Althouse: At the Daybreak Café...

November 20, 2020

At the Daybreak Café...

... talk about whatever you like.

401 comments:

1 – 200 of 401 Newer› Newest»

Churchy LaFemme: said...: So, what I want to know is what election lawsuits are actually filed, with supporting evidence, and when they can expect to be heard. I don't think anything is gonig to turn the election around, but certainly news conferences won't do it.; 11/20/20, 8:56 AM
mandrewa said...: There was a time when something like this would have been covered by every network.

A surveillance video: Woman inside polling area has been filling out BLANK BALLOTS for over an hour, and stamping them; 11/20/20, 9:02 AM
mandrewa said...: "I don't think anything is going to turn the election around, but certainly news conferences won't do it."

Public opinion, if the outrage were great enough, might effect left-wing judges. But beyond that, I can't imagine any conceivable evidence, no matter how comprehensive, having any impact.; 11/20/20, 9:06 AM
rehajm said...: "I don't think anything is going to turn the election around, but certainly news conferences won't do it."

Elections are a political act. It doesn't stop being political because the votes have been miscounted or counted. You need politics to overcome the inertia of 'well, that's good enough and we're tired'...; 11/20/20, 9:10 AM
Jaq said...: I miss the NFL, but it’s supposed to be an escape, not a place where I have to be confronted with Troy Aikman’s puerile politics, just to name one.

https://www.zerohedge.com/political/nfl-primetime-ratings-continue-their-collapse-ten-weeks-season

What they are finding is that the Twat based “boycotts” they were afraid of are nothing compared to turning off their core audiences to their products. I am not even “boycotting” the NFL, I just don’t like their product anymore. It’s different. Like I said before, no need to boycott vomit flavored milkshakes. It’s a shame too, because sports was something that used to connect people, no matter what their politics, which I guess is why it had to be destroyed. Now I sometimes watch soccer in Spanish, I hardly understand any of the commentary, which is why I like it.; 11/20/20, 9:33 AM
Jaq said...: Even the Golf Channel insists on running political agitprop in the form of promos for MSNBC to utterly destroy the peaceful air of watching golfers play a pretty game on beautiful green courses.; 11/20/20, 9:37 AM
D.D. Driver said...: There was a time when something like this would have been covered by every network.

A surveillance video: Woman inside polling area has been filling out BLANK BALLOTS for over an hour, and stamping them

This is another hoax that is circulating. The election workers are remaking ballots. It looks weird if you don't know what is going on, but it's completely normal and mundane. (See page 03 if you are interested.) You need to remake ballots if the postal service damages the original ballot or if there is an overvote.

See how the gentlemen is reading off a ballot and the women is stamping (I suspect the stamp designates that the ballot is "remade") and marking the new ballot. The key point is that for each remade ballot, there is an original ballot completed by a voter, which is then set aside. Only the remade ballot goes through the machine.; 11/20/20, 9:44 AM
Jaq said...: If you google PGA ratings, there are tons of stories about one week this summer when they had huge ratings, if you look for stuff more recent...

The Masters drew a 3.4 rating and 5.59 million viewers for Sunday’s telecast. It is the lowest-rated Masters since 1957 and the least-watched tournament on record (counting goes back to 1995). That 3.4 mark is a 51 percent drop in ratings

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/the-masters-2020-tv-ratings

I am pretty close to their core audience, and I don’t want to watch golf interspersed with tongue baths for the usurper that the press is trying to crown President Elect, His Fraudulence, He of the wandering hands, satrap of the ChiComs! the rapist of the resources of nation of Ukraine! Joooooooh Biden!; 11/20/20, 9:45 AM
I'm Not Sure said...: "President Elect, His Fraudulence, He of the wandering hands, satrap of the ChiComs! the rapist of the resources of nation of Ukraine! Joooooooh Biden!"

He's calm and modest, and displays good instincts. Or so I'm told.; 11/20/20, 9:49 AM
Quayle said...: D D, I applaud you kind of response. Let’s air it all out - assertion and confirmation or explanation.

Tim in VT, Normally I’m a huge golf fan and a huge Masters tournament fan. But the course was not playing like it usually does - the greens were holding too much they weren’t that fast. Once Dustin made it to nine and was still - what - 4 strokes ahead, it didn’t look like much of a horse race. I eventually turned it off after he got through amen corner. In hindsight, it was boring.; 11/20/20, 9:50 AM
Jaq said...: "You need to remake ballots if the postal service damages the original ballot or if there is an overvote.”

How do they decide which vote was valid and why does it appear that all of the ballots she is marking are for the top of the ticket? I am sorry, but that story sounds like bullshit. Are the original ballots kept for review so that this process of marking ballots can be audited? This sounds like one of those explanations that only makes it sound worse.

Like when in PA it was said that it was normal procedure to segregate Biden votes from Trump votes in Philly? Why? What about the rest of the down ballot votes? Oddly, by phoning PA republicans by the thousands and checking their responses against the voter records, it looks like tens of thousands of them had their votes not counted.

https://justthenews.com/politics-policy/elections/mathematics-prof-says-sworn-statement-many-56000-gop-ballots-pa-may-be; 11/20/20, 9:50 AM
Chuck said...: Dig in, Scott Adams. Get down deep in that bunker. Try to find some more Imperial Japanese Army holdouts on your remote Pacific island. It will be 2021 before the news reaches you. Few things about the Trump election loss are more glorious, than Scott Adams’ denial. And few things more depraved, than Scott “I no longer care about the fucking law” Adams trying to describe how Republican legislators might take over the election.

It’s not going to happen, and in the coming days I will have countless happy opportunities to say how wrong and how stupid Scott Adams is.

https://mobile.twitter.com/ScottAdamsSays/status/1329801889974607872; 11/20/20, 9:51 AM
Jaq said...: What any honest election would do damaged ballots and overvotes is to set them aside for hand count, and not count the overvotes. Nothing to see here though!; 11/20/20, 9:51 AM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: For those interested in the ongoing debate about harm done to children in the name of COVID-safetyism, there are a bunch of interesting news (as in facts) to report:

“Childhood natural immunity is so strong kids won’t even spread COVID when exposed multiple times.”

“WHO predicts lack of normal immunizations this year in 26 countries, up to 94 MILLION CHILDREN will contract measles this year, which is especially deadly in the first year of life before the vaccine can be safely administered.”

“Danish study finds surgical mask use ineffective in stopping COVID.” Note the qualifier “surgical” meaning those cloth COVID theatre masks are really just for show, although they tend to capture droplets so that the wearer re-inhales COVID and that ain’t cool.

And the nationwide number of teachers sick and dying from COVID remains stubbornly below detection.; 11/20/20, 9:54 AM
Jaq said...: Remember in the Florida recount when experts on both sides examined ballots with a jeweler’s loupe sometimes, and this lady flies through them six a minute.; 11/20/20, 9:55 AM
Qwinn said...: Regarding "remaking ballots", what mechanism exists to make sure that "completely normal and mundane" practice is not wildly, flagrantly abused? We know that Republican poll watchers were denied the right to observe the process, so -that's- not it.; 11/20/20, 9:56 AM
Qwinn said...: "We would never game the system when you're not watching, you must trust us" is hot an acceptable answer.; 11/20/20, 9:57 AM
steve uhr said...: I watched the video Mandrewa linked to. Gee I wonder why the comments are turned off. Perhaps no one could explain what was really going on?; 11/20/20, 10:00 AM
Jaq said...: MIke, I know statistics aren’t your strong suit, but that Danish study had a margin of error of +/- 30 points. It also followed mask wearers who were the only person in their household who wore masks, and only wore them outside where 95% of people did not wear masks. It had zero applicability to mask mandates, where everybody indoors in stores wears a mask.

If somebody posted a poll here to “prove” something and it had a margin of error of 30 points either way, you would laugh at it. BTW, are you still sticking to the position that there will never be a vaccine? Just curious.; 11/20/20, 10:00 AM
D.D. Driver said...: Regarding "remaking ballots", what mechanism exists to make sure that "completely normal and mundane" practice is not wildly, flagrantly abused? We know that Republican poll watchers were denied the right to observe the process, so -that's- not it.

If there is a concern, they save the old ballots. You can just do a visual verification. If there were an abnormal number of remade ballots, I'm sure that would trigger attention as well.; 11/20/20, 10:01 AM
stevew said...: Whether or not I think Biden is a legitimately elected president is unmoved by the lamentations of his supporters. Turnabout is fair play.; 11/20/20, 10:02 AM
Jupiter said...: Don't get too wound up about physical ballots. They stole the election with computers.
We don't need no stinking ballots.; 11/20/20, 10:02 AM
Andrew said...: "Now I sometimes watch soccer in Spanish, I hardly understand any of the commentary, which is why I like it."

Damn, that is a great idea. Seriously. Because screw the woke sports celebrities of this country, and their advertisers, and their overlords.; 11/20/20, 10:03 AM
Chuck said...: The Powerline blog — a favorite of he Althouse Trumpkins — notes the catastrophic mistake(s) in an “expert” affidavit filed by attorneys for the Trump Campaign.

https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2020/11/do-trumps-lawyers-know-what-they-are-doing.php

As Jake Tapper rightly notes, this is “the gang that couldn’t sue straight.”; 11/20/20, 10:03 AM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: https://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2020-11/mcri-kma111720.php

https://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2020-11/mcri-mol111520.php

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/do-masks-stop-the-spread-of-covid-

In case you want to check the sources, here’s the links.; 11/20/20, 10:04 AM
Jupiter said...: It was a conspiracy, to steal a national office, carried out on a national scale. That's why the Democrats lost the down-votes. The thieves didn't care about the down-votes. They came to steal the Presidency. It was harder than they expected. They managed it, but they weren't able to cover their tracks.; 11/20/20, 10:05 AM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: Tim you’ll need to show where I ever said there won’t be a vaccine. I’m excited about three that are almost ready. You usually mis-state my position or restate it to fit your take, but you’re way off here. YOU said you want a “hard stop” like measles and polio. But that’s not what vaccines do, and my attempt to point that out was met with your typical bullshit. Is 100K deaths per year a “hard stop” Tim?; 11/20/20, 10:08 AM
mockturtle said...: It was a conspiracy, to steal a national office, carried out on an international scale.
FIFY, Jupiter.; 11/20/20, 10:08 AM
William50 said...: On Tucker last night he said they contacted Powell and asked her for any evidence of her accusations but she refused to respond to their request. If I remember correctly, Rudy said in the press conference that they would not release any evidence to the press but only to the court. Does anyone else remember Rudy saying this or was I just hearing things?; 11/20/20, 10:10 AM
The Crack Emcee said...: Why Does This Criticism Get Pointed At President Trump When Obama And Oprah And The Democrats Are The Party With A History Of Cult Involvement)?; 11/20/20, 10:10 AM
Qwinn said...: "The Powerline blog — a favorite of he Althouse Trumpkins — notes the catastrophic mistake(s) in an “expert” affidavit filed by attorneys for the Trump Campaign."

Right, because 100%+ overvotes are completely plausible in Minnesota, just not in Michigan. Right, Chuck?

It was a dumb mistake (by Lin Wood's team, NOT the Trump legal team, which is at least as big a goof on Hinderaker's part as the mistake he's calling out) but in no way, shape or form does it decrease the strength of the presented evidence that fraud occurred.; 11/20/20, 10:16 AM
Andrew said...: On the subject of the post election, I have to say, Giuliani is turning out not to be the best spokesman. I'm sorry, but visuals matter. The hair dye meltdown, the Four Seasons debacle (they couldn't just find a park somewhere?), and his incompetent appearance before a federal judge do not inspire confidence. I really want Trump to win this battle, and he's surprised us all before. Maybe the Supreme Court will cut through all the fog. But Giuliani is not the right person to embody the struggle. Sidney Powell is much more substantive and credible, but she really needs to put up or shut up.

I am afraid this administration is ending not with a bang, but a whimper. Maybe another resurrection is in store, but the clock is ticking. Any exposure of fraud needs to be definitive, and happen quickly. Same with the Barr and Durham investigations. Just put the damn cards on the table.

"Trust the plan" and "The storm is coming" my ass. But please prove me wrong.; 11/20/20, 10:17 AM
Qwinn said...: "Does anyone else remember Rudy saying this or was I just hearing things?"

They did say that. And Andrew McCarthy on Fox immediately after the conference lied through his teeth repeating the lie that the Trump team has had cases dismissed, when Giuliani had JUST pointed out that those dismissed cases were filed before the election by private citizens and were dismissed only due to lack of standing.

Fox and NR have been corrupted. I heard Tucker's segment that you're referring to, and while it sounded reasonable, it DID completely ignore the explanations for not sharing the evidence with the press yet, and I'm pretty pissed off at him for it.; 11/20/20, 10:18 AM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: You know what keeps measles down in the USA, Tim? Herd immunity based on widespread, though not total, vaccination in childhood. Protecting kids aged 1-3 turns out to prevent almost all case of infant measles. Unfortunately my daughter Alli was in daycare with an anti-vaxxer’s kid and required a spinal tap at 3 months. This is the heartache and worry I’d like to prevent but ignorant worrywarts like you are the ones who cause such problems. Alli is fine and went on to be a respiratory therapist, and has contributed greatly to my understanding of pulmonary care. But I despise the anti-vax movement and the danger these idiots bring to our communities. That you lump me in with them tells me a lot Tim.; 11/20/20, 10:19 AM
Qwinn said...: "If there were an abnormal number of remade ballots, I'm sure that would trigger attention as well."

Uh huh. So show me where the number of "remade ballots" is ever reported, anywhere.

"I'm sure" assumptions is not an acceptable answer.; 11/20/20, 10:20 AM
steve uhr said...: Yesterday one of you morons estimated that about 5% of the population in Madison were involved in the conspiracy. That would be 12,000. Assume also that a significant number of people were asked to participate and declined. After all, not everyone wants to be videotaped participating in a criminal conspiracy and risk going to prison for years.

Lets conservatively say that 6 percent either were involved or otherwise knew of the conspiracy.

So the states that must have been participating would include
Wisconsin (6 M)
Michigan (10 M)
Arizona (7 M)
Penn (13 M)
Georgia (10.5 M)
Nevada (3 M)

and also the close states of FL (21.5 M) and Texas (29 M) that the dems thought they had a chance of winning.

Let's cut that in half since the conspiracy was only operating in the bigger cities.

So total population = 100 M. 50% = 50 M. 6% of 50 = 3M. And Trunp's crack team can't get a single one of them to say what was going on? Really.

You guys are completely detached from reality. Hopefully after several years following the end of the Trump era your reasoning powers will return. But I doubt it.; 11/20/20, 10:20 AM
Jaq said...: Mike, I believe that you prattled on about how there was no vaccine yet for the common cold or seasonal flu with a “Gee Tim” thrown in and you challenged me to name where viruses had experienced a “hard stop”

I replied Salk Vaccine and polio which kind of eviscerated your point. After that, I was kind of done with you. Anyway, people like you will never be convinced, my goal is to show other people that you shouldn’t be listened to.

The mask study did not get enough cases to provide a real answer, and as the author said in the study itself under “Limitations” the findings were “inconclusive” That’s his word, he said he couldn’t rule out with his data that the effect might be as high as 43% reduction, he just didn’t get enough cases to make an accurate assessment.

From now on I will stop responding to you, I will just keep pointing out the flaws in your arguments.; 11/20/20, 10:22 AM
Donn said...: "You guys are completely detached from reality."

Here's a little reality for you!

https://twitter.com/i/status/1329720449127780354; 11/20/20, 10:26 AM
Jaq said...: tl;dr Danish Mask Study accuracy +/- 30 pts.; 11/20/20, 10:29 AM
Wince said...: Powell did respond on FoxBus with Maria B.

Sidney Powell: No, I didn’t get angry with the request to provide evidence in fact I sent an affidavit to Tucker that I had not even attached to a pleading yet to help him understand the situation and I offered him another witness who could explain the mathematics of the statistical evidence far better than I can. I’m not really a numbers person. But he was very insulting, demanding and rude and I told him not to contact me again in those terms.; 11/20/20, 10:33 AM
Qwinn said...: "Yesterday one of you morons estimated that about 5% of the population in Madison were involved in the conspiracy."

Funny, I've been reading all these threads and don't recall anyone saying that. How about a quote of what you're actually disputing before we bother reading the rest?; 11/20/20, 10:34 AM
Qwinn said...: And you do get that even if someone said that 5% Madison thing, that doesn't mean any of the rest of us have to be on board with that estimate, are responsible for it, or that any of our arguments rely on such an estimate, right? Or shall we hold you, steve uhr, responsible for the massive, staggering lies by Chuck, readering, D D Driver and others that we've already debunked?; 11/20/20, 10:36 AM
Qwinn said...: Ugh, I wasn't going to bother to read the rest of steve uhr's rant until he actually provided the context of what he was responding to, but I noticed this as I was scrolling:

"And Trunp's crack team can't get a single one of them to say what was going on? Really."

Hundreds of fucking affidavits don't amount to "a single one".; 11/20/20, 10:40 AM
wild chicken said...: "Andrew McCarthy on Fox immediately after the conference lied through his teeth"

Like everyone else, scuffling to end up on the winning side. Because Trump dangerous.

Lol.; 11/20/20, 10:45 AM
Nonapod said...: The Pfizer one is hours away from approval and they claim they're going to start distrubution the second it's approved.

I don't believe that most people fully appreciate what an accomplishment it is to have a vaccine like this in such a timeframe, let alone 2 or 3. After all, we were told back in March that it most likely would be over a year or even 18 months out. People who suggested that we could have a vaccine this year were often mocked. This is truly an incredible human accomplishment.; 11/20/20, 10:46 AM
mockturtle said...: Agree that Giuliani, God bless him, is past his sell-by date.; 11/20/20, 10:50 AM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: Mike, I believe that you prattled on about how there was no vaccine yet for the common cold or seasonal flu with a “Gee Tim” thrown in and you challenged me to name where viruses had experienced a “hard stop”

I repeat, as of now, there is now effective vaccine for the common cold or seasonal flu viruses. Yes I made a challenge.

I replied Salk Vaccine and polio which kind of eviscerated your point. After that, I was kind of done with you. Anyway, people like you will never be convinced, my goal is to show other people that you shouldn’t be listened to.

After quickly healing from said evisceration I pointed out the obvious fact that neither polio nor measles has encountered that mythical "hard stop" and in fact continue killing and maiming children to this day, an utterly unrefutable point, which you ignored as is your habit.

The mask study did not ... yeah, blah blah blah

This is your key skill, eliding the obvious irrefutable facts in order to dispute the minutae of a study. Boring. And the prime reason thoers call you names, which you may notice I don't do. I let you make a fool of yourself solo. Case in point:

From now on I will stop responding to you...

LOL you haven't responded to one point I made about vaccines because you cannot refute it. You are so obviously avoiding the subject that you have sunk to labelling my truth-bomb as "prattling" of all quaint words fading from our culture.

I will just keep pointing out the flaws in your arguments.

You have not come within a nautical mile of any argument made by me, only refuted the conclusion of an author to whom I linked quoting the Danish Study. Your next refutation will be your first Tim. Maybe you should look up how many children died from measles in 2018, the last year we have good, peer-reviewed stats for.

The answer may surprise you (although I gave a big hint at 10:08, which you ignored as usual)!; 11/20/20, 10:53 AM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: How many dead kids from measles will it take Tim!; 11/20/20, 10:54 AM
I'm Full of Soup said...: Re the ballot filling out video. If she was truly just re-doing damaged ballots, there'd be a 2nd person making sure she -re-did the ballot correctly - it's call double checking someone's work.; 11/20/20, 10:59 AM
Chuck said...: Blogger Qwinn said...
...
...the massive, staggering lies by Chuck...

Name one “lie” from me. Quote me, and link to it.; 11/20/20, 11:06 AM
Tommy Duncan said...: It appears that scat flinging monkeys from Michigan are difficult to train.; 11/20/20, 11:07 AM
Jaq said...: Are you really comparing measles now to measles before the vaccine? Was that your point? That coronavirus was going to continue forever at a low level and so death rates in Japan and Belgium are going to even out even with a vaccine? I will let that stand by itself.

"This is your key skill, eliding the obvious irrefutable facts in order to dispute the minutae of a study.”

You mean like quoting the conclusions stated by the authors of said study?
The most important limitation is that the findings are inconclusive, with CIs compatible with a 46% decrease to a 23% increase in infection.

Yet, the findings were inconclusive and cannot definitively exclude a 46% reduction to a 23% increase in infection of mask wearers in such a setting. It is important to emphasize that this trial did not address the effects of masks as source control

Mask mandates are largely about "source control.”

I think that it is very funny that you think that it’s no fair actually reading the study. How about you quote stuff from it that demonstrates “irrefutably” that mask mandates are a waste of time, because there are other more robust studies that show otherwise. But let’s stick to this one. I am all ears.

BTW: “blah blah blah” won’t cut it. People are bored of this Mike, either bring the A stuff or go home.; 11/20/20, 11:07 AM
Birkel said...: DD Driver assumes the "remade" ballots reflect the initial markings.
Based on what proof, DD Driver?
And which poll watchers were within normal distances for vision to confirm your assumption?

Should I just take it on faith?; 11/20/20, 11:08 AM
Jaq said...: " If she was truly just re-doing damaged ballots, there'd be a 2nd person making sure she -re-did the ballot correctly - it's call double checking someone's work.”

Remember when the Sheriff refused to enforce a court order to allow Republicans in the room and Republican poll watchers were not allowed to observe anything from close enough to actually see what was going on? Good times.; 11/20/20, 11:09 AM
Qwinn said...: "Name one “lie” from me. Quote me, and link to it."

This thread. 10:03am.

"The Powerline blog — a favorite of he Althouse Trumpkins — notes the catastrophic mistake(s) in an “expert” affidavit filed by attorneys for the Trump Campaign."

Was Lin Wood up on the podium during the conference yesterday? Is he a named attorney on any of the suits brought forward by Giuliani, Powell or Ellis? Is Trump named on any suit brought forward by Lin Wood?; 11/20/20, 11:10 AM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: Is there anyone here besides Tim that can explain WTF he’s saying about measles? I give up. My statements were clear facts: measles has continued to kill children worldwide and there is no such thing as a “hard stop.” Is this incomprehensible to others? I’ve always thought I could write more clearly than that!; 11/20/20, 11:10 AM
Chuck said...: Blogger Qwinn said...
"The Powerline blog — a favorite of he Althouse Trumpkins — notes the catastrophic mistake(s) in an “expert” affidavit filed by attorneys for the Trump Campaign."

Right, because 100%+ overvotes are completely plausible in Minnesota, just not in Michigan. Right, Chuck?

It was a dumb mistake (by Lin Wood's team, NOT the Trump legal team, which is at least as big a goof on Hinderaker's part as the mistake he's calling out) but in no way, shape or form does it decrease the strength of the presented evidence that fraud occurred.

Yes it does. It makes the whole affidavit laughably, howlingly bad. Because they were grafting mistaken Minnesota localities into Michigan population data. The endeavor was useless. Creating bullshit statistical models out of numbers that don’t even belong together.; 11/20/20, 11:12 AM
Humperdink said...: Responding to Jimmy Kimmel, Obama: “Well, uh, I think we can always send the Navy SEALs there to dig him (Trump)out (of the White House).”

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2020/11/obama-navy-seals-remove-trump-white-house/; 11/20/20, 11:13 AM
Jersey Fled said...: Damn. Maybe the first thing published in the WAPO that i agree with.

The U.N. agency [UNICEF] said data from 91 countries shows no consistent link between reopening schools and higher rates of infection from the coronavirus. The report, which warns of a “lost covid generation,” says children are more likely to get the virus outside of school settings.

The report also stresses the deep harm to children — particularly those in vulnerable communities — by keeping them away from school. “There is strong evidence that, with basic safety measures in place, the net benefits of keeping schools open outweigh the costs of closing them,” the report says.; 11/20/20, 11:13 AM
Birkel said...: tim in vermont is now going to point to the studies published before 2020 that show masks are effective.
Any time now...; 11/20/20, 11:14 AM
steve uhr said...: Quinn.

Let me start by saying that when I speak of morons on this blog, you are very near the top of the list. Congrats.

You don’t like 5%? You’re the one who was screaming about the many thousands needed n Philly to pull it off. Or are there two Quinn’s here? So what is the Quinn estimate?

Point me to a single affidavit talking about this nationwide conspiracy.; 11/20/20, 11:18 AM
Birkel said...: One lie from the fopdoodle?
You claimed to be conservative.
You claimed to be a Republican.
You claimed to be a lawyer.
You claimed not to be racist.
You claimed to be a fully intact male human.
You claimed not to be a liar.

All lies.; 11/20/20, 11:18 AM
Jaq said...: "there is no such thing as a “hard stop.””

So let me see if I can understand your argument from the other day. When I pointed out that Japan was at two orders of magnitude fewer deaths as a percentage of population than Sweden, for example, you said that that was irrelevant because they were all going to equalize over time, since nothing could stop the virus, and I should not quote absolute numbers.

I said that Japan and Norway had succeeded in keeping many more people alive to get to the “other side of the abyss” which is to say, the arrival of a vaccine.

You seem to believe that because COVID will undoubtedly continue to circulate at low levels throughout the world, that this will somehow cause Japan to experience the massive numbers of deaths that Sweden has experienced due to a “long tail” effect. The problem with your math of course is that new people will continue to be born and those deaths will remain a tiny fraction of the people alive at any given time.

In the long run we will all be dead. I think the world will be quite happy to go back to business as usual with COVID deaths running along at a very low level, so I still fail to see what kind of point you are trying to make.; 11/20/20, 11:19 AM
Qwinn said...: "Because they were grafting mistaken Minnesota localities into Michigan population data."

Evidence for this, please, since the link you provided gives NO support for this claim. There is no evidence whatsoever I have seen that the Minnesota data used Michigan population numbers. I don't even know how that could possibly be done. How could you get population data from a precinct in Minnesota that doesn't even exist in Michigan data?

If Hinderaker was making the claim you just made up out of thin air, the (lame) argument he makes here wouldn't be necessary:

"A postscript: has Mr. Ramsland inadvertently stumbled across evidence of voter fraud in Minnesota? I seriously doubt it. The venues in question are all in red Greater Minnesota, not in the blue urban areas where voter fraud is common."

This would count as another staggering lie unless you can back it up, Chuck.; 11/20/20, 11:20 AM
Birkel said...: Mask mandates are about control.
Mask mandates are about forgetting the diseases masks promote.
Mask mandates are about pretending trade-offs don't matter.

Mask mandates are about little tim staying excited while big tim travels along the eastern seaboard.; 11/20/20, 11:20 AM
Qwinn said...: "You’re the one who was screaming about the many thousands needed n Philly to pull it off."

Another steve uhr lie. I've never said anything whatsoever about how many people would be required to pull off the current fraud. Ever.; 11/20/20, 11:21 AM
Freeman Hunt said...: Get to participate in another free event forced online because of COVID. This time, an art workshop out of Amsterdam.

I hope that many things forced online due to these terrible circumstances will continue to make live events viewable online in the future.; 11/20/20, 11:22 AM
Jaq said...: “Let’s rule out all of the studies that have been done since COVID to decide what we should do about COVID” - Birkel; 11/20/20, 11:24 AM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: Side note: when I made reference to historical measles data the other day I had no idea that the WHO would come out today and predict 94 million kids would miss their vaccine this year due to COVID efforts in 26 countries overwhelming their health care systems. That didn’t happen here. We were not and will not be overwhelmed. As I correctly predicted in March on this blog. I base my statements on known facts and epidemiology and the math has stayed true. I was far from alone in predicting the shutdowns would harm more people than the virus and we were right, as the data continues to bear out.; 11/20/20, 11:24 AM
Qwinn said...: (And if I *had* made any such statements, they would have been weighed toward how *few* people it would take to pull it off, not arguing it would require a larger number).; 11/20/20, 11:24 AM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: so I still fail to see what kind of point you are trying to make.

No shit!; 11/20/20, 11:26 AM
Jaq said...: “blah blah blah” - Mike
“No shit!” - Mike

I will say one thing for you Mike, you sure avoid the minutia.

I am sorry about your daughter, Mike. I know what that’s like.; 11/20/20, 11:30 AM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: I made no country-specific predictions regarding deaths. I never compared Japan to Sweden in any way. Just keep avoiding your hard stop fuck up. It is so fascinating to watch you spin after uh eviscerating me. Ouch.; 11/20/20, 11:30 AM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: I’m irrefutable, Tim. You’re proving it every time you avoid the hard stop facts. I love it!; 11/20/20, 11:34 AM
Jaq said...: "I made no country-specific predictions regarding deaths. I never compared Japan to Sweden in any way. “

That’s a pretty carefully couched statement. Nobody cares about this but you and I and we both know what you said.; 11/20/20, 11:34 AM
Jaq said...: Danish Mask Study accuracy +/- 30 points. Refute that.; 11/20/20, 11:35 AM
Jersey Fled said...: I'm not sure these comparisons between countries have much value as regards covid. Africa has been hardly hit at all. Is that because of what a wonderful jobs those countries did?; 11/20/20, 11:36 AM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: Lame; 11/20/20, 11:36 AM
Birkel said...: tim in vermont,
The first time you accurately represent the position I (or others) have taken will be surprising.; 11/20/20, 11:45 AM
Qwinn said...: Well, I do have to give credit to steve uhr for rendering moot the question of whether he should be held to the same standard he applies to conservatives, and be made responsible for the statements (read: lies) of Chuck, readering, etc. He supplies enough lies all by himself... holding him responsible for his allies' lies couldn't further destroy an already non-existent credibility.; 11/20/20, 11:47 AM
RMc said...: Chuck said...
Dig in, Scott Adams. Get down deep in that bunker.

Adams is one of the few people who's actually making any sense, so it's no wonder Chuck hates him.; 11/20/20, 11:48 AM
Qwinn said...: Come to think of it, I can't think of a single resident lefty here that hasn't already destroyed their own credibility all by themselves to the point that blaming them for other lefty's sins could make any difference.; 11/20/20, 11:49 AM
MadisonMan said...: Re the ballot filling out video. If she was truly just re-doing damaged ballots, there'd be a 2nd person making sure she -re-did the ballot correctly - it's call double checking someone's work.
Yes, that was my experience. One poll-worker re-did the ballot (this was usually the case of an absentee mangled enough that it didn't go in the tabulator) and another double checked things.; 11/20/20, 11:53 AM
Jaq said...: "is now going to point to the studies published before 2020 that show masks are effective.” - Birkel

It’s not even sporting Birkel, and you are no better than Mike at telling when some point of yours has been destroyed.; 11/20/20, 11:54 AM
wild chicken said...: Pissing contests are boring.; 11/20/20, 11:57 AM
Jaq said...: "Yes, that was my experience. One poll-worker re-did the ballot (this was usually the case of an absentee mangled enough that it didn't go in the tabulator) and another double checked things.”

Postal workers could easily be deliberately mangling ballots, which In Vermont anyway, received special handling and should rarely have been “mangled” in the first place, forcing them into unsupervised “special handling”; 11/20/20, 11:58 AM
D.D. Driver said...: DD Driver assumes the "remade" ballots reflect the initial markings.
Based on what proof, DD Driver?
And which poll watchers were within normal distances for vision to confirm your assumption?

No I don't. I don't assume shit. I can tell you that the law requires them to accurately remake ballots. I can't guarantee that everyone always follows the law. But, if you are accusing people of committing crimes, the burden of proof is yours, not mine.; 11/20/20, 11:59 AM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: Dear Althouse Readers:

I'm afraid I must self-moderate since what started as a simple discussion about vaccines and related COVID issues has deteriorated into the kind of back and forth we all want to avoid for obvious reasons. My intent was to provide guidance for anyone who mistakenly believes a vaccine can entirely eradicate the threat of a virus. We have about a century of medical data that backs this up. If anyone is still confused, please comment in the next available COVID thread and I will, if time allows, provide more context.

Demographics also made a brief appearance, but based on feedback I don't think it is worth the time or space to say why I think different countries (or states) are experiencing differing infection rates, hospitalization rates or death rates. But let me assure all of you that in the end there will always be pockets of resistance, perhaps even countries that struggle for years, but the vast westernized world will settle at roughly equivalent numbers among various age groups. Yes the numbers are different now, as they were in Spring, as they will be for awhile. These things follow a mathematical course every time. No exceptions. We are only discussing a few of many variables that go into that complex curve.

Have a nice day!

MJB Wolf; 11/20/20, 12:00 PM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: See we already disappointed Wild Chicken. Truly, I regret this thread.; 11/20/20, 12:03 PM
Qwinn said...: "But, if you are accusing people of committing crimes, the burden of proof is yours, not mine."

Wrong.

The crime was performing this "remaking" of ballots without the legally required Republican poll watchers present and observing. Or are you still sticking with your absurd "it's okay to evict most Republican poll watchers as long as there was a single one somewhere in the building" argument?

Anyway. That crime, that there was insufficient coverage by Republican poll watchers due to the actions of Democrat poll workers and Democrat sheriffs ignoring court orders, is undisputed. Given that, the burden of proof IS on you to submit how, absent those legally required observers, fraud can still be established to not have occurred.; 11/20/20, 12:03 PM
Attonasi said...: D.D. Driver said...

DD Driver assumes the "remade" ballots reflect the initial markings.
Based on what proof, DD Driver?
And which poll watchers were within normal distances for vision to confirm your assumption?

No I don't. I don't assume shit. I can tell you that the law requires them to accurately remake ballots. I can't guarantee that everyone always follows the law. But, if you are accusing people of committing crimes, the burden of proof is yours, not mine.

They kicked republican poll observers out. That is a black and white violation of election laws. They admitted the poll observers were removed and went to court arguing they should get to keep removing them.

The laws were written by republicans and democrats in accordance with processes lined out in the State Constitution. The laws were written so that everyone in that state would trust elections and accept the results.

Any deviation from these agreed to processes violates mutually held agreements and invalidates the entire process. You cannot expect one side to accept results when the other side changes rules to suit their needs.; 11/20/20, 12:11 PM
Qwinn said...: "Sure, we kicked everyone out of the bank, including the security guards, and then spent all night in the vault. Sure, bags of money were witnessed leaving the building. Sure, tons of money magically appeared in our bank accounts. Sure, we're fighting every step of the way to prevent you from counting the remaining money to find out exactly how much was stolen. But you have yet to prove we stole any money! The burden of proof is on you!"

Yeah, doesn't work that way.; 11/20/20, 12:13 PM
steve uhr said...: Quinn. You are now on the top of the moron list with your last comment. In this country one is presumed innocent. The prosecution has the burden of proving someone guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.; 11/20/20, 12:13 PM
MadisonMan said...: Postal workers could easily be deliberately mangling ballots, which In Vermont anyway, received special handling and should rarely have been “mangled” in the first place, forcing them into unsupervised “special handling”
The tabulators we used in August for a primary were wicked persnickety. Unless you ironed out the folds in the ballot, it kicked the absentee (read: mailed-in) ballot back out. This time around, the poll workers did a better job ironing out the folds before feeding them into the machine. Far fewer ballot remakes this time, at least in my precinct.; 11/20/20, 12:18 PM
Attonasi said...: D.D. Driver said...

Regarding "remaking ballots", what mechanism exists to make sure that "completely normal and mundane" practice is not wildly, flagrantly abused? We know that Republican poll watchers were denied the right to observe the process, so -that's- not it.

If there is a concern, they save the old ballots. You can just do a visual verification. If there were an abnormal number of remade ballots, I'm sure that would trigger attention as well.

Then why wont democrats let poll watchers observe the recounts?; 11/20/20, 12:18 PM
Birkel said...: Yes, tim in vermont, I want you to point to studies that masks work against viruses and also don't produce negative results regarding other diseases.

Go ahead, you fucking tool.; 11/20/20, 12:18 PM
Qwinn said...: Motive, means, and opportunity. The three things required to convict someone of a crime.

I'd say conservatives here have *more* than established all 3 of those.

To any leftie here: Which of those would you say we've failed to establish?; 11/20/20, 12:18 PM
Birkel said...: DD Driver,
Your admission is enough. You cannot say whether the excuse you offer is accurate. Thank you for that.; 11/20/20, 12:19 PM
Qwinn said...: "Quinn. You are now on the top of the moron list with your last comment."

Funny, you put me on top of that list like an hour ago with a blatant lie about something I never said. Now I'm back on top? Without ever acknowledging your blatant lie?

I'm heartbroken, I really am.; 11/20/20, 12:21 PM
Birkel said...: steve uhr,
You claim to be an attorney but confuse the burden of proof between criminal and civil law.

The burden is now on you to pretend to be a lawyer more effectively.; 11/20/20, 12:22 PM
steve uhr said...: Motive. Means. Opportunity. You’re leaving one out Quinn. That the person actually committed the crime. Moron.; 11/20/20, 12:24 PM
narciso said...: Precedents that may be important

https://law.justia.com/cases/georgia/supreme-court/2002/s03a0136-1.html; 11/20/20, 12:24 PM
Attonasi said...: steve uhr said...

Quinn. You are now on the top of the moron list with your last comment. In this country one is presumed innocent. The prosecution has the burden of proving someone guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

Oh my that is interesting.

May I ask what profession you hail from?; 11/20/20, 12:24 PM
Attonasi said...: steve uhr said...

Motive. Means. Opportunity. You’re leaving one out Quinn. That the person actually committed the crime. Moron.

Do you mind giving me an exposition on Circumstantial Evidence when a crime is alleged?; 11/20/20, 12:26 PM
Qwinn said...: Motive: Obvious, to prevent OrangeManBad from winning election BAMN.

Opportunity: Acquired in direct violation of the law by kicking out legally required Republican poll watchers. Also, the 5 cities with the most statistically improbable results diverging wildly from results everywhere else stopping the count in a completely unprecedented way on election night, permitting the opportunity to establish which voters had not voted earlier so that ballots could be made in their name.

Means: Dominion, video of cartloads of ballots being walked into precincts after polls were closed, unsupervised "remaking ballots", different standards such as the legality of ballot curing applied to counties correlating whether they were red or blue, midnight dumps of tens of thousands of votes in the dead of night eliminating Trump's lead ("the drop"), then nearly every subsequent batch giving Biden the exact same percentage advantage in a statistically COMPLETELY impossible way.

And I could think of more if I needed to.

So exactly what else are you lefties requiring here? What exactly is the burden of proof you require? Cause whatever it is, it seems to go WAY beyond reasonable doubt.; 11/20/20, 12:30 PM
Attonasi said...: From narciso's link:

"It was not incumbent upon Fears to show how the Precinct 9 voters would have voted if their ballots had been regular.[2] He only had to show that there were enough irregular ballots to place in doubt the result. He succeeded in that task."

OCGA § 21-2-527(d) provides:
Whenever the court trying a contest shall determine that the primary, election, or runoff is so defective as to the nomination, office, or eligibility in contest as to place in doubt the result of the entire primary, election or runoff for such nomination, office, or eligibility, such court shall declare the primary, election, or runoff to be invalid with regard to such nomination, office or eligibility and shall call for a second primary, election, or runoff to be conducted among all of the same candidates who participated in the primary, election, or runoff to fill such nomination or office which was declared invalid and shall set the date for such second primary, election, or runoff. "; 11/20/20, 12:30 PM
D.D. Driver said...: Then why wont democrats let poll watchers observe the recounts?

Citation needed. Here are all the poll watchers watching the Wisconsin recount right this second.

Do I believe a rando on the internet or my own lying eyes?; 11/20/20, 12:34 PM
Andrew said...: Bringing up a different subject, but this is frightening.

A German doctor who has been protesting the country's lockdown policies has been arrested. It was caught while he was live streaming:
https://youtu.be/KFLd6JJ6pyY

It appears that Germany is reverting to form. But I wouldn't be surprised if this is in our future not long from now, here in the US. It's not that great a distance from being cancelled, or censored online, and being arrested for crimethink.

Does anyone know more about this situation? The doctor's name is Dr. Andreas Noack. I haven't heard much about him, and there may be more to this story.

When the police come for me, they will probably shout, "We have read your comments at Althouse!"; 11/20/20, 12:39 PM
Qwinn said...: I clicked D.D.'s link so you don't have to.

A picture of a bunch of people in a polling place. Not even the slightest shred of evidence, not even an assertion, that a Republican poll watcher is to be found among them.; 11/20/20, 12:39 PM
Rory said...: Tim: "Let’s rule out all of the studies that have been done since COVID to decide what we should do about COVID"

I don't get into these much, because I don't know a lot. I hope you can understand, though, that once a subject becomes a political issue, all sorts of studies become suspect. One tool in finding the truth is to walk things back a bit before the political issue arose, and see what people were saying about the subject then.; 11/20/20, 12:40 PM
Laslo Spatula said...: Let the festivities begin.

Free turds on the left, punchbowls on the right.

I am Laslo.; 11/20/20, 12:43 PM
Gospace said...: True, we haven't eliminated measles from the wild.

We have, however, through a worldwide effort, eliminated smallpox. WHy the effort for smallpox and not measles? Well, numbers. Smallpox is more deadly. And often leaves victims permanently scarred. measles kills relatively few in comparison, and for most who get it- no permanent scarring or aftereffects. Could we eliminate measles? Probably. AFAIK, it's not carried by other species and transmitted to us. Requires human to human contact. If we put the same effort that we used to eliminate smallpox, contact tracing, vaccination of everyone (no religious or other exceptions) in a breakout area, isolation of infected with vaccination and monitoring or everyone exposed, international response teams ready to travel to a report of a case, we could. But we don't. Why? The cost of eliminating the disease far outweighs the benefits.

COuld we do the same for polio? No. From what I've read, polio viruses live in the very dirt beneath out feet. And actually didn't become a problem until we became too clean. From what I've read, children used to get it before they even reached toddler age. Didn't become a problem until they stared getting it at older ages. When younger, it's a fever and a few days of sickness. When older- it's debilitating. Doesn't require human to human interaction. It lives in the soil.; 11/20/20, 12:45 PM
Qwinn said...: Still waiting on Chuck to provide evidence of his unqualified assertion that Minnesota precinct voting data was matched against Michigan precinct population numbers, which is outright impossible.

Seems to be taking a while.; 11/20/20, 12:45 PM
D.D. Driver said...: A picture of a bunch of people in a polling place. Not even the slightest shred of evidence, not even an assertion, that a Republican poll watcher is to be found among them.

The fact that you doubt that GOP poll watcher are in the count room demonstrates just how little you understand about the elections process. So Trump pays millions of dollars for a recount and then doesn't even show up? LOL.

If that is true (it isn't) Trump would be so incompetent that he deserves to lose.; 11/20/20, 12:45 PM
narciso said...: https://mobile.twitter.com/pepesgrandma/status/1329837893368557570?fbclid=IwAR0aPiQZMRL4D00_FgR3aFXBseSZt9Xenwlb8haPhf_hoNJQsjBaXXjOvXw; 11/20/20, 12:46 PM
Qwinn said...: I clicked DD's new link so you don't have to.

It actually provides direct evidence that whatever Republican observers were allowed were still actively, deliberately prevented from doing their job.

"Stewart Karge raised concerns about the Plexiglass barriers and the distance between the ballot counting and the observers.

Each table where the counting will take place is equipped with a Plexiglass barrier between the election workers and the three observers’ chairs. Observers were asked to remain seated or to stand behind their chairs.

Both are safety measures instituted because of the coronavirus pandemic.

“This procedure does not allow them to see and observe the ballots, and I object to that as an inadequate opportunity for us to observe the ballots and this recount,” he said.

Karge acknowledged that the pandemic and additional security requirements make “general viewing” difficult and said he wanted to make requests to the board before the actual counting begins."; 11/20/20, 12:55 PM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: Mmm facts. I like facts. Thanks Gospace. And I heartily agree with Rory that prior viral events, especially ones like the Hong Kong flu which killed almost the same number (population-adjusted) of people in ‘69 as WuFlu did this year, are very informative and we have a lot of experience here.; 11/20/20, 12:55 PM
steve uhr said...: Let’s say 100 people have the motive and means and opportunity to commit a specific crime. All done. Full stop. They’re all guilty. Right Quinn?; 11/20/20, 1:05 PM
Jaq said...: "The fact that you doubt that GOP poll watcher are in the count room”

Talk about your carefully couched statements. That’s pretty lawyerly of you.

“We didn’t let you in the stands, but we let you into the ballpark so you could listen to the crowd what’s yer bitch?"; 11/20/20, 1:07 PM
Birkel said...: Rory gets it.; 11/20/20, 1:10 PM
Michael K said...: Where did these new left wing commenters come from? How is the pay? Minimum wage, at last?; 11/20/20, 1:12 PM
Jaq said...: "One tool in finding the truth is to walk things back a bit”

Sure, except we have learned an awful lot since say, April 1st, that showed that what we believed before was wrong. If you are going to rule out everything we have learned based on conspiracy theories about scientists pushing a political agenda, you only have to point out what they are doing in the field of global warming to make your case. Fine. Don’t blather on about “scientific evidence” at all then.

I used to believe in global warming the way they described it until I started carefully reading the minutia in the studies. What I found is that it’s not the scientists so much doing the distortion as the press that reports the studies. That same phenomenon can be seen over at Instapundit with the breathless way they report the all but useless "Danish Mask Study."; 11/20/20, 1:14 PM
steve uhr said...: I forgot. You also have to prove there was a crime. Details details; 11/20/20, 1:14 PM
Michael K said...: Could we eliminate measles? Probably. AFAIK, it's not carried by other species and transmitted to us. Requires human to human contact.

Unless the same virus is rinderpest and distemper. They are closely related.; 11/20/20, 1:15 PM
Jaq said...: From narciso’s link

Audio of Sidney Powell on Glenn Beck. The servers were confiscated. There were lines into the servers from FOUR foreign countries. All extremely adverse to the interests of the US.

Remember that we know bin Laden told his men not to kill Biden even if they got a clear shot, because he was hoping to make him POTUS by killing Obama.

If we can get COVID as suppressed as measles,I will be extremely happy with that.; 11/20/20, 1:18 PM
effinayright said...: Qwinn said...
Motive, means, and opportunity. The three things required to convict someone of a crime.

I'd say conservatives here have *more* than established all 3 of those.

To any leftie here: Which of those would you say we've failed to establish?
************

I'm not a leftie, but what's not been **legally** established is WHO committed what crime(s).; 11/20/20, 1:18 PM
I'm Not Sure said...: "And actually didn't become a problem until we became too clean."

And everybody is disinfecting the shit out of everything anymore. Unintended consequences, anyone?; 11/20/20, 1:19 PM
Birkel said...: We have learned a lot means all studies done before 2020 have been invalidated.
Neat-o!; 11/20/20, 1:20 PM
Birkel said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 11/20/20, 1:22 PM
Jaq said...: "My intent was to provide guidance for anyone who mistakenly believes a vaccine can entirely eradicate the threat of a virus”

Talk about your fucking strawmen.; 11/20/20, 1:22 PM
Birkel said...: wholelottasplainin'

Why do you mention criminal law when what we are talking about w/rt elections is civil law.; 11/20/20, 1:23 PM
Qwinn said...: Unrepentant proven liar steve uhr:

"Let’s say 100 people have the motive and means and opportunity to commit a specific crime. All done. Full stop. They’re all guilty. Right Quinn?"

It was many more thousands than that that had the means, motive and opportunity. Democrat judges, Democrat sheriffs, Democrat Attorney Generals, Democrat Secretaries of State, etc., all made sure of that. They all took actions, none of which make any sense except to enable fraud, that made it certain that any poll worker that *wanted* to commit fraud, could do so with little to no chance of exposure.

We have affidavits from hundreds of people witnessing, under penalty of perjury, that they saw it took place. Affidavits from poll workers swearing they were *instructed* to backdate ballots.

Democrats twisted election law to provide motive, means and opportunity for thousands of election workers to engage in consequence free voter fraud. Even if only a tiny fraction of them did, that would be more than enough to swing several of these elections.

You're basically arguing that Democrats get to disable ALL voter integrity measures as enacted by state legislatures, conduct the election unobserved as required by law, do everything possible (such as deny legally required signature verification *even in the GA recount!!*), and saying, "Yeah, so whatchagonnado about it, punk? You can't prove nuthin!"

And our collective answer, 70 million of us, is to go fuck yourself. War.; 11/20/20, 1:23 PM
mockturtle said...: It appears that Germany is reverting to form. But I wouldn't be surprised if this is in our future not long from now, here in the US. It's not that great a distance from being cancelled, or censored online, and being arrested for crimethink.

They already arrest people in the UK who have posted 'hate speech' [meaning disrespectful to the Muslim faith] on the internet. Not long ago someone posted a video of one guy being arrested at his home. But they don't even pretend to have freedom of speech in the UK and today we can scarcely pretend we do, either.; 11/20/20, 1:24 PM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: 140,000 died of measles in 2018. I think the effectiveness of at least two of the nearly ready COVID vaccines will provide for much better herd immunity, given what we know so far about transmission and virulence.; 11/20/20, 1:26 PM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: Be fair Tim I asked many times for a definition of “hard stop” and didn’t get it. Stop quoting me now.; 11/20/20, 1:28 PM
Jaq said...: How about we agree to disagree Mike, I believe that you are sort of half educated, have this obsession with low level virus problems based on your personal experience, (Your 180,000 figure was worldwide, who wouldn’t take a figure like that worldwide for COVID next year?) and don’t really understand the implications of half the shit you say, and you think I am a bad person for reading studies you tout carefully and not just sticking to the headlines from Instapundit.

Wild Chicken is right. Just know that every time you bring up that deeply flawed mask study, I am going to quote the authors’ own words.; 11/20/20, 1:39 PM
Birkel said...: Quote all the studies that show masks work.
Cite, especially, the ones published before 2020.; 11/20/20, 1:41 PM
I'm Not Sure said...: "given what we know so far about transmission and virulence."

Virulance. You don't seem to hear much about this. Google covid "highly contagious" and you get nearly 4 million results.

Before much of anything was known about the virus, the Diamond Princess cruise ship was quarantined due to an outbreak. Of the ship's passengers, 80% were not infected. How does that happen with a highly contagious disease in a closed community that was described by one infectious disease expert as "a COVID-19 mill"?; 11/20/20, 1:45 PM
Attonasi said...: steve uhr said...

I forgot. You also have to prove there was a crime. Details details

No. You need to follow the process we all agreed to before hand.

The election process was a mutual agreement made by a Legislature and signed by a Governor so that we could have elections that everyone trusted and accepted. When Democrats changed those rules because they didn't like them they invalidated the process. You have now won an election half the country does not trust.

Nothing you can do will regain that trust until you reinstate that process and follow those rules. Inevitably everyone will suffer as our high trust society becomes a low trust society. Because of people like you.; 11/20/20, 1:47 PM
Readering said...: Quinn: ah, motive, means and opportunity. Other than that you are doing great.; 11/20/20, 1:48 PM
Jaq said...: Robert Barnes@Barnes_Law
·
3h
Two things can be true:
1) irregularities in the election could bring the outcome in legal doubt, warranting a meaningful audit, re-canvass and recount using best practices; and
2) some of the crazier conspiracy theories lack evidence and undermine the argument for the former.

Gateway Pundit is harming Trump more than helping him.; 11/20/20, 1:50 PM
Birkel said...: readering,
You pretend to be an attorney but don't u derstand the difference between criminal and civil law?

Why are so many people commenting here so damned stupid?; 11/20/20, 1:50 PM
narciso said...: as i pointed out last night, there is a facility for scytl, on their own site, which appears to be in frankfurt, although the legend says paris, must have been written from some contributor to vox,; 11/20/20, 1:55 PM
Jaq said...: Calling “absentee” voters and asking them what they actually did and comparing their answer to official information on them is turning up some interesting shit.

https://twitter.com/MattBraynard/status/1329449462662574082; 11/20/20, 1:58 PM
Inga said...: Herd immunity experiment in Sweden, not doing so well.; 11/20/20, 2:00 PM
narciso said...: so there is plenty of evidence, operations manual, affidavids, reports of publications like the new york times, which judge totenberg (sister of nina) used to challenge dominion's claims,; 11/20/20, 2:02 PM
wild chicken said...: I showed the overhead cam video to the husband, who did a lot of counting center work, and he thought they were darkening the ovals. Because some people esp old people make such light, wimpy marks.

Was my assumption too but I've never worked with ballots after opening.; 11/20/20, 2:03 PM
narciso said...: still looking for the dinosaur,

https://legalinsurrection.com/2020/11/joyce-carol-oates-equates-trump-supporters-with-germans-living-under-nazis/; 11/20/20, 2:03 PM
Wince said...: Let me see the proof!

AN "orgasm cult" where female customers had their privates allegedly stroked by men during "wellness" classes is being probed by the FBI.

Californian company OneTaste made headlines by claiming that the sexual arousal of women could "change the world".

OneTaste co-founder Nicole Daedone claims to have learned 'orgasmic meditation' from a monk in California Credit: @NicoleDaedone/Twitter

However, the firm is now being investigated over allegations of sex trafficking, prostitution and violating labor laws.

Co-founded by "messianic' leader Nicole Daedone in 2004, the company hosted workshops in which women would strip naked from the waist down and have their clitoris "stroked" by a man for 15 minutes.; 11/20/20, 2:09 PM
Wince said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 11/20/20, 2:09 PM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: One does not "experiment" with herd immunity, it happens by vaccinating the population that survives the pandemic to a sufficient level to keep future outbreaks from going widespread. It can also happen if a population survives a epidemic and enough members of the population acquire immunity naturally, but there is some dispute about what percentage of a herd needs immunity for it to be effective.

Herd immunity is why measles is almost unheard of in USA today, and why polio remains virtually gone from our shores. The name should be a big hint that this is a natural phenomenon man has learned to emulate.; 11/20/20, 2:12 PM
Jaq said...: Dialing for vote fraud project is turning up some interesting stuff.

In Arizona 50% of Republicans called who said that they had submitted absentee ballots showed no record of those ballots being received. In Georgia the number is 44%, in PA the number is 41% In Michigan, 32%

They likely stole a Senate seat in Michigan from Jones and one of those in Georgia should probably never have gone to a runnofff.

Look at this guy https://twitter.com/MattBraynard

I don’t “follow” anybody on Twat, I go to their “page” directly from my browser because the algorithms are written to job conservatives.; 11/20/20, 2:15 PM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: Of course if you follow the misleadingly named link from Inga, you find this gem which I reproduce without editing:

She also sought to put to bed one myth in particular. “We never had this kind of ‘herd immunity’ in our strategy,” the minister said, adding that although there was no lockdown, "we did manage to change ... our everyday life radically."

So the Swedish "experiment with herd immunity" never existed. Just more covidiot talking points from people ignorant of what these terms they throw about actually mean, like "hard stop" which has an impenetrable fog surrounding its definition. Really! Pushing back against misinformation is a full time job.; 11/20/20, 2:17 PM
I'm Not Sure said...: "I showed the overhead cam video to the husband, who did a lot of counting center work, and he thought they were darkening the ovals. Because some people esp old people make such light, wimpy marks.

Was my assumption too but I've never worked with ballots after opening."

Who was making the determination that the mark was light and wimpy, and were there observers present to confirm such determination?; 11/20/20, 2:18 PM
Attonasi said...: tim in vermont said...

Dialing for vote fraud project is turning up some interesting stuff.

...

Look at this guy https://twitter.com/MattBraynard

Any honest recount/audit would include efforts like this.; 11/20/20, 2:20 PM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: And what were the "everyday life" changes that Sweden convinced their citizens to take to prevent spread?

1. Wash your hands.
2. Don't touch your face.
3. Social distance when possible or wear a mask when in close contact outside the home.
4. Move activities outside when possible.

No lockdowns (which don't work). This is a praiseworthy approach and should be emulated by all public health professionals.; 11/20/20, 2:21 PM
Jaq said...: "Any honest recount/audit would include efforts like this.”

It’s going to court:

https://justthenews.com/politics-policy/elections/mathematics-prof-says-sworn-statement-many-56000-gop-ballots-pa-may-be

Their goal is to call millions of voters. All the “nothing to see here people” should be happy that such a large scale effort is underway to verify the honest of this election.; 11/20/20, 2:23 PM
I'm Not Sure said...: "Social distance when possible or wear a mask when in close contact outside the home."

Based on some of the comments I've read online, "within rock throwing distance" is considered "close contact" by some. Perhaps more precise definitions are in order?; 11/20/20, 2:26 PM
I'm Not Sure said...: "Their goal is to call millions of voters. All the “nothing to see here people” should be happy that such a large scale effort is underway to verify the honest of this election."

If, by "happy", you mean "heads exploding"- well... yeah.; 11/20/20, 2:28 PM
Birkel said...: Wash your hands.
Get outside into natural sunlight to get your body producing Vitamin D.
Don't go around obviously sick people.

Isolation for the vulnerable who choose to isolate.; 11/20/20, 2:40 PM
Jaq said...: Republican voters in Wisconsin will be happy to know that only 20% of their votes appear to have been “lost” in transit. At least based on the people called so far.

Remember when in PA there were court orders to scour postal centers for ballots? And still 41% of Republican ballots were lost. They guy isn’t even calling Democrats, but large numbers of Republicans are reporting that they never requested absentee ballots that were voted in their name.

It looks like he has identified a number of low frequency voters who told him that they didn’t vote, but I don’t know what the numbers are in terms of absolute numbers, just something like 1-2% of people called, more in Michigan than elsewhere.; 11/20/20, 2:40 PM
MadisonMan said...: Their goal is to call millions of voters
Who will answer?; 11/20/20, 2:41 PM
Inga said...: What does Sweden's lower-than-expected immunity mean for the future of its strategy? Early Swedish projections that a level of coronavirus immunity in the population would give it an advantage during the second wave of the virus appear to have been proved wrong.

At a press conference last week, state epidemiologist Anders Tegnell acknowledged that immunity levels are likely lower than previously hoped for, saying: "The development has been different from what we believed in the summer, and that’s not just the case for Sweden but for the whole world."

He also said that the number of cases not detected was "with high probability smaller than
we thought," meaning that any immunity was not enough to counteract the changes in both weather and behaviour as people returned to work and indoor socialising.

“It is still unclear what percentage of the population needs to be immune in order to reach herd immunity, but estimations for Covid-19 lie somewhere between 40 and 70 percent -- though immunity may have a beneficial effect before reaching that level.

Herd immunity has never been an official objective of the health agency's strategy. It has however often been mentioned as a probable and beneficial side-effect of Sweden's generally looser measures, giving the country an advantage against a virus that scientists agree we will have to live with in some way for a long time.”; 11/20/20, 2:41 PM
Jaq said...: Remember when Trump made it a priority at the beginning of his term to look into voter fraud, and he got shot down by the #RESIST crowd because it didn’t exist?; 11/20/20, 2:42 PM
Jupiter said...: "Gateway Pundit is harming Trump more than helping him."

Yes, I have read that assessment. On this very blog, in fact. Haven't seen it anywhere else.

The problem with GW's work is that it is based on data supplied to the NYT by Edison Research. It is not clear exactly what the data columns in that JSON file mean. And even if it were clear, there would still be the question of where Edison got their information. But assuming Edison was not just making things up, their data, together with what was widely reported on television on election night, support the following conclusions;
a) Trump was leading by a lot in early results in several important battleground states.
b) Democrat election officials in those states stopped counting votes when this became clear. This happened in all of those states, at about the same time
c) When they resumed counting, Biden had somehow received a massive infusion of votes, sufficient to reverse Trump's lead.
d) Thereafter, votes received slightly favored Biden, just enough to maintain the edge he was given while votes were not being counted.

Sounds legit.; 11/20/20, 2:44 PM
Qwinn said...: Yet another compendium list of massive instances of voter fraud:

https://missliberty.com/voter-fraud-2020-edition-a-running-list/

When we see lists like this, and the MSM and our resident leftists continue to chant "no evidence", I want you to understand: gaslighting that fucking extreme is virtually certain to incite violence. You're not creating a low-trust society. You're creating a NO trust society.; 11/20/20, 2:53 PM
Jaq said...: Isn’t Philadelphia where Franklin made his famous quote “We’ve given you a republic, if you can keep it!"; 11/20/20, 2:54 PM
Attonasi said...: Powell just said that she thinks our forces got the Scytl servers in Germany. She is doubling and tripling down. The problem is that our government is split and there are bad guys all over the place. I heard the CIA was excluded from the raid.

It is clear nobody anywhere knows everything. I assume they have taken the machines and have the compiled binaries used. They should demand the original code base and the compiler used to compile that code base into a binary from Dominion.

It is absolutely insane that this code is not open source and insane to even ask someone to accept the results of an election under these circumstances.; 11/20/20, 2:57 PM
J. Farmer said...: Oh boy. Four years of listening to this whinging ought to be fun.; 11/20/20, 3:01 PM
narciso said...: it ocurred to me, why powell might not be so forthcoming with tucker, remember tony bobulinskis documents that were delivered to fox, and then had to be resent, I know it was a whole month ago,; 11/20/20, 3:03 PM
n.n said...: and the MSM and our resident leftists continue to chant "no evidence"

It's not a baby, it's a fetus. It's not racism, it's diversity. It's not sexism, it's feminism. It's not transgender (i.e. state or process of deviation from masculine or feminine) ("rainbow"), it's homosexual ("=") or "gay". It's not war, it's social justice. It's not a trail of tears (catastrophic anthropogenic immigration reform), it's a refugee crisis. It's not progressive prices (i.e. finance, not material costs), it's shared responsibility - same with student debt. It's a Pro-Choice quasi-religion.; 11/20/20, 3:04 PM
n.n said...: Perhaps Biden will save Obama's legacy in the Middle East and renew financing the Iranian regime to sponsor international terrorism under cover of JCPOA or a similar agreement.; 11/20/20, 3:06 PM
Clyde said...: steve uhr said...
...
So the states that must have been participating would include
Wisconsin (6 M)
Michigan (10 M)
Arizona (7 M)
Penn (13 M)
Georgia (10.5 M)
Nevada (3 M)

and also the close states of FL (21.5 M) and Texas (29 M) that the dems thought they had a chance of winning.

Definitely not Florida, which requires voter ID in person and requires that absentee ballots actually be requested by the voter. No mass mailing of live ballots to everyone in sight. Florida is of the places where it's difficult to cheat, which is why Republicans win there.; 11/20/20, 3:07 PM
Qwinn said...: "Definitely not Florida, which requires voter ID in person and requires that absentee ballots actually be requested by the voter."

Don't be so sure. Pennsylvania requires a request too, and it looks like 30-40% of ballots returned by Republicans were not registered as having voted.; 11/20/20, 3:09 PM
mockturtle said...: Mike, Sweden did shut down Universities and secondary schools. Only elementary schools were open [this from a friend of mine who lives just outside Stockholm].; 11/20/20, 3:10 PM
mccullough said...: With mail-in voting, why is it hard to believe that Biden (or any Dem) won?; 11/20/20, 3:11 PM
jaydub said...: Inga, come back when you can cite an article that doesn't use "appears to have been wrong", "immunity levels are likely lower than we previously thought," and "a high probability smaller than we thought." Better yet, go sew some masks.; 11/20/20, 3:11 PM
narciso said...: so how does sweden's more reasonable measures compare with the more draconian measures, taken by other countries who haven't prevented a resurgence,; 11/20/20, 3:12 PM
n.n said...: What does Sweden's lower-than-expected immunity mean for the future of its strategy

Aside form Planned Parent, Sweden followed a marginal approach to restrictive mandates that delayed and prolonged exposure to viral and bacterial contagion of the most vulnerable. The restrictive mandates are either unproductive or counterproductive, and sustains community vectors for spreading viral and bacterial infections. With open borders, there is open spread. The denial and stigmatization of early treatments, which globally (i.e. signal diversity) reduced hospitalization and disease progression by 80 to 90%. This is exclusive of excess deaths and collateral damage caused by spreading social contagion.; 11/20/20, 3:13 PM
Jupiter said...: steve uhr said...
"In this country one is presumed innocent. The prosecution has the burden of proving someone guilty beyond a reasonable doubt."

True. However, the question of whether the evidence of a particular person's participation in a crime is strong enough to justify the State in punishing him is quite separate from the question of whether a crime was committed. It may be impossible to demonstrate who arranged to steal this election. If that were true, it would actually be strong evidence that the election process is deeply flawed. Nonetheless, those of us who voted for Trump should not be expected to accept a Biden presidency simply because we cannot prove who stole the election for him.; 11/20/20, 3:14 PM
Jaq said...: Acting guilty doesn’t help Dominion.

Dominion Voting Systems Thursday night abruptly backed out of attending a fact-finding hearing that was set for Friday morning with the Pennsylvania House State Government Committee.

At a press conference Friday morning, State Govt Committee Chair Seth Grove said the 1.3. million Pennsylvanians who used Dominion’s voting machines have been “hung out to dry and slapped in their faces.”

Pennsylvania lawmakers had scheduled the hearing with the voting machine manufacturer “to help identify and correct any irregularities in the election process,” according to the House Republican Caucus.; 11/20/20, 3:18 PM
roesch/voltaire said...: the gang that couldn't sue straight example number what :https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2020/11/do-trumps-lawyers-know-what-they-are-doing.php

“Here’s the problem: the townships and precincts listed in paragraphs 11 and 17 of the affidavit are not in Michigan. They are in Minnesota,” Hinderaker declared. “Monticello, Albertville, Lake Lillian, Houston, Brownsville, Runeberg, Wolf Lake, Height of Land, Detroit Lakes, Frazee, Kandiyohi–these are all towns in Minnesota.”; 11/20/20, 3:20 PM
Jaq said...: In steve uhr’s Amerika, Trump is presumed guilty and any election he wins is presumed tainted and a special prosecutor is required to to spend years working to trap him in a process crime, and elections that Democrats win are presumed to be clean on honest and so no investigation is required.; 11/20/20, 3:21 PM
Qwinn said...: r/v - Chuck already posted that crap and lied about it. Second day in a row you're proving you post without reading the thread, miss all the rebuttals, and waste everyone's time.; 11/20/20, 3:26 PM
Rusty said...: Oh. I see. As long as the vote fraud occurred in Minnesota it's OK then?; 11/20/20, 3:26 PM
effinayright said...: I want Dana Perino to eat a steaming Dixie cup of excrement on camera, in view of her support for Dominion yesterday and her hope they would sue Powell and Rudy for defamation.

Shutting down your PA operations and fleeing the jurisdiction is not, as they say, a good look.; 11/20/20, 3:29 PM
roesch/voltaire said...: So are you saying Hinderaker is lying about the fact that this happened in court? I don't understand Chuck was asked to produce evidence and here is the link, what is your. problem?; 11/20/20, 3:30 PM
Jaq said...: The Board of Elections in Georgia's Floyd County voted Thursday to oust Chief of Elections Clerk Robert Brady after officials found thousands of uncounted ballots.

Hmmm.

I hope Dominion sues, discovery would be epic, and we need to be able to trust such a key part of our voting infrastructure. Air it all.; 11/20/20, 3:31 PM
effinayright said...: D.D. Driver said:

The key point is that for each remade ballot, there is an original ballot completed by a voter, which is then set aside. Only the remade ballot goes through the machine.

***************

Unless you were actually there, you do not know that's what happened. Instead you are claiming that those workers in avoting precinct known and shown to be engaging in fraud, what you see on that video was entirely legit.; 11/20/20, 3:34 PM
Qwinn said...: "I don't understand Chuck was asked to produce evidence and here is the link, what is your. problem?"

Chuck already posted that link, and then claimed it said that Minnesota voting data by precinct was matched against Michigan population data by precinct, and thus all the numbers are wrong and don't even represent what happened in Minnesota either. Which is a flaming pile of bullshit, and not supported at all by that link.; 11/20/20, 3:34 PM
Qwinn said...: Also, Lin Wood is not part of Trump's legal team, and Trump was not named in that suit, so claiming it was "Trump's legal team" is bullshit.; 11/20/20, 3:35 PM
Attonasi said...: D Tom Wolf, Governor of PA doesn't want an independent audit of the 2020 election.

“The Legislative Budget and Finance Committee has no expertise or role in election administration and no statutory authority outside the fiscal realm, and it is inappropriate to pretend it does,” Governor Tom Wolf, a Democrat, said in a statement. “An audit by the LBFC would be incomplete, duplicative, and unreliable.”

“Interference by partisan legislators in Harrisburg is wrong. It creates chaos and confusion and should be rejected. A reliable audit conducted by election experts is the best way for all Pennsylvanians to trust the results of this election,” Wolf said.

Why?; 11/20/20, 3:36 PM
Wa St Blogger said...: In this country one is presumed innocent. The prosecution has the burden of proving someone guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

There are two separate things in question here. One is proving WHO robbed the jewelry store, and two is that the store was robbed. Insurance settlements are not contingent on proving who did it, only that it was done.

Determining that the election was rife with fraud does not require specific suspects to be found guilty and thus invalidating the vote does not require people to have been convicted.; 11/20/20, 3:38 PM
Qwinn said...: "Interference by partisan legislators in Harrisburg is wrong."

At least those partisan legislators are actually empowered to set election law. Interference by partisan executive and judicial that *don't* have power to set election law is also wrong, but apparently perfectly fine according to Wolf and every Democrat judge in the state.; 11/20/20, 3:39 PM
Jaq said...: "The Legislative Budget and Finance Committee has no expertise or role in election administration and no statutory authority outside the fiscal realm, and it is inappropriate to pretend it does,”

You know who has no role in setting the rules of the election per the US constitution? The governor or the courts of that state. Of course the Democrat governor got elected through that fraud, and so he doesn’t want it examined by anybody in any practical sense. This is one more attempt to run out the clock.

They probably told their buddies at Dominion to skiddadle to waste more time.; 11/20/20, 3:44 PM
Inga said...: Sweden now has a higher Covid-19 infection rate than both France and Britain after shunning lockdowns in favour of a 'herd immunity' approach to the pandemic.

Hospital admissions for coronavirus patients have almost doubled each week in Sweden, with the country recording 208,295 cases and 6,406 deaths since the outbreak began.

Though this is far fewer than in Britain, Spain and France, the per capita infection rate in Sweden has now far surpassed all three nations.

“The number of Swedes in intensive care with coronavirus is doubling each week, The Sun reported, and is far higher than in Austria and Slovakia.

Here, hospital admissions for Covid-19 patients are doubling every nine days.

Goran Hansson, the head of the Swedish Royal Academy of Sciences, has warned the situation in Sweden is 'serious' with the number of cases increasing at an 'accelerating speed.'

On Monday, Sweden's former state epidemiologist warned the country has been left unprepared for a second wave of coronavirus because of 'wishful thinking' by its top virus expert.

Annika Linde said Anders Tegnell got it wrong when he predicted that 'herd immunity' built up over the summer would protect the country when winter came.

This approach has seen cases and deaths soar, and on Monday forced Prime Minister Stefan Lofven to announce that gatherings would be limited to a maximum of eight people.

Mr Lofven said Swedes should also avoid going to gyms and libraries, and cancel any dinner parties they had planned.

'This is the new norm for the entire society,' he said. 'It's going to get worse. Do your duty and take responsibility for stopping the spread of the virus.'”; 11/20/20, 3:45 PM
Drago said...: steve uhr: "I forgot. You also have to prove there was a crime. Details details"

Yes. The lunatic russia collusion, hoax dossier, Kavanaugh is a gang rapist truther steve uhr wrote that.

Today.

As if the last 4 years never existed at all.

History began anew for him just this morning.

Again.; 11/20/20, 3:53 PM
Michael K said...: It is absolutely insane that this code is not open source and insane to even ask someone to accept the results of an election under these circumstances.

Yes, I wonder who made that decision and when ?; 11/20/20, 3:55 PM
J. Farmer said...: Perhaps Biden will save Obama's legacy in the Middle East and renew financing the Iranian regime to sponsor international terrorism under cover of JCPOA or a similar agreement.

On the bright side, we’ll all get to listen to know-nothings like you talk bullshit.; 11/20/20, 4:01 PM
rhhardin said...: Open source code fares no better in verifiability.
Ken Thompson Turing Lecture pdf

You need access to the compiler and its history, the assembler, the microcode assembler, and the history of any code used in making them.

The ultimate lesson is "Don't patronize any company that hires people like me," at that degree of cleverness.

On the other hand the motivation is huge and somebody will always do it.; 11/20/20, 4:03 PM