October 21, 2020

What if a woman had been caught — like Jeffrey Toobin — masturbating on camera during a Zoom business call?

This is my second burning-a-witch-at-the-stake post of the day... and I did not go looking for more witch-burning material. It fell on me in the normal course of blogging. 

I'm reading "Rose McGowan slams Jeffrey Toobin defenders amid ‘#MeToobin’ scandal" (NY Post): 
“Can you all imagine if a conservative woman was caught masturbating on an @zoom meeting like #MeToobin? If it had been a liberal woman? If it had been a [woman of color]?” the #MeToo activist wrote Tuesday on Twitter. 
Responding to another Twitter user, she mused, “Do you think there’d be liberal ‘intellectuals’ rising to defend her? She’d be burned at the stake.

Really? I think if a woman mishandling her computer camera exposed herself accidentally, there would be tremendous sympathy and an immediate understanding that it would not be talked about — about like what you'd do if you walked in on someone using the toilet. If the circumstances indicated that she was intentionally exhibiting herself — could that have been the case with Toobin? — then I think people would regard her as having a very serious mental problem and would close ranks around her and try to protect and help her. In either case — accidental or intentional — I don't think a woman would have been as badly treated as Toobin — who has been ruthlessly ridiculed and humiliated.

148 comments:

rcocean said...

what would happen if a conservative man had done this? There'd be NO minimizing it, or trying "understand" it. The culprit would not be put on "temporary leave" for "Personal reasons". My liberal radio talk show host discussed Toobin briefly and spent the whole time talking about computers, zoom, and how 'this could happen to anyone'. If it was a conservative, he'd be fired, and subject to 24/7 vicious non-stop mockery.

CharlieL said...

ruthlessly --- humiliated. As he should be. But I agree, a woman would get sympathy and advice to seek mental help.

Lucid-Ideas said...

Yeah no, bean-flicking in such a situation is just as nasty, unprofessional, and disgusting as toobin'. For me no chick would be getting a pussy-pass just for being a chick.

Yancey Ward said...

McGowan, of course, is mostly wrong. Had Toobin been Tucker Carlson, then, yeah, he would have been completely crucified and never allowed to work on television or print again. A conservative woman would be treated more harshly than a progressive woman- the conservative would probably be treated like Toobin, while the progressive wouldn't suffer more than a day or two of suspension.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Anyone masturbating in a public format or during a work meeting whether woman or man....has lost their sanity IMO. Plus it shows a complete disregard and disdain for the others around you who don't want to participate in your sexual fantasy.

Really? You can't wait until you are in a private setting? You can't use a modicum of manners or common sense.

I get having "kinks" and all that. The thrill of it all. But geeze.....get a grip ...oops. I mean have some self control 😁

Tom T. said...

The more relevant question is what would have happened to a conservative man, and we all know that he'd be denounced as deviant and predatory. But the news industry protects its own. Remember that Matt Lauer could lock people in his office by pressing a button.

tim maguire said...

As Celeste Barber well knows, it depends on how attractive the woman is.

mezzrow said...

Agreed. Unless the woman is labeled as a conservative.

That's why Barrett had to be asked about her record of sexual misconduct. Like LBJ said, make 'em deny it.

Anonymous said...

Well, maybe if the person in question hadn't been such an insufferable ass their whole life.

Doug said...

I think you're wrong. I think a woman would be brutally ridiculed in the same set of circs. Unless she were insanely hot.

Michael K said...

A lot would depend on whether she had a history of creepy behavior in the past, like Toobin has. For example, having sex with young males.

Dave Begley said...

Ann:

No person in their right mind - male or female, gay or straight, white or black - would ever do such a thing during the work day. Heck, I have NEVER even had a beer during lunch.

This is not a high bar. Some would say, nothing is a high bar. Or something like that. A blogger in Wisconsin has a maxim on this. We, as a society, have some standards; even today.

People who do this are nuts and need to be ostracized. I don't want to say burned at the stake as that could be understood as inciting violence and I could be banned from Twitter and Facebook. I'm already banned at AMZN book reviews.

RigelDog said...

I totally agree with Althouse. A woman in this situation would be treated mostly with sympathy and a quick move on to other stories. If she were a "conservative" woman, I imagine the sympathy would be lacking and the reactions would be endless mocking---but not that she was doing something dangerous/illegal.

Sometimes Rose McGowan has an insightful observation, but mostly she just has a monomaniacal reaction to anything she can shoehorn into her me-too template.

MikeM said...

Worry not about Mr. Toobin"s psychic damage. He is a solipsist unaware and uncaring of others. His best times are with a mirror and himself.

Spiros said...

What about the woman who forgot she was on camera and started to poop...

Some people compared this woman's experience with the common adolescent nightmare of going to school without any pants on.

Drago said...

"What if a woman had been caught — like Jeffrey Toobin — masturbating on camera during a Zoom business call?"

I believe all men attending the meeting would have had a portion of their weekly pay diverted without their consent to the woman for services rendered as a matter of principle.

Eleanor said...

If someone is masturbating during a Zoom meeting, male or female, I would assume some of the sexual excitement would be coming from the possibility of being caught.

wendybar said...

Men would have been thrilled!!

Charlie said...

I, for one, would be in favor of such a scenario.

Earnest Prole said...

Exhibitionism: Our society perceives sexually aberrant males as more threatening than sexually aberrant females. Surely that’s just a superstition, right?

Joe Smith said...

Depends on how hot she is...

All kidding aside, Toobin's behavior is either the result of some sort of sex addiction or sexual harrassment.

He got a thrill out of the fact that he 'could' be caught, so who knows how many times this had already happened. I'd bet he was doing it on every audio-only call.

Or he was taking a page out of the Weinstein/Rose playbook: 'Oh gosh, my robe just happened to come open...I was just getting out of the shower and my towel just happened to slip.

It's a way to wag your wienie without putting on a raincoat and hanging out at the playground.

Big Mike said...

Really? I think if a woman mishandling her computer camera exposed herself accidentally, there would be tremendous sympathy and an immediate understanding that it would not be talked about — about like what you'd do if you walked in on someone using the toilet.

Nah. Liberals would find a way to say that women are too stupid to use a computer, except they’d use language that would obfuscate their sexism so that people would feel ashamed of laughing at the poor thing.

Which, I guess, is what Althouse is saying with this sentence.

PM said...

Ok zoomer.

Tom T. said...

Reader poll: Raise your hand (eww, your other hand) if you think you could keep your job after being caught doing what Toobin was doing on a work call. Male or female.

stevew said...

A woman in that circumstance would be celebrated as brave, edgy. Like Celeste Barber.

rehajm said...

Once a year or so we get a car off the interstate and the cops find the lady's toy on the floor. If the woman caught on zoom was also on the interstate she's worthy of promotion just for the multitasking!

Kate said...

For this thought exercise, who is the woman? Is she MILF-y? Is she Millenial? Is she Pelosi?

Details matter.

Unknown said...

Am I right, here, Ann? You are sympathetic to Toobin on this? Doesn’t a guy have enough off-hours in the day to feed his appetites? The man is a Patantagruel character. Sympathy is misplaced.

Mary Beth said...

Toobin was always so ready to attack others over sex-related rumors, this is karma.

The story would have never gotten out if it had been a white liberal woman. Her co-workers would have kept it to themselves. A conservative or a woman of color would have been mocked endlessly.

It does make me wonder, do we know who told on Toobin?

NCMoss said...

I'm surprised Toobin hasn't been politically re-assigned as a conservative republican; big media can always correct it later.

rehajm said...

Toobin can zoom with a french tickler on his John Thomas for all I care, just stop wheeling him out on TV like he's important.

Drago said...

Hey, if the Biden clan can have family members hanging out naked with underage members of the opposite sex and, allegedly, having sex overseas with underage Chinese girls while being filmed AND being paid millions to help the ChiComs steal US technology and purchase American foreign policy decisions, then what's the big deal with Toobin?

Robert Marshall said...

Toobin may have been ridiculed and humiliated, but he hasn't been "badly treated." He deserves every bit of it, and more. As Bugs would say, 'what a maroon!'

NorthOfTheOneOhOne said...

Really? I think if a woman mishandling her computer camera exposed herself accidentally, there would be tremendous sympathy and an immediate understanding that it would not be talked about...

McGowan is totally off the mark when she uses a conservative woman as an example. It would be ridicule city in that case.

jaydub said...

Depends on who the woman is. Doubtful either Kayleigh McEnany one the one hand or Joy Behar on the other would be treated with kid gloves by partisans of either stripe.

Drago said...

NCMoss: "I'm surprised Toobin hasn't been politically re-assigned as a conservative republican; big media can always correct it later."

I guarantee that by the end of this very week the lefties and their trained LLR-lefty lap poodles at Althouse blog will be screaming to the rooftops that Toobin is the perfect example of Trump's "Northern Strategy" where the democraticals sexual deviants, including Joe and Hunter Biden along with Toobin, were really republican's all along.

Drago said...

Unknown: "Am I right, here, Ann? You are sympathetic to Toobin on this? Doesn’t a guy have enough off-hours in the day to feed his appetites? The man is a Patantagruel character. Sympathy is misplaced"

Althouse perhaps feels a bit of kinship with Toobin who no doubt also hates The Babylon Bee.

And when it comes to democrat transgressions, isn't it the Babylon Bee that is real culprit?

Iman said...

In either case — accidental or intentional — I don't think a woman would have been as badly treated as Toobin — who has been ruthlessly ridiculed and humiliated.

“Badly treated“? After all the lies and disinformation this corksoaker has issued, he’s fortunate to be relegated to being a joke.

Charlie said...

"The main difference between working in journalism and working at Panda Express is you probably can get fired for masturbating at work at Panda Express"-Iowahawk

Balfegor said...

I think the transgression might not be seen as quite as gross as Toobin, but it would still be masturbating during a work meeting. Even if it's accidental in the sense he/she thought the camera was off, it's not accidental in the sense that you "accidentally" find yourself masturbating during a work meeting with your colleagues. That's a deliberate decision. Unless there's something mentally wrong with you.

But it's been pretty surprising how people have twisted themselves into knots to minimize the grotesque inappropriateness of Toobin pleasuring himself during a work meeting. I don't think people would go to such lengths for a woman. But it probably depends on who the woman was. Toobin is obviously getting special treatment because of who he is -- for a normal man, this would probably be a firing offense, and only marginal voices would be trying to minimize it.

Harold said...

There was the woman who broadcast herself using the toilet on a zoom call. there may have been sympathy, but it was certainly talked about. https://www.the-sun.com/news/579215/work-from-home-toilet-chat/

tim in vermont said...

“What’s that buzzing noise? Does anybody else here it? I think that somebody has a microphone problem..."

Tom said...

I’m sorry but if you masturbate on a zoom call on video, you’re subject to ridicule. Everyone expects that from Cardi B but for the rest of us, I’m not sure gender matters.

tcrosse said...

What if a trans-woman whips her dick out on camera during a Zoom business call?

Lurker21 said...


Toobin gets mocked and jeered at, but there's a sense that this was a very "guy" thing to do -- something a 60 year old shouldn't get caught doing, but something younger guys might do. If a woman masturbates on a Zoom conference, people wouldn't know how to react. Some would pity her and hope she got help. Others would mock and attack her. Political views would also have an effect. But there would be an undercurrent of unbelief and horror that wasn't present in Toobin's case. People fear unbridled male sexuality for its effects in the real world. It has dangers that unleashed female sexuality doesn't have. But conceptually, people fear and recoil from anarchic, uncontrolled female sexuality more than male, because they can't process it or fit it into the same comfortable framework that "men being men" provides. Instead it's "a woman being a crazy slut."

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

If the Biden, Clinton and Pelosi families can amass wealth in secret off of international pay-to-play schemes - what's a little on screen dick action by a leftwing journalist?

Dave Begley said...

Good question. Who ratted out Toobin. My money is on Jane Mayer. She will get more space in the mag for her stuff now that Jeff is gone. And she's just a nasty piece of work too.

DarkHelmet said...

"Reader poll: Raise your hand (eww, your other hand) if you think you could keep your job after being caught doing what Toobin was doing on a work call. Male or female."

I'm pretty sure that simply describing Toobin's activities out loud at the office would run afoul of all my employer's rules on harassment, diversity and inclusion, racial oppression and global warming. I wouldn't just be sacked, I'd be un-personed.

Sebastian said...

"who has been ruthlessly ridiculed and humiliated"

What's the prog argument for ridiculing him?

OK, so some women may have taken offense--is that the standard?

But as a form of sexual expression, what's wrong with it? For example, why is it worse than what Clinton did with Monica, which no prog ridiculed and did not banish Bill from prog circles? Where is the prog line these days?

Leland said...

If a woman was using the toilet while on a zoom call and accidentally exposed something; I agree some would laugh it off immediately and that would be the end of it. Heck, if she was nursing an infant, I doubt anyone would comment. But if she was petting the kitty because she was so depraved of good sex, she just couldn't wait for the call to end; I'd expect others to complain about that inappropriate behavior.

Yesterday it was insufficient maintenance sex. Now the excuse is Toobin may a mental problem? I'd say "get fucked" is actually the appropriate response here, except Toobin was doing the even more appropriate, "go fuck yourself".

Fernandinande said...

Does the woman in question have a penis?

I'm Full of Soup said...

I wonder what Jill Biden will cook for Thanksgiving dinner if Trump wins. Thin Hunter will be invited?

Freeman Hunt said...

"I think if a woman mishandling her computer camera exposed herself accidentally, there would be tremendous sympathy and an immediate understanding that it would not be talked about — about like what you'd do if you walked in on someone using the toilet."

You think that's what would happen if a woman were caught masturbating in a work meeting? I don't think so.

Xmas said...

Instead of 'Zoom D**k' trending it would have been 'Zoom THOT'.

There's like a thousand female Twitch streamers that 'accidentally' expose themselves all the time.

Related SFW video

Wince said...

What if a woman had been caught — like Jeffrey Toobin — masturbating on camera during a Zoom business call?

Now you're in "what could possibly be better than a 'cat fight'?" territory.

Eleanor said...

I caught a lot of boys masturbating under their desks. I never saw one of the girls do it.

Francisco D said...

I think if a woman mishandling her computer camera exposed herself accidentally, there would be tremendous sympathy and an immediate understanding that it would not be talked about

That depends on the size and color of the dildo.

Black = acceptable fantasy for most Karens.

White = obviously racist.

Large = getting what she doesn't get at home.

Small = Why bother?

phantommut said...

The key moderator is the word "conservative." Let's say the woman were Kayleigh McEnany. Do you seriously believe the Left would have any compassion for her?

traditionalguy said...

Hard question. Is viagra use cheating.

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

What if Hunter Biden, who got rich off of VP dad + senator big guy dad, had sex with under-age girls? Would the me-too movement - hypocrite left care?

Nah - they would deny it!

Here's a Sampling of the Hunter Biden Texts Giuliani Turned Over to the Police


Would toobin' Toobin care or report? no way - He's all in with corrupt Biden. Has his hands down is pants for Biden and everything.

Mike of Snoqualmie said...

Sorry, Ann, it's not that difficult to keep one's pants on while one is working. Especially when there's a zoom call going on. Toobin couldn't control himself. If he'd done that at the New Yorker's offices, he'd have been fired, told to collect his things and frog-marched out of the building. He's earned everything that's been dumped on him.

Birkel said...

Yeah, Althouse.
That is exactly the treatment Sarah Palin would have gotten.

Do you even read the words you type?
Or have you hired 10,000 monkeys?

Lance said...

The Toobin story distracts from the Biden corruption. I speculate that Toobin planned it that way.

Ron Winkleheimer said...

https://gizmodo.com/heres-how-to-avoid-accidentally-showing-your-genitals-t-1845418261

TheOne Who Is Not Obeyed said...

A woman caught doing what Toobin did would be the latest flash-in-a-pan feminist hero and probably get the Presidential Medal of Freedom from Pres. Harris next year.

Any maybe even a statue on Wall Street and her own podcast and radio show.

Ice Nine said...

>>Althouse
"... would have been as badly treated as Toobin — who has been ruthlessly ridiculed and humiliated."<<

As if any of that were unwarranted or something! Good lord.

The humiliation is completely on him. The ruthless ridicule is on others, and is completely appropriate.

Gahrie said...

I don't think a woman would have been as badly treated as Toobin — who has been ruthlessly ridiculed and humiliated.

1) This was not an accident. This was thrill chasing.

2) A major reason why Toobin is being savaged is that Toobin is a smug, sanctimonious, partisan hack. A woke scold to boot.

n.n said...

So, Toobin cannot self-moderate, which is evidence of a serious mental problem. Back to Biden et al. in Water Closet and alleged pedophilia, but at least it's Chinese, not British girls, this time.

doctrev said...

A woman would face less censure: but the sheer weight of the accurate and deserved mockery would push her to extremes of emotion, out of proportion to the criticism.

Or she'd say screw it and just become a camgirl. That isn't an invitation, Marie Harf, just an observation. Anyways, the fact Jeffrey Toobin is in the caste of Elites with Absolute Merit means he'll manage to worm his way back into polite society, much as whoremonger Eliot Spitzer did. Though I should not: I've seen Spitzer thrown out of Clinton events even when he was with CNN, so the idea of being invulnerable forever clearly isn't guaranteed. Just ask Franken.

Milo Minderbinder said...

This is one of those situations that calls for application of the Sanctimonious Bozo Exception.

Virgil Hilts said...

Toobin is a smug hypocrite asshole, with bad reputation, who horribly mistreated the young woman he adulterously impregnated (and a hell of a lot of people know about that history). If this had been a decent person, the ridicule would have been much softer. But he's more of a Matt Lauer type.
OTOH, Twitter is lethal. I think if I were famous I would never attack anyone on Twitter. - I would be the nicest person possible. Maybe like Steven Pinker (every tweet I see from him seems to be nice and educational). Had this happened to Pinker I would have felt honestly sad and would not have sent it to anyone (as opposed to sending it both my families within seconds with Loobin Toobin). But I admire Ann's niceness.

Aggie said...

If it was a woman caught doing it, there would be 100 guys saying Yeah, baby !! in the comment and voice threads, and another 50 guys asking for the Request Line Paypal information.

Toobin is what he does.

madAsHell said...

I can sell tickets to watch a woman masturbate.

No one's going to pay to watch Toobin masturbate.

Sally327 said...

I think it mostly depends on what the woman looked like. If she were old or frumpy or overweight or homely, especially with some combination thereof, she'd be ridiculed and demeaned by pretty much everyone.

If she were attractive, men would make lascivious, approving comments and women would make catty, belittling comments.

I don't know why so much is being made of the exhibitionist aspect of all this. The world is made for narcissistic preening and bizarre stunts, that's what it's all about these days. Why should self-pleasuring be all tsk-tsk, no no, we can't have that. As opposed to the guy who held up a book and had his girlfriend shoot a gun at him for a youtube video?

To paraphrase Nicole Kidman in the movie "To Die For", what's the point of doing anything if nobody's watching?

Howard said...

Hypothetical Strawmen: Tastes Great, Less Filling

bleh said...

The fact that Toobin has "defenders" just shows how wrong Althouse is about him being "ruthlessly ridiculed and humiliated." Sure there's been some mocking at his expense -- how could there not be? -- but for the most part, journalists are treating this as just a terrible mistake, even relatable, and they feel sympathy for Toobin (who must be mortified) and so on, disregarding all the red flags from his past. Toobin gets a presumption of innocence that he does not deserve.

In the end, Toobin is going to keep his cushy jobs at CNN and the New Yorker and people will pretend this never happened. For a normal guy, taking out his dick and masturbating during a work Zoom call would be cause for immediate termination followed by corporate investigations and probably a lawsuit. He might even be referred for criminal prosecution. Not Toobin.

holdfast said...

She would get away with it if she were super hot. But if she had a really hairy beaver or something, then that would be brutally mocked for that. Like Christine O’Donnell.

Jupiter said...

I would think that as long as she kept quiet, no one would notice.

And I agree with Mary Beth, the unanswered question here is, which one of his fellow Commie Rats ratted him out? They certainly didn't have to.

Static Ping said...

If it was a non-partisan incident, then I am 99% sure that a man or a woman would both be fired. If the company were to be forgiving, I sense that both would be sent to therapy, though the man would probably be more likely to be eventually fired of the two. Trying to prove in court that a woman is a sexual predator is always a tougher sell and the business would be more likely to grin and bear it for a woman.

If it was a Republican, he or she would be fired. Republicans generally find that sort of behavior unacceptable and beyond the pale, and any Democrats who would not understand why this was a big deal would like getting Republican scalps regardless.

If it was a Democrat, honestly I don't know. Toobin has done some utter reprehensible things long before this and he remained in good standing (pun unintended). It is hard to comprehend the thought process of an organization that thinks Mr. Toobin should be part of their staff. Would they be more strict with the man or the woman? Dunno. The only thing I can infer at this point is they are not strict with Mr. Toobin at all and he's probably shocked that they took any action against him at all.

Finally, if there was a business Zoom meeting with a woman masturbating, I suspect that Toobin would quickly submit his resume.

Jupiter said...

"If he'd done that at the New Yorker's offices, he'd have been fired, told to collect his things and frog-marched out of the building."

I'm not so sure of that. People do weird shit all the time. Sometimes it gets reported to HR, sometimes it gets hushed up. Depends on whether anyone feels like making trouble. I suppose it might be a little different on zoom. You can't just look around the room and arrive at an unspoken agreement that this meeting is over and the minutes will not be published.

Mary Beth said...

My second question, after who ratted, was why didn't they screenshot it? Or maybe they did and just need time to review the bids.

ObeliskToucher said...

If the premise is that the woman was discreetly pleasuring herself in an online meeting and the camera happened to slightly “break” that discretion, I’d agree that the response would be quite sympathetic and forgiving, on the basis of “we all get that itch”. The difficulty here is that if Toobin had been caught with his hand *discreetly* in his pocket “taking care of business”, he’d also be getting that kind of a response. But that was apparently not the case here — by all reports, Toobin’s exposure and actions were entirely obvious and flagrant.

The real premise should be “What would be the reaction to a woman in an online meeting who is clearly exposed and pleasuring herself?” In that case, I believe the opprobrium and mockery would be pretty much the same.

Mark said...

What if Rudy Giuliani was caught on video by Sasha Baron Cohen playing with himself, as just was released?

Quite the source for oppo dirt you got there.

Leland said...

From bleh@12:14 above: "For a normal guy, taking out his dick and masturbating during a work Zoom call would be cause for immediate termination followed by corporate investigations and probably a lawsuit. He might even be referred for criminal prosecution." Perhaps that's Althouse point in defending Toobin's action. The termination, investigation, and potential prosecution is all over-reaction for everyone, not just Toobin. But if we can't forgive Toobin, then we will never stop the over-reaction. However, I think most people are drawing the line clearly on two conditions; it wasn't just accidental nudity but pleasuring yourself, and it occurred in a work setting, even if remote. I think people can relate to masturbation, but they know the hazards of doing it in front of any camera and doing it while clocking time for other purposes. The other hypothesis defending Toobin require removing these elements to get a lesser reaction. Changing gender is insufficient.

BUMBLE BEE said...

Toobin should have to register.

Douglas B. Levene said...

Toobin has been ruthlessly mocked and humiliated because he committed a sexual assault - exposing himself without consent to others. Maybe he's mentally ill, I don't know, but he committed a crime.

I can't imagine how anyone at CNN or the New Yorker (or anywhere else) would ever want to work with him again. Geez, the creepy perv is online again (or has entered the office), time to log off (or leave the premises).

RobinGoodfellow said...

Ann,

The original question was not “What if a woman ...”. The question was “What if a conservative woman” did it.

I think to ask the question is to answer it.

tcrosse said...

This behavior, in person, did Louis C.K.s career mono good.

Jupiter said...

Mark said...
"What if Rudy Giuliani was caught on video by Sasha Baron Cohen playing with himself, as just was released?"

You're doing it wrong, Mark. If Sasha Baron Cohen was invading Giuliani's privacy, that's Cohen's bad, not Giulini's. See how that works? You are supposed to include something about how there was an actress present, pretending to be Cohen's daughter.

You know, these new trolls aren't as good as the old ones. I hated Igna as much as anyone, but at least when she cut-and-pasted the latest talking points from Fearless Leader, she didn't try to improve on the content. A troll has to know his limitations.

Mary Beth said...

Quite the source for oppo dirt you got there.

And yet, knowing what happened and that it would become public, Giuliani still decided to be the one to talk about Hunter Biden's laptop. I wonder why.

I Have Misplaced My Pants said...

Althouse is working oddly hard to look at this asshat with sympathy.

Drago said...

Douglas: "Toobin has been ruthlessly mocked and humiliated because he committed a sexual assault - exposing himself without consent to others. Maybe he's mentally ill, I don't know, but he committed a crime."

Toobin is most definitely psychologically wacko (see: Jeff Greenfield's daughter) along with being an incompetent legal "authority".

Of course, it goes without saying that those two truths alone make Toobin a big favorite of the LLR-left.

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

The only thing that matters is politics.

Gender does not apply here.

D party = you get to do what you want. All bad things can be given a white-wash.

TheDopeFromHope said...

She'd be seen as striking a blow against the partiarchy!

ObeliskToucher said...

Mark@12:56 — “What if Rudy Giuliani was caught on video by Sasha Baron Cohen playing with himself, as just was released?”

Rudy wouldn't be any more or less surprised by seeing Sasha Baron Cohen play with himself on video than the rest of us... it’s kind of his shtick, isn’t it?

mikee said...

In my 60+ years of life, I have walked in on people masturbating exactly twice. One stopped and pretended nothing happened. The other invited me to help her finish. I have also walked in on people having sex a small number of times - college dorm rooms are not very private places. Awakening to female giggles from the top bunk makes for an interesting start to a Sunday brunch with one's roommate and his new friend. None of that is what Toobin did.

There is no Costanza Defense here. The behavior indicates Toobin lacks the very, very small amount of self-discipline necessary to participate in actions where trust, authority and responsibility are required. This is the same issue as Bill Clinton accepting BJs from a White House intern. If you don't have enough self-control to say "No" to such things, you should not be in that job, that office. Fire him, as Clinton should have been fired.

Unknown said...

"If it was a Democrat, honestly I don't know. Toobin has done some utter reprehensible things long before this and he remained in good standing (pun unintended). It is hard to comprehend the thought process of an organization that thinks Mr. Toobin should be part of their staff"

He is a cult member who is virtue signaling. He is happy for people to see what he can do and get away with. All that matters is his cult membership. Being a 'liberal' and 'Dem' is armor plating. He is recruiting more followers to the cult. They can see that there are no consequences. It's great to be a party member. Are we living in the Soviet Union?

bagoh20 said...

"Yeah, Althouse.
That is exactly the treatment Sarah Palin would have gotten.

Do you even read the words you type?
Or have you hired 10,000 monkeys?"


My exact sentiment, but done better. Thanks

I often hope she is just trolling, but unfortunately, I don't think so.

bagoh20 said...

OK lefties defending this creep, who wants to hire Toobin as a babysitter?

narciso said...

multitasking is tricky, lol,

Drago said...

Dumb Lefty Mark: "Quite the source for oppo dirt you got there."

LOL

The "source" is Hunter Biden's actual laptop with Hunter Biden's actual pictures and Hunter Biden's actual text and email messages which the FBI has had in their possession since December of 2019.

But then you wouldn't be Dumb Lefty Mark unless you were dumb and a lefty, would you?

Doug said...

Mad as Hell said:
No one's going to pay to watch Toobin masturbate.


Many of Althouse's gay fan base just called you a homophobic asshole.

TRISTRAM said...

“In either case — accidental or intentional — I don't think a woman would have been as badly treated as Toobin — who has been ruthlessly ridiculed and humiliated.”

Too in gotta be saying where that white or male privilege I keep hearing in have?

Mary Beth said...

Quite the source for oppo dirt you got there.

Reply part 2, now that the truth about it has come out. Giuliani was tucking his shirt back into his pants after she had removed his mic.

The misrepresentation makes the left look very desperate. More than usual.

Chris N said...

It's tiresome to pretend to false equivalence when the presumed foundations of a new morality and legality elide over deep realities, rewarding ideologues and angry children.

I'm kind of checked out.

The 60's game is as old and faded as are many Dylan songs (to be judged and re-judged as future generations see fit)

bobby said...

1. Toobin has made a career out of partisan lying, and out of ridiculing people he doesn't like. He capped it off with Kavanaugh. This would have gone away had a decent person been caught as he was.

2. I'm amused by the vitriol of so many commenters about the "indecent" perversion of masturbation. Let's count, right now, the number of those commenters who have not masturbated: uhh, . . . . Okay, zero.

Chris N said...

And if a man whips out his dick during Zoom meetings, possibly visible, he's got other issues, having fed many bad impulses over time, eroding the character he has.

In a time of more reaonable judgment, you send him away, put him out to pasture and move on.

Freeman Hunt said...

"The real premise should be “What would be the reaction to a woman in an online meeting who is clearly exposed and pleasuring herself?” In that case, I believe the opprobrium and mockery would be pretty much the same."

I agree. There's no way people just let that go, woman or no.

Iman said...

TOOBIN!!!!!!!!!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4P-C_z1rwRk&ebc=ANyPxKopNjuVn607Qdgc4SCnxb2e0mlN2oghu5fln5APw2kScTRUDNpQ0iURsY3VYRRGXiWo7dFese5iW6Dh889F_QqMYyR64Q

Kalli Davis said...

As far aa news value goes:
- Liberal woman masturbating on business call is akin to "dog bites man."
- Where as,conservative woman masturbating on business call is "man bites dog."

n.n said...

Sex politics. Also, social politics. Diversity politics.

Paul said...

"ruthlessly ridiculed and humiliated".... he was playing with his willie while on camera... that's a sick bastard and he needs that ruthless ridicule and humiliation.

He is a pervert in the class with Anthony Weiner, Pee Wee Herman, and Dollar Bill Clinton. God knows what over perversions he has... we don't know but we do know while talking to others he spanks his monkey.

Bob Smith said...

Any conservative, male, female, or otherwise would be mocked and vilified to the end of days. Annnnnd. Jeffrey was masturbating in a meeting for chissake. It wasn’t an accident.

William said...

I think this would make an interesting premise for Stormy Daniels' next movie....I can envision some women doing this but not doing this gratis. Women occasionally do shocking things but raw lust isn't usually the real motive....Somebody cut Toobin a break. There have been no screenshots released from that meeting and no remarks about what was going on at the meeting when he did the dirty. Was he discussing Amy Coney Barrett? Was that what drove his libido to crazed excesses of lust? If so, will this cause him to lose support among committed Democrats? There are many details that need to be further examined before we can reach a balanced, informed decision on Toobin's culpability.

Ingachuck'stoothlessARM said...

Grab myself by the pussy!

...when you're a woman, they let you do it

William said...

On further thought, I guess it would be permissible if he had been fantasizing about how AOC would look in Justice Ginsburg's black robes. Who could blame him? Many masturbatory fantasies are not only permitted to Democrats but actively encouraged.

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

I'm surprised there isn't a "blame the Russians" for hacking his computer and forcing him to masturbate by tricking him somehow - campaign.

Freeman Hunt said...

"I'm amused by the vitriol of so many commenters about the "indecent" perversion of masturbation."

Haven't seen that from anyone. It's masturbating *while on a business call* AND *pointing the camera at yourself masturbating so that everyone at the meeting sees you doing it* that people are reacting to.

Bruce Hayden said...

“I think it mostly depends on what the woman looked like. If she were old or frumpy or overweight or homely, especially with some combination thereof, she'd be ridiculed and demeaned by pretty much everyone.

“If she were attractive, men would make lascivious, approving comments and women would make catty, belittling comments.”

Unfortunately, I think that is right. A lot of guys dream about women masterbating. Then, they have a woman pull out her little toys, after having had sex with them, and discover that maybe it isn’t that great. Still, I think that for the most part, a lot of guys would be fine with a woman masterbating in this sort of situation, if they can dream about having sex with them, without a BAC high enough to qualify for a DUI. One baggers are probably out. Double baggers are definitely out.

exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...

Dust Bunny Queen said...
Anyone masturbating in a public format or during a work meeting whether woman or man....has lost their sanity IMO. Plus it shows a complete disregard and disdain for the others around you who don't want to participate in your sexual fantasy."

Well said, DBQ.

I'd have more sympathy for Toobin if he was a sympathetic character. (I would still think that firing him was justifiable and would advise him to seek counseling and get help.) But he's a vicious, hypocritical shit who deserves all the ridicule and scorn he is receiving.

Jeff Wilson said...

I haven't seen any comment from Jane Mayer. Was she flattered?

Marcus Bressler said...

I think the craziest part of this blog post is that the Hostess THINKS IT WAS ACCIDENTAL. Or she leans that way. I guess she means the Lib/Dem version of "accidental" -- it was an "accident they got caught". Nobody, and I mean nobody, whips it out and start stroking it before a ZOOM call is finished. He meant to beat off. He didn't mean to have others see him -- for if he did, he's as bad as Harvey and Bill Cosby and the rest

THEOLDMAN

Whiskeybum said...

bobby said...

Let's count, right now, the number of those commenters who have not masturbated: uhh, . . . . Okay, zero.


Let’s count, right now, the number of commenters who have never taken a dump: uhh,....Okay, zero. Now, let’s count, right now, the number of commenters who have dropped their drawers and taken a dump while online during a business Zoom meeting: uhh, ... not quite as many.

See the difference?

FryingPanHead said...

I need to hear what ARM, that Crackhead or Inga thinks before I come to any conclusions.

minnesota farm guy said...

Have to agree with Freeman Hunt. Those who are trying to change the subject from Toobin's abject stupidity to a debate over whether you will got blind from masturbating are just trying to distract from the man's complete lack of intelligence and good judgement.

Skippy Tisdale said...

What if a woman had been caught — like Jeffrey Toobin — masturbating on camera during a Zoom business call?

It would have gone viral and be forever available on Pornhub.

max said...

I don't think a woman would have been as badly treated as Toobin — who has been ruthlessly ridiculed and humiliated.

I do not think this is about Toobin, but about the act. There are just so many double entendres about male masturbation.

Unknown said...

Male and female masturbation are asymmetrical. Male orgasm is too easily achieved. Female orgasm is much more effortful. Male m is messy; female m has an invisible aftermath. Female m is somehow hopeful. Male m is an expression of defeat. They are both called m, but they have different cultural textures.

autothreads said...

It seems that Toobin was simultaneously participating in the Zoom conference video sex chatting with someone else, and genuinely thought his camera was off, so it's not clear if his kink is the thrill of discovery.

Exit question: who here has ever rubbed one out at work?

Ann Althouse said...

If you think I seem biased in favor of Toobin, click on my “Toobin” tag and see how I’ve written about him over the years. I don’t have any special liking for him. My motivation is similar to what affects me about Trump: others are attacking him. I feel compelled to look at the side of the story that isn’t getting represented in the public discourse.

I mostly dislike all public figures in the law and politics realm. I like some artists and entertainers.

bbkingfish said...

Apparently, we'll be able to check out Rudy Giuliani's form in the new Borat movie.

Terry Ott said...

The woman in AA’s hypothetical might have an unexpected career path open up. It would probably pay well and not require nearly the amount of “work time" expected in her current role. She already would have a blockbuster audition tape at no cost.

By the way, Toobin might have the same opportunity, if there’s a market for such stuff. Watch for him in the upcoming short film, "Pro boner Legal Work by Jeff T"

Unknown said...

There is a significant disparity/double standard about sex toys and masturbation between the sexes. Vibrators, sex toys and masturbation are considered normal and openly celebrated for females. Sex toys and masturbation for men are still thought to be a sign of perversion. "Good men don't need them!"

Skippy Tisdale said...

Unknown said...
Male and female masturbation are asymmetrical. Male orgasm is too easily achieved. Female orgasm is much more effortful. Male m is messy; female m has an invisible aftermath. Female m is somehow hopeful. Male m is an expression of defeat. They are both called m, but they have different cultural textures.

Unknown's moniker is apropos. Dated a young woman who could get there in 90 seconds. And if you think there's no visible aftermath you're are clearly mistaken.

Skippy Tisdale said...

I like some artists and entertainers.

I like horses. I like people who like horses.

-- A parody Princess Di quote from a satirical piece in an early 1980's National Lampoon Magazine.

Comes to mind surprisingly often.

Drago said...

bbkingfish: "Apparently, we'll be able to check out Rudy Giuliani's form in the new Borat movie."

Yes, tucking a shirt back in after having a microphone removed is EXACTLY like masturbating to a live zoom meeting audience.

Thanks for checking in bbkingfish.

You never disappoint.

Eugene Dillenburg said...

Ann, I believe you are missing the point. Toobin didn't just expose himself; he exposed himself while pleasuring himself. If all he had done was flash his schlong -- his robe fell open, say, accidentally or not-so-accidentally -- there would be snickering, but likely no scandal, unless it was clearly intentional. But no: he was apparently going to town, an appalling lack of judgment, consideration and respect (for self and for others) that deserves ridicule.

IF a woman suffered a wardrobe malfunction, there would be a day or two of tittering, and the event would live permanently on various nip-slip sites. But on-line masturbation would be hard to ignore. I do think the reaction would be more shock and outrage than ridicule and humiliation, but reaction there would be. Indeed, it might be more dangerous to her career, as no one would ever be able to look at her again without imagining that moment. (With men: we know what beasts they are.)

iamagenius said...

Ask ANY victim of sexual harassment what they think.

Sexual harassers do it on PURPOSE. It's not an accident, all thumbs or lack of tech savvy.

It's done on purpose, to stick it to you AND get away with it.

PRIYANKA GARAI said...

agree
https://chemicalgorithms.blogspot.com/

PRIYANKA GARAI said...

Agree
https://chemicalgorithms.blogspot.com/

DeepRunner said...

Ann Althouse said...
"In either case — accidental or intentional — I don't think a woman would have been as badly treated as Toobin — who has been ruthlessly ridiculed and humiliated."

Putting the visuals aside for a moment, I think one thing that makes Jeffreu Toobin "ridiculed and humiliated" is his sanctimony. Add to that his evidently having tried to pay off his mistress to get an abortion rather than accept her "choice," I dunno, but it seems awfully Karmic.

I believe this sort of ridicule is equal opportunity. Depending on where you land in the spectrum, I could easily see Kayleigh McEnany, Gretchen Whitmer, or Rachel Maddow being harpooned with pretty great intensity if any of them were caught in such a manual activity.

walter said...

Does this prove or disprove the notion that men can't multitask?
I mean, he might just be finding it challenging to fit it all in.
There also may have been a triggering scenario presented in the discussion.

exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...

bobby said...
2. I'm amused by the vitriol of so many commenters about the "indecent" perversion of masturbation. Let's count, right now, the number of those commenters who have not masturbated: uhh, . . . . Okay, zero.

10/21/20, 4:07 PM


I'm amused by your lack of logic. Like every other living human being, I urinate. Quite frequently, actually, since I'm a big water drinker. That doesn't mean I'm being hypocritical when I say I don't want to see my co-worker take a whiz in a wastepaper basket while we're on a Zoom call.

Unknown said...

It’s kind of obvious that Amy Schumer has been angling to make it part of her act for a while, when she does it will be “brave”, but alas no longer funny.

AllenS said...

I suppose one could give Toobin credit; no one has ever caught AIDS from his hand.

Ann Althouse said...

"Ann, I believe you are missing the point. Toobin didn't just expose himself; he exposed himself while pleasuring himself."

No, I meant exactly the equivalent behavior (whatever it was). That I didn't state it more harshly may show the tendency to protect women.

"If all he had done was flash his schlong -- his robe fell open, say, accidentally or not-so-accidentally -- there would be snickering, but likely no scandal, unless it was clearly intentional. But no: he was apparently going to town..."

We're relying on 2 anonymous people who chose to take this to the press. What did they see during that brief exposure and why was masturbation left out of the original report? Perhaps only that his hand was in the picture, grasping the organ. I'm guessing whatever he did was something that wouldn't change the look of the upper body, so I wouldn't picture what you call "going to town."

With a woman, with the hand in the picture and seen only for a second, I think people might wonder if she just was inelegantly scratching an itch or struggling with a need to urinate. I'd speculate about that being the case with Toobin, but if so, I think he'd have offered that defense.

Rusty said...

Depends on the woman, Ann. Guys pay money for that sort of thing. Yes, yes, we're pigs.

Bunkypotatohead said...

Enough with the speculation of how a woman would be treated.
Althouse should arrange a demonstration to find out how everyone would respond.
In the name of science, of course.