December 7, 2019

"There appears to be an emerging consensus that the impeachment of Donald Trump won’t matter very much in November, 2020."

John Cassidy writes in "Impeaching Donald Trump Is Already a Win for Democrats" (The New Yorker), and I note the weasel words "appears" and "emerging" and the lack of specificity about the set of persons who are coagulating into this consensus.

Is he looking entirely at those who are hoping to steel the Democrats to get through this next phase?
“Impeachment will eclipse all for the next seven weeks. And then it will recede, and other events will supersede it as the election year moves on,” David Axelrod, the CNN commentator and former adviser to Barack Obama, commented in a Twitter thread on Thursday. 
That's already clearly untrue. Impeaching isn't eclipsing all. Just yesterday, the impeachment was eclipsed by good economic news, an act of violence, and Trump talking about toilets. If you can't even get the next day right, your assurances about the next year sound like made-up happy talk.
In a Times Op-Ed, Michael Tomasky, the editor of Democracy, wrote, “I will bet you dollars to doughnuts that when we pore over the exit polls next Nov. 4, impeachment itself will have been a minor factor in people’s voting, let alone the question of how many articles the House passed.”
Dollars to doughnuts? Is that anything like malarkey? I'm going to guess that Michael Tomasky is over 70, because I'm almost 70 and I've only ever heard "dollars to doughnuts" from people who seemed really old to me. I looked. He's 59. I'm going to assume he's adopting a cornball, folksy style because he's knows it's a con.
Axelrod and Tomasky are shrewd and experienced observers....
No, they're not shrewd and experienced observers. They're shrewd and experienced participants in political discourse, manipulators of opinion. They're not prognosticating because they're trying to get it right. They're trying to affect what happens and what people think.
[Ezra Levin, the co-founder and co-executive director of the Indivisible movement] said that he wasn’t making any predictions about the outcome. But he added, “It was vital to demonstrate that elections do have consequences and that the Democrats will use their power to stand up to Trump.” If Pelosi and her colleagues had refused to launch an impeachment process, Levin went on, “it would have been enormously demoralizing for all these people who were newly engaged after 2016.”

This argument seems incontrovertible.
So a failure to impeach would be remembered. Cassidy praised Axelrod and Tomasky as "shrewd and experienced observers" because they recognize that "the news agenda moves rapidly these days" and that voters are interested in health care and the economy — things other than the impeachment. But somehow it's "incontrovertible" that the impeachment is crucial to the Indivisible movement, about which Cassidy says nothing other than that it "has more than five thousand affiliated local groups." Wikipedia makes it sound like one of these efforts to have a Tea Party of the left.

Cassidy says:
I suspect [this incontrovertible argument] is why Pelosi ultimately came around to supporting impeachment, despite the reservations of some House Democrats who represent purple districts. (That and the fact that Trump’s abuse of Presidential power in pressuring Ukraine to dig up dirt on his domestic political opponents was so egregious.) 
Ha ha. I love the parenthetical. I'm imagining Cassidy panicking after he wrote that Pelosi went forward with impeachment for the purely political reason of appeasing the left wing of her party. What a pathetical parenthetical!
Now the local activists who have spent three years opposing Trump can watch the House Judiciary Committee file articles of impeachment against him. When the process moves to the Senate, in January, they will be the ones demonstrating outside the offices of Republican, and, if necessary, Democratic senators and pressing them to convict the President....
Yeah, that will be a good look for the Democrats going into the elections. Trump haters demonstrating in the streets, clamoring for conviction, making your supposedly law-based trial look unfair and hot-headed.

And Trump supporters know how to show up in droves.
[N]one of this means that the impeachment process couldn’t end up alienating some independent voters who believe Trump’s misdeeds don’t rise to the level of impeachable offenses, or who think Congress should let voters determine his fate next November. That may happen. And an impeachment trial will certainly fire up pro-Trump activists as well.
That's the penultimate sentence and it's packed with concessions I would pillory Cassidy for failing to make. Here's the last paragraph, which begins with "But..." and has Cassidy adopting Ezra Levin's pitch as his own:
But these threats have to be balanced against the imperative of maintaining an energized front against Trump going into an election year. As a disruptive insurgent who eagerly fans social and racial resentments, he has always had an enthusiastic base—that isn’t going to change. One of the big challenges for Democrats—or anybody else opposed to Trump—is to nurture and sustain a nationwide countermovement that is at least equally passionate and engaged. From that perspective, as Levin pointed out, impeachment is already a win.
Premature celebration of a win... that's so reminiscent of 2016, when Hillary trounced Trump.

128 comments:

tim in vermont said...

This reminds me of the when Mullah Omar, hoping to improve relations with the United States, asked bin Laden to cut out the terror attacks. bin Laden told him “I have this one operation we have been working on, and my people will be dispirited if we cannot carry it out,” and Omar said “OK, just this one.”

Did they interview New Gingrich for this?

Lincolntf said...

This impeachment effort has never been anything but a political stunt, as everybody with half a brain recognized from the outset. If the same raving idiots who were sure that Kavanaugh was a serial rapist, Trump would destroy the economy and those Covington kids were horrible racists are sure that Trump that should be impeached, that's fine. History records idiocy as well as accomplishment.

David Begley said...

I’m still not convinced Nancy has the votes in the House. But I am sure that the Senate trial is going to be a massive victory for Trump.

His lawyers will carve up the witnesses. Can you imagine what a good lawyer would do with Hunter Biden?

People are already bored with this Ukraine stuff and the good performances by Trump lawyers will be the news.

On CNN yesterday they rolled out 90 year old Slade Gordon of WA. That ancient Swamp creature was all in favor of impeachment and thought a number of GOP Senators would vote to convict.

tim in vermont said...

Interesting though that Axelrod doesn’t seem to think that any swing district voters will notice that the Democrats explicitly disavowed that they were running to impeach Trump last time around and went back on their word. I think he’s wrong leading Democrats though get the press to write whatever the target of their stories, in this case the swing district Congressmen, need to believe for whoever is leading this party to get what they want at the time.

In five years if the shoe is on the other foot, they will just say, “yeah, we were wrong then” if anybody brings it up but mostly they will shun anybody who tries to point it out. viz #M3TOO and Bill Clinton.

tim in vermont said...

"History records idiocy as well as accomplishment.”

They plan to be the ones writing the history same as they are in charge of the “first draft."

The Bergall said...

Must suck when all your thoughts are consumed by this..........

tim in vermont said...

" As a disruptive insurgent who eagerly fans social and racial resentments, he has always had an enthusiastic base—“

Always accuse the Republicans of whatever it is that you are doing.

Hagar said...

All week (and the one before) the impeachment news in the Albuquerque Journal have been on Page A4 or 5 along with the obituaries.

What I hear at the barbershop is that it is beginning to dawn on some devoted Democrats that the new all-Democrat legislature and administration have voted in a slew of new taxes and regulations, and are grasping for yet more.

tim in vermont said...

"that the new all-Democrat legislature and administration have voted in a slew of new taxes and regulations, and are grasping for yet more”

Wait untill they start the gun grabbing in VA.

Tom T. said...

"One of the big challenges for Democrats is to nurture and sustain a nationwide countermovement that is at least equally passionate and engaged."

He's impliedly conceding that the Democratic presidential campaigns have failed to do so.

AllenS said...

Skylark said...
Wait untill they start the gun grabbing in VA.

Wait until the gun owners say "make my day".

tim in vermont said...

"One of the big challenges for Democrats is to nurture and sustain a nationwide countermovement that is at least equally passionate and engaged.”

You don’t think that they are abusing their power for political ends?

Ron Winkleheimer said...

As a disruptive insurgent

Trump is a disruptive insurgent. We elected him because of that, and its why the Democrat party is so desperate to oust him.

As for impeachment, as a Trump supporter I can only say, you gots to be kidding me.

William said...

It is an existential threat to our democracy to investigate Hunter Biden. Trump must be impeached.

Jeff Brokaw said...

Stupid is as stupid does.

These people are all idiots, unaware of the righteous anger within people like me that they created and continue to stoke every day with every stupid word out of their stupid mouths.

They have NO idea.

Keep talking, dumbshits.

stevew said...

They keep saying what Trump did was egregious, most adding so to it, but I can't ever uncover the so egregious parts. What strikes me as so egregious is this ginned up impeachment sham.

Quayle said...

It seems to me that all the pieces are set up or are falling into place for Donald Trump to make a devastatingly simple argument in the next election. “I fought for you, the little guy, and all they did the entire time was try everything possible to stop me because we are threatening their power and their corrupt money-flow - the big gravy train.”

And if the Dems aren’t careful this is an argument they could play in the inner cities. Which is why I predict the Dems are going to have to turn back to topics around race.

tim in vermont said...

And twitter forces a guy to delete a screencap of the Pensacola terrorist’s tweet of his motives.

Lincolntf said...

Nothing terrifies and enrages the Left like a thriving economy. A black man with a good job is the Democrats worst nightmare, and currently, we have the lowest minority unemployment rate in generations. That is some scary shit for Leftists. They are and will continue to be panicked.

Shouting Thomas said...

The flips from the Dems over the past 3 years are fascinating:

They have moved from calling Trump crazy for saying he was spied on during the campaign, to saying the spying was fine and he had it coming.

And, now, Schiff has employed the same spying techniques on Nunes and Giuliani... and that's OK!

whitney said...

What's weird is impeachment doesn't Eclipse anything. Outside of the media bubble nobody cares. I have had not one conversation or even heard anyone allude to it anywhere in real life. Outside The Hive and a few comment boards it doesn't exist

Shouting Thomas said...

I have had not one conversation or even heard anyone allude to it anywhere in real life.

Neither have I, but I'm not sure that's indicative of anything.

I think most people probably look at this the same way I do. I can rant politics on FB and online 24/7/365, so why bring that shit to social or business events? It's been a long time since I talked politics face to face with anybody, and I think that's a good thing.

The only exception I can think of is... I had a proctological exam six months ago. My doctor has TDS. He has magazines with screeching TDS headlines on his coffee table in reception. He tried to talk impeachment with me while he had a finger up my butt. I declined and said I'm not interested... in politics, that is.

Dan from Madison said...

Whitney at 7.27am - excellent observation.

Andrew said...

A waitress at my favorite cafe, who never mentions politics, had an outburst when impeachment showed up on TV. "I wish they'd leave the man alone and let him do his job!" The few people sitting at the counter all agreed with her.

Tank said...

I'm digging this new thing at Althouse: throw up a couple of meaty posts, go for an INSANE morning run (Althouse, not Tank), come back and post some more later. Good stuff.

narciso said...

Cassidys gig is supposed to be economics, so hes branched into other areas of category error.

Bob Boyd said...

"One of the big challenges for Democrats is to nurture and sustain a nationwide countermovement that is at least equally passionate and engaged.”

Dems don't need to nurture and sustain this mob. It's self-sustaining via media and social media. They are now struggling to appease it.

Original Mike said...

"Impeaching Donald Trump Is Already a Win for Democrats"

These people aren't even hiding the fact that this is just politics for them. Disgusting.

Hagar said...

I also think the State government as well as the City and County are way over-promised on all the services and "stuff" they are going to provide. The new taxes are not going to be sufficient for all that; they are going to need more.
Also I think the bonanza they are expecting to collect from the new discoveries in the oil patch is likely to be disappointing; especially since a lot of it is dedicated to their programs to put oil drilling and mining of whatever kind out of business.

Darrell said...

Democrats accomplished one thing--
I will never vote for a Democrat again.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Althouse said They're not prognosticating because they're trying to get it right. They're trying to affect what happens and what people think.

The MSM in a nutshell!! Hah... another old folksy saying :-)

The driving force of the media, which is mostly dominated by liberals and out and out Democrat operatives, is not to report the news. Not to present facts and allow the readers to draw their own conclusions. Not to inform, but to manipulate.

The subtle use of weighted terms, adjectives and other language that evokes emotion. All used to manipulate people into thinking what THEY want you to think.

Young people who have not been trained to use critical thinking skills and who were not taught principles of writing or language are often just buying into the mantras that are being ladled onto their trays; like prisoners in a chow line who have no choice but to eat the slop that is being served. Hook...line...sinker....(Old saying again. This is fun)

To quote George Orwell 1946 "Political language... is designed to make lies sound truthful and murder respectable, and to give an appearance of solidity to pure wind."

MattL said...

If you don't think that it's egregious to use the power of the United States to investigate potential crimes and misdeeds by a Democrat, well, then you're just a racist who's a threat to the Republic!

Shouting Thomas said...

I also discount the notion that Trump is winning because the Democrats are impeaching.

And, I'm a Trump supporter.

I think both sides are engaging in wishful thinking and nobody knows where this is leading.

Darrell said...

2019 Media exists to mislead and misinform public opinion.
Prove me wrong.

Kevin said...

Shorter article: Sometimes when you win, you really lose, and sometimes when you lose, you really win, and sometimes when you win or lose, you actually tie, and sometimes when you tie, you actually win or lose.

gilbar said...

"Impeaching Donald Trump Is Already a Win for Democrats"

so, let me see; if i've got this right?
They're saying that by election, impeachment won't be on peoples minds, and won't matter
AND!
They're saying that that makes it "a Win for Democrats"?

Not, a wash* for democrats; not won't hurt democrats; but, will be: a WIN?
not being hurt by your actions, makes them 'a Win'? hmmmm?

a wash* means the same thing as: Dollars to donuts, since donuts cost about a buck each

rehajm said...

The fact these agitprop articles are talking about impeachment as complete is suspicious. More of that second order manipulation. The verbiage is suspicious too. Nancy has the votes but will they actually use them? I’m not so sure. Fantasizing about protests in the halls of the Senate is gratifying for lefties but the leftie bad actors stonewalling subpoenas in the trial won’t be good optics. Will any of the major perps be held in contempt?

Let’s not get ahead if ourselves...

Rusty said...

"Wait untill they start the gun grabbing in VA."
The various county sheriffs in VA are considering deputizing tens of thousands of gun owning citizens.
Action-reaction.
Gun owners stand in the way of a peaceful socialist coup.

Michael K said...

The driving force of the media, which is mostly dominated by liberals and out and out Democrat operatives, is not to report the news.

Did you notice that Insty's link to the Pensacola terrorist story is to a British newspaper ?

I haven't looked at the LA Times yet but I'll bet the motive is a mystery.

Browndog said...

Axelrod is no dummy.

He may be signaling to democrats to hide/run from impeachment while campaigning, knowing it's a losing issue.

The problem is, the entire point of this impeachment is to create a campaign issue to hurt Trump.

I don't think the reality of impeachment has set in for many people. It will. When it does, a seething anger will set in for a substantial portion of the populace that may be permanent.

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

CNN Will forever be the Clinton News Network.

Zucker is a partisan hack. It's not a news organization, it's a hack outlet for propaganda for The Party.

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

Democrats can use the Constitution to wipe their asses. CNn and MSNBC echo the charmin.

tim in vermont said...

Do you think that Trudeau’s jaw fell to the floor when he saw Canada had lost 77K jobs? Critically, two weeks before the election, they came out with a number showing Canada had gained jobs, but the election is over now, eh?

rhhardin said...

Dollars to doughnuts was back when doughnuts were a nickel.

Doughnuts make my brown eyes blue.

narciso said...

The daily mail is an odd creature, it sonetimes trawls the garbage chuck gets off on, but its the voice of the people on issues like the climate scam and immgration.

Its irationsl on race issues amd or gund in the american context

rehajm said...

Dollars to doughnuts is poppycock! Claptrap! Balderdash!

23 skidoo!!!

tim in vermont said...

Obviously, if they think that they need this issue to drive voter turnout among Democrats, they know it will also have the power to drive turnout among Republicans and probably suspect that it will turnoff independents.

ST is right, this is a crap shoot, but Nancy might keep her job, it’s hard to know. The other complete unknown is a Republican president getting support from black Americans unseen in a long long time. That’s a wildcard that could matter or not matter, but it’s going to be hard to win PA without solid black support to overcome the rural voters who will be voting bread and butter on the jobs issue.

‘Yeah you’ve got jobs now, but forget about the past, we are going to give you better ones” seems to be the Democrat pitch. And you know they are going to continue pushing a recession, I saw USA Today a week ago talking about the dim future for American workers.

narciso said...

Irrational on guns, the times and the post seem to agree with the shooter and his posse.

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

The corrupt left - top down from the nexus of Brennan-Hillary to Strozk and his insurance policy, (being played out by Nancy) and the anti-democratic Adam Schitt - the real treason IS the Democrat Party and its support of this very damaging stunt.

stevew said...

"I also discount the notion that Trump is winning because the Democrats are impeaching."

Agree with that. Trump's winning because, among other things, the state and health of the economy, jobs, improved foreign relations, lowering of the trade deficit, and bringing troops home. Impeachment strengthens his support in his base, and brings in some moderate like me to vote for him.

Oh, and what news from our southern border - haven't heard anything reported in quite some time.

Charlie Eklund said...

Despite the predictions I’ve seen that the House Democrats don’t have the votes to impeach Trump and send impeachment to the Senate for trial where this disaster will blow up in the collective face of the Democratic Party, I am going out on a limb to predict that this is exactly what will happen. Why is that? Because the two most hostile and self-destructive forces in America today are Democratic voters and their elected representatives. Neither of these forces has the slightest degree of self-control, even where political survival is concerned. Let impeachment be the wheel upon which the Democrats are finally broken.

narciso said...

Ah tomasky fmrly of the village voice and the guardian, now at the basilisk.

Ray - SoCal said...

It’s tiring to read an article, and try to figure out the 5 W’s of the article:

Why was the article written?

- To change the view on impeachment to a nothingburger.

What was the reason?

- impeachment is polling terrible for democrats
- swing district representatives that vote for it may pay a political cost, but that may be reduced if it’s a Nothing burger
- Trump / Gop ads on impeachment are having an impact
- reduce the rage of the core Democratic voters when impeachment foes not have the impact they were promised, or reduce the pressure to have an impeachment vote?

When:
Right before the impeachment vote

Who wrote this?

- what is their political background, have they written lots of anti trump stuff?

Where did this appear?
New Yorker that swings left

narciso said...

Cassidy is their economics correspondent, most recently he ventured in foreign affairs with the khashoggi matter.

Chris N said...

Cassidy’s beat is supposed to be economics, but he’s probably really there because he’s sufficiently Left and maybe British when everybody was hiring Brits and he can write and he knows some things about economics.

If you want to curate good writing and the arts without all the Leftwing ideology papering over good writing and the arts, you’re probably gong to have to get rid of Remnick and all the people selecting around Leftwing ideology at the New Yorker.

I’d rather ideologues howl about doctrinal purity, blame all the problems of the world on the ‘oppressor’ and eat each another out in the woods.

Trump’s got problems for me, but against identitarians and radicals co-opting institutions they never respected in the first place, he has my support. Thanks for taking the heat, Donny.

n.n said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
narciso said...

Facts not in evidence,

Leland said...

I typically hear "I bet you dollars to donuts" when someone is trying to pass off an opinion as fact.

Anyone, I've seen several articles trying to buck up the Democrat base for impeachment. This one looks like another one. I oppose impeachment, but once the Democrats pull the trigger on it; there is no longer "obstruction of justice" when Trump defends himself by declassifying documents. I suspect that is why mouthpieces like 538 are making claims like this: "The basic sentiment is that the president is being railroaded. But the reality is that when it comes to impeachment, there aren’t any protections for the president laid out in the Constitution."

The President has lots or protections laid out for him in the Constitution, and they'll be brought up during the Impeachment, just like they are being reviewed by SCOTUS right now. Even RBG has reined in Pelosi's efforts to get Trump's pre-Presidential tax returns by claiming oversight.

n.n said...

those Covington kids were horrible racists

Those Covington kids were BLM activists. Baby Lives Matter. Rabid diversitists.

Kavanaugh was a serial rapist

We can empathize with the uncorroborated testimony of one of her/his victims that s/he may have been... was a rape-rapist.

The political climate models are running hot with progressive perturbations forcing anomalies.

Temujin said...

I love the phrase "shrewd and experienced observers". I mean...aren't each one of us who regularly mutters something in these posts also shrewd and experienced observers? (well...some of you anyway). It's not like you need a Journalism! degree to be a shrewd and experienced observer of such things.

And there's the added plus of the last 20 years showing us just how the professional class of shrewd and experienced observers are not shrewd at all. If there ever was an illustration of groupthink, they are it. But they are experienced in the fine art of peddling a message. Massaging a message. Moving a message forward.

And sometimes, when it's becoming clear that they are about to hit an iceberg, saying aloud that they asked the Captain to turn the ship ahead of time. If only the Captain had listened.

Rory said...

"Indivisible"

Why do they keep choosing words that define fascism?

Bay Area Guy said...

There's an emerging consensus that John Cassidy is a delusional Leftwing Fuckhead.

narciso said...



Yes we can reasonably surmise:

https://www.newyorker.com/contributors/john-cassidy

PB said...

Democrats are destroying the seriousness of impeachment.

narciso said...

As you can see hes been wrong at every step so he keeps digging

Chris N said...

And what’s with these all these maroons asking around about Biden’s kid?

Joe used to work every street corner and every saloon after The War around the time of The Pecksniff Mine Safety And Fair Labor Act.

Sure he got handsy with the gals, and sure he liked the look of himself a little too much, but he fought for YOU!

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

One thing the corrupt left have revealed -- there are some really amazing unsung heroes and stars in the GOP. (soon to be smeared by the Nazi brownshirt left)

Gaetz gets it.

anti-feminist hag cannot raise her hand when asked a direct question. heh.

Sebastian said...

"other events will supersede it"

You mean, like, a booming economy?

"alienating some independent voters"

So, Althouse, have they lost you yet?

Or are you just fisking for the hell of it?

MountainMan said...

“Wait untill they start the gun grabbing in VA.”

A good number of counties have passed 2nd Amendment sanctuary resolutions. The sheriff of Culpepper Co. said yesterday he is prepared to deputize “thousands” of residents if necessary to take advantage of law enforcement exceptions in proposed legislation.

Howard said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Chris N said...

A booming economy but a huge deficit. A lot of unsustainable rot in D.C built up over a long time. A culture and educational system which drifted away from civics and towards social studies. Ever more freedom and inclusion but less and less of it making much sense and nearly everybody upset over the rules. A long low tide

A crude populist President saying all kinds of shit (ineffective Congress and over inflated Presidency and more and more people fighting over less and less that matters) and even worse options on the other side. Both parties infighting as much as out with warring factions and coalitions.

I’m not sure where this leads either. Each of us holding an oar.

Ann Althouse said...

"A waitress at my favorite cafe, who never mentions politics, had an outburst when impeachment showed up on TV. "I wish they'd leave the man alone and let him do his job!" The few people sitting at the counter all agreed with her."

Great anecdote, but where did this happen? In the heart of Trump country?

Fernandinande said...

"dollars to doughnuts"

I've always liked that saying, but changed it to "I'll bet you donuts to dollars" to give impression that a donut costs more than a dollar nowadays.

And for normal people, they almost do: 58 and 1/3 cents each not including taxes and applicable fees.

Ann Althouse said...

I'm digging this new thing at Althouse: throw up a couple of meaty posts, go for an INSANE morning run (Althouse, not Tank), come back and post some more later. Good stuff."

Ha ha. That's the pattern when the sunrise is after 7 and the early sunset has me going to bed before 9 and getting up at 3. This will change when the days lengthen again. I do like this pattern, but when the sunrise is around 5, the run will probably come first (especially since the sunset is so late, and I won't be going to sleep so early).

Howard said...

Nothing is more serious than impeachment over a blow job. Given the difference in presidential approval ratings this impeachment seems to be working better for the Democrats than the Republicans did on Clinton who had near record 2/3 approvals.

Gunner said...

Tomaskey is most famous to me for being the choad who call Mitt Romney racist for speaking with the NAACP in 2012 because he didnt kiss their butt with liberal bromides like the Dems do.

rcocean said...

The Impeachment is a bloody bore. Its bad political theater. Again, Mitch and his gang should be cutting this short, instead of playing their usual Pompous Senators Take Things Very Seriously roles. Of course, we know that when this is over, Pelosi and the D's will just move on to another attack on Trump.

narciso said...

Yes but hes been stupid for a long time, before the interwebs i bought the village voice, know your enemy.

M Jordan said...

Axelrod’s crafty. He doesn’t hyperventilate like, say, Joe Scarborough, but he eases the dagger in like the family doctor checking your prostate (simile built on a metaphor. Cool, huh?). Althouse is right, he and Cassidy and really 98% of the media are in the business of shaping news, not reporting it. But in the Trump arena, this doesn’t work. It’s like a snake charmer playing his flute to a buffalo. The music seduces no one and least of all the buffalo.

rcocean said...

Of course the D"s have the votes. They wouldn't have gone this far without them. The D's vote in lockstep, they're Pelosi Robots. The "Moderates" are only moderate, when they campaign in their home districts. I note that Independent (former R) Amash is voting for Impeachment. Just one more reason he's a complete fraud.

Seeing Red said...

Oh I’m angry and this isn’t “going away.”

2016 was my crawl across broken glass to vote against Evita.

Now after 3 years of this Bullshit...

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
rehajm said...

impeachment over a blow job

Clinton wasn't impeached over a blow job. He committed perjury to a grand jury, encouraged perjury of witnesses, bribing witnesses, and making false and misleading statements to witnesses

...and there was evidence of it, not hearsay and mind reading...



Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

"news" attempting to manipulate what people think.

hmmm. there's a word for that.

Clyde said...

My guess is the that it will prove a Pyrrhic victory at best for the Democrats.

Francisco D said...

Dollars to doughnuts was back when doughnuts were a nickel.

When I was a kid, you could get a dozen donuts for 77 cents at a shop under the Howard Street El station.

JayDee77 said...

No way after yesterday's jobs numbers is Nancy going to get enough Trump district dems to walk the plank in similar Obamacare fashion knowing that it leads to complete optics disaster in the Senate. No way.

Ken B said...

“Dig up dirt” is a tell. It was not said by anyone except hostile journalists.

Annie C. said...

Nothing is more serious than impeachment over a blow job. Given the difference in presidential approval ratings this impeachment seems to be working better for the Democrats than the Republicans did on Clinton who had near record 2/3 approvals.

Howard, as you know, it was perjury and suborning perjury. However, in the era of # metoo, a blow job from a subordinate is cause for firing, shaming and expulsion from society. So take your pick.

pacwest said...

I think the Democrats efforts would have been better spent trying to wreck the economy and starting a nuclear war somewhere.

Michael K said...

Given the difference in presidential approval ratings this impeachment seems to be working better for the Democrats than the Republicans did on Clinton who had near record 2/3 approvals.

Hope springs eternal but hope is not a strategy. Interesting that WaPoo published a column by Marc Theissen warning Democrats about consequences. I didn't read it as I don't subscribe but the headline suggested they should worry.

Clinton had a fawning press while Trump faces 98% hostile press. Clinton got a pass as the economy was good. He got out of town just before it collapsed and Osama rewarded his indifference to terrorism in Africa and the Cole.

Amadeus 48 said...

Cassidy is flailing because impeachment is failing.

Shouting Thomas said...

Speaking of blowjobs, Glory Hole Howard:

How did last night's visit to the club go? Did you score again?

BUMBLE BEE said...

Results of the meeting in the men's room confirm.

Ken B said...

Howard,
Can you point to the impeachment resolution about the blow job? I can only find the ones for perjury and obstruction of justice. The price is higher on eBay if you sell them as a complete set.

Iman said...

November 4, 2020. I can hardly wait for that fateful day.

Bob Smith said...

Election night 2016. Before the polls closed. An almost universal quote from “the experts”. “Hillary Clinton appears headed for victory. All the polls show her in the lead.” Or some variation. The we have with “experts” is there are never professional consequences for them when they are wrong.

chuck said...

Participation trophies all around.

Seeing Red said...

That “blow job” turned into the MeToo movement and exposed 23 flights on the Lolita Express.

And Hillary knew and supposedly also visited the New Me Ivan ranch.

His Butler who had the black book is dead. And we also had that charming portrait of Clinton that Epstein had done and hanging in his house.

The House looked prescient at this point. Open the Impeachment files.

Iman said...

“ especially since a lot of it is dedicated to their programs to put oil drilling and mining of whatever kind out of business.”

Collusion with Putin and Russia right there!

Iman said...

All this talk of dollars and donuts has me jonesing for a hearty breakfast. Thanks for that.

Andrew said...

@Ann Althouse,
"Great anecdote, but where did this happen? In the heart of Trump country?"

In a suburb of Columbus, Ohio. The city of Columbus, especially being both the state capital and a university town, is largely hostile to Trump. The suburbs are a mixture of pro and anti Trump voters. The rural areas are strongly pro-Trump. These are generalizations, of course.

todd galle said...

I used to say 'dollars to donuts', but then I was buying a pack of cigarettes for 45 cents, and my southern relatives would load their car trunks with cartons at $3.00 or so when they visited for the holidays. Old Gold (filtered), if you are curious. Haven't smoked for 25 years though, my daughter shamed me out of it, God bless her.

gilbar said...

rehajm said...
Dollars to doughnuts is poppycock! Claptrap! Balderdash!
23 skidoo!!!


it's less that 25 days, until we're Back in the Twenties!
and that's, the Bee's Knees!

bagoh20 said...

" ...Democratic voters and their elected representatives. Neither of these forces has the slightest degree of self-control, even where political survival is concerned."

That is the thing that is most glaring and disappointing to me. Trump hate has made them incapable of seeing facts or their own lies for what they are. Howard demonstrates it again above. He knows what he wrote is a lie, or does he? Regardless, it clearly is, but is it sickness or dishonesty that causes him to do it?

todd galle said...

I should add, that it was a fair exchange. My South Carolina relatives would bring cigarettes, and we would provide Lebanon Baloney from the deli for them to take back. Can't get good PA Lebanon in Cowpens, SC. I prefer Seltzer's myself.

https://www.seltzerslebanon.com/

narciso said...



No good news is permitted:


https://mobile.twitter.com/susancrabtree/status/1203294387905548290

Bruce Hayden said...

I think that deep down, they know that they are lying through their teeth. I think that the real consensus is that it isn’t clear yet which side will be benefitted the most by impeachment. They hope their side, but deep down are worried that this will give Trump an electoral college landslide.

The reason that you can be pretty sure that these guys are spinning like tops right now. The House Dems are rushing the impeachment. The Republicans were supposed to get a day of calling witnesses in the HSCI. Nope. Similar in the Judiciary Committee. Likely nope again. They are rushing to the impeachment vote without giving the Republicans even the minimal amount of due process and fairness they had promised. They are rushing because they know that they need to be done before election year.

But that rushing means that they are making mistakes. Possibly big mistakes. They stacked their panel of law professors 3-1, but didn’t check them out before going live. Now, they are rushing to draft articles of Impeachment. But the only real hearings have been those strictly stage managed by HSCI chair Schifty. They are rushing folks, because they couldn’t read the Congressional calendar.

Funny thing is that they might be able to put themselves in a better position if they weren’t rushing things. They have three lawsuits pending in the federal courts in DC: for Trump’s tax returns, Mueller grand jury testimony, and, I believe, Mueller material protected by Executive Privilege. They found sympathetic, Obama appointed judges, and the DC Circuit was heavily packed by Obama. One of the purposes of the Mueller investigation in the first place was to pass material illegally obtained by the FBI’s Counterintelligence Division through FISA, etc, abuse to the (at the time not yet elected) Dem controlled House to be used for impeachment. Trump and Barr killed the easy way of accomplishing that by forcing the Mueller investigation to shut down before the House was reorganized, so that Mueller’s prosecutors no longer controlled the material - AG Barr does. I think that it is likely that they will probably win some of those lawsuits, and likely could find some actual dirt to throw at Trump. Except that the impeachment will, by then, be in the Senate. No Do Overs here, by the House, with a Republican Senate.

And that is what these spin artists are also, studiously, ignoring. The Senate is Republican controlled, and they have every incentive to drag things out all spring, with a vote maybe as late as this summer. Maybe even competing with the Dem Convention. Sure, give the Democrats the sort of fairness that Palsi, Schifty, and Wadler denied Trump and the House Republicans. A lot of dirt there to uncover. During a Presidential election year. Hopefully, Wadler will throw in some Obstruction charges from the Mueller Report, so that that investigation can be looked at in more detail.

Howard said...

You people kid yourself with officious canards hiding your puritanical moralistic persecution.

bagoh20 said...

So Howard, is what you wrote above about Clinton a lie or the truth?

And, if Trump got the blowjob in the Oval office with an intern, but didn't perjure himself or and try to get other to, what would you be saying? I'm betting it would be along the line of: IMPEACH HIM!

Francisco D said...

it is likely that they will probably win some of those lawsuits, and likely could find some actual dirt to throw at Trump.

Good analysis as always, Bruce.

However, I don't see the SCOTUS ruling in favor of Dems illegal attempts at gaining dirt on Trump through the Mueller report. They have so far been afraid of litigation (e.g., their supposed subpoenas) because they know that they will lose big time. Even RGB may rule against them.

Bruce Hayden said...

“They are rushing folks, because they couldn’t read the Congressional calendar. “

Also, they got outmaneuvered by Trump in getting AG Barr confirmed and the Mueller investigation shut down too quickly. I think it highly likely that the original plan was to run the SC investigation until they could elect a House majority, and then pass all of their material to the new majority. All of the Mueller prosecutors were rabid Dem partisans, so when (probably) Wadler asked them for the material, it likely would have been transferred before anyone knew what had happened. But instead, seeing this coming, Trump and the Senate Republicans pushed Barr’s confirmation through as fast as they could, and then within days Barr confronted Mueller about the status of the investigation. It was over within days except for writing up the report. The important thing though was that Barr, and not Mueller, and his partisan hack prosecutors now controlled their material. And Barr immediately invoked Executive Privilege. End of Plan A.

The Dems then faced the problem of finding something to impeach Trump over, after Plan A blew up on them. Except that they didn’t have a Plan B, but had promised impeachment to their base, and, in particular the dark money mega donors (likely billionaires like Soros) who had bought the Dems their House majority. I think that they may have dawdled a bit through the spring, hoping that one of their lawsuits would pay off. So, they went into the summer with an impeachment investigation all set up and ready to go, but nothing to impeach Trump over. Which is why Schifty and his staff set up, orchestrated, fabricated, and worked with Eric Ciaramella as their “whistleblower”, as the missing predicate for their Impeachment investigation. Schifty has been trying desperately, ever since, to hide his part in this, but I have little doubt that Eric Ciaramella will be at the top of the list of witnesses called in the Senate - and he can either testify, or quit, since he is a federal employee.

I don’t think that Plan A would have had these problems. If the House Dems had acquired the Mueller information and evidence legitimately, as they had expected, they very likely knew where the dirt was already. They would likely have just had to have asked Mueller’s partisan hack prosecutors, who had piled much of it up for them. But it would have lacked legal provenance. That doesn’t seem to bother Schifty much, with his subpoenaing all those call records on Oversight grounds, when he had no oversight authority. In any case, Wadler and Schifty would have had plenty of time to get this wrapped up this year without rushing. But they appear to have squandered 3-4 critical months dawdling, trying to figure out a Plan B. Think of it as continuing to advance after surprise has been lost, because those were their orders.

John henry said...

That and the fact that Trump’s abuse of Presidential power in pressuring Ukraine to dig up dirt on his domestic political opponents was so egregious.) 

That's an interesting construction.

Opponents? As in more than one?

Who are the others? Other presidential opponents are getting money from Ukraine?

Which ones?

I think this is just more fake news and obfuscation.

John Henry

Bruce Hayden said...

@Francisco - in a perfect world, you are correct. But they had picked their Obama nominated District Court judges, and at least one refused to stay his ruling in favor of the House, ignoring that the only way to maintain the status quo ante was to stay their order, since once the House Dems got the information, there was noway to get it back from them. And Obama and the Dems had expended a lot of effort expanding the DC Circuit, and then filling those new seats with their partisans. Even through a second term, Trump may have a hard time flipping that Circuit.

Still, I agree. Given enough time, Trump and the Republicans are ultimately going to win most, if not all not those fights because of their control of the Supreme Court. I don’t think that the Dems really thought it through. Faced with Plan A1 blowing up on them, with all the attorneys involved on their side, their natural response was to sue. That is what attorneys do. And, no doubt their Lawfare auxiliaries figured that they could cheat them to victory in the courts. So, their snap response was Plan A2 - sue to overcome Executive Privilege and grand jury secrecy, getting the material that they were expecting from Mueller through the courts. Except that strategically that sucked, because going through the court system takes time, time that they didn’t have, is probably going to lose long term, and distracted them from their problem of having promised an impeachment, having an impeachment inquiry set up, and not having a decent predicate for the impeachment. At best, this should have been a parallel effort. And maybe not even that. They needed to have been working on a Plan B, at least as early as when Barr shut dow the Mueller investigation. Maybe even from the start.

NorthOfTheOneOhOne said...

rehajm said...
Dollars to doughnuts is poppycock! Claptrap! Balderdash!

23 skidoo!!!


Ever considered going to work as a speech writer for the Biden campaign?

John henry said...

http://academic.brooklyn.cuny.edu/history/johnson/clinton_impeachment_articles.htm

Howard,

Rejahm did a nice capsule summary but you should really read the actual articles of impeachment for Clinton at the link above or elsewhere.

Not long. Not hard to comprehend.

Nothing about Monica. Nothing about blow jobs. Nothing about taking advantage of his position to have shove his sick down a subordinate's throat.

John Henry

Bruce Hayden said...

“And, no doubt their Lawfare auxiliaries figured that they could cheat them to victory in the courts.”

This started out well for the Dems, with the DOJ dispatching third string attorneys to argue the first case, which they promptly lost. I don’t know if that was Deep State sabotage, or if the Lawfare Group had a hand in it. Didn’t happen again. No doubt the attorneys assigned to other cases and other hearings were much more loyal and skilled.

narciso said...

I included the roscoe davis thread, about who was processing much of the aid, a company called thermonics, which has ties to the Clinton foundation,

narciso said...

themronics, sorry, they had planted mines in the bureaucracy, sally yates was just the obvious one, ciaramella, vindman, kent, were the pre invasion country team, who monitored the money going out,

narciso said...

they want a wrapped in the bow open and shut case, like the galuzia case in malta, where the chauffeur for the maltese magnate, pointed a straight line to the prime minister and his chief of staff, interesting parties to this matter are an azeri energy soc gen, and there are german end users with siemens, the times has only briefly touched on this,

hstad said...

"There appears to be an emerging consensus that the impeachment of Donald Trump won’t matter very much in November, 2020." Is that you 'Baghdad Bob' or 'Pelsoi il Comico's' opinion.

hstad said...

Whitney states.."I have had not one conversation [about Impeachment] or even heard anyone allude to it anywhere in real life..."

Sorry my friend, everyone is aware of the "Impeachment Sham" in my social sphere, people are always soliciting what I think of it - but I try to avoid politics. But your statement is your sole experience, therefore anecdotal evidence. This is not what is really going on in the country. If you believe that, then I think you need to talk to the 25,000 people at a Trump rally [all rallies] and find out what they really think. Either that, it is your wishful thinking as a Democrat in the hope that come November, 2020 the entire Democratic controlled Impeachment Sham will be forgotten. Not a chance! BTW, one blogger had it right - the waitresses' observation on TV,\. Ask any waitress or bartender - that's the real gauge - not your wishful comments.

Michael K said...


Blogger Howard said...

You people kid yourself with officious canards hiding your puritanical moralistic persecution.


Aw, Howard. You got away with Bill Clinton lying under oath. Even Sam Donaldson thought he would have to resign. Then Hillary sold Uranium deposits to Russia and nothing happened. Then she took out Gaddafi making sure that no dictator would ever give up nukes (Kim anyone ?)

What have you got, Howard? The Green Nude Eel?

narciso said...

they were still behind the lines,


https://www.thedailybeast.com/malta-arrest-of-yorgen-fenech-in-daphne-caruana-galizia-murder-still-dont-solve-the-crime

narciso said...


a few more details here,

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-malta-daphne-confession-exclusive/exclusive-daphne-murder-accused-details-plot-to-kill-for-150000-euros-idUKKBN1Y21HL

john burger said...

This is Prof. Althouse at her best.

jvb

Greg the class traitor said...

Wow, they sure are smoking so weird shit.

The Democrats are going to get utterly pounded in the Senate trial. Schiff lied repeatedly, and will have to admit that on the stand.

Vindman violated the law passing info on to EC the WB, and will have to admit that on the stand.

Then there's Hunter Biden's $3 million from Burisma, which was paid off by VP Biden shutting down the prosecutor going after them.

There will be people testifying that no one other than Biden was pushing to get rid of the prosecutor.

And Joe Biden, refusing to testify, while Trump calls him corrupt.

Then those 31 House Democrats in Trump districts will get to go back to their voters, and explain what they accomplished in the last 2 years. Which is: absolutely nothign other than "impeaching Trump"

Oh, yes, voters are going to remember impeachment in Nov.

Greg the class traitor said...

Howard said...
Nothing is more serious than impeachment over a blow job.

Nothing's more dishonest than a left winger

The impeachment was about perjury and obstruction of justice. Which you know. Which makes it even more pathetic that you push your lie.