From "Big Pharma Is Fooling Us/Heroic work went into the development of the coronavirus vaccines. But that doesn’t mean this industry deserves your affection" by Stephen Buranyi
(NYT).
We have to get back... and we have to change the world.
Thanks for changing the bad new world with the vaccine, but we have to get back to the good old world where we hated you.
Posts
99 comments:
CTRL-F Trump.....
"There was talk of community support"
To do what?
"the rediscovery of the positive powers of the state to protect its citizens"
Ah yes, the state shall "protect" us, by stripping us of basic liberties to start with, with the "positive powers" of unconstrained coercion. Commie dreams die hard. The left likes the pandemic regime.
"we have to get back to the good old world where we hated you"
Of course, not just Big Pharma. Making money by saving lives is just one sin among others. Progs hate the very system and all of us who sustain it. To them, even a virus is just a tool.
He yearns for something that does not exist and which, when tried in the past, did not work. At least that's what I get from his anger and frustration at Big Pharma - they just aren't socialist enough, or at least aren't motivated by positive social outcomes to change the world for the better. Even though they are changing the world for the better, saving and improving lives.
The left really needed the virus and have made the most of it.
The Biden recession will be four years long. No "Summer of Recovery" just as there wasn't when Obama ruled.
There was talk of community support, mutual aid and the rediscovery of the positive powers of the state to protect its citizens.
Mutual aid is tough when we're not allowed to come near each other. We did what we could. Those of us with a paycheck put more effort into buying from our local businesses, but there's only so much you can do.
"rediscovery...of the state" Oh, right, that's the real point.
"Thanks for changing the bad new world with the vaccine, but we have to get back to the good old world where we hated you."
A mishmash of left-wing nonsense, just as I expect.
If you don't like this vaccine, go discover another.
yes, the brainslugs can't be cured with a vaccine,
It's not a coincidence that nearly all modern medical innovations (from drugs to devices) originate in the U.S.
Creating new drugs is incredibly expensive. Big Pharma spends billions of its own money on discovery and testing. 99.9% of ideas that make it to testing will fail. Take away the profits they can earn on the .1% that succeed, and the entire industry collapses.
Hate Big Pharma and free markets if you want. They'll extend your life expectancy anyway.
Thanks for changing the bad new world with the vaccine, but we have to get back to the good old world where we hated you.
OK, now I am confused. Which of these [or any other] worlds were supposed to be the one where they didn't hate us? Cause I have yet to see/visit that world. Sometimes it is an in-your-face hate (like when Trump got elected) and sometimes it is a very-condescending-can't-we-pretend-to-get-along-you-dumb-rube hate (like the 30 minutes after 9/11) but it is always hate.
i.e. resume assholery
If it weren't for Big Pharma, I'd be dead ,,, twenty times over at least.
At the beginning of the pandemic, I predicted that American capitalists would save the world but then be forced to grovel before Congress for being "too greedy" while saving the fucking world.
The good news is that the Leftist Collectivists cannot hate me more than I hate them.
It's impossible for them to reason and therefore their hatred of me is unreasonable.
My hatred of them is indefatigable because it is well-reasoned.
Ah yes. Evil Big Pharma, those baddies whose offerings have increased the quality and longevity of those old people whose health is so important to all of you that we had to halfway destroy society.
Can we get a little consistency here? Not a lot; just a little?
Ah yes, the positive power of government of the rulers, by the rulers, and for only some of the people.
"There was talk of community support, mutual aid and the rediscovery of the positive powers of the state to protect its citizens."
New York is raising its minimum wage next month, which will certainly kill some of the businesses that have managed to survive the state's overreaction to the covid virus. How much more positive does it get?
The people who didn’t lose their business or their paycheck still want to control society.
I never got all the hate for Big Pharma, even knowing the games they played with opioids and antidepressants.
By God, they gave the people what they wanted - good clean dope! - but now no one wants to admit it. So it's all Pharma's fault.
How conveeenient...
Trump worked hard on decreasing drug prices. Pfizer and Moderna delayed announcing the vaccine's availability until after the election. Coincidence, I'm sure.
Community? Mutual aid? The state?
What planet does this idiot live on?
I was thinking about stocking the freezer and pantry with protein.
Making sure my wife had a more than adequate supply of the medication she needs.
Could I get more ammo?
And also thinking that 'Preppers' and Mormons are smarter than all of us.
How about this deal...liberals write down all of the people/things they hate, and promise never to buy or use anything that those hated people or things invent/produce.
Most liberals these days seem to hate large corporations (except the social media giants), white men, and Jews.
They wouldn't survive a week.
I don't see where loving pharmaceutical companies comes into this, or loving any company for that matter. Congratulate them for completing a difficult task quickly? Sure. Love them for it? What does love have to do with it?
Carol said...
By God, they gave the people what they wanted - good clean dope! - but now no one wants to admit it. So it's all Pharma's fault.
Completely agree. Why are there so many opioid overdose deaths now? Because the feds cracked down on the safer options that addicts used to have. Going after the drug companies is easy, but they never thought of the consequences -- that addicts would resort to cheap heroin and fentanyl if they couldn't get the black market Oxy and youths seeking a quick high would also take the risk of fentanyl-laced drugs.
Drug companies (even those who make drugs to control pain) make tens of millions of people's lives much better, indeed worth living in many cases. Compare that to whiny journalists.
The people who write for New York media come across as neurotic, emotional messes with less self-control than a thirteen year old. It seems as if any reasoning ability they may have possessed has been excised.
why is this?
Without Big Pharma many people I love would be dead. Can't seem to work up the hate!
I think there is more reason to vilify BigPharma now. There is no question they acted in a political manner, which wasted time during a pandemic. What about that act shouldn't be vilified, if the pandemic is truly as dangerous as declared by so many?
Fuck the NYT.
Never let a crisis go to waste. And speaking of chumming the waters with politics, how about that NY Times? It would be nice to introduce more competitiveness into pharmaceuticals, but I suspect the way to get there is less government involvement. Consider the CDC testing boondoggle as a case in point, there were plenty of small labs who could have done that work locally. Technology has changed, government hasn't kept up, it is a dinosaur without wings.
Carol said...
I never got all the hate for Big Pharma, even knowing the games they played with opioids and antidepressants.
By God, they gave the people what they wanted - good clean dope! - but now no one wants to admit it. So it's all Pharma's fault.
How conveeenient...
This is what government does.
The Government Produces nothing. It survives as a parasite.
The people who work for the Government are generally worthless and provide little value to anyone so they must steal the value others produce.
This includes social and moral capital.
It is why the government works when people like Trump run it and why it doesn't work when people like Biden or Obama run it.
Trump knows how things are made and done.
Biden and Obama only know how to steal what others have done.
Big Pharma gave me the ability to have more than one child, since both of my husbands have O pos blood and I have O neg. Thanks RhoGAM!
It doesn't matter if Freeman Hunt works up the hate.
She already gave an inch and now protests that the taking of a mile was not her fault.
There is really nothing left of the common fabric of our society.
There is no common ground to be achieved with people who only know how to take other people's stuff and hate.
My residence changes to the first State that tells Washington DC to fuck off. I am tired of paying taxes to people like Joe Biden and his cokehead family. Jill Biden is just completely useless as a human being. I haven't seen a single person in his "cabinet" that could survive on their own.
I don't want to live around people that don't want open honest elections.
I don't care. Just give me the shot.
There was talk of community support, mutual aid and the rediscovery of the positive powers of the state to protect its citizens.
The people who became deranged when Trump said "America First" want you to believe they're the ones concerned about your welfare.
and the rediscovery of the positive powers of the state to protect its citizens.
When did the state protect its citizens from influenza? WTF is he talking about?
We have to get back to that place. Yet this may be the best chance in our lifetimes to break the hold of an industry that, until recently, was rightly vilified."
We must thoroughly break the pharmaceutical industry, grind it into dust until there is nothing left. Oh, and also they should produce 330 million doses immediately and give them out for free.
Access to pharmaceuticals is, as a subset of medical care, a basic human right that cannot be denied to anyone. Also there must be no pharmaceutical companies to manufacture said pharmaceuticals that we all have a basic human right to have.
They're not really hungry for that omelet-- they just like breaking eggs.
The only way to save pharma is for everyone to agree that it was Joe Biden that made the "in less than a year" vaccines available.
Believe it or not, many Bidenites are already heavily invested in that narrative.
Oh yeah, they are also arguing that Trump's pre-pandemic economy was also due to Biden.
Not a joke by the way.
Why doesn't this guy just break the hold of big pharma on his own self (and family) and restrict himself to vintage 1950 medicine such as aspirin, penicillin and such like? If he doesn't want expensive new treatments, don't get them.
Maybe that not really what he wants...
Yep, time for 1984's Five Minutes of Hate to recommence.
"rightly vilified". Rather, vilified by people who don't understand the free market, who want medicines that cost literally a billion dollars to develop - when they work out - without having to pay a billion dollars.
Well, they can have that. But they won't have the medicines.
Drago said...
The only way to save pharma is for everyone to agree that it was Joe Biden that made the "in less than a year" vaccines available.
That's what their hoping to do. That's why I say very few people will see that vaccine before Jan. 21 of next year.
Under Trump's pressure and vision, this vaccine was produced and delivered in 1/5 the usual time. Something all the "experts" said was impossible. They have a great track record underestimating Trump. It reminds me of another big important presidential effort, so important it was named after the President. That would be the incredibly competent development and rollout of the a website for Obamacare. It took twice as long and I bet cost twice as much at least. A damned website. Something that's done regularly by all kinds of organizations with far better results. I'm glad we have one of the geniuses of that effort running things soon. It should be epic.
I Have Misplaced My Pants said..."both of my husbands ..."
No wonder you can't find your pants?!?
I don’t hate big pharma, but I sure do hate fascist democrat leaders.
Big Pharma not only kept the information about the vaccines secret until Biden was installed via fraud, but was complicit in the massive lie campaign about HCQ, a drug that helps keep death down outside the Western world.
The Dems can salt them like Carthage, for all I care. Let the next generation of pharma leaders remember there is a price to pay for partnering with evil.
That whole despotic "never let a crisis go to waste" mentality of exploiting the situation to reinvent society -- including the plagiarized "build back better" -- got really old really fast.
Under Trump's pressure and vision, this vaccine was produced and delivered in 1/5 the usual time. Something all the "experts" said was impossible.
The government threw billions of dollars (24 I believe) at the development of a vaccine. The approval process was truncated before the long term effectiveness of the vaccine was known, which is why the experts said that we shouldn't expect a vaccine until the middle of next year. That point is still valid. We still don't know what the long term effectiveness is.
That's the sort of article you get from someone who entered a PhD science program, left with a Masters degree, became a journalist, and is thoroughly ignorant about pharma R&D.
the experts said that we shouldn't expect a vaccine until the middle of next year. That point is still valid. We still don't know what the long term effectiveness is.
This is why you lefties are so amusing. Is there no depth you will not go to deny Trump any credit ?
Blogger NC William said...
Why doesn't this guy just break the hold of big pharma on his own self (and family) and restrict himself to vintage 1950 medicine such as aspirin, penicillin and such like?
Good year to pick as high blood pressure and schizophrenia were untreatable before that year. Lots of powerful drugs came that year and soon after.
I'm sure the NYT didn't mean for it to be a "hate" article. They are above that kind of journolism. They want to inform their readership, which by the way consists of only the best people. Probably most commenters here would never qualify for Club NYT. You can tell.
Does in utero exposure to Covid 19 matter?
Big Pharma saved my life. Not once but about a half dozen times. I think they should be the wealthiest companies in the world considering what they do for us. Facebook?, Google, Twitter? Apple, Amazon? I could live without any of them, and how powerful they are doesn't help us one bit, but having powerful capable pharma companies is life saving.
I see Birkel has adopted the Drago schtick
BTW vaccines are typically a money loser or very low margin item. Unlike a high priced med, you use it once or twice and then you're done.
"Is there no depth you will not go to deny Trump any credit ?"
What percentage of the left do you suppose, given a chance to receive the vaccine, either themselves or their families, will refuse it?
BigPharma doesn't always wear angel wings. They own cloven hoof boots, too.
But this schill's drivel is gag inducing on this topic. Completely missed how to drive home valid points.
bagoh20:
Ditto. See my post at 12:49 PM.
it's going on for a while now,
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/energy-dept-nuclear-agency-breached-as-part-of-massive-cyberattack-report/ar-BB1c18bz
“It doesn't matter if Freeman Hunt works up the hate.
She already gave an inch and now protests that the taking of a mile was not her fault.”
What is it with Birkel and certain women that comment on this blogs comments section? He’s been hounding her for no apparent reason for a few years now. Beyond creepy.
I have no animosity for big pharma, I depend on a couple drugs that keep a certain conditions under control. Over the years I’ve heard as much animosity for big pharma equally from the left and the right.
As for the vaccine, I can’t wait to get it, as is the case for most people I know.
That's the sort of article you get from someone who entered a PhD science program, left with a Masters degree, became a journalist, and is thoroughly ignorant about pharma R&D.
Actually, I suspect most journalists never took a science class of any sort, nor an economics course. Something about 27 year olds who know nothing about nothing?
I can only assume that Steve’s disdain for Big Pharma extends to not using their products. I hope he doesn’t develop Gout. It hurts a lot.
The main "value added" that the pharma companies bring to things like vaccines isn't just the R&D. It's the tools of mass production.
A good example was penicillin. Discovered (or rediscovered?) by Alexander Fleming in the UK, but he could only scrape enough penicillin together to treat just one patient. American companies figured out how to mass-produce penicillin in giant vats.
In the entire article, there's no acknowledgment that it's one thing for scientists to research a new vaccine and develop a few doses. And quite another thing to mass-produce tens of millions of doses to vaccinate people around the world.
At Peace Pavilion West, after the despair and nihilistic woe cleared a bit, we realized COVID would renew our Mission Statement.
-Community-All for the community. Nothing outside
-Concern-Care for all community members
-Empathy-Feeling for one's Self and all living beings on Spaceship Earth
-Diversity-Unite under Community. See step 1
-Peace-Our enemies are evil. not us. They must be destroyed.
Next thing you know Steve will be complaining that we don’t vaccinate the Bushmen of the Kalahari first.
I consulted to Big Pharma and Startup Pharma back in 1994-2002, working mostly with the scientists in Phase 3 trials.
They were smart, hard working and well intentioned people. The marketing folks are the ones who give Pharma a bad name.
There is no reason not to trust the vaccines. Not everyone will have a positive response. Some may get very sick.
There are different protocols for certain drugs such as those addressing HIV and cancer. I do not know if the COVUD drugs have that looser protocol, but I doubt it.
Those of us with a paycheck put more effort into buying from our local businesses, but there's only so much you can do.
You too? Good man.
Former Pharma guy here. I saw a lot of wonderful science get ruthlessly flushed as it progressed but not far enough or fast enough. The complexity of the process is mind-boggling and anybody who wants a good honest look at it could do worse than visit Derek Lowe's blog. He is funny, insightful and super-well informed.
Those who complain about Big Evil Greedy Cruel Pharma really have the easiest job in the world, and will never stop. They can posture as gimlet-eyed cost cutters, tribunes for the dispossessed, demanding results sooner but only if they are much safer and more effective and also free, agitating for some really good Congressional hearings or, better yet, just rounding up management and sending them to the clink. Their ignorance (often feigned or deliberate) and their intellectual incoherence and shameless lack of decency really do represent a paragon of sorts, and I think we should thank for it.
This thread reminds me of Robert Heinlein's quote: "Throughout history, poverty is the normal condition of man. Advances which permit this norm to be exceeded — here and there, now and then — are the work of an extremely small minority, frequently despised, often condemned, and almost always opposed by all right-thinking people. Whenever this tiny minority is kept from creating, or (as sometimes happens) is driven out of a society, the people then slip back into abject poverty.
This is known as 'bad luck.'"
Francisco D @ 5:11: "...There is no reason not to trust the vaccines. Not everyone will have a positive response. Some may get very sick."
Agree. I hope any bad reactions are very rare and mild but only time will tell. What I worry about, in this supercharged take-no-prisoners environment, is that the media (and political opportunists) will seize upon anything untoward (even random and transient and subjective stuff) and play it up as a Huge Crisis Requiring Immediate Magic Intervention and, as a natural follow-on, Big Damage Awards For My Constituency. Throw in the anti-vaxxers and, just for fun, those who are stuck in the queue and who come to suspect there is favoritism and hoarding or diversion, and we have all the makings for a real mess.
As if we weren't already in a real mess; which this moron is making worse.
"There is no reason not to trust the vaccines."
123 Chinese agents infiltrated in Pfizer, I believe.
I'll wait for the J&J vaccine, if I take it at all.
Recently heard that if you take the vaccine, you get contact traced for up to two years. That joyful little intrusion of civil rights has been outsourced to Google. If that is a requirement, I will not be taking it.
Can't we just have a good old fashioned moral panic in this God forsaken country? Are there no witches eating children in homeless shelters? Are there no asteroids on a path to Earth? Are the branch davidians really all burned up? F*** the vaccine, spoilsport! F*** global warming, we have all had global warming up to here.
I read that my own senator Durbin the Dick praised Trump for his efforts toward the vaccine. So typical, after the cheat is in and there is nothing to be gained or lost, go for some downstate gullible suckers.
At the start of this pandemic, I recall feeling amusement that the Democrats were using it to prop up and advance their political agenda. I laughed at the mask wearers. I scoffed at the shoe and hand washers. I expected the panic to die down by the summer. On all but the last of these I was correct.
Phil 314: "I see Birkel has adopted the Drago schtick"
Whatever that means.
I do recall a time not that distant in the past, when long, long after it became transparently obvious the entire collusion "investigation" was just a cover up and a sham frame up job, our courageous Strawberry Phil was still busily defending the "integrity" of that hack Mueller by pretending any other approach was a bizarre conspiracy.
Good old Phil.
About a year or two after the truth has emerged on any issue, you can always count on him to be Johnny on the spot with "timely" support.
Think of Phil as an even tardier Andy McCarthy.
Drago, I haven’t got a clue what you’re alluding to but again that’s you’re schtick:
“My argument? That other commentator is an asshole!! And he’s not one of us! BTW Drag, I don’t normally mention or respond to you because its like wrestling with a pig. My comment was more towards Birkel who seems to have a bee up his butt for Freeman Hunt.
Are you capable of discussion, or is “You’re an idiot!” You’re only go to argument?
PS I do appreciate the “Caine Mutiny” allusion. That tells me there’s hope
"Thanks for changing the bad new world with the vaccine, but we have to get back to the good old world where we hated you."
It's amazing these people can even get out of bed in the morning given the size of the chip on their shoulders.
Thank God the people with the skill to do things like develop vaccines do it out of a love of doing, not for the gratitude of pond scum like the author of this piece.
PPS Drago;
Merry Christmas.
And I mean that sincerely.
I hope you have a joyful Christmas.
People at the NYT should get their vaccines from the Peoples Paradises they always claim are better than from evil US corporations.
There should be a tag for #meOrYourLyingEyes.
Achilles- "I don't want to live around people that don't want open honest elections."
You've never lived in that world.
Well-fed Western leftists are the most miserable ingrates on the planet.
When it's available, my wife and I will get the vaccine. We're elderly and have underlying conditions that could make Covid particulurly dangerous for us. Personally, I've never hated drug companies per se (particular ones, in particular situations, sure) and I won't worship at their feet, but if they have indeed developed an effective vaccine in record time, then God bless them (and need I say, bless Pres. Trump, too?). Folks who WANT to hate drug companies are like the ones who want to hate auto manufacturers, and power companies, and modern farmers, and hydroelectric projects, and on and on. I wish there were a way to give them the experience Michael Crichton imagined for them in one of his last books ("State of Fear" I think, available, I assume, on Amazon).
Birkel said...
"The good news is that the Leftist Collectivists cannot hate me more than I hate them."
Birkel is wrong. He will post about how much he hates the Leftists. The Leftists will murder him and much of his family when they get the chance, then enslave the survivors and torture them for the rest of said survivors lives.
If Birkel really hated them equally, he'd be killing them.
Enjoy the sound of silence Top 5 Silent Mouses
https://technihelps.com/silent-mouse/
Blogger I'm Not Sure said...
"There was talk of community support, mutual aid and the rediscovery of the positive powers of the state to protect its citizens."
New York is raising its minimum wage next month, which will certainly kill some of the businesses that have managed to survive the state's overreaction to the covid virus. How much more positive does it get?
This is known as “bayonetting the wounded.”
Mikey @1:20PM
> I don't see where loving pharmaceutical companies comes into this, or loving any company for that matter. Congratulate them for completing a difficult task quickly? Sure. Love them for it? What does love have to do with it?
It is a love for productivity, achievement, and, ultimately, for one's own life, that is expressed when you trade the money you earn from being productive with the goods/services produced by others that enhance your life. And, reason implies that, since you did not (and probably could not) produce that life-saving drug by yourself, you should be grateful for the others that did so, above and beyond the money that you trade with them, which represents mutual profit. Similarly if you are a programmer who has produced a useful app: when someone buys that, they should also be grateful (at a smaller scale) for your effort and inspiration.
If you can't actually send a thank you note, then surely you can pause for a moment to "give thanks" for the value you have been offered, in exchange for the values you have produced. And, if you have not produced any values and are being given this drug as charity, perhaps your spiritual obligation is even greater.
We have been taught that physical goods are grubby, detached from our higher selves, and that the profit and productivity that is generated by this process of trading value for value is a necessary evil. But, in fact it is a profound good, and it is the ultimate expression of our highest selves.
I love big-pharam, and big-energy, and big-software-as-a-service, because I love my life.
What I find most amusing here is the oh-so-angsty worry about "the global South," which won't get the vaccine nearly as soon as the countries that developed and paid for it.
Oh, the horror! The kleptocrats who run said countries won't be able to steal the vaccine nearly as quickly as they could in a properly run world. Will no one think of the Swiss bankers, who will have to wait months for more stolen billions to be deposited in their institutions?
Really, this situation is laugh-out-loud funny.
All that pleasant BLM/Antifa rioting? That had nothing to do with the COVID, and everything to do with Trump pulling a few percent of Black and Hispanic voters from Dems.
All that closure of small businesses, while big businesses selling the same things could continue? That had nothing to do with COVID, and everything to do with Bezos and his ilk making more money than even they thought possible.
All that anti-Trump agitprop, about how he bungled the government response to COVID, while he had months of DAILY multihour news briefings describing in detail the amazing actions of his administration pushing the FDA & CDC & military and other bureaucracy to help.
All that Chinese Communist Party being Communist, making the pandemic happen through their WHO lies when the virus could have been squashed in Wuhan. But that would have made some CCP members look bad, so better the whole damn world suffer.
The vaccines were announced just days after the election.
I don't want to go back to the Resistance, and to Orange Man Bad, and to Russian Collusion, and to every other vile Democrat activity of the past five years.
All Reagan did was crush the Soviet Union without a world war, nuclear or conventional.
And he has been demonized by Dems for it, for 30 years.
All Trump did was make the US economy better than ever, for everyone, without any war, nuclear or conventional. Trade wars with China aren't wars, are they?
And he has been demonized by Dems for it since before his election.
I look forward to a different world, after the pandemic, where Democrats stop fighting against the US.
Phil 314: "Drago, I haven’t got a clue what you’re alluding to..."
Sure you do.
Just dial up "teh interwebs" "Wayback Machine" (Althouse archives) for "Strawberry Phil" (to describe you) that I used during the height of the Mueller Mania at Althouse blog where I had laid out all the publicly known information at that time and then connected those dots with commonsensical assumptions, which I labeled as such, and for which you made a dramatic show of calling those assumptions a wild conspiracy theory....and of course it turned out I was proven completely correct.
And to say I havent made substantive comments but only wrestle in the mud is simply your mischaracterization of my history of posting here because I routinely will give only the sort of response and "respect" to the leftist trolls that they deserve.
And naturally, that sort of confrontational policy is guaranteed to disturb your more obviously delicate sensibilities.
I trust nothing in/from the NYT.
There is a video out there that shows a nurse, who had just received the vaccine shot, faint in the middle of her press conference. The press conference was held at the hospital. The video ends with a group of doctors ministering to her as she lay unconscious on the floor.
I wonder if this video will have a serious effect on the public's confidence in the vaccine.
mtrobertslaw said...
I wonder if this video will have a serious effect on the public's confidence in the vaccine.
12/18/20, 9:59 AM
Depends.
If the media can sell the story that this is Biden's vaccine then the narrative is that the poor dear was so overcome with joy as she started to fully realize what POTUS-Elect Biden was able to accomplish when so many tried to fight against him and claim it was all impossible, that she got the vapors and fainted.
If they can not, the story will be how the Trump administration pressured this poor woman into accepting an unproven, untested, unsafe concoction that was rushed to market at an enormous price mark-up to try and make Trump look good and that he was cut in on the price gouging deal.
And also thinking that 'Preppers' and Mormons are smarter than all of us. I was engaged to a non-practicing (aka banished) Mormon back in the ought's and I came away with the feeling that when society collapses, the mob will be coming for Mormons and Preppers first because they have food and supplies.
At the beginning of the pandemic, I predicted that...
At least 90% of all statements that begin with these words are blatant lies.
Skippy- the Preppers and Mormons do have food and supplies. And...they have friends...and they have 'defensive equipment', and they will be the first to share. The deal is what the deal has always been. Work a day, eat for that day.
In the Air force, the base clinic always made you sit and wait for about 15 min after every immunization. It was a nuisance but it was based on experience. Some people faint after shots. I was surprised when I got out and found that drug store shot clinics don't do the same.
I'm sorry, but you can't believe how much time I spend talking people away from the anxiety the NYT creates.
The NYT is nothing, but a social science experiment for Democrats.
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