Crabbed Tucker Carlson, quoted in a Mediaite article with the scary headline "Tucker Carlson’s Ominous Monologue Claims Vaccine Rollout ‘Feels False,’ Rails Against Crackdown on Covid Misinformation as ‘Social Control.’" (Mediaite).
I liked Ian McKellen's tweet. He's helping!
At some point, too much promotion makes people suspicious. It's good that we're sensitive to propaganda and our skepticism can be triggered. I think that's what Tucker meant by "This is patronizing. Stop with the slogans."I feel very lucky to have had the vaccine. I would have no hesitation in recommending it to anyone. https://t.co/gBLRR0OeJc
— Ian McKellen (@IanMcKellen) December 17, 2020
Practically, there should be no temptation to overdo vaccine promotion. There are millions of people waiting in line who want to get their shot early. If some who could go early lag behind, what's the problem? I presume the vaccines are getting injected as quickly as possible and there's no shortage of people coming forward. Let the more skeptical people be the ones who wait, and you're maximizing the minimization of anxiety.
Posts
155 comments:
Covid Misinformation
Now, there's an ambiguous term.
I have to be vaccinated to return to work playing live in churches and accompanying vocal groups.
I remain deeply suspicious of every aspect of this crap, since my assumption is that the virus was a deliberate biowarfare attack by the Chinese.
"Let the more skeptical people be the ones who wait"
Like Kamala Harris.
"If some who could go early lag behind, what's the problem?" How about "racial equity"?
"He's helping! "
Not this again.
I'd rather see publicity from a bunch of regular old people or doctors and nurses receiving the vaccine than a bunch of celebrities and politicians. That's why it feels false to me. I know they're trying their best for a, "the vaccine is cool roll out," but that's what makes it feel false.
Right now, if you're at risk, I assume you want the vaccine. If you're like me and not particularly at risk, then I think it's fine to wait. I told my oldest just yesterday, "we haven't really changed anything about our lives and haven't gotten sick. I'll assume that our risk of infection will only go down now, so what's the hurry."
Who's making that mandatory Shouting Thomas?
Althouse said...
Let the more skeptical people be the ones who wait, and you're maximizing the minimization of anxiety.
But mandatory vaccination means...
"You shall not pass!"
Welcome to hyperreality, Tucker. Did you take the red pill or the blue one?
Everything "feels false" in the modern world, because the overlay of publicity and spin makes it hard to understand what's really going on, and it will get worse in the Biden era.
As for McKellan, I wouldn't say he's actually ecstatic about getting the shot, just pleased and taking the opportunity to tweet about it.
And he's not worried that the vaccine will make him gay or anything, so there's that ...
So I take the vaccine. Does this mean I can dispense with my mask? Does it mean we can sit down at a restaurant?
The Experts say no. So why get one?
"You shall not pass!"
That's what my middle school health class teacher said.
"Practically, there should be no temptation to overdo vaccine promotion. There are millions of people waiting in line who want to get their shot early. If some who could go early lag behind, what's the problem? I presume the vaccines are getting injected as quickly as possible and there's no shortage of people coming forward. Let the more skeptical people be the ones who wait, and you're maximizing the minimization of anxiety. "
This all makes sense...if you ignore the fact that the left is going to want...nay demand... 100% vaccine compliance. And not only 100% compliance, but orderly compliance. No "wait and seers", when your time comes you're going to get it.
"Ian McKellen"
One of the bigger mistakes our culture has made was making entertainers part of the public relations effort during WWII. Genie out of the bottle.
Who's making that mandatory Shouting Thomas?
NY State. The pandemic has offered the left, which is in complete control in NY, a golden opportunity to suppress churches and synagogues.
The lefty churches are willing allies of the state.
Conservative Protestant, Catholic and Jewish denominations are fighting for their lives against a hostile government.
I am skeptical of anything, repeat anything, the government tells me is good for me. Decades of experience confirms my suspicion.
The mandatory part will come later- after corrupt Biden, the crook is installed.
You will not be allowed to travel or do much of anything - without your vaccine papers.
I'm generally pro-vaccine, but am suspicious of the corrupt left - because they are proven liars.
One has to take Trucker pronouncements with a grain of salt tossed into the swirl of Fox propaganda..Remember how Trucker promoted the Swedish approach to herd immunity as the correct model as opposed to the US models? Now that Sweden has admitted that approach was a failure, Trucker is silent. If poor Trucker and Althouse think the current approach to promoting the vaccine is a bit much, they might want to go back and look at the polio vaccine efforts to convince people to line up for the jabe.
Waiting for my state's Health Secretary Dr. Rachel (née Richard) Levine (D-Mentally Ill) to make the vaccine mandatory.
The motive all around is always clickbait.
“ I feel very lucky to have had the vaccine. I would have no hesitation in recommending it to anyone.”
Was he blinking an SOS out with his eyes while he said this?
Seems like a pretty scripted quote.....
Those of us with Three Stooges Syndrome don't care because "indestructible!"
Of course there’s hype and publicity. Isn’t that true with so many things. Ignore the hype. I’d encourage folks to get the vaccine when its available. And to R-V, the Swedes have not suggested their approach was a failure but they admit it has not turned out exactly as they hoped. but then again the Germans are saying the same thing now. Humility in the midst of the pandemic is a precious thing.
Recall during the Bide'n campaign where he called for mandatory wearing of masks. Making the vaccine mandatory is right up his alley.
My body, my choice? Not if you want to eat, travel, or go to work.
At some point, too much promotion makes people suspicious.
Kind of how I felt about all the people telling everyone to go vote.
"If poor Trucker and Althouse think the current approach to promoting the vaccine is a bit much..."
Don't misread me. I didn't say what's being done now is too much. I said "At some point, too much promotion makes people suspicious." My point is, don't go extra hard at the beginning. You've got plenty of compliance and people worried about having to wait.
Don't people who refuse to be vaccinated endanger me in the same way as people who refuse to wear masks?
All it would take to slow things down is for Trump to "tout" vaccination. But the reaction to his "touting" HCQ probably taught him a lesson.
Maybe there's a Post Corona Stress Disorder, "PCSD",, in which nothing can put an end to a person's implanted fear of Getting It. I know people afraid of Covid and afraid of vaccines. They want vaccinated people and people who have had the disease to wear masks; and some want to everyone to wear masks forever. At present, you can't talk to them about states like Florida without mandates or lockdowns which aren't doing as badly as states with masks and lockdowns like New York. And in the future the PCSD victims still won't be able to hear about these differences; and, probably, they won't be able to act as if it's over, either. For years to come in that brighter future when it's over over here, they'll be wearing masks and challenging people in stores, a recognized group like "returned soldier". And that bright time might be closer than we think - I've heard that primary schools in Milwaukee County will re-open in January (long before teachers get the vaccine) because it's been observed than primary schools in nearby counties have re-opened without causing a catastrophe. Observed and acted on - everybody doesn't have PCSD.
Nothing causes more controversy than repeating out loud what democrats say.
I'm in my late seventies. I'll be glad to take the vaccine when it becomes available. The government is right about some things and wrong about others as are its critics. I don't know of any sure fire, absolutely guaranteed way to predict what to believe and when to believe it. The vaccine looks like a good bet, however....If you don't watch cable news, you can avoid the hype. If you watch cable news, you are part of the hype.....They used to blame witches and Jews for plague outbreaks. We've moved on. We now blame Trump voters and the Swedes for the plague or, if you prefer, Biden voters and the experts for it.
At some point, too much promotion makes people suspicious.
My daughter and I were just discussing that yesterday. That and the fact that Pfizer execs are not getting immunized--at least for now--because they 'don't want to cut in line'. If it becomes mandatory, there will be problems. I've become so skeptical that I don't believe Pence really got the vaccine.
Google fact-checks these questions as "unsafe"
I have a few...
No corona-type virus vaccine has ever been successfully created - let alone in less than a year.
Anyone feel weird about this?
How do we know we are even getting a real vaccine? (one of the first media-covered doses to a health care worker - was actually a fake dose)
The white left want to give the first doses to people of color. Why? "to even the playing field" - as the NYT says? or is it different - to use certain groups as guinea pigs?
It's a good thing our corrupt liar press, Google, and politicians Like Pelosi and Adam Schitt have poisoned the well with their lies... to the point where most of us are skeptical - of just about anything. Including a shot to the arm.
>>Greg Hlatky said...
So I take the vaccine. Does this mean I can dispense with my mask? Does it mean we can sit down at a restaurant?
The Experts say no. So why get one?<<
To keep from getting the disease, perhaps? I know that's a minor Covid issue compared to that of mask-wearing but...
I wouldn't hesitate to get a vaccine, but then none is being offered to me any time soon.
It is good for some number of people to get them publicly. But what does what Ian McKlellan have to say about it mean to anyone?
Some people have adverse reactions to their vaccines. The Japanese Encephalitis vaccine you have to stay close to a hospital for like 24 hours. But any parent can tell you, when you bring your baby in for any vaccination you get a boatload of consent forms telling you what adverse affects it may have. I think that's what started the anti-vaxing movement.
So Ian didn't have an adverse affect, but some people will. That doesn't make it bad. It doesn't make it safe for everyone.
"I liked Ian McKellen's tweet. He's helping!"
Helping whom? To do what?
He's old, and he thinks there's a good chance he might die if he gets covid. Of course he wants the vaccine. So what? If the idea is to prove the vaccine is harmless, let's all watch Ian for a while. See how he does.
The Pfizer vaccine is the first vaccine to use messenger RNA, which will over-write your DNA code. Do you really want your DNA files overwritten by a vaccine that, at best, will only keep you immune to one virus for less than a year?
roesch/voltaire said...
Remember how Trucker promoted the Swedish approach to herd immunity as the correct model as opposed to the US models? Now that Sweden has admitted that approach was a failure
How is it that the French approach is a success, while the Swedish is a failure?
At 14.45 GMT today the total number of deaths since 1 January 2020 was 56,990,519 people. The so called Corona virus deaths were 1,684,288 people. I am asking myself what is the reason they have called this a pandemic. I am past my 80th birthday by a couple of months I am still busy working in my small company which lost some 60% of its business due to lockdowns and all that other rules and regulations and I intend to continue doing so as I enjoy what I am doing. I will avoid the vaccines not because I don't think they are safe but I survived all these years with minimal interference from the medical profession.
The best way to get rid of COVID is to be an Island nation, or share a peninsula with a militarized border.
According to the Surgeon General, the vaccine will not make you immune, or even stifle the spread. It will only keep you from getting very sick.
So there's that-
Posted by me earlier:
Don't people who refuse to be vaccinated endanger me in the same way as people who refuse to wear masks?
I have an idea. How about if you don't want to get the vaccine you don't get the vaccine.
After all, if I get the vaccine, what do I care if you get it.
And if you don't want to wear a mask, you don't wear a mask. Same logic.
And if you don't want to go to a restaurant...
For Christ sake.
Remember how Trucker promoted the Swedish approach to herd immunity as the correct model as opposed to the US models? Now that Sweden has admitted that approach was a failure
What bubble do these people live in?
Interesting . CNN this morning was obsessed with the history of blacks being used as guinea pigs in medical experiments (including testing vaccines). Not sure how that will get more blacks to take the COVID vaccine.
"Do you really want your DNA files overwritten by a vaccine that, at best, will only keep you immune to one virus for less than a year?"
Not sure what sources you are reading but I would find new ones.
For one, the vaccine does not give immunity, it only makes you unlikely to get severely ill. You still can catch and pass the virus post Pfizer shot.
And the whole rewriting the DNA throughout your body claim .... enjoy making it. I don't have time to waste explaining to someone who doesn't want to think.
Seeing that health care worker pass out on camera minutes after getting jabbed was certainly dramatic.
Is Althouse chomping at the bit to get it?
Who here remembers the hysteria surrounding the swine flu vaccine in the 70s?the pandemic that wasn’t.
"And if you don't want to wear a mask, you don't wear a mask. Same logic."
Same faulty logic. Your logic only makes sense once everyone who wants is vaccinated. Before then,if you refuse to wear a mask in public it just means you are a dick. OK if someone sneezes in your face or would you consider that to be a violation of your right to be free from such intrusions to your body? Same logic re masks. Only difference is that the virus is too small to see and much more dangerous than your typical (pre-COVID) sneeze.
The EEOC has said that employers may require employees to be vaccinated in order to return to work. If employers generally choose to require it, that will drive a lot of vaccinations.
Oh Mark - DO explain. we want to hear your scientific expertise.
"The Pfizer vaccine is the first vaccine to use messenger RNA, which will over-write your DNA code. Do you really want your DNA files overwritten by a vaccine that, at best, will only keep you immune to one virus for less than a year?"
Another lay person who knows more than all the scientists. Injecting RNA into a person doesn't do anything to the DNA of a human cell.
Also, one year is enough to get the virus to go away.
And what about Tucker Carlson's inflammatory comments about the CDC's decision to vaccinate workers in "essential" industries first? Mr. Carson suggested that the CDC wants the elderly and infirm to die. I'm not sure if the CDC is as racist and anti-White as Mr. Carlson implies. The aging prison population and the elderly living in medicaid nursing homes are overwhelmingly Black and Latino. These people are going to suffer the brunt of the pandemic. These are the people we should vacinnate, NOT 25 year old hypochondriacs and losers.
What the hell? If the estimated IFR is less than 0.01% at age 25 but increases progressively to 1.4% at age 65, 4.6% at age 75 and 15% at age 85, then we can save more lives by focusing on the elderly. I think young people who get the vaccine are selfish bastards. What is wrong with our country's young people?
The vaccine will not prevent one from getting COVID, it will only make a case less bad than it would otherwise be. Also you might still be infectious. Also you will still have to wear a mask. And social distance.
Businesses will weigh their chances regarding a vaccine requirement. Will you have to present evidence of vaccination to board a plane? Enter a church? Go to a concert? Attend a sporting event? Your papers please.
"Crabbed" is an appropriate verb. Why pick on Sir Ian, liked by many, when you could stir the pot by showing the poor nurse who passed out during her post-vaccine press conference?
(1) The way this works is, you won't be allowed out of your house without proof of vaccination. And you won't be on the list to be vaccinated unless you are a Party member. Thus, automatic house arrest for anyone with a whiff of Deplorability about them.
(2) In other news, did we all know that in October the American Medical Association approved a resolution reinstating Hydroxychloroquine as acceptable therapy for early stage Wu Flu? Yes: the very same stuff that had been banned in the spring because it was useless and dangerous. Somehow the media forgot to cover this development, which quietly reversed the discrediting, for months, of Trump's early favorable comments.
Ann Althouse said...
"If poor Trucker and Althouse think the current approach to promoting the vaccine is a bit much..."
Don't misread me. I didn't say what's being done now is too much. I said "At some point, too much promotion makes people suspicious." My point is, don't go extra hard at the beginning. You've got plenty of compliance and people worried about having to wait.
12/19/20, 8:53 AM
Right now, it seems to me that one of the biggest issues in the current early "promotion" is the obsession on the part of the Trump Administration to focus as much favorable attention, and grab as much credit for Trump, as possible. And to do it now, before January 20. Even though comparatively few can even be vaccinated during that time, and the ones being vaccinated are all "easy" patients insofar as they are mostly hospital-based medical staff members who know more about the horrors of COVID than anyone.
Trump says the quiet part out loud, as usual; “Don’t let him [Biden] take credit for the vaccines because the vaccines were me and I pushed people harder than they’ve ever been pushed before."
Respectfully, I think you've missed the most interesting vaccination story, Althouse. That is, whether and how Trump will get vaccinated. Lots of Trump critics are wondering about that, and there was this simple, clear, believable speculation about Trump's own attitude toward being vaccinated:
"I have a theory... I don't think that he wants to be jabbed with a needle on live television... I think he considers that to be some kind of an act of weakness..."
https://twitter.com/gtconway3d/status/1340053316278083585
And yet Trump really did proclaim earlier that he would get the vaccine as soon as it was available to him. Since Pence was immunized, and Biden is going to be immunized, one might think that it is available to Trump.
SteveUhr, God help him, argues: Another lay person who knows more than all the scientists. Injecting RNA into a person doesn't do anything to the DNA of a human cell.
Just what, pray tell, do you think mRNA does????
From the Mayo Clinic:
A COVID-19 vaccine might prevent you from getting COVID-19. Or, if you get COVID-19, the vaccine might keep you from becoming seriously ill or from developing serious complications.
Getting vaccinated also might help protect people around you from COVID-19, particularly people at increased risk of severe illness from COVID-19.
There are vaccines that have provided immense benefits, but that doesn't mean that anything labeled as a vaccine is worth it. I'll withhold my judgement on this one, and I'm perfectly happy to be near the end of the line.
Re the AMA and its position on HCQ: apparently there is not (yet) a change in the organization's official stance. I am unclear on how the AMA decides what it thinks --there is a group pushing for the change, and others resisting the push, and lots of speeches and emails. So: maybe nothing. Best argument I read about the debate was, "We don't want to change our position because that would imply we were wrong before."
Logic.
I'm sorry Shouting. I'm really glad I live in the South where we don't have the government telling us what to do, life continues mostly as normal, and our infection rates are still lower than NY and California and everywhere else where the people TAKE THE VIRUS SERIOUSLY.
If poor Trucker and Althouse think the current approach to promoting the vaccine is a bit much, they might want to go back and look at the polio vaccine efforts to convince people to line up for the jabe.
Like all leftists, R/V knows no history. The 1935 polio vaccine trials were a disaster.
Brodie was head of one of two separate teams that developed polio vaccines and reported their results at the annual meeting of the American Public Health Association in November 1935.[9] Both projects were cancelled as a result of the angry reaction from other researchers there, and no researchers dared attempt a polio vaccine for another 20 years.[10]
Professor John Kolmer, MD (1886–1962),[11] of Temple University in Philadelphia, presented his findings first. He had developed an attenuated poliovirus vaccine, which he tested in about 10,000 children across much of the United States and Canada.[10] Five of these children died of polio and 10 more were paralyzed, usually in the arm where the vaccine was injected, and frequently affecting children in towns where no polio outbreak had occurred.[10] He had no control group, but asserted that many more children would have gotten sick.[10] The response from other researchers was uncharacteristically blunt; one of them directly called Kolmer a murderer.[10] Brodie presented his results afterwards, but the feelings of the researchers were already unfavorable before he started because of Kolmer's report.[10] Brodie and his team had prepared a formaldehyde-killed poliovirus vaccine, testing it first on Brodie himself and five co-workers, and eventually on 7,000 children and adults, with another 4,500 people serving as a control group.
A pathologist fried of mine developed Guillian-Barre Syndrome after receiving the Swine Flu vaccine and was out of work a year. He recovered but had a foot drop for the rest of the time I knew him.
It is true that this "vaccine" is an mRNA molecule and not a typical "vaccine."
I am unclear on how the AMA decides what it thinks
Usually based on money coming to Board members. I have lots of stories about the AMA.
Both the Pfizer and Moderna vacinnes were found to be 95% effective in preventing the disease. Meaning you still had a 5% chance of getting it.
We've been attending church since August with no problems, though we are sitting a pew apart from each other and most of the older people watch on zoom. My husband is singing tomorrow with a quartet for our Sunday Christmas services. Like I said, mostly normal life.
Right now, it seems to me that one of the biggest issues in the current early "promotion" is the obsession on the part of the Trump Administration to focus as much favorable attention, and grab as much credit for Trump, as possible
Is there any topic that interests Chuck that does not involve hating Trump?
Speaking of obsessions, as he was.
A lot of "might" in there, Jersey.
John Henry
I do not want to feed the troll, but I don't understand why someone who already had the virus would need the vaccine...
We are spending Christmas with family in CA and I will be taking my HCQ. When this all began, I prescribed HCQ for everybody to keep in case they were exposed. My younger son is a paramedic and type I diabetic. Nobody has gotten the WuFlu.
Why should PDJT get the vaccine?
He's already had kung flu. He probably has better immunity than Pence who did get it.
Perhaps someone who knows more about the science could elaborate.
John Henry
Who wouldn't dismiss the happiness felt over all those lives being saved and the beginning of a return to normalcy? Being angry and suspicious about good things is what gives decent people like us a sense of identity!
Chuck- Trump had covid and was treated with a cocktail of therapies that make it so he cannot be vaccinated until a certain amount of time passes.
I see birches beat me to it
John Henry
The left's collective smearing of the use of HCQ only got people killed.
The democrat elite and their water-carriers are corrupt and vile.
Del Shannon knows what Althouse knows.
The virus is real - but the left wanted it to kill as many people as possible for political reasons. Gloom and doom! and blame...
A few corners of their corruption are how covid deaths are reported. They ARE inflated. It's the Maracopa count. 60 days in any direction of covid? you died of something else? They count it as a covid death.
Suddenly 50-70 deaths per year by flu - "manageable!"
Here in CO - the State told one county to count gun shot deaths as covid deaths.
The left's collective smearing of the use of any therapy that Trump said showed promise, or beneficial - the left smeared it.
Trump should have told everyone to eat bananas as a cure - just to watch the corrupt collective left scream about bananas.
>>mockturtle said...
SteveUhr, God help him, argues: Another lay person who knows more than all the scientists. Injecting RNA into a person doesn't do anything to the DNA of a human cell.
Just what, pray tell, do you think mRNA does????<<
It presents its base sequence to the ribosome to read and to translate into its corresponding amino acid. In the cytoplasm - not in the nucleus. mRNA does not go into the nucleus and does not interact with the genomic DNA.
What do you think mRNA does (that is of concern)?
John henry said...
Why should PDJT get the vaccine?
He's already had kung flu. He probably has better immunity than Pence who did get it.
Perhaps someone who knows more about the science could elaborate.
John Henry
The immunologists are just about unanimous that persons who have had COVID-19 should nevertheless be vaccinated. Because the immune response to the disease varies widely; so much so that there are some documented cases of people getting sick twice.
Sorry to interject some calm medical facts into what I expect is supposed to be an hysterical emotional political fight.
Using hydroxychloroquine and taking an anecdotal single family case study to override epidemiology is a grand part of the scientific tradition and should be submitted to the medical journals! Just like another piece of advice that was recently recommended.
MockTurtle - Through transcription, DNA information is transferred into RNA, which is then translated into a protein molecule. DNA to RNA to Protein. Not the other way around.
Please provide a link to a legitimate scientific article saying that the injection of a virus containing mRNA alters the DNA of a cell. I assume you got your "knowledge" from somewhere.
Chuck -
Trump had covid and was treated with a unique cocktail of therapies that make it so he cannot be vaccinated until a certain amount of time passes.
look it up.
BidenFamilyTaxPayerFundedCrackPipe said...
Chuck- Trump had covid and was treated with a cocktail of therapies that make it so he cannot be vaccinated until a certain amount of time passes.
I am not aware of that. Do you have any sort of citation to authority on that point? What is the time frame you're suggesting?
It is true, that as a technical matter, the CDC is "not commenting" on the need for persons who had COVID to be given a vaccine. That, at the same time that all immunologists are saying that they recommend that eventually all persons who can be vaccinated, get vaccinated. From that perspective, it is a priority matter. But obviously Vice President Pence's priority was moved up based on his position, and not his personal medical needs. The So too President-elect Biden.
The CDC offering "no commment" on the needs of previously-infected persons is understood as a matter of prioritizing limited supplies of vaccine, not medical risks. They have noted that as many as 10% of vaccine trial participants may have been infected before or during their vaccination times. They found no risk of harm.
Pro-marxist democraticals LLR-lefty Chuck: "The immunologists are just about unanimous..."
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
"The immunologists"
"Just about unanimous"
That's just the kind of assertion formulation one would expect from a self-declared $1,000/hour legal beagle who also claims he requires $40,000 retainers just to speak with prospective clients.
LLR-lefty Chuck sure does sound legit, eh?
Can we really be sure that Bill Gates isn't putting HIV RT into the vaccine?
That's what all my science friends told me. Like Randy who makes methamphetamine out of decongestants in his van.
Pro-marxist LLR-lefty Chuck: "That, at the same time that all immunologists are saying that they recommend that eventually all persons who can be vaccinated..."
Note how "smoothly" LLR-lefty Chuck's narrative weaves a serpentine path from one untruth to another.
Perhaps this was another Chuckian propensity that contributed to his being banned from Althouse.
That, and his violent rhetoric against women and racist attacks against minorities.
Lets see how today's, no doubt gin and tonic enhanced, attack proceeds.
Chuck - I heard it reported on a local network affiliate. CBS, ABC - some such.
I'm not finding it heralded or repeated. What a surprise!
Chuck - If Trump rushed to get the vaccine - you'd be the first to say Trump is a greedy bastard for jumping the line.
Mark said, "For one, the vaccine does not give immunity, it only makes you unlikely to get severely ill. You still can catch and pass the virus post Pfizer shot."
Browndog said largely the same thing, and my understanding is the same. The vaccine triggers the creation of long-term systemic antibodies but is not so good at creating the antibodies which block COVID from infesting nasal cavities, throat, and windpipe.
I'm guessing this means you might still test positive for SARS-Cov-2.
Which is concerning because of the public perception of the vaccine if people still get sick (however mildly). And if an elderly, obese diabetic dies of a heart attack a few weeks after vaccination (which an elderly, obese diabetic might well do), it might be called a COVID death and we might stay locked down forever.
Just when you started to think it’s safe to go outside......
My IPad vis wsj and wapo tells me Britain is in panic mode as mutation has 70% higher transmission rate.. oh feckin joy
BidenFamilyTaxPayerFundedCrackPipe said...
Chuck - I heard it reported on a local network affiliate. CBS, ABC - some such.
I'm not finding it heralded or repeated. What a surprise!
Chuck - If Trump rushed to get the vaccine - you'd be the first to say Trump is a greedy bastard for jumping the line.
In fact, I am NOT saying that about Pence, Mother, Biden or Harris. I've had my chance to prove you right, and I have proven you wrong.
...
...That's just the kind of assertion formulation one would expect from a self-declared $1,000/hour legal beagle who also claims he requires $40,000 retainers just to speak with prospective clients...
Go fuck yourself, you insane hateful worm. I have never made such such a claim and you cannot quote me about what I charge "prospective clients."
You're the poster child for what is wrong with moderation on these pages.
Hey -> Perhaps we can all get wrist-barcode tattoos?
Im generally pro-vaccine. Juat got my flu shot. Plus ten dollar coupon to buy fancy cheese at the Publix! Anyone who works on old houses should get Hep A in addition to tetanus: that stuff can live in pipes for decades, and you don't want it. Anyone over 55 should get pneumonia and shingles. Two shots for each prevents hundreds of thousands of deaths, plus unbelievable suffering each year.
This one is a bit different. I'll take it once it proves its efficacy and safety. It's a new formula, new design, and it's been rushed out. Most likely setback is it makes you look like Prince Charles. No, not really. We'll know a lot more soon.
That's all. But get yer damn Hep.A shots if you're going to replace plumbing fixtures, old guys. The pharmacist can give it to you. It might even be a nubile young lady pharmacist.
No Chuck - I am not wrong. You're just a Trump hating jackass.
Trump's drugs and therapies pretty much amount to a short term vaccination. He cannot, medially, get the vaccine right now.
TRUE.
It is time for the cognoscente to launch powerful attacks on the doubters and win this culture battle once and for all. For example, the "fainting nurse" video, which is substantially increasing the number of doubters, must be exposed for what it is: a clever production using actors put together by a group of angry naysayers.
I am probably considered (statistically) to be the at risk group because of age and recently having surgery for a cancer.
However, in reality, because I live in a sparsely populated rural area, with almost ZERO cases of Covid (3 known cases in the 100 square mile area around me). PLUS I don't interact with groups or even very many people at time. (unless I go shopping and then like a good little zombie, I wear a mask) ....my real chances are slim. I'm low risk.
Not zero. But slim. It is up to ME, if I want to be first in line. Or...stay to the back and see how other people react to the rushed out vaccine. Or.... just not take the shot at all. MY CHOICE.
I've never had a flu shot. Don't think I've ever had THE flu. Covid is a flu. As the man says...you place your bets, you takes your chances.
BidenFamilyTaxPayerFundedCrackPipe said...
No Chuck - I am not wrong. You're just a Trump hating jackass.
Trump's drugs and therapies pretty much amount to a short term vaccination. He cannot, medially, get the vaccine right now.
TRUE.
I only asked what the medical authority was on that. You said you couldn't find it. Meanwhile, the White House is saying that Trump will get vaccinated when the time is right. I'm just asking when that is, and what the medical basis is?
https://news.trust.org/item/20201218183550-stazs
CHUCK - How would I know when that timing is right for Trump to get a vaccine. Again - no matter what he does - it will be an unforgivable sin!
Why do you care so much, Chuck? What is your game?
Trump had covid, he was treated with drugs and therapies that probably most of us do not have access to - which would be true for any sitting president, and now he has to wait a bit before he is given the vaccine.
You want an exact date?
Chuck - I heard it reported and it made sense. and I am super skeptical of most msm news.
You calling me a liar? fine -- I really do not care. I know what I heard.
Dr, K I am talking about push for polio vaccinations in the nineteen fifties when I received mine, and can well remover the pr as well as the summer when kids were required to isolate in the backyards.
For the people who choose to skip getting the vaccine now, that means that there will be more vaccine available for those who do choose to have it when their particular group is eligible. Take it or don’t take it, whatever. You’re an adult you get to choose unless your employer demands it as a requirement, then it’s your choice to seek employment elsewhere if you choose to decline getting vaccinated.
As for myself, as soon as it’s available to me I’ll take it. I’d like to hug and kiss my grandkids again one day.
McKellen has a pretty sketchy background when it comes to young (ahem) boys.
Not sure why you'd roll him out...
roesch/voltaire said...
Now that Sweden has admitted that approach was a failure,
Their confessed failure was not based on science, but rather on politics.
Right now Sweden has the 25th worst death rate, 8 spots better than France and two worse than Switzerland. Belgium, Italy, Spain, the UK, and the US are all worse than Sweden.
It's revealing how many left wingers say to follow the science when they mean follow the government directives.
So I take the vaccine. Does this mean I can dispense with my mask? Does it mean we can sit down at a restaurant?
The Experts say no. So why get one?
So I can get on a plane and see my grandkids before they are any older (and their parents will not worry).
The Pfizer vaccine is the first vaccine to use messenger RNA, which will over-write your DNA code. Do you really want your DNA files overwritten by a vaccine that, at best, will only keep you immune to one virus for less than a year?
The vaccine doesn't overwrite your DNA, Your DNA stays the same. The vaccine simply borrows some of your protein-building organelles (ribosomes) to build proteins that your body will react to by creating anti-COVID antibodies.
I'm in an AstraZeneca covid immunization trial. I don't know if I got the placebo or the real deal. I might have had a mild reaction after the first injection but it might have been an above average day of aches and pains. I did it out of boredom, out of a hope that maybe if this crap gets approved things can get more normal faster and out of a bit of selfishness - if I got the actual immunization (66% chance) and it doesn't kill me, maybe I won't get as sick if I do get covid. Oh, and also to save the world because I care so much about all of you.*
I think the restrictions are nonsense and wearing masks is not helpful to stop the spread. I can make my own decisions about taking risk. I also got a flu shot and the shingle's vaccine. I felt the risk of taking those was worth it. I avoid crowds unless I really want to go see what ever is going on, then I'll decide if it is worth the risk in times of covid or worth the hassle of having to put up with people and traffic.
*Not at all true.
Roger Sweeny said...
So I take the vaccine. Does this mean I can dispense with my mask? Does it mean we can sit down at a restaurant?
The Experts say no. So why get one?
So I can get on a plane and see my grandkids before they are any older (and their parents will not worry).
And why are the parents worrying? About you? That's your job. About the kids? Why? Chances of them suffering permanent damage or death from the dreaded covid is near zero.
Life is not risk free. I read yesterday that tamiflu prescriptions are way down. Flu in most forms is very contagious. Does the dreaded covid kill influenza? Or is flu being ignored this year in order to focus the people's worries exclusively on the dreaded covid? I'm not convinced flu cases dropped 90+% from last year.
I am hearing that in California, a lot of frontline medical personnel are apparently refusing to get vaccinated. Not doctors so much as the nurses and techs (and receptionists). I anticipated high resistance to vaccination, particularly among Blacks -- that's been apparent in the polling since early in the pandemic. I . . had not anticipated this.
There's a problem here that mere messaging isn't going to help when the working level staff of our medical industry apparently think the vaccine is going to give them HIV or something. I'm not opposed to celebrity messaging. I think I might have written a comment about it here a while back, actually (I was thinking more popular young actors and singers rather than elderly Shakespearean actors, though, given the audience that needs to be reached). But I don't think it's enough if people are hearing that their cousin who's a nurse had the opportunity to get vaccinated but turned it down because she thinks Bill Gates is using the vaccine to microchip everyone or Pfizer is run by
that Jewish cabal that controls the weather or whatever.
Does it matter if a celebrity gets a vaccine on camera?
We are all thinking the same thing. Was that even real? Would not be hard to fake. They did fake - admittedly - one of the on-camera vaccine shots already. Wow -that inspires confidence.
Lets strap Debra Messing and Jane Fonda down and force the needle in. See how it goes.
The Pfizer vaccine is the first vaccine to use messenger RNA, which will over-write your DNA code. Do you really want your DNA files overwritten
HELL NO.
I've already had serious adverse effects from an antibiotic that works by genetically interfering with how bacteria reproduce -- which not surprisingly also has the potential to interfere with how your own bodies cells reproduce. I ignored the BIG WARNINGS on the label before. I'm not taking the risk again.
Re: Rick
Sweden stands out because at 789 deaths per million it's close to the Spain/UK/US/France bracket in deaths per million (all ~1000), rather than where you'd think it would be, with the other Scandanavian countries (88 and 176). They're not doing well in comparison to the East Asian democracies (the worst of which is Japan at all of 22/million), but by Western standards they're great successes. And I think you do need to evaluate performance in light of underlying characteristics.
Incidentally, this is one reason I think criticism of Trump's coronavirus response in the US is massively overblown. Our best case scenario probably was never going to be Germany (313 deaths per million and climbing). It was going to be something like France, i.e. only marginally better than the US's actual performance (922 vs 969 deaths per millon). The bureaucratic, cultural, and institutional issues that hindered the US response are common to most of the other Western democracies, and have nothing to do with who the President happens to be.
“ I read yesterday that tamiflu prescriptions are way down. Flu in most forms is very contagious. Does the dreaded covid kill influenza? Or is flu being ignored this year in order to focus the people's worries exclusively on the dreaded covid? I'm not convinced flu cases dropped 90+% from last year.”
I read that the flu is down because people are wearing masks and taking precautions. Covid is still high because it’s THAT contagious and it’s airborne, it can even enter through the eye membranes. Most people don’t wear protective eye coverings, nor am I saying they should. Do what you feel comfortable doing to protect yourself and others, but it’s you who may have to live with infecting grandma or parent, which may result in their death.
Jersey Fled said...
From the Mayo Clinic:
A COVID-19 vaccine might prevent you from getting COVID-19. Or, if you get COVID-19, the vaccine might keep you from becoming seriously ill or from developing serious complications.
Getting vaccinated also might help protect people around you from COVID-19, particularly people at increased risk of severe illness from COVID-19.
That's an awful lot of "mights". Almost as if it's saying you're going to have to actually get the dreaded covid to get immunity from it, this vaccine is in itself useless.
AS for documentation that people can get the dreaded covid more than once- AFAIK, less than a handful of DOCUMENTED cases- worldwide. You can only get chickenpox once. Well, except for one of my children. The pediatrician diagnosed him twice, incredibly mild cases, but the spots were definitively chicken pox with chickenpox characteristics. The third time was severe- worse than any of our other kids had it. I had measles, mumps, rubella as a kid- along with chickenpox. My children were vaccinated against the first three, chickenpox vaccine came after the last one had it.
I get the flu shot yearly- job requirement. My better half skipped it this year- along with many others, CDC actions made them suspicious of it. At 65 I've had the pneumonia and shingles vaccines. Since my job description includes work around wastewater- I've had HEP A and B vaccines.
I'm also old enough to have had the smallpox vaccine. Twice- as a kid, and in boot camp. Like many other military with a suspicious mindset- I think it should still be standard. Someone out there is planning on releasing it back into the wild...
A hurriedly rushed dreaded covid vaccine? When my employer gets around to telling me it's now my turn. At 95% effectiveness, low for a vaccine, with unknown side effects, that from initial reports seem more serious and frequent than initially advertised, to protect me against a disease with a fatality rate that quite frankly doesn't worry me, since I'm a healthy 65 year old, I'd skip it if I had a choice.
Inga said...
“ I read yesterday that tamiflu prescriptions are way down. Flu in most forms is very contagious. Does the dreaded covid kill influenza? Or is flu being ignored this year in order to focus the people's worries exclusively on the dreaded covid? I'm not convinced flu cases dropped 90+% from last year.”
I read that the flu is down because people are wearing masks and taking precautions. Covid is still high because it’s THAT contagious and it’s airborne, it can even enter through the eye membranes. Most people don’t wear protective eye coverings, nor am I saying they should. Do what you feel comfortable doing to protect yourself and others, but it’s you who may have to live with infecting grandma or parent, which may result in their death.
Gee- my wife and I are the grandparents. We're not worried. As for infectiousness- the numbers from the Diamond Princess and the USS Theodore Roosevelt prove it's less contagious than most influenza types- all of which are airborne and can enter the body through eye membranes. If the masking is stopping flu- it should be stopping the dreaded covid. Period. Things aren't adding up.
Here's how I look at it. This is a war, humanity against a virus. If we lose the battle to suppress the virus into non-existence, millions will die every year ad infinitum. Those who get vaccinated are the front-line soldiers. Their risks maybe moderately larger than the anti-vaxxers', but what they are doing offers the best hope of defeating the virus. I'm not of the Greatest Generation, I missed getting drafted for Vietnam by a year, but I can belatedly do my part by getting vaccinated. Refusing to get the shot because it gives you the heebie-jeebies is childish and cowardly. Do your fucking part.
“Gee- my wife and I are the grandparents. We're not worried.”
I’m not worried merely because of my age. I have two conditions that may make getting Covid be fatal to me. So if you’re feeling lucky, if you are confident that your immune system and general wellness can keep you from having a complicated difficult case, then more power to you.
I would say if you are like my parents, both 80, both with lung issues(COPD & interstitial disease) already, the vaccine is a no brainer from a risk reward point.
I know two people, both under 57, who had lung issues, one had a previous bout of pneumonia, the other asthmatic, who struggled mightily with covid. The one who earlier had pneumonia almost didn’t come off the ventilator in April. The asthmatic spent 33 days in icu, and a month at home now still is on O2 100% of the time.
Violence Inclined And Vulgar Racist Poster Who Was Banned And Has Endorsed Marxist Senate Candidate In GA LLR-lefty Chuck: "Go f*** yourself, you insane hateful worm. I have never made such such a claim and you cannot quote me about what I charge "prospective clients."
Its important for leftist trolls who pose as "principled conservatives" but endorse marxists (BTW, has anyone else read FakeCon Steve Schmidt's public Twitter love letter to AOC? Most amusing...) who have been banned to pile lie on top of lie in order to, in their own mind, be "effective" in their Lefty gaslighting and trolling.
I fully suspect that LLR-lefty Chuck's Fellow Far Left Lunatic "Ban-ee", Russian Collusion Truther Dead Ender Inga, to, once again and as always, come to her fellow lefty's (LLR-lefty Chuck) defense.
Lets see what happens....
They wouldn't need to talk it up so much (at least in the US) if so many top Democratic politicians hadn't expressed distrust of anything developed during the Trump administration.
Banned Poster Who Was Banned LLR-lefty Chuck: "You're the poster child for what is wrong with moderation on these pages."
Banned Commenter Who Was Banned from blog has thoughts he wishes to express regarding moderation policy and practice "failures" on the very blog from which he was banned.
Discuss.
Inga said...Covid is still high because it’s THAT contagious and it’s airborne, it can even enter through the eye membranes.
So, if I live in a household with two people who have Covid, there is no way I can escape getting it too?
Sometimes moderation isn't so bad...
@Mary Beth
Weirdly enough I've known five households that have had COVID with only one or two people getting it instead of everybody.
Something's not adding up is correct.
So, if I live in a household with two people who have Covid, there is no way I can escape getting it too?
Not necessarily. There are variables that make us more or less susceptible, like blood type, Vitamin D levels and strength of immune system.
Birches: "Sometimes moderation isn't so bad..."
Banned Poster Who Was Banned, Chuck, is in complete agreement with you.
Balfegor said...
Sweden stands out because at 789 deaths per million it's close to the Spain/UK/US/France bracket in deaths per million (all ~1000), rather than where you'd think it would be, with the other Scandanavian countries (88 and 176). They're not doing well in comparison to the East Asian democracies (the worst of which is Japan at all of 22/million), but by Western standards they're great successes. And I think you do need to evaluate performance in light of underlying characteristics.
While true we don't know what the relevant underlying characteristics are. People critical of Sweden assert the Scandinavian countries are the correct comparison. But Sweden has been very different from the other Scandinavian countries for roughly a thousand years which has resulted in it being more urban and interconnected than the others. Maybe the relevant characteristic is how urban a society is, or how much travel occurs within it rather than simply ethnicity. Sweden also took in many more refugees over the last decade or so likely increasing the travel and urban-centric differences between them and the others.
Are these the relevant factors? Maybe, but certainly those left-splaining to us have zero interest in understanding the matter. Further if differences were determined by political policy would the difference between Sweden and other countries be this small? It is still well within the range of all countries. If this were such a disaster why isn't Sweden's experience worse than literally any other country with a different policy and clustered with others in a classic double-hump rate trend? This is what we should expect if what left wingers claim were actually true. Instead we see them within the single hump distribution.
And why would you make this point and then compare them to the Asian countries if the underlying characteristics are the driving factor? It seems like you're listing everything which points to a specific conclusion, first arguing that the similarities are the appropriate comparison but then switching the comparison to a group as dissimilar from Sweden as any on the planet.
Re: Gospace:
At 95% effectiveness, low for a vaccine,
Where are you getting this? Flu vaccine effectiveness apparently ranges from 10% to 60%:
On average, it’s been 40% effective, meaning it’s prevented illness 40% of the time. Since health officials started tracking it in 2003, effectiveness has varied from year to year, ranging from a low of 10% in 2004-05 to a high of 60% in 2010-11.
That would make 95% effectiveness quite high, comparable to the two dose MMR vaccine.
There is one thing I am glad to have learned about the vaccine. It took only days to develop after virus samples were available to researchers, and several different vaccines were developed independently. This makes biological warfare using novel bugs much less a successful move for anyone. Were Covid19 more deadly, I bet the rollout of vaccines would have started in March.
Rick: "Are these the relevant factors? Maybe, but certainly those left-splaining to us have zero interest in understanding the matter."
Correct.
Irrefutably correct.
The left/LLR-left politically weaponized the virus and every aspect of every related issue to the virus from day 1.
They are already attempting to position the political question to set up for mass mail in voting again in 2022 in order to repeat the industrial scale fraud they executed in November...but in 2022 the effort will obviously be focused on throwing the Senate into or further into democratical/LLR-lefty/marxist hands.
This is why Gates and Fauci and any number of democraticalsLLR-lefties continue to publicly say it will be years, if ever, that we can "return to 'normal'".
Re: Rick --
My comparison and contrast is all consistent, I think --
1. Culturally similar Sweden vs Scandanavia (within which Denmark is slightly more urbanised than Sweden, although Sweden seems to be more open to refugees, and is larger than either Norway or Denmark too). Sweden is performing badly.
2. Modest but noticeable cultural distance: Sweden vs Spain/UK/US/France. Sweden is doing modestly better. But there are other macro differences, e.g. its population is tiny compared to these countries. The Stockholm metropolitan area is like 1.5 million people, slightly smaller than Copenhagen, whereas Paris and London are both over 10 million.
3. Large cultural and institutional difference, i.e. those factors really do matter: Western Europe vs East Asia. Western countries all look like abject failures on mitigating spread. But whether Scandanavian or Latin or Germanic, they're all working with broadly similar institutions and cultures which limit the best possible outcome for them.
That relates to Sweden because the countries they seem most similar to had markedly better outcomes (comparison 1), suggesting that a different response realistically could have achieved different and better results.
Similarly, if Japan were seeing 100 deaths per million and its former colonies were seeing 10, well, sure that would be a great result compared to Europe, but it would suggest to me that they could realistically have achieved much better results. To be fair, their actual results (22 vs 13 for Korea) do suggest they could have done a better job, which is probably correct even if there were specific elements of Korea's response that would not have been feasible in Japan.
In contrast, I think while the US could have responded better (e.g. not letting CDC control testing initially, the CDC not being anti-mask between January and April etc., quicker roll-out of contact tracing), I think that would only have made a difference on the margin. Thousands of lives, perhaps, but not hundreds of thousands.
Vaccine mandates have no place in a free society.Yes I know about schools,yes I am a Veteran who had to get shots with an air gun and shots for overseas war zones, am not an anti vaccination person but I am an American with choice. Like it has been stated make your choice, Big Brother is not telling me anymore what I must do to follow their rules.If I dont like the area rules I move to an area that differ(of which we have)I have tested negative for Covid 19 and got test just because I wanted to, but am in the susceptible age range but still will make my own choice especially the way they are pumping out"vaccines" like aspirins with no follow up and made in months,Nah...maybe in a year or two maybe not.We wear masks,stay out of crowds ,have family and grandkids over,travel minimally just left New York,they are clueless up there people in airport said see JET BLUE for Covid info,baggage people? (supposed to quarantine although my wife and I filled out form on line and they said no you dont have to quarantine yet the people we traveled with and stayed at sae place did.Does that make sense? Nobody at airport knew of anybody that was supposed to see you before you left airport and we were told they would call and check on you to see if you quarantined.NO CALLS...My daughter got a call after we were back 3 days after we were back and just said did you get back OK? Population,large per centage, dont believe its real ,people dont care about masking or distancing or crowds,the supposed leaders of the country role model everything that is against guidelines,so your on your own.My son says why would I take a 9 month produced vaccine when my chances of surviving even if I get it is 98% or more.NAH. Americans will not conform and if you do then you are part of the machine IF GIVE IN TO FORCE.You loose choice and become a member of the 666 indoctrinated group. No job,or situation is worth the forced participation in a FREE society ,might as well move to Russia or China or Turkey etc where you'll do what your told or you'll face the consequences. Lived too long for anymore of that. DINKY DAU BE CRAZY BUT Dinky Dau not be stupid :)
I can wait. In fact, I will probably have to in any case.
Refusing to get the shot because it gives you the heebie-jeebies is childish and cowardly. Do your fucking part.
Don't fucking tell me what to do.
Two people in my household got it and have since recovered. Two of us did not get it. I question whether it is "THAT contagious" as Inga claims.
I believe it is contagious and some people are probably more susceptible than others. My experience is just one small sample and not indicative of anything. Still, I feel like the fear-mongering over it is kind of like when the D.A.R.E officers would come to my kids' classes and make it sound like smoking some weed was the equivalent of shooting up heroin. Pushing fear is counter-productive.
I will still wear a mask and try to keep distance between myself and others when I'm out. I'll still keep taking Vitamin D and zinc. I will keep washing my hands a lot. (To be honest, I did that long before Covid and that's not going to change.) I will continue to do all of this because I believe I could still catch it but my concern over it has dropped dramatically from how I thought about it back in February or March when we had less information about it.
“Two people in my household got it and have since recovered. Two of us did not get it. I question whether it is "THAT contagious" as Inga claims.”
I also know of instances where one or more people in the household have had it and the others did not catch it or were asymptomatic. As Mockturtle said, there are probably reasons some become symptomatic. Maybe some based on genetics, blood type, Vit. D, levels, immune systems and lord knows what else. I suspect that for certain people it is very contagious and not so much for others. Who really knows yet?
Apparently written before the vaccine was approved.
“There are some key differences between flu and COVID-19. COVID-19 seems to spread more easily than flu and causes more serious illnesses in some people. It can also take longer before people show symptoms and people can be contagious for longer. Another important difference is there is a vaccine to protect against flu. There is currently no vaccine to prevent COVID-19. The best way to prevent infection is to avoid being exposed to the virus. More information about differences between flu and COVID-19 is available in the different sections below.”
https://www.cdc.gov/flu/symptoms/flu-vs-covid19.htm#:~:text=For%20both%20COVID%2D19,is%20still%20under%20investigation.
“While COVID-19 and flu viruses are thought to spread in similar ways, COVID-19 is more contagious among certain populations and age groups than flu. Also, COVID-19 has been observed to have more superspreading events than flu. This means the virus that causes COVID-19 can quickly and easily spread to a lot of people and result in continuous spreading among people as time progresses.”
Large cultural and institutional difference, i.e. those factors really do matter: Western Europe vs East Asia.
We don't know whether this is cultural or not. Perhaps (as you say) the difference is because Asian cultures developed differently. Maybe even this is caused by their higher density and the relationship of that density to disease. Alternatively perhaps ethic Asians are more resistant to Asian diseases because their ancestors were exposed to similar diseases more often than other populations (a fact recognized by epidemiologists and historians). We don't know which of these is true, but we do know left-splainers assert that Asians wear masks more readily (and other cultural factors) as if that explains the entirety of the difference.
How did they eliminate the resistance alternative to conclude cultural factors cause the difference? They didn't: they assert the alternative which supports their political preferences even though it is no more conclusive than the alternative.
The bottom line is that we don't know what all the relevant facts are and those who insist the facts they point to must be controlling are overwhelmingly likely to be wrong. Pandemics are far more complicated than the simplistic model presented. Public health officials want us to take these steps because they are the only steps they can think of. This doesn't prove they work.
The bedpan commando shares her deep knowledge.
“There are some key differences between flu and COVID-19. COVID-19 seems to spread more easily than flu and causes more serious illnesses in some people.
The cruise ship is still the best baseline study. 20% got infected.
Flue kills more young people and is at least as contagious. The number of deaths from SARS-2 is greatly exaggerated.
And, In spite of destroying the economy except big business, CA is showing the virus is out of control.
As of Saturday, nearly 17,400 people were hospitalized with confirmed or suspected COVID-19 infections — more than double the previous peak reached in July — and a state model that uses current data to forecast future trends shows the number could reach an unfathomable 75,000 by mid-January.
Of course, it is also flu season but we don't mention that.
Blogger Mary Beth said...
Two people in my household got it and have since recovered. Two of us did not get it. I question whether it is "THAT contagious" as Inga claims.
My wife had it in June. I did not. Of course, I took HCQ which is not possible for Democrats.
Blogger roesch/voltaire said...
Dr, K I am talking about push for polio vaccinations in the nineteen fifties when I received mine, and can well remover the pr as well as the summer when kids were required to isolate in the backyards.
Since I am probably older than anyone else posting here, I remember the summers with polio very well. LA County built an entire hospital for polio victims. It was finished in 1954, just when it was no longer needed. It became the pediatric pavilion.
My point was that the early attempts at polio vaccine, before Enders was able to culture the virus, failed. I don't know if this mRNA approach will work and be free of complications. The level of hysteria equals the polio hysteria of the 1950s.
Pasteur was very lucky his rabies vaccine worked. Brodie was not.
Not my opinion, just looking for reasons, make of it what you will.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/covid-19-precautions-are-thwarting-the-flu-11608210000
“As the coronavirus rages across the U.S., the country has so far blunted the impact of influenza and other seasonal respiratory viruses.
U.S. laboratories are finding significantly fewer flu cases among tested patients so far this year, compared with previous flu seasons, thanks to efforts to stamp out Covid-19.
“We are seeing very low levels of influenza so far,” said Daniel Jernigan, director of the influenza division at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. Between mask wearing, social distancing, and measures such as bar closures, “all of those things are impacting influenza,” he said.”
The white left want to give the first doses to people of color. Why? "to even the playing field" - as the NYT says? or is it different - to use certain groups as guinea pigs?
The Tuskegee Study of Untreated Syphilis in the Negro Male comes to mind...
I think "maximizing the minimization" of anything is just "minimizing" that thing.
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Roesche Voltaire the idiot at 8:40 re Sweden.
USA deaths per 100,000 is 96.
Sweden is 78.
FYI -78 is lower than and better than 96.
Humpedink said:
"Waiting for my state's Health Secretary Dr. Rachel (née Richard) Levine (D-Mentally Ill) to make the vaccine mandatory."
PA resident here too. Love this comment - when will the world finally acknowledge transgenders are mentally ill?
For one, the vaccine does not give immunity, it only makes you unlikely to get severely ill. You still can catch and pass the virus post Pfizer shot.
And here the goalposts are moved, once again.
I've been told by the health "experts" that the only way to get herd immunity is by getting a large enough group of people vaccinated. So much for that.
So I can get on a plane and see my grandkids before they are any older (and their parents will not worry).
If the assumption is that people will still have to wear masks, what makes you think you'll be any safer to see your grandkids and kids? It's apparently already been established that the vaccine doesn't give you any immunity. What changes?
And An you are maximizing the minimization, nigh decimation, of your intellect.
" If we lose the battle to suppress the virus into non-existence, millions will die every year ad infinitum"
Poe's Law rears its ambiguous head...
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