December 6, 2020

"Today, it’s Netflix and other major streaming services that play the role which studios did in the nineteen-thirties and forties..."

"... like the studios, streaming services control the spigot of viewing, and, like the studios, the major services are vertically integrated, controlling both the means of production and the means of distribution. Netflix both produced 'Mank' and is the place where the film will be seen—the company, in effect, owns a thousand-screen multiplex, present in every subscriber’s home. If Fincher, in 'Mank,' looks so ruefully at the intersection of media power and political power, it’s because, in the age of streaming, the reign of behemoth studios and their monopoly has, in effect, returned."


The movie is about Herman J. Mankiewicz, who wrote the screenplay for "Citizen Kane," and the story is told in the same manner as "Citizen Kane." 

Now that I have at long last subscribed to Netflix, I have to consider whether to watch these things that are only on Netflix. Before, I was saved a lot of trouble. Some of these shows feel like assignments. And before I was a subscriber, I was able to look on calmly and know that I'm not taking that course. I don't have to do that homework. 

I did watch the first 5 minutes of "Mank." Yeah, this bed frame is way up in my face and I know why — because it's something like what Orson Welles did in "Citizen Kane." And, oh, yeah, that's Gary Oldman in the bed, and he's supposed to be such a great actor. And who are all these other characters bustling about the room supposed to be and why should I care... or just answer the second question first and if you can't answer you don't have to answer. It's like a bad dream where you can't do the work and then wake up and realize you don't have to do that work. It was never your work to begin with. So let's just watch another episode of "The Crown," the show I subscribed to Netflix because I wanted to keep watching.

But if "Mank" were a movie in the theater, I'd only be watching the first 5 minutes because I got motivated to leave my house and to buy a ticket just for that one thing, and now I was in my seat and settled in for what I'd made a tangible commitment to. So I'd do the work of paying attention and trying to get interested and figure out why everything happening is important and meaningful. That's nothing like Netflix.

72 comments:

Mr. O. Possum said...

Watch "A French Village" on Amazon.

It is a seven-year long French TV show about life in a French village during the Nazi occupation.

It is the single best TV series I have ever seen.

rhhardin said...

I bail out very quickly on bad movie plot cliches. Unfortunately Amazon Prime marks those as movies I like and offers more like them.

Temujin said...

Netflix has such a pervasive algorithm that once you start looking- and worse- viewing certain shows or movies, that's all you'll start to see on their suggestion lists. Those type of shows/movies. I keep messing up my wife's algorithm by staying up late to watch grade c dystopian science fiction movies that even I can only make it through 30 minutes of before turning off. But it messes up her algorithm for British murder investigation themed movies/shows.

You'll find you spend more time clicking away from their lists than actually watching anything of note. And when you look for an older, classic, well made movie to re-watch, you'll find that Netflix does not have it.

I banter between both NF and Prime. Occasionally I feel like I've won a battle when I run into a multi-season series that I actually like. Per 'Unknown" above, I'm going to check out "A French Village" once I'm done with season six of The Vikings. It's pretty bloody and faintly follows some legends...or history. I'm not sure which.

Eleanor said...

Amazon offers you an opportunity to sample a lot of the books they offer for the Kindle. You can read the first chapter. If the book sucks you in, you can buy the book. If it doesn't, then you haven't invested much time, and you haven't spent any money. The downside is there are some very good books out there that don't suck you in that quickly, and if you decide not to finish the experience of reading them based on the sample, you've missed a good book. Netflix is a lot like that. Because watching a little bit of a movie or a series costs you no more than you've already spent, you can sample a lot of things. If the movie or the series doesn't catch your interest, you can click on something else. Studios know if you've spent 20 bucks to see a movie in a theater, the movie has to be pretty bad for most people to walk out, and even if you do, they have still have your 20 bucks. On Netflix, they have to suck you in pretty quickly for you to stay. If they show you enough things you aren't interested in, you'll decide Nwtflix isn't worth the monthly subscription price so they have to please you in the first 10 minutes or so more often than not. Stories with a slow start are less likely to get made. I do find the mindset that watching a movie or a series is an "assignment" interesting, though. Who is making the assignment?

Lincolntf said...

Speaking of assignments, I am wrapping up an Introduction to Film class for my Associate's, the Final exam is due tomorrow\ in fact. Anyway, I watched a bunch of movies I'd heard of but never seen before throughout the class. Standouts were "The Rider", "Pan's Labyrinth", "Donnie Darko" and "Moonlight". All interesting in their own way.

stlcdr said...

I’ve been a member of Netflix from almost the very beginning, getting dvds in the mail. There’s a lot of good, interesting stuff, but finding it is an issue, likewise with Amazon. Both Netflix and Amazon push their productions, obviously, as well as what people are watching (are they really?)

I won’t tell you what to watch - venn diagrams, and all that. I’ll tell people what I’m watching if it is exciting or interesting enough (has a good premise/acting, etc.)

The ability to bail out of a movie or series and be instantly watching something else: a lot of good and bad movies are not defined by that first 5 minutes.

Assistant Village Idiot said...

So everyone is assuming that in spite of all this what they really, really need in their lives is movies. I very seldom watch movies. It is a dangerous, misleading art that hacks into centuries of evolutionary response to what real people are like.

gspencer said...

"the reign of behemoth studios and their monopoly has, in effect, returned"

If I get a Netflix subscription, does a casting couch come with it?

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Althouse I did watch the first 5 minutes of "Mank." Yeah, this bed frame is way up in my face and I know why — because it's something like what Orson Welles did in "Citizen Kane." And, oh, yeah, that's Gary Oldman in the bed, and he's supposed to be such a great actor. And who are all these other characters bustling about the room supposed to be and why should I care... or just answer the second question first and if you can't answer you don't have to answer.

Hope you don't say all of this out loud while watching the show.

Because my husband does, and I generally scream at him SHUT THE F UP. or WATCH THE SHOW AND YOU MIGHT FIND OUT. OR PAUSE THE DAMNED THING IF YOU WANT TO TALK TO ME.... BUT mostly."I...DON'T....KNOW!!!!"...generally right before STFU

Actually, what is good about Netflix...and television today is the ability to stop the show, at an appropriate point and talk about these types of issues and decide together is it is worth your time to continue. Also to rewind to hear what the actors said while someone else was talking over an important plot point.

A made for Netflix show you probably would like Queens Gambit
Plus a lot of foreign TV shows from France, Russia, Australia, Turkey that are quite interesting to view in opposition to what US TV fare is.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

rhhardin said...I bail out very quickly on bad movie plot cliches. Unfortunately Amazon Prime marks those as movies I like and offers more like them.

Delete them from your watched queue. The AI program sees that you "watched" the show even if it was 4 minutes of dreck. It then assumes that since you watch that, you must like this.

You can do this better on the compute than through the lame app on your TV or streaming device.

Kay said...

I tend to dislike the content on Netflix that’s been created by Netflix, though there are exceptions to the rule. They seem to do better with nonfiction movies and shows than fictional ones.

Ann Althouse said...

"I keep messing up my wife's algorithm..."

In our Netflix account, we each have a separate icon with our name, and you go in there and establish your own persona. You don't let your choices affect the other person's suggestions.

J2 said...

Do not give Ann Althouse movie recommendations.

Her favorite movie is "My Dinner with Andre" - last I heard; maybe she has a new favorite movie.

I recommend Ann cease her Netflix subscription after she finishes "The Crown". And no longer blog about Netflix or any movie.

narciso said...

Charles dance as hearst seems an interesting casting choice so is tom burke as welles, the original is very derivative of swanbergs citizen hearst, swanberg was a left wing smear artist like gabriel sherman did to ailes.

Ann Althouse said...

"Hope you don't say all of this out loud while watching the show."

Ha ha. No, I pause if I need to talk but the thing is when I've got the state of mind I'm writing about, if I pause it won't end up being a pause. I'll be more interested in the conversation and in looking for something else.

In this particular case, I was sampling "Mank" to get an idea if I wanted to watch it. Netflix was pushing it at me. What I really wanted to watch was another episode of "The Crown" or the TV comedy series that I've been watching alongside "The Crown." In Darkmonth during the lockdown, I'm able to watch an hour drama and a half hour comedy every day. Ordinarily, I prefer clicking around on my computer/iPad and not committing to anything!

Michael K said...

Former NetFlix subscriber. I also used to get the DVDs but I just don't watch TV anymore. College football and golf and "Ice Road Truckers" is about it.

Sam L. said...

I just watch TCM and my DVDs.

Earnest Prole said...

Now that you have at long last subscribed to Netflix, I could make all kinds of recommendations, but let me offer just one: Get Me Roger Stone.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

"Hope you don't say all of this out loud while watching the show."

Althouse Ha ha. No, I pause if I need to talk but the thing is when I've got the state of mind I'm writing about, if I pause it won't end up being a pause. I'll be more interested in the conversation and in looking for something else.

Whew...thank goodness :-)

Don't forget to delete the stuff you hate from the Amazon and Netflix watched queues or they will just continue to shove similar stuff at you.

I Have Misplaced My Pants said...

So Netflix is accelerating two processes already in place which undermine our ability to participate in the world in intelligent ways: lack of attention span and siloing of information and culture.

Woo hoo! Are we having fun yet?

Are the Amish hiring, anyone know?

For the record, there are MUCH better ways to approach the film arts than letting Netflix decide what you can and should see. Use a site like Letterboxd to keep track of what you want to watch and to access extensive lists of movies and TV from other times and places. Also use lists written before the current religious fundamentalism that is taking over arts and culture such as this one. Your attention is too precious to let Netflix direct it for you.

I Have Misplaced My Pants said...

A made for Netflix show you probably would like Queens Gambit

Everyone is raving about this and I watched the trailer, and just the you go grrrrrrrrrl tone of the woman telling the tournament check in guys which division to put her in turned me off. Does everything have to be so goddamned heavy handed and messagy? Yuck.

Iman said...

Netflix sux.

MountainMan said...

@DBQ:

"Also to rewind to hear what the actors said while someone else was talking over an important plot point."
We tend to turn on closed captioning for many shows, especially the British ones, where the use of slang or a lot of mumbled dialog is hard to understand.

"Plus a lot of foreign TV shows from France, Russia, Australia, Turkey that are quite interesting to view in opposition to what US TV fare is."
Agree with this 100%. We recently watched "To the Lake" from Russia and thought it was very good. Also, a crime show from Finland, "Bordertown", is very interesting.

Some of the best recommendations of shows to watch on Amazon and Netflix have come from commenters here on Althouse. I just added "A French Village" to our queue on Amazon. I would not have known about it otherwise.

Another good place to find some good TV shows to stream is to have a PBS Passport and use the PBS app. We have watched a number of good TV series, usually police dramas, that were shown on Masterpiece that we did not see when originally broadcast. Some of these shows seem to eventually turn up on Amazon Prime as well.

Mattman26 said...

Seconding the Queen’s Gambit recommendation. Well done and quite enjoyable.

rhhardin said...

Hero tied to a chair and being tortured must have started with one of the Bond films. It's all that action movies are nowadays.

It now stands, metaphorically, for the audience.

LYNNDH said...

We watch Amazon, BritBox, MhZ, Acorn, Netflix. Mostly mysteries, mostly non US productions, lots of older shows. Nothing on the major channels because they are all crap.

rhhardin said...

There's a few DVDs I've watched more than once, one unlikely one being Closed Circuit (Rebecca Hall, 2013). She does the British swallowed vowels as well. I think it's on Prime. Oh but not free. Might as well buy the DVD.

Man and woman team who don't like each other but working together genre.

LYNNDH said...

If you want a good series try "BOSCH" on Amazon Prime. Based loosely on the books.
"Vera", "Midsomer Murder", "Frost", "Murder in Paradise", "Silent Witness", "Beck" are just a few more. Lots of British, French, German (the "Tatort" series"), Swedish, even Polish. Really much better that what the US puts out.

Phil 314 said...

DBQ said “SHUT THE F UP. or WATCH THE SHOW AND YOU MIGHT FIND OUT. OR PAUSE THE DAMNED THING IF YOU WANT TO TALK TO ME.... BUT mostly."I...DON'T....KNOW!!!!"...generally right before STFU ”

Yes, this happens (without the STFU reply) when my wife and I watch “The Crown”.

There used to be a moniker for that guy who knew all the facts and trivia “The Answer Man”. Maybe we should replace that with “Mr. Wikipedia”. (and I apologize upfront for the sexist assumption.)

Howard said...

Getting back to the comparison to the old Hollywood studio system, I don't think NF ana Amazonthey are locking up actors in exclusive contracts. I think Mank director Fincher signed a four year exclusive deal with Netflix. Directors are now the stars.

Due to the widespread practice of the various Russian based acting methods, most actors are very very good. New stars are created all the time. There is an endless supply of new talent and the blockbusters are frequently ensembles with interchangeable parts.

The key now to a successful production is down to script, photography and editing.

Temujin said...

"In our Netflix account, we each have a separate icon with our name, and you go in there and establish your own persona. You don't let your choices affect the other person's suggestions."

Yeah, but I didn't want to subscribe to them (Netflix). We have our own Prime accounts. Actually I do enjoy experimenting with selections to see how it affects the algorithm. And my wife doesn't flinch. She's learned to live life with me and knows the consequences. She works right past them. A real trooper. Actually she's fine tuned that key ability to ignore your spouse at key moments in order to live in peace and harmony.

Phil 314 said...

I definitely agree with the recommendation to check out foreign series. While many are mediocre the good ones are engaging and provide a different, non-American perspective. The spy thriller series “Occupied” (at least the 1st season) was a great example of that for me. It also led me to read about the history of the Nazi invasion of Norway and the origin of the moniker “Quisling”. And then I discovered there was a Netflix movie on the Nazi invasion of Norway “The King’s choice”

Dust Bunny Queen said...

@ Phil 314

I'm really not that mean to my husband. I just think the STFU part.

He IS Mister Movie Trivia though. He has this amazing ability to recognize faces of actors and then be able to reel off the various other shows they were in and who they were married to, other actors in the casts of the shows.... etc.

Don't get him started on cars, makes, models, when they were made, and how the vehicles in the show aren't period correct. I can do the same with the clothing, furniture and other decorative objects in the background....but I restrain myself. (BTW. This is why I liked Queens Gambit. The items and decor were mostly period correct)

His ability is amazing and interesting to me because I am completely unable to remember the actors names or recognize them outside of the show or if they are different ages than previous shows.... until he brings it up. Then I am ..aha I do know that actor.

HOWEVER. Stop doing it out loud during the show and talking over everything!!

I, now, am in control of the remote and when he goes off....pause. Stops a lot of arguments 😁

ex-madtown girl said...

Pants, Her attitude in that scene comes from her being somewhat socially awkward more than anything. I understand what you’re saying, and I was worried the show would be all about forced “girl power,” but it pleasantly is not!! It’s really well done, and one of the things that struck me while I was watching was how refreshingly NOT over the top it was in regards to social agendas. I was also pleased by the lack of extreme, over-the-top HBO style gratuitous nudity and graphic sex. I am no prude by any means, but it wouldn’t have served the story in any meaningful way, and a lesser production would have added it anyway. It is extremely entertaining, and does a good job of portraying the combination of genius/drive that is needed to achieve greatness, sometimes at the cost of other areas of life. I say, give it a try!!!

Lem Vibe Bandit said...

I can't seem to finish a Netflix in one sitting. With homework you have deadlines. Elections used to have deadlines. With Netflix I find myself switching to my YouTube smart tv app.

It took me about a month to finish The Last Dance. I was about halfway through Mank when I stopped to look up the Organ Grinder's monkey parable.

I'm not even paying for my feed. I'm on my sister's account.

rehajm said...

Netfilx has already paid up to 'provide a platform' for the 'new' administration. Carefully curated messages from Obama's streaming straight to your brain- coming in 2021!

Temujin said...

lincolntf said: "The Rider", "Pan's Labyrinth", "Donnie Darko" and "Moonlight"

All good movies. The Rider was especially interesting, well made, and under the radar.

Charlie Currie said...

Long time Netflix subscriber, here. Early Netflix productions were pretty good. Now, they're just preachy.

I'm finding it harder and harder to find anything good to watch. When it was just DVDs you could wait for a popular movie to show up - now, I have no idea what movies are even out.

I've been more successful on Amazon, lately. Mostly British and Australian.

Poor eyesight at television range and being a slow reader makes subtitles a no go for me. And, dubbed dialog is cringe worthy.

My son has his PLEX account loaded on our Roku - it's like pirating once removed. He can load just about anything you want to see on there.

narciso said...

the German channel, DW used to have some interesting fare, montalbano, brunelli, even the swedish bond, commander hamilton, but they went to all news format, montalbano, I sort of stayed away initially because of his editorial notes, but the lead actor has just the right touch of cynicism,

rehajm said...

The early seasons of The Crown were more enjoyable. Claire Foy was a more compelling Elizabeth and Vanessa Kirby provoked Peter Townsend quality lust for Princess Margaret. I always seek out my birthday bud GIllian Anderson but Netflix was certainly concerned it might portray Thatcher as something less than Hitler. As a result Anderson falls flat on her arse...

rehajm said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Charlie Currie said...

The Dust Bunny Queen

"He IS Mister Movie Trivia though. He has this amazing ability to recognize faces of actors and then be able to reel off the various other shows they were in and who they were married to, other actors in the casts of the shows.... etc."

My wife.

I'm you.

I don't remember, or know, the names of the characters in a series that I'm currently watching, let alone who the actors are. Sometimes I remember a face and say, we've seen them in something else - that's as far as I get.

JMW Turner said...

Once Ozark is done,I'm done with Netflix...

rehajm said...

Watch Queen's Gambit even if you find chess Althouse level boring. The fashions are fabu...

rehajm said...

In our Netflix account, we each have a separate icon with our name, and you go in there and establish your own persona. You don't let your choices affect the other person's suggestions.

Separate accounts also reduces the probability of learning your MIL has a passion for tentacle porn...

Jersey Fled said...

I can't seem to finish a Netflix in one sitting.

Actually, I see that as an advantage. I have the attention span of a gnat. I often come back to even a 1 hour episode two or three times before I finish it.

Phil 314 said...

Rehajm said “Netflix was certainly concerned it might portray Thatcher as something less than Hitler. As a result Anderson falls flat on her arse...”

It’s funny, I can tell the writers and producers of “The Crown “ wanted the portrayal of Thatcher to be negative but every time she gives a soliloquy I find myself thinking “yes, exactly...well said”. I wonder how many other conservative watchers have the same thoughts and if there are many then I would wonder if the writers did that intentionally or unknowingly.

Phil 314 said...

DBQ, re: fashion for the era in movies.

Have you watched the alternative history series on Apple TV plus “For All Mankind”. The series so far is interesting if not overly woman power and righteous closeted gay power. What’s also interesting is a clear attempt to capture ‘70s fashion and style. Those were my high school and college years and anything that’s a reasonable facsimile of the time really grabs my attention.

I’d be interested to see if you think “they got it right”.

MayBee said...

Pants, I second what ex-Madtown girl said. I didn't want to watch it because I thought it was going to be either all "grrrrrl power" or "look what women before this generation had to deal with !' but Queens Gambit is neither of those things.

We're currently watching The Flight Attendant on HBO Max. Has kind of a Killing Eve vibe to it, which I love.

MayBee said...

Yeah I loved this season of The Crown, but Anderson seemed like she was doing an impersonation of Thatcher rather than a portrayal.

Unknown said...

I enjoyed the queens gambit. I am currently watching Occupied. It is well done My wife and I enjoyed the Crown. I have read AAs blog for years. I enjoy reading it and the comments. This is my first comment. Keep up the good work on this AA.

NorthOfTheOneOhOne said...

The movie is about Herman J. Mankiewicz, who wrote the screenplay for "Citizen Kane," and the story is told in the same manner as "Citizen Kane."

Show biz kids making movies
Of themselves you know they
Don't give a fuck about anybody else -- Steely Dan

I Have Misplaced My Pants said...

Ok ladies - upon your recommendations I will give it another shot!

I Have Misplaced My Pants said...

Oh and I second the Plex server mentioned above. That's the way to keep a film and TV library safe from the Goodthinkers.

tcrosse said...

Watch "A French Village" on Amazon.

It is a seven-year long French TV show about life in a French village during the Nazi occupation.

It is the single best TV series I have ever seen.


Better then 'Allo 'Allo?

MayBee said...

Hi unknown! Give yourself a name! Believe it or not, we have several unknowns and only one you!

ngtrains said...

Hope you watch Queen's Gambit.
it's time well spent

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Phil 314 said... DBQ, re: fashion for the era in movies.

Have you watched the alternative history series on Apple TV plus “For All Mankind”.


Oh wow. I would love to watch that. Sci-Fi,alternate history are some of my favorites in media/books/movies and that time is my era too. 70's Unfortunately I don't get Apple TV. So unless it is available elsewhere?

rehajm said...

Once Ozark is done,I'm done with Netflix...

Mooch off the account of an apolitical nephew, like me...

Joe Smith said...

"And, oh, yeah, that's Gary Oldman in the bed, and he's supposed to be such a great actor."

Oldman is a great actor. Watch him back-to-back in 'Fifth Element' and 'Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy' and come back and tell me he's not.

If he's got shit to work with it's not his fault.

Dear corrupt left, go F yourselves said...

I enjoyed The Queens Gambit. I have low expectations, so if something can hold my attention and inspire me to keep watching... it's a winner.
(Not sure what Tina meant about all that lesbianism. Was there any? perhaps one second.)

Dear corrupt left, go F yourselves said...

As with most hollywood creations - Queens Gambit holds a small dose of stereotypical Christian bashing.

Dear corrupt left, go F yourselves said...

The 2nd season of Mrs. Maisel is still one of the most hilarious and tightly packed enjoyment of characters and lines - ever. I love the 2 fathers played by Tony Shaloub and Kevin Pollack.

RMc said...

Because my husband does, and I generally scream at him SHUT THE F UP

So when will the divorce be final?

eddie willers said...

I enjoyed The Queen's Gambit. I have low expectations, so if something can hold my attention and inspire me to keep watching... it's a winner.
(Not sure what Tina meant about all that lesbianism. Was there any? perhaps one second.)


I was pleasantly surprised that The Queen's Gambit was virtually free of the PCism that ruins so much entertainment these days. Then when it came up here the first time on Althouse, someone posted about the "obvious" transexual woman in the first episode (which is set in 1957). I had to scratch my head because I did not remember seeing a transexual.

I would have passed that off, until I read a "professional" review say the same thing. So I went back and watched and all I saw was a typical husky woman in the 1950s. Reminded me of Lunchlady Doris from the Simpsons. So, sometimes we just see things and they resolve into some expectation that may not be true.

I saw only two instances of "upgrading" the book for "modern sensibilities". They made the man she had her first crush on (unrequited and exited the book) into a suggestion that he was homosexual and had her come back into her life periodically.

The second is making Jolene just a little more "magical negro" than she was in the book. (though still very close to book Jolene).

All in all, one of the best original NetFlix production to date.

PS. The German series (the most expensive non-US made TV show ever) Babylon Berlin is stunning in all respects. That it is set during the Weimar Republic made it more interesting to me since I know so little of that period. I haven't even seen Cabaret.

Joe Smith said...

"(Not sure what Tina meant about all that lesbianism. Was there any? perhaps one second.)"

The protagonist has a French model waking up in her bed in one of the late episodes.

So implied, which is bullshit.

Two hot babes and they don't show any action?

Again, bullshit...give the people what they want!

eddie willers said...

The protagonist has a French model waking up in her bed in one of the late episodes.

OK...I will have to add another instance of "modern sensibilities". That character was not in the book.

Joe Smith said...

"OK...I will have to add another instance of "modern sensibilities". That character was not in the book."

You are a bit behind.

These days every type of entertainment must (by decree) contain a gay/lesbian, trans, 'go-girl,' interracial, etc. element to satisfy said sensibilities.

I think it's a law now.

The lesbo stuff is OK as long as the chicks are hot.

rcocean said...

Yeah, who would watch Mank? LOL! BTW, the guy was a drunk and a backstabbing shit. Marion Davis invited him to Hearst Castle and Hearst's treated him well. He repaid them with Citizen Kane.

But then Hearst opposed Communism and getting involved in ww2, so he deserved it.

rcocean said...

I can only second the people who watch foreign TV and shows. by comparison Hollywood and the USA is putting out unwatchable shit.

Joe Smith said...

"I can only second the people who watch foreign TV and shows."

We love to watch all of the British murder mystery/police dramas.

But in the past few years, the Brits have been infected with a huge dose of political correctness.

And they're not very subtle about it.

It gets so blatant and in-your-face at times that it makes things unwatchable...

DimWhit said...

One thing you can say about Orson Welles: He was not mediocre....