I don't think Bernie should go after anyone. He must defend and would do best to appear worthily presidential and above the fray. But is he capable of controlling his angry face and modulating his yelling voice? Doesn't matter. Let Bernie be Bernie. It's worked so far, and how could he possibly change at this stage? Stand your ground, Bernie. Your mere presence as the frontrunner is horrifying and flummoxing to all the rest of them.
Elizabeth Warren should have a secret alliance with Bernie. All the delegates she collects can be handed over to Bernie later. She could give him the majority he needs at the convention. As she collects delegates, the radical left position gains force, but it's less obvious than it would be if all of them went to Bernie. She's serving his interests, and he can make her his VP choice.
In any case, Warren is not allied with Biden, Bloomberg, Buttigieg, and Klobuchar. They're the moderates, all begging for the nonradical voters in a desperate, bungling stop-Bernie effort. Warren should attack all of them, especially Bloomberg. She's good at that.
And what should Biden, Bloomberg, Buttigieg, and Klobuchar do? Continually barge in front of each other demanding to be seen as the one person who's palatable enough to have a ghost of a chance against Trump? Or will they take a first-things-first approach and insist they're the one to stop Bernie?They probably have convinced themselves that to do one is to do the other. The reason to vote for B/B/B/K is that Bernie must be stopped in order to stop Trump. But it has to be one of them, not 4 of them, and so they will have to turn on each other.
Bloomberg has a special position: He can say that he should be the one of the 4, because he has his own money, and none of the others has stood out enough as a candidate to have a stronger argument than that. That's why Biden, Buttigieg, and Klobuchar all need to keep beating up on Bloomberg, and that keeps Bloomberg in at least as bad a position as Biden, Buttigieg, and Klobuchar. And it keeps the entire group from mounting a serious challenge to Sanders.
Maybe Bloomberg will rise to the occasion. Expectations are low now, after last week's debate fiasco. Surely, he's taken some coaching and has a more realistic idea of how to do a debate. He's incredibly arrogant, but he got an epic humiliation. And everyone's interested in seeing what he can do to make a comeback. And now now there's less hope than ever that one of the other nonradicals (Biden, Buttigieg, or Klobuchar) can get all the attention, he's got reason to hope he can be the one. And he's got the motivation to regain his dignity and the constant boost of knowing that he's the one with all the money.
UPDATE: I'm told Tom Steyer will also be in the debate. Oh! That is so dull. He does not belong there. I guess he hurts Bloomberg because it is just so ridiculous to have 2 billionaires who've bought their way on to the stage and will be standing there so long after all those governors and senators have slipped away.
IN THE COMMENTS: DanTheMan says:
The so called moderates need to go after Biden. If he loses in SC he’s done and a big chunk of moderates have to find a new home.I'm picturing something in the form of an intervention. He needs it. So much damage he has caused.
Posts
218 comments:
1 – 200 of 218 Newer› Newest»Buttegeig is a radical.
He’s a red diaper baby. Just because you don’t think he’s radical, doesn’t mean he’s not. He just said he supports Walter’s (the angry old man’s) agenda.
It wasn’t that long ago that Warren claimed Bernie said something sexist and he called her a liar and she refused to shake his hand. Or something like that. I remember one of the more remarkable things was how the media treated the dustup. A debate moderator basically assumed Bernie said what Warren, the lying snake, claimed he said.
How long ago was that?
"Buttegeig is a radical. He’s a red diaper baby. Just because you don’t think he’s radical, doesn’t mean he’s not."
Well, that's an argument that can be used to argue that he shouldn't get the votes of the stop-Bernie people. I'm writing about what each candidate should do in the debate, and Buttigieg has clearly decided to position himself as one of the nonradicals. This post is not about the question whether the seeming moderates are in fact moderate in the larger scheme of things. Within the structure of this particular fight, you have radical and moderate as defined by Bernie at one end, with Warren, and the people who have defined themselves in opposition to that (Bloomberg, Biden, Buttigieg, and Klobuchar). If one of the moderates gets the nomination in the end, of course, conservatives will do their usual thing of telling us how left wing they are. Fine. That's predictable. But I want to talk about how tonight's fight will be fought. I'd like to talk about it more like a network sports analyst, where you look at one particular game and the players and try to envision what will happen.
Bleh: It wasn’t that long ago that Warren claimed Bernie said something sexist and he called her a liar and she refused to shake his hand. Or something like that. I remember one of the more remarkable things was how the media treated the dustup. A debate moderator basically assumed Bernie said what Warren, the lying snake, claimed he said.
How long ago was that? 2/25/20, 8:22 AM
That was January 14. Ancient times.
1. Buttigieg is indeed a red-diaper baby radical. He's just a younger, smoother Bernie. No difference in their objectives.
2. Forget campaign tactics: all the others should attack Bernie because he's a nasty communist who would destroy the nation as we have known it. (This assumes that they care about the nation as we have known it.) The fact that they won't attack Bernie just for being a communist shows that they are either accomplices or indifferent to anything but their own chance at power. In either case they demonstrate their unworthiness to hold office.
3. Biden is done. He wouldn't be able to find his way to the debate without help. It was a terrible mistake for him to run at all. Bad for him personally, bad for his party and bad for the nation.
4. Warren and Klobuchar are vying for VP at this point. Have to have a woman on the ticket. Warren will attack Bloomie again because that's who she is, and because she believes she is best serving the eventual nominee by doing so.
5. Bloomie needs a very strong performance. There was no excuse for him being unprepared in Round 1. There is less than no excuse for him being unprepared in Round 2. Interestingly, Bloomie has decided to attack Sanders FROM THE LEFT! Sanders is a tool of the NRA, you see. Genius, that Bloomie.
I'm trying to redirect this conversation to the content of the post, as explained in my 8:28 comment, so I will delete the comments that are in danger of hijacking the thread. I don't want this to be about how leftism doesn't work or about how Bernie is vulnerable to attacks because of things he's said over the years, etc. etc. All the usual things we've seen over and over. And please don't just drop random things you saw at Instapundit. We can all read what's over there, and I really don't care about stuff like rewriting the words of John Lennon's "Imagine."
I would think Bernie would choose a more moderate candidate for his VP slot, and one with geographic distance from his home base. Klobuchar, or maybe Buttigieg.
They should try to be more interesting than Bernie. Leftism isn't interesting. It's all PC crap. So there's that.
5. Bloomie needs a very strong performance. There was no excuse for him being unprepared in Round 1. There is less than no excuse for him being unprepared in Round 2. Interestingly, Bloomie has decided to attack Sanders FROM THE LEFT! Sanders is a tool of the NRA, you see. Genius, that Bloomie.
2/25/20, 8:30 AM
So the former Republican is attacking the commie due to his involvements years ago with the country's oldest civil rights organization. Things that make you go "huh"...
Elizabeth Warren could shoot flaming matches at Bernie, an indian convention against wagon trains. You can make a fine match-striker and shooter out of a single spring clothes-pin. I'm sure it's on youtube, or just ask any 50s era boy.
This is not a debate so much as an audition to see who gets cast to play President on TV. All the candidates believe pretty much the same thing (if they believe anything) but differ in personal style: the firebrands Sanders and Warren versus the cooler headed B/B/K. It also suggests that the main objection to Trump is not so much his policies but his personal style.
Comments about my deletions are off topic, and I have to delete them. Please stay on topic.
Buttigeig should attack Bernie's fashion sense. Disheveled is out. Nobody wants a frumpy president.
If you just want to "speak truth to power," you can do that on your own blog. Or try Facebook or Twitter. They exist.
It's funny to think that Warren, after a year of chasing Bernie's voters, would now present herself as the moderate alternative. Bloomberg should mention that. Buttigeig would probably like to mention it but he's trying to corner the empty pablum vote and can't afford to say anything concrete.
Klobuchar runs hot and cold with the polls (now she's charging! no, wait, she's nowhere), but her best bet is to play it like the 3rd place person on Jeopardy--stick to her own message and let the others battle it out for first. Then see what opportunities present themselves once the others are all beaten up.
Klobuchar seems to be boring about everything. Bernie will beat her. Maybe have a high school valedictorian-off.
I thought one of the women was a nurse. Have a bedpan changing race, whoever it was.
Althouse: “In any case, Warren is not allied with Biden, Bloomberg, Buttigieg, and Klobuchar. They're the moderates....”
None of them are moderates, particularly Buttigieg, who is a Gramscian and perhaps the most dangerous of all.
The so called moderates need to go after Biden. If he loses in SC he’s done and a big chunk of moderates have to find a new home.
I'll let the Althouse blogsters in on a little secret, but it goes no further. Deal? Show of hands, please... Good, that's as near-unanimous as dammit. Ready? Here goes...
I am the other Biden.
I would just like to take this time to thank everyone in advance for watching and analyzing the upcoming debate so I don't have to.
Debate strategy is everyone else should hammer Bernie. If Bernie gets 35 percent on super Tuesday most likely is he garners the needed pledged delegates. If he stays in the low to mid 20s all bets are off. Biden pushes his comeback off the win in SC, Bloomberg wins a couple and seconds a couple, a few states give three candidates delegates, Amy wins MN. Amy wins! Chaos. If you're a not Bernie you can take your chances at the brokered convention and against Bernie I like their chances...
Steyer is another drone, so he'll lose to Bernie too.
It is never too late to bring up the Nazis :) Hitler was appointed chancellor because the other parties couldn't come to agreement among themselves, so they sought agreements with the Nazis. A plurality is as good as a majority when the opposition is divided and can be played.
From the update: assuming the DNC is trying to engineer a milquetoast candidate not named Bernie who is inoffensive enough to take a chunk of the middle from Trump without surrendering any of the left to ennui, what would a tea leaf reader make of the decision to let a second billionaire on the stage? (Sure, Steyer is polling well in SC, but is that at Bernie's expense or Biden's? He's nowhere pretty much everywhere else.)
The so called moderates need to go after Biden
Bernie should be in SC trying to knock out Biden. Instead he's in VA and somewhere. Perhaps he feels he has no chance in SC
"Elizabeth Warren should have a secret alliance with Bernie. All the delegates she collects can be handed over to Bernie later. She could give him the majority he needs at the convention. As she collects delegates, the radical left position gains force, but it's less obvious than it would be if all of them went to Bernie. She's serving his interests, and he can make her his VP choice."
I think you're overestimating the good faith of these candidates if you think any of them is interested in ceding victory to another candidate just to stop Trump or advance a political agenda. This exercise is about personal ambition, first and foremost. If it guaranteed her the presidency, Liz Warren would turn into a Whig overnight. Same for HRC and, frankly, all of them. Romney would turn Maoist in a heartbeat if it somehow meant he got to be president for four years.
(I'm not ignoring the fact that, in your scenario, Warren gets to be Bernie's running mate. However, that's not such a great consolation prize, especially where Bernie is likely to lose in November.)
In a multi-way taking-turns duel, the worst shot should fire in the air until the other guys finish each other off. Then shoot the last guy. It will be your turn.
A lot of commenters at the Washington Post are making the argument that Bernie is just like Trump. He's outside the party establishment. He is thin skinned when criticized. He flies off the handle and blames the media for bad coverage. If any of the other candidates buy this, they may try to provoke an ill-considered response from Bernie. I think this is the motivation behind actions intended to goad Trump (Bloomberg's signs that say Trump cheats at golf, or Pelosi's ripping up the SOU and refusing the standard greeting). I can't be sure, when Trump does make an outrageous tweet, whether it is a deliberate strategic decision, or an emotional response of an out-of-control Trump.
Steyer might win delegates in SC which means fewer proportional delegates allocated from the losers to Bernie. Good for the not Bernie camp.
If I were Pete I'd be tempted to attack only Bernie. Bloomberg has put so much money and effort in Super Tuesday states he would be better served comparing himself favorably to Bloomberg - a better more electable choice. He should also like on when others inevitably attack Bernie. I suspect the moderators will frame questions in a way that highlights Bernie's fantastical platform.
Klobuchar should continue acting like the only completely sane and realistic one. She shouldn't engage Pete at all if possible.
Bernie should continue selling the dream but ignoring the cost or impediments. Reality is not his friend.
Biden would be best served getting a good nap after a healthy meal this afternoon. He needs to try to appear competent.
I would advise Warren to do the exact same type of thing she did last time.
I guess Bloomberg's best bet would be to sound less like a capitalist. Apparently that is a hard sell to the Democrat primary audience.
What they will choose to do is another matter. I haven't a clue. That is what is making this primary season so very entertaining to me!
Let's play a drinking game: If at anytime during the debate, any candidates makes reference to:
a. Horse-Faced Lesbians
b. Fat Broads
c. Rape fantasy pamphlets
d. Fidel Castro
..we each have to take a shot of whiskey. I'm not sure if we will ever get drunk. We may be sober the entire night. But the anticipation will be glorious.
I like the Sanders Warren ticket. I admit I avoided all debates until Bloomberg. He adds variety. Sanders can close the deal if he shows up in a Che' t-shirt, and a Madonna T for Warren.
"I'm not ignoring the fact that, in your scenario, Warren gets to be Bernie's running mate. However, that's not such a great consolation prize..."
I think her candidacy is close to full collapse, so it's her best move.
Read "The Passage of Power" (Caro LBJ bio volume 4) about LBJ's reasoning about accepting the VP position. And Warren would have a much stronger hope of inheriting the presidency, given Sanders's age and recent heart attack.
Memo to Bloomberg: Don't get scalped by a fake Indian.
Dan @ 8:47 hits the nail on the head. The DNC/leftmedia will take care of Bernie. For example, see, CNN: “Bernie Sanders' disastrous answer on '60 Minutes'.” Just the beginning.
The others ought to lay off Bernie, mostly, to avoid pissing off “the Bros.”
Memo to Biden: You are in Westerville, Ohio. Write this down on your hand, if necessary.
I suspect that Bloomberg will be more aggressive in attacking Bernie and in defending himself from attack.
Attacking Bernie will go well for mini-Mike, but the self-defense will be off putting because he comes across as arrogant.
Why would Bernie go for Warren if Tulsi is available? If he wraps up the nomination, he's not going to listen to DNC mewling about balance. Tulsi quit the DNC over the way they treated him, she apparently hates the Clinton's - she's got everything.
Memo to Bernie: All these moderators are stinking capitalist pigs, exploiting the working man for profit. And so is Michael Bloomberg.
Bloomberg is the Bruce Springsteen of Presidential politics, the most over-rated guy in the game.
Wow. A Bernie / Warren ticket. I’m rooting for it. It really is her only hope for any relevance at the convention.
But what States would this east coast radical liberal ticket flip? Yeah they get California, NY, Illinois, Mass….etc….
But to they win NC, FLA, WIS, MI, NV, OH, IA, PA, AZ…….
They also finalize the reshaping of the Democrat Party into a radical left-wing shit-house. Crazy Bernie and Pocahontas. DO IT! I’m gonna get me a beer.
Veep is indeed Warren's best shot at the presidency. At her age it’s also her last shot.
This is partly because her leftist ideas are unworkable and some of the unconstitutional, but I am not allowed to say so, or to complain about it.
Face it everyone, it's Bernie and his Socialism that will be running the Democrat Party. Does the fact that you have money in the stock market scare you now?
I couldn't see Warren as Bernie's running mate, because they are too close in ideology, geography and temperament. Warren isn't as angry as Bernie, but she's very strident. Bernie would need to bring in a woman of color from outside of New England to meet the demands of intersectionality.
Ultimately, there's only room for one person in the far left lane, and Bernie seems to have claimed it over Warren. Unless she tomahawks him tonight, her campaign is probably done.
100% Rory. Tulsi is the perfect balance to a Sanders ticket. The only way it could be better is if Tulsi were African American
Elizabeth Warren should have a secret alliance with Bernie. All the delegates she collects can be handed over to Bernie later. She could give him the majority he needs at the convention. As she collects delegates, the radical left position gains force, but it's less obvious than it would be if all of them went to Bernie. She's serving his interests, and he can make her his VP choice.
Will Bernie forgive her for the whole "woman can't be president" nonsense? I suppose if he wants her deligates he'll have to.
But I'm uncertain as to how the other candidates can attack Bernie. With perhaps the excpetion of Bloomberg, to me they seem to mostly agree with him on policy. The main differences between them are things like Medicare for All versus some sort of reboot of Obamacare or some other massive new program. They all raised their hands for free healthcare to illegal aliens. All of them seem to want to ditch the electoral college. All of them want $15 dollar mimum wage. All of them want some or all college to be "free". All of them want "assault weapon" bans, and most of them are for a national firearms registery. All of them want citizenship for "dreamers". All of them seem to be in favor of some sort of "special tax" on wealth.
Warren and Sanders want to have an actual tax on wealth. Warren and Sanders both want to ban fracking.
Biden would have won in 2016, and then we'd be seriousLy talking the 25th today. He was arrested in South Africa with Andrew Young, for trying to see Mandela, hundreds of miles away. That's his story. Andrew Young denies it. There is nothing in any paper about it. Members of Congress getting arrested in foreign countries usually makes the news.
This is the first They Have Black People Here primary.
This debate is going to be Pander Palooza and That Other Candidate Hates Black People.
Biden is going to repeat the mantra Obama Obama Obama. And they are all going after Bloomberg for his Up Against the Wall and Spread Your Arms and Legs Policy of Bloomberg.
If Biden is smart, he’ll go after Bernie and Klobuchar for being Senators from White People States.
They’ll all go after Mayor Pete for not fixing up the Darktown part of South Bend and focusing on the sidewalks and attractive craft beer pubs for The White People
Ain't it a little premature to be riffing on the VEEP? In ordinary times, Bernie would sale to the nomination. But not so fast -- the Dem establishment wants to sink him. RCP betting odds has Bernie at 56% likelihood for the nomination, which means 44% someone else. Let's see what the Dems throw at him, and see if he can survive (politically).
Forget Biden, did anyone else see that video of Slow Joe in South Carolina? He needs to run only to the old folks home. If he can find it.
How is Elizabeth Warren any different than Lori Loughlin?
For the moserates, Bernie is tomorrow’s problem. If you don’t knock Biden out of the race you don’t get to tomorrow
The problem with the "moderates" going after Bernie (which I agree is what will probably happen) is that it's so obviously contrived. Oh, so now all of a sudden you've noticed that Bernie is a leftist radical? How come this didn't bother you before?
What will be missing in the midst of all the attacks will be a positive and inspiring vision for this country.
Good God! There's bad advice, and there's -terrible- advice. Sounding presidential works only if you're trying to convince low-watt pundits that you're "electable." Donald Trump never had to worry about sounding presidential until he was actually president, and yet his base most admires him for when he sounds like a fighter- and delivers on his promises. In the same vein, Bernie Sanders doesn't have to sound like he wants to put America to the sword- he should keep engaging and slap down every pretender to the crown. When Elizabeth Warren shrilly declares that he can't get along with people and tears down the health plans of the other candidates, simply point out that she's doing the most criticizing of anyone on stage. Which is a glass house, considering how she withdrew her own Medicare for All plan. Then keep kicking Bloomberg in the ribs (it's easy, he's short) over trying to win the Dem nomination as a Bush Republican in sheep's clothing.
Of course, "advice" for a candidate that's taken 1st place in every state so far is superfluous. Bernie's going to be fine, especially if he learns to not knuckle under when women screech at him. By the same token, the vain thought that a debate will turn things around for them is why the also-rans aren't dropping out. They take Althousian debate advice and keep splitting the vote, leading to an easy path for Bernie. What they need to do is co-operate behind the scenes- or have the moneymen twist their privates until they do. Bernie would be crazy to make Warren his VP, as she's an untrustworthy snake and not smart enough to bring home the bacon. Tulsi Gabbard would be the ultimate fuck you to the Democratic establishment, and also makes the idea of wishing ill health on President Sanders a very dicey one.
As I said yesterday, Warren's most effective attack would be Bernie’s health records. But if she is angling for VP, she won’t.
I predicted a while ago the DNC would coalesce around either Bloomberg or Klobuchar. But they need to do well or that’s out. Leaving Buttigieg. But the DNC know he is a weak candidate.
My own preference is Bloomberg. Not that I like him much, but at least he is sane and a proven manager.
AOC alliance will have the final say whether Tulsi or anyone else becomes Bernie's VP.
Leave Bernie alone!
...and, they will.
Because they agree with Bernie, they just don't like him saying what they all believe so loudly, in public.
Do they attack Bloomberg because he's "buying" his way in, or because he won't play footsie with a commie?
you decide.
The seven that will be on the stage tonight made me research the contribution limits for Trump’s campaign. Interestingly, by campaigning against Donald Trump in the primaries, Bill Weld allows me to give Trump twice as much money, as long as I contribute half while Trump still has primary competition. C’mon tax refund! I don‘t really need an expensive vacation this year, do I?
Those who are suggesting Tulsi as Bernie's VP: Bravo. That's brilliant, and would indeed make the Dem ticket formidable.
I think a covert alliance between Warren and Sanders is a terrible idea. It's exactly what people think, that these politicians are always secretly scheming and hiding the truth from us. Warren already suffers from a phoniness problem, how does she stand up there pretending to be about something other than her own self-interest if she's just in it to try and ride Bernie's coat tails.
I'm hoping Biden has one last glorious effort in him, to be coherent and rational and can (figuratively) rage, rage against the dying of the light. He will not go gentle, he will be The Man, the one who so many want him to be. Not me, but so many others.
Pete and Amy can't do much except at least try and be authentic and own what they are, white middle class mid-westerners who mean well, even if they have to little to show for it. Pete should avoid trying to use his sexuality as some kind of bond with African-Americans.
Bernie left Brooklyn to move to Vermont because he couldn’t stand the blacks and wanted to live only with other White people. He wants to turn the US into Norway so first he’s going to kill off all the blacks.
There are only 1,000 black people in Minnesota and Amy Klobuchar locked them all up when she was the District Attorney of Minneapolis.
Joe Biden was a Senator from Delaware for almost 40 years. Delaware was the only slave state in the north. Joe’s family still owned slaves into the 1960s when their head slave, Corn Pop, led a revolt against the Bidens.
Warren taught at Ivy League law schools because they are filled with Rich White People.
I'm sure everyone is aware of the stock market sinking like a lead weight. What/who is to blame?
I'm going with Caronavirus at 50%
Crazy Bernie at fault for the other 50%.
“In a multi-way taking-turns duel, the worst shot should fire in the air until the other guys finish each other off. Then shoot the last guy. It will be your turn.”
Hardin is right about a famous puzzle in game theory, but it isn’t a turn taking game. Not with Super Tuesday so early.
Klobuchar can get noticed by preemptions Bloomberg: she defends capitalism but decries the attempt to buy support. I doubt she does though.
Memo to Biden: Don't forget your keys to the "No Malarkey" bus. You'll be driving it soon.
It will be interesting to see if Biden can even hold it together tonight. Take a look at his latest signs of decline:
https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2020/02/joe-biden-remembers.php
When you watch the first video, look at the crowd behind him. Blank faces, with no enthusiasm.
Pretty spot on assessment, I would say.
It also took me a while, very late in the race (which admittedly I haven’t devoted much attention to) to realize that Warren is not one of the “moderates.” I don’t know why. Could be something about the way she presents herself. Maybe it could be that she reminded me of Hilary in a lot of ways, though I’m realizing now that she’s for a lot of things Hilary would never be for, and that Clinton co-opted some elements of her “leftness” (not directly from Warren) in her presentation during the last election.
Isn't It Time the Media Started Asking Hard Questions About Bernie Sanders' Rape Fantasy Essay?
Money grafs: CNN was quick to the story, with network contributors, including conservative columnist S. E. Cupp and Democratic strategist Steve McMahon, disagreeing Thursday over whether Sanders' little known newspaper scribblings would do harm to his presidential campaign.
Fox News and MSNBC mostly ignored the essay Thursday and Friday.
On the print side of things, the Wall Street Journal and the Washington Post took a pass on the story. The New York Times didn't address the essay until late Friday afternoon.
The New York Post and the New York Daily News, on the other hand, weren't too far behind CNN, with the two newspapers publishing equally unflattering reports on the senator's 43-year-old article.
BuzzFeed and Vox turned out brief write-ups of the story Thursday afternoon.
Some liberal sites, like Salon, even defended Sanders over the article.
Waiting for the NYT to flood the zone with a sober explication of Bernie's old writings in the era of #Metoo.
Still waiting....
Presidential politics meets Survivor. Interested in the goings on and outcome, won't bother to watch. I know and trust that you capable people will let me know all about it, in due time.
If Biden is smart ...
@mccullough, that sure presumes facts not in evidence! Good God, twelve years ago he claimed in his debate with Sarah Palin that Article I of the Constitution described the Executive Branch. (Go look it up if you need to.) Not a biggie perhaps for the likes of you and I, but back then Slow Joe was teaching a seminar on Constitutional La w at Widener Law School. Perhaps I overestimate Professor Althouse. Looking at on Law professors like Larry Tribe, Slow Joe, and former Con Law lecturer Barack Obama, perhaps on Law is where the law schools stash their duds? Hope I’m wrong.
I'm picturing something in the form of an intervention. He needs it. So much damage he has caused.
Hiding fundamental problems with an ideology is - in the end - more disastrous in the long-term.
My predictions are that Warren will not attack Sanders. Bloomberg will try to attack Sanders. Buttigeig will definitely attack Sanders. Amy will attack anyone if she thinks it’ll help her. I suspect Steyer will not put himself forward aggressively and will see which way the wind is blowing. Lord only knows what Biden will try to do, poor guy. Bernie will be his strong and focused self and be concerned with getting across his agenda and how it be positive for the US, not radical. I suspect Warren will be agreeing with him all night.
It will be more complicated than just ganging up on one guy. Biden has been repeating a dubious story about getting arrested in South Africa while going to meet Mandela and he said he worked on the Paris Climate Accord with Deng Xiaoping. He should get hammered on both. Bernie’s praise of Castro’s literacy program should raise the question of whether he approved of Hitler’s construction of the autobahn too.
Warren would help herself and her standing if she would hire a fashion consultant.
There are only 1,000 black people in Minnesota and Amy Klobuchar locked them all up when she was the District Attorney of Minneapolis.
I did read a story that she participated in the railroading of a young black man for a murder he may not have committed. The case was sad enough — a bright twelve year old girl sitting at her kitchen table doing homework was killed by a stray bullet in a gang fight. A black teenager was arrested and convicted but the article claimed that the only witnesses against him were a personal enemy of the defendant and jailhouse snitches, some of whom have since recanted their stories. That’s all I know about the case, but I find it plausible that the police and DA would railroad a young black on nearly no evidence if there is enough public pressure to close the case.
“And Warren would have a much stronger hope of inheriting the presidency, given Sanders's age and recent heart attack.”
Yes, I’ve been saying that but get pushback, some even suggesting Sanders tag Tulsi Gabbard. I’d be shocked if he did that, even though Tulsi was a Bernie supporter in the past. Realistically, Warren would be the best and most logical choice for VP.
stevew said...
Presidential politics meets Survivor. Interested in the goings on and outcome, won't bother to watch. I know and trust that you capable people will let me know all about it, in due time.
2/25/20, 9:41 AM
I feel the same way.
And I never watched Survivor either.
Buttigieg should play it as a gay, happy warrior and focus on policy. Adopt that old Bobby McFerrin song, “Don’t Worry, Be Happy” as his campaign song. That will help position his uncanny resemblance to Alfred E. Neuman as a strength.
Andrew said...
What will be missing in the midst of all the attacks will be a positive and inspiring vision for this country.
2/25/20, 9:22 AM
No, it will be missed [by any that are paying attention] because NONE of those folks on that stage have one.
Burnie just needs to not freak out and have a yelling melt down. Biden needs to just node his head to every question and NOT open his mouth. The rest do need to go after Burnie, which will cause him to freak out.
When he wins anyway, he will pick AOC for his VP...
How do you attack Bernie? Seems pretty easy to me. Wait until he’s all red in the face and waving his arms and his hair is sticking out like it’s on fire, then say “You’re our front runner, Bernie. Try to act presidential.”
No matter what he says next, you say “We don’t need a Democrat Donald Trump.”
“Warren would help herself and her standing if she would hire a fashion consultant.”
That sounds so shallow, how has the way Bernie dresses harmed him?
Since WWII, there have been only two VPs who didn't subsequently run for president: Barkley and Cheney (leaving out the special case of Agnew). Most eventually won nomination: Nixon, Johnson, Humphrey, Ford, Mondale, GHW Bush, Gore (note: LBJ and Ford had ascended to the Oval Office by the time they ran on their own).
The only former VP to run and not win nomination is Dan Quayle. Soon to be joined in this category by Slow Joe.
The VP slot is not a consolation prize, but a valuable stepping stone.
Advice given in all honesty, on the assumption that the Democrats will ignore it:
No, they should all rip the hell out of Bernie. From his rape fantasies, to his lies about Fidel's accomplishments (WaPo gave them 3 Pinocchios in 2016 when Trudeau made them: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2016/12/01/justin-trudeaus-claim-that-castro-made-significant-improvements-to-cuban-health-care-and-education/ to his covering up Fidel's atrocities ("so, apparently Bernie thinks that, say what you will about Hitler, at least he made some really cool Autobahns"), they should be going after the guy in the lead.
Because a lot of Biden supporters may have Bernie as their second choice. But "getable" Bernie supporters won't have Bernie as their second choice.
But the Democrats aren't going to do that. Because:
1: They all want to be Bernie's VP
2: Other than the rape fantasies, they're all on the same page as Bernie. As are the voters they listen to (on Twitter).
And I doubt anyone will go after Biden in earnest. I think it would make them look mean to go after Biden hard.
From the post:
"I'm told Tom Steyer will also be in the
debate. Oh! That is so dull. He does not belong there. I guess he hurts Bloomberg because it is just so ridiculous to have 2 billionaires who've bought their way on to the stage and will be standing there so long after all those governors and senators have slipped away."
I saw a sticker on a Bernie supporter's car that said "BILLIONAIRES SHOULD NOT EXIST." I wonder if Pres Bern will tax them out of existence or if there will be Cuban style firing squads.
One of things I find hysterical about aged, revolutionary hipster, Bernie Sanders is this:
In Feb 1972, he wrote his famous "rape fantasy" newsletter, and basically kept writing these pamphlets from his Vermont cabin for several years, while trying to get a foothold into Vermont politics via the Liberty Union Party -- the socialist party. These 30-something wackos were part of the "Green Mountain Anarchist Collective" (yes, that is their true name).
Wait. Wasn't something big happening in our country between the years 72' -74, capturing all the headlines and the world stage? Yes, it's on the tip of my tongue...Yes, WATERGATE.
So, during the entire turmoil of Watergate, with congressional hearings, and impeachment, and John Dean, and "Saturday Night Massacres", and young attorney Hillary Clinton, fighting the good fight, and young Senator Joe Biden doing his thing, we had future President, Bernie, up in Vermont, toiling away at his silly little newsletter, plotting to become Mayor of Burlington, with his cadre of remote country hippies.
The guy is just lost. It's embarrassing that he's even made it this far.
we are waiting for Inga- the koolaid drinker - to reconcile that notion that both Bernie and Trump are being helped by the RUSSIANS!
Re: A Warren secret alliance with Bernie:
If Warren’s delegates allowed Bernie to avoid the superdelegate second ballot it would save Bernie’s candidacy. But it’s a huge risk for Warren, even with the vice-presidency as an inducement. The DNC mandarins would never forgive her. If the Bernie-Warren ticket was unsuccessful, as seems likely, she’s a pariah.
Realistically, Warren would be the best and most logical choice for VP.
@Inga, normally I just laugh at you, but this time I will be serious. Bernie should not forget that she set him up back in January when she had a private meeting with him, then made the preposterous claims that he said a woman couldn’t win the presidency. A President needs to be able to trust his (or her!) VP, and there is no way Bernie can trust her after that little episode.
“From his rape fantasies...”
Except they weren’t rape fantasies. Sanders wrote an an article about gender roles in our society and was questioning the fantasies of certain people based on their gender roles. He admitted it was poorly written and didn’t defend it. Would Trump have admitted anything that came out about him from his sordid past? No, he would say the women were lying and how he would sue them.
Anyone who adores the corrupt Cuban dictator Castro and the evil destruction created by the corrupt Castro family - should never be president of a free nation.
The big Cuban lie
The problem with attacking Bernie is that any other nominee is going to need the Bernie supporters in the election.
And any aggressive Bernie attackers will be scorned by them as the Dem version of Never Trumpers.
(And the original Never Trumpers -- Kristol, Boot, etc -- trying to now convince the Dems to be Never Bernies only makes it worse for them: unwanted bedfellows that shit the beds).
The hatred of Trump is what made Bernie possible; too late to appeal to reason. Or even simulate it.
I am Laslo.
Nobody on the debate stage tonight needs to go after Biden. He'll sink himself, and so far, he's been enormously successful.
It seems to me that Warren pretty obviously burned bridges with Sanders. But if Sanders were dumb enough to trust her, my expectation is that she'd stab him in the back and use whatever delegates she accumulated in the process of having a "secret deal" with him to steal the nomination.
Crazy Bernie's VP choice is the only conversation that we need to have now.
“Inga, normally I just laugh at you, but this time I will be serious.”
BM, normally I just I consider you an old fart that has lost a few gray cells. I’m quite sure Bernie doesn’t need BM’s advice. I’m quite sure that Bernie and Warren will have ironed out that misunderstanding already. I’m sure Bernie and Warren would put the good of the country before their own hurt feelings.
I guess Bernie once again voiced his love of authoritarian regimes last night.
"China is an authoritarian country becoming more and more authoritarian. But can anyone deny, I mean the facts are clear, that they have taken more people out of extreme poverty than any country in history. Do I get criticized because I say that? That’s the truth. So that is a fact. End of discussion.”
Of course, while it's technically true that in recent years many people have been lifted out poverty in China, the actual reason for it is obviously China's adoption of a limted free market in the so called Special Economic Zones. Of course, Bernie seems to believe that wealth is something that is bestowed upon the citizenry by the Government rather than generated from the bottom up.
“She fantasizes being raped by 3 men”:
Only RUSSIA! RUSSIA! FALSE-GOD FIGURE-HEAD MUELLER MADDOW RUSSIA INGA could say "no rape fantasy there"
Even with the actual words RAPE and FANTASY - right there in front of everyone.
more from Bernie Castro:
" A man goes home and masturbates his typical fantasy. A woman on her knees, a woman tied up, a woman abused.
A woman enjoys intercourse with her man — as she fantasizes being raped by 3 men simultaneously.
The man and woman get dressed up on Sunday — and go to Church, or maybe to their "revolutionary" political meeting. "
These debates are too late in the game, early voting changed the timeline and the debates have not been properly synchronized to the new schedule.In Texas they have been voting since 2/18/20 (a day before the Nevada debate) and California started three days ago.CNN has reported over two million votes already cast in those states.It is my understanding that only Bloomberg and Bernie have major ground games in those states so you have to assume the early votes are to their advantage.
From what I read SC polling shows Steyer taking votes from Biden.
Not a Bernie fan, but once he saw he really could win - he went all in and has created a serious ground game staffed by true believers. Hard to imagine he doesn't get the nomination at this point.
Bloomberg has to align his debate strategy with his ad blitz. The problem for Bloomberg is that he went after Sanders last week and it made Sanders stronger, not weaker. I suspect Warren will continue to go after Bloomberg tooth and nail. Sanders will simply point out that the Bloomberg is trying to literally buy the nomination by bribing one party official after another- this will be extraordinarily effective with actual voters.
There will fireworks and Sanders is likely to benefit from all of it.
I’m sure Bernie and Warren would put the good of the country before their own hurt feelings.
Now I will laugh at you.
"Comments about my deletions are off topic, and I have to delete them. Please stay on topic."
The people responsible for sacking the people responsible for the credits have now been sacked.
“I’m sure Bernie and Warren would put the good of the country before their own hurt feelings.”
“Now I will laugh at you”
And I, you.
"the good of the country" means what to Crazy Bernie, and the Fake Indian? What policies have they been promoting that will be for the good of the country?
"Bernie Sanders began his week by floating one of those ideas that leftists swoon over: free child care and pre-K for all.
The rest of us recoil in horror at the thought of turning our children over to the government indoctrination mill that early.
The only reason Bernie Sanders is where he is right now is because public education’s goal is to churn out obedient little lefties. It’s a mission statement in elementary and high school, then it becomes a dark art form in colleges -- public or private. The Left has been so successful at it that millions of Americans are willing to cede freedom to this raving lunatic because they truly believe he is going to give them free stuff."
-Stephen Kruiser
The problem for the "moderates" is that they have invested a year of their shortening lives in the pursuit of the nomination, so none of them want to drop out and endorse one of the others. And it might not matter anyway- Sanders is the second choice of some of the other candidates, so it isn't the case that Buttuvwxyz drops out with his 10% support and that 10% goes to Biden or Bloomberg- it is likely that 3-4% of it, or more, goes to the frontrunner, Sanders. Same applies to Biden, especially given that Biden's polling support is heavily minority based. Seriously, if Biden isn't in the race, does anyone really think his minority supporters vote for Bloomberg or Buttuvwxyz?
The nightmare scenario for the "moderates" is a situation where, on Super Tuesday, Sanders wins California with 40% of the vote and no other candidate gets to 15%. Same for Texas. Three days ago, I would have thought such an outcome impossible, but then Nevada happened. I suspect that the DNC will change the threshold rule if that happens.
It's a sign of how far the Democrats have gone that the candidates are arguing over who is most against the 2nd Amendment, who has least respect for the Bill of Rights. How can we support such a party?
Didn't come up with this but admire it:
Bernie must be the candidate this year or else in 2024 the Dems, once again, will have to pander to the AOC/Port Huron wannabes of the party. Better to fail now so in four years the Dems can say "Hey, we already tried a Socialist' and be done with it.
DanTheMan said...
For the moserates, Bernie is tomorrow’s problem. If you don’t knock Biden out of the race you don’t get to tomorrow
Nope
Bernie is the Super Tuesday problem. If you don't knock him down before next Tuesday, thanks to the idiotic Democrat Party rules, you may not get any more chances to knock him down.
If Biden wins in SC, then worry about him. Otherwise, he's self destructing all on his won. Bernie is not.
Side note: I will say this for Inga, when it comes to analyzing the Democrat Primary, I have no idea if she's right, but at least here she makes sense.
Inga said...
I’m sure Bernie and Warren would put the good of the country before their own hurt feelings.
2/25/20, 10:16 AM
LOL! Now that right there is comic GOLD! You should take it on the road!
If ANY of those clowns on that stage actually put the good of the country ahead of their own feelings, they would not be running for ANY office, let alone President.
Is this a debate to run for Senate? or some other office?
". He must defend and would do best to appear worthily presidential and above the fray."
Yea, how did that strategy work last time in the Republican debates? Bernie's supporters are after the same thing Trump's were - somebody who is and acts different, a real outsider. Unfortunately, Bernie has lived his life on the inside of the system. He knows nothing but politics. Most voters on all sides are anti-swamp, anti-establishment, but we disagree on where the alternative should take us. The swamp doesn't want Bernie or Trump. They have a tough decision to make. It shouldn't be tough, but for them it is.
Comments about my deletions are off topic, and I have to delete them. Please stay on topic."
The people responsible for sacking the people responsible for the credits have now been sacked.”
I’d say more sackings should happen, as people are now back on how bad the candidate is instead of sticking to the topic as described by Althouse. Even my own comments defending the candidates could be sacked.
“If ANY of those clowns on that stage actually put the good of the country ahead of their own feelings, they would not be running for ANY office, let alone President.”
So that’s what you expect and find acceptable? Whoa, that’s sad.
Blogger Ozymandias said...
Re: A Warren secret alliance with Bernie:
If Warren’s delegates allowed Bernie to avoid the superdelegate second ballot it would save Bernie’s candidacy. But it’s a huge risk for Warren, even with the vice-presidency as an inducement. The DNC mandarins would never forgive her. If the Bernie-Warren ticket was unsuccessful, as seems likely, she’s a pariah.
1: Warren only "controls" the delegates to the extent that she can require them to vote for her in the 1st round. She can't force them to vote for Bernie.
2: This is Warren's last shot at President. And there's nothing the DNC can do to her to get her to lose her Senate seat in MA. So that's not a valid threat
On a different subject: PM points out the thing I've been saying for some time. Of course, my hope is that the Dems "steal" it from Bernie in 2020, so that the Left gets to go more insane for the next 4 years, before getting their candidate, and losing horribly, in 2024.
So the Dems best hope is to let Bernie win the nom, then flush the leftist poison after he performs even worse than Corbyn did in December.
But:
1: 2020 is a "reapportionment year." Getting crushed down ballot this year will cost the Democrats for the next 10 years
2: RBG isn't going to last to 2025. Losing now and winning in 2024 costs them the ability to get their unconstitutional ideas psuhed / validated by the US Supreme Court
Let's see. To be President you have to be native-born and over 35. Perhaps the Democrats have considered everyone in the Country who qualifies and carefully selected the two least appealing and relatable people in the entire cohort for the Sanders/Warren ticket. What other explanation can there be?
So much damage he has caused.
Well that all depends on your perspective now, dunnit?
I don't follow Ann's Warren VP scenario. If Warren stays in to the end, and Bernie doesn't win on the first ballot, doesn't that mean the Super-delegates get to weigh in on all subsequent ballots? So even if Warren plus Bernie equals a majority pre-Supers (which of course assumes that Warren commands her delegates--dubious), won't the Sanders-Warren ticket lose to the, say, Bloomberg-Buttiedge Democrat Establishment ticket on the second ballot?
Inga said...
“If ANY of those clowns on that stage actually put the good of the country ahead of their own feelings, they would not be running for ANY office, let alone President.”
So that’s what you expect and find acceptable? Whoa, that’s sad.
Um, Inga, every single one of the remaining Democrat candidates for President is worthless scum, who will only make the country worse if they get more power.
So yes, if they actually cared about the country, they wouldn't be trying to become President. They're up their for their won personal power, nothing more.
See Bernie "Millionaires are bad! Oh wait, now I'm a millionaire. Billionaires are bad!" Bernie is a typical socialist "leader": Lots of money and perks (private planes, multiple house) for him, nothing for the rest of us peasants.
See Elizabeth Faucahontas Warren, who lied about being a "woman of color" in order to get tenure as a Harvard Law professor, then immediately dropped the claim once it no longer benefited her. While never once acting as a mentor for any of the actual Native American law students
See Joe "payoffs to my family members in exchange for gov't $$$" Biden
Shall I go on?
Cacimbo makes a point that needs to reiterated- the primary states of Super Tuesday have been voting for days now- it is likely that a majority of the people who will vote will have voted in those states by the end of this week. Sanders crushing victory in Nevada is the biggest news story those early voters are going to be seeing, including tonight's debate.
Here is the AP's review of that case I was describing upthread. I misremembered the age of the murder victim -- she was 11 and not 12. The key takeaway:
"[Myon] Burrell, then 16, was arrested only after a tip from an often-used jailhouse informant. During his lengthy legal process, Burrell hired and fired six attorneys as they failed to cross-examine witnesses, pursue alibis or challenge glaring irregularities in the investigation."
"Of course, my hope is that the Dems "steal" it from Bernie in 2020, so that the Left gets to go more insane for the next 4 years, before getting their candidate, and losing horribly, in 2024."
Bernie will be too old to run in 2024. Of course, it's not like there is a shortage of Commies in the Dem party.
Xioaping? Jinping?
Let's call the whole thing off.
I don't see Biden quitting for the good of the Party between Saturday night and Super Tuesday. Maybe his voters will see he's toast, but he won't.
Big Mike said...
How do you attack Bernie? Seems pretty easy to me. Wait until he’s all red in the face and waving his arms and his hair is sticking out like it’s on fire, then say “You’re our front runner, Bernie. Try to act presidential.”
No matter what he says next, you say “We don’t need a Democrat Donald Trump.”
I doubt anything I read today will top this.
Nice work.
"So much damage he has caused." What damage is that, exactly? The damage to Amy Klobuchar's chances? Then Amy Klobuchar should go after Joe Biden. And Elizabeth Warren's best move to position herself as a VP choice may also be to go after Joe Biden.
I keep seeing people claim Buttigieg is a moderate. He is not; he is Sanders-lite. He wants most of the things Bernie wants; he just softens the language by talking about putting the country on a "glide path" to having the feds take over medicine and other industries. He's Bernie without the crazy old man shtick.
FWIW, Steyer received more votes in the Nevada caucuses than Klobuchar.
@Browndog, why thank you very much. Blushing ☺️
It will fall to Bloomberg, Klobuchar, and Biden to go after Sanders. Crazy Bernie's glowing talk about Castro's Cuba provides a good opening for them to establish some credibility as moderates. And a good chance for Biden to convince people he's not already dead. They need to put Sanders on the defensive all night long.
(eaglebeak)
In Mao's Great Leap Forward of 1958-1962, around 45 million Chinese died as a result of government policies. That's one "facts are facts" fact Bernie could be asked about.
Also, compare Cuba's literacy rate, medical/healthcare standards, etc., from the years just BEFORE the Castro Revolution to those rates today.
Oops--turns out Cuba is NOT better off after a zillion years under Castro than it was before the Revolution.
Here's another quick stat: around 4 million Ukrainians starved to death as a result of Soviet policy in 1931-33. That would be Stalin's Holodomor.
We spent our honeymoon in New Hampshire--
Bernie, on the other hand, is full of prunes. Someone should ask him about that.
I do hope, if nothing else, they put Buttigieg and Klobuchar on opposite sides of the stage. They almost came to blows last week.
it doesn't matter, he's just dead man walking, and no one will seriously confront a clear and present danger like sanders, they don't know how or understand why,
it would be better they run ncis reruns for all the good that will do,
most of the field isn't any better, they are just predators in nicer garb,
Ann Althouse said...
I'm trying to redirect this conversation to the content of the post, as explained in my 8:28 comment, so I will delete the comments that are in danger of hijacking the thread. I don't want this to be about how leftism doesn't work or about how Bernie is vulnerable to attacks because of things he's said over the years, etc. etc. All the usual things we've seen over and over.
Whatever. I am glad you are having your fun. I wouldn't expect a Clinton voter to get it. It is historically standard for the intellectual class that support the statists and be the first to be eliminated.
The only good thing about what is going on now is it ensures they all lose.
Every one of these people has promised to confiscate guns, decriminalize illegal immigration, provide free health care to illegals, eliminate all student debt, and ban fracking. The only one of them that condemns Bernie for praising Castro is the overt fascist who banned big soda drinks. wtf?
1. Sanders = War.
2. Warren = War.
3. Buttigieg = War.
4. Bloomberg = War.
5. Steyer = War.
6. Biden = War.
7. Klobuchar = War.
Slow or fast. They all lead to war. People like you and your son can't vote away our freedom just so you can feel better.
This isn't a game. It is not cool. It is not fun to think about.
It should be terrifying. But you don't know what war is like. You haven't seen what happens when these people take over.
bagoh20 said...
Yea, how did that strategy work last time in the Republican debates? Bernie's supporters are after the same thing Trump's were - somebody who is and acts different, a real outsider. Unfortunately, Bernie has lived his life on the inside of the system. He knows nothing but politics. Most voters on all sides are anti-swamp, anti-establishment, but we disagree on where the alternative should take us. The swamp doesn't want Bernie or Trump. They have a tough decision to make. It shouldn't be tough, but for them it is.
The swamp would be very happy with Sanders.
They know he is their tool and will do exactly what they want.
They just know that Sanders will get wiped out in the general and cause the down ballots to lose as well.
Sanders removes the mask.
That is all they are worried about. Their best case would be him winning the presidency.
What is the difference between a "radical moderate" and a "moderate" in this context? No matter who wins, what are the odds this time around that they will select a loser who ran in the primary against them? Maybe they will go for one of the early dropouts to round out an ethnic or gender box, but I just don't see them choosing one who lasted this long running against them.
“ The swamp would be very happy with Sanders”
Not sure I agree. The swamp is connected to the DNC and RNC. They are the establishment grafters. Sanders promises to spread his graft elsewhere.
I consider "the swamp" to be full of Democrats, with a sprinkling of RINOs.
I do hope, if nothing else, they put Buttigieg and Klobuchar on opposite sides of the stage. They almost came to blows last week.
That's a reason to keep them next to each otter, and maybe close the distance between them.
"The VP slot is not a consolation prize, but a valuable stepping stone."
Of course, there's always the chance that the VP becomes president due to the death or resignation of the president. But other than that, being vice president hasn't been much of a stepping stone in recent decades. GHWB is the only president in well over a hundred years to win election as a sitting VP. Before that, I think it was Martin Van Buren! (Then it's Jefferson and Adams, if you care to go back to the beginning.)
Nixon became president eight years after serving as Ike's VP. So it was an electoral stepping stone for both him and GHWB.
However, Biden is on the verge of losing in 2020 as a former two-term VP. Gore also lost as a former two-term VP. Quayle, Mondale, and Humphrey were all single-terms veeps who failed in subsequent bids for the WH. (And it's worth noting that the ones of these who came closest, Gore and Humphrey, already had significant national prominence before becoming VP. So its debatable whether Humphrey in '68 or Gore in 2000 were even better off running as sitting VPs than they would have been without that line on their resumes.)
PM said...
Didn't come up with this but admire it:
Bernie must be the candidate this year or else in 2024 the Dems, once again, will have to pander to the AOC/Port Huron wannabes of the party. Better to fail now so in four years the Dems can say "Hey, we already tried a Socialist' and be done with it.
Agreed, totally. Then or earlier, you have the Democrat Night of the Long Knives, when the Sanders/AOC wing and the Clinton apparat have it out once and for all.
And yes, Sanders-Gabbard. Warren offers nothing but negatives, including her untruthiness and awkwardness and creaky old-woman voice, and he doesn't need her for any reason.
Only better choice than Tulsi Gabbard is another proto-commie, ideally black, who could help win a swing state, like if Van Jones were the governor of Pennsylvania.
Blogger exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...
"Of course, my hope is that the Dems "steal" it from Bernie in 2020, so that the Left gets to go more insane for the next 4 years, before getting their candidate, and losing horribly, in 2024."
Bernie will be too old to run in 2024. Of course, it's not like there is a shortage of Commies in the Dem party.
IIRC, AOC will be 35 in 2024.
BTW, when Rubio actually attacked Trump in a 2016 GOP Primary debate, Trumps numbers went down. "Problem" was, so did Rubio's. So Rubio didn't do it again, and neither did anyone else
Brown Hornet: They need to put Sanders on the defensive all night long.
What they really need, is for the Clinton apparat to pick someone, not necessarily their favorite candidate but perhaps a suitable Kamikaze, and arm them with some kind of heretofore unknown big dirt (FBI files?) on Sanders, which they can spring at the debate, without any opportunity for Sanders to prepare. Buttigieg as the current CIA candidate might also have such a pipeline.
Otherwise if any of the others continue it should be on the basis that Sanders suddenly drops dead and they're there to pick up the pieces.
"appear worthily presidential"
Huh? Bernie?
"Only better choice than Tulsi Gabbard is another proto-commie, ideally black, who could help win a swing state, like if Van Jones were the governor of Pennsylvania."
How about Keith Ellison? I expect he'd pull some weight in Dearborn. Or better yet, Ihlan Omar.
Sanders/Warren ticket?
Please, leftists. I beg of you.
Do it.
I would give Buttuvwxyz and Klobuchar the same lectern just for shits and giggles. However, they should give the two Bidens different ones far apart.
But other than that, being vice president hasn't been much of a stepping stone in recent decades.
VPs may not win, but they always seem to have a clear path to the nomination. Remember, the enemy gets a vote, and usually we alternate parties.
Ken B said...
“ The swamp would be very happy with Sanders”
Not sure I agree. The swamp is connected to the DNC and RNC. They are the establishment grafters. Sanders promises to spread his graft elsewhere.
Sanders has been lying to rubes since at least 2016.
The same people that bought him his lake house will do just as well as Maduro and Castro did.
They want fewer Billionaires, not no Billionaires.
"I'm sure everyone is aware of the stock market sinking like a lead weight. What/who is to blame?
"I'm going with Caronavirus at 50%
"Crazy Bernie at fault for the other 50%."
Coronavirus 100%. Nothing at all to do with Sanders. The people who own our country don't really believe he can beat Trump, (and they'll do all they can to ensure he doesn't get the nomination just to make sure, as witness the apoplectic epithets directed at Sanders by rich news readers and establishment semi-regulars on MSNBC and other corporate media outlets).
How about Keith Ellison? I expect he'd pull some weight in Dearborn. Or better yet, Ihlan Omar.
At this point MN itself may be a swing state. (On that basis Blobuchar might have something to offer.) So you're not wholly full of beans. Hmmm. Omar is too young, too horrid, and an 85 IQ is not what he needs. But Ellison? Hmmm.
Althouse talks about what "moderates" should do.
Are these moderates all moderate enough to refuse to be Bernie's running mate, if asked? If they won't, what does that tell us about moderateness among Dems today?
Robert Cook: "Coronavirus 100%. Nothing at all to do with Sanders. The people who own our country don't really believe he can beat Trump, (and they'll do all they can to ensure he doesn't get the nomination just to make sure, as witness the apoplectic epithets directed at Sanders by rich news readers and establishment semi-regulars on MSNBC and other corporate media outlets)."
I don't often write this, but this is absolutely correct.
Anyone catch Donna "Shalalalalala-my-oh-my!" on TV this morning going ape-s*** over the mere possibility of a Sanders candidacy and what it would mean for dems chances in South Florida?
Pure gold baby. Pure gold.
"Nixon became president eight years after serving as Ike's VP. So it was an electoral stepping stone for both him and GHWB."
Well...not quite. Nixon lost to JFK in 1960, and JFK succeeded Eisenhower as president. He then ran for Governor of California in 1962, but lost. Nixon, at a post-loss press conference, declared he was leaving politics,telling the assembled reporters they would not "have him to kick around anymore."
He did finally win the presidency in 1968, 8 years later.
If there's blood I might watch the curated re-runs!
Joe's gonna be the boxer that went into the ring for four or five too many fights. Getting pounded and pounded and weakly swinging back too many times.
After a while, even in blood sports, the crowd simply can't watch any more.
"Every one of these people has promised to confiscate guns, decriminalize illegal immigration, provide free health care to illegals, eliminate all student debt, and ban fracking. The only one of them that condemns Bernie for praising Castro is the overt fascist who banned big soda drinks. wtf?
1. Sanders = War.
2. Warren = War.
3. Buttigieg = War.
4. Bloomberg = War.
5. Steyer = War.
6. Biden = War.
7. Klobuchar = War.
"Slow or fast. They all lead to war."
Really? All the people you name have espoused all the things you list above? Where? When?
As for them all leading to war, what do you think we've been up to for the past nearly 20 years? And we started the wars.
Regarding political strategy, it's clear: all the Dems will position themselves as moderates--which they are, at best--and will attack Sanders as dangerous and destabilizing. Whoever other than Sanders gains the Democratic nomination will run as the innately unlikable Hillary unsuccessfully tried to do, and as Obama successfully did, as a compassionate change agent who will uphold America's "promise." When they get in office, they'll govern as Obama did, as a faithful guardian of Wall Street, protecting the prerogatives of the financial elites and the military/corporate/intelligence complex, offering the rest of us only platitudes and sawdust.
war against the people, taking everything you ever owned, ultimately the lives, an uncle who died in the florida straights, a distant cousin, who bore the scars of his imprisonment and betrayal by the us government, almost 40 years later, there are others I knew who served a stint in the umap camps In the 60s, im sure it was an attraction they showed bill ayers on his training jaunt in the 60s,
"I'm picturing something in the form of an intervention. He needs it. So much damage he has caused."
The biggest damage for Dems is that he made it harder for moderate governors to enter the race or gain traction.
At this point, it's too late: Bernie has the bro enthusiasm, the faux moderates are weak, and Bloomberg, who has actual skills and accomplishments, is too rich and suspect for most Dem primary voters.
Van Jones? Patrick Devall to the white courtesy phone please. Patrick Duvall?
Not only does Devall share David Axelrod with Obama, Obama often used some of Duvall/Axelrod's lines in 2008. And, he was a governor. From Massachusetts, yah, that's the ticket.
that's on the mark
https://babalublog.com/2020/02/24/fidel-castro-has-done-some-good-things-for-his-people-bernie-sanders-nope-that-was-republican-u-s-sec-of-state-colin-powell-gotcha-more-proof-of-the-devilish-effectiveness-of-the-hist/
Robert Cook said in regards to the stock market: Coronavirus 100%. Nothing at all to do with Sanders.
I think that is correct because the virus is disrupting all the business supply chains involving China.
Of course, the Democrats will blame Trump, but what else is new?
Isn't funny that someone like Bernie, who has never run anything, thinks he can run a government that should run everything. You would think a guy like Bernie, who has avoided real work all his life, would want to head a more lazzy-fair government, maybe one that only works 2 days a week.
Blogger Bob Boyd said...
How is Elizabeth Warren any different than Lori Loughlin?
Lori Loughlin has nice tits.
narciso said...
https://babalublog.com/2020/02/24/fidel-castro-has-done-some-good-things-for-his-people-bernie-sanders-nope-that-was-republican-u-s-sec-of-state-colin-powell-gotcha-more-proof-of-the-devilish-effectiveness-of-the-hist
Colin Powell! Narciso, you've got it, the Ds should draft Powell! Other than "dicking bimbos," which after all was true, he's perfect!
I'd rather live in a country infected with Corona virus than one infected with socialism. Corona doesn't make everyone sick and weak, and the elite are not protected which seems more fair.
"I'm picturing something in the form of an intervention."
I just looked up "intervention script":
Step 1: Open With Affection "Joe, we love you. You've been a stalwart democrat for decades and you have earned a place in all our hearts."
Step 2: Describe Specific Behaviors "You've always been a gaffe machine, but the aggression you've shown caucus goers and reporters is getting out of hand. And your son's prima facie corruption problems have caused all sorts of trouble."
Step 3: Detail the Problems "You're driving away voters and donors. If you stick around, Bernie is going to win the nomination, and that creates all sorts of trouble."
Step 4: Outline Treatment Options "Any one of us will make you Undersecretary of Hair Sniffing. You don't have to retire, you just have to back out of this race."
Step 5: Express Love and Support "We really do love you and want you to be happy."
Optional Step: Set Consequences "Or we'll turn Hillary loose and then you're fucked."
so the cdc's update, isn't terribly helpful, what would they have us do, not venture out, not bring in any products from china, or south korea, or are they going for sphincter twisting terror,
Biden's got no game in south Carolina, and precious little afterwards, so he'll just burn himself out,
There are no moderates in the Democratic debate.
- Sanders is a communist.
- Warren is a straight on socialist at the moment, though she probably would not admit that in public.
- Buttigieg is also a socialist who is trying to pretend he is reasonable, like a gay Obama.
- Biden is so far gone that he is basically whatever his handlers tell him he is. Then again, it was not like he was super principled or coherent when he was younger, so maybe this is just Joe being Joe.
- Klobuchar is a cipher. She is a senator with essentially nothing to recommend her at all. It is not moderate to be a blank slate. It is simply another form of extremism. (Most likely she's also a socialist.)
- Steyer, after his recent announcement, is basically a fascist.
- Bloomberg is an authoritarian with fascist tendencies.
To summarize, two far leftists, one leftist pretending to be moderate, a couple of fascists, a man with diminishing brain functionality who was never that bright to begin with, and some woman from Minnesota whose main features are anonymity and abusing her staff.
And they wonder why I would vote for Trump.
I've been wondering what the caronavirus is having on US Chinese restaurants bottom line (profits).
“Whatever. I am glad you are having your fun. I wouldn't expect a Clinton voter to get it. It is historically standard for the intellectual class that support the statists and be the first to be eliminated.”
Oh my God! This means war! So who is going to eliminate who?
Bernie had a substantial ground game among young hispanics and PoC in Nevada. What does he have elsewhere?
“Slow or fast. They all lead to war."
—————————————-
“Really? All the people you name have espoused all the things you list above? Where? When?
As for them all leading to war, what do you think we've been up to for the past nearly 20 years? And we started the wars.”
He’s referring to a civil war.
Warren doesn’t and won’t have anywhere near the delegates to be relevant in Althouse’s scenario.
Winnie touched on this, but I think the moderators, scripted by the DNC, will dictate things. Watch their questions and who they aim them at to see the Dem establishment’s strategy re Bernie.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Biden surprises in the actual voting, enough to keep him thinking he has a chance and to keep things complicated. After all he came in second in NV, proving there is a powerful low info voter contingent out there.
Bloomberg (whom I detest) is the only differentiable guy on the stage (not thinking his lack of height). He’s the only capitalist on the stage. He also can’t be bested in spending. The others an knock him out by forcing him to look awful again. True, they’ve fired most of their bullets already, but he’s such an arrogant prick with no humor, no personality and, actually very little (no pun intended) presence, the so called moderates can kneecap him fatally if they try. Bernie himself should definitely do this.
On the other hand, the non Bernies may wish not to attack Bloomberg thinking they have a shot at VP with him. In their hearts I believe they know they have no chance of winning. Pete’s campaign is an obvious career step sham. No chance of winning but opens the Overton Window for himself.
Buttigieg / Blagojevich has a nice ring to it.
Why Bloomberg is now becoming increasingly unlikely to be the next President:
NY Post
Bloomberg’s partner tells people to ‘get over’ sexual harassment claims"
(The photo of the decidedly un-trophy-like prospective first consort says a thousand words.)
https://nypost.com/2020/02/25/bloombergs-girlfriend-tells-people-to-get-over-sexual-harassment-claims/
Hot Air
“I’m Sorry, What?” Bloomberg Adviser Hints At Mother Of All Oppo-Research Drops On Bernie
'...CAMEROTA: Look, I hear you but, I mean, it’s still a Democratic primary. You’re still — if you’re trying to avoid the circular firing squad, this is still the circular firing squad if you’re going after another Democrat.
O’BRIEN: But we’ve got a candidate who’s got a better record. We’ve got a candidate who has more governing experience than anybody on that stage. We’ve got a candidate who has risen in the polls because of his track record. Bernie has all of this loopy stuff in his background, saying things like women get cancer from having too many orgasms or toddlers should run around naked and touch each other’s genitals to insulate —
CAMEROTA: I’m sorry, what?
O’BRIEN: — themselves from porn.
CAMEROTA: What?
O’BRIEN: Why has this stuff not been more surfaced? He’s written about women’s rape fantasies. That hasn’t been surfaced. That’s the looney side of Bernie. The policy side of Bernie is he has not been good at immigration, he has not been good on criminal justice reform. He was an avid backer of the ’94 crime bill. He’s bad on guns, bad on immigration. And as a legislator — as a member of the Senate, I think he’s only sponsored seven pieces of legislation; two for post offices in Vermont.'
https://hotair.com/archives/ed-morrissey/2020/02/25/im-sorry-bloomberg-adviser-hints-mother-oppo-research-drops-bernie/
I don’t think Bloomberg can overcome his arrogance. He’s an older man who’s achieved a great deal in the private and public arena. He’s never learned to explain himself and clearly thinks it’s beneath him to do so. He can do snark pretty well, but that’s about it for his communication skill set. I’m not even sure he’s going to try.
"He’s referring to a civil war."
That won't happen. No matter who gets into office, nothing much will materially change. The inertial force of our current system is too great for any president to halt or significantly transform...at least in the short term. Especially given the combined forces in government and outside of government who would resist in the strongest way any changes such as Sanders advocates. Such changes will only happen if and when a tipping point is reached among the populace demanding such changes, and even then, the forces opposed might prevail. We are not a representative republic any longer, but an oligarchy.
That won't happen. No matter who gets into office, nothing much will materially change.
Cook is right. Too many full bellies.
Anyone still supporting Biden at this point, even after the public display of his lack of mental acuity, ought to be described in other terms that fit far better than "moderate." "Low information" would be the kindest. It's impossible to predict how they'll migrate.
"Cook is right. Too many full bellies."
Robert thinks that's a bad thing.
Andrew said...
Those who are suggesting Tulsi as Bernie's VP: Bravo. That's brilliant, and would indeed make the Dem ticket formidable.
Tulsi's problem is that her support is at <1%. Notice that she's not on the stage tonight. If the Democrat primary voters don't want to vote for her as a presidential candidate, why would she magically make Comrade Bernie's candidacy any more palatable to anyone over 40? She looks to pretty to be a Stalin to Bernie's Lenin, but other than being a woman of color not from New England, what does she really bring to the party?
frenchy said...
Anyone still supporting Biden at this point, even after the public display of his lack of mental acuity, ought to be described in other terms that fit far better than "moderate." "Low information" would be the kindest. It's impossible to predict how they'll migrate.
In the South, they'd be described as "Aw, bless their hearts" voters.
Frenchy:
The word is "Acruity" according to Biden.
Inga said...
“Whatever. I am glad you are having your fun. I wouldn't expect a Clinton voter to get it. It is historically standard for the intellectual class that support the statists and be the first to be eliminated.”
Oh my God! This means war! So who is going to eliminate who?
I know you are too stupid to read history so a short lesson.
The progressives/marxists always wipe out the intellectuals.
Happened dozens of times already. Look at the college campuses and the violent little shits at every one.
We all remember Inga and thousands of leftists telling Scalise he should stop supporting the second amendment after he got shot by the Bernie bro.
tcrosse said...
That won't happen. No matter who gets into office, nothing much will materially change.
Cook is right. Too many full bellies.
There will be millions of us fighting.
There will be many more millions watching from their couch.
It has always been that way.
But my daughters will not grow up in a country destroyed by the same movement that created Cuba and Venezuela.
These people would rather have Castro in power than Trump.
They will not have power over me or my family.
Ever.
pol pot aka saloth sar, was the most obvious example, he was a French educated philosopher, as was abimael guzman, the leader of the shining path, who wanted to replicated the khmer path, mao sent the intellectuals into the fields, including xi's own father, the counter revolutionary campaign, the cultural revolution came later.
It seems like Buttigege should be nice to that old man Sanders so he can angle for a VP spot. All it takes during the general election is for Bernie to have angina or another heart related attack and it's all over. At least with a young guy on the ticket it shows the electorate you are thinking ahead.
It feels like Bernie is in a Trump situation; his goal is to make sure as many of the not-Bernies as possible last as long as possible so they continue to sabotage each other.
Achilles is frustrated beyond sanity. Can you imagine going to combat to save the US from Muslim terrorists and end up making more of them which led to further destabilization death destruction and refugees. None of it his fault. He and his brother's gave everything and it was worse than squandered. Trillions and trillions down the shitter engorging ravenous corporations, chieftains, functionaries and political hacks. It's tragic we didn't listen to Robert Cook and his anti-war comrades back in '02 and '03.
I can totally see how Achilles thinks that going to war against the deep State and globalists would be righteous and atonement for his dead and broken brothers. It's more likely that he will suffer in grumpy desperation lashing out at windmills on blogs. I'm sure his wife and kids bring him back to sanity every day after he rants about the millions ready to take up arms and start an actual shooting war.
After Ruby Ridge and Waco, there was lots of similar talk. Remember G Gordon Liddy advising his listeners to aim for the heads of the jack booted thugs because Kevlar.
Achilles is so stupid he doesn’t realize how foolish he is to make threats of civil war. Does he think that his daughters and the children of millions of Americans wouldn’t be negatively affected by a civil war of his choice? Speaking of history, very recent history actually, look at Syria, take a lesson dumbass.
“There will be millions of us fighting.”
Dorsey always helpful
one can be a field organizer for sanders, in iowa or south Carolina, and they can extol the gulag, and the majority press will remain utterly silent,
https://twitter.com/mrctv/status/1232372187732103170
Althouse shows there could be a strategy, it only requires that some Dem politicians sacrifice their egos and even that only for a short while. But they'll never. Look at Biden, announcing last night that he's running for Senator. Under pressure his mind slips and yet he won't step back and no one is intervening. The debate probably will be interesting, anyhow. I wonder if they'll bring up the corona virus - would you maintain open borders in the face of a pandemic? And I want to see if Bloomberg can sort of recover. I don't require real people doing difficult things to get everything right every time - just better be some improvement.
After Ruby Ridge and Waco, there was lots of similar talk. Remember G Gordon Liddy advising his listeners to aim for the heads of the jack booted thugs because Kevlar.
Ask then grand jurors of northern Idaho about how they feel. They would love to get their hands on Lon Horiuchi, the sniper who killed Vicki Weaver as she held her baby, or the US Marshall that shot Randy weaver's 12 year old son and his dog.
You lefties had it pretty good with Clinton. Kill 50 women and kids at Waco and blame Rush Limbaugh.
The term "jack booted thugs": was coined by John Dingell, a life member of the NRA, back when Democrats cared about normal people.
I never voted for Clinton, Doc. In those days I attended a couple militia meetings and other events about Waco and the intentional FBI fire hosted by the local right wing radio station. I actually have empathy for Achilles desire to fix the problem by any means necessary.
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