March 10, 2020

At the Sunrise Café...

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... you can talk about anything you want... even the primaries that happened today, which I thought were too boring to put up a separate post. I mean, Biden won. You knew that would happen.

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163 comments:

MadisonMan said...

Biden won. Meh. More like the Media pushed Grandpa over the finish line. I just don't get his appeal, but I didn't get Hillary's appeal either.

brylun said...

Anyone familiar with the 1956 Isaac Asimov book “The Naked Sun” about a planet where humans live in isolation and shun contact with other humans.

rehajm said...

Hillary now worth twice as much as Bernie. Smell the bern...

rehajm said...

Those cranes sure know how to wreck a golf course. Worse than gophers...

Drago said...

Seen on twitter:

Breaking: Pete Buttigieg has declared victory in the Michigan Democratic Primary.

curt said...

Given the choice between dementia and an ancient Commie, the Dems are choosing dementia, continuing their 3 year streak.

Sebastian said...

Bernie at townhall: "I'm not an expert on the current economy in Sweden."

Don't tell Farmer!

Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...

AMELIA THOMSON-DEVEAUX said ...

It’s very striking how quickly things are starting to wrap up. I think a lot of voters have just been exhausted by this process, and they don’t see the primary as the battle they want to be waging — the real fight for them is against Trump.


Ken B said...

He's toast. Hopefully he will slink off in the shame he has earned.

Nate Silver I mean.

Ken B said...

“ Don't tell Farmer!”

He's still in mourning for Hossein Sheikholeslam.

narciso said...

I remember that one and caves of steel.

narciso said...

The joint list thwarted the will of the people again in israel.

Inga said...

“It’s very striking how quickly things are starting to wrap up. I think a lot of voters have just been exhausted by this process, and they don’t see the primary as the battle they want to be waging — the real fight for them is against Trump.”

Indeed, that’s the bottom line, always has been really.

Bay Area Guy said...

It's good to keep Bernie as far away from the levers of power as possible.

But.

The current Dem swamp is totally corrupt and in dire need of a cleansing. I guess they won't get it.

Mark said...

Just saw an ad for a new season of Fargo.

narciso said...

I robot was the only real attempt at a asimov adaptation, coruscant was an homage to trantor, but still

Ken B said...

Theory:
“It’s very striking how quickly things are starting to wrap up. I think a lot of voters have just been exhausted by this process, and they don’t see the primary as the battle they want to be waging — the real fight for them is against Trump.”

Nothing at all to do with there being only two choices I'm sure.

This is just DNC spin. The DNC decided they had to stop Bernie, and that just declaring him ineligible was too bad a look. So they enforced party discipline. Everyone (but Gabbard) fell in line. Now the idea is to pretend the voters prefer it this way. They don’t, if they did they would have coalesced around Biden spontaneously.

narciso said...

Well nightfall but no one has seem that.

Ken B said...

BAG
Yeah, kudos to the DNC for averting a Bernie candidacy, but their choice is still a dreadful one.

wild chicken said...

Funny how the ancient commies always seem more lucid than the ancient moderates.

Funny-scary that is.

Ken B said...

Tried the new Spenser movie on Netflix. Crap. Stopped it, watched something else.

Inga said...

https://www.businessinsider.com/gaetz-slept-in-walmart-lot-after-potentially-exposing-trump-to-coronavirus-2020-3?op=1

“Rep. Matt Gaetz's whirlwind of a day after he learned he was exposed to the coronavirus ended in a Walmart parking lot, according to the Pensacola News Journal.

The Florida congressman was initially skeptical of the virus — going so far as to wear a gas mask on the House floor — but he was forced to self-quarantine aboard Air Force One after sitting next to President Donald Trump on the ride over.

On the plane, Gaetz learned he had posed for a photo with someone who later tested positive for COVID-19.

To take maximum precautions, Gaetz reportedly slept in a Walmart parking lot "somewhere off [Interstate] 85" on his drive back to Florida from Washington, DC.”

Whoa Karma was fast on that one.

“He also reflected on the gas-mask stunt.

"I wasn't making light of the situation," Gaetz told the Pensacola News Journal. "I only wish I had worn the gas mask at CPAC."”

Cute sense of humor.

mockturtle said...

The most painful part of watching certain college basketball games is listening to Dick Vitale. If I weren't occupied with other things, I could just mute the audio.

Inga said...
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narciso said...

Robert urich was so identified with that role, waldberg hasnt played a boston chatacter in a long while

Inga said...

Turn out was reported to be HUGE tonight, despite all the Covid19 fears.

mockturtle said...

Inga quotes: "I wasn't making light of the situation," Gaetz told the Pensacola News Journal. "I only wish I had worn the gas mask at CPAC."

That's what I was thinking when he had to self-isolate after CPAC: Where was that gas mask when he needed it? ;-)

Mark said...

You have to wonder if any of these people have actually heard anything that Biden has said in the last year or so.

chuck said...

Anyone familiar with the 1956 Isaac Asimov book “The Naked Sun”

Yes, I have the serial version stashed away in boxes with the rest of the Astounding issues from that period.

Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...

Blogger Ken B said...
if they did they would have coalesced around Biden spontaneously


They voted under threat of execution? This is exactly what happened, the voters coalesced around Biden spontaneously. They got sick of all the internecine fighting and picked a champion, a very flawed champion, not a champion I would have picked, but they 'coalesced' all by themselves.

I am sure the party would have preferred Klobuchar, or Warren or Harris, someone younger and preferably female.

rehajm said...

He's awesome! The diaper dandy! The TP pee-er baaay-beee!

narciso said...

The paris treaty with deng zhao ping.

Mark said...

Turn out was reported to be HUGE tonight, despite all the Covid19 fears.

I guess all that talk about the need for early voting, then, was complete BS.

J. Farmer said...

@Sebastian:

Bernie at townhall: "I'm not an expert on the current economy in Sweden."

Don't tell Farmer!


Luckily I have never claimed otherwise. I've only ever argued that a higher marginal tax rate and single-payer healthcare will not turn the country into Venezuela.

@Ken B:

“ Don't tell Farmer!”

He's still in mourning for Hossein Sheikholeslam.


You'd think me being on the right side of most foreign policy decisions for the last 20 years would engender a bit of confidence in my opinions. But then again there's nothing people hate more than hearing the truth. Tell me lies, tell me sweet little lies. But yeah, a middling regional power thousands of miles away from us that has next to no ability to project conventional military force outside its borders. Terrifying! And remember back when people thought taking down Assad would be a blow to Iran and the Shia crescent, and we followed in the footsteps of our "allies" in the region like Turkey, Saudi Arabia, and the UAE in supporting radical Salafi jihadists to wage war against the government. Yeah, that worked out well for us. Goofy John McCain even flew over and posed for a photo op with a jihadist beheader. That sure worked out swimmingly for us. I mean, except for that whole rise of ISIS thing we're still dealing with.



etbass said...

Vitale does have the most unique voice in sports announcing, IMO.

J. Farmer said...

The current primary campaign demonstrates that if the GOP is about 90% owned and operated by the Establishment, the DNC is most certainly 100% owned and operated. The party, the media, and the other candidates all immediately jumped in line to sink Sanders' campaign in favor of a brain dead zombie like Joe Biden. And the reason is very simple. Sanders might actually exercise some Independence of thought and action. Whereas even if Joe Biden dropped dead, they could still prop him on stage, stick a tape recorder behind his head, and hit play. Hell, who would know the difference> So long as the recording don't contain too many coherent sentences.

narciso said...

Isnt islamic state run by those very secular officials of saddams army and security services, the most recent one is a turkmen.

Ignorance is Bliss said...

One week into Multiple Myeloma treatment. Too early to say if it is effective, but I am tolerating the treatments well, with minimal side effects. That is better than a lot of people do.

Start a new job in a new city next month, so will be switching oncologists too.

Life is never dull, unless you are.

Bay Area Guy said...

I hope people don't forget that most Americans get infected with the other Coronaviruses and get infected with the flu virus, get a little sick and get over it. It's not that complicated. Let's not pretend we were born yesterday, without any practical experience.

And, yes, to what Ken B said in every respect.

Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...

Ignorance is Bliss said...
One week into Multiple Myeloma treatment.


Very sorry to hear this.

narciso said...

Prayers for you, iib, ive known two people who had been diagnosed not with that particular form.

mockturtle said...

Ignorance is Bliss: I pray your treatment will be successful! God bless you.

BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

I'd like to learn more about the CPAC person who arrived infected.

J. Farmer said...

@narciso:

Isnt islamic state run by those very secular officials of saddams army and security services, the most recent one is a turkmen.

And yet where was the Islamic state before Saddam's fall or the effort to bring down Assad? Sometimes the devil you know is preferable to the one you don't. Or as Rumsfeld might put it, known knowns are preferable to unknown unknowns.

rcocean said...

It's amazing how the MSM and all the hysterical "We Can't abandon our Kurd Allies!" Congress Critters don't seem to care one fig about what's happening in Syria. Where is Mittens? He was so full of righteous indignation over Trump's "Craven Surrender" and its impact on the Kurds and Syria. Now, he's AWOL.

exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...

I think a lot of voters have just been exhausted by this process, and they don’t see the primary as the battle they want to be waging — the real fight for them is against Trump.


3/10/20, 8:32 PM

And you picked a real heavyweight to go up against Trump.

Joe was exhausted by this process 8 months ago.

rcocean said...

I've come to the conclusion that Senators like Lindsey Graham don't really care about "our noble allies" or "Stopping dictators" its really all about keeping Defense Spending up. And you can't spend $700 Billion/year without some "enemies". If they don't exist, you need to create some.

The same is true of Foreign Aid. Lots of that $$$ ends up being kicked back to the Senators in terms of jobs for their kids, and "donations" to their foundations. Not to mention speeches for $100K a pop, or nice lobbying jobs once they retire.

Milwaukie guy said...

Posted again:

A couple or ten days ago I was posting late on a café about Bill Ayers because I couldn't get through to Powerline. Commenter Tina Trent got in touch with me and we've spoken a few times about Mr. Ayers. The conversation got around to the People's Cube and a poster design project I'm brainstorming to celebrate 90 years of Democrat Party rule in Chicago. She put me in touch with the genius behind People's Cube.

On what other blog does this stuff happen?

Thank you Ann Althouse and Meade for this lovely place. I hope you keep up on the sunrise pictures for an entire year.

rcocean said...

McCain wrote in his autobiography that the most thrilling day as a Senator was when he was in Israel and his bus was surrounded by Israelis who serenaded him and sang songs in his honor. It must be a real high, for these clowns to go overseas and be treated like Royalty.

On our dime.

narciso said...

Right william hale thompson was a republican.

William said...

During the time of Stalin, two Russians were arrested. Their crime: they were plotting to blow up a bridge that had not yet been built. When informed of their crime, the two conspirators fell into a state of despair. What possible defense could they mount for a crime that was impossible to commit......I keep hearing on the news that Dem politicians are criticizing Trump's response to an epidemic that has not yet happened. The time of Stalin is never really past.

rcocean said...

Looking at the results, Bernie is finished. But he's a good loser. Hope he gets a house as consolation prize.

J. Farmer said...

@Bay Area Guy:

I hope people don't forget that most Americans get infected with the other Coronaviruses and get infected with the flu virus, get a little sick and get over it. It's not that complicated. Let's not pretend we were born yesterday, without any practical experience.

I really hate when people keep making the flu comparisons. For one, we have vaccines and antivirals to treat the flu. Second, even relatively conservative estimates suggest that Covid-19 is nearly ten times deadlier than the traditional flu. Third, for those that do develop serious symptoms, the primary treatment modality is putting them on a ventilator while their immune system fights the infection. A mass outbreak could easily put a serious strain on the healthcare system. When was the last time the flu overwhelmed Lombardy's healthcare system? Italy has 3.4 hospital beds per thousand people, and the US has about 2.4. And Italy has a pretty significant north-south divide with the north being much richer and more productive than the south. Lombardy is on the Swiss border and contains the city of Milan. At any given time, about 2/3 of America's 95,000 or so ICU beds are occupied. It wouldn't take that long for health systems to get overwhelmed, particularly on a regional level.

Narr said...

This ChiCom Virus has distracted everyone from the important things. You know, like Putin, and Erdogan, and Assad, or whomever becomes the villain of the week for the Permanent War Party of DC.

Narr
Good luck, IiB.

rcocean said...

If Trump has done what Biden did today, it'd be headline news, with every MSM outlets screaming for Trump to apologize and declaring he was unfit. And you'd have 30 Republican Senators rushing the microphones to condemn him.

But since Biden's a Democrat, its just "ho hum, Joe got in a tiff with a voter"

Mark said...

Michigan young adult vote -- 77 percent to 19 for Bernie.
Michigan group at greatest risk for corona (old folks) -- 73 to 21 for Biden.

Jeff said...

An Italian doctor working at a small hospital in Bergamo wrote a long Facebook post about what's happening there. A local newspaper L'Eco Di Bergamo has
the entire post. Run it thru Google Translate. If it doesn't scare you, you're an idiot.

rcocean said...

You want to make comparisons - compare it to the Ebola flu of 2009. Remember all the panic. Remember all the toilet paper hoarding? Remember Obama being on TV 24/7 reassuring the country.

No you don't because it didn't' happen - despite tens of thousands dying the USA, and hundreds of millions getting infected overseas. The MSM sure knows how to stoke people's fears.

Inga said...

“One week into Multiple Myeloma treatment. Too early to say if it is effective, but I am tolerating the treatments well, with minimal side effects. That is better than a lot of people do.”

Sorry to hear this, it’s never a welcome development, but especially hard so soon after losing your son. My best wishes for a full recovery.

madAsHell said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
FullMoon said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

Farmer - you made valid points, but a nasty new virus is nothing new - other than in the age of Trump where we can turn it into his Katrina by counting the deaths one at a time.
and panic about TP.

"For one, we have vaccines and antivirals to treat the flu.

Flu vaccines do not treat the flu. At best they are calculated scientific guesses as to what strain might hit in any given year. Some years the vaccines are mid-calculated. Flu shots do provide some protection and a flu shot is well worth it, especially if you're elderly or have a compromised immune system. A flu shot will not help you if you already have the flu. You must time a flu shot well in advance of the flu season in your area. Anti-viral meds only work if the timing is right once you GET the flu, and even then it's not 100%.

Mark said...

Reading a bit about the new season of Fargo, apparently one of the characters will be played by Timothy Olyphant.

Mark said...

The thinking out there is that it is NOT the coronavirus that actually kills. Rather, it merely weakens people and when it gets into the lungs, some other underlying infection/condition is what is fatal.

Limited blogger said...

So the dems have their man. Good luck to him.

TRUMP 2020

mockturtle said...

Perhaps the current obsession with COVID-19 is in part a welcome shift from politics.

Nonapod said...

We're about to break 1000 covid-19 confirmed cases in the US. I expect we'll hit 2000 within the next couple of days now that the test kits are being more widely distributed.

Mark said...

The kids have to be wondering what the hell is going on.

After 20 years of being indoctrinated in hard left politics, now their party is crushing their hopes and beliefs, saying that they are too extreme.

BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

If the virus spreads to the point of 'we are out of hospital beds' - we are screwed. Everyone, everywhere.

Imagine if everyone with the flu or a cold were taking up a hospital bed. Now of course the Corona virus is worse, and the virus is attacking the lungs and respiratory systems and those kinds of machines are only at hospitals... so yes - if this virus spreads and we cannot contain it and we run out of hospital beds, bad bad... bad.

The idea of the corona virus taking over hospitals is not something I want to ponder either.
People go to hospital for all sorts of other surgeries - not only treatments of viruses or infectious diseases. Knee replacements, heart surgeries, etc...

mockturtle said...

BleachBit: When Farmer said 'we have vaccines and antivirals to treat the flu', I think he meant that as two separate means by which flu virus can be controlled. I.e, we have vaccines and we also have antivirals to treat the flu.

As I understand it, antivirals have so far proved ineffective in treatment of this virus. There had been some hope for remdesivir but results have been disappointing.

BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

Heh - indeed Mock-T. One other positive might be that subway cars, buses and aircraft finally get a long overdue cleaning.

mockturtle said...

If I get it I'll just stay home and die. I won't take up a hospital bed.

Sebastian said...

""Bernie at townhall: "I'm not an expert on the current economy in Sweden."

Don't tell Farmer!"

Luckily I have never claimed otherwise. I've only ever argued that a higher marginal tax rate and single-payer healthcare will not turn the country into Venezuela."

That's our Farmer!

But just for the record, you did claim more than that: namely, that what Bernie proposed was a welfare state with high taxes and regulated markets like the one European social democrats support. To which I objected that since Bernie has no clue about European social democrats, and is not proposing what they support, that claim is false. In further exchanges, it appeared that you yourself have no clue about European social democrats--from whose perspective Bernie is representative of their adversaries on the left.

Come to think of it, many Dem-style "liberals" who actually do have much in common with social democrats (minus their fiscal rectitude) also view Bernie as an adversary to be destroyed, even at the cost of a Biden nomination. Actual social democrats can relate, though I cannot think of a single social-democratic leader in post-war Europe as debilitated as Slow Joe.

stephen cooper said...

In order to build a million respirators that are good enough, you need about the same industrial effort that the USA put into making planes and tanks in an given month in early 1942.

One month of hard work from our factories and there will be more than enough respirators.

It is not gonna happen because we are not who we were in 1942.

By the way, I was on a respirator for about a week, back in the 1980s. It is a fairly simple machine.



BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

Mock-T - oh right. I was just saying we don't have a cure for viruses. Flu vaccines don't guarantee you won't get the flu. One thing 1+ - a flu shot is supposed to lesson the severity of the the virus even if you get it.
I've become very pro flu shot.

Oso Negro said...

Blogger Jeff said...
An Italian doctor working at a small hospital in Bergamo wrote a long Facebook post about what's happening there. A local newspaper L'Eco Di Bergamo has
the entire post. Run it thru Google Translate. If it doesn't scare you, you're an idiot


So Jeff, will you be heading for Boulder or Las Vegas? Clearly the end times are at hand!

BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

If I get it I'll just stay home and die. I won't take up a hospital bed.

#metoo.

Oso Negro said...

Blogger mockturtle said...
If I get it I'll just stay home and die. I won't take up a hospital bed.


Thanks Mockturtle. I, for one, will miss you.

narciso said...

where are you getting that

mockturtle said...

BB: Yes, and there are other silver linings in this cloud, such as--I hope!--we can work to produce medications and medical supplies here in the USA rather than being dependent on China.

I also suspect this could signal the end of the People's Republic of China. Those who survive this epidemic are really pissed. Things could get ugly but maybe a better government will come out of it. I feel terribly sorry for the Chinese people.

If this pandemic ends the centuries-old handshaking tradition that will also be a plus. I've always hated it, as do many people. It's a germ-laden practice even in non-epidemic times. The elbow bump or the polite Japanese bow would be a welcome replacement.

mockturtle said...

Oso: Thank you. ;-)

rightguy said...

Farmer : the South Koreans have 7755 proven cases of Corona and 61 deaths- a death rate of
0.7 %. Of course we probably know about most of the deaths, but who knows how many more un-diagnosed mild/asymptomatic cases there might be?

stephen cooper said...

rightguy - there is evidence that there are not that many un-diagnosed cases, from statistics (maybe reliable maybe not) in those few countries with extensive testing. That would mean that if you get the new coronavirus you really are facing grim statistics.

On the other hand, the evidence that there are not many un-diagnosed cases also would mean that the new coronavirus is not as contagious as we thought. Which would definitely be good news,

exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...

mock, I am hoping it will also end the disgusting tradition of baseball players spitting all over home plate and the dugout (how foul dugout floors must be!). That gross habit made some sense, I suppose, when many of them chewed tobacco. But chewing tobacco has been banned now in the dugouts and most players chomp on bubble gum. They can make it though a game without spewing saliva around like dogs marking their territory.

narciso said...

Theyve just started trials with remdesvir, dont be giving up yet.

stephen cooper said...

remdesvir might be really really bad for the kidneys at the levels that are needed

mockturtle said...

Aren't most of these respirators manufactured in China?

mockturtle said...

Exiled, I totally agree! I'd enjoy baseball a lot more if they didn't show what went on in the dugout.

BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

"Lessen"
tip toe thru the bad spelling.

I hope not, Mock-T.

mockturtle said...

Oso: I've also seen a video of a doctor in China losing it because of the stress and overwork. It must be a nightmare. And there is evidence that they are making room for new patients by placing in body bags and cremating 'not yet dead' patients. :-(

Yancey Ward said...

Vitale was, at one time, the best college basketball color man. However, he well past his prime I would imagine.

I haven't watched a single college basketball game this year. The sport has just lost all my interest in the last five years.

Yancey Ward said...

Mock, don't go gently.

Yancey Ward said...

The first three seasons of Fargo were really good. I thought the producers were done, but glad to see a 4th is coming.

mockturtle said...

OK, Yancey, I'll go kicking and screaming into that good night.

narciso said...

First and third seasons were good? Second not so much.

The Cracker Emcee Refulgent said...

"It’s very striking how quickly things are starting to wrap up. I think a lot of voters have just been exhausted by this process, and they don’t see the primary as the battle they want to be waging — the real fight for them is against Trump."

2020, the Haste Makes Waste primary. In November, they'll be baffled how this all happened.

It's insane. How did they give Trump exactly the opponent he wanted? They must be laughing their asses off in the White House tonight.

Gospace said...

There's enough evidence around that every IV bag in a hospital should contain Vitamin C unless contraindicated for a particular condition or other medication. And I don't know of any it would be contraindicated for.

Seems the medical profession is really slow to adopt, or even try, new things that are actually really simple. It began with handwashing - Ignaz Philipp Semmelweis[ proposed it in 1847, and the medical establishment didn't start doing it until a year after his death in 1866.

FullMoon said...

They never learn.
NBC Manipulates Video: Cuts Around Biden Threatening to Assault Man

narciso said...

Well there isnt a penalty, re zimmerman at least one of the reporters relocated to the west coast, courics editor in 2008 went to work for yahoo david chalian etc

Yancey Ward said...

Mock,

Good to hear!

J. Farmer said...

@BleachBit-and-Hammers:

Farmer - you made valid points, but a nasty new virus is nothing new - other than in the age of Trump where we can turn it into his Katrina by counting the deaths one at a time.
and panic about TP.


You're confusing risk assessment and media criticism. Yes the media will always tend towards hype and sensationalism. That face does not refute the claim that Covid-19 poses a serious risk to the US.

Flu vaccines do not treat the flu.

To quote mockturtle: "BleachBit: When Farmer said 'we have vaccines and antivirals to treat the flu', I think he meant that as two separate means by which flu virus can be controlled. I.e, we have vaccines and we also have antivirals to treat the flu."

This was the point I was attempting to make but could've chosen my words better.

Yancey Ward said...

So, Biden finished Sanders off tonight. No surprise once I saw the polling data out of Washington state- Sanders only hope was to dominate there and win a squeaker in Michigan, but not to be. Very glad if Biden really is the candidate they put up in November- no candidate was weaker than he was, and I can't really believe the Democrats intend to let him actually be the top of the ticket.

So, I expect, starting around early June, to see the mainstream Democratic media start the first stories about Biden's mental deficiencies- they may even start noticing his family's corruption and influence peddling. Then the calls will start, around early July, for Biden to step aside the week before the convention and endorse whomever the party leaders pick- my money is on Klobuchar- they seem to have groomed her for this once they realized that only Biden could stop Sanders.

J. Farmer said...

@rightguy:

Farmer : the South Koreans have 7755 proven cases of Corona and 61 deaths- a death rate of
0.7 %. Of course we probably know about most of the deaths, but who knows how many more un-diagnosed mild/asymptomatic cases there might be?


For one, South Korea has been much more aggressive in identifying and isolating patients and slowing the spread of the disease. South Korea has administered around 3500 tests per million residents. The US has administered about 5 per million residents. When you suggest the kind of isolation that was implemented in South Korea, people call it hysteria and panic. There are also other relevant factors, such as the percent of South Korea's population that is elderly.

Unknown said...

The Caves Of Steel and The Naked Sun were the two classic-era Asimov robot novels. When he came back to the robots decades later (and introduced them into the Foundation universe) the results were not as good.

The movie I Robot was not really an adaptation of anything particular of Asimov's (except for the Three Laws Of Robotics), but addressed Asimovian themes pretty well -- I think he would have liked it.

A lot of people think that the movie Fantastic Voyage was based on a book of his. In reality, he got the novelization contract, and wrote so swiftly (as was his wont) that the book came out well before the movie.

Yancey Ward said...

By the way, California is now at 94% finished with the counting in their primary from a week ago.

J. Farmer said...

@Sebastian:

That's our Farmer!

But just for the record, you did claim more than that: namely, that what Bernie proposed was a welfare state with high taxes and regulated markets like the one European social democrats support. To which I objected that since Bernie has no clue about European social democrats, and is not proposing what they support, that claim is false.


Yes you continually made that argument, and I continually objected that it had nothing to do with the argument I was making. And yet here you are repeating it once again. My point was that if Sanders was given a magic wand and able to institute all of his policies, the US would be much closer to the so called Nordic model than the Soviet one. Pointing out how one Sanders' policy is different than the one in Denmark, and another policy is different than one in Sweden, and another policy is different from one in Norway does not refute that argument. Also, I continuously pointed out that even if some policies were similar, we have no reason to expect similar results because of the cultural and demographic differences between the US and the Nordic countries.

Yancey Ward said...

I think rightguy's main point is that South Korea has probably done the best job of quantifying the actual pool of infected, and I am willing to bet that they haven't found 10% of the infected, even with the increased testing, and they have been testing people who don't even have symptoms. So, by quantifying that pool, they have a better estimate of the upper bound of the actual mortality for this disease.

Mark said...

Isn't a CPAP basically a positive pressure respirator?

J. Farmer said...

@Yancey Ward:

So, by quantifying that pool, they have a better estimate of the upper bound of the actual mortality for this disease.

Covid-19 does not have to kill a bunch of people to be a serious problem. In a large country, even a relatively small percentage of serious cases (not deaths but ones requiring hospitalization and ventillation) can easily put a strain on finite healthcare resources. And this obviously presents a problem with the other sick people occupying ICU's for other ailments. There is also the risk of infecting healthcare workers and other hospital staff. Lombardy, which has a population of 10 million, has experienced only a few hundred deaths, but was experiencing a severe strain on its health resources.

Yancey Ward said...

They have also put an upper bound on the seriously ill percentage, which is about 1%.

J. Farmer said...

@Mark:

Isn't a CPAP basically a positive pressure respirator?

You could call it a kind of respirator but so what? Patients need ventilators not respirators. A ventilator basically does your breathing for you, thus taking the work load off your lungs. And there is risk associated with long-term ventilation.

J. Farmer said...

@Yancey Ward:

They have also put an upper bound on the seriously ill percentage, which is about 1%.

If a million people got infected, that would require more ICU beds than exist in the country. And that doesn't even include the people who are currently occupying such beds.

Mark said...

Why is it that almost every Dem talking head on TV since the Clinton era is always FOS?? It's always spin, spin, spin.

Yancey Ward said...

The 1% won't all require a bed in an ICU, Farmer.

narciso said...

Who will call them on it, the corrupt press is their transcriber.

J. Farmer said...

Why is it that almost every Dem talking head on TV since the Clinton era is always FOS?? It's always spin, spin, spin.

Most talking heads are full of shit. Their job is to read from a prepared script, not do any real thinking. Relying on television news, regardless of the provider, will almost certainly guarantee you will be misinformed. The purpose of mainstream media is to mold public opinion, not inform it.

Mark said...

Could you make your point without being an ass about it, JF?

Why wouldn't a positive pressure respirator be helpful? What's the the difference between that and a "ventilator"?

J. Farmer said...

Could you make your point without being an ass about it, JF?

Perhaps, if I cared to try.

Why wouldn't a positive pressure respirator be helpful? What's the the difference between that and a "ventilator"?

A ventilator involves inserting an endotracheal tube down your throat, and ventilated patients are often kept under sedation. A ventilator takes the work load off your lungs, which are typically compromised in some way. A CPAP merely blows air into your mouth and/or nose. Your lungs still have to do the work, which would provide no relief to someone with compromised lung function.

walter said...

CPAP is typically self-administered at home. Ventilation/intubation is an ICU level procedure/intervention that might be inescapable prior to death.
Hey..didn't S. Korea prez say they had an obligation to share the Covid pain with Kim FAT?

Mark said...

You know what? Don't answer. Let someone else answer my question.

Mark said...

Someone who might be interested in exploring solutions rather than simply bitching.

eddie willers said...

So Jeff, will you be heading for Boulder or Las Vegas? Clearly the end times are at hand!

I'm going with Gary Sinese.

J. Farmer said...

Someone who might be interested in exploring solutions rather than simply bitching.

Short answer: CPAP would provide no solution to people with compromised lung function.

StephenFearby said...

Catchy headline...

Coronavirus fears cancel think tank’s coronavirus conference

https://nypost.com/2020/03/10/coronavirus-fears-cancel-think-tanks-coronavirus-conference/

walter said...

It's a means to bypass obstructions upstream from lungs (nose/throat)

Mark said...

Meanwhile, I don't understand this Democrat call to basically disenfranchise the primary voters of 26 states.

By demanding that Sanders get out, they are telling millions of people that their choices don't count. They claim to be anti-communist, but in true communist style, they want to give voters only one choice.

walter said...

I should add dentition, having had to record presentations about dental alignment devices that, for some, obviate need for CPAP.

StephenFearby said...

Short video:

Cow poop bath is yet another coronavirus 'cure'
March 10, 2020
Don’t have a cow? Fearing coronavirus, three men and one boy in Hiriyur, India, were filmed taking a dip in a bath filled with cow poop. “The whole world is terrified of the deadly virus outbreak,” one of the men said. “If we all start taking cow dung bath, we will attain immunity from the virus.”

https://nypost.com/video/cow-poop-bath-is-yet-another-coronavirus-cure/

Sebastian said...

"My point was that if Sanders was given a magic wand and able to institute all of his policies, the US would be much closer to the so called Nordic model than the Soviet one."

No. Your specific point was that he wanted what European social democrats support. That claim was false. It is still false.

J. Farmer said...

@Sebastian:

No. Your specific point was that he wanted what European social democrats support. That claim was false. It is still false.

No, my point was that Sanders' model was closer to social democracy than to Cuba or Venezuela.

Drago said...

For a guy who has spoken non-stop for 4 years about the importance of securing the borders over all other issues, Farmer is very invested in Open Borders Sanders.

Narayanan said...

What is stopping BIG DATA from initiating health care infrastructure building to meet coming Coronapocalypse?

Don't they believe science?

Chris N said...

Hmmmm.....if COVID-19 is spreading exponentially, 2 or higher for infection rate, then we’ll see cases jump very rapidly towards hospital overload. If it mostly passes through droplets of asymptomatic people in the incubation period average of four days, then we’ll be dealing with an Italy like situation shortly.

Nearly all hospitals unable to bear load with doctors, nurses, incubators and beds to handle those patients who need respiration. Triage and a mess for a month.

Mild to nasty flu for many (hardly any kids, the older and more risk factors you have like weight, illness etc the worse your chances), really bad lung shutdown for many fewer,,but enough to overwhelm front line care care in a surge.

That’s worst case but it could be true. Better case is we self quarantine better and the surge and infection rate is staggered....heres to hoping.

Prepare for worst and hoping for mild,

rightguy said...

My main point, Farmer, is that the death rate of Corona is no where near 10X of influenza.

BTW, the attack rate has peaked in SK.

I believe that this Corona epidemic will prove to be a bit of a dud and I am personally not any more concerned than I am during a pretty bad flu epidemic. I am going on with my life while taking some extra precautions- buying airline tickets presently.

J. Farmer said...

@Drago:

For a guy who has spoken non-stop for 4 years about the importance of securing the borders over all other issues, Farmer is very invested in Open Borders Sanders.

I am not sure how “very invested” I can be for someone I have no plans to vote for.

Chris N said...

On the Eastside of Seattle, if you have higher risk, then it’s avoid big crowds and places where droplets are in the air. Worst case is 1-4 days later you start displaying symptoms, 3-10 days in you’re exhausted and have trouble breathing, and if you’re in a surge, you decide to go to the hospital and they turn you away and you ride it out at home or don’t.

Won’t happen to most people to have such bad symptoms, but once it’s a few thousand all at once, there’s trouble it seems.

If not it’s take your chances and do all the normal stuff which prevent contraction and severity and it’s not too big a deal for you. All the big companies and many smaller ones work from home who are able. Months of this?

J. Farmer said...

@rightguy:

My main point, Farmer, is that the death rate of Corona is no where near 10X of influenza.

The number you quoted was 0.7%. The CFR for influenza is generally given as 0.1%. So that would be 7x the rate for the standard flu. I also don't know how much we can extrapolate from South Korea's outcomes without taking into account their response, which has been much more aggressive than what we're doing. South Korea has tested 700x more people on a per capita basis than the US.

Chris N said...

Either way, it’s time to turn towards Nature’s Embrace, trusting in the three E’s. Empathy is found in Community Care, Equality is for equal distribution of resources, and Earth stands for for healing harmony.

Come to Peace Pavilion Eest and liberate your inner child.

Find your Self. Work for the future to come in your own ecopodment. Bug paste has flu resistant properties. Be nice and well liked.

Brochures available.

rightguy said...

Farmer : but of course the denominator of 7755 is certainly low and the true death rate will be considerably lower than 0.7%. And SK is a country that shares a border with China.

Lewis Wetzel said...

What is the average age of people who have died of corvid-19 virus? I've heard it's eighty. Eight-zero. Current life expectency in the US is 79.4 years. Stop panicking, for God's sake.

Jon Ericson said...

I believe that the community is already in process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence, where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

Jon Ericson said...

Sorry, forgot attribution.

-- Learned Hand

MadisonMan said...

I've heard it's eighty. Eight-zero.

And they're more likely Trump voters! Why worry?

Clyde said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Clyde said...

Here's a preview of the Trump-Biden debates, with Trump as King Arthur, Biden as the Black Knight and Bernie as the Green Knight:

Black Knight

"I'll bite your legs off!"

Tina Trent said...

Milwaukie Guy: very fun to chat with you about terrorists and vegetable gardens. Ignorance: good luck with your treatment. You seem to have attitude in the bag.

Bannon's pandemic podcast continues to be the best source for both the science and economics of coronavirus. I listened to the BBC yesterday, and it was shameful. The first subject was a long diatribe about how it's racist to use terms like Wuhan virus. The leading medical professionals seemed to feel the most important information they could impart was nattery lessons on the horrors of using "prejudiced" language. In later shows, they discussed sustainability briefly before postponing the rest of their planned content to switch to a travel agent who kept saying she knew nothing about the virus but also kept advising people that they should keep their vacation plans and not cancel flights to Spain and Greece.

There was one Italian virologist who seemed befuddled that they were asking her whether it was really bad in Milan. The EU seems to have strip-mined what little non-suicidal instinct still exists in Britain and Europe.

Lincolntf said...

I'm getting ready for a long drive to an orphanage in the Blue Ridge Mountains to shoot an informational video for new employees. Never been to an orphanage before, should be interesting.

Inga said...

Trump has all the best words

BUMBLE BEE said...

Ignorance... Good luck with your treatment. I understand they're zeroing in on that disease!.

Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...

Inga said...
Trump has all the best words


That cracked up my whole family. There is a lot negative that can be said about Trump but he has always been entertaining.

Angle-Dyne, Servant of Ugliness said...

J.Farmer to BB&H: You're confusing risk assessment and media criticism.

Lot of that going around.

Lewis Wetzel: Stop panicking, for God's sake.

Calm down, Lewis.

The only people I see going emo on these covid threads are the people panicked about panic.

Other than that I see people calmly discussing the issue. (N.B.: disagreement with the "nothing to see here, no different from the annual flu" position re the extent of risk, or the wisdom of any given public health measure, does not constitute "panic".)

tim in vermont said...

Maybe we should join OPEC? Set a tariff on imported oil to set the price within the US so that we keep our domestic energy interest alive and manage our balance of trade and let Russia and Saudi Arabia fight it out over the rest of the world. A tariff would be a tacit agreement to cooperate with OPEC. Our interests are now their interests in many ways.

Bruce Hayden said...

“So, Biden finished Sanders off tonight. No surprise once I saw the polling data out of Washington state- Sanders only hope was to dominate there and win a squeaker in Michigan, but not to be. Very glad if Biden really is the candidate they put up in November- no candidate was weaker than he was, and I can't really believe the Democrats intend to let him actually be the top of the ticket.”

At this point, I don’t think that they will. At one point, I thought they would try to slide him into the WH, then move him to the side with the 25th Amdt. Now, I expect that they know he won’t last that long.

“So, I expect, starting around early June, to see the mainstream Democratic media start the first stories about Biden's mental deficiencies- they may even start noticing his family's corruption and influence peddling. Then the calls will start, around early July, for Biden to step aside the week before the convention and endorse whomever the party leaders pick- my money is on Klobuchar- they seem to have groomed her for this once they realized that only Biden could stop Sanders.”

She may be the best of the worst there. No really useful experience there, of course, which means that the country would be run again by the billionaires and centamillionaires, internationalists, and the bureaucrats. I doubt that she would be quite as bad at putting really corrupt people in top positions as Obama did. I view him using a Chicago style of governance, where it is just expected that different constituencies get different top posts, based on their relative power. To me, she is just blah. Not someone you would write home about meeting. But maybe that is what they need to win back the WH - someone blah enough that Trump has a hard time getting a handle on. If they keep the House, and flip the Senate, I see the action being in the House, and the young Turks there, such as AOC and her squad, with Schifty ultimately taking over for Palsi. Best thing that Trump could do right now there is to try to have him indicted for violating the Espionage Act.

Maybe it’s my paranoia, but Crooked Hillary all of a sudden becoming politically active worries me. On the one hand, I have to believe that there is no way that the Dems would let her grab the nomination again. It is so blatant. She likely would have been creamed in the primaries, esp being as debilitated as she appears to be. But the Clintons are nothing if not blatant. Think about what they (mostly she - he was off with Epstein to Pedophile Island a lot) did in four short years. They managed to make a couple hundred million dollars personally, and gain control over a billion of two more, in their private foundation/slush fund, by fairly overtly selling American foreign policy to the highest bidders, then hid it from scrutiny by using an illegal private server for her communications. After Obama picking Holder and Lynch as AGs, and seeing how the DOJ, FBI, CIA, etc, were weaponized against his politician enemies, I worry, a lot, about what a truly evil and corrupt person, like her, will likely do this time around, having seen what can be done. The good thing though is that I don’t see her beating Trump, or really coming that close. Right now, I see her as vulnerable to Trump as Bernie is, even more than Biden and Warren.

tim in vermont said...

"Maybe it’s my paranoia, but Crooked Hillary all of a sudden becoming politically active worries me.”

She is politically tone deaf. I am not really worried about her actually becoming president, but if it’s Amy, her machine will be running things, you can bet.

Fernandistein said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
tim in vermont said...

Look at what the Clinton machine did to keep people from looking into Biden corruption in Ukraine.

Is Ukraine going to go away just because Democrat primary voters don’t want to hear about it? IDK. I know the press won’t want to cover it, but we have seen that Trump may well have the power to force the issue into public consciousness.

Fernandistein said...

Cow poop bath is yet another coronavirus 'cure'

That's a traditional treatment in Indiana, one which might actually work for contagious diseases because nobody wants to get close to the bathers, and they would avoid touching their own faces, after their bath.

tim in vermont said...

Is anybody running polls anymore about how people feel about what Biden did in Ukraine and China? No. Because they know damn well what those polls would show and it’s not helpful for smothering Bernie with a pillow, which is the Democrats’ No ! priority.

Unknown said...

Those wacky Hoosiers!

tim in vermont said...

"and they would avoid touching their own faces,”

That’s like the old cowboy joke about kissing your horse’s asshole to cure chapped lips. It keeps you from licking them.

mockturtle said...

The Two Cranes with Reflections photo is very appealing.

Michael K said...

Best thing that Trump could do right now there is to try to have him indicted for violating the Espionage Act.

I think that Arkansas judge in the Hunter babymomma case is going to lower the boom on him. That $12,000 a month pad in LA is just a tad blatant for Arkansas. Joe is just senile. His family are all dirty and that will be coming out over the next few months.

Joe might just get a case of corona virus by July and drop out for "medical reasons."

Klobuchar is dull but might be the insurance policy for the down ballot races they hope to salvage.

Rusty said...



"Blogger Oso Negro said...
Blogger mockturtle said...
If I get it I'll just stay home and die. I won't take up a hospital bed.

Thanks Mockturtle. I, for one, will miss you."

(sniff) I will miss you too, mockturtle. can I have your camper?