the DoD OIG published management advisories focusing on the DoD’s use of funding provided through the Ukraine Supplemental Appropriations Acts, 2022. The DoD OIG determined that the DoD Comptroller had implemented and continued to improve procedures for DoD components to follow in reporting the execution of $26.6 billion in funds appropriated to the DoD to provide assistance to Ukraine.20 However, as the DoD is building processes and procedures to ensure the transparency of the reporting for the Ukraine supplemental funds, the DoD OIG identified areas of concern that, if not adequately addressed, could cause the DoD to inaccurately report the budget execution status of Ukraine supplemental funds."
Oh, so the principles of transparency needed in place to ensure the ability to audit aren't in place yet but not to worry! They will be soon! Swearsies!
It gets better...or worse:
"As of January 6, 2023, the DoD OIG has 13, State OIG has 10, and GAO has 1 planned or ongoing oversight projects related to security assistance and coordination within this SOA. State is overseeing unprecedented levels of security assistance in Ukraine, presenting significant risk of misuse and diversion given the volume and speed of assistance and the wartime operating environment. In response, State OIG is conducting a review that will summarize applicable end-use monitoring requirements, current procedures, and operating challenges, and cover programs overseen or implemented by the Bureaus of PoliticalMilitary Affairs, International Narcotics and Law Enforcement Affairs, and International Security and Nonproliferation (ISN). In addition, this review will identify areas of potential risk and mitigation steps that bureaus and the State Department could take."
Hooray!!
Soon we will have a "review" that will tell us all about the areas of greatest risk and concern and then, THEN, we can implement the policies/processes necessary to make sure we aren't getting ripped off left and right!!
Double Hooray!!
What's that you say? What about all the stuff provided thus far? Oh, well, uh, hmmmmm, whoopsie?
Russia Collusion Truther and Hillary/FBI Hoax Dossier Dead Ender Inga: 'Already spreading Russian disinformation?"
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
Tell us more about hookers peeing on beds, "secret servers" pinging in the night, Putin crashing the Northeast US electric grids, Michael Cohen meeting his "handler" in Prague, secret russki payoffs to Trump, "proven mostly true" hoax dossiers, how Gen Flynn is a treasonous traitor (Inga's exact words), etc.
Go ahead!
We'd all love to hear it.
Spoiler: for those reading this, it will seem almost impossible to believe but its completely true: Inga STILL believes in every single russia collusion farce/hoax/lie/rumor/debunked idiocy that has been peddled for over 7 years.
She has never taken back a single one of those lies. To this very day.
Will she do so today?
What do you think?
Jimnumbers said proof? and provided a broken link that returned this result from the office of inspector general: "Sorry, This Page Cannot Be Found"
So let me me answer a firm no that's not good enough and summarize my thoughts on Zelenskyy so you won't continue to embarrass yourself citing regime propaganda to show everything's on the up on up. I don't trust the slimy sonofabitches because:
a) Z's Ukrainian, a traditionally corrupt country that continually produces a huge crop of corrupt politicians including all the ones linked directly to the Biden family grift, of which Mr. Z is NOT unentangled by the way.
b) His "plan" as articulated is to drive Russia from all formerly Ukrainian territory including the regions seized by Putin while Bush and Obama were in office. This is a plan so ambitious as to be unworkable yet he expects the USA to finance it.
c) Thus the Z Plan necessarily includes gobs of money in ever-larger chunks but comes with no metrics to measure success by.
d) Even if the Z Plan was realistic, which it is not, it would require a full-tilt effort by the USA to achieve it, yet our CiC has, as detailed many times, prolonged this little war by every means possible including denying defensive systems when they could have made the most difference.
e) Every prediction made by Milley or the Joint Chiefs has been wrong spectacularly from the very first "Russia won't dare go in" to the laughable "sanctions will work this time" to the truly subhuman-level idiocy of "it'll be over in three days."
So even if I trusted Mr. Z I don't trust the people WE have in charge over here for their ability to tell the truth, supply the weapons or predict what Putin will do. What we have is nuclear brinksmanship being engaged in by doddering old fools with nothing to lose and no firm grip on the war being waged. Joe's team can't even accurately report the DOL jobs data and you think I should trust the OIG giving a thumbs up to Ukrainian Accounting standards?
Dream on Jimbodude. Fuck you. Fuck Putin. Fuck general Milleyktoast. Fuck Zelensky and fuck Joe. I don't trust ANY OF THE MOTHERFUCKERS. It's not my fight. I don't want to finance through the system in place.
Maybee: "David Corn, who brought us the Joe Wilson story that Comey was partly the hero of. I really would love to know sometime what is going on."
Corn was an insider and he knew it was all a lie from the very start, as did the GOPe-ers that worked hand in glove with the dems to sideline Trump with the collusion hoax.
But Corn is paid to keep the Inga's of the world spun up and he is well paid to do just that.
Already spreading Russian disinformation?
Yes you are doing that. Why did she SAY she went there, Inga? What was the precipitating event that led to such a drastic move?
Where are former ABC producer David Meek and doctor Gal Luft? How are their disappearances tied to Tara Reade? Is the news of her "defection" also the FIRST instance of NPR and the Guardian and the NYT saying what she accused Joe of doing? Why is her interview on NBC embargoed? Is David Corn investigating?
I always think of David Corn the day after I eat corn.
"It's Corn! A big lump with knobs."
Reporting that Joe Biden raped you is a good way to get invited to move to Russia.
Note that one of the anti-Trump Lincoln Project founders was actually registered as a foreign agent lobbying for Russian interests in Washington.
Russia ain't picky.
Neither are we. Neither is anyone. And yes, it was a big cackle around the feminists in the 90's that they'd let Clinton rape them so long as he protected abortion rights.
Politics is a rabid raccoon eating your soul. I was going to say possum, but they don't get rabies, do they?
jim1234 is confident that anything David Corn says is the whole truth, nothing but the truth and the real skinny.
Maybe that explains more about jim1234 than Tara Reade.
This will not serve Russia's demographic problem.
Wasn't David Corn one of the main people who initially pushed the Steele Dossier? Maybe he should take a back seat when discussing misinformation. That said, it is odd that Reade defected to Russia.
No serious human takes David Cornhole seriously on any topic other than the opinions of David Cornhole.
Then they stop paying him any attention at all.
Remember when Hillary labeled Tulsi Gabbard as a Russian agent? Pepperidge Farms remembers!
Already spreading Russian disinformation? Putin wants Americans to think there are many Americans who have gone/are going to Russia to seek a new life of freedom of speech, prosperity in Russia?
Or simply looking to avoid being killed by the shadow US Government. Seth Rich, Vince Foster, Jerry Parks, Kathleen Willey's husband and Jeffery Epstein were unavailable for comment.
Since when are we at war with Russia?
Is there any record of Corn criticizing any American for supporting Saddam Hussein or the Taliban?
"False accusation"? But Kamala assured us it was true.
Jim5301 yea because the federal government, the democrat party and the democrat media have been paragon of truth tellers for 6 years.
If you are actually going to trot out federal propaganda as “proof” don’t be surprised if those “conspiracy theorists” who have been CORRECT for 6 years think you are a very useful idiot indeed.
Gettin' out of the reach of Boldfinger.
Believe all women.
She’s actually seeking Russian citizenship but your commenters have their own weird agenda to push, and that requires a narrative where Americans actually go to seek a better life in the Russian hellhole for reasons that aren’t purely ideological.
Not very capable critical thinkers. How cute!
So are the conservative vice signalers actually trying to vouch for Tara Reade’s mental stability/sanity and reliability as a source of accurate information or sensible narratives?
That would not surprise me. These people have horrible judgment.
Maybe they can be a character witness for her. Just don’t call her your girlfriend, cons. Or maybe she’ll accuse you of having done so anyway.
I don't like Biden, but suggesting that Biden liquidates people that are detrimental to his interests is just as absurd as all the nonsense the left blames Trump for.
No, Garland is in charge of making people disappear. There are hundreds who have not been seen since the Stasi rounded them up and accused them of "trespassing" on Jan 6.
Readering at 1:37 made me LOL
No one needs to prove that Zelensky is not corrupt. His critics need to prove that he is personally corrupt, instead of just asserting it loudly and repeatedly, and they haven't even tried to do that.
Of course, Ukraine, like all post-Soviet countries, was extraordinarily corrupt in 1991. However, while Russia and Belarus have gotten even more so, the rest have all been struggling, with various degrees of success, to rein in their inherited corruption. One of the main reasons Ukraine elected Zelensky in 2019 was his promise to fight corruption. It's a two-steps-forward-one-step-back process, but he has been doing exactly that. Examples:
1. Hunter Biden quit his fake Burisma job and left Ukraine forever the same month Zelensky entered office. He obviously assumed Z. was not going to continue Poroshenko's gross corruption. Too many talk about "Ukraine" being corrupt as if Zelensky were responsible for Poroshenko's actions, when he ran as an outsider (like Trump) specifically to get Poroshenko and the rest of the corrupt old guard out of power.
2. Less than two weeks ago the "chairman" of the Ukrainian Supreme Court (I think that's equivalent to Chief Justice) and an associate were arrested and indicted for taking $2,700,000 in bribes. Nothing to do with U.S. aid: it was from a Ukrainian oligarch buying favorable S.C. rulings. The chairman had to resign and is (I think) in jail awaiting trial. I've seen a picture on Twitter of his coffee table covered with stacks of Benjamins. I think it's fair to assume that federal prosecutors would need Zelensky's approval to arrest this big a bigwig.
3. A month or two ago the mayor of Odesa was indicted and had to put up a $300,000+ bail money for the kind of corruption that is also rampant in the U.S.: buying a private property for government use and paying way over market value in return for a kickback from the owner.
There are plenty of other examples if you can be bothered to go look for them.
People who think Zelensky is planning to lose the war and flee with billions of U.S. dollars are idiots. Where would he go? Putin has assassinated Russian citizens in England, gleefully rubbing the world's face in it by using Plutonium and Novichok (~nerve gas, though it may be a liquid) when commoner poisons would have done the job. Nowhere in the world would be safe as long as Putin or anyone like him is in power. He has to stay, and win.
Ukraine also needs all the weapons and ammunition they can get to defend themselves, and can't afford to sell any. Despite what some here have claimed, there is no evidence that they have sold even one tank or missile or aircraft or artillery piece on the black market. The only corruption I've heard of is that some of the (foreign) leaders of the International Legion have been accused of stealing foreign contributions and selling small arms, but even the latter I think was to Ukrainian civilians.
The comments on Twitter to that Tweet will make you weep for the Republic
Hey doofus weevil I don’t need to prove squat. The people who want to keep shoveling $billions to Ukraine need to prove our tax dollars are being spent as advertised. I like most critics of this war am unwilling to accept empty promises from this prevaricating cabal running DC. They OWE US an accounting. We don’t owe Ukraine squat. We have no responsibility to “prove” anything using the publicly available information. Maybe if we had heard some truth about Ukraine from the beginning they wouldn’t have such a trust deficit BUT WE DON’T LIVE IN THAT COUNTRY.
Mike (MJB Wolf) (8:43am):
Do you really not know that rudeness only detracts from the plausibility of your 'argument'?
We "don't owe Ukraine squat"? Bill Clinton helped convince them to give away their nuclear weapons in return for signed promises that their borders would be inviolate. We are in fact morally and probably legally obligated by his promise.
Also by common decency: it used to be a principle that when a brutal tyrant rolls his tanks across a border to occupy a foreign country and enslave its citizens, free countries should help them repel the invaders if they could. We did that with our own (and allied) troops in Korea in 1950 and Kuwait in 1990, and sent vast amounts of arms and ammunition and food and money to Britain and the USSR when Hitler was doing that and we were still officially neutral.
In this case, the Ukrainians aren't asking for troops, just arms and ammunition to defend themselves with. What we've sent them is mostly obsolete equipment from long-term storage that would have cost more to dispose of than it cost to send to them, so the actual cost to us has been far less than the advertised value of our aid. And the actual cost has been a minuscule percentage of the budget: we would be just as screwed by debt if we hadn't sent it.
And the fact remains that the military has people in the Ukraine keeping an eye on what we've delivered (jim5301, 9:53am yesterday). The fact that they include boilerplate admitting that it is impossible (Drago, 12:42pm yesterday) to follow every single item all the way the front line (or the target, for missiles) does not take away from the fact that they have found no fraud or corruption. Do you think we should have uniformed American soldiers in every trench at the front lines?
Again, the Ukrainians are fighting for their lives and freedom and need every weapon they can get. Selling some of them would be stupid as well as crooked, and they're not stupid - unlike some commentators here.
Let me help with your problem interpreting my plain and offensive speech, which you would realize is a response to your offensive BS bolded below if you read what I wrote more carefully:
There are plenty of other examples if you can be bothered to go look for them. you wrote last night. As I said earlier the people actually shoveling the $$ out the door need to start being truthful, and Joe is not doing that. I don't need to HUNT for the data: simply provide a truthful accounting of what has been spent better than the typical DOD "well we can account for almost half" bullshit.
We "don't owe Ukraine squat"? Bill Clinton helped convince them... Really? Bill broke all his promises to me and America but now I am responsible for following through on his promise when Bush and Obama let it slide? Guess again dude. This is the worst appeal to authority in this discussion. Where were you when the Orange Revolution happened?
...free countries should help them repel the invaders... First see my anser above, and second yes this is what we have been saying about the useless EU for three years now. People closest to the fight should do the most. When did we become best pals with Ukraine? We can't even secure OUR border.
In this case, the Ukrainians aren't asking for troops, just arms and ammunition to defend themselves with. What we've sent them is mostly obsolete equipment from long-term storage that would have cost more to dispose of than it cost to send to them, so the actual cost to us has been far less than the advertised value of our aid Pure bullshit from top to bottom. (1) Mr. Z wants to retake ALL territory lost over the last 20 years, not simply "defend" against the invasion. (2) We have depleted our stock of missiles that WE may need for self defense since Joe is doing nothing to slow Xi's march to war AND the "old" stock is not obsolete as Ukrainian troops are proving but is needed because that's what OUR guys in reserves train on. (3) The real cost is when we sub in F22s for the F16s we are sending over and WHY has it taken Joe two fucking years to send them!
And the fact remains that the military has people in the Ukraine keeping an eye on what we've delivered (jim5301, 9:53am yesterday). Nice 2nd and 3rd worst appeals to authority in one lame post. So we have "observers" like we did in Viet Nam eh? How'd that work out again?
Do you think we should have uniformed American soldiers in every trench at the front lines? Answer your own stupid fucking question using the material I've provided. You can read can't you? Who exactly do YOU think wants our troops on the ground?
While you're digging for answers maybe you can find out who blew up the stupid Russian pipeline. I'm sure your sources will be almost as entertaining as the dreck you wrote already.
And finally: ...and they're not stupid - unlike some commentators here Do you really not know that rudeness only detracts from the plausibility of your 'argument'?
So when you're done arguing with yourself maybe you can address my very real concerns about this poorly managed and executed war. Maybe.
Dr Weevil: "Again, the Ukrainians are fighting for their lives and freedom and need every weapon they can get. Selling some of them would be stupid as well as crooked, and they're not stupid - unlike some commentators here."
Your faith in the integrity of the ukrainian leadership is adorable.
This government and its supporters on this policy of forever wars everywhere there is injustice in the world, except our own borders and security naturally, OWE us a clear, transparent, traceable, auditable accounting of every penny sent to Ukraine.
This government admits it cannot even begin to do that and is only now even paying lip service to putting in place "processes" to "begin" to identify the "risks" involved in this massive and rapid transfer of money and resources in terms of accountability.
Full. Stop.
No more of anything until we know precisely what is happening with all that we've already sent.
Dr Weevil: "Mike (MJB Wolf) (8:43am):
Do you really not know that rudeness only detracts from the plausibility of your 'argument'?"
Someone assesses Mike (MJB Wolf) to be rude.
Thus, no accounting for all the money and weapons sent to Ukraine is necessary and the discussion is now off the table.
And God help us all if Mike (MJB Wolf) is also responsible for Mean Tweets.
Whatever the rights and wrongs in Ukraine (and the other conflicts around the world), it remains a fact that the quickest way for a government--ANY government--to increase the scope and reach of its powers is to become involved in a war.
Special military operation. Peacekeeping.
Kuwait? Sheesh. One of the least free countries (or 'countries') in the world then and now.
Narr (1:12pm) thinks Kuwait being "[o]ne of the least free countries [no sneer quotes needed] in the world" made it OK for Saddam to invade them. Really? As I recall, thousands of young male Kuwaiti civilians are still missing, and their loved ones will never know how or where they died, or where any remains might be found.
Does he know that Poland in 1939 was a military dictatorship under a Col. Beck? If so, does he think the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact and double invasion of Poland were just fine, and the U.K. and France were fools to try to fulfill their treaty obligations by declaring war?
South Korea was a military dictatorship before the Korean War and for decades afterwards, but saving it from North Korea has turned out very well for the South Koreans in the long run.
And Ukraine is infinitely freer and less corrupt than Russia, even leaving aside the rapes, tortures, murders, mutilations, and kidnappings the Russians are gleefully inflicting on the occupied areas.
Why do Drago (12:42pm), Mike (MJBWolf) (12:56pm), and Dude1394 (6:00pm) accuse jim5301 of saying he had "proof" that the U.S. is auditing expenditures in Ukraine? He wrote "evidence", and the word "proof" is nowhere to be found in his comment, yet two of the three put it in quotation marks, the third in boldface. That is deeply dishonest.
Why does Mike (MJB Wolf) sneer at jim5301 as "Jimnumbers"? Is there something offensive about using numbers to distinguish yourself from other commenters named Jim? That's a lot less confusing than having a 'Chuck' and a 'chuck' commenting on the same site. Is he embarrassed now to have an ally calling himself Dude1394? Will he call him 'Dudenumbers'?
My point about his insulting me was not to demand that he stop doing so. Insults like his are very useful. In 20+ years on-line, I have never had anyone demote me to 'Weevil' or small-w 'weevil' or 'Mr Weevil' or 'weev' who did not go on to argue dishonestly, or stupidly, or both. I was just advising him that he'd be more convincing if he didn't do that. By the way, the subject of silly pseudonyms was hashed out 15+ years ago, and everyone paying attention realized that many serious thinkers have silly handles, and many idiots and clowns have serious ones. (Three of the most interesting commenters at Ace of Spades call themselves 'Charlie Brown's Dildo, 'Masturbatin' Pete', and 'bear with assymetrical balls'.)
And why does he assume that my comment that the Ukrainians are "not stupid - unlike some commentators here" referred to him? We all know that there are two very frequent commentators that are not worth arguing with, and most of us don't bother to reply to them any more. Then again, if the shoe fits, wear it. If you can't help thinking my reference to stupid commentators applies to you, maybe it does.
Why have none of the three who replied to my comment so much as acknowledged that I offered actual evidence (three examples and one hypothetical) that Zelensky is in fact trying to clean up the corruption of Ukraine?
Finally, why does Drago insist that I think that "no accounting for all the money and weapons sent to Ukraine is necessary"? That is a bald-faced lie. Accounting is in fact being done, which is a good thing (duh!), but anyone who insists that it be absolutely perfect and literally track every single penny is not serious.
Yes, I know ALL that history, and more. I don't think we had an alliance with Kuwait, BTW.
How it relates to dealing with Saddam Hitler is another matter. (No, I don't think the B&F were fools given the totality of THEIR circumstances, but plenty of people here do think so. Maybe they'll chime in.)
And just how IS the Greater Middle East in general doing, after so much of America's healing and cleansing firepower?
Countries, and 'countries' will pursue their own interests (or those of their elites). The only question is whether the pursuit catches--garners--more than it costs. I think it has been conclusively demonstrated that our selfless interventions on behalf of Muslims have not paid off.
Maybe things will work out better among the eastern Europeans, but I wouldn't bet on it happening in our lifetimes.
'pudding,
Maybe Reade felt only a country sufficiently distrustful of US guvmint w/Joementia at head would protect her.
But you tell me given the Russian oligarch who dumped money into the fiery dumpster aka Hunter.
Dear Chuck!,
In terms of Rinos the Bulshitwark praise, the debt ceiling "debate" was a distraction.
Bulshitwark all in on such responsible governing/gaping.
To be fair, they only praise Tripping Joementia.
Dr. Weevil has questions! Many!!!
Dr Weevil: "Accounting is in fact being done, which is a good thing (duh!), but anyone who insists that it be absolutely perfect and literally track every single penny is not serious."
The US govt has already admitted that it cannot give an accounting of how much of the resources given reached their intended destination and jim(numbers) own link demonstrated that.
All your questions have the same answer: Biden and his handlers are pushing for a direct confrontation with Russia and or China. I oppose that disastrous tactic because I don’t trust these people in charge. Period. All your feelings don’t matter. Your trust in Pentagon “accounting” is naive at best and catastrophic on our present trajectory. The way to avoid world war is to stop these regional conflicts before they spill over.
Sad that someone who calls himself Dr online wishes to risk the peace and stability of the entire earth trusting these idiots.
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