October 16, 2021

In trying to present Sanjay Gupta as a science-is-real hero for talking to Joe Rogan for 3 hours, CNN laid the groundwork for fact-checkers to draw attention to all the most damaging omissions.

Fox News embraces the opportunity in "CNN praises Dr. Sanjay Gupta for interview with Joe Rogan, buries viral moments" (Fox News).

Ironically, CNN's self-serving effort to make Gupta look better than he did has the unintended effect of highlighting Rogan's serious and informed questioning about the vaccine and the covid therapeutics. And, more generally, it undermines CNN's reputation for journalism. 

Lots of transcribed conversation and video clips at the Fox News link.

That's just Fox News. I'm sure other sites are working on the same material, and I look forward to hearing what Joe himself has to say about the way Gupta enjoyed his hospitality for 3 hours then retreated into CNN world and trashed him. 

I say "his hospitality" because that's the feeling the podcast gives the listener and it's something Joe openly talked to Gupta about creating. You have the sense that these are 2 friends talking the way they'd talk all evening if they got together for drinks. You could accuse Joe of setting a trap, making the guest feel too comfortable and amiable. But I think Gupta knew what he was doing, and he intended to trap and use Joe too. 

63 comments:

rhhardin said...

It's a business and they supply whatever their audience chooses to entertain themselves with.

You can't do news because nobody would choose it as entertainment. At most you can borrow the news genre and gestures, like war of the worlds.

Nothing actually happens in the world that's of any interest. Japan elects a new parliament. You can print it or blog it but nobody comes to read it.

exhelodrvr1 said...

Did you actually write "reputation for journalism" or was that from the Babylon Bee,?

farmgirl said...

A friend just sent me a headline on apple from the Wash post about some idiot chick shacked up w/a mooch of a fella and is resentful about (possibly?) being used. This nation is unserious about Truth- top to bottom libs- and bury heinous actual newsy crimes- behaviors- intentionally. Outright lie to benefit bottlenecking society. Culture vultures.

I’m reading a short book by Venerable Bishop Sheen called Characters of the Passion- published originally in 1947. Same same. Beautiful verse. I’m thinking he was prophetic.

Red Fascism.

Jamie said...

You could accuse Joe of setting a trap, but if you did, you'd be a hypersensitive (and ridiculously ignorant) little snowflake. Gupta cannot claim with any credibility that he didn't know Rogan was not on his side of this debate.

I remember when Gupta was embedded with the Army in the first Gulf War. At one point, a child who had been - if memory serves - shot in the head was brought in, and Gupta, being a neurosurgeon and the most qualified surgeon for this operation on the scene, broke with journalistic ethics to operate on that child.

The child, sadly, didn't survive. But I remember Gupta's statement on CNN just afterwards - he was practically wild with adrenalin, dismayed that he hadn't been able to save this child, but kept repeating that he thought he had done the right thing even though it compromised his objectivity.

Of course he had done the right thing.

Where's that Gupta now?

wendybar said...

CNN lies. They lie about everything. Their ratings are in the toilet because MOST people are sick of being lied to...some just eat up those lies and spew them around over and over again. Sanjay is a pansy. What he talked about with Rogan was totally different when he went on Liar Lemons' show after and contradicted what he and Rogan talked about. What a snake. You can't trust progressives.

rhhardin said...

Another news genre Wright and Kaus entertainment with some self-awareness about the entertainment and how it relates to the stuff talked about. (Weekly, roughly)

Jersey Fled said...

And yet CNN viewers (both of them) will continue to see Gupta as a trusted source.

Sydney said...

I watched the first half of Guota’s interview with Rogan, and I was very unimpressed by Gupta. Rogan was better prepared, but Gupta wasn’t even able to respond to his assertions with any kind of coherence. It was pretty clear that Gupta is used to telling people what to think and not to explaining why he recommends something beyond appeal to authority. He doesn’t even understand how intramuscular injection works, stating the injected material gets taken up by your muscle cells. Well perhaps some does, but the reason we inject into muscles is that they are highly vascular and provide a depot from which things can get taken up into your blood strea, and delivered elsewhere. Hence, an antibiotic can be injected in your arm and treat your pneumonia or your gonorrhea, which most definitely are not in your arm muscles. He should stick to neurosurgery.

Mike of Snoqualmie said...

CNN hasn't been a serious news outlet in decades. They're the Democrats-are-wonderful propaganda channel. Just look at how they treated Donald Trump vs. Joe "Let's go Brandon" Biden. Antagonistic questions to Trump, soft-ball question to Brandon. Trump took all incoming fire from the press while all Brandon can do is walk away.

Horse dewormer is just the latest CNN lie. The can't help themselves, they're Democrats. It in their nature. Like the scorpion in the tail of the frog and the scorpion.

Temujin said...

This is the interesting era we live in. The media- and by media I mean all of it- our regular corporate media from the NY Times and WaPo (and other large press) to our broadcast media, online media organizations (including magazines doing more online than print), and of course social media giants. This media, while knowing very well that they own the mainstream avenues of information, and live in an era where they have the ability to control what gets out, seem to have a blind spot about the fact that while they own a lot, they do not own it all. And there are numerous other sites and means for people to get the actual information out there.

In other words, they know they spin reality, talk up narratives that are not true, spout flat-out lies, and cover up truths. This is an entire industry who thinks their job is to Stay the Narrative. They know they lie, yet they act as if there is no way people will find out they are covering the truth or flat-out lying. But we do. We find out. We know this now- daily. This is not new. You would think they'd be embarrassed into doing their jobs correctly, but no...A Narrative is more important than anything apparently.

They are not alone. Our politicians do it, too. Our university administrators and professors do it. And now our corporate heads to it as well. The Narrative above all. Even as the truth is falling on their heads for all of us to see, they keep up their mission. In other words, that fact that Gupta was shown to be part of a lying organization did not phase him. He knew he could show up back on CNN and get back to the comfort of the narrative. It's like a safety blanket for these people. Their...bankey (to use a child's words).

Fact checkers are a joke and not needed. People can see. People know. CNN is garbage as is most all of the media. We know this. They are held in less regard than Congress for God's sake. And no one should ever be held in less regard than Congress. Joe Rogan will have more to say on this, you can be sure. And all of CNNs night time viewers don't add up to 1 hour of Joe Rogan's listeners.

CNN should simply embrace their reputation. Dress up their talking heads in clown costumes and let them do their show as is- dressed as clowns. It would be more appealing, and as clowns, it would make more sense.

rehajm said...

They are so threatened by any valid reason not to take the vaccine. There are risks, like Rogan’s myocarditis in young boys, there are is no immunity for people on certain immunosuppressant drugs. Still vax doctors are willing to subject these people to the risks of vaccine because they are ‘so small’, yet for some there will be ZERO benefit.

What happened to ‘do no harm’?

Bob Boyd said...

"Believe the science" means believe the narrative.

Lurker21 said...

But I think Gupta knew what he was doing, and he intended to trap and use Joe too.

Or he was so well cocooned that he expected deference.

Quaestor said...

And, more generally, it undermines CNN's reputation for journalism.

CNN has no reputation for journalism to undermine. For years now it has been a porn channel for the Trump deranged. What's been undermined is Gupta's reputation for virility.

Sebastian said...

"it undermines CNN's reputation for journalism"

??

Sydney: "Gupta is used to telling people what to think and not to explaining why"

The problem with our expert class as a whole. The arrogance of the anointed. Yet they presume to rule us.

Amadeus 48 said...

Rogan left Gupta bleeding on the floor, and he did it with such skill that Gupta didn't even realize he was down. The fourth time Joe asked him about CNN's ethics, Sanjay should have answered the question: CNN publishes lies to enthrall and entertain their audience of smug bien-pensants.

Chris N said...

One old-timey lagoon is drained, carted and dumped to where the new lagoon is.

Interesting that we all get to pass-by and watch.

Achilles said...

Everyone knew that CNN lied. But you could still be a part of that tribe because it had power.

You could associate with CNNABCCBSNBCWAPONYT because they were the Beautiful People even though everyone knew they were liars.

That is why Althouse still reads these "sources" and not those "trashy" outfits.

Deep down a lot of people, and white women in particular, are obsessed with the class conscious need to be accepted by the Beautiful People.

That is why people are still saying they don't like Trump despite the fact he was objectively the most successful president in modern times. He is so icky and the Beautiful People don't like him.

But the Beautiful People are going to fall and they are on the wrong side of a preference cascade. I will feel joy every time they get their comeuppance.

Big Mike said...

And, more generally, it undermines CNN's reputation for journalism.

In my house their reputation is that there is no lie so obvious that they would not push it if it served “the Narrative.” It’s not just that the wife and I object to being lied to by an alleged news organization, it’s that we are expected to be gullible enough to believe their crap.

If Fox is genuinely fact-checking Gupta, then that is a good thing. Your text, Professor, implies that other news media might join them. Trust me, if that happens it will be wretches like Glen Kessler trying to cherry pick made-up “facts” to try to provide cover for Gupta.

Randomizer said...

"I look forward to hearing what Joe himself has to say about the way Gupta enjoyed his hospitality for 3 hours then retreated into CNN world and trashed him. "

Rogan doesn't tend to trash people. I bet Rogan will say that he likes Gupta and appreciates him coming on, but Gupta is playing the game for CNN. Rogan will continue hammering CNN for being a news outfit with no credibility.

Gupta said that he watches Rogan's podcast, so he knew the format. As Gupta said, he thought he could school Rogan, but never considered that he had anything to learn. Gupta may realize that he did learn something. The cool, smart guys aren't at CNN, but are what for a couple of minutes, were called the "Intellectual Dark Web".

Howard said...

Whatever it takes to kill off more Trumpers. If you like your metabolic disorder you can keep your metabolic disorder. Have it your finger licking good way.

Another old lawyer said...

I've been amazed at just how self-destructive CNN has been over the last 6 or so years, and how its owners have been OK with that destruction of shareholder value. WAPO I get since it's now owned by a single person. But CNN's owner has always been a publicly traded company.

Bob Boyd said...

Rogan is a grappler. Grapplers prepare, prepare, prepare, then go for the quick submission.
Sanjay went into Rogan's cage thinking he could simply unroll his credentials and wait for Rogan to be awestruck. Rogan cheerfully mauled him.
Now Sanjay is saying, Well I actually won if you think about it because my total humiliation shows what a frightening brute Rogan is. Embarrassing.

Michael K said...

They are not alone. Our politicians do it, too. Our university administrators and professors do it. And now our corporate heads to it as well. The Narrative above all. Even as the truth is falling on their heads for all of us to see, they keep up their mission.

They have half the population convinced they are correct and that, according to the joke about Lincoln's comment ("You can fool some of the people all of the time and all of the people some of the time" and those are pretty good odds), is good enough for government work. They get close to 50% and cheating does the rest.

Aggie said...

Rogan has a certain stoner gregariousness about his podcasts, but I wouldn't necessarily mistake that for being friendly. When he has someone genuine on his program, his manner is different - he's willing to be as open and genuine as they are. Gupta's efforts to be genuine failed miserably - using Joe's name when he was answering, and using other interviewer's tricks designed to put the subject at ease. Rogan saw right through that and made sure his viewers did too; Gupta's a phoney.

It's always a mistake to underestimate a fighter - they are the shrewdest people there are when it comes to interacting with others, because when they do it, it's their blood. I think Rogan wanted to call CNN's bullsh*t going into the podcast, but when he saw what a phoney Gupta was, he decided to work out a little.

Ann Althouse said...

"The fourth time Joe asked him about CNN's ethics, Sanjay should have..."

Ha ha. Gupta himself brought up the subject near the end, and Joe snatched it up and ran with it. Gupta tried saying he was sorry he brought it up again, but Joe wouldn't let him get away with bringing it up and then depriving Joe of the chance to use it. I found that highly amusing. Gupta fell for the illusion that he had won Joe's friendship and Joe wouldn't want to hurt him.

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

NO COVID THERAPEUTICS FOR YOU!

You will follow the diktats of the corrupt press and their $$$ corrupt party.

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

it undermines CNN's reputation for journalism.

hahahahaha That ship sailed a while ago.

Breezy said...

So ironic that CNN et al tear into Trump for propagating the “Big Lie”, when they are the ones drenched in and spurting their ridiculous lies. The money must be awesome to sell one’s soul so.

@Temujin - well said!

Narayanan said...

Professora said ....
I say "his hospitality" because that's the feeling the podcast gives the listener and it's something Joe openly talked to Gupta about creating. You have the sense that these are 2 friends talking the way they'd talk all evening if they got together for drinks.
----------
time for game of BYOB >>> what beverages would / did "Dr. Gupta" / other guests bring

chance to do a poll?


Narayanan said...

can Gupta claim to have been ambushed drugged and abused?

A visit to Joe Rogan’s studio space means an endless supply of what we love most — KILL CLIFF energy drinks and CBD beverages. We can’t deny it: we’re jealous of the exclusively KILL CLIFF fridge that Joe says, “fits right into the studio.”

It makes sense that with a fridge full of KILL CLIFF, Rogan frequently shares KILL CLIFF drinks with podcast guests, and the host recently passed a can to guest Hannibal Buress, saying “It’s legit!”

Kevin said...

Setting a trap: Not taking the answer and moving on, even if the answer is evasive or obviously false.

mikee said...

Joe Rogan - a former actor and reality TV show host - just destroyed the small shreds of credibility held by a star member of a major new's channel. CNN will ignore it. Their hundreds to thousands of loyal viewers will continue to ignore it. People who quote CNN and spread their narrative far beyond the reach of airport TVs in social media will ignore it. Why? Because there is nothing left for CNN to lose. They have been so bad, for so long, that this further proof of their inadequacy as a source of news isn't surprising, or challenging to anyone's beliefs. Another crack in the wall, another log on the bonfire, sure, but the wall is so shabby and the bonfire so big nobody notices these latest additions. Good work, Joe. Carry on, and may the wall fall soon, and the bonfire engulf the entire edifice of CNN.

wildswan said...

Sydney: "Gupta is used to telling people what to think and not to explaining why"

Agree. And even though Gupta "knew" Joe Rogan might disagree, Gupta no longer knew what that meant. He no longer knew that he should learn Joe Rogan's main positions and have answers. Gupta lives in Brandon's World where mere assertion by A Connected is all that is needed to establish a fact (and to establish the opposite fact later, if needed). One assertion of Brandon's World is that there is no world beyond. There's no such world and so no word from any such world could ever negate a Brandon's World Word. And yet Joe Rogan is more popular than Gupta or Lemon and there are people who hear him talking - and Bari Weiss and Jordan Peterson and various ministers of true religion. The silenced are not silent - but like a tree falling a forest which no one hears - for those who can no longer hear, the silenced do not make a sound.

Narayanan said...

Temujin said...
... that fact that Gupta was shown to be part of a lying organization did not phase him. He knew he could show up back on CNN and get back to the comfort of the narrative. It's like a safety blanket for these people. Their...bankey (to use a child's words).

Fact checkers are a joke and not needed. People can see. People know
------
thanks Temujin :
people are wrong to call it fact-checking : more accurate to call it laundering their ... bankey - since the purpose is to washing out the stain of reality as much as possible to preserve the NARRATIVE.

LA_Bob said...

Temujin said, "Dress up their talking heads in clown costumes and let them do their show as is- dressed as clowns."

Joe Rogan does standup comedy. He ought to dress up in brownface with a red ball on his nose and a clown suit and do a parody of Sanjay Gupta.

Yes, Sanjay Gupta is parody, but still...

Narayanan said...

...
but kept repeating that he thought he had done the right thing even though it compromised his objectivity.
-----------
I don't get this about 'compromised his objectivity' : is Gupta saying surgeons who are teaching and recording : i.e. describing / narrating what they are doing - are not objective

Drago said...

"Fox News embraces the opportunity in "CNN praises Dr. Sanjay Gupta for interview with Joe Rogan, buries viral moments" (Fox News)."

Fox News Pounces!

Greg The Class Traitor said...

"And, more generally, it undermines CNN's reputation for journalism."

How? They have no reputation for journalisms, and haven't since the Mueller Report came out and showed that everything they claimed about "Russiagate" was bullshit

0_0 said...

No national network besides Fox will mention this.

Greg The Class Traitor said...

"You could accuse Joe of setting a trap, making the guest feel too comfortable and amiable. But I think Gupta knew what he was doing, and he intended to trap and use Joe too."

"I found that highly amusing. Gupta fell for the illusion that he had won Joe's friendship and Joe wouldn't want to hurt him."

That's pretty much the most damning thing one can say about the US "press". "Gupta fell for the illusion that he had won Joe's friendship and" therefore Joe would screw over his customers, the listeners, by avoiding any questions his "good pal" Gupta didn't like.

Just like CNN avoids asking any uncomfortable questions of anyone on the Left who they political support.

Because they (and by "they" I mean CNN, MSNBCm ABC, NBC, CBS, WaPo, NYT, etc et al) are not in the business of informing their customers. They're in the business of sucking up to the powerful for "access", and pushing a political agenda.

We've gone from "if your mother says she loves you, get a second source" to "give nothing but love to your sources, because they're your source of power".

It's wretched and pathetic

William said...

In the interview with Rogan, Gupta came across as a decent sort. Is that part of the act? If you wish to appear on tv on an ongoing basis, you have to come across as pleasant and likable. Who would have ever thought Charley Rose and Matt Lauer were crazed sex fiends, but there you are.....Gupta looked a little smarmy in the Lemon exchange. He didn't push back at all. I can sympathize to some extent. I would not wish to give up wealth and fame for the chance to present Lemon with a nuanced view of ivermyctin. Everybody has retreated to their corners. Gupta may have lost the debate with Rogan, but there's no percentage in him then going on and attacking his cornerman, Lemon.......Here's my balanced, nuanced view of ivermyctin which I don't know how to spell. It's probably ineffective but otherwise harmless for humans to take in the treatment of covid. However, there's always the possibility of the placebo effect. A lot of drugs work simply because the taker thinks that they are going to work. Beyond this, I would like different people to try different remedies. Someday somebody is going to hit upon a winning treatment. I believe in science and I believe that serendipity is an important part of the scientific process.

Yancey Ward said...

Gupta thought he was so much smarter than Rogan that there was no way the interview could go wrong for him. Rogan likes to act like an everyman- it is part of his performance- but if you spend any amount of time actually listening to him, it is pretty fucking obvious his IQ isn't under 120, and might not be under 140. The parts of the interview I have seen are a clinical demonstration on how to interview a liar.

Bilwick said...

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I put it to you: would people whose basic economic agenda is legalized theft actually LIE to you? Come on, man!

BUMBLE BEE said...

Ah yes! Clearly Not News. The go to news source of airport janitors.

cassandra lite said...

I hope Rogan files a defamation suit. Gupta's kowtowing to Don Lemon, who went back to the dewormer trope, smells like actual malice and a winnable suit...that would of course be appealed and quite possibly be the catalyst for revisiting Sullivan, which has become obsolete with the news media's self-inflicted degeneration.

Unlike Nick Sandmann, who needed the money more than the notoriety, Rogan wouldn't settle, so the case would also certainly have to be heard.

Scott Patton said...

I didn't see the beginning, so maybe I'm wrong, but Gupta probably expected Rogan to take 3 big hits of weed and slam 6oz Bourbon before they got rolling... Oops!

Mike of Snoqualmie said...

We need to nuke CNN from orbit, just to be sure the Lie-Stream Media infection is eradicated.

Scott Patton said...

Rogan is the next generation's Brian Lamb, maybe more opinionated or at least he shows it more. He has a genuine curiosity and intellectually honest approach.

He was interviewing Michael Shellenberger hocking a book, San Fransicko. When the guest was describing the industry build up to deal with the homeless situation, Joe blurted out "They're farming homeless people!". Perfect analysis.

Ann Althouse said...

"time for game of BYOB >>> what beverages would / did "Dr. Gupta" / other guests bring"

Gupta brought a bottle of whiskey of a type he had never sampled, chosen for the name, which was "Dr." something. They broke it open in the middle of the show and seemed to drink. Rogan said it was good.

Ann Althouse said...

Has Rogan sued CNN? Let me know. But I don't think he has, and I don't think he should. Moreover, I believe he would lose, and I think he should lose.

CNN was mocking him, and it was bad and stupid, but there isn't exactly a lie in there, because they never asserted specifically that he got his drug from a veterinarian or that the drugs he took were in the form given to horses.

The Vault Dweller said...

It is possible to not tell a lie and still be dishonest. Referring to Ivermectin as Horse Dewormer isn't a lie but it is dishonest. Just like if someone were to refer to Don Lemon as an open homosexual who has been seen drinking a solvent regularly used to clean children's genitals wouldn't be a lie but it would be dishonest. I also don't think Rogan should sue CNN and if he did I would hope he would lose because if being factually correct ceases to become an defense against defamation, litigation would run rampant. But I still hope Rogan and others drag CNN for their behavior.

Joe Smith said...

'CNN was mocking him, and it was bad and stupid, but there isn't exactly a lie in there, because they never asserted specifically that he got his drug from a veterinarian or that the drugs he took were in the form given to horses.'

https://www.mediaite.com/opinion/don-lemon-un-corrects-the-record-on-joe-rogan-just-hours-after-dr-sanjay-guptas-concession/

Greg The Class Traitor said...

Althouse and Vault Dweller, I believe you are wrong.

If you give oatmeal cookies to your kids, and I say "Althouse is such a bad parent she was feeding her kids horse food", that would be a lie.

If CNN said "Joe Rogan is taking a drug that is also used as a horse dewormer", that would not be a lie, just like me saying "Althouse is giving her kids food that is also given to horses" would not be a lie (whether you're giving them oatmeal, carrots, or sugar).

But IIUC they said "Joe Rogan took a horse dewormer." And that is a lie. He took the human prescription form or a drug invented for humans.

He should sue CNN, he should win, and he should take them to the cleaners.

Greg The Class Traitor said...

Althouse and Vault Dweller:

If I wrote "yesterday, Althouse was such a bad parent she fed her kids dog food", and it turned out that she'd fed her kids a nice pair of steaks she'd picked up at the local Whole Foods, would that not be libel? Even though dogs eat steak?

If I wrote "Vault Dweller is such a pathetic drug addict that he's reduced to taking doggie pain killers", and you're not a drug addict, and you're taking pain killers your doctor prescribed for you, that it just so happens vets can also prescribe for dogs (my wife and dog each have their own prescription for the same pain killer), would that not be libel?

Sorry, but when CNN said "Joe Rogan is took a horse de-womer", they lied.

walter said...

Bah. Gupta crowed that he went into the lion's den.

Sydney said...the reason we inject into muscles is that they are highly vascular and provide a depot from which things can get taken up into your blood strea, and delivered elsewhere.
--
Tonight I heard a WHO conference excerpt where concerns over antigens and adjuvants mixing with each other are to be negated by injecting into different limbs.
Nevermind that vax schedules can suggest 5-8 at a time.

Chuck said...

I don’t know why my earlier-submitted comment was not posted.

The substance of my comment was, first, my repeated observation that it seems like the kerfuffle over CNN’s sloppy one-time categorization of Joe Rogan’s Ivermectin prescription as “livestock de-wormer” has been taken by all of right-wing media as the one lead story from the interview. It’s what this blog has done.

To me, the CNN story is almost inexpressibly minor, compared to serious public health advice about vaccines and so-called therapeutics for COVID. The CNN part of the interview story is practically the only story for the Trump Wing of the Republican Party, as it feeds all of their grievances about a hostile media.

The second part of my unposted comment had been related to this blog post’s headline; drawing attention “to the most glaring omissions” in CNN’s own reporting on the Rogan-Gupta interview. So CNN.com’s reporting said almost nothing about the “livestock de-wormer” error. At the same time, Trumpist media including this blog have said next to nothing about the important substantive issues relating to COVID prevention and treatment.

I read this CNN story — filled with quotes from the interview transcript — with interest because it highlighted all of the things from the interview that have otherwise been omitted here:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2021/10/15/health/dr-sanjay-gupta-joe-rogan-key-moments/index.html

Ann Althouse said...

"Sorry, but when CNN said "Joe Rogan is took a horse de-womer", they lied."

You are making an assertion about what the quote was. You put that in quote marks, but I don't think that is the quote. It's hard to find the original quote now, but if this were a defamation lawsuit, the actual words would be extremely important. I have gone back and looked at them, and they don't literally say "Joe Rogan is took a horse de-wormer." It's more something like Joe Rogan took Ivermectin. Period. Then the assertion — which is true — that Ivermectin is a horse dewormer. I think that would trip you up in a lawsuit.

walter said...

More disturbing was that cheeky FDA tweet, "y'all."

walter said...

Of course, there was also the doc who claimed a certain hospital was overrun with EverMerkin overdoses, y'all.

Chuck said...

Blogger Ann Althouse said...
"Sorry, but when CNN said "Joe Rogan is took a horse de-womer", they lied."

You are making an assertion about what the quote was. You put that in quote marks, but I don't think that is the quote. It's hard to find the original quote now, but if this were a defamation lawsuit, the actual words would be extremely important. I have gone back and looked at them, and they don't literally say "Joe Rogan is took a horse de-wormer." It's more something like Joe Rogan took Ivermectin. Period. Then the assertion — which is true — that Ivermectin is a horse dewormer. I think that would trip you up in a lawsuit.

This is all true; there might also be an “actual malice” component as a prerequisite element to a cause of action. Per the New York Times v. Sullivan line of cases. Joe Rogan being a public figure using his world-recognized podcast to weigh in with opinions on pandemic responses.

But in addition, the bloggress rightly notes how narrowly the supposed CNN defamation has played. I too tried to find it online. I had thought that the exact phrase was “livestock de-wormer.” I thought it was Brianna Keillar who said it. But I couldn’t check my memory on either point, because I couldn’t find the original video. Not that it would be legally dispositive, but as a practical matter, no one has done more to keep the CNN “de-wormer” sloppiness alive in the national discourse than ... Joe Rogan.

walter said...

On television, you can say it without saying it.
https://www.latimes.com/entertainment-arts/story/2021-10-15/joe-rogan-covid-19-treatment-don-lemon-cnn
"In CNN’s initial coverage, a report by studio host Erin Burnett featured a chyron reading, “Joe Rogan says he has COVID, taking livestock drug despite warnings.” In that report, Burnett described ivermectin as “a drug used for livestock.”
Deadly cancer at age 31

A September segment on fellow host Don Lemon’s show featured a chyron reading, “Joe Rogan, controversial podcast host, says he has COVID, taking unproven de-worming drug.” Lemon said Rogan claimed he “took the de-worming drug, ivermectin, that has been touted by fringe right-wing groups.”

Of course, Pierre Kory of FLCCC is a NY Dem who chalks up suppression to regulatory capture by Big Pharma. You know..Right Wing talking points since forever.....

Greg The Class Traitor said...

Ann Althouse said...
Me: "Sorry, but when CNN said "Joe Rogan is took a horse de-womer", they lied."

You are making an assertion about what the quote was. You put that in quote marks, but I don't think that is the quote.


https://www.mediaite.com/opinion/don-lemon-un-corrects-the-record-on-joe-rogan-just-hours-after-dr-sanjay-guptas-concession/

“He says he’s been taking the livestock dewormer ivermectin,” said Jim Acosta on September 5, just a short month or so ago. Dr. Anthony Fauci, with whom Acosta was speaking, made no effort to correct this.

• Anderson Cooper teased his September 1 segment on the subject by saying that Rogan “acknowledged taking a controversial treatment designed for animals.”

• In the same segment Cooper repeated that characterization, and fellow CNN host Brian Stelter called what Rogan took “a horse deworming medication that’s discouraged by the government.”

• Don Lemon on September 1 claimed Joe Rogan “says he took the deworming drug ivermectin that’s been touted by right wing groups” as a covid treatment.

The Jim Acosta on September 5 looks to me like a clear case of they literally say "Joe Rogan is took a horse de-wormer." It's not "Joe Rogan took Ivermectin, which is also used as a horse dewormer".

No?