Here's the text of the article of impeachment.
January 11, 2021
"House Democrats on Monday introduced an article of impeachment against President Trump for inciting a mob that attacked the Capitol last week, vowing to press the charge..."
"... as Republicans blocked a separate move to formally call on Vice President Mike Pence to strip him of power under the 25th Amendment.... Democratic leaders were confident it would pass, and pressured Republican lawmakers to vote with them to beseech the vice president, who is said to be opposed to using the powers outlined in the Constitution, to do so.
It was a remarkable threat. If Mr. Pence does not intervene 'within 24 hours' after passage and the president does not resign, House leaders said they would move as early as Wednesday to consider the impeachment resolution on the floor, just a week after the attack.... Last minute changes were made late Sunday to include a reference to the 14th Amendment, the post-Civil War era addition to the Constitution that prohibits anyone who 'engaged in insurrection or rebellion' against the United States from holding future office. Lawmakers also decided to cite specific language from Mr. Trump’s speech last Wednesday, inciting the crowd, quoting him saying: 'If you don’t fight like hell, you’re not going to have a country anymore.'"
I note that the Trump quote they included did not make my list "The 7 most violence-inciting statements in Donald Trump's speech to the crowd on January 6th"! I thought "fight like hell" sounded too much like ordinary politics to make the list. We fight for our rights, we fight in political campaigns, we fight in court. Are we going to outlaw the word "fight"?! We'll be descending into Newspeak.
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155 comments:
As always, the left over-plays its hand. Republicans will control the House in 2022 and the whole thing in 2024. And the only time the country will be run well is from 2022 to 2024, when government is divided.
Democrat priorities are always inverted from what reality would seem to demand. So SOP for Congress under their control.
Democrats, "Bradenburg v. Ohio? What's that?"
Much like how Sarah Palin had to suffer for her target and targeting imagery, Trump's use of Fight will suddenly be beyond the pale.
We are in reruns again. Didn't we just do the Palin vs. New York Times libel lawsuit?
These people do not act in good faith.
Oh well.
I blame Paul Ryan for much of the failure of Rs to get anything done 2016-2018.
years of democrats inspiring and building Antifa mob violence, using wholesale lies to remove Trump or cripple him.
Media ignore Antifa violence - call it mostly peaceful.
Now - it is fast becoming obvious that Antifa infiltrated the "mob" at the Capitol, and did some damage. Certainly some of Trump's supporters may have acted stupidly.
I suspect most of the worst of it was all Antifa - disguised as maga.
Nancy wants her theater... Media happy to oblige.
"Are we going to outlaw the word "fight"?!"
Only for righties.
"We'll be descending into Newspeak."
We already have.
Welcome to calm normality, Althouse.
Years ago, I created a song that said I wanted no part of what I was seeing happening to all my friends and relatives in Silicon Valley.
I’m amazed Nancy Pelosi never told you about it.
“implore” would work better than “beseech” in that sentence.
One week to go. Someone please explain what the objective of this is. What kind of backroom stategy is taking place? Fucking nuts is pretty high on my list, but it has to be more than that. If they haven't discredited him with his supporters by now how will this help?
We need a new book to tell us what we can and can't say anymore, since everyday there is a new word or phrase that needs to be banned because it offends somebody. Regressivism is so much fun.
"fight like hell"
I wonder how many times Biden said those exact same words?
Ownlife oldthink.
The takeover of the Chinese Communist Party is almost total.
The unpersoning and censorship campaign has resolved any doubt:
1. The election was rigged
2. The CCP deliberately released the virus.
You engage in an unpersoning and censorship campaign to punish telling the truth.
Democratic leaders were confident it would pass, and pressured Republican lawmakers to vote with them to beseech the vice president, who is said to be opposed to using the powers outlined in the Constitution, to do so.
It's such a slam dunk they are begging republicans to commit political suicide? If they have the votes, why do they need Pence and the 25th amendment?
"as Republicans blocked a separate move to formally call on Vice President Mike Pence to strip him of power under the 25th Amendment"
Oh, they did? Good. I'd like that one reserved for a slightly stricter definition of "unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office" than "We hate you and think you're doing a shit job."
We'll "be descending" into Newspeak? Is it not patent that that ship is way out at sea already?
When Apple and Google pulled Parler, I knew where we were headed. I didn't expect Amazon to act quite as fast as they did, but that they would act as they did was a foregone conclusion. I have no idea exactly how we're going to get the rest of the way to our "It's A Good Life" cornfield, but it looks as if we're headed there at breakneck speed.
Oh, but in contrast to the story, we don't have to plaster on huge fake smiles because we have these handy masks to hide behind.
Since I would never have predicted--even a month ago--where we are today, I suppose my predictions about the future are of questionable value.
That said, I'm having a hard time seeing two-thirds of the Senate voting to convict.
If I'm right, I guess this is nothing but theater.
Or the basis for future imprisonment of senators who vote to acquit.
Wake me when it's over. Or maybe don't.
Imagine how short Senator Warren’s speeches would have been without the word “fight” in them.
Joe Biden is the Manchurian candidate, literally.
What’s next, Althouse?
The CCP is going to hold you to account for your comments section.
You’re a very clever political actor. Think you can finesse it?
Lawmakers also decided to cite specific language from Mr. Trump’s speech last Wednesday, inciting the crowd, quoting him saying: 'If you don’t fight like hell, you’re not going to have a country anymore.'"
Really?
Damn, it's going to be fun collecting the quotes from all the Democrats who said things just like that, or worse, and bringing articles of impeachment against all of them.
Some GOP House Reps are going to have a lot of fun over the next 2 years
By Jove, I think she’s getting it...
Incitement to violence:
Fight On for ol’ SC
Our men Fight On to victory.
Our Alma Mater dear, looks up to you
Fight On and win for ol’ SC
Fight On to victory. Fight On!
Social Justice:
Bow down to Washington,
Bow down to Washington.
Mighty are the men who wear the purple and the gold
Joyfully we welcome them within the victor's fold
We will carve our name in the hall of fame
To preserve the memory of our devotion.
So, heaven help the foes of Washington
They're trembing at the feet of mighty Washington
Our boys are there with bells,
Their fighting blood excels,
It's harder to push them over the line
Than pass the Dardenelles.
So, victory's the cry of Washington
Our leather lungs together with a rah, rah, rah!
And o'er the land, the loyal band will
Sing the glory of Washington forever!
They left out the time when the mob reached the Cap and Trump tweets that Pence didn't have the courage to defend the Constitution.
Which is idiotic on its face because they were doing exactly as the document prescribes.
The vanguard in the Capitol started yelling where's Pence, we want Pence.
Not explicit directions from Trump but ugly and damning.
The evidence and timing is gone - thanks, Jack.
If removal from office is the goal, isn't the indisputable fact that the President pressured VP Pence to engage in an unconstitutional act in itself a violation of his oath of office, and hence impeachable? This would seem to be a much cleaner set of facts to prove vs. something more nebulous like incitement.
It looks like democrats didn't even need to rig the election. The strategy to gaslight the population for 4 years and now threaten anyone who opposes them seems to be working just fine.
JPS said...
"as Republicans blocked a separate move to formally call on Vice President Mike Pence to strip him of power under the 25th Amendment"
Oh, they did?
The move required unanimous consent, and a GOP Congresscritter from WVa objected. So now it requires a vote.
I look forward to seeing which GOP "Reps" want to nuke their careers by voting for it
Ben said...
If removal from office is the goal, isn't the indisputable fact that the President pressured VP Pence to engage in an unconstitutional act in itself a violation of his oath of office, and hence impeachable?
Who says what Trump pushed for is unconstitutional?
So, we get to impeach any President who supports a law that the Supreme Court strikes down as unconstitutional? And impeach any member of Congress who votes for that law?
Cool! So, everyone on the other side fo "Citizens Untied" gets impeached? Everyone who supports and Federal "gun control" laws that get overturned gets impeached?
Sounds good! Lets go!
Nancy Pelosi is Humpty Dumpty:
"When I use a word,’ Humpty Dumpty said in rather a scornful tone, ‘it means just what I choose it to mean — neither more nor less.’
’The question is,’ said Alice, ‘whether you can make words mean so many different things.’
’The question is,’ said Humpty Dumpty, ‘which is to be master — that’s all."
Why not, they have already impeached him for a phone call asking another country to reopen their criminal investigation into US citizens that the prior administration illegally pressured them into ending.
So it only makes sense that they also impeach him for not starting\instigating a protest that resulted in the police(?) shooting an innocent protester.
Just because you can literally impeach the President of the US for "being" (all it takes is the votes, reason/cause does not come into it) does not mean you should.
Biden’s campaign slogan was “Fight for the soul of America”
Blogger pacwest said...
One week to go. Someone please explain what the objective of this is. What kind of backroom stategy is taking place?
They are deathly afraid of Trump. Look at the left wing trolls they have turned loose. The impeachment thing is about 2024. They are afraid, if he ran he would win. Even the huge vote fraud was a close call this time.
You won't get an argument from me that placing the election on Pence was the dumbest bit of BS from Trump. Talk about selling false hope.
I got a text from a friend who wanted me to pray for Pence - as If Pence could flip the election. Now I do think massive fraud took place- but I also recognize the reality that there wasn't a good enough team in place (most in the law profession were harassed and threatened out of joining any effort) to fight for election integrity.
That's all we want. If Biden won fair and square, fine. It really does not look that way.
We are so screwed.
Trump-hate sells.
The corrupt left want to destroy Trump in every way.
That's how the Soviets roll. *
This is rapidly escalating towards war. Pelosi has been demented by hatred for years, what excuse do the rest of the Democrats have?
In some places, Biden's slogan was written "Battle for the Soul of the Nation"
They are going to impeach Trump on the word "Fight"?? that's kind of hilarious.
Biden images of the slogan
As a matter of law, the quoted language does NOT met the legal standard of incitement to riot.
Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden has probably used similar “fighting” language.
pressured Republican lawmakers to vote with them to beseech the vice president
"beseech" the Vice-President? Isn't that like asking for the Vice President to participate in a coup, an insurrection? Oh, wait; its only an insurrection if the sitting head of government calls for a peaceful demonstration that it gets construed as knowingly calling for the ignoring a democratically made decision.
Ann:
Did you teach Brandenburg v. Ohio?
Seemed like they were fighting like hell.
I’ll say this again, because it doesn’t seem to sink in.
Focusing on the day of voting as the source of the fraud is a misdirection.
An election that takes place while one side, the Democrats, is fielding paramilitary forces and inciting riots, looting, arson and cop murder in the streets of our cities, is a fraud.
The entire year leading up to the election was a psy-ops campaign that paid off.
The Democrats won by extortion. They put a gun to our heads and said: “We’ll stop the violence if you vote for us.”
This weird concept of acceding to the Democrat’s possession and use of paramilitary forces... I don’t get it. Why aren’t you seeing the outcome of this?
Descend into Newspeak? PC, hate speech, cultural appropriation, mostly peaceful protests, white privilege, RAAAAAAAAACISM everywhere but only by whites, we are descended deep in an Orwellian hole already, yet the Left keeps digging.
Reports that Antifa infiltrated will go largely un-reported by the hack press.
If removal from office is the goal, isn't the indisputable fact that the President pressured VP Pence to engage in an unconstitutional act in itself a violation of his oath of office, and hence impeachable?
If is so indisputable and a fact; perhaps you can name the Unconstitutional Act? Democrats provided evidence in Dec 2019 that you can impeach a President for ordering a ham sandwich. But civilized people expect better arguments than assertion that things are "indisputable" and are "fact", when neither the fact was described and those who might object are ignored.
This should be an interesting impeachment. Will there be witnesses? Will any Republican members get to cross-examine anyone? Will they be able to call their own witnesses? Will the President be represented by counsel?
How long will Speaker Pelosi wait before delivering any articles of impeachment to the Senate? Will undelivered remain effective when the sitting Congress is dissolved? If articles of impeachment get to Majority Leader McConnell's desk before the current term ends, will any rules or procedures adopted be binding on the income Senate -- or will they have to start over? How long will any Senate trial run? Remember how, just last January, Senator Schumer was explaining how important it is to have witnesses testify in such a trial?
"They are deathly afraid of Trump. Look at the left wing trolls they have turned loose."
No, Doc. They are afraid of 75 million voters. The impeachment is to get him to agree not to run again. .
"beseech" the Vice-President? Isn't that like asking for the Vice President to participate in a coup, an insurrection? Oh, wait; its only an insurrection if the sitting head of government calls for a peaceful demonstration that it gets construed as knowingly calling for the ignoring a democratically made decision.
Oh great point.
On Wisconsin, On Wisconsin
Fight on for her fame
Fight, fellows, fight fight fight
We'll win this game.
We descended into Newspeak a long time ago...
I think my favorite non-incitement peaceful protest event was Kathy Griffith holding Trump bloody severed head. And being applauding by the left.
Unless the Republicans in the senate completely collapse and roll over on their bellies like Romney, there is no way 2/3 of the Senate votes to convict.
If that does happen, it is finally time to ditch the Republican Party and found a new one.
Blogger Rusty said...
"They are deathly afraid of Trump. Look at the left wing trolls they have turned loose."
No, Doc. They are afraid of 75 million voters. The impeachment is to get him to agree not to run again.
I agree but they are convinced only he can get us motivated and that might be true.
ST at 12:26 has it right.
One may choose to ignore it, to avoid accepting unpleasant truths about how evil and cynical government officials can be, but then you’re living in a constructed fantasy to manage your emotions.
I assume this effort is to distract us from whatever is they're actually scheming to do, presumably something to do with the "stimulus". Or maybe just to keep us from looking at the early days of the Biden presidency, although I'm sure it is going to be an energetic rollout of exciting new initiatives.
If Trump was really looking to incite an insurrection, he failed miserably. That's not offered as evidence that he wasn't trying to do it, it's intended as a caution. Not that there might be a more successful one, just that there are other ways to oppose vindictive over-reach without breaking the law.
This post seems to be missing its "Lawsuits I hope..." tag.
pacwest said...Someone please explain what the objective of this is. What kind of backroom stategy is taking place? Fucking nuts is pretty high on my list, but it has to be more than that.
It is:
1. Encouragement of Republicans in Congress to commit political suicide which many will;
2. Encouragement of the Deep State to refuse to release any documents that Trump will declassify;
3. Drama, drama, drama to take the spotlight off of other mroe insidious actions by the DNC and
4. Their insane hatred and fear of Trump.
"We'll be descending into Newspeak."
Welcome to the party, Althouse.
You know, early last summer I started stating that, based on their performance over the previous 4-8 years, and where they are threatening to take this country, there should not be another Democrat elected for two generations. Figuring it'll take at least two generations to clean out the mess that is the Democratic Party.
So what happened? In the House, the Republicans made great gains, and very nearly took it over. Then Biden swiped the Presidency without even leaving his house. (can I still question it online?). And then the Georgia Senate race was overcome with 800,000 mail-in ballots that came in from Singapore.
IF we get another chance to clean them out, it has to get done. What's coming down the pike from these people will turn this country into California. And when that happens, there will be nowhere for any of us to run to. Not even Californians.
Are we going to outlaw the word "fight"?! We'll be descending into Newspeak.
The deuce you say.
"One week to go. Someone please explain what the objective of this is. What kind of backroom stategy is taking place?"
To trivialize and render impotent the process of impeachment itself. The next GOP Congress will have no problem finding a reason to impeach the corrupt Donk du jour. This proactively removes the teeth from impeachment. Partisans in the Senate will have no problem scoffing at whatever the House sends. Impeachment is, effectively, dead as a constitutional remedy.
Dr. Althouse: Are we going to outlaw the word "fight"?! We'll be descending into Newspeak.
This observation comes, at a bare minimum, 47 years too late.
The Oliver Cromwell solution will still be available.
serious questions
are the Dem's TRYING to turn Trump into a martyr?
are the Dem's TRYING to make Half of the country Fighting mad?
do the Dem's think these are GOOD Ideas?
do the Chinese think that these are GOOD Ideas?
I guess they look at Venezuela, and see How Good things are going there?
Blogger tim maguire said...
As always, the left over-plays its hand. Republicans will control the House in 2022 and the whole thing in 2024. And the only time the country will be run well is from 2022 to 2024, when government is divided.
Given the current state of the southern border and the priority that will be given to immigration amnesty I think this is optimistic.
“ We'll be descending into Newspeak”
We already have.
I see that Althouse the Trump Whisperer wants full pay to the last day.
Covering the important issues, I just want to be thankful that the DC football team now has a wealth of available names. Though Capitol Raiders is taken (at least Raiders in taken) we have Capitol Rioters, DC Insurrection, Capitol Flashmob, DC Attack, Capitol Destructors, DC Fear. Then, too, other countries will soon be observing how brilliant Joe Biden is and wondering at how free America is. A wealth of good things will be talked about and about on Twitter and no bad things. As the song says: "Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Day /Plenty of sunshine coming my way." Thanks, everyone who contributed.
>tim maguire said...
As always, the left over-plays its hand. Republicans will control the House in 2022 and the whole thing in 2024. And the only time the country will be run well is from 2022 to 2024, when government is divided.<<
20+ million newly-minted "American" Democrat voters of Latin American provenance will beg to differ with you.
Republicans have won their last presidential election.
Descending into Newspeak?
Remember when the folks at MerriamWebster.com changed the definition of a word during the Barrett confirmation hearings, to support the claims that her use of a common and unobjectionable phrase made her a bigot?
Good times.
(CAPTCHA seems to have gone nuts -- it's started replacing the pictures I click with new ones, very slowly. It feels a bit like a psychological experiment is being run.)
The fact that Trump accomplished so much more than any dem president with gale force opposition for all 4 years is another embarrasment to these career politicians. Real people recognize this fact. His trolls are essentially children in adult bodies. Let me call the WAAAAAAAAAMBULANCE. Or as we used to say, act your age but don't leave a puddle!
Why all this blithering about the 25th amendment. Removing a president via the 25th is harder than impeaching him. Isn't it? Am I missing something? Has no one actually read the amendment?
I vote for "The Washington Virtue Signalers" as the new name for the new name of the Washington Redskins.
Hispanics come into this country to work hard and save their money to buy a small business. Of course, they will support Biden's Endless Lockdown, Good Taxes and Regulation, Regulation, Regulation since it's all good for small businesses. Anyhow, even if 50% of them lose the money they saved over five years of endless work and overtime, they won't notice as long as they get a chance to vote for pronouns and using the word Latinix. Yay.
Impeachment requires passing the Impeachment resolution in the House, then getting the Senate to hold the trial. The Senate won't start the trial until after Trump has left office, so the impeachment is moot, since it only applies to office holders, not former office holders.
I'd argue that the raised fists that the Dems like to put on their protest signs is incitement.
Dershowitz disagrees
Kamala Harris must be impeached for inciting riots last summer. Riots to pressure the voters of the cities to vote Democrat. Vote Democrat or the riots won't stop.
Let the fun begin. Watch the Dems twist themselves into a Gordian knot trying to show the difference between Republican rhetoric vs Democrat rhetoric.
Mike of Snoqualmie said...
I vote for "The Washington Virtue Signalers" as the new name for the new name of the Washington Redskins.
Or maybe we could replace the "referee's whistle" which includes a word of Nordic origin (hwistlian) with a "referee's virtue signaler" which safely originates in sociological jargon.
"I got a text from a friend who wanted me to pray for Pence - as If Pence could flip the election."
Even more unbelievable, as if praying has any efficacy!
History won't be nice to these Democrats. Sucks for us though.
"Even more unbelievable, as if praying has any efficacy!"
Right on the money Cookie, for non-believers, that is.
You may want to escape your bubble and ask believers if any of their prayers have been answered.
Blogger GingerBeer said...
The Oliver Cromwell solution will still be available.
The last competent US general has retired. A few years ago. Mattis was on the Board of Theranos and trying to get the military to buy their sham technology. George Schultz was there, too, but he is 100 years old.
Fear not, DEPLORABLES, The Democrat Party is merely sealing it's fate.
If you haven't given me your support before, please consider doing so, after you see this is true.
"We'll be descending into Newspeak."
'BE'?
We've been there for a long time now AA.
Mike of Snoqualmie said...
Kamala Harris must be impeached for inciting riots last summer. Riots to pressure the voters of the cities to vote Democrat. Vote Democrat or the riots won't stop.
While you're at it you need to shut down Twitter and reddit, Antifa routinely uses them to plan their activities.
Impeachment requires passing the Impeachment resolution in the House, then getting the Senate to hold the trial. The Senate won't start the trial until after Trump has left office, so the impeachment is moot, since it only applies to office holders, not former office holders.
You really think they care? It's like these people writing "Brandenburg vs Ohio". SCOTUS decisions don't apply to Articles of Impeachment. So if the Senate decides to take up Articles of Impeachment passed by this Congress the first convened on 3rd January 2021 after 21 January 2021; what power do you think stops them?
Even if John Roberts were so inclined; what authority does he have other than to follow the rules approved by the Senate? Pelosi has claimed the purpose of the impeachment is to prevent Trump from running again. What standing will citizen Trump have with SCOTUS? Does Trump get to make that case now, or 4 years when he is barred from running in a primary?
This is where we are by thinking the rules matter to those making the rules. It's like being upset about being told to cancel Thanksgiving plans because of covid, while the health official making those rules vacations in Mexico. You'll still be held accountable for breaking the law, and they'll come back from vacation and retain their position.
"As always, the left over-plays its hand. Republicans will control the House in 2022 and the whole thing in 2024."
Who will stop them from stealing 2022 as well?
Refusing to concede, telling people that he definitely won this stolen, fraudulent, landslide election and telling people they need to "fight like hell" is fundamentally inciting in a way that conceding for the moment and telling people they need to "fight like hell" to win in the midterms and 4 years later isn't.
Twitter stock has plunged 12% today. It lost $5B in value.
The Crack Emcee said...
Fear not, DEPLORABLES, The Democrat Party is merely sealing it's fate.
I agree with you. I have been saying for the last couple of weeks that just like Cuomo and DeBlasio are driving people out of NY and Newsome driving them out of California, the Democrats are driving people out of the Democrat party. Of course, McConnell, Graham, and others are also driving people out of the Republican party.
The Deplorables party is getting bigger and bigger.
It's still the wrong charge, though. Incitement is what's fresh on our mind, but entertaining the notion that a sitting VP has veto power over which Electoral Votes to count or not was the bigger threat to the republic.
Even more unbelievable, as if praying has any efficacy!
Even if God doesn't exist, it has a placebo effect.
Mike @ 2:23. I'm flummoxed by this--some people seem to think that an officeholder can be impeached after leaving office. Even if this were true (is it?), how can it be perceived as anything but kicking a man (and his 74 million voters) when he's down? Are these people insane (well, OK, yes they are)? Are they morons? Or do they really want to provoke more violent resistance? Related point: Will this torrent of censorship end any way but badly? I saw earlier that Facebook has now virtually shut down Ron Paul's page. It's very alarming--and I've never been an alarmist.
Imagine in January 2001, the Vice President just not choosing to count Florida's electors.
Anyone who sees a bigger threat to the Constitution than, charitably, has a massive blind spot.
Still, don't let the wrong charges stop you from making the right call.
Witness said...
It's still the wrong charge, though. Incitement is what's fresh on our mind, but entertaining the notion that a sitting VP has veto power over which Electoral Votes to count or not was the bigger threat to the republic.
And the genius Pelosi fought that with....trying to pressure the sitting VP into invoking the 25th Amendment. While she also tried to tell the joint chiefs not to let Trump use the nuclear codes. So an even bigger threat to the republic.
"https://www.forbes.com/sites/nicholasreimann/2021/01/09/house-republicans-ask-for-biden-to-help-stop-trump-impeachment/?sh=2f49ecdd835a"
"Did you teach Brandenburg v. Ohio?"
Yes.
Rush pointed out today that the media has failed to play Trump's speech that is supposed to be the incitement. Clearly, the reason is that there was no incitement.
On Friday, Ann Althouse did the work the media refused to do. She listed her idea of the most inciting statements. Of course, her point was that none of them rise to the level of incitement. To refresh our memory, here they are going from least to worst:
"7. We’re going walk down to the Capitol, and we’re going to cheer on our brave senators, and congressmen and women. We’re probably not going to be cheering so much for some of them because you’ll never take back our country with weakness. You have to show strength, and you have to be strong.
"6. To use a favorite term that all of you people really came up with, we will stop the steal…. We will not let them silence your voices.
"5. The Republicans have to get tougher. You’re not going to have a Republican party if you don’t get tougher.
"4. [W]e’re going to have somebody in there that should not be in there and our country will be destroyed, and we’re not going to stand for that.
"3. We will never give up. We will never concede, it doesn’t happen. You don’t concede when there’s theft involved.
"2. We’re not going to let it happen. Not going to let it happen.
"1. Together we are determined to defend and preserve government of the people, by the people and for the people."
As usual, the argument by the media is that everything Trump says is a dog whistle. For example, they are say that his announcement that he would not attend the Biden inauguration is a dog whistle to start another riot. If he would have said he is attending, they would say that was a dog whistle too.
"This post seems to be missing its "Lawsuits I hope..." tag."
It's not a lawsuit.
I don't have a position on the impeachment, though. I need to know if there was a plan to breach the Capitol and if Trump knew about it. If the answer on those 2 points is yes, I would support impeachment. It would provide a very different context for understanding his remarks, which on their face seem to refer to a peaceful but passionate street protest.
Mike of Snoqualmie said...
"Twitter stock has plunged 12% today. It lost $5B in value."
I pulled the plug on it. Everyone else should, too - seriously.
Make Dorsey feel it - and like his life's diminished for it.
The Oliver Cromwell solution will still be available.
They're going to send us to Connacht? I'm okay with that. That's where my great-grandfather William Burke was from. Arguably the most beautiful part of Ireland.
Bags already packed!
RichAndSceptical said...
"I agree with you. I have been saying for the last couple of weeks that just like Cuomo and DeBlasio are driving people out of NY and Newsome driving them out of California, the Democrats are driving people out of the Democrat party. Of course, McConnell, Graham, and others are also driving people out of the Republican party.
The Deplorables party is getting bigger and bigger."
I left the Democrats in 2004, specifically over the advance of The NewAge Movement, and that nasty turn the party took under Bush.
I left the Republicans in 2014, specifically because the 2012 election "autopsy" told them what I've said, here, a billion times, angrily and with good nature - and even had to point out, again, yesterday, upon my arrival back: the GOP (not me, or other blacks) has a race problem - and that's not good for the party that freed the slaves and wants us back.
I'm an Independent now, after attending Tea Parties, and America's there - everyone ideologically from David Duke to Ice Cube - so there *might* be room for me, somewhere, politically. I like how things are going, so far. I'm not against storming the Capital, after 30+ years of the Democrats stalling on justice for Bill Clinton's rape accusers, and more.
I've got a 30+ year laundry list of political sins the Democrat Party should NOT be allowed to get away with, or capitalize on, and nothing they say about Trump's five years in politics can make it go away.
"I don't have a position on the impeachment, though. I need to know if there was a plan to breach the Capitol and if Trump knew about it."
LOL Did anyone fucking intimate a plan? Including the Democrats calling for impeachment?
What sophistry.
MayBee said...
And the genius Pelosi fought that with....trying to pressure the sitting VP into invoking the 25th Amendment. While she also tried to tell the joint chiefs not to let Trump use the nuclear codes. So an even bigger threat to the republic.
Not within an order of magnitude.
pacwest said...
One week to go. Someone please explain what the objective of this is. What kind of backroom stategy is taking place? Fucking nuts is pretty high on my list, but it has to be more than that. If they haven't discredited him with his supporters by now how will this help?
1/11/21, 11:55 AM
Power. The ability to compel people, through rhetoric, a legal system or force, to stand on one leg while touching their nose is very compelling: it has a drug-like addiction.
Michael K: I do not refer to the Enlish Civil War, but rather to Cromwell's treatment after death. Barely two years later, with Charles II returned from exil, Cromwell's corpse was disintered, hung in chains, beheaded, and his head placed on a pike. Is there any doubt this "solution" would be supported by a large number of Democrarts regardless of the success of impeachment?
We must get rid of Trump they said for four years. Now it's destroy him before he gets away.
I need to know if there was a plan to breach the Capitol and if Trump knew about it. If the answer on those 2 points is yes.
Breathtaking. Positively breathtaking.
Lord Clanfiddle said...
Are these people insane (well, OK, yes they are)? Are they morons? Or do they really want to provoke more violent resistance?
I think they're hoping they do so they can use it as a basis for more political theater.
The Democrats trying to impeach Trump while their fascist tech financers use their monopoly to silence any who don't follow the Democrat party line is the true sedition.
Now that he has been accused, Trump should organize a peaceful protest and march on the capitol.
that's pretty thin stuff. But the new standard is, if the House dislikes the President - impeach and Logic and tradition be damned.
Its all about Power baby. If the D's have the power, they will use it. They don't care if the R President was elected or not. Its the new standard. As shown before the Democrats in the Senate think the same way.
Its Banana Republic time. Courtesy of the Mitt Romney and the Democrats.
The black chairman of Homeland security is demanding Cruz and Hawley be on put on a "No fly" list for "questioning the election".
The black man as Stalinist.
John Hinderaker at Powerline has come up with an excellent response to the Pelosi Impeachment Machine (when you drop in a quarter, Jerry Nadler pops up waving a resolution):
When the GOP next retakes the House, they should impeach Obama for saying "If they bring a knife to a fight, we bring a gun."
Tote up all that Michael Brown/George Floyd death and damage and lay it at Obama's feet.
Just looked at the weather forecast for D.C. Snow is forecast for the early morning hours of the 20th. One inch of snow will paralyze the city. Should be lit for the inauguration.
Roughcoat: Start unpacking! https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/ireland-had-world-s-highest-covid-19-infection-rate-last-week-1.4455609
The hunters and judges doth protest too much. They've suffered self-inebriation from consuming rotten peaches.
Some will say that it doesn't meet the legal definition of incitement or that the subsequent mob rush doesn't meet the legal definition of insurrection, but we're way beyond sticking to the constitution of the law at this point. In their minds the ends justify the means and this has been the goal since Trump won the election in 2016.
"He also willfully made statements that, in context, encouraged—and foreseeably resulted in—lawless action at the Capitol[...]"
I suspect the addition of the weasel-word intensifier "willfully" is evidence of the frivolity of their move to impeach. Why add that word? To make your case even harder to prove?
Trump says I have the best impeachments.Even the sycophants are cheering! Miss Lyndsey sold him down the river that's our lindsey can always count on him for a turn with the wind .Powell quits the Facist party and two others saying g the same ,way to go Don, thanks for Presidency. House and Senate couldnt have done it without you.Sleepy Joe puts the lights out on the Mussolini wanna be and the army..Next!
This is only about 2022 political ads.
"https://www.forbes.com/sites/nicholasreimann/2021/01/09/house-republicans-ask-for-biden-to-help-stop-trump-impeachment/?sh=2f49ecdd835a"
I've said before that I hope that's the game here. Play all the silly reindeer games, then Biden stops all the silliness, so the press can write their articles of how he is uniting the country.
That hope was squashed when he started referencing US Senators as Nazis.
"I want to make sure we’re going to fight like hell by investing in America first,” said Biden. He ticked off energy, biotech, advanced materials and artificial intelligence as … NYT 12/20
I need to know if there was a plan to breach the Capitol and if Trump knew about it
What is your Fingerspitzengefühl and what sources of information are you using?
"We'll be descending into Newspeak."
You're looking in the wrong direction. We'd have to climb to get back to something as mild as Newspeak from where we currently are.
Given the speed at which censorship and repression is spreading, impeachment is looking like a distraction from the bigger picture.
No one remembers that Pelosi called for an uprising? And that Kamala called for the riots to continue? And "the resistance" was a term used thousands of times, as if this was occupied France?
No of course not, we are supposed to act like goldfish with a 15 minute memory span (just a fig of speech, I know goldfish are smarter than that).
Hey Ann, do we need any actual evidence of Trump planning the breaching of congress before we start another investigation? Or is just assertions without evidence by the media and Democrats now the law? You tell me, you're the Constitutional Law professor.
I thought "fight like hell" sounded too much like ordinary politics to make the list. We fight for our rights, we fight in political campaigns, we fight in court. Are we going to outlaw the word "fight"?! We'll be descending into Newspeak.
It reminds me of the left's fake complaints over the words "target" and "campaign" after the Gabby Giffords shooting. It turned out they were completely wrong for asserting a political motivation at all but even had that been accurate their focus on mundane language as their evidence proved their only interest is blaming their enemies.
So nothing has changed.
Every goddamn office-seeker on either side hits the "I'll FIGHT for you, blah, blah, blah ..." in their campaign TV ads every election. I have taken to mocking this tired old trope every time election season rolls around.
And no, I do not expect Biden and the libs to be too ashamed to try to hang Trump for using this same locution. dems and shame have not occupied the same space since Slick Willy got hoovered in the Oval Office.
For all the folks confidently predicting a Republican takeover of the House in 2022, let me ask you: now that the dems have audaciously stolen a presidential election with impunity, what makes you think the dems will 'let' any Republicans win any elections, ever again? Do you think whoever pulls the strings on the Biden puppet will let the Rs sweep in and immediately impeach him?
Not bloody likely. The dems just pulled the biggest scam in history. Only civil war is going to right that wrong.
I don't see how this helps Biden.
The Left conducts a Coup, stealing the election to oust Trump.
Then the Left charges Trump with insurrection.
They would send the bill for bullets/rope/lethal injection mix to his family afterward if they could play the game out to their desired outcome.
Doug: You're wrong. "Republicans" will keep winning elections regularly. "Republicans" like McCain and Romney. They'll be utterly controlled opposition, and they won't lift a blessed finger to do anything for conservatives - in fact, they'll sell us out as fast and as often as possible - but they'll be "Republican". The show, the farce, that conservatives have *any* representation in the Swamp will continue.
So you would have to say that no *conservative* will ever win election again. But to be accurate you'd pretty much have to go back to roughly 1992 and start from there.
The corrolary to my outline above, of course, is that despite all the focus elsewhere, the most consequential event of the past week was Mike Pence's decision to say "no".
This will be lost on many.
And, to bring this back full circle, I am compelled once again to refer to this historical quote:
"Will no one rid me of this turbulent priest?"
An actual monarch, who plausibly didn't mean to incite his followers to murder or know of their plan, was nevertheless publicly whipped for his acknowledged responsibility in the resulting death.
Knowledge and intent are not required to bear political responsibility, even if they are our standards for legal culpability.
It will be interesting to find out if TDS has serious withdrawal symptoms. On a serious note, it is a mistake for Democrats to establish this precedent -- that impeachment does not require any sober consideration of evidence.
Doug, 7:04:
"let me ask you: now that the dems have audaciously stolen a presidential election with impunity,"
I'm not even convinced they have. (Pauses to duck rotten fruit.) But I'm pretty sure they'll cheat like hell next time, serene in the knowledge that any accusation of fraud will be met with a chorus of housebroken Republicans, Democrats and the media [normally I use an Oxford comma] yelling, "Baseless accusations! Just like Trump used to incite an insurrection!"
I mean, let's face it. You'd have to have an awful lot of reverence for process and norms over results not to.
The House is apparently going to impeach Trump without an investigation, without a hearing, just based on media coverage. It’s only an indictment, they say, he’ll get a trial in the Senate.
I predict that the Senate, after the Democrats take control, will railroad Trump and not allow him to present a defense. He will want to offer evidence that the election was in fact stolen, and they will rule it all out of order. Then they’ll vote to convict.
Then we’ll get to the interesting open legal question: is an impeached president barred from seeking elective office, like the Senate or the presidency. Legal scholars are divided on this. If Trump tries to run, and some state official won’t put him on the ballot , Trump. Will sue that official and eventually the Supreme Court will decide. I don’t think it’s possible to predict how the Supreme Court would rule on that issue.
Douglas at 9:20. Yes, but they need 67 votes to remove. (Or can they change the Constitution in the next 10 days?)
"Inciting violence" is joining "insurrection" and "sedition" along with old-timers "racist" and "fascist" in the Newspeak dictionary under synonyms for "Opposing the Hive" and "Excuses for us to bring the Mailed Fist down on you head, you uppity peasant."
Good grief, even though on the west coast it's still 1/11/21. So, even if Congress is working overtime tonight, there are only 8 1/2 days to push through an impeachment and conviction. What a bunch of horse-hooey.
For the moment, it's the Democrats, but, really, is there anything possibly stupider than a Politician?
@Douglas
I predict that, as laid out in the Constitution and as happened in the previous impeachment, the Chief Justice will preside over the trial, and that anything he rules "out of order" won't be reasonably laid at the feet of Senate Democrats.
It will still be unreasonably laid at their feet by some.
It seems like a lifetime ago, but R-leaning commenters used to be better at this.
Seems like there should be a name for the loss of basic civics knowledge.
Maybe something like... Trump Derangement Syndrome. Maybe that's too on the nose.
"I'll FIGHT for you, blah, blah, blah ..."
I contribute campaign money despite the garbage fund raising letters. I resent being treated like a milk cow. Both Democrats and Republicans are much the same in that regard, it is hard to take them seriously. Maybe it is all a scam.
"d they'll come back from vacation and retain their positions"
Until they don't.
Waaaaaaay too much linear extrapolation going on these days.
‘We'll be descending into Newspeak.‘
Ann, WTF do you think is the agenda. Full inciting violence by MSM. C’mon that waif-ty gait does not match with your putative intellectual heft.
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