Concludes Glenn Greenwald, in "Biden Appointee Neera Tanden Spread the Conspiracy That Russian Hackers Changed Hillary's 2016 Votes to Trump/How can Democrats and allied media outlets credibly oppose unhinged conspiracy theories and attacks on U.S. election legitimacy while empowering its worst purveyors?" (Substack).
November 30, 2020
"If Joe Biden succeeds in empowering someone like Neera Tanden without extreme opposition from supposedly adversarial journalists..."
"... not only Democrats but also these media outlets will lose whatever lingering credibility they have to denounce conspiracy theories and to defend the legitimacy of U.S. elections. And they will deserve that fate. You can’t run around expecting people will take you seriously when you warn of the dangers of toxic, moronic conspiracy theories when you yourself embrace, elevate and promote the most prolific and reckless purveyors of them."
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169 comments:
This is an eye roller from Greenwald. He of all people knows that the media has no credibility left to lose. It's like saying, "that's the day America lost its innocence." How can we keep losing our innocence over and over again like that? How many times can the media lose the last shreds of its credibility?
Trump has had no concern with hypocrisy, I think that ship sailed.
Concern trolling and nothing but.
"Trump has had no concern with hypocrisy, I think that ship sailed."
Wow. So you're even hypocritical about hypocrisy.
They don't care and they won't even try to defend past (wrong) assumptions.
The Ds are all about 'fuck you, in your face, you will be made to comply.'
It's all about raw, naked power.
Democrats live for power and control. Republicans think about the actual rule of law.
That is why Rs usually lose.
"Unhinged conspiracy theories"? Heh. Greenwald likes his conspiracy theories hinged. So they swing, I guess.
Sorry, Glenn, that UFO has left the station. It's tinfoil headgear, all the way down.
I see what your doing here, Althouse.
"If Joe Biden succeeds in empowering someone like Neera Tanden without extreme opposition from supposedly adversarial journalists not only Democrats but also these media outlets will lose whatever lingering credibility they have to denounce conspiracy theories and to defend the legitimacy of U.S. elections.
You say that like you think it matters any longer. The left will slurp up whatever is put in front of them as long as it comes from the "proper" sources and the right will not be swayed as they already know the media and Dems have no credibility left to lose.
The left will only care [what little any of them actually care] up until Joe is crowned. From then on it is heads Dems win, tails Reps lose until the U.S.A fades from memory.
I suppose there is an issue here of some importance. One of the central conceits of Althouse Blog is that the events and personages she blogs about are real. The complete hollowing out of the MSM will tend to undermine that genteel suspension of disbelief. As if she were blogging about imaginary Presidents playing with imaginary dogs. Its hard to get very worked up about that sort of fiction.
The more jerks like Tanden that are out front, the better.
The media has no remaining credibility. Only with the completely stupid I guess.
I’m sure Glenn is swell guy, but what in the fuck credibility does the msm have left. It’s less than ZERO. Ffs
Qwinn said...
Wow. So you're even hypocritical about hypocrisy.
Public Democrats and the Mark's of the world aren't the target audience so there's no need to worry about whether they care about hypocrisy or double standards. Just keep piling on. Every reveal is a few converts to reality.
Have you all noticed the best public commentators never went to Journalism School? Greenwald used to be a lawyer and got into this to pursue his interests without having them first molded into the hive-mind. Althouse, McArdle, and Reynolds followed a similar path.
The laughable thing is that "liberals" like Greenwald (who are kind of supportive of liberty, except in economic matters, where he prefers to confiscate all your income and property), actually think that there are more obscure candidates who are not mediocre hacks.
Narrator's voice: They're all mediocre (or worse) hacks.
My eyes roll out of my head when some apple polisher like Sullivan or whoever is nominated for some post and is described as "brilliant" because he could write a paper in high school and then got his standard issue Ivy league degree (connections). But these hacks, all cut from the same cloth, have been wrong about everything, literally everything for 60 years.
They're not brilliant. They're not even average.
And if Americans had any common sense anymore, we'd throw them all out and actually restore small government because guys what, the average government person is an idiot and the fewer of them are running our lives, the better.
You can’t run around expecting people will take you seriously when you warn of the dangers of toxic, moronic conspiracy theories when you yourself embrace, elevate and promote the most prolific and reckless purveyors of them.
Yes, you can. We've seen this before. The Truth is what the Party says it is. Greenwald knows this. He just can't believe that he's seeing it right in front of his own eyes.
What ELSE is new?? They have been doing this and more for over 4 years, and people are just waking up to it now??? Just stick your heads back in the sand and go back to sleep. Why do we even have Media anymore??
Ehh she was probably just helping her crew work through their grief. Much like the diehards here are doing.
I shall go my way rejoicing whatever.
Credibility?
L
O
L
That ship has sailed a long time ago.
Tanden is a vile bitch... the president of Center for American Progress - a “left-leaning” org per National Progressive Radio, snicker, snicker - good luck with that, Biden.
It's like you people are vampires standing in front of a mirror.
The result of Neera Tanden's work?
"Two out of three Democrats claim Russia tampered with vote tallies on Election Day to help the President – something for which there has been no credible evidence."
*Two out of three.*
Republicans should have been mocking this conspiracy, forcing Dems to answer for it. That's what Dems and their media allies do when the Right spreads a conspiracy.
But this one targeted Trump, so the GOP hid under their desks in silence.
Greenwald is on a hot streak. Everyone goodthinking person knows that questioning the integrity of an election is highly unpatriotic now. We always been at peace with East Dominion.
Democrats don't need no stinkin' evidence!
Ask lefty Mark or Howard.
Democrats and allied media outlets ARE CREATING unhinged conspiracy theories and attacks on U.S. election legitimacy while empowering its worst purveyors!
fify!
serious question
How Long? How Long before Jo Biden is BRAGGING* about having the “most extensive and inclusive voter fraud organization in the history of American politics”**, and how he used it to THROW the election?
Bragging* Like, you know: I said, you’re not getting the billion. I’m going to be leaving here in, I think it was about six hours. I looked at them and said: I’m leaving in six hours. If the prosecutor is not fired, you’re not getting the money. Well, son of a b-tch. (Laughter.) He got fired. And they put in place someone who was solid at the time
“most extensive and inclusive voter fraud organization in the history of American politics.”** oh! never mind! that boat has sailed
Joe Smith said...
They don't care and they won't even try to defend past (wrong) assumptions.
The Ds are all about 'fuck you, in your face, you will be made to comply.'
It's all about raw, naked power.
Democrats live for power and control. Republicans think about the actual rule of law.
That is why Rs usually lose.
Do you think most elected Republicans actually care about the rule of law?
You think Raffensburger or Kemp actually care about the law?
Howard said...
It's like you people are vampires standing in front of a mirror.
Are you ready for a low trust society?
Is that what you really want?
What evidence do you have that the election was actually legitimate?
This is actually a fair question by Greenwald. Some of the Lincoln Project guys have been asking similar questions.
I like these inquiries; that turn righteous ridicule of Biden foibles into even more ridicule of Trump’s own excesses.
Stupid election conspiracies are all just as bad, coming from either side.
So, We have this post where we learn that Biden is in some way supporting conspiracies. In the prior post we learn that Biden likes lies.
1) pushing conspiracies.
2) fibbing.
In the next post we’ll learn that Biden is bad for the deficit.
Carry on.
"What evidence do you have that the election was actually legitimate?"
Hey, now, that's not fair. He has the word of a guy named Krebs, who no one ever heard of until Trump fired him. That guy relied on the word of an advisory board that includes employees of Dominion Software. They said that their machines weren't hooked up to the internet, even though we know for a fact that the only thing you need to do to connect them to the internet... is to plug your phone into it.
But Krebs said so, in a 60 minutes interview that didn't even attempt to present the opposing evidence in any kind of fair or impartial manner.
So they have that.
I'm gonna have to learn how to pronounce 'Kamala' sooner than I thought.
Guy giving testimony in AZ right now says that absolutely, positively, the Dominion machines were hooked up to the internet, and the only people saying otherwise... is Dominion.
Achilles: your getting boring repeating the same old tired nostrums. All the Kings horses and all the Kings men can't prove fraud in court once again... so Achilles turns the tables, just like a good Scientologist
Beyond her partisanship and peddling of the Moscow stole the election 2016 meme, she needs confirmation and is busy deleting tweets calling GOP Senators evil terrible people.
She really bad mouthed Susan Collins for example. Bad Karma. Also Moscow Mitch. If the GOP holds Georgia, she might not get a vote.
On the other hand, she might be a sacrificial nomination to appease the GOP. See! we killed a Biden Radical nomination.
She's the same person who praised Muslim suicide bombers killing Israelis.
I see Bill Kristol lauding the choice of Neera Tanden because he thinks she’s tough.
Can’t agree with Kristol on this one.
Seen today on some Internet news site: "Joe Biden will be given his first intelligence briefing . . . ." A good example of unconscious humor. Trunalimunumaprzure forever!
In fulton county the chief dominion official was kamalas photographer, not suspuicious at all.
Old, radical, more pure 'Marxist' left vs the identity Left.
Long-term, can they both lose?
Seen today on some Internet news site: "Joe Biden will be given his first intelligence briefing . . . ." A good example of unconscious humor. Trunalimunumaprzure forever!
The democrat propaganda outlets say “hold my beer”.
Howard is full into his "you people" phase. Yes, we know you are on the other team.
Rare indeed is the leftist who will admit that MS Tanden is to the left of Alger Hiss.
Of course, most of them don't know who he was or who was President then.
"You can’t run around expecting people will take you seriously when you warn of the dangers of toxic, moronic conspiracy theories when you yourself embrace, elevate and promote the most prolific and reckless purveyors of them."
Of course, progs don't worry about being taken "seriously," of course, they care only about power, and of course, any theories they purvey are simply tools, toxic only if they prove counterproductive.
And of course, progs can perfectly well "run around" doing these things. Besides showing who's boss, they are sending the Greenwalds and the Althouses of America a message: see, we do these things that you think reveal us to be unserious and hypocritical, and even bad, to show you that we do not give a damn about your standards and about you.
Neither Greeenwald nor Althouse has quite received the message and come to terms with the contempt--with the realization that they, too, are deplorable.
Personally I lost pretty much all trust in the the overwhelming majority of the media a very long time ago. I have a sense that at a majority of Americans are at least fairly skeptical of most stuff coming out of the media (although nowhere near skeptical enough in my opinion).
A question to ask is whether or not most members of the media even care that they're no longer implicitly trusted by a majority of Americans. I haven't seen evidence to suggest that they do. They just pump out more and more nonsense day after day and evidently there's still enough of an audience to keep them generally afloat, not to mention amoral billionaires who are willing to continue to dump money into the awful machine just to satisfy their own vanities and ends.
I used to watch the "Huntley-Brinkley Report" long ago and almost all of the news was presented fairly. That, of course, was 1958. David Brinkley added some truth to the ABC "This Week," until his lung cancer took him leaving a shell of leftist propaganda. Even Sam Donaldson said on TV that he wondered how quickly Bill Clinton would resign after the blue dress story came out. He was quickly herded back into the plantation.
The Clintons really mark a watershed between the high trust society we used to be.
Neera Tanden is a vile piece of work. Always has been.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/venezuelas-guide-to-election-theft-11606684680
lose whatever lingering credibility
That's not going to happen. They'll just run a "fact check", "blue checkmark", of "verify" that says Neera Tanden didn't push conspiracy theories about Russia. They will claim it is false and will point to the indictment of Russia Troll Farms. No mention will be made about the results of that case, because it won't be necessary for the checkers.
I think more likely; this woman will be sacrificed to show the willingness of the Biden Administration to listen to the other side of the aisle. She will withdraw. Get some paycheck from a supporter for doing the right thing. And the situation will be used from then on as an example of Biden being a uniter, while he appoints someone further left that had a lower profile.
Donald Trump is a vile piece of work. Somehow is POTUS.
Biden's proposed administration is looking like the Kennedy School of Government, a retirement gig for corrupt and incompetent Democrats.
Is it a conspiracy theory if journalists actually believe it?
The 2016 election has been thoroughly investigated.
The 2020 election, not so much.
Mikey NTH said...
Is it a conspiracy theory if journalists actually believe it?
11/30/20, 1:57 PM
No, it is only a conspiracy theory if journalists DON'T believe it.
Whatever they believe is [by the fact that they believe it] the truth. Everything else is not the truth and if you insist on continuing to believe and begin to convince others, it is a conspiracy theory.
She's not empowered. She's just another women that nobody believes.
"Donald Trump is a vile piece of work." I keep seeing things like this, almost always from "liberals" (i.e., "tax-happy, coercion-addicted, power-tripping State-fellators"--i.e,. the stupidest and vilest people on Earth. So what makes Trump so vile, especially in comparison to "liberals"? I mean, all the "liberals" I have known have had soft spots for tyrants and mass murderers. Is Trump viler than Che, the Castros, Uncle Ho, and other homicidal heroes of the Left? Or evenb viler than the Clinton and Biden crime families?
Readering: "Donald Trump is a vile piece of work."
Is that why you feel justified in continuing to push your insane russian collusion conspiracies?
Readering said...
Donald Trump is a vile piece of work.
No more than Joe Biden who claims moderate Republicans want to return blacks to slavery.
Revealingly Biden was never asked to explain this claim during the election. Not once.
At least she hates Israel, which is nice.
I see Neera Tanden as a trial balloon for a Hillary appointment. Crash and burn: message received. Can you imagine Hillary as Secretary of Defense and one of her minions in control of the OMB with John Kerry running around trying to control foreign policy via the climate accords? What a nightmare!
One of the reasons readering currently calls Trump "vile" is for insisting that mail in ballots without signature verification can't be trusted.
Of course, Barack Obama has said the exact same thing. Clearly, by logical extension, he believes Barack Obama is vile.
So, the question is, why is readering such a vile racist?
The real question is what is in store for the rest of us if these people are willing to accept appointments and power that they all know was fraudulently gained. EVERYONE knows this election was decided by fraud. It’s just a matter of if you care or not, or if you we’re “counting” on the fraud to usher in the new COVID Socialist utopia that Madison has dreamed about for so long.
Who cares if this woman is appointed in a fake Biden administration? EVERY appointment will be illegitimate and crooked. Nobody believes Biden is making ANY of these appointment decisions. We now are blessed with the return of the always wrong John Kerry to save the planet? We're fucked if this all happens. So it may be time to change focus and prioritize differently.
In these times of desperation and thirst for basic human interaction; stressful poverty and totalitarianism, banging chicks is easier than ever. Fish in a barrel. 2020 was a banner year for single guys. If the Biden inauguration does come to pass, it will be Urban chic to fuck a Trump voter from the suburbs. “He actually paid for the entire dinner and drinks!” “He took me to a place where everyone was acting normal and nobody was wearing a mask!” "OMG...he actually takes care of his kids!!" It will become the new act of defiance. WINNING!!!!
My sentiments have nothing to do with that statement. Matter of opinion, evenif his opinion was rejected by those conducting the election. So long as he does not try to throw them out without evidence, as he is doing
The main reasons go back decades. Remember, the guy raped his first wife per her sworn testimony. And has raped many others per their public statements, some sworn, others not.
I guess we'll keep hearing from the loonies on the election for a while.
“One of the reasons readering currently calls Trump "vile" is.....”
Yes, several of you have theories re reader’s comment.
Does Dave B have any ideas?
readering said...The main reasons go back decades. Remember, the guy raped his first wife per her sworn testimony. And has raped many others per their public statements, some sworn, others not.
Public allegations of rape were made against both Clinton and Biden yet no left winger named them vile or showed any concern whatever.
It's comical they cannot apply their standards to their own leaders even as they make the allegations. They're so in thrall to their partisanship it's just not possible for them to judge by objective standards.
Blogger Readering said...
Donald Trump is a vile piece of work. Somehow is POTUS.
Says the voter for Biden and Company, Corruption, Inc.
Blogger readering said...
I guess we'll keep hearing from the loonies on the election for a while.
Well, you're still around.
Speaking of vile pieces of work, Hillary is one dog which hasn't been barking. Not that I'm complaining, but her silence seems suspicious to me.
I feel solidarity with 80 million plus voters and feel sorry for the 74 million being treated like dumb rubes. Have you contributed today to Trump's litigation fund? You have to answer at least one of the two dozen email requests you get each day, surely.
For the record I wanted and said that Clinton to resign when the Lewinsky stuff got revealed by Drudge. I figured it would cost the Democrats the presidency in 2000 and voted for Bradley in the primary because Gore was behaving much like Pence.
No allegations of rape against Biden. False equivalence.
Hypocrisy and contradiction are features for the left.
Oceania had always been at war with Eastasia.
How many people like Greenwald have read 1984 and so completely failed to grasp it?
No allegations of rape against Biden.
...he stated falsely.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Biden_sexual_assault_allegation
Reading comprehension just the first failing of so many AA commenters.
Wow. When it comes to rape allegations against a Democrat, Tara Reade must not only not be believed, she doesn't even exist.
I guess soon we'll hear that finger rape isn't really rape rape.
"My sentiments have nothing to do with that statement. Matter of opinion, evenif his opinion was rejected by those conducting the election. So long as he does not try to throw them out without evidence, as he is doing "
The only evidence that is needed is that they counted ballots without signature verification, in stark defiance of the law.
The idea that we have to prove that dismantling those voter integrity checks doesn't matter unless we prove that led to fake ballots *when the only means of identifying fake ballots has been dismantled*, is pure insane gaslighting.
readering said...
For the record I wanted and said that Clinton to resign when the Lewinsky stuff got revealed by Drudge. I figured it would cost the Democrats the presidency in 2000
Revealingly the rape allegations against Clinton were not about Lewinsky but others (Juanita Broaddrick and Carolyn Moffet, among others). So the 2000 vote was two election cycles too late to uphold the standard Readering pretends to support. As we can see he supports it only against non-Democrats.
Us: "You can't trust mail in ballots without signature verification."
Them: "That's just an opinion, and it doesn't matter if Barack Obama said it too. Makes no difference unless you prove there were fake ballots."
Us: "Okay. We'll need to do signature verification to identify the fake ballots."
Them: "No."
Blogger readering said...
Reading comprehension just the first failing of so many AA commenters.
That's why I usually come here for entertainment. You are one of the funniest.
And you one of the most faithful
Reading comprehension just the first failing of so many AA commenters.
It's not clear what he's trying to say but I'll presume he's trying to parse the difference between rape and sexual assault. Rape is a subset of sexual assault and the specific accusations made by Reade are rape even though Wiki uses the catch-all term sexual assault.
It's revealing he thinks other people lack understanding when the failure is his. As usual he's so far behind he thinks he's ahead. Dunning Kruger rears its head again.
A lot of insanity being spouted here regarding the election that has been called.
A lot of insanity being spouted here regarding the election that has been called.
Nice self-referential statement. Election are not decided by calls, unless you mean a call made by a person conceding defeat; which doesn't even mean that much after 2000 and Al Gore.
Actually, that needs an update:
Us: "You can't trust mail in ballots without signature verification."
Them: "That's just an opinion, and it doesn't matter if Barack Obama said it too. Makes no difference unless you prove there were fake ballots."
Us: "Okay. We'll need to do signature verification to identify the fake ballots."
Them: "No. Why are you trying to destroy democracy?"
So, the question is, why is readering such a vile racist?
Isn't everybody?
I was hoping GOP Senators had as thick skin for mean tweets as I have for mean comments. Crossing my fingers.
@Readering
A lot of insanity being spouted here regarding the election that has been called.
You know, you seem to think you're the re-incarnation of La Rochefoucauld or sumthin'. Come here, lay down a riposte or two, never come up with any detailed arguments nor with with links. We're just supposed to be bowled over by your witty insights, I guess.
You really are quite tiresome. Come here, make some arguments, deal with the details as presented by others, or just find some other place to troll. It's not difficult.
Learn to scroll
Readering said...
as I have for mean comments.
Isn't it odd people only here to be aholes to everyone else manage to convince themselves they are the victims?
If the comments are mean you could try being less stupid.
Oh, I actually agree we're posting insane shit. The thing is, the completely insane things are what the Left is expecting us to believe.
For example:
In 2012, Obama won 689 counties across the country.
In 2020, Biden won 477 counties across the country.
And, Biden won 13 million more votes than Obama.
Completely insane. That is our point, indeed.
Numbers are strange things. Conspiracy theories without proof are stranger.
I scoff at the idea Joe Biden will accomplish anything.
The people who have their respective hands up his ass will accomplish some great and terrible things.
"Numbers are strange things. Conspiracy theories without proof are stranger."
And Democrats are blocking every single last attempt to acquire proof.
Strangest of all!
Also: "Numbers are strange things."
No. No, they're really fucking not, unless there was fraud.
I learned a long time ago that mean comments are the coin of the realm here. No matter. Personally, I don't find them satisfying, so I try to limit myself. Probably La Rochefoucauld limited himself. Or summthin'.
Biden lost 18 out of 19 bellwether counties, when no previous winner won less than 17 of them.
How strange!
And when you casually dismiss dozens of data points every bit as insane as that, when *everyone knows* that you'd consider any ONE of them to be proof positive of fraud if it was Biden that had lost, makes the game pretty obvious: There is literally no level of proof that you'd admit was enough, even if it was acquired despite your repeatedly breaking the law to prevent proof from being acquired.
So you'll just keep gaslighting. Because your real goal is to foment violence.
If he is lucky, Joe Biden will be allowed to pick his nose.
Gaslighting! Like the National Review!
And Fox News!
But numbers!
Readering said...
Numbers are strange things. Conspiracy theories without proof are stranger.
How many signed witness statements under penalty of perjury does it take to go from Conspiracy theory to Preponderance of the Evidence?
100? 200? 300?
It is so odd that an adult would care how mean an unknown person on the other end of the internet might be.
Mean is pro-fascism ANTIFA knifing and shooting people on the street.
Mean is harming a person's career because they hold opinions you don't much like.
Mean is not giving honest opinions about the unlikelihood that readering's parents were married.
Readering said...
But numbers!
What kind of numbers are right now allowed in court cases where fraud is being charged?
You know this kind of analysis is admitted every day in court in fraud cases for decades right?
Wit is not what you are doing Birkel, but it's probably appreciated here, so don't let me discourage you.
Attonasi, we have been finding out. 40 or so cases so far.
Wow, so readering is *still* lying by including in *his* number cases brought by private citizens *before* the election that were dismissed in nearly every case for no better reason than "standing".
And it's not like he isn't aware that's a lie. He's been called on it a dozen times.
His goal - the goal of all the Left right now - is to provoke the Right into violence. And then come the camps.
Fucked-up as it is, we've almost gotten used to the Permanent Coup Attempt against Donald J. Trump for the last five years--that's right--five years. But this has now gone far beyond the President himself.
They are now trying to overthrow us, the American People, directly. I take that personally, as personally as it gets.
If China invaded the United States with troops and managed to install Joe Biden as a puppet president, the only essential difference with what is going on would be that Americans would have even more clarity.
President Trump won in a true landslide, receiving from the People 80 million votes, around 400 Electoral Votes, carrying the states of Georgia, Pennsylvania, Michigan, Wisconsin, Arizona, Nevada, Virginia, almost certainly New Mexico and in all likelihood, Colorado and, yes, California. You heard me.
I was born a free citizen of a Constitutional Republic and I will remain one. I will not be ruled by leave of Globalist Gangsters, Pervert Criminals and their whore Chinese Poodle, not now and not ever. I do believe there are enough people of integrity here to stand for truth and thwart this unprecedented Constitutional Crime Spree. And even the dullest among us can see that the Hand of God is upon our president.
But all should know and understand this clearly: speaking just for me, and some folks from Tennessee, I'm Your Huckleberry.
And just one of millions.
Sincerely,
Huck
And if they don't get someone on the Right to commit violence, they'll do it themselves. And then blame the Right for it. Wouldn't be the first time - remember the "climate of hate in Dallas"?
Banal is not the same as mean.
Hey Michael K, go easy on the trolls! They're workin up their Christmas money. Soros spent most of their the cash on the election. Dominion gets first dibs.
Readering said...Numbers are strange things. Conspiracy theories without proof are stranger.
I am not sure if you are Big "R" or little "r" readering, but the comment applies to both, Your comments would have some value if you were willing to discuss the numbers instead of being a troll. Others have pointed out numerical anomalies in this election. For example:
Maybe you would like to explain how Biden got 13 million more votes than Obama while only winning 2/3 of the counties that Obama won.
Perhaps you can also explain how Republicans took at least 11 House seats from Democrats in a year of apparently massive Democrat turnout.
Also explain how only four major Metropolitan areas (Philadelphia, Milwaukee, Atlanta and one I forgot) in key states swung vastly to Biden while Trump did far better than Republicans typically do in every other metro area.
Numbers are not strange things if you understand them.
Althouse, Drago and crew:
So here's what our President said on Sunday on Fox News (transcript taken down by Fox, but still available on FactBase.
1. Re Domininion machines: "They're theft, they're fraud, absolute fraud. And there were many of them, obviously most of them, tremendous amounts, got by without catching."
2. The FBI and the Department of Justice "maybe they are involved."
3. "This election was rigged. This election was a total fraud." (2X)
4. "I got 74 million votes, and "then the phony mail ins started coming in."
5. "They panicked [because I was ahead] and they started just doing ballot after ballot very quickly and just checking the Biden name on top."
6. "They backdated the ballots that came in."
7. "They threw away many Trump ballots."
8. "We actually have thousands of votes, many--in some cases, hundreds of thousands of votes more than we need in every swing state we are talking about."
Note that to the extent they have content, these allegations have either not been made in litigation, presumably because Trump's lawyers regard them as frivolous, or have been rejected by the courts.
So then Bertiramo asked him for evidence, and here's what he offered:
1. The story of one voter who was denied the opportunity to vote in person because she had allegedly already voted by mail. Note: the Nevada version of this story turned out to be false.
2 "They weren't allowed to have pollwatchers." The Trump lawyer in one of the early Pa. cases had to admit under judicial pressure that this was false. Subsequent Pa. lawyers declined to make the allegation. In Michigan, the campaign withdrew a similar claim to avoid a judicial lashing, because it was clear that Trump/Repubicans had more people in the counting space than the Dems did.
3. "We have hundreds and hundreds of affidavits." No description of their content, relevance, etc. Many of those hundreds of affidavits were in the Michigan pollwatcher (count watcher) case, where the claims that Republicans were not permitted to observe were withdrawn.
And that's it. And this is offered up after two recounts, after lawyers all over the country, including Rudy G., declined to make fraud allegations that they knew were false, after losing more than 30 lawsuits, in the face of uniform testimony from Trump's own Department of Homeland Security and Republican and Democratic officials in charge of the count.
Professor Althouse, do you still believe that Donald Trump may believe that what he is saying is true? And if so, what does that say about his fitness to govern?
I am inclined more to the following description of the big lie technique contained in a US government analysis of the conduct of Adolf Hitler:
"His primary rules were: never allow the public to cool off; never admit a fault or wrong; never concede that there may be some good in your enemy; never leave room for alternatives; never accept blame; concentrate on one enemy at a time and blame him for everything that goes wrong; people will believe a big lie sooner than a little one; and if you repeat it frequently enough people will sooner or later believe it."
Why doesn't this fit perfectly with our fearless leader?
https://mobile.twitter.com/Doranimated/status/1333035387065933824
I am inclined more to the following description of the big lie technique contained in a US government analysis of the conduct of Adolf Hitler:
Of course you do because you are an asshole and come around here to post lies. Nobody but other lefties pays attention to you.
Pitiful.
Numbers are not strange things if you understand them.
He doesn't and is proud of it.
Blogger Readering said...
I learned a long time ago that mean comments are the coin of the realm here
Gee, is someone preventing you from leaving ?
Stephen, I have and will continue to give you this: You're at least willing to get specific with your bullshit, unlike the rest of these trolls.
"Note that to the extent they have content, these allegations have either not been made in litigation, presumably because Trump's lawyers regard them as frivolous, or have been rejected by the courts. "
Oh, it's much worse than that. In a huge number of cases, the courts are *refusing to review the evidence at all*. They're prejudging as much as it's possible to prejudge. You get that the validity of the evidence is not gainsaid in even the smallest way if the court doesn't look at it at all, right? But you guys are counting every one of those cases as if they mean something about the validity of the evidence.
Hell, it was a major story *just this week* that a court in Nevada *finally* allowed the Trump Team to present their evidence. *This week*. The first time a court looked at evidence in Nevada. Seriously. I'm sure you heard of it. It was a "huge Trump win". Can't imagine if the propaganda machine didn't mention it.
"2 "They weren't allowed to have pollwatchers." "
You *get* how I know, as personal as it gets, that calling that bullshit is the purest form of bullshit, right? You've heard, once or twice?
3. "We have hundreds and hundreds of affidavits." No description of their content, relevance, etc. Many of those hundreds of affidavits were in the Michigan pollwatcher (count watcher) case, where the claims that Republicans were not permitted to observe were withdrawn."
And this is the same as #1. The courts have mainly declined to even look at the affidavits either. Oh, they rail against them in their statements... and it's true when they shout in an outraged voice "We've seen no evidence!"... only because they refused to look at the evidence.
And that's why "that's it".
And the recounts - yeah. Trump and everyone else on his side said from the beginning that the way the recounts were done were complete bullshit without signature verification. You could "recount" exactly what you needed to, with nothing but pieces of papr. And you've had four weeks as of tomorrow to decide what you want the count to be and produce however many pieces of paper you need to hit that number. Oh wait, right, you couldn't do that, because of all the oversight.
"And that's it. And this is offered up after two recounts, after lawyers all over the country, including Rudy G., declined to make fraud allegations that they knew were false, after losing more than 30 lawsuits,"
Same bullshit as readering. Attributing dozens of cases brought by private citizens before the election to "Rudy G.".
Hey. Adolf Hitler. Go fisk yourself.
I guess we'll keep hearing from the loonies on the election for a while.
You thugs have been screaming about an election for four years now. This one hasn't even been certified.
So, you can kindly fuck right off.
Nice job Stephen. (But I would skip the Hitler stuff. When that name comes up it tends to mean the end of all other discussion. I think it enough to point out Teump has been conducting himself the same way for 50 years.)
Yes, Michael K, your faithfully following me keeps me here. Ignore me for 3 months and see what happens.
Define thug. Define scream. Find one post of mine about the counting of votes in 2016. Althouse saves everything.
If you'll notice, Stephen and readering's arguments all devolve down to "the courts decide truth, and they rejected the evidence". Cause they know they own the courts.
No answer for the numbers, though. Ever.
Well, that'll be solved soon enough. Like I said, they've had four weeks to produce all the paper they need. In fact, if tomorrow they said "Okay! Fine! We'll do a signature recount!", I wouldn't be impressed anymore. At one time you could probably hire enough decent signature forgers in L.A. alone to forge tens of thousands of signatures a week. With every day that has passed, the plausibility of the evidence (which was never plausible to begin with, because no chain of custody required either) is shrinking into the farcical.
Heh, forget signature forgers. In four weeks, you could've ordered the entire national vote with signatures digitally transposed from the registration rolls courtesy of China ten times over.
If any of you were smart or competent, anyway.
Definition of loony right there.
people will believe a big lie sooner than a little one; and if you repeat it frequently enough people will sooner or later believe it."
You can keep your healthcare plan, you can keep your doctor, voting for Obama will help to heal racial divisions.
never allow the public to cool off
DIEBOLD! Russians! BLM! Systemic Racism!
concentrate on one enemy at a time and blame him for everything that goes wrong
Bush! Trump!
never accept blame
Name something Obama has excepted blame for and has not hid behind racism.
never concede that there may be some good in your enemy;
Everyone that voted for Trump is a racist or morally lacking.
That's why they're so free with their bullshit. It's just a stall for time while the printing presses print out the entire valid signature verified vote. They know exactly who voted and who didn't.
That still won't explain the absurd numbers, but they'll sink everything into those pieces of paper now. They sure did do a huge propaganda campaign for paper ballots last few years, didn't they? Even I supported them.
So were any of the Chinese companies that "invested" in Hunter Biden and friends capable of printing ballots en masse? I hope someone has looked for such a link, at least. That's the one that would get a dozen shell companies for the transfers.
"Definition of loony right there."
Why, cause you guys would never dream of printing a few ballots to take power from people you all regularly label Nazis? You'll all applaud yourselves for pulling it off with "a minimum of violence".
On today's Instapudit, Insty talks about getting into a political argument with someone who thought his big argument clincher is, "we just have different truths." Can you trust a gang that holds to a concept such as "different truths"?
Readering said...
Attonasi, we have been finding out. 40 or so cases so far.
Does your soul cringe every time you tell this lie?
The corruption excusing left would like you to ignore this.
They can fake all the signature verifications they want in the time they've had, but that's not really sufficient anyway.
The other thing that's required is a chain of custody.
And once that's gone, there's no way to fake that, not even months down the line.
That's what has to be thrown out. Frankly, we can't afford absentee ballots anymore at all. Even electronic voting for military overseas only would be better than this.
Before McCarthy even came around, the first group the communists infiltrated and took over was the lawyers' guilds.
It was always going to be the lawyers.
Nobody takes the democrats seriously not because the hypocrites but because they think like women, in particular this lady.
The hypocrisy charge is just misinterpreting the way women think. It's not about principle but the feeling of the moment, and it changes as fast as she changes her mind.
Everything's a chemical calculation.
How many of the articles reporting that the PA Supreme Court (which should have been listed as a defendant on the docket) decided to let the vote certification continue included the words "Overwhelmingly Democrat"?
Qwinn:
You can't present evidence to a court unless you can plead a legal wrong. That's a gating thing, to prevent people from using the courts as psychotherapy or to inflict harm on their opponents.
A legal wrong is a claim upon which relief can be granted. So it can fail because the conduct described is lawful, or because the wrong doesn't justify the relief sought.
It doesn't take much to plead a legal wrong: you just have to plead some facts that make out a plausible legal theory. Moreover, you don't have to know, or even be confident, that you can win. All that's required is that your lawyer has reason to believe that when all the facts are discovered, the evidence may permit the judge to find for you and grant the relief you seek.
So what's stopping Trump from even pleading his big fraud theories is ultimately that his lawyers know that such evidence doesn't exist, because if it did, they would be duty bound to plead the claims that it supports, seek the broad relief that such conduct would justify, and then offer the evidence as proof. Their failure to plead Trump's broad claims is strong proof that persuasive evidence is either non existent or in very short supply. Which makes sense given that the Republican and Democratic officials in charge of the count, both at the national and state level, uniformly agree that Trump's charges are false.
Where Trump has been able to plead a plausible legal claim, courts have allowed him to introduce evidence, and then found that the evidence doesn't prove the wrong he is claiming or justify the relief he is seeking.
Your personal case doesn't disprove this. I assume that you were in fact excluded from a polling place or from watching the count. But your exclusion, or even that of multiple watchers, does not establish a legal wrong, if in fact many Republican watchers were permitted to observe, and it doesn't establish the right to set aside the outcome of the election, unless there is also evidence that it had an effect on the count large enough to make a difference. In the Philly exclusion case, there was evidence of exclusion, but also undisputed evidence that there were tons of Republican observers who weren't excluded. The judge was not happy to find out that the basic premise of the claim was false. The evidence was the same in Detroit, which is why the claim was withdrawn.
As for the Hitler reference, I know its incendiary, and I apologize to everyone for that. I considered the possiblity of just using the quote, without identifying the subject, but that seemed too tricky. So I ask the question a different way. Which part of the modus operandi described in that quotation is inapplicable to Trump's conduct here?
Dude, five judges on the overwhelmingly Democrat Supreme Court admitted that the election code explicitly stated the requirement for signature verification and dating, but one of those five joined the other 4 to say "We'll be sure to get right on fixing that for the next election, but 2020 stands."
That's the strength of your case.
"because the wrong doesn't justify the relief sought."
Translation: "It doesn't matter if the election was stolen. The people have spoken."
"It doesn't matter if the election was stolen."
Well, they had to steal it in order to get rid of Orange Man. There's no way they'd ever get enough people to vote for the best the dems had to offer to win an honest election.
*somethingsomething*ends*somethingsomething*means...
Readering said: "I think it enough to point out Teump (sic) has been conducting himself the same way for 50 years."
Before he ran for president, Trump was the best of friends with Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton. They were always by his side (and his wallet). Funny how he was a labelled a RACIST only after he came down the escalator.
Readering,
A lot of insanity being spouted here regarding the election that has been called.
Unless you are seriously proposing that AP and Reuters and various large Left-leaning newspapers are the ones to "call" elections, as opposed to the electors in the, um, customary way, the election has not been called, and will not be for another couple weeks. You're a stickler for propriety, yes? Can't you wait a fortnight until the proprieties have been observed? Or is the very idea too icky-conservative to you?
Nobody's expecting Greenwald or Taibbi or Sullivan or (Bari) Weiss to turn into Trump fanatics.
What is heartening is that a few members of the commentariat have returned to their journalistic roots: Report the facts and let the chips fall where they may.
They're risking their livelihoods by looking facts in the face. Long may they thrive.
Legitimacy of Biden Win Buried by Objective Data
Emerging information from the states render his victory less and less plausible.
Blogger Readering said...
Yes, Michael K, your faithfully following me keeps me here. Ignore me for 3 months and see what happens.
When you post 6 comments in a thread, you are seeking attention. That is what trolls do. No argument, no facts, just bullshit.
Did you count your posts in this thread? Easy with your face logo. Self aware or what?!?
Trump isn't alone.
https://pjmedia.com/election/tyler-o-neil/2020/11/30/explosive-michigan-illegally-counted-or-ignored-500k-ballots-lawsuit-claims-n1181826
EXPLOSIVE: Michigan Illegally Counted or Ignored 500K Ballots, Lawsuit Claims.
“In the wee hours of Thanksgiving Day, the Amistad Project of the Thomas More Society filed an explosive election lawsuit asking Michigan’s Supreme Court to prevent Secretary of State Jocelyn Benson from certifying the election results until the Michigan legislature can fully investigate fraud claims and to force election officials to hand over all election materials to the legislature for this purpose. The lawsuit claims that officials illegally counted or threw out no fewer than 508,016 ballots, far more than Joe Biden’s 154,000-vote margin over Donald Trump. . . . Citing state records, the lawsuit claims that Benson’s office sent out 355,392 unsolicited ballots. Northon explained that Michigan law requires two signatures for absentee voting: a signature on an application form and a signature on the security sleeve for the ballot. In this election, officials mailed out more than 300,000 ballots that no one had requested.”
You were saying about no one would bring a lawsuit if they couldn't prove it, Stephen?
Let's just say for the sake of argument that this lawsuit succeeded, readering and Stephen. What would you say then? Would you still oppose judges looking at the evidence in lawsuits in the rest of the states?
That's why I'm glad Trump lost on a landslide.
The Left keeps insisting that Trump has to win in 3 or more states to make a difference.
I don't think so. He just has to win in one.
Then the preference cascade, as a lot of people who wouldn't look at the evidence previously because the media said that could never happen are going to start looking.
"Then the preference cascade, as a lot of people who wouldn't look at the evidence previously because the media said that could never happen are going to start looking."
So many uncurious people. I bet it would be different if it looked like Biden had the election stolen from him due to fraud.
Ok AA commenters. Sit back and open some popcorn. The Democratic left has knives out for Biden's OMB pick.
Different whiners, same result.
It is pretty obvious that Readering and readering are trolls who have no interest in discussing the various reports and data points.
What is the point in engaging them?
Stop playing into that bullshit folks. You are all a lot smarter than that.
The point at least for me is that their responses are so in fact so non-respons8ve, so consistently lame, their excuses so easy to see through, that every time they fail to answer, another person will see the idiocy and gaslighting of it all and look at the evidence again.
I don't do it for *them*. Sheesh. They're hopeless, shameless, hypocrites who will lie about everything and are almost certainly getting paid for their troubles.
No allegations of rape against Biden. False equivalence.
Jesus, Readering, that's idiotic. Even for you, and that's saying something.
All 6 contested states that Biden won have certified their results, plus NE 2 that flipped to Biden. It's over folks. Those who deny this are the trolls.
Now where do I collect my pay?
Jason, say something.
Readering said...
All 6 contested states that Biden won have certified their results, plus NE 2 that flipped to Biden. It's over folks. Those who deny this are the trolls.
** I would think not. The judges are on trial here. What you think is a troll is just someone forecasting the coming storm. It's time to clean up the corruption mess that modern IT has revealed to all.
Glenn Greenwald is an extremely progressive columnist who seeks support from conservatives in keeping his income stream alive. He twists the facts associated with populist Donald Trump to keep blinded conservatives from recognizing Trump's self-aggrandizing and self-enriching lifestyle without rule-of-law limits. Greenwald's tall tale about the FBI investigation of Henry A. Wallace is a perfect example of his unbelievable dishonesty.
To weaken opposition to the investigation of Donald Trump, Greenwald cited the FBI’s investigation of Vice-President Henry A. Wallace that began during FDR’s third term and continued when President Truman made Wallace Secretary of Commerce, and yet again when Wallace ran for president on the pro-Communist Progressive Party ticket in 1947.
As examples, Greenwald ignored Wallace's Communist lean in a Wallace statement describing the Soviet slave labor colony of Magadan as a “combination TVA and Hudson’s Bay Company” and Greenwald failed to tell readers that had Wallace been elected president, he would have made Soviet agents Harry Dexter White and Laurence Duggan part of his cabinet.
Greenwald instead made a big deal of Truman’s firing of Wallace after the Henry gave a speech in September 1946 at Madison Square Garden completely at variance with Truman’s necessarily tough new Soviet policy caused by Stalin's aggressive behavior.
Greenwald pretended that intercepted Soviet messages and records didn't expose Wallace's leanings, but the fact remains that after being fired, Wallace openly tried to stop the White House from blocking Stalin’s expansionist policies in Eastern Europe. Later, Wallace opposed the creation of NATO, advocated abandoning Berlin at the time of the Soviet blockade in 1948, denounced the Marshall Plan as “the martial plan,” and justified the 1948 Communist coup in Czechoslovakia as a measure needed to thwart a fascist takeover - exactly mimicking Stalin's arguments.
The 1940's was a long time ago, but 83 year-old Ronald Radosh, who wrote about Greenwald's misreporting, is a unique expert on Communism since he grew up with Communist parents and remained in the party into the 1960s. Glenn Edward Greenwald wasn't born until March 6, 1967 and he obviously failed to pay attention in history class.
LMAO... the Left is now trying to use the Venona Project as if it backs *them* up?
Too fucking funny.
Easily amused.
Blogger Michael K said...
"Blogger Readering said...
Yes, Michael K, your faithfully following me keeps me here. Ignore me for 3 months and see what happens.
When you post 6 comments in a thread, you are seeking attention. That is what trolls do. No argument, no facts, just bullshit."
Just ignore him and Chuck as well. They're both lawyers on the take.
lol and the leading lights in hollywood in media and academia like norman mailer and george mcgovern, were followers of wallace,
Qwinn,
As I said earlier, I don't oppose judges looking at evidence in any case. What I said is that judges are not ALLOWED to open a broad ranging factual inquiry if the plaintiff has pleaded no legal basis for doing so and the defendant points that out. This is not a factual finding against the plaintiff--in deciding the question the Judge has to assume that the plaintiff's factual allegations are true. I haven't studied the legal reasoning of all those judges who have rejected claims without hearing evidence, but where I have, it looks persuasive to me, and I note that pretty much every trial court ruling against Trump has been affirmed on appeal, suggesting that trial courts are getting the law right in finding that they lack the power to go further on the basis of what has been pleaded.
As I noted, not all the cases decided against Trump were decided on the pleadings. Recall that in at least one Pa. case the judge expressly found that Republicans had in fact been able to observe the count. The same thing happened, I believe, in some of the Michigan litigation--the facts turned out to be that hundreds of Republicans were able to observe the Detroit count. And the judges found against the Republican claims based on those facts.
Whether the Michigan Supreme Court case will yield a different result is not known, but it looks as though a number of claims made there have already been made and rejected in other Michigan lawsuits, while others were originally made much in other courts and then withdrawn, suggesting that plaintiffs are engaged in forum shopping and prejudicial delay.
We'll see what the Michigan Supreme Court says.
Achilles, great link, thanks. I return the favor:
https://rumble.com/vbiy7f-dominion-contractor-drops-a-bombshell.html
This is fucking devastating. This girl (very cute, which helps the watching, cause it's long) worked freelance IT and was hired by Dominion Voting Systems (she's got the badge and training materials and everything) to tabulate votes in Detroit. She was there for *twenty seven hours*. I find her utterly credible.
The shit she's testifying to is utterly plausible and completely horrifying. The Senators try like hell to focus on bullshit, but she does eventually answer all their questions and by the end they even feel obligated to pretend they'll look into it.
She was in Detroit, by the way.
While you watch it, note the Senator's reactions (and attempts to stop her) whenever she starts mentioning the names of people involved. And she gives lots of names.
The key word in "supposedly adversarial press" is "supposedly." as Glenn Reynolds often says on his "Instapundit" blog: "Think of them as DNC operatives with press passes."
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