October 19, 2020

"Some meaningful number of voters who are clear-eyed about Trump and his manifest failures—even those who think he is plainly doing a bad job—will stick with the president..."

"... because they believe Democrats are worse and the media aren’t to be trusted. And these aren’t voters who are glued to Fox News and reading Breitbart News. Often they don’t think about politics at all—and they certainly don’t follow the daily machinations of Washington. They’re typically not on Twitter. Instead they swim in a cultural soup of Trumpism, surrounded by friends, family, and social-media acquaintances who do live more exclusively in a right-wing-media ecosystem. Even if Biden pulls off a landslide victory, that ecosystem will remain. And so will the dislike of Democrats and distrust of the mainstream media. Getting rid of Trump won’t end the opposition’s problems."


Yes, it will be interesting to see what these people do if Trump is cut off after one term. I'm thinking something like the Tea Party will reconfigure itself, but also that much less polite people — having seen how aggressively Trump was torn apart every day of his entire term — will treat Biden just as harshly. 

199 comments:

Amadeus 48 said...

Actually, I plan to treat Biden more harshly. If we elect Biden, we deserve what we will get.

Unknown said...

I'm going to give biden everything the democrat propaganda media gave trump.

Joe Smith said...

If there is a monolithic media/socialist juggernaut, I predict more 'unrest' than anyone bargained for.

The second amendment is there for a reason...

Mattman26 said...

Oh, these benighted souls swimming in cultural soup.

Good thing there's nothing like that on the left.

(By the way, we've moved this morning from bathing in blood to swimming in soup. What's going on here?)

Drago said...

"manifest failures"....from The Atlantic!

LOL

Too funny.

Milo Minderbinder said...

In China, no one watches, listens to or reads the media because everyone knows it's propaganda from the party that controls them. We're beginning to catch on. I can't think of any institution in this country that's despised more than our media elite.

pokerone said...

So I scrolled down the Althouse page to Saturday without seeing anything about Hunter's laptop. Are we not talking about Hunter's laptop? Are there no stories to blog about Hunter's laptop in the media? Interesting.

Laslo Spatula said...

"They’re typically not on Twitter. Instead they swim in a cultural soup of Trumpism, surrounded by friends, family, and social-media acquaintances who do live more exclusively in a right-wing-media ecosystem."

That overwhelming cultural Trumpism soup: to live in an "exclusively right-wing-media ecosystem" all you need to do is avoid ABC, CBS, NBC, MSNBC, CNN, NPR, NYT, WaPo, Daily Beast, Atlantic, Facebook, Twitter, Netflix, Hollywood, Disney... And Althouse.

I am Laslo.

Geoff Matthews said...

Given what we're learning about the Biden family's influence leveraging for monetary gain, is there any reason why Biden, if he should be elected, shouldn't be impeached and investigated with the same vigor that Trump was?

MayBee said...

Instead they swim in a cultural soup of Trumpism, surrounded by friends, family, and social-media acquaintances who do live more exclusively in a right-wing-media ecosystem.

It can't ever just be-- this is what people think and this is their preference. There has to be some explainer about how they are ignorant in a bubble trying to trick them and their hopped up Trump supporting relatives.

Dear Democrats: You know those things in your noggin that are opinions? We all have them! And some people who are very thoughtful have opinions that are different than yours! This might sound amazing, but it's true! The problem isn't that you are smart, and if you could make other people smarter they would have the same opinions you would. The problem is you can't recognize that smart people don't all think alike.

Mr Wibble said...

Yes, it will be interesting to see what these people do if Trump is cut off after one term. I'm thinking something like the Tea Party will reconfigure itself, but also that much less polite people — having seen how aggressively Trump was torn apart every day of his entire term — will treat Biden just as harshly.

The line from a podcaster I listen to is, "The Tea Party was us being polite. Trump is us being less polite. You don't want to see what comes after Trump."

Mr Wibble said...

The difference is that any attempt to treat Biden harshly will result in the destruction of your life, your job, your family, your friendships, as well as very likely the force of the state used against you. Have fun being audited, sued into oblivion, or even prosecuted on bullshit charges.

The left has made it very clear that they want revenge for the humiliation of 2016, and that they don't intend to lose power again.

tim in vermont said...

Can you imagine doing 50 focus groups because you are obsessed with breaking up a source of information which you do not control?

I bet she never once asked herself “is it possible that I am wrong and they are right about some things?” I bet not once in any of those 50 focus groups. The person who never asks themselves whether they are wrong, and instead searches for more “proofs” that they are right, probably is wrong.

Wince said...

Where's the article on Trump's "manifest failures"?

Equally amazing: The majority of 2016 Trump voters — despite a mismanaged pandemic, widespread economic fallout, a racial crisis exacerbated by divisive rhetoric, and a debate meltdown—plan to back Trump a second time.

Pretty weak tea. Not to be too conspiratorial:

Biden Inc. solicited and received graft from the very Chinese communists who inflicted the pandemic on the world.

Democrat governors pretty much throttled their states' economies with shut-down while actively spreading the contagion to vulnerable populations.

Democrat mayors of big cities that were the epicenter of "systemic racism" for the last two generations also abetted riots and violence in the streets while marginalizing law enforcement.

But it's Trump's rhetoric and debate performance against his opponent and the obstreperous moderator that are the "manifest failures" that should turn-off voters?

Psota said...

If Biden is elected he should worry more about harsh treatment from his own side

OSU '92 said...

I absolutely would treat Biden much harsher. After all, if Biden is elected that means the Democrats temper tantrum tactics (impeachment, media hoaxes, riots, deep state corruption etc.) have worked. Why wouldn't I use those tools as well?

People who think the country will go back to "normal" after a Biden victory are going to be sorely disappointed. You can't put that genie back in the bottle.

Trust me, much like eliminating the judicial filibuster, the Democrats will come to rue the day when those same tactics are used against them.

stevew said...

Embarrassing for The Atlantic to explain the Trump support among those that are put off by his Mean Tweets and aggressiveness as resulting from exposure to hard core, right wing Trump fans among their family and friends. Embarrassing because The Atlantic doesn't even imagine what I think is really going on with these reluctant Trump voters. They look past Trump's tweets and personal style to his accomplishments as POTUS which they judge to be positive for themselves and the country. In other words, they are behaving as thoughtful, rational, adult citizens.

West Texas Intermediate Crude said...

Actually, we'll be fine. Maybe not as good as now, and not as good as if Trump wins, but we'll find a way to be safe, healthy, and well-fed Deplorables
The people who will suffer will be the "disadvantaged," the people who depend on government for their daily bread, their medical care, the roof over their heads, their safety. They will be forgotten faster than Monica's blue dress once the election is over and the Dems know that they are at least temporarily safe.
Their handbook is "1984," but their mentor is Robespierre.
It will not end well for them, but it will end.

Lance said...

Instead they swim in a cultural soup of Trumpism, surrounded by friends, family, and social-media acquaintances who do live more exclusively in a right-wing-media ecosystem.

Facebook ensures that no one is able to ignore Democrats and the media. There is no one in the country who lives "exclusively in a right-wing-media ecosystem".

traditionalguy said...

Total fantasy that Trump’s voters really dislike him. If that were true they would not vote for him. Instead they turn out by the millions Chanting “we love you”. His courage is off the charts and he destroys our enemies. Who would not love that.

Ice Nine said...

>>but also that much less polite people — having seen how aggressively Trump was torn apart every day of his entire term — will treat Biden just as harshly."

"Just as harshly?" Not even! They would have to control the mass media to even come close to that parity - and they control almost none of that.

MountainMan said...

"...manifest failures..." That's just laughable.

Bay Area Guy said...

...because they believe Democrats are worse and the media aren’t to be trusted."

This is close. Kudos to The Atlantic, for even getting this close.

Most Democrat voters are nice people. They want peace. They don't want racism. They want gays to be treated fairly with dignity. They wanna own homes, and have good white collar, professional jobs. Etc, etc.

What I just described are my neighbors. Nice, clueless, well-off, older folks, who vote Dem.

These folks are mostly sweet, mindless sheep. Perhaps, their parents and grandparents were mostly sweet, mindless sheep in the 50s, who recited the pledge of allegiance, watched Ozzie & Harriet, didn't think too much about racial discrimination in the south, and voted Republican.

Those people - a big chunk of Dem voters -- don't bug me.

The writers for the Atlantic -- don't bug me. They have no power. They are misguided and clueless, but for different reasons.

What bugs me is the hard core left, whom these sheep enable to do terrible things to our country. I'm talking about Democrat party figures. I'm talking left-wing College professors. I'm talking Antifa, BLM and other looters, rioters, and arsonists who destroy cities. I'm talking Big Tech. I'm talking the Intelligence agencies, and their Deep State operatives. I'm talking big corporations, who like cheap labor, and have leftwing HR departments.

The energy and power of the Democrat Party is horrid and fanatical. They control the show. That's who is worse than Trump -- by miles. Not some 78-year old demented placeholder, like Slow Joe.

Carry on, Comrades.

Birkel said...

Trump will win every state he won in 2016 plus several other states.

Waste no time contemplating a Biden Administration; Biden has called a lid.
Meanwhile, a Harris Administration is frightening but will not happen.

MadisonMan said...

"Roughly 50 Focus Groups" I am suspicious of this claim.

Darrell said...

Fuck you, partisan Atlantic. Made-up tales of Russian collusion. "Failures" created by their own lies and delusions. Current credibility rating? Zero.

Brent said...

Why would Democrats not deserve the continual wrath of Trump voters after everything they did. Are you (everyone) not awake? Why should their anger be constrained after the last 4 years of hate and acorn heaped upon them?

Why?

tim in vermont said...

If Biden wins without an airing of the charges against him, which incidentally match up with stories written about him in the past in Politico.eu, the New York Times, Kazakhstan Asset Recovery Initiative, etc, etc, etc, not to mention at least two pictures of him and Hunter with known kleptocrats, my belief will be that our government is no longer legitimate. I don’t think I will be alone.

The Crack Emcee said...

This description clearly fits me now I put out a call for "The Macho Response" and got what I wanted, so I'm not gonna complain it it's not perfect:

"Never let the perfect be the enemy of the good" right?

Michael K said...

Ann, it might be time for you to read "Peoples' Republic" to learn what a Biden/Clinton/ AOC regime will be like.

Matt said...

One side wants to put a mentally disturbed man in a dress in my daughter's restrooms, locker rooms, etc. They want to remove all the spaces society has set aside for my wife and daughter to feel safe and take care of things females need to take care of. In addition, while uttering phrases like "pregnant man" and " feminine penis" with all sincerity, they call me names and say I'm the deluded asshole. Now take that same formula and multiply it by all the other issues out there.

This isn't exactly a hard choice.

stever said...

We won't have Biden around that long but yeah, there's a lot of anger/frustration. Trump pushes back, his popularity is simple to understand.

mandrewa said...

What does it matter if the less polite people want to treat the Democratic party and its lackey's harshly?

They don't have control of the media. They don't have control of the schools. They don't have the institutional daily low-level control of the government.

What does it matter what they think? They have no voice.

And further given the malignant spirit of the left, it is altogether likely that criticism of the left will be made illegal, either formally or informally. Or I should say even more illegal given that this has to a significant degree already occurred.

This is what anyone voting for the Democratic Party is voting for. This among many other ugly things.

FullMoon said...

Lots of people will vote for Trump in response to being insulted by media and anti Trump people.

People will vote for Trump because they are tired of the racial division started and encouraged by Obama and amplified and continued by the left.

On the other hand, many will vote against Trump because they are either ignorant, or stupid enough to believe the lies and propaganda of the MSM.and Social Media.

Plenty of young voters as well as mature dems have no sense at all.

Many are actually as imbecillic as the lefty commenters here pretend to be.

wild chicken said...

Look, here's the deal: look at the alternative: Harris.

Bob Boyd said...

they swim in a cultural soup of Trumpism, surrounded by friends, family, and social-media acquaintances who do live more exclusively in a right-wing-media ecosystem.

Talk about projection.

BidenFamilyTaxPayerFundedCrackPipe said...

Sean Ono Lennon
@seanonolennon
It is no longer exaggeration to say that the collusion between social media and media to manipulate our reality for the benefit of their political agendas has reached Stalinist proportions.

Greg The Class Traitor said...

It will be a right wing anti-fascist movement

But, since the fascists will be running the government, they won't be out in the street beating up anyone who disagrees with them (like "Antifa" does).

Instead, they'll be shooting people from sniper positions. Throwing Molotov cocktails from cars. Setting up IEDs

Because if the Democrats win, that will be the American people saying that using violence to advance your political objectives is A Ok.

And that's a game any number of people can play

Lurker21 said...


Instead they swim in a cultural soup of Trumpism, surrounded by friends, family, and social-media acquaintances who do live more exclusively in a right-wing-media ecosystem.

No recognition for Trump voters who swim in the salty soup of progressives and the mainstream media and are turned off by that?

I don't buy Longwell's rhetoric at all. You don't have to be surrounded by Trumpites to realize that the media is biased, that Biden isn't what he's pretending to be and that Trump may not have been the disaster that his enemies take him for.

Her complaint seems to be that media brainwashing isn't as thorough or as successful as she would like it to be.

_______

Harsh treatment, though, is in the eye of the beholder. To the extent that I do swim in the talk soup of the Internet, I do tend to pull back from the more extreme comments you find there and am often not as harsh on politicians as they really deserve.

Kathryn51 said...

I wonder if Ms. Longwell invited any Republican lawyers into her "focus" groups. In 2016, most of my GOP lawyer friends voted "other" (McMullen, Johnson, etc.). After the Kavanaugh hearings, it became "crawl over glass" - because the enemy IS the Democrat/progressives cabal and we won't go down without a fight.

I also consider it strange that her focus groups apparently don't include any of the "shy" Trump voter - the ones surrounded by screeching, suburban harridans and therefor keep quiet. She couldn't find any of them?? (maybe I need to read the article before asking that question).

TreeJoe said...

Trump is extremely chaotic, has hired many bad people along the way and fired them with painful PR results, and himself is often a very shitty public communicator. He's done a few bizarro things along the way (the walk out of the white house to do a photo shoot with a bible being one of the worst).

But honestly: No new wars, fantastic economic results sans pandemic, multiple major peace deals, major multinational trade agreements optimized, pulled out of stupid deals, great judicial nomination/results, major re-alignment with evil countries (Syria, Iran)...

Joe Biden: 47 years in government....not much to his name. Lots of evidence of pay to play in his family. Nominated Kamala Harris, pretty much the last nail in his coffin.

tim in vermont said...

I tell you who will really be shit on my list, it will be the sellout Never Trumpers. They will be dead to me.

wendybar said...

Unknown said...
I'm going to give biden everything the democrat propaganda media gave trump.

10/19/20, 11:03 AM

Same here.

rcocean said...

Its amazing how the liberal/left always PROJECTS.

I don't know any Trump supporter who only watches Fox news or reads Brietbart. Its almost Impossible to avoid reading/hearing/seeing Anti-Trump, Pro-Democrat news. We have 7 TV news channels and 6 of them are anti-Trump all the time. Almost every national newspaper and magazine is anti-Trump. My local radio talk channels are 50% anti-Trump. Hollywood is anti-Trump. Comedy Central is anti-Trump. Every single Late Nite TV talk show mocks and attacks Trump every night. We even have Pro Sports pushing BLM and hating Trump!

And we now have Facebook and twitter actively censoring pro-Trump stories and users.

SO, its quite easy to bathe yourself in 24/7/365 in Hate trump, Pro-Democrat Propaganda and NEVER hear/Read/see one single word in favor of him. Which explains the weird derangement of so many Liberal/Leftists. And the cow-like stupidity of so many average Democrats.

Francisco D said...

The only way these people "know" that Trump "is doing a bad job" is because that is the propaganda line from the Hollywood/DNC media. How has Trump done a bad job in objective terms?

Aside from the "fact" that he created the WuFlu, nominated a rapist and a Catholic handmaiden to the SCOTUS, gave succor to invisible White supremacists, derogated soldiers, works for Putin and you know the rest.

The gaslighting will continue until the deplorable are eliminated from society, maybe by a Truth Commission as suggested by Robert Reich. Isn't he the third Reich to suggest that?

Kathryn51 said...

I read the full article. The headline said "Why PEOPLE Who Hate Trump. . . ". The article was mostly about women voters.

And the author who claims to be a "life-long Republican" is the publisher of The Bulwork (A bill Kristol publication). AND. . . . . according to Wikipedia, she is the founder of Republican Voters Against Trump.

I call bullshit.

Anthony said...

The Projection is strong in this one.

rcocean said...

People don't trust the media because they are smart. Only stupid people "trust the media". They've lied and misrepresented Trump, for example, for over 4 years. They are now lying and covering up for Biden and his son's corruption. They were lying about Hillary's emails 4 years ago. They spent 3 years lying about "The walls are closing in" and "Trump colluded with Russia".

I could literally write a 300 page book detailing all their lies, fake news, and slanted news stories ONLY ABOUT TRUMP for the last 4 years. If you "trust the media" you're either a leftist or a moron. Or both.

Mike (MJB Wolf) said...

In China, no one watches, listens to or reads the media because everyone knows it's propaganda from the party that controls them. We're beginning to catch on. I can't think of any institution in this country that's despised more than our media elite.

This is true. Yet there’s no navel-gazing truth-telling essays in the Atlantic or New Yorker wondering why journalism and especially the newsertainment industry are held in such low esteem by the Public, lower than car salesmen and Congress. How bad does it have to get to be held in lower esteem than Congress! Yet they keep asking the question from the wrong end as “what’s wrong with These People?”

Bruce Hayden said...

“Trump will win every state he won in 2016 plus several other states”

PA is looking problematic. The level of fraud may exceed the level of Trump’s edge in the state.

FullMoon said...

Waste no time contemplating a Biden Administration; Biden has called a lid.

I suspect Biden is being prepped with info about Trumps kids profiting from his presidency.

Doesn't have to be true for Biden to repeat it, just needs to be a diversion.

Also, Joe's "heartfelt" appeal to voters who have an addict in their orbit was a good touch. Attacks on Hunter's disgusting behavior as an addict entertaining but not useful. Emphasis needs to remain on fact that he profited from Joe's position. That is obviously true, emails or no emails. The vid of Joe bragging about dangling the billion dollars, coupled with Hunter's Soprano like no show job are killer for the average working stiff.

BidenFamilyTaxPayerFundedCrackPipe said...

The media and big tech oligarchs and even the FBI are corrupt democrat buffers.

Democrat buffer soup. Corruptocratic.

This same corrupt soup will vilify teaparty people at every turn.

Mr. D said...

I'm thinking something like the Tea Party will reconfigure itself, but also that much less polite people — having seen how aggressively Trump was torn apart every day of his entire term — will treat Biden just as harshly.

Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got til it's gone

Big Mike said...

much less polite people

“Much less,” Althouse? You see, here’s the thing. There’s no way to get an anti-Biden message on TV and NPR and all the newspapers, so go after the supporters. Cars with Trump/Pence stickers get keyed? Do the same with cars that display Biden/Harris stickers. Those cars with the ridiculous “Coexist” stickers? (Ridiculous because quite obviously they aren’t ready to coexist with Trump supporters.). Spray paint the word “Never” over top of it. Yeah! And that’s just for starters.

BettyB said...

There are also many people voting for Trump in spite of his assholishness mainly because the alternative is unthinkable who do NOT" live more exclusively in a right-wing-media ecosystem"--rather, they live silently among a more exclusively LEFT wing media ecosystem. The penalty--personal and professional--for being known as a Trump voter is too severe. If Democrats win, we'll suffer along with all others who run small businesses, applaud US energy independence, prefer to be individuals making decisions for ourselves rather than being pigeonholed as members of a group.....

Dave Begley said...

In total and complete seriousness - and applying cruel neutrality - even if you hate Trump's personality, how could a person vote for Joe Biden? He sold his office to foreigners and mentally he's not at all there.

Bruce Hayden said...

""Some meaningful number of voters who are clear-eyed about Trump and his manifest failures—even those who think he is plainly doing a bad job—will stick with the president...""

Who rationally believes that Trump has been doing a bad job? Only hard left idiots like those at the Atlantic. Realistically, he can claim credit for:
- reducing our dependence on foreign oil, primarily through allowing fracking, which has turned this country from having oil as a weakness, to one of our greater geopolitical strengths. Wasn’t happening under Obama, and wouldn’t have under Crooked Hillary. And Biden would kill that as quickly as he could.
- diplomatic successes around the world - starting with Israel and the Gulf states, but also Kosovo, N Korea, etc
- finally getting out of our longest war - Afghanistan.
- record economic growth, low unemployment, esp after Obama promised us we would never see decent growth again. We did. It was a combination of tax cuts and cuts to regulations. Both would be reversed as quickly as they could, if Biden/Harris win.
- maybe finally starting to cut back on the power of the deep State, etc.

Iman said...

Wince @ 11:22am... well said, sir!

Richard Aubrey said...

There's talk of demographic groups, education levels, age groups, economic levels and so forth. There's another group which may be one of the deciders. It's the mush head group. I know a couple of the sweetest ladies you'll ever meet. They've functioned effectively through their lives and have no baggage--drugs, criminal history, bankruptcy, multiple divorces--in their past. I don't make a value judgment, necessarily, but to say more effectively you organize your life, the less chance of such happening.
And it's, for them, MEAN TWEETS!!!!
Fracking makes us a net energy exporter. That makes Putin strapped for cash to the extent he's had to reduce his defense outlays. Banning fracking will put Russia back into the tall grass. Right? Look of blinding incomprehension. MEAN TWEETS! It's not that they aren't capable of figuring this out. It's that nothing else matters. Either this is new to them and they are incapable of processing it because of MEAN TWEETS, or they know about it but can't comprehend its importance compared to MEAN TWEETS.
I use the term to cover what they consider coarse or inconsiderate communications besides tweets.

It is astonishing to see the complete incomprehension when the subject of minority employment, for example, is raised.

And so they'll vote for an all-time champ of corruption who happens to be subject to galloping senesence followed by a dirty prosecutor who couldn't get past first base in the democratic primaries.

In terms of my own equanimity, a policy difference can be considerably less annoying.

Richard Aubrey said...

There's talk of demographic groups, education levels, age groups, economic levels and so forth. There's another group which may be one of the deciders. It's the mush head group. I know a couple of the sweetest ladies you'll ever meet. They've functioned effectively through their lives and have no baggage--drugs, criminal history, bankruptcy, multiple divorces--in their past. I don't make a value judgment, necessarily, but to say more effectively you organize your life, the less chance of such happening.
And it's, for them, MEAN TWEETS!!!!
Fracking makes us a net energy exporter. That makes Putin strapped for cash to the extent he's had to reduce his defense outlays. Banning fracking will put Russia back into the tall grass. Right? Look of blinding incomprehension. MEAN TWEETS! It's not that they aren't capable of figuring this out. It's that nothing else matters. Either this is new to them and they are incapable of processing it because of MEAN TWEETS, or they know about it but can't comprehend its importance compared to MEAN TWEETS.
I use the term to cover what they consider coarse or inconsiderate communications besides tweets.

It is astonishing to see the complete incomprehension when the subject of minority employment, for example, is raised.

And so they'll vote for an all-time champ of corruption who happens to be subject to galloping senesence followed by a dirty prosecutor who couldn't get past first base in the democratic primaries.

In terms of my own equanimity, a policy difference can be considerably less annoying.

AllenS said...

I talked to about 100 focus groups just this last weekend who all came to the conclusion that Sarah Longwell is full of shit.

JZ said...

It’s going to be awful, either way. I’m dreading 2021. I will be able to avoid a lot of the ugliness but certainly not all of it. I think I am among the more fortunate. But I think it will be awful.

tim in vermont said...

They did manage to buy off Matt Drudge, and that was big.

Kevin said...

because they believe Democrats are worse and the media aren’t to be trusted.

If you think you can trust the media, you're too demented to vote.

And if the media can get rid of Trump, what makes you think they'll suddenly revert to telling the truth?

Iman said...

The Democrats will be moderated. Forcibly, when necessary. Always. Too bad, but karma. They’ll have to wait to see if they’ve bitten off more than they can chew. There will be omelets. We just need to break a few eggs.

Alcibiades said...

She's the publisher of the Bulwark.

Her other article in The Atlantic is: Mitt Romney, It’s Time
The senator is best positioned to pry the Republican Party from President Trump’s hands.

Enough said.

Mr. T. said...

"Instead they swim in a cultural soup of Trumpism, surrounded by friends,"

Sneering leftwing media speak for

"Deplorables who are upset that antifa and BLM keep burning down our homes and livelyhood, while the teacher unions keep stealing our property taxes so they can go on molesting and raping our children."

hombre said...

The Atlantic belongs on a hook in the outhouse.

It is unlikely that any significant number of Trump supporters think he is doing a “bad job.” It is generally indisputable that pre-pandemic, despite Democrat sedition, Trump was doing what his supporters elected him to do although many of us also voted for him to avoid Crooked Hillary and the Dems.

Joe the Grifter and today’s loony Dems are even worse. Regardless of the results of this election, Trump’s greatest contribution may be that he has exposed how dirty the Democrats are (in so many ways), how corrupt and dishonest the media and social media are and how pervasive and foul are the swamp and the Deep State, particularly in federal law enforcement and intelligence services.

The tragedy is that half the country is too stupid to notice or too jaded to care.

tim maguire said...

If Biden is elected, I will continue to ignore partisan politics as much as my environment will allow. Just as I do now.

That said, I will be voting for Trump despite not liking many things about him because he has done a good job. But I would vote for him even if he hadn't because the Democrats want to transform society and have made it clear they are willing to use violence to do it--no matter what else you think about anything, that makes them more dangerous than the Republicans. Even if you believe that, once in office, Biden/Harris, much like Obama, will be much more moderate than advertised.

Big Mike said...

@Crack, Trump just gave your $500 Billion reparations to Ice Cube to distribute. Better go see him if you want your share.

YoungHegelian said...

What worries me (among many other things) is that if Biden wins, there will be a power struggle between the moderates & hard Left of the Democratic Party for effective control of the figurehead Biden administration. I see this intra-party power struggle as capable of producing every bit as much violence as a Left/Right wing struggle.

Rabel said...

This is propaganda from one of Bill Kristol's never-Trump groups.

Sarah Longwell: Executive director of Republicans for the Rule of Law.

"Republicans for the Rule of Law is the principal initiative of the conservative, anti-Donald Trump political group Defending Democracy Together, founded by Bill Kristol, Mona Charen, Linda Chavez, Sarah Longwell, and Andy Zwick in 2019."

NorthOfTheOneOhOne said...

Even if Biden pulls off a landslide victory, that ecosystem will remain. And so will the dislike of Democrats and distrust of the mainstream media. Getting rid of Trump won’t end the opposition’s problems."

Sounds to me like someone's ginning up a case for:

Confiscating fire arms/Repealing the 2nd Amendment by fiat.

Restricting rights.

Locking up those who refuse to comply in camps.

SoLastMillennium said...

A while back Ann Althouse said...

"Well, count on Republicans to make themselves disgusting to ordinary people."

Which is her most interesting comment on politics so far and might be a foundational belief of hers which would explain many of her posts and comments. It certainly would explain this post if was a strong belief.

I so wish she would talk of this more, and not just give a circular answer. When did she first learn this? What was the event that convinced her? What is the something real behind this?


Bilwick said...

What interests me more is these alleged Lifelong Republicans who appear on the Lincoln Project's YouTube videos saying they are going to vote for Biden, which is a vote for Kamala Harris, AOC and the rest of the collectivist zoo. Assuming these people aren't just paid spokespeople on Soros Bucks, would you really abandon lifelong principles (limited government, a free market, Second Amendment) because Trump hasn't been your ideal president? "I'll vote myself into serfdom! That'll show Trump!" Or is it simply a People's Pottage thing (look it up)? "I'm getting on in years, and will need expensive medical care, so screw limited government!" Very strange.

Rabel said...

And like most "Life Long Republicans" Sarah is also a grossly overweight lesbian.

Dex Quire said...

Going on record here to predict a Trump win for the presidency in 2020. Not based on emotion or wish fulfillment. A specific detail that both Dems and Repubs have missed. I'll talk about it after the election if anyone e is interested. Cheers.

pacwest said...

despite a mismanaged pandemic
He saved over 10 million lives! And that is by the left's own metric. More than Gahndi and Mother Teresa combined.

widespread economic fallout
In part by not following his initial instincts due to an abundance of caution forced on him by the deep state, but mostly due to Democratic state and local politicians. Or meaning the one where the recovery is exceeding expectations despite Democratic lockdown on both the economy and stimulus packages?

a racial crisis exacerbated by divisive rhetoric
What racial crisis? The one where a bunch of white kids cheered on by Democrats riot and burn down black businesses in the name of Marxism? Or the one where Black colleges don't have to go begging for funding every couple of years. Probably not the immense funding of black owned businesses.

and a debate meltdown
Oooh, a meltdown. Oooh. What a puddle.

Whatever. But at least the Democrats are worse what with their last two (three, four?) candidates being two of the biggest government crooks in American history.

Mideast peace, record unemployment, lower taxes, wage gains mainly benefiting the middle and lower classes, trade deals favoring the US, ...on and on. While fighting off two palace coup attempts and upholding the Constitution and the principles of the Republic no less. It is totally inexplicable why any American would vote for this man. Inexplicable I tell you.

But if we vote for the Democrats they might quit burning down our cities so they have that going for them.

NorthOfTheOneOhOne said...

Hmmm, interesting! Apparently in Oct, 2019 Sara Longwell was opining that Mitt Romney was in a position to take over control of the Republican Party!


So much for that!

RichardJohnson said...

"Instead they swim in a cultural soup of Trumpism, surrounded by friends, family, and social-media acquaintances who do live more exclusively in a right-wing-media ecosystem."

I live in a place that votes Democrat. Some of my friends are Republican, some are Democrat. For nearly a decade I debated politics with a Democrat friend over Friday beers at a local venue- since closed. A friend who has always voted Democrat is voting Republican this year. Half of my relatives are yellow-dog Democrats. I was born and raised in a place- not in the state where now live- that votes Democrat. Most to all of my childhood friends are Democrats.

Regarding the "right-wing-media ecosystem," I am reminded of a Republican cousin's interchange with a Democrat cousin. The Democrat cousin replied that she was "poorly informed." Her reply was that she didn't restrict herself to lefty Facebook feeds.

Regarding the "right-wing-media ecosystem," I read the NYT and WaPo less now that they no longer have a simple click-and-read option.

Rick said...

"Some meaningful number of voters who are clear-eyed about Trump and his manifest failures—even those who think he is plainly doing a bad job—will stick with the president..."
"... because they believe Democrats are worse and the media aren’t to be trusted


It would be easier to understand her point if she'd list these failures. But based on commercials Biden ran yesterday during NFL games he thinks it's the economic impact of the pandemic. The ads included a bar/ restaurant owner testifying that reducing capacity has put his life's work at risk ending with the claim this is "Trump's Economy".

This is a strange position since essentially every public Dem in the country wanted more draconian measures in place for longer, even beside the issue that the closures are mandated by governors and mayors rather than Trump. Trump was the only one who believed the economy should be considered, which makes a certain amount of sense since Dems think they can just take more from people who don't vote for them and give it to those who do.

It's a bizarre position which shows the Dems were fine with intentionally damaging the economy to give themselves a campaign issue. I suppose they're hoping to influence those who don't understand the Dem's position, but given the hoopla are there that many who don't understand this?

Achilles said...

Yes, it will be interesting to see what these people do if Trump is cut off after one term. I'm thinking something like the Tea Party will reconfigure itself, but also that much less polite people — having seen how aggressively Trump was torn apart every day of his entire term — will treat Biden just as harshly.

If Trump loses we are going to treat you like you have been treating us.

BLM/Antifa are a bunch of losers and bitches.

We will show you what reality is like. After they actually defund the police and people can no longer call them for help then we will see the truth of human nature.

We will never accept a corrupt child molesting rapist as president.

We will never respect people that could vote for Joe Biden.

n.n said...

End of Obama's Iraq War 2.0, coups, domestic spying and intimidation; emigration reform rather than [catastrophic] [anthropogenic] immigration reform (e.g. "refugee crises", illegal immigration), child trafficking; standing up to diversity (e.g. racism) and sociopolitical rackets; addressing progressive prices secured through Obamacares; standing up to human and civil rights violations under color of social justice, globalism, and inclusion; standing up to the climate cargo cult and redistributive change and extortion schemes; equal treatment rather than political congruence ("="); limiting injury and collateral damage from a foreign-sourced virus, despite Planned Parent, the press et al stigmatizing early treatments; and surviving 16 trimesters of witch hunts, warlock trials, and protests. The American dream: Pro-Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness without discrimination by age, color, sex, etc.

Tyrone Slothrop said...

If Trump loses, I'm thinking less Tea Party and more Citizen Militia.

Cassandra said...

re: "cultural soup"

Actually, we are surrounded by a mixture of people, some of whom are frothing at the mouth anti-Republican and hate Trump like they hated W, others are traditional/moderate Democrats (some of these are worried there's no place for them in the party these days), some are moderate Republicans who voted for Hillary, others moderate Republicans who voted for Trump.

So if it's a cultural soup, it's got a long and varied ingredient list.

wendybar said...

Do You want to STAY America, or do you want to be China?? THAT's the choice. Joe is selling us out. Vote for Joe if you think Foreign corruption is okay!!!

Left Bank of the Charles said...

Trump is something like the Tea Party, so maybe he will reconfigure himself if he loses. Trump Network was the rumored plan if he lost in 2016, why not if he loses in 2020. Since to him even Fox News is infected with fake news, it will be put up or shut up time. He’ll also need to start Trump Twitter.

Achilles said...

Bay Area Guy said...

This is close. Kudos to The Atlantic, for even getting this close.

Most Democrat voters are nice people. They want peace. They don't want racism. They want gays to be treated fairly with dignity. They wanna own homes, and have good white collar, professional jobs. Etc, etc.

What I just described are my neighbors. Nice, clueless, well-off, older folks, who vote Dem.


This is bullshit.

Everyone knows that Biden is a corrupt rapist.

They just refuse to admit it.

Everyone knows the violence that is inherent in the left now.

Those "nice" people voting for democrats are a part of the problem and 100% responsible for what comes next.

Bilwick said...

The Sarah Longwell article, just based on the excerpts here, seems like what Glenn Reynolds on Istapundit called the "Gorillas in the Mist" school of journalism he predicted would become fairly common after Trump defeated Hillary.

bagoh20 said...

"having seen how aggressively Trump was torn apart every day of his entire term — will treat Biden just as harshly. "

No, I don't think we will, because: we are not made that way. We didn't do it to Obama, who I think most of us found more dangerous than Biden. We will critique honestly, not with blatant known lies pursued for years. We won't have to be harsh, because mother nature and the truth will handle that just fine. We won't have to make up lies or attack his family if the truth is simply allowed to see the light of day.

robother said...

Ann thinks "much less polite people — having seen how aggressively Trump was torn apart every day of his entire term — will treat Biden just as harshly."

Of course, none of those people occupy corner offices in the FBI, CIA or DOJ, much less any MSM or Big Tech corporation. (If Biden wins, how long will Tucker Carlsen last at Fox--not even till inauguration.) Trump's trade deals with China and NAFTA will turn into a bonanza for the Biden family, billions for each exception or concession. And Big Tech and MSM have already established that any reports of such corruption during a Biden Harris administration are Russian disinformation, cause to ban any news organization that publishes them, and any user who links.

I joked under another heading about Ann's non-voting stance being early dementia, but, realistically, it might save her blog if Biden and the Dems take over. If she wants to keep her blog, she can keep her blog, provided that she and her commenters restrict themselves to light-hearted observations about Dylan, the Beatles, masks and such. Just for shits and giggles, so to speak.

I Have Misplaced My Pants said...

That overwhelming cultural Trumpism soup: to live in an "exclusively right-wing-media ecosystem" all you need to do is avoid ABC, CBS, NBC, MSNBC, CNN, NPR, NYT, WaPo, Daily Beast, Atlantic, Facebook, Twitter, Netflix, Hollywood, Disney... And Althouse.

Not to mention the preaching from corporate America. My favorite were the banner ads on the H-E-B (Texas grocery store) curbside site and Amazon exhorting me to donate to BLM. And Walmart piping messages about racial justice over the PA in between the other minilectures about distancing and masks. And a few years ago when I popped into Office Depot just needing binder clips and there were signs all over the place with Lady Gaga's gay whatever.

Leftists: more pushy and annoying than Jehovah's Witnesses.

roesch/voltaire said...

Well at least Biden won't encourage domestic terrorism, and he would get the endorsement from Putin and the Taliban as Trump has.

Kai Akker said...

We won't have Biden to kick around long enough.

J Melcher said...

"What does it matter if the less polite people want to treat the Democratic party and its lackey's harshly? They don't have control of the media. They don't have control of the schools. They don't have the institutional daily low-level control of the government. What does it matter what they think? They have no voice."

It's dangerous to allow the resistance/opposition no voice. It does matter.

Dylan Klebold was a marginalized, voiceless, student. Timothy McVeigh was a voiceless veteran. Cliven Bundy had a voice in court but 21 years of fruitless talk left him eager for action.

Soap box. Ballot box. Bullet box. This is not a new idea...

Don't remove the soap box.

BidenFamilyTaxPayerFundedCrackPipe said...

Do we love our Rabel, or what?

Left Bank of the Charles said...

The equally interesting question is what the Democrats will do if they win the House, the Senate, and the Presidency. Will they govern so as to hold their House and Senate majorities in 2022? Or will they lose one as they did in 2010, or lose both as they did in 1994?

tim maguire said...

having seen how aggressively Trump was torn apart every day of his entire term

How does one square this sympathetic remark with the earlier remark (thanks to SoLastMillennium for reminding us), based on nothing more than a smear from one of the resident lefty trolls, "Well, count on Republicans to make themselves disgusting to ordinary people."

Why isn't the aggressive tearing apart deserved given that Republicans make themselves disgusting to ordinary people?

RichardJohnson said...

Bruce Hayden
Realistically, he [Trump] can claim credit for:
- reducing our dependence on foreign oil, primarily through allowing fracking, which has turned this country from having oil as a weakness, to one of our greater geopolitical strengths. Wasn’t happening under Obama, and wouldn’t have under Crooked Hillary.


While Obama can claim no credit for it, fracking increased during his terms in office. Easy way to corroborate: the price of oil crashed to around $50/BBL in the second half of 2014. The price of oil crashed due to increased oil production from fracking. While Obama tried to take credit for increased oil production, some Obama quotes quickly refute that. In addition, increased domestic production occurred on privately owned lands, not on Federal lands.

In 2008, Presidential candidate Obama off-the-teleprompter told us that tuneups and inflating tires could save the equivalent amount of oil that increased domestic drilling would provide. Fracking has shown Obama's claim to be absurd, but in 2008, before the advent of mass fracking, anyone with a modicum of knowledge of oil and gas production could easily refute Obama's claim. That Obama doubled down and refused to admit his mistake indicated what a conceited fool he is.

In 2012, Obama, in his infinite wisdom, informed us that we couldn't drill our way to lower gas(oline) prices. Yup.

Hillary, Biden, and Obama are definitely anti-fracking compared to Trump, though Biden has IIRC put himself on both sides of the fracking issue.

tim maguire said...

Left Bank of the Charles said...
The equally interesting question is what the Democrats will do if they win the House, the Senate, and the Presidency. Will they govern so as to hold their House and Senate majorities in 2022? Or will they lose one as they did in 2010, or lose both as they did in 1994?


When a party runs the table, they pretty much always squander the advantage through short-sighted hubris, giving the other party an opening to recapture a share of the power. While I think it unlikely that the Dems will take it all, I think it impossible that they will hold it together for more than one election cycle.

Nob490 said...

+5 points to MayBee.

This is what I have been saying for years!

I am continually astounded by my family's (siblings, not my wife and children) inability, despite their advanced degrees, to imagine that anyone can come to a different conclusion than them. Unless of course, those conclusions are based on deplorable thinking.

While I almost always disagree with them I don't belittle their choices, or say things like "Won't someone, please, explain to me how some people can continue to be so misguided."

I don't ever assume that I am right and they are wrong, like they do. We just see things differently.

Smug pains in my ass.

bagoh20 said...

Like the mayor of Portland, who you gonna call when your violent insurgents inform you that they are not yours either? Don't expect us to help out. We'd rather wait for the smoke to clear and start over without you.

rhhardin said...

What manifest failures would those be.

pacwest said...

Well at least Biden won't encourage domestic terrorism

???

bagoh20 said...

"Well at least Biden won't encourage domestic terrorism..."

Come on, man! That's just an idea.

Rick said...

a racial crisis exacerbated by divisive rhetoric

This is one of the more absurd criticisms.

Joe Biden: "[Mitt Romney Republicans] want to put ya'll [black Americans] back in chains."

It's revealing none of the people citing "divisive rhetoric" ever criticized Joe Biden for this. One reason they don't criticize Biden for this is that essentially all left wingers believe it which only emphasizes that they aren't concerned about divisiveness for one second.

Gospace said...

FullMoon said...

Also, Joe's "heartfelt" appeal to voters who have an addict in their orbit was a good touch. Attacks on Hunter's disgusting behavior as an addict entertaining but not useful. Emphasis needs to remain on fact that he profited from Joe's position. That is obviously true, emails or no emails. The vid of Joe bragging about dangling the billion dollars, coupled with Hunter's Soprano like no show job are killer for the average working stiff.

10/19/20, 12:19 PM


In the case of my brother-in-law, the family just gave up on him- after he bled the parents dry of any inheritance they might have left to the other 6 kids. He made it to age 63. No one in the family gave him a job, recommended him for a job, provided him shelter...

But let's look at Hunter. Age and drug waiver to get into the Navy- as a COMMISSIONED OFFICER. Tell me that's not special treatment. Lasts less than 6 months before popping positive on a whiz quiz. Gets administratively discharged- WITHOUT A COURT MARTIAL! Again, tell me that's not special treatment. Those of us with addicts in the family really don't feel any sympathy for Biden because he has one- he failed to deal with it properly.

stevew said...

Achilles @1:07 PM

Appreciate the sentiment but I don't think you are correct. Republicans and conservatives have not shown that they behave as the BLM/Antifa/Rioters/Looters have behaved over the past nearly four years. There may be pockets of conservative people that will, but nothing like on the scale of the liberal miscreants.

roesch/voltaire said...

Nob do you ever question why you see things differently from your family in the face of things like the New England Journal of Medicine for the first time in over 200 years endorsing a president candidate. Or maybe Rolling Stone endorsement of Biden, or maybe maybe Republican senator Ben Sasse's comments about how Trump "kisses dictators' butts" or General Kelly and the list goes on.

Rick said...

roesch/voltaire said...
Well at least Biden won't encourage domestic terrorism, and he would get the endorsement from Putin and the Taliban as Trump has.


This is obviously false. Biden spent 6 months winking at the largest domestic terrorist movement in 50 years before mildly criticizing violence all while minimizing the threat.

Left wingers just don't live in reality.

Bay Area Guy said...

Our friend, @Achilles, calls out my purported bullshit:

I said: "Most Democrat voters are nice people. They want peace. They don't want racism. They want gays to be treated fairly with dignity. They wanna own homes, and have good white collar, professional jobs. Etc, etc.

What I just described are my neighbors. Nice, clueless, well-off, older folks, who vote Dem."

He said: This is bullshit.

Allow me a quick reply, my warrior friend: I think you are making a similar mistake as Dems often make - extrapolating on politics too far from the specific to the general.

In 2016, Hillary got 66 Million votes. You think all those 66 Million voters were wackjob Antifa, BLM, college professors, felons and woke feminists?

I don't. I think most of those 66 Million are like Althouse, or Inga or Readering, or my clueless neighbors in Northern Cal, where I live and work. I see things on the ground in blue city, blue state, for over 45 years. I know these people. I live and work with them. I see how they operate. These are mostly nice harmless people -- with wrong-headed ideas.

This has recently changed with the advent of the violent/anarchist wing that you and I both also see in Seattle and Portland. Very bad criminals. In 2000, I remember the Gore v. Bush battles with a lotta lawyers, but I don't recall physical violence and Molotov Cocktails.

Sadly, these violent thugs have a huge influence in the Dem party, and are trying to influence the vote in November. You see that, I see that. And, sadly, there's a lotta clueless Dem politicians and voters who enable these thugs, true.

But it's also true that these leftist/anarchist thugs are a small minority in the Dem Party. They are an important part of the political story, but they are not the full story.

Politically, you and I are on the same side. If Trump wins, despite the violence, despite the cheating, you will be in a good place. And, I think he has a slightly better than 50-50 chance to win in a couple of weeks.

Hang tough, Achilles! (But not too tough:)

stevew said...

Prediction: should Biden win all the NeverTrump talking heads and pundits will pivot to defending conservatism and complaining about Biden. Why? Because that's where the money is.

Francisco D said...

roesch/voltaire said... Well at least Biden won't encourage domestic terrorism, and he would get the endorsement from Putin and the Taliban as Trump has.

If r/v and Robert Reich are the best trolls the Dems have to offer, things are looking bright.

It is possible that these people are stupid and overly credulous. However, I believe that they will tell any lie (a la Christine Blasey Ford) to get the power they want. On November 3:

Make Orwell Fiction Again

ALP said...

Question: if we see record-breaking voter turnout, will Trump get any credit for inspiring people to engage in democracy? I have never seen so much churning emotion over voting in my entire 6 decades.

Iman said...

FAT!!!!!

bagoh20 said...

I guess "manifest failures" means things we hoped for and then did, but blame you for it.

Does anybody really believe that Democrats wish these things didn't happen? They tried everything else, and Trump was sailing to reelection with nothing left to critique but too much Tweeting. No way they wanted good news to continue.

If Biden gets elected, having served their purpose, the economic news, and Covid narratives will reverse overnight.

If Trump wins, things will continue to improve, and you'll never know it.

Nob490 said...

roesch/voltaire: Aren't there other journals, and yikes! rock music magazines?! and senators who disagree?

I don't say that I am infallible, or even right, necessarily. My point is simply that I allow people to come to different conclusions without belittling them.

The fact that we've spent almost four years chasing Trump's "Russia" b.s., all over social media and regular media, and the first seemingly legit instance of Biden doing what Trump was falsely accused of and we get "Look at these idiots, falling once again for Russian agitprop. Such morons."

Can there be no investigation? No curiosity allowed? It may turn out to be bogus, but to dismiss it out of hand is nonsense.

As is the Charlottesville nonsense.

Trump may be a hard to defend buffoon, but him being so doesn't make Joe Biden a saint.

Rick.T. said...

roesch/voltaire said...
Well at least Biden won't encourage domestic terrorism, and he would get the endorsement from Putin and the Taliban as Trump has.
--------------------
We do know that Putin pretty much endorsed Biden as ideologically closer to Soviet communism, so there's that. Biden also supported Russia's entry into the IMF and WTO. And of course, Trump's moved troops and materiel closer to the Russian border as well as making NATO members increase their defense spending.

DEEBEE said...

I am one of those people who is very clear-eyed about Disliking Trump’s antics and not his policy action. No I do not visit Breitbart and Fox — regularly. Yes I would have like an establishment Repub pick up on Trump’s themes but NOOOO. The moneybags on the conservative side would not allow that and neither would the globalists at the Chamber of commerce.

I am however forced to rethink my social group that is full of people who have TDS and still yearn to find these right wing, easily available networks.

Sebastian said...

"the media aren’t to be trusted."

Is there anyone who thinks, in general, that the media are "to be trusted"? I mean beyond progs assuming that the media can be trusted to promote Dems and the prog narrative?

Nonapod said...

No matter what happens I don't think things are going to get better in the near term. I see only bitterness, anger and hate in our collective futures.

There seems to be an extremely significant divide between perceptions of Trump voters and Biden voters.

Biden voters see Trump as having many "failures". Many (perhaps most?) of them seem to see this country as deeply systemically racist. They see any bad events as being Trump's entirely fault and any good events as being the result of something other than Trump. Many of them fully believe the various hoaxes perpetuated by the media Trump, that he called white supremecists "fine people", that he called dead soldiers losers.

They conclude that even though Biden is flawed, he's somehow a better choice.

It's extremely disheartening to see this severe divide. I never in my life thought we'd reach this point, where half the country is percieving events in a widely different way than the other and there's no longer any meeting in the middle. And what's worse, I truly believe that if Biden wins we'll be heading for an era of chaos the likes of which we haven't seen in our modern times.

I hope I'm wrong.

bagoh20 said...

I just started recently, but yes, some of us do read Breitbart.

"The survey shows Biden leading the president by 1.3 percent, garnering 47.6 percent to the president’s 46.3 percent. The Democrat candidate’s lead is well within the survey’s +/- 2.94 percent margin of error, pointing to a virtual tie in the Badger State."

"Monday’s RealClearPolitics average had Biden leading in Wisconsin by six percent. However, the final average in 2016 had Hillary Clinton winning the state by 6.5 percent. To the shock of many, Trump secured the state by less than a single percentage point."


https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020/10/19/wisconsin-poll-joe-biden-donald-trump-statistically-tied-badger-state/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+breitbart+%28Breitbart+News%29

bagoh20 said...

Jeffrey Toobin's dick has a zoom feature, but his employer wasn't impressed.

https://pjmedia.com/instapundit/407825/

Jupiter said...

"Even if Biden pulls off a landslide victory, that ecosystem will remain. And so will the dislike of Democrats and distrust of the mainstream media."

"Dislike"? "Distrust"? I wouldn't dislike throwing them into the ocean from a helicopter. I would trust them to splash when they hit.

AllenS said...

5/6/11

“We can’t just drill our way out of the problem,” Obama said during an energy policy speech in Indiana Friday. “If we’re serious about addressing our energy problems, we’re going to have to do more than drill.” -- Barack Hussein Obama

"do more than drill", so he comes up with a brilliant idea: cash for clunkers.

What a fucking idiot.

tim in vermont said...

“Foreign Policy” has been eliminated as a debate topic.

https://twitter.com/DonaldJTrumpJr/status/1318206094750212097

Wow are they ever trying to protect Clueless Joe Biden from any questions.

tim in vermont said...

So if Trump asks him about Hunter, it will be ruled as an off topic question and Biden will say “Talk to the hand” again.

I am not sure that is going to work for them as well as they think. They know this election is over if this gets out into the broad electorate.

Of course if it’s disinformation, I think that the blowback Trump would get if the FBI came out and said this stuff was fabricated would settle the election the other way. Which raises the question of why the FBI hasn’t done so, and why Biden hasn’t claimed the emails are fake. Of course to ask these questions is to answer them.

Sally327 said...

The Democrats used the IRS to destroy the Tea Party movement during the Obama administration so I doubt that will be an open avenue for anyone seeking to mobilize.

What we should do is work from the ground up at the local level, support good candidates running for local and state office, get involved with the school board, all that sort of thing. Most of what affects our daily lives happens right in own neighborhoods, our own towns and cities, plus it's those officials who are interpreting and implementing what comes down from Washington.

Take back the country one mile marker at a time.

Night said...

I consider myself more progressive than progressives but I consistently vote for Trump. I do not care for the DC class of people left and right. Trump is the foundation for freedom in this country now. If he loses I won't riot.

I see Sam Harris and several guests projecting fears about Trump refusing to leave office if he loses. That level of fear precludes rational thinking which Harris thinks he is famous for. He attaches Q and Proud Boys to conservatives when at best they have been extreme outliers. And ignores Antifa.

Night said...

Trump should interview with Rogan and Adams and Willink. It a missed opportunity.

Night said...

Trump on his worst day is far better than Biden/Biden/Harris on their best days.

gilbar said...

Yes, it will be interesting to see what these people do if Trump is cut off after one term.

If Trump 'is cut off after one term', we will (soon) have a President Kamela... Wow!
If that happens, time to read up on Grover Cleveland

Night said...

Francisco D said...


Make Orwell Fiction Again

Have to get a new hat now. I need one that has LED's that I can change the flashing message from MOFA to MAGA

Balfegor said...

I thought this

Instead they swim in a cultural soup of Trumpism, surrounded by friends, family, and social-media acquaintances who do live more exclusively in a right-wing-media ecosystem.

Sounded implausible, since Trump's vote was geographically distributed and generally not as concentrated as Clinton's. That's true, but not as true as I had thought. I looked at the county level data. At first blush, it might look like Trump's voters are way more cocooned, because the most pro-Trump district was 96.03% for Trump, vs. only 90.86% for Clinton. But the most pro-Clinton district was DC (311K voters), and Keya Paha had 479 votes total.

The top 3 districts for Clinton are DC (90.86%), the Bronx (88.52%), and Prince George's County (88.13%). Grouping Trump districts to get roughly the same population as the top three districts for Clinton, his top 78 districts gave him 87.8% of the vote; the next 76, 84.82%; and the next 57, 83.08%. The Trump vote share in the Trumpiest synthetic district still isn't as high as Clinton's vote share in her third most lopsided district.

But this comparison overstates the cocooning of Trump's voter base -- I'm literally taking his highest vote share from anywhere and cobbling together a synthetic district that represents the absolute Trumpiest population you could assemble (and then number 2, and number 3). But even then, they're still not as lopsidedly pro-Trump as DC, the Bronx, and PG county are pro-Clinton. And in reality, all these tiny pro-Trump districts have other somewhat less Trumpy districts in their vicinity.

Long story short, while I'm sure there are some parts of the country where one could swim in a "cultural soup" of Trumpism -- more, in fact, than I had expected -- it's not nearly as pronounced as the pro-Clinton/anti-Trump cocooning.

tim in vermont said...

Oh look:

John Ratcliffe, Director of National Intelligence, told Fox Business on Monday morning that Hunter Biden’s laptop was not part of a Russian disinformation campaign despite the media’s attempts to claim otherwise. - Daily Wire

Glad that’s cleared up. He’s pretty unequivocal and in a position to know. The stories of “Russian disinformation” came from anonymous “former officials"

Night said...

Bay Area Guy said...
Our friend, @Achilles, calls out my purported bullshit:

I said: "Most Democrat voters are nice people.

Same. Lots of left coast friends who support Biden. They like to assign violence to conservatives based on one or two people doing something horrendous. They prefer to put blinders on when it comes to ANtifa and just say " Ah those kids these days." they become a passive part of the violent mob when they propose groupthinking past the violence of their kids. Makes life difficult for everyone in the long run.

All my Biden friends. ALL. Post their support for Biden online. None of the Trump friends do. NONE. Should be an automatic vote for Trump when that dynamic occurs in society.

Jupiter said...

"We will show you what reality is like. After they actually defund the police and people can no longer call them for help then we will see the truth of human nature."

They have no intention of defunding the police. It's much worse than that. The plan is to take over the police, by driving out the good ones, and training the rest not to cross rioters and looters. Then they will use them to arrest the rest of us, on charges from the Soros DA's. That's how they intend to get around the 2nd amendment. Give the devil his due, it's a well-thought-out plan, and it isn't clear what we can do about it.

Rick said...

Barack Hussein Obama

"do more than drill", so he comes up with a brilliant idea: cash for clunkers.


Isn't it revealing every one of Obama's - and Democrats - policies is the same: take money from people he hates and give it to his voters. The justifications change, but the policies themselves are always the same. That's why left and right disagree about Obamacare. The right criticizes it because it was sold as universal insurance which would reduce total costs. Needless to say it did not, in fact Obamacare fails every stated goal.

But the left still loves Obamacare because they always understood it was about shifting costs from Dem constituencies to others (taxpayers, young and productive workers). The rest was just PR for the rubes.

Jack Klompus said...

"Well at least Biden won't encourage domestic terrorism, and he would get the endorsement from Putin and the Taliban as Trump has."

I think you might be the stupidest human being ever to draw oxygen.

"Or maybe Rolling Stone endorsement of Biden..."

Okay, it's no longer up for questioning.

mccullough said...

Those who aren’t Left or Far Left will sit back and watch the Far Left destroy the Left.

High violent crime, shitty schools that are so bad they can’t even indoctrinate the children, high suicide rates, high drug usage rates, declining numbers of military recruits and police departments that no one will join.

The Left has spread far too much Covid Panic to ever come back. Their children will not make it through life.

And no one who is not Left or Far Left will do anything to help them.

I'm Not Sure said...

"I never in my life thought we'd reach this point, where half the country is percieving events in a widely different way than the other and there's no longer any meeting in the middle."

Meet in the middle? Otherwise known as a click of the ratchet. You know- the one-way ratchet, where today's allowance is tomorrow's nefarious loophole that needs closing. Because "common sense".

JAORE said...

"...much less polite people — having seen how aggressively Trump was torn apart every day of his entire term — will treat Biden just as harshly. "

Yes, because my occasional posts on Althouse overcomes the noise (filtered through) Twitter, FacebookABC, CBS, NBC, MSNBC......"

Would that my "harshly" committed acts had that level of power.

Pianoman said...

I don't watch Fox News, and I don't read Breitbart. If I want to watch cable news, I'll watch OANN.

I get most of my news from a handful of linking sites, and get most of my commentary right here at Althouse.

I think Trump is a circus clown, and I wish he wouldn't Tweet so much. But the Dems can't be allowed anywhere near the levers of power until they demonstrate that they've earned it back. That means they have to cut loose the Left from their party, and return to being the part of the "working man".

Until then, I'll vote straight GOP because they're less bad than the Dems.

BUMBLE BEE said...

R/V proving once again... a mind can be a terrible thing.

RichardJohnson said...

roesch/voltaire
Nob do you ever question why you see things differently from your family in the face of things like the New England Journal of Medicine for the first time in over 200 years endorsing a president candidate.
It was also unprecedented that in 2016, daily newspapers that endorsed Trump accounted for only 2% of daily circulation. I didn't follow in the footsteps of the 98% of daily circulation who didn't endorse Trump, so it is not likely that I will fall in the footsteps of the New England Journal of Medicine, unprecedented though its endorsement may be.

Daily newspaper endorsements in the 2016 United States presidential election

Or maybe Rolling Stone endorsement of Biden
As Rolling Stone's reputation for journalistic integrity is bottom-of-the-barrel after its reporting of the fake rape at the University of Virginia, only a fool or a yellow dog Democrat would consider Rolling Stone's endorsement of Biden a valid reason to vote for him.

or maybe maybe Republican senator Ben Sasse's comments about how Trump "kisses dictators' butts"

Seems to me that Trump did a much better job than Obama of NOT kissing the Mullah's butts. But as it appears that Democrats like to kiss the Mullahs' butts, that is not to Trump's credit, according to the Democrat narrative.
For the last 80 years, realpolitik has required that the US do some kissing of dictators's butts. Such as Stalin in WW2. Such as the Saudis. If Trump has kissed dictators' butts, he is no different from any other President in the last 8 decades. I also note that for the last 4 years, Democrats have claimed that Trump is Putin's stooge, but the facts do not support that. Such as Trump's support for fracking.

hstad said...

"...even those who think he's(Trump) doing a bad job..." the Atlantic rag who seems to get their sources only from select groups. What about these folks: a Gallup poll that shows 56% of the country believes they are better off today than they were 4 years ago.

https://news.gallup.com/opinion/gallup/321650/gallup-election-2020-coverage.aspx?utm_source=alert&utm_medium=email&utm_content=morelink&utm_campaign=syndication

How about these folks? "...56% of the country say President Trump will win on November 3rd..."

https://www.wtxl.com/news/election-2020/gallup-poll-majority-of-americans-believe-trump-will-win-november-election

Iman said...

Jeffrey Toobin: Typical liberal male... a mile of mouth and 2.5 inches of dick.

Skeptical Voter said...

Some people will stick--or switch--to Trump because he's the lesser of two evils? Ya think?

But let's posit a Biden win. Would those on the right emulate their progressive betters and give a Biden presidency a dose of the same political codswallop and castor oil that the Schumer Pelosi Hoyer gang has tried to force down Trump's throat each day.

I'd like to think that the folks on the right were more polite than that--but once they've seen a slow motion coup and nullification of their 2016 choice, they just might have a case of what we called in the Army in my day the "natural Russian Red ass". And those who suffer from that disease tend to be grumpy and even vicious in their behavior. But after all the progressives have shown the way.

Readering said...

I think it's starting to sink in with Trumpists.

Greg The Class Traitor said...

tim maguire said...
While I think it unlikely that the Dems will take it all, I think it impossible that they will hold it together for more than one election cycle.


Oh, Tim, you think if the Democrats take it all in November, they're going to allow another honest election?

"We need Universal Mail in Ballots!"

"Cleaning up the voter registration rolls is voter suppression!"

"Photo ID requirements are voter suppression!"

Pack the Court so Dem "judges" won't get overturned by the Supreme Court when they change the election rule to whatever the Democrats need to "win" each State.

After all, the Republicans are all Nazis, we can't let them back in power!

2020 is the last election we'll have where your vote matters, unless Trump wins

Greg The Class Traitor said...

roesch/voltaire said...
Well at least Biden won't encourage domestic terrorism, and he would get the endorsement from Putin and the Taliban as Trump has.

Antifa and BLM ARE domestic terrorism, and Biden encourages both

Biden opposes fracking, Trump supports it. So every person with a functioning brain knows that Putin supports Biden.

Obama / Biden spent 8 years losing to the Taliban. Why wouldn't the Taliban want Biden?

bagoh20 said...

"I think it's starting to sink in with Trumpists."

Yep, just like last time. Do you think Hillary had as much corruption and health issues surfacing as Biden does - more or less?

Do you think Biden is getting out to voters more or less than Hillary?

Do you think voters see Trump more or less as a seriously candidate this time?

Do you think Biden will run and hide on election night like Hillary did?

Bob said...

Dear Maybee:

You like apples?

You know those things in our heads you call "opinions"? They're not opinions. They're facts! We have them all. We are the thoughtful people who trust science and the people working for the common good. You clowns all have rocks in your heads. When we're restored to our rightful places in this country, we won't even allow you to vote anymore. We will cancel you all!

How you like Dem apples?

[By the way, good comment!]

Unknown said...

"Yes, it will be interesting to see what these people do if Trump is cut off after one term. I'm thinking something like the Tea Party will reconfigure itself, but also that much less polite people — having seen how aggressively Trump was torn apart every day of his entire term — will treat Biden just as harshly."

This brings to mind why we got Trump; the first significant political donnybrook I remember was Bork. I don't know if the Democratic party was that uncivil before and maybe it just broke out at that time, because I seem to remember more vaguely hearing that the Republican party wanted to kill women (while apparently Kennedy actually did). Whatever, the Democratic party has been getting more bellicose for decades. Bell curve time, as the main stream Democratic party got more coarse the outliers got more radical until it takes very little provocation to get riots. And all the while the Republican party seemed to want to continue to be genteel and above the fray.

Finally, the GOP base got a little feisty and the Tea Party movement was born. However, it's still GOP and the GOP party didn't want the hoi polloi to create a lot of unrest (after all, not genteel and certainly not above the fray). So pressure cooker time, until an uncouth self centered loud mouth capable of wrestling in the mud showed how to out-Democrat the Democratic playbook.

I don't pretend to read tea leaves, but if Trump loses it might be that the base takes a page and copies Democratic operatives the way Trump copied (maybe on purpose, maybe not) Democratic party politicos.

RichardJohnson said...

Jupiter
They have no intention of defunding the police. It's much worse than that. The plan is to take over the police, by driving out the good ones, and training the rest not to cross rioters and looters. Then they will use them to arrest the rest of us, on charges from the Soros DA's.

That is a good description of what has been happening in Portland.

Joe said...

Before going to what the author proposes and disposes, I'm constantly struck by the stated prefaces that go unargued or even explained--simply stated as self-evident truths. In this case Trump's "manifest failures." What are those failures that are so manifest that they don't even have to be listed? I often hear he's a racist (how so?), a sexist (in what ways?) divider (pot calling the kettle black much?) liar (different how from every other political person?). Trump is a unique "politician" in that he isn't much of a politician. He seems much like Teddy Roosevelt and Andrew Jackson (and a little bit Truman) who upset the "natural" order, were crude/plain spoken, terribly direct, and attacked the existing order. I care little for the politician's spoken words except as they promise to, or actually do, translate in to actions and results. Only when those actions and results don't match up to the spoken words do I begin to think maybe someone is lying.

Rick said...

there's no longer any meeting in the middle.

This has been obvious since the left's long march through the institutions was successful in the early 80s. Why would they ever compromise when they can achieve far more with institutional leverage?

Reagan compromised with them on immigration. The right's half of the deal was enacted. The left immediately reneged on their half of the deal and started pushing for more.

Pass Obamacare, immediately drop the elements you included to make the finances work (like Cadillac plans), and push for Medicare for all.

This isn't a new game plan.

Gk1 said...

Actually the worst outcome of a Biden "win" will be the millions of people who think Trump was sunk by the swamp and will either stop playing, stop paying taxes,stop giving authorities at all level of government the benefit of the doubt etc. or Some group will take it into their hands and drive a concrete truck full of TNT up to a DNC party headquarters and detonate it. I can easily see it at this point.

The democrats,republicans, media and D.C swamp have pushed all of their chips in the middle of the table to defeat Trump but they are naive beyond belief if they think this is the end of what Trump started.

And the kicker for my liberal friends is do you think Trump will go away quietly in the good night if he loses under the cloud of voter fraud? You don't think he will start a new tv channel titles "I WAS SCREWED!" and spend his days hurling molotov cocktails into the Biden administrations living room?

tim in vermont said...

Newly obtained emails from a Hunter Biden business partner lay out in detail how the Vice President’s son and his colleagues used their access to the Obama-Biden administration to arrange private meetings for potential foreign clients and investors at the highest levels in the White House. These never-before-revealed emails outline how a delegation of Chinese investors and Communist Party officials managed to secure a private, off-the-books meeting with then-Vice President Joe Biden.

Oh gee. These are emails from a screwed over partner of Archer and Biden who got left holding the bag in prison. Not even from the not really purloined laptop.

Joe Biden has rarely claimed over 400K income for him and his spouse with the IRS. He brags about it. He wants to raise taxes on the suckers who actually report their income they get from creating real value in the world.

mandrewa said...

This seems extremely appropriate to this thread.

Ben Shapiro:

"I did not vote for Donald Trump in 2016. I am voting for Donald Trump in 2020."

"There are three reasons I'm going to vote for Donald Trump in 2020 when I didn't four years ago. First I was simply wrong about Donald Trump on policy. Second I wasn't really wrong on Donald Trump on character but whatever damage he was going to do has already been done and it's not going to help if I don't vote for him this time. And third, most importantly, the democrats have lost their minds."

"So first of all Donald Trump has governed pretty conservatively. I thought he would not be conservative in his governance. I was just wrong on that. Donald Trump radically cut regulation. He actually saw reductions in the number of man-hours dedicated to dealing with regulation for the first time in a long time. Under Donald Trump, he appointed originalist judges to the best of his ability. We're talking dozens of them. Textualist originalist judges who actually care about the role of the judiciary. He cut taxes..."


See Ben Shapiro: I didn't vote for Trump in 2016. I am in 2020 -- here's why

Michael K said...

Blogger RichardJohnson said...
Jupiter
They have no intention of defunding the police. It's much worse than that. The plan is to take over the police, by driving out the good ones, and training the rest not to cross rioters and looters. Then they will use them to arrest the rest of us, on charges from the Soros DA's.

That is a good description of what has been happening in Portland.


I keep suggesting people read Kurt Schlicter's books. This plot comes from "Indian Country"

I just hope they remain fiction.

Michael K said...

Sadly, these violent thugs have a huge influence in the Dem party, and are trying to influence the vote in November. You see that, I see that. And, sadly, there's a lotta clueless Dem politicians and voters who enable these thugs, true.

But it's also true that these leftist/anarchist thugs are a small minority in the Dem Party. They are an important part of the political story, but they are not the full story.


BAG, I agree. Three of my kids are lefties. The other two think their siblings are clueless, and vice versa. We don't talk about politics. Two of the lefties are lawyers so there is an excuse. The third is in the art world so that may also be understandable.

q12345q6789 said...


OK, this is actually might be me.
It's not (all) fake news.
I'm one of the still undecided 4% of the electorate.
And yes I know most of you despise me for that.
Whatev.

I'm not a anarchist/communist/leftist.
I'm not a Trumpist.
I feel like man without a political "country".
Whatev.

BUT, after reading most of these comments I have come to the realization that so many commenters here are voting for Trump because they think that will keep the Leftists at bay. That the cultural institutions they now distrust will "come around" to see their "common sense" views again.
But that didn't happen these last four years.
Why in the world would it happen in the next?
It won't.

Cultural conservatism, or indeed common-sense thinking, and shared common decency will not come from a second Trump term. It will **ONLY** come from the bottom-up. From the hard work and civic engagement of cultural conservatives at every level of American life. And demographically, their numbers are dropping. BUT instead of redoubling their efforts to reach as many as possible to maximize their impact in order to engender a next generation that shares their values; all I see is retreat. Retreat to their own much less-populated schools, their own much less-populated neighborhoods, their own, much smaller, news media.
All I see is complaining, retreat and praying to a false king.

If Trump wins 2020,all of you who want a "return to American values" keep sitting on your dead-asses waiting for the Right's version of a cultural revolution to cleanse and purge the discontents. Well, Ya done. It's already over.
And dead-assed, small-minded, money-obsessed, lazily-disengaged conservatives were to blame.
The fact is the Left is out working you. They are engaged everyday.
Hustlin' while we are just Moanin'.

Greg The Class Traitor said...

Readering said...
I think it's starting to sink in with Trumpists.

Gallup poll is out today. National Party ID: R+1

You know what it was 4 years ago? D+5

So yes, rendering, please do tell us how it's obvious the Dems are going to "win"

stevew said...

tim in vermont: the "Russian Disinformation" as source of the Hunter Biden "smear" came directly from the mouth and vocal chords of Rep. Adam Schiff.

Matt Sablan said...

Biden, like Hillary, will never seriously be held to account or checked on anything. It's one of the many reasons that Trump, for all his flaws, is in some ways a preferable candidate. Because... we can actually keep him from indulging his worst impulses.

Marc said...

I call bullshit.

I very rarely click through to the articles when they're from such sources because almost inevitably they are written by people like Sarah Longwell or worse.

Which should I read first: Michael Anton's The Stakes or Messrs Sunstein and Vermeule's Law and Leviathan?

Robert Cook said...

"Total fantasy that Trump’s voters really dislike him. If that were true they would not vote for him. Instead they turn out by the millions Chanting 'we love you.' His courage is off the charts and he destroys our enemies. Who would not love that."

You're so busy "toobin'" over Trump you aren't reading for comprehension: the article does not assert "Trump's voters really dislike him," (as in, "his base"). It describes a segment of voters who do not like Trump but who like Biden less and therefore will vote for Trump for the same reason many Democrats will vote for Biden: he is their "lesser evil."

Me? I'm not voting for either of these truly terrible candidates.

Robert Cook said...

"And the kicker for my liberal friends is do you think Trump will go away quietly in the good night if he loses under the cloud of voter fraud? You don't think he will start a new tv channel titles "I WAS SCREWED!" and spend his days hurling molotov cocktails into the Biden administrations living room?"

He'll just return to a revived The Apprentice, where he can keep his fat head, face and body before the public, feeding his his insatiable narcissism, while getting paid big bucks to do the gig, big bucks he apparently needs.

tim in vermont said...

"Russian Disinformation" as source of the Hunter Biden "smear" came directly from the mouth and vocal chords of Rep. Adam Schiff.”

Sunday, but it was already circulating last week in the press attributed to *former* intelligence officials.

Drago said...

Readering: "I think it's starting to sink in with Trumpists."

I think its starting to sink in alright......that the dems are panicking and are crying for obambi to immediately head to Philadelphia and Detroit to try and get the base excited about Dementia Joe and His Band of Traveling Grifters Who Love Selling US Foreign Policy for Fun and Profit.

LOL

Because Dementia Joe is up by 16%.................LOLOLOLOLOLOL!!

Meanwhile, and I am hoping this isn't true, there are strong rumors that there might just be videos of trafficked children being sexually abused by Hunter on one of those laptops (there are 4 of them you know, including 1 that was left overseas!).

hmmmmmmmmm,..............gee, nothing politically compromising about any of that, eh?

tim in vermont said...

So they have changed the rules to take foreign policy out of the debates as a discussion topic, and have given the anti-Trump moderator the ability to mute Trump’s mic if he brings up the laptop, theoretically she could mute Biden’s but that will never happen.

This is kind of similar to impeachment where Trump was only allowed to present lines of defense pre-approved by Schiff. Except I don’t think that this is going to work out like they expect. It will probably help Trump if he interrupts less.

HMuns said...

There are no Trump supports who think he's doing a bad job. What an idiot statement.

exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...

I am feeling cautiously optimistic about Trump's chances. Certainly better than I did 2 weeks ago. Gallup, for the first time in decades, shows a +1 advantage for Republican affiliation nationwide. The number of GOP voter registrations in FL since March is much higher than Dem registrations. On every other metric except polls, the indications are not good for the Dems.

Baris and Barnes at People's Pundit Daily provide very interesting commentary on the poll numbers and break the data down by state and county pretty thoroughly. They think that Trump will win narrowly (it would have been a landslide if not for Wuflu) and they don't sugarcoat demographics for the states they believe are lost (like VA). They point out the difficulties of getting accurate polling data, especially about a pretty big group they believe are being missed: rural white men. Barnes made 500K betting Trump would win in 2016 and he think the Dems are making exactly the same mistakes this time around.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCWubnBV028_4rVoDPt7FpNQ

Phil 314 said...

2016 was the “lesser of two evils election. I voted for neither

Four years later, I don’t like the behavior, the tweets and the sometime stupid comments (but he does come out with some seriously funny lines at times.). But I’ve gotten used to the noise and once you get past that... its not bad

2020 is the “man vs the party” election and therein is the key issue. The Dems have gone batshit crazy and I don’t see Joe standing up to that (and frankly I‘m a bit skeptical that either his mind or his heart will survive 4 years). So this time I will vote for Trump (actually already have). Many in my family won’t be happy but the Democratic future (court packing, condoning riots, anything approaching the Green New Deal) is terrifying.

I’m an independent who leans right. I hope a majority of independents see it my way.

rcocean said...

Who here asserted that every one of the 66 million that voted for Hillary are all antifa, BLM and horrible people?

No one.

And why should everyone on the center-right have to qualify their generalizations regarding Hillary supporters or Democrats? So stupid people won't misunderstand and think we talking about every single voter with no exception? Or not upset the Tone Police, who "think we're too negative"?

Sorry, I'll pass.

Michael K said...

I still wonder why Freder or gadfly or any of the other lefties never give an example of one Trump's "Manifest Failures." You'd think they would have a long list.

OldManRick said...

Biden won't last long enough to be treated harshly. I'll be that within six months of his being elected, the democrats will discover that he has dementia and was in on Hunter's graft. In comes Kamala who is the left's idea of a dream candidate. And who is also unelectable by normal means.

Rory said...

"...the first significant political donnybrook I remember was Bork. I don't know if the Democratic party was that uncivil before..."

The Dems held the Senate all but four years between 1933 and 1981. They held the House all but four years 1931-95. The Dems' went scorched earth as soon as the Republicans started consistently contesting control of Congress.

bagoh20 said...

You know, back before Covid when all the news was pretty damned good, they were still saying he was doing a terrible job. Their opinions mean nothing in the world of facts and reason. They couldn't even say he was just OK if he was the best President ever, which he may end up being. Just think for a moment about what success would be so substantial that people like this would say that Trump is a pretty good President. Is there anything even possible that could do that? Nope.

Spiros Pappas said...

Holy cow this Hunter Biden thing is a real problem for me. If he is a pedo, the CIA or FBI has known for years. Hunter was a national security risk and that means Obama and Biden knew. The democrats need to clear the air on this. Was Hunter a real pedo or just a scummy pig screwing around with a 17 or 18 prostitute?

The Godfather said...

Robert Cook: "I'm not voting for either of these truly terrible candidates." Good for you! Tell all your friends and family to do the same. You might start a Movement.

Lurker21 said...


It took me a while to figure out, but she was talking about herself. She was growing up gay in a conservative community and assumed that the opinions of her parents, church, and community were right. Then she entered the gay world and decided that those she grew up with weren't right about things, but she remembers what it was like when she was still back home with her parents.

Also, there's a similarity to what Hillary Clinton said a few years back (based on Hillary's experience with her own mother): there are some women whose husband is always telling them how to think and how to vote and who never object to that and speak their own mind (Hillary's own mother didn't talk back to her husband, but took care to vote Democrat when she got in the voting both).

But really, how representative are these cases of people who vote for Trump and the Republicans? Isn't their something patronizing about the view that one knows the truth oneself and others would recognize it if they weren't "swimming in the soup" of their family's, friends, or acquaintances Trumpism? I'd say that, generally speaking, you don't go wrong if you assume that people know their own interests and their own minds, and that people can disagree with you without being stunted or bigoted or benighted.

mikee said...

Remember when the Tea Party politely petitioned the government for redress, and found none?
Choose the form of your Destructor, assholes.

stevew said...

They spell "Manifest Failures" this way: Mean Tweets.

Mike Petrik said...

If Trump prevails my hunch is that the key votes will come not so much from folks who think he's done a good job with the economy, foreign policy, COVID, or whatever, but from folks who are genuinely afraid of the threat wokeism places on basic freedoms. People do not like being told they must think a certain way or their jobs will be jeopardized or property vandalized, especially people who do not see themselves as bigots or haters in any way.

tim in vermont said...

"The democrats need to clear the air on this.”

Yeah, they’ll get right on that.

Jack Klompus said...

"Me? I'm not voting for either of these truly terrible candidates."

You stick it to the system, Florida Man. What an edgy dissident.

chickelit said...

@Althouse: Why should Biden and Harris remain mostly unchallenged by the professional media? Why should the important task fall to you and your commenters? You are in a precarious position, viz. Google’s whims should Biden win.

Robert Cook said...

"There are no Trump supportERs who think he's doing a bad job. What an idiotIC statement."

Fixed that for you, smart guy.

Actually, a more true correction would be:

Only idiots do not think Trump is doing a bad job.

Bilwick said...

Trump's manifest failure is that he didn't use the Magic Wand that "liberals" and other magical thinkers are convinced presidents can use to make all evils (including the Kung Flu) disappear.

jim said...

Biden will not be torn apart everyday, because he will not spend every day tearing at "the others"

Butkus51 said...

Replace Trump with Biden, and right wing extremists with common liberal. Makes more sense now.

Sam L. said...

"Yes, it will be interesting to see what these people do if Trump is cut off after one term. I'm thinking something like the Tea Party will reconfigure itself, but also that much less polite people — having seen how aggressively Trump was torn apart every day of his entire term — will treat Biden just as harshly." Silly you! We, the people, and the Tea Partiers, do not run the media.

As I keep saying, I don't know if the media is a wholly-owned subsidiary of the Dem Party, or it's the other way round, but it's obvious that they are in cahoots.

Robert Cook said...

"You stick it to the system, Florida Man. What an edgy dissident."

Not at all, Nowhere Man. It's not edgy at all, but the only rational choice.

chickelit said...

jim said...Biden will not be torn apart everyday, because he will not spend every day tearing at "the others"

Mainstream journalists are looking forward to another 8-year long vacation from searching and reporting the truth. much as they enjoyed during the Obama's two terms. This time around, they're hoping to be able to keep having those paid vacations from the comfort of their homes and couches, courtesy of Covid.

chickelit said...

Bottom line: Journalists did not do their fucking jobs during Obama's terms. They won't again either under Biden and especially under Harris.

RichardJohnson said...

jim
Biden will not be torn apart everyday, because he will not spend every day tearing at "the others"

Biden's track record says otherwise.Biden tells African-American audience GOP ticket would put them "back in chains."

Yes, Biden Called Trump’s Travel Restrictions Xenophobic.
The day after Trump announced the travel restrictions on China, Biden tweeted that “We are in the midst of a crisis with the coronavirus. We need to lead the way with science — not Donald Trump’s record of hysteria, xenophobia, and fear-mongering. He is the worst possible person to lead our country through a global health emergency.”

Trump's attacks are invariably in response to already having been attacked. Democrats may not like Trump attacking back, but I and many other Trump voters like his attacking back, in contrast to previous Republican Presidents and Presidential candidates who did not attack back. "ChimpyBushMcHitler" ring a bell? Bush, McCain and Romney didn't fight back. Trump does. Democrats may not like Trump's fighting back, but many Republicans do.

Speaking of "tearing at 'the others,' " recall Hillary's condemning the "deplorables," which IIRC by her estimation constituted half of Trump voters.

Kirk Parker said...

DEEBEE,

Trump's "antics" are a very large part of why he is succeeding. Yes, they are over-the-top bombast*, but hearing of them should have sent a thrill through you in the same manner as Natan Sharansky reported of the Soviet dissidents upon hearing of Reagan's deplorable Evil Empire speech: "WE AREN'T FORGOTTEN!"

----------------
* Though as Richard Johnson points out immediately above, almost all of Trump's feistiest material is a response, not an initiation of an attack.