September 28, 2020

Why didn't Joe Biden work on changing the tax laws in all those decades in Congress? He's responsible for the system that Trump, as a private citizen, was forced to operate within.


ADDED: It's unAmerican to use the phrase "get away with" to refer to following the law. It's like accusing me of speeding when I'm going 75 in a 75 mph zone. I'm not "getting away with" it. I'm going the speed limit! Change the speed limit if that's the wrong top speed. Crimes are the things that have been defined as crimes. It's particularly irksome for a legislator to talk like that — shifting the blame for the legislature's own failures.

AND: Trump's tweeted response to the tax revelations:
The Fake News Media, just like Election time 2016, is bringing up my Taxes & all sorts of other nonsense with illegally obtained information & only bad intent. I paid many millions of dollars in taxes but was entitled, like everyone else, to depreciation & tax credits..... Also, if you look at the extraordinary assets owned by me, which the Fake News hasn’t, I am extremely under leveraged — I have very little debt compared to the value of assets. Much of this information is already on file, but I have long said that I may release... Financial Statements, from the time I announced I was going to run for President, showing all properties, assets and debts. It is a very IMPRESSIVE Statement, and also shows that I am the only President on record to give up my yearly $400,000 plus Presidential Salary!

140 comments:

rhhardin said...

You skipped the part where you explain what's wrong with the current system.

Mattman26 said...

Sounds like Spartacus thinks we need to tax people on their losses. Seems kind of cruel.

Mark said...

Is Trump arguing the tax system is problematic, or just Republicans who are concern trolling?

Ann, playing naive is not a look you can pull off.

Readering said...

Wow, doubling down on how Trump's taxes are Biden's fault!

Lucid-Ideas said...

Someone should look into Booker's taxes.

Left Bank of the Charles said...

Is Joe Biden responsible? To make that claim stick, please compute Trump’s tax liability based on the tax laws Biden voted for as opposed to those he voted against. Also, please compute the taxes Trump would have paid if he hadn’t cheated on his taxes.

Michael K said...

Was Cory Booker adopted? He has two very bright parents.

Lucid-Ideas said...

Also...

I WANT ANY PERSON WHO TALKS ABOUT TRUMPS TAXES TO RELEASE THEIR PERSONAL TAXES IMMEDIATELY.

Right fucking now. Immediately.

What? You won't.

Your opinion shall forthwith be placed in the trash and your opinion immediately discarded (as if it wasn't discarded already).

Smegma-hording scumbags.

Lucid-Ideas said...

Joe Biden should release his taxes. Right fucking now.

Chris said...

Bull pucky Booker. You mean to tell me that you Corey Booker have never taken any deductions, and have over paid your taxes all these years on purpose?

Lucid-Ideas said...

Nancy Pelosi should tell the world how she became a multi-millionaire (I mean...we assume she's a millionaire. She couldn't possibly be lying). She should release all her tax returns for the duration of incumbency.

That would be fascinating.

n.n said...

Trump's taxes reflect the variability over years and decades in a dynamic world, and the legal but deplorable recording and reporting of financial statistics and tangible assets. Meanwhile, the end of Obama's wars, confronting terrorism directed from Iran, and peace in the Middle East, while leftists burn, loot, and murder, and Democrats go along to, ostensibly, get along.

OldManRick said...

Yeh, let’s destroy a tax system that encourages investment by reducing risks so we can get one guy we don’t like. Democrats know how to ruin economies.

Mike Sylwester said...

According to the US Constitution's penumbra and emanations, all US citizens have a Constitutional right to privacy.

Doesn't that mean that Donald Trump has a Constitutional right to privacy in relation to his income taxes?

Lucid-Ideas said...

Release Hillary and Bill's taxes.

Lucid-Ideas said...

Btw, it's quite obvious that it's legal to just go out and get this information and publish it.

O'Keefe...you listening?

Narr said...

Hey, Joe's been an innocent bidenstander in the swamp for nearly fifty years.

Narr
Cut the man some slack!

Drago said...

Not to worry Althouse.

Very soon we will have an article from the far left and marxist policy supporting Fake Conservative website The Bulwark explaining "The Conservative Case For Why Obeying All Tax Laws Is Sufficient Grounds For Impeachment".

Should be a real humdinger...

Achilles said...

Everyone in Washington DC must get the Manafort treatment.

Trump is incredible. Nobody has had their past more scrutinized in the history of the world and come up so clean.

It is time to do the same for every single person in Washington DC including Mattis and McRaven all those Generals, all the senators, obvious criminals like Hillary Clinton and Ilhan Omar, rapists like Bill Clinton.

If the justice system ignores all of this obvious criminality then the most obvious outcome is vigilantism.

You get what you ask for.

Todd said...

So, Cory Booker (@CoryBooker US Senate candidate, NJ) is POWERLESS to enact any change until Biden gets elected POTUS! Booker and Biden have zero power and ability to enact any change, today. Interesting...

Readering said...

The reason he "gets away with this" is that the IRS is underfunded. I read today that Trump bought undeveloped land in NYS for about $2M with the intent of building a golf club. Couldn't, so donated it for a useless (and unused) park, and claimed $100M deduction. The story is not so much the tax laws on allowable deductions, but the failure of the IRS to challenge the qualification and valuation. The story of Trump taxes that comes out over the next weeks is going to be about Trump's conduct more than the tax laws that he worked off of.

Craig said...

In the near future, U.S. citizens will not be able to "get away with" being Republican.

Geoff Matthews said...

How much did Trump's property pay in property taxes? And did he write these off of his taxes?

Stephen St. Onge said...

        Biden and Booker and all the rest of Uniparty Congresscritters REFUSED to change the tax laws because they are 'legal graft.'

        If I lived in his state, I'd ask Booker to pledge that he WILL get the laws changed by the time he's up for reelection, and if he doesn't, he'll retire from politics.  And if he violates that pledge, he wants the voters to throw him out of office.  We know he wouldn't do it, but watching him come up with reasons why he wouldn't do it would be damned amusing.

BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

I find it really creepy that his taxes were leaked. Who has access? Isn't this illegal?

Also- what part of the picture is withheld to create the narrative?

Elliott A said...

If Biden comments about this, Trump should bring up: 1. Biden's woeful history of not donating to charity and 2. Did Hunter pay taxes on the 3.5 million he got from a Russian

boatbuilder said...

Hey Cory--How about we change the legal system so that news organizations and their government leakers are properly charged and prosecuted when they break the privacy and tax laws that are actually on the books?

Marshall Rose said...

But, first!

We must get rid of that evil SALT deduction cap!

Mike of Snoqualmie said...

You do that, Spartacus.

BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

The left will create the crime after the fact.

Freder Frederson said...

You seem to be assuming that all the things Trump did to lower his tax liability were legal. Paying your daughter to consult for herself doesn't seem to pass the smell test at all.

Mikey NTH said...

The subject is not important, only the outrage, and it is outrageous that this Bad Orange Man has been so outrageously Orange while being a Bad Man and not cooperating! Operating with in the confines of the law? What could be more outrageous than that!

Bay Area Guy said...

Where's all the Putin payments all these years that Russian Hoaxters were telling us about?

Sebastian said...

"It's unAmerican to use the phrase "get away with" to refer to following the law"

Considering that it's prog gospel that anyone who's rich gets away with it, it means that their position is "unAmerican."

Lance said...

We still don't know what Trump paid in taxes. We only have what the NYT says he paid. The same NYT that said Trump was colluding with Putin and Russia, and has never apologized for that slander.

Achilles said...

First, we must vote this man out of office.

Then, we must change a tax system so deeply flawed that he could get away with all of this.



By saying this Corey Booker is showing he believes that people who vote for democrats are just really fucking stupid people.

And he is right.

Larry J said...

Back in the late 1960s, there was outrage when people learned that a small number of millionaires paid no federal income tax because they took advantage of legal tax deductions. The bastards, they followed the law as written! The outrage led to the Alternative Minimum Tax (AMT), which we were told would only apply to "the rich". Of course, being morons, Congress didn't index the AMT to inflation, so by the late 1990s, millions of people (especially those in high tax states) became part of "the rich" and had to pay the AMT. There was historical precedent - he federal income tax itself was sold to the public in 1913 as being a "tax on the rich". Remember how that worked out for everyone? The moral to the story, whenever some Democrat calls for increased taxes on "the rich" (without ever defining that term), watch your wallet. Before long, those taxes are going to apply to you, too.

Big Mike said...

ADDED: It's unAmerican to use the phrase "get away with" to refer to following the law. ... Crimes are the things that have been defined as crimes. It's particularly irksome for a legislator to talk like that — shifting the blame for the legislature's own failures.

Good for you, Althouse, and further proof that you don’t need a three-digit IQ to be a Democrat senator. I don’t care quite so much for your example, though. I’d prefer an example where the law was drafted so that only the “right” people are supposed to take advantage of it, not people that the legislators disdain. But I can’t think of a good example off the top of my head.

Big Mike said...

I can’t help but think of Pat Leahy excoriating Tim Cook for not repatriating billions of dollars earned overseas, when the plain fiduciary duty of any CEO was to spend the money where it was earned instead of subjecting it to exorbitant tax rates by bringing the money back inside the US.

C R Krieger said...

I wonder how many jobs were created, jobs where the worker paid local, state or federal taxes, by this non-taxpaying person?

For me that is a far more important criteria than how much tax he paid. Lift up everyone.

Regards -- Cliff

Leland said...

It appears Trump paid his taxes on April 15th, like everyone else, but also filed an extension. Later, when the extension was due; he paid either nothing more or had a margin of error of about $750 short. The NYT is trying to smear the President by focusing on what the President paid at the extension, but that's not when taxes were due.

Gospace said...

Just in time- a story about business audits.
https://daughnworks247.wordpress.com/2020/08/11/the-presidents-tax-return-and-467-of-italian-bolillos-2/

The tax thing isn't going to change the minds of anyone. I've said before- and you've said just about the same thing now- Skirting the law means you followed the law.

minnesota farm guy said...

Trump's comment is correct. Tax returns do not show assets. It would be interesting to compare, say, Bloomberg's returns to Trump's. Higher number on the asset side, but I have no idea how he receives income. I suspect Bloomberg takes advantage of every deduction available also. Why not?

Static Ping said...

At the moment, I have an 80% inclination that the leak was from Trump himself. If so, I have a suspicion that the reason is he is going to slam Biden over the head with this information during the debate.

Static Ping said...

It's also nice to see that Booker is actually interested in the tax code. I mean it took Trump to actually get him to care, but given it is is part of his job it is nice to see him show interest. Look upon the Spartacus and break the shackles of your deductions!

steve uhr said...

Why are we assuming that he followed the law? Maybe he did ... maybe not

roesch/voltaire said...

Sorry but ducking out on paying taxes is not like going over the speed limit by a few miles and objecting to the ticket. But I suppose taking questionable auctions like $70,000 for treating fake hair, is a bit like offering a bribe to the officer.

Ajnal said...

Trump doesn't follow the law...

Why is Ivanka paid as a consultant for a company she already works at? Because then Trump thinks he can claim a deduction for her consultant salary.

This is illegal and part of the reason he is under audit by the IRS.

Leland said...

The whole NYT piece is just to give Biden a line for the debates "The NYT says Trump didn't pay his taxes." This is the same M.O. from Russia Collusion, where the FBI would tell FISA "The WaPo even wrote an article on this subject that corroborates are source" without noting the WaPo sources was a leak from the FBI, who was primarily relying on a drunk guy in a UK pub.

Bill Peschel said...

FWIW, the Ace of Spades blog is quoting the Times' own reporting that shows Trump paid $1 million in 2016 and $4.2 million in 2017. So which Times are we supposed to believe?

(Note, whatever you think of Ace, he's quoting the Times.)

Plus, the Times was given access to, in their own words, "thousands of individual and business tax returns for 2000 through 2017."

Thousands of private citizens.

Also, Ace quotes someone, who claims to have a graduate law degree in taxation and was tax counsel to the world's large bank (he IDs himself as James G. Rickards), and says tax losses are normal in real estate because expenses are reported immediately, but gains are deferred until you sell the building. Millions in losses in real estate is normal, therefore.

Mary Beth said...

He told us in 2016 that he doesn't pay taxes. No one is surprised and no one cares. There are some people who are adamant about telling me that I should care...but I'm not even convinced that they really care, except to score political points.

gerry said...

Someone tell Corry that very, very many of his rich friends on Wall Street love those same write-offs, and that if such things did not exist, the nation would not have the
massive wealth it has. I'd comment more about Booker's ignorance, but it's not really a surprise. He's a Democrat, which means he eats, drinks, and lives on envy and resentment.

Birkel said...

We should get Jill Biden to commit to giving up the $400000 salary if her husband's corpse is drug across the finish line.

richlb said...

Althouse nails it. You can't pillory the man for following the letter of the law.

n.n said...

if you look at the extraordinary assets owned by me, which the Fake News hasn’t, I am extremely under leveraged — I have very little debt compared to the value of assets.

Yes, leverage is the key to wealth not backed by tangible assets. The "wealthiest" corporations are leveraged a dozen, hundred times over their tangible (e.g. assets, income) value.

Trump's wealth is in tangible assets. Alphabet/Google's wealth is in intellectual property. Amazon's wealth is in services. Trump's wealth varies with global productivity. Alphabet/Google's wealth varies with trust and implicit consent. Amazon's wealth varies with performance and arbitrage (more so past than present). Our tax laws encourage development, productivity, and risk from the entrepreneur to the home owner.

gilbar said...

You can't even go there!
After jo Biden, you can't even use the Word corruption

OldManRick said...

Leave to the democrats to want to stifle investment and make investors risk adverse by modifying the tax laws to get at one man they hate.

Apparently a fundamental understanding of how economies work is not only not a requirement to become a senator but an actual determent to obtaining the job. You can't bloviate as well on something you understand.

Drago said...

r/v: "Sorry but ducking out on paying taxes is not like going over the speed limit by a few miles and objecting to the ticket"

r/v continues to surge ahead of readering in the Most Inga-ist Poster At Althouse competition.

readering better get back in the playbook and think of something before r/v buries him/her/xer!

Drago said...

Readering: "The reason he "gets away with this" is that the IRS is underfunded. I read today that Trump bought undeveloped land in NYS for about $2M with the intent of building a golf club. Couldn't, so donated it for a useless (and unused) park, and claimed $100M deduction. The story is not so much the tax laws on allowable deductions, but the failure of the IRS to challenge the qualification and valuation."

Shorter: Trump continues to "get away with" obeying all tax laws and being a savvy real estate speculator.

This angers Noted Historian and Military Strategist (and Recently Designated Tax Law Expert) readering.

This angers him/her/xer very much indeed.

Drago said...

Readering: "The reason he "gets away with this" is that the IRS is underfunded. I read today that Trump bought undeveloped land in NYS for about $2M with the intent of building a golf club. Couldn't, so donated it for a useless (and unused) park, and claimed $100M deduction. The story is not so much the tax laws on allowable deductions, but the failure of the IRS to challenge the qualification and valuation."

Shorter: Trump continues to "get away with" obeying all tax laws and being a savvy real estate speculator.

This angers Noted Historian and Military Strategist (and Recently Designated Tax Law Expert) readering.

This angers him/her/xer very much indeed.

Mikey NTH said...

steve uhr said...

Why are we assuming that he followed the law? Maybe he did ... maybe not


Presumption of innocence - or does that only apply to people you like?

Drago said...

readering: "The story of Trump taxes that comes out over the next weeks is going to be about Trump's conduct more than the tax laws that he worked off of."

LOL

Realizing what an idiot he/she/xe has been on this easily debunked issue, readering devolves into "fake but accurate" mode whereby Trump's entirely legal and entirely common activities are still somehow culpable because OrangeManBad.

Yep, the Walls Are Certainly Closing In.......Again!!

Jim at said...

I must say I'm impressed with the leftists on this board who are gladly paying more taxes than required.

Attaboys all around.

Jim at said...

You seem to be assuming that all the things Trump did to lower his tax liability were legal. - Freder

And you seem to be assuming all the things he did weren't.

Gee. If we only had some sort of federal agency to look into these things and make some sort of determination.

BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

So. I finally read the NYT Trump tax story because I wanted to see what line was being reported for taxes owed and I came across this about the $750 in 2016 and 2017. Per the NYT own story, Trump actually paid to the US Treasury $1 million in 2016 and $4.2 million in 2017.


Joe Smith said...

"It's particularly irksome for a legislator to talk like that..."

Despite a Stanford education, the fiercely heterosexual Corey Booker isn't very bright...he's what's known as a diversity pick...

Joe Smith said...

As a gentle reminder, Donald Trump is the most vetted person in human history.

He's either clean or the smartest man in the world.

You pick.

Michael K said...

Trump is incredible. Nobody has had their past more scrutinized in the history of the world and come up so clean.

You know, it really is amazing. It would be fun if someone leaked Biden and Pelosi and DiFi's financial data. You would have to get the women's husbands as they are the bag men, like Hunter and Hillary.

Bilwick said...

To be angry at Trump over this is like some shtetl-dwelling Russian peasants, after the Cossacks raided the village, raped all the women, killed all the men, and stole whatever wealth they could find, blaming Yankel, who was able to hide himself, his family and his sack of gold, because he and his family escaped relatively unscathed.

And yes, I'm comparing the IRS thugs and goons to Cossacks.

Friedrich Engels' Barber said...

I'm far more disgusted with the New York Times thinking they need to influence the election by dropping their little treasures 2 days before a debate than anything they could ever print. Of course, I don't believe a word they print anyway, and it saddens me to see my would-be sophisticate, but in fact gullible friends conned.

Michael K said...

It is mildly amusing to see the noted leftist tax lawyers opining so brilliantly. I'm sure you could up your annual income substantially if the Trump Organization would put you in charge of the tax filing, but then you would have to know something.

bagoh20 said...

Rendering and others actually believe Trump sits down and does his own taxes. I doubt he even looks at them before signing. Some of us pay professionals to handle such things. They may ask you if you want to be aggressive or conservative in approach, but that's about it. A few 50/50 decisions get brought up, but most stuff is done the standard way. Trump and everybody doing his taxes fully expects the IRS to scrutinize his return way beyond most others. They know everything they do will be seen, and judged, and by people who probably don't like Trump. Nobody is going to try and cheat under those conditions.

Michael K said...

Blogger Freder Frederson said...
You seem to be assuming that all the things Trump did to lower his tax liability were legal. Paying your daughter to consult for herself doesn't seem to pass the smell test at all.


Memo to noted tax expert, Freder. It seemed to work out OK for Bernie when he hired his wife and daughter.

Gk1 said...

This was the liberals "big get" after years about whining about Donald's taxes? Trump used his army of tax attorneys to pay little to no taxes? That's it? Did anyone expect a different outcome? Duh.

I always suspected trump would hold back on divulging his tax returns because he knew they would get distorted just like this.

This isn't exactly GW Bush's DUI arrest being spilled at the last minute so I can only presume the democrats have shot their wad the day before the make it or break it Biden-Trump debate.

Gahrie said...

Sorry but ducking out on paying taxes is not like going over the speed limit by a few miles and objecting to the ticket.

Oh come on!

Who the fuck doesn't try to avoid paying taxes? Anyone?

Does anybody know anybody who doesn't try to avoid paying taxes?

Bill Clinton claimed a deduction for underwear he donated to charity for Christ's sake!

Gahrie said...

You seem to be assuming that all the things Trump did to lower his tax liability were legal. Paying your daughter to consult for herself doesn't seem to pass the smell test at all.

I guarantee you there are three very good lawyers who are willing to argue in court exactly why there is nothin wrong with it, and it is perfectly legal. There is no way the company lawyers or accountants would OK it otherwise.

Rusty said...

Readering said...
"The reason he "gets away with this" is that the IRS is underfunded."
Let me explain something to you. This is not over a 1040EZ like you file every year. This is about a complicated series of returns that the IRS is happy to devote time and personnel examining. When you don't know shit try not to comment. It annoys the adults.
Freder Frederson said...
"You seem to be assuming that all the things Trump did to lower his tax liability were legal. Paying your daughter to consult for herself doesn't seem to pass the smell test at all."
I paid both my daughters to work for me. Perfectly legal.

Howard said...

Are we still at the last straw?

Gregory said...

Ajnal said...

"Trump doesn't follow the law. Why is Ivanka paid as a consultant for a company she already works at? Because then Trump thinks he can claim a deduction for her consultant salary. This is illegal and part of the reason he is under audit by the IRS."

I'm a CPA. Please cite the IRC code section you think this violates. Please also name the IRS auditor who disclosed to you that this is why he is under audit (he can expect to be prosecuted).

When businesses are incorporated, then the wages paid to the consultants become a deductible cost to the corporation...because corporations themselves are taxpayers. The corporation issues a taxable wage statement (1099 or w-2, depending), which Ivanka then uses to pay personal income taxes for the salary paid. The owners of the consultancy are then also taxed on the net income of the business, after the salaries are deducted.

There is nothing remotely wrong or illegal about a business (incorporated or otherwise) paying children of the owner, taking a deduction for the wages paid, reporting that income as required, thus resulting in the children paying income tax for the income they received. Most businesses in America are family-owned, and this is how they are supposed to operate.

Drago said...

Field Marshall Freder: "You seem to be assuming that all the things Trump did to lower his tax liability were legal. Paying your daughter to consult for herself doesn't seem to pass the smell test at all."

Keep hope alive amigo.

Keep hope alive.

Meanwhile, I think I'll disregard your hilariously moronic opinions and go with the professional opinion of the army of Mazar's USA accountants who prepare Trump's taxes as to what is legal and what is not legal.

Good luck with your next hoax!

Michael K said...

steve uhr said...

Why are we assuming that he followed the law? Maybe he did ... maybe not


Lois Lerner is still not available.

anti-de Sitter space said...

“Wow, doubling down on....”

In this thread she deleted my one sentence comment that stated my opinion re gaslighting is boring.

Now she can double down. Double delete.

This is the stuff that makes me love this blog. Althouse is hilarious.

IMHO.

Tom said...

My grandmother always said that it’s not only my right, but my duty as an American to pay as little taxes as legally possible.

anti-de Sitter space said...

Comment moderation is the best thing that has ever happened on this blog.

It’s so funny.

JAORE said...

"Crimes are the things that have been defined as crimes."

Agreed, yet Pelosi and Warren refer to the deaths of certain AAs as "murder" both before trial and after aquittal.

But that danged Trump is divisive.

hstad said...

As a former Banker who's looked at 1,000s of wealthy individuals tax returns this article is so simple to dispute even if you don't understand the complicated way we tax people. Hell, in fact Ann Althouse will know this since now she's self-employed and has to pay estimated taxes the day she files or asks for an tax extension to file. But, all of these 'tax Einstein's' will be coming out of the woodwork to regal us with their expetise. Unless, you're either a tax accountant or tax lawyer nobody should do anyone's complicated taxes like President Trump's. Funny thing about the NY Times article it got it wrong - President Trump paid only (two years - each) $750 in taxes - that's in addition to the $1 million in 2016 and $4.2 million in 2017 ( in taxes) that he wrote a check for for the right to extend his taxes. If you're self employed (like me) you must estimate your next year's income and pay the taxes on those estimated taxes every quarter [BTW - shown on Trump's 1040 return] - beginning with the tax extension (on your tax return) filing. Wonder why the NY Times got that one wrong. LOL - just another hit piece trying to go after Mr. Trump and gin up its circulation because they are a discredited paper.

hstad said...

0, 2:20 PM
Blogger BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

Sorry, I should've saved myself some time (cause I hate reading the NY Times) and waited for "BleachBit's.... connection to Alexandria's more in depth review of the NY Times "fake news" article. Nevertheless, she validates my simple claims of "estimated taxes" for self-employed people.

Achilles said...

roesch/voltaire said...

Sorry but ducking out on paying taxes is not like going over the speed limit by a few miles and objecting to the ticket. But I suppose taking questionable auctions like $70,000 for treating fake hair, is a bit like offering a bribe to the officer.


Democrats are just stupid people.

Achilles said...

Readering said...

The reason he "gets away with this" is that the IRS is underfunded. I read today that Trump bought undeveloped land in NYS for about $2M with the intent of building a golf club. Couldn't, so donated it for a useless (and unused) park, and claimed $100M deduction. The story is not so much the tax laws on allowable deductions, but the failure of the IRS to challenge the qualification and valuation. The story of Trump taxes that comes out over the next weeks is going to be about Trump's conduct more than the tax laws that he worked off of.

Democrats are just stupid people.

Achilles said...

Freder Frederson said...

You seem to be assuming that all the things Trump did to lower his tax liability were legal. Paying your daughter to consult for herself doesn't seem to pass the smell test at all.

Democrats are just stupid people.

Achilles said...

steve uhr said...

Why are we assuming that he followed the law? Maybe he did ... maybe not

Democrats are just stupid people.

Achilles said...

Ajnal said...

Trump doesn't follow the law...

Why is Ivanka paid as a consultant for a company she already works at? Because then Trump thinks he can claim a deduction for her consultant salary.

This is illegal and part of the reason he is under audit by the IRS.


Democrats are just stupid people.

n.n said...

You seem to be assuming that all the things Trump did to lower his tax liability were legal. - Freder

And you seem to be assuming all the things he did weren't.

Gee. If we only had some sort of federal agency to look into these things and make some sort of determination.


Let's call the agency "Internal Revenue Service (IRS)". On the other point, let's cancel the Bill of Rights, and on a forward, retrospective, and present basis assume people... persons are guilty until proven innocent. Let's call the new quasi-religion ("ethics") "Pro-Choice" and established it under a Progressive (i.e. unqualified monotonic change) Church... life deemed unworthy of life... a leftist Utopia.

Gospace said...

Bought land for $2 million and claimed $100 million value donating it? Not all that uncommon, except for the high numbers both for buying and selling. Land and house values are enormously subjective and subject to change.

It’s not all that uncommon for someone to buy a lot cheap from an owner who wants to unload it, and then discover even though it’s zoned for “X” use the local government won’t give a building permit. So the land is then donated to a non-profit and valued at the maximum per sq ft any similar property has sold for. Perfectly legal.

I live in a 3000 sq ft home on 8.5 acres, tax value $100k. I paid $90k for it 20 years ago. I have it insured for replacement cost- currently $370k according to my insurance company. A friend in the next town has a 5000 sq ft home on a city sized corner lot. Owner had died and kids put it on the market for $80k. A year later he told his wife “Let’s offer $35k for it. The worst they can do is say no.” They said yes. The tax assessor had a fit when he went in to have the taxable value more than halved, and said no. The appeal process was simple and the property was reassessed for it’s selling price.

Both of us have acquaintances with smaller properties and homes that are upset our taxable values are so low, but they represent the last sale.

I was looking online the other day at lots in Berkeley Springs WV. The asking price history is listed. Six months ago lots people/companies were selling were listed for $6900 now $15000 and up. Why the jump? City dwellers looking for a country escape, aka the covidiocy panic.

hstad said...

"Achilles" what only 5 parrots on AA's site - very good?

But, it's still light out, so more "TDS" infected opinions will come out of the woodwork like termites.

stevew said...

A small example:

I worked for a small firm that provided architectural, engineering, and construction services for commercial real estate development. We were a small firm; about 25 ftes. The owner set up the company as an LLC. He also had his wife set up her own company. She owned the office building and underlying real estate that we occupied. Our owner paid a monthly lease, and covered a number of property expenses on a triple net basis. The wife collected the rent, paid to keep the building in good condition, paid the property tax, and, of course, took all that as legitimate expenses against the rental income. The business owner deducted all the facility expenses he paid his wife against his business revenue. All perfectly legal and, dare I say, quite common.

As Achilles might say: Democrats are just stupid people. Though I prefer ignorant and inexperienced.

Unknown said...

Dems are losing "the working man"

narrative engineers are coordinating with Dems

To drive a wedge between billionaire

and his base

Worked with Romney, but Trump ain't Romney

readering said...

How did it come to pass that, even when Trump does really sketchy stuff, like lie about his businesses, and misuse the tax laws and the office of the presidency office, to keep himself afloat, the overwhelming reaction among commenters on the AA blog is to rush to his defense--and personally insult the very few commenters who don't? Those very few have demonstrated over time mostly that they don't care about the insults. (Others who cared more stopped posting.) I sure don't (dogs on the internet and all that; thanks for reading), but I do find it unfortunate that a wide-ranging, idiosyncratic blog over the years has devolved into a convenient alt-right notice board. (In part because of the disproportionate number of posts on racial issues.) As someone noted elsewhere, if the folks who peeled off of Romney in 2011 don't care about these financial revelations, what is really going on? What's going on seems more and more to be about Trump's militant, self-declared defense of white people. Yikes, says this easily sun-burned white person.

Dagwood said...

BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

So. I finally read the NYT Trump tax story because I wanted to see what line was being reported for taxes owed and I came across this about the $750 in 2016 and 2017. Per the NYT own story, Trump actually paid to the US Treasury $1 million in 2016 and $4.2 million in 2017.


---------------------------------

So then Trump paid almost as much in taxes as WalJoe strong-armed from Ukraine and Russia for his crackhead kid?

Gospace said...

Something else about land and taxation. There are a handful of communities in the USA that taxes all residential land, period, all of it, at $X dollars per acre. Doesn’t matter if you put up a shed or a mansion, you’re only taxed on acreage owned. Seems to me that encourages efficient land use. Mentioned that to some coworkers at another place I worked and was told that was completely unfair. They couldn’t explain why, but it was completely unfair. The why was simple though they’d never admit it- jealousy. They want people who own more than they do to pay for the privilege.

Same way they thought the way VFDs were financed in SC should be outlawed. In NY VFDs are taxing districts. If I don’t pay my taxes I lose my house. In SC the VFD came around and asked for a donation and I wrote out the check for the requested amount. If I didn’t and my house caught fire, they would rescue people inside, then watch the structure burn down. And your fire insurance was null and void. I was allowed to take the risk of losing my house to fire. Sort of like carrying just liability insurance on your car. In NG I’m not allowed to take that risk. And I’m guaranteed to lose my house if I try....

Of course if my house does catch fire by the time the VFD gets here, with a full pumper, the fire will be out of control and if everyone is out they’re going to watch it burn down anyway. Makes the subsequent cleanup easier.

Joe Smith said...

@readering

Unless you are a highly-experienced tax lawyer or CPA (preferably both), you have no idea of the issues involved with his taxes. I'm guessing there are ten or more people looking at it on his behalf.

Trump is not a tax lawyer and relies on the advice of people that he pays to give him proper legal advice.

If you find something illegal then it's points for the never Trump side.

But until then, it's just stuff that 99.99999 percent of the population can't even begin to understand.

And nobody, even a liberal, should pay more than they legally owe.

There's a name for people who willingly over-pay the IRS...morons.

Joe Smith said...

"What's going on seems more and more to be about Trump's militant, self-declared defense of white people."

Examples? And don't give us the 'very fine people' hoax. Only knuckle-dragging lefties believe that one.

bagoh20 said...

Readering,

Just because you feel that Trump did something worth rejecting him, does not mean people who are pleased about the job he's doing should feel the same. You have believed he should be rejected over every one of the dozens of disproved charges over the last 4 years. You were wrong those times, and that should make you more careful. We are arguing the law, logic, and economics, not feelings.

We do not have reliable information yet about his taxes. We have stories by the same sources that have lied to us repeatedly. It's not reasonable to just accept their version. He might not have broken any tax laws, and if he did, we argue that is pretty normal, and virtually unavoidable for a complex tax situation like his. Nobody in DC, including Biden would come out squeaky clean from a thorough examination of their taxes. Biden can put up his and we can see how they stack up.

To take the word of the NYT on anything Trump related is simply not intelligent. If Trump knowingly violated the law in some serious way we can use that in our decision, but you simply do not know that yet. If Biden has done something illegal, then we should know that too. I expect both men have less than perfect tax returns. Argue the facts. Don't expect us to just FEEL like you do.

wholelottasplainin' said...

Do not feed the readering troll.

Drago said...

readering: "How did it come to pass that, even when Trump does really sketchy stuff, like lie about his businesses, and misuse the tax laws and the office of the presidency office,...."

LOL

Let's just stop you right there tiger.

Maybe you should just revert to your hoax collusion, hoax dossier, hoax ukraine scandal, hoax Trump feeds goldfish incorrectly, hoax (insert one of the hundreds of other hoaxes here), etc.

You might have better luck.

So lets put the Inga test to readering:

Carter Page, russian spy or no?

This should be fun....

Drago said...

readering: "...the overwhelming reaction among commenters on the AA blog is to rush to his defense--and personally insult the very few commenters who don't? "

Because you are all lying lefty hacks.

Period.

End of discussion.

You are liars.

Complete and utter liars.

But only completely.

And only utterly.

Other than that, you guys are peachy.

Drago said...

readering: "...but I do find it unfortunate that a wide-ranging, idiosyncratic blog over the years has devolved into a convenient alt-right notice board."

LOL

"alt-right" = doesn't automatically believe the next in a long series of lefty hoaxes and lies.

Drago said...

readering: "What's going on seems more and more to be about Trump's militant, self-declared defense of white people."

LOL

And there it is.

Just as you knew it would be.

How could it be anything else?

And we will soon see that Trump increases his % of votes from the hispanic and black communities, and I would guess the Jewish community as well.

BTW, the horrible white supremacist Trump was just nominated for a 3rd Nobel prize by 4 Australian parliamentarians.....I guess those guys are KKK members too.

Hey, did you hear? Kosovo and Serbia just announced they had come up a with a compromise name for a shared lake that had been at issue for many years......the compromise?

Lake Trump.

And Kosovo is 90% muslim.

readering hardest hit.

But not to worry. By tomorrow morning readering will forget he/she/xe even read that.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/09/25/contested-lake-balkans-renamed-donald-trump/

Cue Sad Trombone for readering.

wholelottasplainin' said...

C R Krieger said...
I wonder how many jobs were created, jobs where the worker paid local, state or federal taxes, by this non-taxpaying person?

For me that is a far more important criteria than how much tax he paid. Lift up everyone.
**************

Cliff, you ignorant booby: you are utterly forgetting the thousands of people Trump employs through his many companies.

Readering said...

All these posts about, here is how the tax laws worked for me or my friend, are missing the point. Which will be developed over the coming weeks. Already analyses are showing that his debts exceed $1B and his real estate assets--offices, hotels, golf courses--barely exceed that. Hence the incentive to scrape together money in all kinds of unsavory ways. Yeah, he gave away his salary (so did JFK), but he has given nothing to his reelection campaign, instead charging millions to host campaign events at his properties, and millions to the government for his own attendance.

anti-de Sitter space said...

“(Others who cared more stopped posting.)”

Don’t forget the commenter(s?) who get a ton of their comments deleted such that those comments are never seen in the threads. That’s another reason for posts/comments not being here.

The absolutely coolest and most amazing thing re these deletions is that Meadehouse derives satisfaction.

They really got the better of dumb-dumb me.

This blog is so perfect nowadays!

Michael K said...

Blogger readering said...
How did it come to pass that, even when Trump does really sketchy stuff, like lie about his businesses, and misuse the tax laws and the office of the presidency office, to keep himself afloat, the overwhelming reaction among commenters on the AA blog is to rush to his defense--and personally insult the very few commenters who don't?


Because you are idiots making idiotic comments about tax law you know nothing about ?

Asking for a friend.

Michael K said...

This is one of the funniest threads I've seen here in a long time.

If you are going to use a tax filer, it's best not to choose a hard lefty.

I spent 50 years in Medical practice doing pretty well and my accountants probably never cost me less that $10,000 a year. A lot of it was monthly and then my personal tax return, which was usually about $4,000. Trump's business is probably 1,000 times the size of my medical practice. I see no one on the left who has any idea of complicated taxes. You have all been on salary, never run a small business.

Achilles said...

readering said...

How did it come to pass that, even when Trump does really sketchy stuff, like lie about his businesses, and misuse the tax laws and the office of the presidency office, to keep himself afloat, the overwhelming reaction among commenters on the AA blog is to rush to his defense--and personally insult the very few commenters who don't? Those very few have demonstrated over time mostly that they don't care about the insults. (Others who cared more stopped posting.) I sure don't (dogs on the internet and all that; thanks for reading), but I do find it unfortunate that a wide-ranging, idiosyncratic blog over the years has devolved into a convenient alt-right notice board. (In part because of the disproportionate number of posts on racial issues.) As someone noted elsewhere, if the folks who peeled off of Romney in 2011 don't care about these financial revelations, what is really going on? What's going on seems more and more to be about Trump's militant, self-declared defense of white people. Yikes, says this easily sun-burned white person.

There is no point with arguing with a dumb tool like you so all you are getting is mockery. You should just feel really fucking stupid for supporting democrats.

For years bleated about Trump being a Russian Agent/Ukraine Colluder/sketchy tax filer/racist/rapist/literal hitler/authoritarian.

Every single attack you idiots latched on to was complete bullshit. It has taken less and less time for each stupid lie to be completely destroyed.

Read your posts on this thread. Read all of the democrats posts on this thread.

Democrats are just stupid people.

KellyM said...

At one time Elizabeth Warren made a stink about how everyone should pay their fair share. There are two states in the Union which offer the taxpayer the option of paying at a higher tax rate if they so choose. (MA and OK). In MA there are roughly 2.2 million people who pay state income tax. Out of that number roughly 875 individuals ticked the box to pay at the higher rate last year. When asked whether she herself ticked the box on her return, Warren was characteristically evasive.

Cory Booker can go pound sand.

Achilles said...

hstad said...

"Achilles" what only 5 parrots on AA's site - very good?

But, it's still light out, so more "TDS" infected opinions will come out of the woodwork like termites.

It isn't that they are parrots.

It is that they are all just completely ignorant of how taxes are payed, filed, and what "illegal" means.

They all voted for Hillary Clinton who did things that are definitionally illegal.

They are triumphant that nobody is going to jail for framing General Flynn.

They gloat when people who lied and broke laws to spy on political opponents are not charged with their crimes.

Then they are mad that someone who broke no laws is not charged with things they think should be illegal even though they can't actually name any of those things.

And then they are mad that people call them fucking idiots.

iowan2 said...

How did it come to pass that, even when Trump does really sketchy stuff, like lie about his businesses, and misuse the tax laws and the office of the presidency office, to keep himself afloat,

What sketchy stuff. Be specific and show your work.
How did he lie about his business, or more accurately, what leads you to believe he lied?
The New York Times has proven the tax laws were not misused(broken).
The House of Representatives drew up articles of impeachment, nothing about misuse of office.
What leads you to think President Trump is needing any assistance staying "afloat"

This is such a great example of what leftist try to pass off as criticism of President Trump. Wild generalizations lacking any specific to support the smear.

Rusty said...

readering said...
"How did it come to pass that, even when Trump does really sketchy stuff, like lie about his businesses, and misuse the tax laws and the office of the presidency office, to keep himself afloat, the overwhelming reaction among commenters on the AA blog is to rush to his defense--and personally insult the very few commenters who don't?"
Quit trying to convince people that 2+2 =5. Your in over your head on this. Quit trying to prove your ignorance and pay attention to what the adults are saying. You might learn something despite yourself.

wildswan said...

I have a theory that the Dems have stolen the debate questions and are prepping Basement Guy. But this maneuver requires that the news stories in the days before cover the topics of the questions so as to drive the Dem line on different lines of questioning into the TDSer's heads. So, regarding the Dem comments on this tax question, I see that Ivanka's consultancy might come up. I think Biden is prepping to be very indignant if Hunter is brought up. I see that Trump paid millions but the Times story as disseminated to fiscally ignorant people like myself is that he paid $750. Biden will probably be unable to understand that and hint that the rest of us can't either. Finally, Biden is going to call Trump and all his voters white supremacists. I personally know someone who is sure that all the riots this summer were led by white supremacists while BLM was doing peaceful protests. But can Biden do it, even knowing the questions? Remember Hillary being thrown in the van when she passed out at the 911 memorial, only to emerge from Chelsea's place a short while later all well and happy? And there's shots that will enable a person to play football with broken ribs. O brave new world that has such needles as this.

Drago said...

Readering: "All these posts about, here is how the tax laws worked for me or my friend, are missing the point. Which will be developed over the coming weeks. Already analyses are showing that his debts exceed $1B and his real estate assets--offices, hotels, golf courses--barely exceed that."

LOL

What a moron.

Hey r/v, rounding turn number 3, readering is making a strong play to catch up with you in the Most Inga-like Poster competition.

For awhile I thought r/v had completely pulled away but readerings performance on this thread has definitely moved him/her/xer back into the competition!

Well played readering and good luck! Back to you r/v!

DeepRunner said...

Spartacus implored...
"First, we must vote this man out of office. Then, we must change a tax system so deeply flawed that he could get away with all of this."

Lighten up, Francis. How many bedroom communities in JERSEY have folks who take advantage of tax laws? Why do we have tax lawyers?

Cory Booker might wanna get an education. Then a real job.

readering said...

Achilles, thanks for reading!

Qwinn said...

They distracted from Hunter Biden taking even more corrupt Russian and Chinese money than even we conservatives ever suspected... and distracted from the NY Times describing that as "no evidence of wrongdoing".

Those who control and direct tools like readering know that the tax thing is nothing (in fact the NY Times report exonerates Trump from half a dozen lefty conspiracy theories, including Chuck's favorite that Trump was lying when he said he couldn't reveal his taxes because audit). But that's not the point of the tax story. The point is to cover up the results of the investigation of Hunter Biden, Joe's bagman.

Mission accomplished. For now. But I suspect Trump will bring it up tomorrow night.

Michael K said...

Readering is waiting for those walls to close in.

Good luck with Slow Joe tomorrow night.

Drago said...

Who wants to explain to our stupid lefties that Trump's "secret" creditors are listed in full on page 35 of his publicly available OGE form?

Cue another Sad Trombone for readering and r/v and Freder.

We're running out of trombones.....

Drago said...

My God man! We must close the Strategic Sad Trombone Gap immediately!!

CWJ said...

Don't ever expect anything definitive from readering. Citing facts and asking for specifics is a fool's errand. He gets his jollys stirring the pot. That's all. He's having the time of his life tonight.

Readering said...

Since it should be obvious that I treat insults as dogs on the internet, I suppose the regular repeaters are just trying to scare off other would-be nonconformist commenters. Sad.

The Godfather said...

Can we be serious here for a minute? Sure, it's always fun to beat up on "Rollo the Rich Kid", but what are we talking about? Is Trump a Rich Guy who isn't paying his "fair share" of taxes? Or is he a failed businessman who is about to be swamped by debt? He can't be both! Except, I guess, in the New York Times.

I wasn't a tax lawyer, but I did represent real estate developers and investors in transactions and litigation. I learned that the Internal Revenue Code purports to impose high taxes on various kinds of income, but that there are provisions that the savvy investor can use to reduce or eliminate tax liabilty. Those provisions were not enacted by President Trump. They were enacted by Democrat and Republican Congresses and Presidents over (at least) the last four decades. I assume that Trump's advisors took advantage of them. I assume Joe Biden's tax advisors did so, too. Or he should fire them.

Todd said...

Readering said...

Already analyses are showing that his debts exceed $1B and his real estate assets--offices, hotels, golf courses--barely exceed that. Hence the incentive to scrape together money in all kinds of unsavory ways. Yeah, he gave away his salary (so did JFK), but he has given nothing to his reelection campaign, instead charging millions to host campaign events at his properties, and millions to the government for his own attendance.

9/28/20, 6:46 PM


This is being looked into by "top men" AS WE SPEAK! There will be a HUGE breaking story on this "real soon now"!

can't wait...

Nicholas said...

Micheal K, further to your Memo to noted tax expert, Freder, one could add that putting the family on the payroll worked out pretty well for Chelsea Hubbell as well.

Rusty said...

Readering said...
"Since it should be obvious that I treat insults as dogs on the internet, I suppose the regular repeaters are just trying to scare off other would-be nonconformist commenters. Sad."
You will inform us when one shows up, won't you?

Drago said...

Readering: "Since it should be obvious that I treat insults as dogs on the internet, I suppose the regular repeaters are just trying to scare off other would-be nonconformist commenters."

readering is very very upset that Trump pre-paid $1M in taxes in 2016 and $4.2M in taxes in 2017 and then rolled all overpayments forward.

And since this has been pointed out, he/she/xe refuses to acknowledge that and instead, predictably and inevitably complains that others do know about that.

Sorry readering, but many of us can't help but notice things that are true and not things that are magically false for you lefties.

Now tell us more about how Kavanaugh led a wild drunken rape gang which roamed across the Maryland countryside for 2 decades. I miss that one from you guys.

Or, if you prefer, tell us more about Carter Page and Flynn being russian assets.....this would be especially rich coming after this last weeks Special Agent Barnett's testimony being released!

You know, it apparently is beyond the ability of most lefties to integrate the latest developments into their tired and weary hoaxes. That's what makes them terrific lefties!

Michael K said...

I suppose the regular repeaters are just trying to scare off other would-be nonconformist commenters. Sad.

No, just dumb ones. Come on ! You can do better than this. Howard even sounds sensible sometimes.

Pookie Number 2 said...

I suppose the regular repeaters are just trying to scare off other would-be nonconformist commenters.

Goodness, no. Many of us are looking for intelligent arguments from the other side. Instead we get the trained seal act where the NYT and other dishonest partisan media do their best to cast Trump in a negative light, and the credulous leftists - none of whom betray the faintest familiarity with the topic in question - pretend that there’s merit to these accusations.

List the actual laws broken, and some people will listen. Citing the “authority” of the New York Times - which, as a reminder, won a Pulitzer for demonstrably false reporting - just proves that you cannot make a decent argument.

William50 said...

Why didn't we hear these complaints when it was revealed that AOC hasn't paid her taxes either?

Double standard? It seems that Sandy Cortez doesn’t like paying her back taxes.

tim in vermont said...

readering never does rebuttals, he just complains about being criticized. That’s how it’s done in the elite circles he jerks in.

hstad said...

Readering said...

"...Already analyses are showing that his debts exceed $1B and his real estate assets--offices, hotels, golf courses--barely exceed that..."

Is this your opinion, or do you have some documentation not available to the NY Times. Tax returns do not show a 'balance sheet' for individuals.

gadfly said...

Why repeat another Trump lie? Impressive financial can come from a word processor without the benefit of a single strand of reality.

Tax returns, at least, must be sworn to and signed by the preparer and the "taxpayer."

Michael K said...

gadfly is not buying the NY Times story. "Show the tax return," he says.

MadCow got hold of his 1995 tax return from another Biden voter felon and it showed he paid $25 million in taxes. Shortest story in history. Gone the next day.