Dr. Narita, 37, said that his statements had been “taken out of context,” and that he was mainly addressing a growing effort to push the most senior people out of leadership positions in business and politics — to make room for younger generations....Appearing frequently on Japanese online shows in T-shirts, hoodies or casual jackets, and wearing signature eyeglasses with one round and one square lens, Dr. Narita leans into his Ivy League pedigree as he fosters a nerdy shock jock impression. He is among a few Japanese provocateurs who have found an eager audience by gleefully breaching social taboos. His Twitter bio: “The things you’re told you’re not allowed to say are usually true.”...
At a panel hosted by Globis, a Japanese graduate business school, Dr. Narita told the audience that “if this can become a Japanese society where people like you all commit seppuku one after another, it wouldn’t be just a social security policy but it would be the best ‘Cool Japan’ policy.” Cool Japan is a government program promoting the country’s cultural products....
We discussed the "Cool Japan" policy on this blog 9 years ago, here. At the time, I said, "Isn't government the antithesis of coolness? Getting government on anything makes in uncool."'
I think Narita is using humor to open up a discussion about serious policy changes, and I won't venture to guess how notions of suicide play out in Japanese culture. But here in America, you're expect to be vigilant about saying or doing anything that risks generating suicidal ideation in anyone. It's emphatically not a topic for humor.
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39 comments:
yes! Absolutely!! but START WITH YOU SELF!
Report to Carousel, ASAP.
So japanese emmanuel
Oh, so it's "duty to die" again is it?
Easy to feel that way about others. My older brother once said people should check out at 80 but he's 82 now and hasn't mentioned it.
Look at the Crowd! Good Carousel tonight!
He is certainly in sync with the World Economic Forum.
and I won't venture to guess how notions of suicide play out in Japanese culture.
You've never heard of samurai, Bushido and seppuku? He was clearly appealing to their sense of duty and honor and telling them that the honorable thing to do is to commit seppuku. It actually makes sense from a traditional Japanese perspective. Leaking lifeboat ethics.
If the country insists on shutting itself down to save the elderly, I can understand his point.
He loses me after that.
Canada beat them to it. Minnesota will be next, and Wisconsin right after that.
Sepukku
The proper method for committing the act—developed over several centuries—was to plunge a short sword into the left side of the abdomen, draw the blade laterally across to the right, and then turn it upward. It was considered exemplary form to stab again below the sternum and press downward across the first cut and then to pierce one’s throat. Being an extremely painful and slow means of suicide,... [yadda, Yada, yadda]
If you are trying to sell suicide, telling people to commit seppuku a/k/a Hari-Kari, does not seem designed to convince.
A lot of people might think "yeah, maybe it is time for me to check out. But you want me to do WHAT? Hmmm, maybe it's not quite the right time."
John Henry
"You've never heard of samurai, Bushido and seppuku?"
Read the post. Anything IN the post I have obviously heard of.
But I don't presume to understand Japanese culture. I have respect and deference and humility. Ever heard of that?
But I don't presume to understand Japanese culture. I have respect and deference and humility. Ever heard of that?
How do you respect something you claim not to understand? How is failing to understand something deferential? What does humility have to do with it?
Wouldn't the truly respectable choice be to at least an attempt to understand their culture rather than refuse to? I've spent years teaching American students about Japanese culture and its differences from ours. It's not that hard.
I thought Covid was meant to wipe out the elderly? the sick elderly, anyhow. Just a joke.
Seriously, the reproductive choices of each generation create a demographic regime for that generation. For example, the World War II generation had a "baby boom" so their demographic regime was: "somewhat poor when young, well-supported when old even singles." C'est moi. But the Boomer generation had few children so their demographic regime is: " most well-off when young and most quite poor as they get older, singles die." You see, while poor and old and helpless to change their demographic regime, there can be unexpected policy changes - calls for euthanasia or seppuku. In short, young people should understand the meaning of their reproductive choices in terms of the sort of demographic regime they will belong to when they are old. At present, young people are encouraged to think only of what will happen right now if they have no children. "More money, easy life"; But the hidden reality is: "and then later, little money, hard life, maybe euthanasia/seppuku for singles".
So, dear young people of 2023, you can still chose - have some kids! now!!!!
Reading List
The World We Have Lost. Peter Laslett
Personally, I find the "inscrutable Asian" thing to be much more offensive than a sincere attempt to understand traditional Japanese culture.
Canada’s on its way down the slope, making medical killing easier to qualify for with every revision to the law. There are basically no protections right now and, while they will talk about it from a humanitarian perspective, I work in healthcare and the savings to the healthcare system from simply killing the sick is not lost on them.
This trading of life for money has spread to other areas. For instance, the financial analysis of genetic testing of pregnant women turns on estimates of the money saved through aborting the children of women who test positive.
"it wouldn’t be just a social security policy"
Which it soon will be in the West. Current entitlements are unsustainable; thinning out the old crowd would be a big help. Of course, progs are already there. Ezekiel Emanuel "hoped" to die at 75.
"it would be the best ‘Cool Japan’ policy.”
Indeed. Nothing is more cool to progs than enforced individual sacrifice for the benefit of the collectivity. Started with the Cool France policy of 1789ff.
"But here in America, you're expect to be vigilant about saying or doing anything that risks generating suicidal ideation in anyone."
Well, I guess you could still run some legal risks. But prog policy already promotes suicidal ideation in would-be trans kids, easy availability of fentanyl, and growing support for euthanasia--"assisted" suicide.
Big Mike said....2/12/23, 9:59 AM
Carol said...2/12/23, 9:15 AM
Yup, Big Mike, I immediately harkened back to the same Dick Lamm statement from 1984. It doomed him for any future he might otherwise have had in politics. It was pretty much universally condemned. And yet, as Carol notes, here we are, only some 40 years later, seriously considering termination of humans deemed (by ....?) not useful to society.
O tempora! O mores!
(and how astonishing is it, that words spoken roughly 20 centuries ago remain so relevant today?)
It's difficult for Westerners to fully comprehend the degree of cultural and personal behavioral control the elders in Japan continue to have over the younger generations. In my personal observations there, the resulting suppression of personal expressiveness and initiative in young people, and particularly the women, appears to be developing into a "reproductive seppuku." If continued, it's a population death spiral.
There's definitely pent up hostility there. And this is a kidding/not kidding release of that hostility.
Why is The Last Samurai such a beloved movie in Japan?
Because it demonstrates that a Westerner can understand, appreciate, and depict traditional Japanese culture.
I am not sure why I should respect or understand or have deference for a culture which is so backward as to believe that the solution to anything is to kill off their elders.
It might be appropriate to learn about their culture to see where things went wrong. And there are undoubtedly many things about Japanese culture that are good (they do make very good cars).
My first thought was that this is some sort of Swiftian Modest Proposal. But apparently not.
planned parent/hood
Funny because it's true--and it's only the serious things we need comedy to deal with.
The Japanese (can one say that?) have many admirable qualities, but Japanese culture mostly leaves me cold; my son was taking Japanese in high school 2000-2003 (part of the enriched curriculum) but that was when Japan Inc. was still a thing, even though the reality had never been so threatening.
As far as mass demographics, we're at the same stage and a similar dynamic as with climate: IF changes are underway, whether man-caused or through natural cycles, it's too late to do much if anything about it.
Difference between encouraging old people to kill themselves vs the government killing them.
It's emphatically not a topic for humor
Imma skip whatever Louis CK said but Burge's Law: Every New Yorker cartoon can be improved by recaptioning "I think I'm going to kill myself it just fucking funny…
evolutionary seppuku: planned parenthood, friends with "benefits", casting couches, volcelism, feminism/maculinism, social progressivism, transgender conversion therapy, etc.
Difference between encouraging old people to kill themselves vs the government killing them.
One-child or one-child delegated via selective-child with State-established religious/moral/ethical/legal normalization in sanctuary states.
Blogger John henry said...
Sepukku
The proper method for committing the act—developed over several centuries—was to plunge a short sword into the left side of the abdomen, draw the blade laterally across to the right, and then turn it upward. It was considered exemplary form to stab again below the sternum and press downward across the first cut and then to pierce one’s throat. Being an extremely painful and slow means of suicide,.
I think that most of the senior generals who committed seppuku had an aide who was ready to administer a bullet in the head once the ceremonial part was done.
I read what he said to be, it's time for the old folk to think seriously about stepping aside and letting the younger folk have more say in how the world that they will be spending more of the future in than the oldsters will be structured.
And he said it in the context of Japanese culture and history.
Nothing horrific in that.
Thoughts of an old Tokyo Gaigin -
Seppuku is a "method" of ending oneself by taking personal responibility in narscasistic (Hey, look at me!)way. Although part of Japanese culture, it is sort of reserved for the elite or those who fancy themselves elite.
Garden variety suicide is a simple expression of "shame" (for your actions and the discredit they have brought on your family, neighbors or colleagues). The most tragic of these involve young mothers who take young children with them when stepping off the building's edge (so they won't have to carry the mothwer's shame through life). As a big believer in "comebacks", I hate the idea of suicide in most cases. Shame, on the other hand, is what makes Japan Japan. EVERYONE knows the rules and EVERYONE plays by the same rules (diversity be damned).
IMO, any Japanese citizen with a non-STEM college degree from an Ivy should not be allowed back in the country. FWIW, There was a time (maybe still) when fast-rising stars in Japanese industry were sent to the US to work at the top of Japanese enterprises here. Many of them left yheir families in Japan because they were terrified of exposing their children to K-12 "education/indocrination" in the US.
Japan and other Asian cultures are among few in the world that don't regard old people as garbage - something to be put on the curb and swept away ASAP. In our country, we have laws forbidding discrimination based on age but unlike protections for race, gender (and emerging genders), sexual orientation, physical disabilities and histories that are re-invented daily; it is Open Season 24/7 on those of us "of a certain age".
Well - F*** that. I am 80 and I anm not getting out of anyone's way. I go to bed at 0400 and get up at 0800. I eat about 9 at night, not 4 in the afternoon. So many interesting things to do. My mind remains active, agile and CURIOUS. I own and operate a small business in a heavily regulated industry. I am frequently called on by community groups to organize and promote activities of all kinds. I'm an active day-trader of stock options. I'm asked to do eulogies and make memorial videos of the dearly departed for people I hardly know (because the widow or brother thought I said just the right things at an earlier one). I travel for months at a time, often solo. My real face-to-face friend roster (not that "Facebook" nonsense) includes people from 18 - 95. Life is GOOD on the green side of the grass and I'm gonna' enjoy every minute as long as I can - for now, I doubt I'd have to wait long for a ride if I was standing on a corner in Winslow, Arizona :-)
I don't know if the "things you're told not to say are usually true" is an accurate description of Japanese culture, but it is definitely an accurate description of the culture at Yale.
I don't know if the "things you're told not to say are usually true" is an accurate description of Japanese culture, but it is definitely an accurate description of the culture at Yale.
"Difference between encouraging old people to kill themselves vs the government killing them."
And when encouraging fails, the coercion begins.
Japan has a cultural mythology of leaving old women on mountainsides to die during hard times. Sons would carry their mothers up mountains and leave her their to die from exposure, animal attack, thirst or starvation. Long history and many folk stories regarding this. Historical revisionists like to claim these were just myths but it was accepted as true well into the 20th century and there are recorded incidents of people being convicted for doing it after WWII and the Americans changing Japanese law.
Dr. Narita, 37, said that his statements had been “taken out of context,”
Right. He didn't mean to have them quoted.
Well now, Whitmer and Cuomo were ahead of the curve on this. They certainly did their part.
I've watched several versions of Madame Butterfly in the last year (given Met Opera on Demand). Wanting to hurt her faithless husband is natural and forgivable, but to stain her son's adoption/abduction in such a way is a horrible thing to do to him. Even if he never learns the full truth, his new parents will be affected adversely. Her own father's forced suicide must have warped her own life, so she repeats it with her son.
My dad's hospital stay a month ago spurred me to get things to make his life better and safer. It's appalling how poorly most designed so much stuff is for old people. I finally found a microwavable granite block in a plastic frame for $16 to keep his food warm longer, but there was nothing else but those large electric plates for a buffet and small ones for coffee mugs. No insulated or thermal-mass plates that I could find. The box it came in looks 40 years old. They cut off the original price tag.
This weekend, I've been searching for a new recliner with a high seat and high, sturdy arms he can put weight on getting in and out (he has a painful hip). Nothing comes close, even in plain armchairs. A lifting chair is the only thing available, and it won't cut it for him. It may not work for his existing chair, but I'm going to screw vertical 2x4s to the flat 2x10s I put under it to raise the seat.
Next they'll be promoting Soylent Green tempura.
We are long past taking anyone's word for what they really mean. We have spent the last couple of decades repeatedly being told that X will never happen and we are being paranoid to not only X happening but also X+1 and X+2 and we are bigots if we disagree with any of these, but X+3 won't happen, oh wait, X+3 just happened and you are a bigot for noticing, but don't worry about X+4. We just experienced the Biden administration serious considering banning gas stoves, then claiming that there is no attempt to do so and we are being paranoid, followed by multiple left-wing governments banning gas stoves, followed by "journalists" claiming that literally no one is banning gas stoves and we are being paranoid.
If they say it, they mean it and they mean it literally. Act accordingly.
'Always the evangelist, never the volunteer.'
A more or less accurate quote of someone's tweet about this fellow and his sort.
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