His show, "The Many Loves of Dobie Gillis," was on TV from 1959, when I was 8, to 1963, when I was 12.
From the NYT obituary:
For all its well-scrubbed chastity, the series marked a quietly subversive departure from the standard television fare of the day. It was among the first to place the topical subject of teenagerhood front and center by recounting the story from a teenager’s point of view. It broke the fourth wall weekly, opening with a monologue in which Mr. Hickman, seated in front of a replica of Rodin’s “Thinker,” gave viewers a guided tour of his gently angst-ridden soul.
Many well-known actors received early exposure on the series, notably Bob Denver as Dobie’s best friend, Maynard G. Krebs, a scruffy junior beatnik who yelps “Work!” at the merest suggestion that he seek gainful employment.... Tuesday Weld was seen regularly as the beautiful, avaricious Thalia Menninger, the financially unattainable object of Dobie’s affections; Warren Beatty had a recurring role early in the run as a blue-blood classmate.
Dobie’s cantankerous, tightfisted father and sweet, harebrained mother were played by the characters actors Frank Faylen and Florida Friebus. His deeply intellectual classmate Zelda, aflame with unrequited love for Dobie, was portrayed by Sheila James. (Under her full name, Sheila James Kuehl, she became, in 1994, the first openly gay person to be elected to the California state legislature.)
They forgot to mention Chatsworth Osborne Jr., the ridiculously snobby rich kid.
And why did they call Zelda "deeply intellectual"?! Seems to me Zelda was sexually harassing Dobie, failing to accept that no means no, insisting that he'd end up with her because their names on the alphabetized class roster were right next to each other — Gillis and Gilroy. Thalia was at least as smart — and much more rational.
I really don't think anyone on that show was intellectual, and certainly not "deeply intellectual." Deeply! Where does the NYT get that? From the fact that the actress turned out to be gay? Here's the Wikipedia article on Zelda:
Zelda especially irritated Dobie by wrinkling her nose at him. He always wrinkled back; he claimed it was a reflex action (often admonishing her "Now cut that out!"), while she took it as proof that he loved her but didn't realize it yet. Zelda assured Dobie that he would eventually come to realize his love for her through the influence of "propinquity": because he was Gillis and she was Gilroy, they were always going to be seated together through high school and college and would eventually fall in love.Here's a full episode — complete with opening theme, musing by "The Thinker," and plenty of Thalia:
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A great show. A couple of memories/observations:
Herbert T. Gillis, Dobie's father, frequently brought up his war service, referring to it as "The Big One, W W Two".
Rush used to refer to Tucker Carlson as "Chatsworth Osborne Junior".
Actress Doris Packer, Chatsworth's mother, played the same role she played on almost every show in which she appeared, a rich, emotionally distant, dignified woman. The one exception was her role on Leave It to Beaver, where she played a somewhat sympathetic school principal, Mrs. Rayburn.
Another Dobie fan here, sorry to see him go.
Serious question:I believe Dobie was his real name in the show, not a nickname. Right?
What kind of name is Dobie? In all my years I've never heard the name before or since.
John LGBTQBNY Henry
up front... was that Gilligan?
Wilbur forgot Mrs Osborne's taglines. "Nasty", often meaning obstreperous or unconventional, and "All right, Chatsworth, break clean", any time Chatsworth showed any affection for Mumsie.
And, yes, Dobie was his given name, after a Schweitzer-like scientist Winnie admired.
insisting that he'd end up with her because their names on the alphabetized class roster were right next to each other
Alphabetized seating charts did help to create special desk buddy bonds. She’s not so off the mark…
Though neither were my desk buddy I’m sorry to hear of their passing.
Watching this and a Full House episode I took notice how long the opening credits are: One Full Minute. For a 30 minute show (with 6-8 minutes of ads) that was a lot to dedicate to credits. And most shows had a full minute of closing credits as well.
For a 30 minute show (with 6-8 minutes of ads) that was a lot to dedicate to credits.
Too Many Cooks…
Of course there was the singer Dobie Gray, but that was a stage name given to him by record producers, an allusion to Dobie Gillis. This is per Wikipedia.
"I believe Dobie was his real name in the show, not a nickname. Right?"
I can't remember, but it must have been Doberman, don't you think?
"Watching this and a Full House episode I took notice how long the opening credits are: One Full Minute. For a 30 minute show (with 6-8 minutes of ads) that was a lot to dedicate to credits. And most shows had a full minute of closing credits as well."
Lots of long credits today though too... with the innovation of the "skip intro" button.
In the old days, the theme song was a call to everyone in the house to get to the TV set and you had enough warning to go to the bathroom or to the refrigerator or whatever before you got situated.
Since there's nothing new under the sun, Disney's Lizzie Mcguire repeated the opening 4th wall conceit.
When I saw the headline I thought there was no way you were a Full House aficionado.
"And why did they call Zelda "deeply intellectual"?!"
She played a sociology student on the Beverly Hillbillies.
Here's a great episode, Dobie matches wits and wardrobes with Milton to win the heart of Thalia for a while:
https://youtu.be/kkrURusRb4M
Looking at Wikipedia, I see that Dobie is itself a last name, so it's a legit first name, just the use of a last name as a first name.
Also, I see an entry for a criminal named Dobie Gillis Williams, who was born in 1961 (the last year of the TV show):
"Dobie Gillis Williams (1961 – January 8, 1999) was an American criminal in Louisiana who was convicted of the murder of Sonja Knippers in 1984, and sentenced to death. He was executed in 1999. His case has been controversial. Police contended that he confessed, although they had no recording. He was evaluated as intellectually disabled, according to one standard, but his defense attorney failed to discuss this or mitigating factors from his childhood. Williams' execution was twice stayed and his sentence was overturned by a federal district court judge. But Williams was executed because the 5th Circuit Court of Appeals ruled that mitigating information was introduced to the jury too late in the case. It ruled that the execution had to proceed, under the 1996 Antiterrorism and Effective Death Penalty Act (AEDPA). In 2005, Williams was one of two subjects of a book by Sister Helen Prejean, a Catholic nun and anti-death penalty activist. She contended that Williams could not have possibly committed the murder and was wrongfully convicted and executed...."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dobie_Gillis_Williams
Wilbu
WRT the reference to WW II: It's hard, this much later, to recall how suffused popular culture was with one or another aspect of WW II.
Such references were required, it seems. Micky Mouse Club's "Spin and Marty" (teen age guys at a dude ranch) had an opening scene where one of the adult staff, watching the guys get off the bus. commented to a colleague, "His father was XO on my ship." Nothing remotely connected with the plot. But it was required. We're all in this world which included WW II in which world we all are.
Sid Caesar, doing a skit where he was teaching Nanette Fabray to drive: "If you want to turn left, turn the wheel this way. To turn right, turn the wheel to the right. If you want to climb, pull back on the....." Is then silent and puts his hand over his eyes. Completely irrelevant in a skit where a slightly ditzy character is being taught to drive. But required. We all know fifteen million guys brought home more than their boots.
Dobie Gillis was an early contender for "Must See TV"...it was a come together occasion for all members of the family.
Ron Howard appears at 15:15 - "Oh yeah, the kid" says Dad.
Well, well, an early role for Ron Howard as the teacher's little boy.
The news of Dobie’s passing is as sad. as Sputnik. I too was a fan. All episodes may be viewed on SHOUT TV If you want to binge, laugh and remember.
I used to love that show as a kid and to this day, in my mind, I think it was way ahead of typical TV for that day. And that day had much more serious writers than today's TV does. 'Dobie Gillis' was one of the most underrated TV shows in our lifetime, with virtually no one under 50 even knowing it existed.
BTW, the writer of that show was Max Shulman, who was one of those great early comedy writers. He had a number of humorous books to his credit, more in the style of James Thurber, not David Sedaris. I used to have one of this books..."Barefoot Boy with Cheek", but just looked at my shrinking bookshelf and see that it's no longer there. ??? Damn! Probably gave it away to some library during one of my book purges, where it'll sit in the dark forever, collecting dust and never another set of eyes.
I saw all the mentions of Bob Saget- another truly funny man. But saw nothing of Dwayne Hickman. They say Saget was a comedians comedian. What you saw on that TV show was nothing like his stand-up routine which was supposedly as blue as it can get. Comedians used to always put him in their top funny people lists. RIP to both Mr. Saget and Hickman.
Max Shulman's original Dobie Gillis stories, from 1945 on, were set in St Paul, MN, when Dobie was going to the University of Minnesota.
Literary hat tip to Max Scbulman, who created Dobie Gillis and published a couple of books' worth of short stories about him in the 1950s. As a teenager, I was enthralled for a time by Schulman's oeuvre, brought to me by the TAB Book Club, which on a monthly basis sold cheap paperbacks (at 35 cents a pop) to junior high school students. That included Schulman's humorous novel, Sleep Till Noon, which opened with:
"Bang! Bang! Bang! Bang! Four shots ripped into my groin and I was off on the greatest adventure of my life! But first let me tell you a little about myself."
And a cinematic hat tip to Bobby Van, who first played the part of Dobie in the 1953 film version of what later became the tv series. Co-starring with Debbie Reynolds and Bob Fosse. Sadly, the film had no Maynard, Zelda, Chatsworth, or Thalia. It did have Hans Conried as Professor Pomfrit, however.
"Thalia was at least as smart — and much more rational."
And nice looking. She still is.
"The Aristocrats" is 2 hours of comedians doing variations of the same filthy joke. Saget's version is the filthiest by several orders of magnitude. R.I.P.
Tuesday Weld!
Want PROOF that GOD Loves Us? He not only created a world with Tuesday Weld, he lets US live in it!
Wilbur: And don't forget, "With the Good Conduct Medal."
Faylen’s recurring take, “I gotta kill that boy,” never got old.
Praise is due to writer Max Shulman, who died in 1988. Along with "Dobie," he wrote about American college life, let us say pre-Sputnik, when it probably was fairly innocent compared to what came later. In high school in the low 70s I had an assigned reading of "Love is a Fallacy." A nerdy young man thinks an attractive young woman will make a suitable mate if only she learns the basics of logic, and then avoids common errors. In the end she illogically chooses a young man who has the latest fashion--a raccoon coat. Set at the U of Minnesota in the 1950s; Shulman graduated from there in 1942. Shulman more or less kept up with the times; he wrote the movie "House Calls" (1978), about a doctor who swings with younger women when his wife dies (Shulman's wife died in 1963, and he re-married in 1964); this became a TV series. Walter Matthau as the doctor having young women to his apartment, trying to keep up with the culture: can I offer you something to drink? Cranberry juice? Low-fat milk? Eventually he falls in love with Glenda Jackson, more his own age.
Actually, in its last seasons Leave it to Beaver showed things from a Teengage POV. Wally, Eddie, Lumpy, etc. I didn't see Bob Denver in this show until AFTER I saw Gilligans Island, so it was quite a shock.
Its good Hickman lived a nice long life. Reading his Bio, it looks like his career pretty much ended in his mid-30s, but that's normal for Teenage/child stars.
Zelda (Kuehl) was 4-10 and ended up going to Havard Law School So, she may have been "deeply intellectual" but her character certainly wasn't.
Chatsworth Osborne Junior - my favorite character.
Who played the teacher? An attractive woman.
"Who played the teacher? "
Jean Byron, later played Patty's mom on the Patty Duke Show.
I only remember a little bit in syndication. In later years, I thought Troy Donahue or Tab Hunter played Dobie, and I figured that would have made Sheila a little less lonely on the set. Of course, Bob Denver was famous, but I had trouble in my memory knowing where Maynard G. Krebs ended and Sal Mineo's Plato began. Everything is much clearer now, thank you.
We named our cat Chatsworth because he was snooty and handsome. I remember Dwayne from his role as Bob Cummings' nephew in "Love That Bob." Rosemary DeCamp played Bob's sister and Dwayne was her son, Chuck. Ann B. Davis had the unrequited love role in that show. Not nearly as tiresome as Zelda.
She doesn't seem "deeply intellectual" here!
https://www.foxla.com/news/la-county-supervisor-dines-at-restaurant-hours-after-voting-to-ban-outdoor-dining
I remember watching this as a kid on Nick at Nite in the early 90s/late 80s. It was removed too soon for me to see every episode.
Bilwick said...
Who played the teacher? An attractive woman.
Jean Byron. She went on to play Patty Duke's mother in the Patty Duke Show about "identical cousins." William Schallert played Patty's father and had been Professor Pomfritt on Dobie Gillis. I always thought of the Patty Duke Show as Dobie's teachers getting married, moving to Brooklyn, and having a child. It took me until this moment, incidentally, to suddenly realize that "Professor Pomfritt" basically translates to "Professor French Fry."
Little Ronnie Howard, b. 1954, shown here basically before the Andy Griffith show. My God that was a child star. Yet he always comes across as quite unaffected. Bob Denver as a kind of beatnik: pre-hippie.
Little Ronnie Howard, b. 1954, shown here basically before the Andy Griffith show. My God that was a child star. Yet he always comes across as quite unaffected. Bob Denver as a kind of beatnik: pre-hippie.
I was a little younger than Dobie would have been and that show was a blessing for me. I had a low status and low economic childhood and it gave me a glimpse of normal life. It had something that many shows now lack- it was sweet. It was funny but it was rarely mean. There was one episode I have always remembered. All the students in Dobie's class were supposed to describe their bedroom. One very quiet student loner described a bedroom that had books, a microscope and other impressive elements. It was found out that the young fellow made that up and that, in reality, he came from a very poor family and shared a bedroom with siblings and had no personal belongings. Of course he was made fun of until Dobie stepped in. Dobie's point was that we should be judged on what we wish for and not what we had at the time. Our aspirations help define us and the lad's aspirations were about things related to learning.This is especially in regards to children whose possessions come from their parents pockets. Never understood why the show was only on for a few years and why Dwayne Hickman never had a better career. Hopefully he had a happy life. So sad.
Back in the 1980s, when he was music director of the Saint Paul Chamber Orchestra, Pinchas Zukerman left his wife Eugenia for Tuesday Weld. She would turn up occasionally at his concerts, and really stood out in the crowd. A real knockout in person. She was hilarious in Serial (1980), with Martin Mull, one of those movies that would provoke howls of outrage if it were shown today.
Dobie’s cantankerous, tightfisted father and sweet, harebrained mother were played by the characters actors Frank Faylen and Florida Friebus.
Are you sure those aren't characters Lena (Hannah Horvath) Dunham thought up?
Nobody cares about Bob Saget.
It was among the first to place the topical subject of teenagerhood front and center by recounting the story from a teenager’s point of view.
Notice the qualifier that readers are expected to pass over -- "among the first."
Although a bit younger, the earlier Leave it to Beaver was from the kids POV and for all the outrageous situations that Beaver and Wally got into, was pretty recognizable as true to life.
Tuesday Weld was born in Manhattan but was a Boston Weld, a distant cousin of politician William Weld. Her father, who had the fine old New England name of Lathrop Motley Weld, died young, so Susan (Tuesday) had to help support the family with her acting. She went on to be married to Dudley Moore and Pinchas Zukerman. I saw her in Play It As It Lays a few weeks back. I don't know what she's done professionally since then, but guys, apparently she is single.
It broke the fourth wall weekly
Of course, George Burns did that often -- and even would sometimes watch the show, as it was happening, on his TV.
I have a distant recollection that in one scene, Dobie’s dad muttered something about no good, lazy bums, and Maynard sprang up with his trademark, “You rang?” I can’t find any references to this scene anywhere and perhaps I just imagined it.
Stopped at 2:40.
This is supposed to be high school? In the 50s? Beards? Relationship advice from hot flirty teacher?
This show was always on, but the only characters and actors I can match by name are Krebs and Dobie. Didn't seem relevant, I guess, to my pre-teen self.
I just read his obit. He had a long, successful life. He produced and/or directed several successful tv shows. His third marriage lasted thirty years. None of his kids died early. His coworker was Tuesday Weld. Definitely a good life.....Unlike Tuesday Weld, he never made that much of an impression on me, but I enjoyed the show. I think the success of the show was mostly due to Max Shulman.....I read many of his books when young. They were very funny and you never had to adjust the horizontal hold while reading them. Back then, reading was an attractive alternative to television.....Has anyone recently read a Max Shulman book? I wonder if they hold up. P.G. Wodehouse seems to be the only comic writer whose work carries across generations.
I wander if something akin to "propinquity" (more broadly defined) influenced the United States founding, in the development of the separation of powers, more specifically, the 10th amendment that says, "all powers that have not been specifically enumerated, or delegated to the U.S. Congress, are to be left to the individual states."
I was prompted to this frame by something Supreme Sotomayor reportedly said, “I’m not sure I understand the distinction why the states would have the power [to institute a mandate such as OSHA’s], but the federal government wouldn’t,”
The idea being that those closest to you, along with you, have a better perspective, than those far away, like say those in positions of authority all the way in DC.
Max Shulman, the creator of Dobie, wrote one of my favorite short stories of all time: Love Is a Fallacy. It’s a supremely self-ironic take on the pseudo-intellectualism class. And funny as hell.
Thanks to those who identified Jean Byron. I was going to use IMDB to see what else she'd been in, but they now have this annoying feature wherein when you try to look up an actor's filmography, it blocks you because they want you to use an app or something.
“I’m not sure I understand the distinction why the states would have the power [to institute a mandate such as OSHA’s], but the federal government wouldn’t,”
Not only is she confused about federalism, but the premise of her question is wrong.
Introduce me to that big blonde
She's got a touch of Tuesday Weld
She's wearing Ambush and a French twist
She's got us wild and she can tell
She loves to limbo, that much is clear
She's got the right dynamic for the new frontier
Donald Fagen, 1983
Max Shulman. Never heard of him. Shows what I know!
I do recall the line about The Big One--W W Two and the Good Conduct Medal.
Totes agree on the pervasiveness of The War to us Boomers; stuff bored most of my peers to tears, but it sparked a lifelong interest in me.
Max Shulman's "Barefoot Boy with Cheek" has been required reading in my family for a couple generations. It satirizes life at the mythical University of Minnesota. For something written decades ago, it's funny how much of it still applies today.
Thanks for the clip. Ronny Howard!
I worked with Max Shulman's son. His novel Rally Round the Flag, Boys!, was turned into a fun film satirizing the NY suburban commuter life my parents were living through at the time.
Gil Dobie was a successful college football coach: 58-0-3 when he coached the University of Washington. He was admitted to the National Football Foundation Hall of Fame in 1951. The name was just flipped around and modified a little.
Another major childhood Dobie Gillis fan here. I was 7 when it started. My favorite episode has always been the one where Maynard got a job ("job!" as he would freakishly repeat & twitch whever he heard that word) selling a shelf of Confucius statues with clocks in their stomachs at the Army Navy Surplus store.
It was in Season 2 & called "The Face That Stopped the Clock". In the mid-70's I actually found a plastic Buddah with an alarm clock in it's stomach at this big-box/KMart style store that was going out of business. Bought all 9 they had left and gave most of them as Christmas presents.
IMDB already has DH's death posted in his bio.
As with one or two others, my first reaction on seeing the Althouse headline was, whoa, she's talking about Bob Saget???
Another big fan of the DG show. As I've said before, I'm just about three years younger than Althouse (more precisely, two years and eleven months, give or take a day). I remember the show from when it was originally on, but probably more the later (not as good?) college seasons than the earlier high school ones. As with lots of shows from the 60s, I also remember and can "sing" (if you can call it that) much or all of the theme song.
More recently saw a lot of the episodes when they were running on Nick at Night, which was probably twenty years ago or more. They used to call William Schallert the "hardest working man" on TV because of all the shows he appeared in.
I think it was only much later, possibly from the Nick at Nite episodes, that I learned about the Warren Beatty connection in the first season or two. I didn't see any of the Beatty movies until much later, but he only became known later on for, first, Splendor in the Grass (which I can't sit through), The Roman Spring of Mrs. Stone, and then the big breakthrough in Bonnie and Clyde. Apart from B&C, the earliest things I remember Beatty from are Shampoo and Heaven Can Wait, though I don't think I've ever actually seen all of Shampoo.
Anyway, almost everything I thought of has already been said above. Just a few additions.
First, as I'm sure I've already said before, Sheila K. was in my law school class. I remember seeing/recognizing her, but I don't think we were ever in class together and don't remember ever having any interaction with her. Always wondered how many of the other students knew her as Zelda.
Second, Dobie's ma (doing my Chicago schtick here, like Bonnie Hunt, who has the perfect (non-existent) Chicago "accent," when she was on, I think, Wheel of Fortune with her "ma"; I didn't know him but her brother was in my high school class) was later one of the members of the therapy group on the original Bob Newhart Show. She was also on a bunch of other TV shows, but that's the one I remember her from.
Frank Faylen was, of course, in tons of movies. Perhaps best known in recent years as the taxi driver in It's a Wonderful Life. Pretty sure DG was my introduction to his work.
I can sorta see Tucker Carlson as Chatsworth Osborne, Jr. Loved, loved Chatsworth's ma.
Finally, DH's older brother Darryl, apparently still alive at age 90, was a big child star in movies in the 40's and then on TV in the 50s. I probably remember him most from Leave Her to Heaven, where the gorgeous but evil Gene Tierney sits in a rowboat cooly watching him get a cramp and drown while he's swimming in a lake. Then a small role in what may well be the weirdest of the Tracy Hepburn movies, Keeper of the Flame (though there are a couple of other contenders).
--gpm
P.S. lohwoman mentioned Love That Bob with Anne B. Davis, without specifying that she played the fabulous "Schultsie." If the kids know her at all, it's as Alice, the maid in the Brady Bunch.
Hickman's autobiography, in which he recounted his days as a TV exec, post-Dobie is fascinating. Best book I ever read about the inner workings of TV production.
I didn't remember the animated Dobie at the beginning and end of the show, and just as well. There was something creepy and gnomish about cartoon Dobie leering at the peephole, not like the "loveable" Dobie in the episode itself. Cartoon Dobie would probably pay to see Zelda in a Tijuana Mule Show.
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