Meade answers my question: "Apparently, you're not Democratic enough to feel the chaos. Remember, Jeb Bush called Donald Trump 'the chaos candidate.' Oh, Jeb, that hurts so bad calling me the chaos candidate."
Okay, now what do I want to read first — The Hill's angsting about chaos now or Jeb's old warning? I go with Jeb:
I blog from a perspective I call "cruel neutrality," and much as I love calm and order — perhaps because I love calm and order — I don't take the cue to see a "chaos!" narrative. You know, it's only when you have the luxury of living without chaos that you can indulge yourself imagining chaos. When real chaos comes, no one will be writing "Chaos!!!" essays.
All right. Here's Jonathan Easley at The Hill with his "Chaos!!!" essay:
Democrats are on edge less than three months out from the Iowa caucuses...Oh! It's only 3 months... Panic time!
... as a four-candidate pile-up...4!!! 4... all piled up! What a massive tangle of barely distinguishable humanity!
... and Michael Bloomberg’s potential candidacy injects a new level of uncertainty into an already chaotic race....Oh, no!! There could be 5!! Not merely 4, but 5!!!! Have you ever seen such a complicated crowd?
It appeared for a while that Warren might run away with the nomination, but her national poll numbers have dipped in recent weeks amid sustained attacks from Biden and Buttigieg and new scrutiny of her "Medicare for All" plan.This isn't chaos. This is just people not particularly liking any of the candidates. The "chaos" — fake news chaos — is only the prospect of more Trump, more "chaos President" — to quote Jeb again — because none of the Democrats are shaping up into good enough competition for Trump. Maybe it seems as though people don't particularly like Trump either, but he will be the candidate — although we're being nudged to think he'll go away via impeachment though we pretty much know he won't. And we pretty much anticipate that — whether we vote for him or just stand back and let others cast the votes — he's going to win a second term. This doesn't feel chaotic to me. It's very ordinary. Trump himself is not ordinary, but the old idea that he's just too weird to be President is part of what's normal in America now. Don't normalize him! Too late for that.
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72 comments:
Chaos is a code word for Hillary to get in and save them all. Don't worry, Agent 86 is working to end Kaos.
Chaos is not bad, weird or unusual.
Trump is the NORMAL one. THEY are the corrupt ones who hate Trump for exposing them all.
Somebody (Instapundit?) linked to Nate Silver, who is also not buying the chaos narrative.
Biden's the front runner--he always has been and he isn't threatened now. And, outside of the media bubble, nobody much likes Bloomberg. He is NOT shaking up the race.
Maybe it seems as though people don't particularly like Trump either, but he will be the candidate
A lot of people voted for Trump in 2016 because he wasn't Hillary. But I think a lot of people will vote for Trump in 2020 because he is Trump.
Of course the Dem race is chaotic compared to 2016 when the result was preordained.
Joe will be the Jeb! of this primary cycle. Please clap.
Oh, no!! There could be 5!! Not merely 4, but 5!!!!
Yes, chaos. Today's progressivism demands uniformity and conformity. No opposing views, much less tolerance of differing views allowed.
There can be only one.
You want chaos? Just wait for Crooked Hillary to enter the race.
So, at the first debate, All 10 Democratic presidential candidates on the debate stage raised their hands when asked whether their health plans will provide coverage for undocumented immigrants...
Then, Democrats Push Immigration Policies That Amount To Open Borders In Second Debate
That, is The Definition of Chaos
Boomers used to value non-conformity. “March to a different drum” I think Boomer hero Thoreau said. Millennials on the other hand prize conformity above all else. Question authority turned around to #NotNormal. So that’s a difference.
Where is a Vladimir Lenin when you need her? she will restore order out of chaos the old fashioned way. Just arrest and suicide all the other candidates and declare herself Party Chairman for life.
on the Non Chaos side of things:
Bolivia's socialist President Evo Morales resigns amid election fraud allegations
"I don't take the cue to see a "chaos!" narrative."
But you did in 2016, if only as a way to rationalize a vote for Hill.
It's convenient, that phony cruel neutrality: it enables you to claim that you don't take fabricated cues, and then in the end claim that you neutrally, autonomously, out of your own pure reason happen to interpret the situation just as prior cues cued you to do.
Jeb was the GOP's best 2016 candidate of the Uni-Party. Like Bush 1, Bush 2, Bob Dole, Mittens, McCain. All Deep Staters, globalists first and always, not champions of America's best interests.
Professor Carroll Quigley, cheerleader for the CFR (Council on Foreign Relations) was President Clinton’s mentor when he was a student at Georgetown University. Here's how the CFR has structured elections, by offering us the Uni-Party; quoting,
The National parties and their presidential candidates, with the Eastern Establishment assiduously fostering the process behind the scenes, moved closer together and nearly met in the center with almost identical candidates and platforms, although the process was concealed as much as possible, by the revival of obsolescent or meaningless war cries and slogans (often going back to the Civil War). …
[MONEY QUOTE] The argument that the two parties should represent opposed ideals and policies, one,perhaps, of the Right and the other of the Left, is a foolish idea acceptable only to the doctrinaire and academic thinkers. Instead, the two parties should be almost identical, so that the American people can “throw the rascals out” at any election without leading to any profound or extreme shifts in policy. …
Either party in office becomes in time corrupt, tired, unenterprising, and vigor-less. Then it should be possible to replace it, every four years if necessary, by the other party, which will be none of these things but will still pursue, with new vigor, approximately the same basic policies.
Carroll Quigley, Tragedy and Hope: A History of the The World in Our Time (1966), pp. 1247-1248
The CFR is Deep State Central and is why Trump, who is a real American, not a globalist, is being given such a rough time. Trump's sin is the same as our sin - wanting America First by following the limiting principles of the Constitution.
Wouldn’t it be nice for Ann to go on MSNBC or CNN - with all the so called smart people - and explain this chaos thing.
General Mattis codename was chaos.
God help these people if they were to inject him. H would kill them all 5 times before they hit the ground.
Real Life is chaotic. I'd like a candidate used to chaos.
Funny. Very enjoyable. And you're right, they won't be writing chaos articles when real chaos comes. Everyone will be surprised when the restraints of civilization are let loose
This isn't chaos. This is just people not particularly liking any of the candidates.
Pretty much. Many powerful people remain unconvinced that Joe Biden, or any of them can actually beat Trump.
To me it seems like Joe Biden remains farily well liked among the more moderate Dem electorate, despite his issues. Or at least they find him to be the least worst. In their minds Biden is far preferable to Warren.
Warren scares away many of the key big deep pocketed Dem donors with her evident wealth redistribution proposals. And her various grand plans seem a little dubious at best with many critical swing voters.
Bloomberg isn't particularly well known outside of NYC, and those that do know him don't necessarily seem to be enamored with him. It's hard to know what effect his sudden presence will have on the race, but realistically I can't see how it will be good for the Dems at this point.
The Democrats have become the uberdrama Party, perhaps in reaction and opposition to the most TV-savvy opponent they’ve ever faced. Trump is theatrical in his affection for costumes and staging and bizarre hair, for repetition to emphasize speech, for feeding off of live audiences and engagement with the Press. However the party holding primaries is used to being better at image manipulation, at staging, at drawing crowds. Having met their thespian match in Trump they have ceded much of their traditional turf to him. SNL doesn’t even try to be funny half the time because Trump is the best working stand-up today. Now the Dems are left hoping for an off-screen herobto tude to their nomination because all their heroes stink. They have worked on a Deux ex machina for years and still have no believable scenario to dispose of the big bad Orangeman.
So with their adventure movie devoid of suspense and substance they resort to dramatic telling of their search for a hero, using hyperactive journOlisters to gin up some interest. It appears to be a dud.
A wed wose. How ordinawy...
"What's the chaos?"
Don't you mean "Where's the chaos, like the incredulous oldster Clara Peller's "Where's the Beef?!"
"What's the chaos" to me sounds more like "What's the buzz?"
What's the Buzz? Tell me what's happening.
(Funny Philip Seymore Hoffman version.)
Why should you want to know?
Why are you obsessed with fighting
Times and fates you can't defy?
If you knew the path we're riding,
You'd understand it less than I.
Isn't he a billionaire?
Don't Dems hate billionaires?
Certainly the current crop of Dem presidential hopefuls do.
Imagine Bloomberg getting into the race at this stage.
Awkward!
"Trump himself is not ordinary, but the old idea that he's just too weird to be President is part of what's normal in America now."
In 2016 the America people reacted to a growing awareness that the government and the political parties that fuel government had gone off the rails. We found ourselves in a world where the proposed solution to every problem was a government program run by bureaucrats who leaned hard to the left and answered to no one. Regardless of the results delivered by government, slick politicians were ready to offer us the comfort and security of more government. But comfort and security come at the cost of personal and economic freedom and economic prosperity.
Trump is President because many Americans sensed it was time for change and a new direction. Change is messy and rarely boring. In addition, change is never embraced by those who profit from the status quo. The need for change is obvious to those who spent their life in the private sector. Those who spent their lives in the safe, secure confines of government want "boring" and "calm".
Your a 60s boomer wearing miniskirts to defy, support a court-ordered policy which still has the country at each others’ throats and you don’t like chaos?
Bwaaaaaaaaaaaa
The best way for the Democrats to move forward is to throw the Bidens under the bus. That's productive chaos
Bloomberg is currently at 4%. So there's 4 percent chaos. Funny, how nobody mentions that Bloomberg was a Republican for 15 years, and for 15 years was full of "Concern" over the R Party and its "drift to the Right". And now, he's back being a Democrat. Its like he always was one, and was just ...wait for it...a Republican in name only.
And why would the D's Panic? According to the their MSM Polls, EVERYBODY beats Trump. Bernie, Biden, Buttigig, Warren, Bloomberg. And what's with everyone being a "B"? Two "B" or Not to "B". We could call Warren, Beatty Warren. So now's everyone's a "B". The Killer "B's" - who will Kill America.
As for Hillary - Wird der Teufel genannt, kommt er gerannt
Bloomberg's signature accomplishments - making billions on Wall Street and maintaining law and order in NYC - are both net negatives with the Dem primary electorate. His candidacy is going to "sink like a stone" as Bob Dylan would say.
Chaos is a code word for Hillary to get in and save them all.
For Hillary to prevail she needs chaos to keep three or four of the candiplates™ spinning until the first vote at the convention. Otherwise she'd have to campaign and we all know how that turns out.
I think in the eyes of the typical Democratic voter it's depression and not chaos. They've had three years to select a defining issue and a competent spokesperson who's "not Trump" and they've come up short. Extrapolating on the Obama, "this is not who we are", it's more like, "who are we?".
Don't normalize him! Too late for that.
The Democrats and the media have normalized chaos through their constant exhortations, investigations, and calls for his removal.
Their boring candidates have become too boring to break through the noise.
The four - or five - of them sit there wondering why no one is tuning into their show.
The word "chaos" always reminds me of the weird math (Lyapunov) in a EE course called "Non-linear Control Systems", but I think it's gotten weirder since then:
"Visual Analysis of Nonlinear Dynamical Systems: Chaos, Fractals, Self-Similarity and the Limits of Prediction", or "Why Our 737 Crashed".
They've had three years to select a defining issue and a competent spokesperson who's "not Trump" and they've come up short.
They're all "not Trump".
They forgot about the competent part.
Trump is chaos, as all Great Men are.
He is the unexpected phenomenon throwing off the trend all the academics and bureaucrats predicted. It is his kind that stops or bends the stream of history.
That the Democrats are having a problem finding an acceptable leader is not chaos, it is the predictable result of their decadence.
Shorter Jeb!: I'm not low energy! I'm just the right amount of energy! It's Trump who's abnormal and un-Commander-In-Chiefy!
@gspencer: Kudos.
I prefer chaos to an army of Fascocrat arms raised in Societ Realist unison to destroy our border. But hey, I just live next door to a much-released illegal immigrant serial rapist.
And they ... don't.
Of course.
What's happening now isn't so much chaos as the weakening of several candidates in several ways in advance of the convention, when the Dem Party rules enable a thimble cohort of backroom grandees to annoint the candidate of their choice. It's like breaking a few kneecaps in advance of ending the strike.
It's hilarious that the Democrats are always the ones who loudly abandon the "ramparts." At least some of their anger at Trump voters is that we beat them to actually overthrowing our Party establishment.
If they were smart, they'd nominate Jeb! He's very bipartisan. I'm leaning strategic cis-partisan these days. I'm about ready to lop off the leftitarians for better or worse.
I’ve become convinced the only reason Joe is running is to deflect questions about his involvement in spying on the Trump campaign. He’s using the campaign to deflect criticism as “Trump attacking a rival” even though he’s not running against Trump yet. Obama probably told him to run in order to stave off the inevitable shitstorm that will hit when the prior admin’s sins are laid bare. His heart isn't in it. He’s never polled above 1% in a real primary contest. And he’s an extremely flawed candidate morally, mentally, tactically and given the looming metoo skeletons in his swimming pool.
What chaos? According to a number of pills at least three Dems beat Trump in a hypothetical contest. Besides after Trump throws everybody under the bus he will manage to steer it into a ditch leaving Nikki Hailey to take over throwing everything into real chaos.
I think that there are is a bit of panic now in Demsville. And a lot of it is due to Bloomberg entering the race. He scares them because he is jumping in late, but probably has the best chance in the general election. I think that he is going to squash Mayor Buttplug in the center lane. Bloomberg was the successful mayor of one of our biggest cities, while Buttplug is the unsuccessful mayor of an insignificant (to most of us) smaller one. Crime was under control in NYC when Bloomberg left office. Crime has skyrocketed up under Mayor Pete, and other Blue Paradise problems like city services and runaway spending are starting to get out of hand there. His biggest claim to being a card carrying progressive is his sexual orientation, and that just isn’t going to fly in much of the country. A little bit, is that they don’t want to envision what would be going on behind closed doors in the WH. But more, how does a gay guy stand up to macho bullies like Putin? Much of the Muslim world would treat the US as even more degenerate (and thus weak) by allowing what they consider deviancy and degeneracy in the White House, while many of them are still brutally executing those practicing what their Prophet considered a heinous perversion.
Meanwhile Biden has mental (and criminality) problems, while Sanders has his own old age health issues. Neither is likely to survive eight years in office (though Biden would more likely be removed because of his declining mental facilities). Warren is healthy enough, but is rapidly turning toxic to the donor class, due to get detailed plans to destroy our economy, by taking the fortunes of rich, starting with the billionaires, and flushing it down the toilet by simultaneously implementing fully socialist healthcare while completely opening our borders to a flood of mostly unemployable ignorant 3rd world peasants from Central America. The Dems have long depended on their mega donors to compensate for the GOP’s advantage in collecting mid sized campaign donations. But they are at the front of the list of people Warren would beggar if she were elected and had her way.
And then there is Crooked Hillary and her coterie of enablers, who seem to be expecting to waltz into a brokered convention, and walk out with the nomination, without actually having to campaign for it. She is, of course, probably sicker than either Sanders or Biden, and an order of magnitude more corrupt than Biden. But she was robbed in 2016, and the Dems owe her a rematch. She fully seems to have expected to be able to exploit the vacuum caused by the party failing to coalesce around a second rate candidate. Much less likely with Bloomberg filling that vacuum.
Bloomberg scares many of the Dems. He probably has the best chance at winning the general election, but they won’t have much of a hold over him, like they do most of the other candidates. Very much like what Trump did to the GOP. A lot of the Dem powerbrokers would rather lose to a Trump (hopefully, on their part) weakened by impeachment than face eight years of a Dem President whom they cannot control.
Here's chaos: Republicans don't really have to vote in a primary. How will Republicans vote in Dem primaries?
Howard: "The best way for the Democrats to move forward is to throw the Bidens under the bus."
LOL
Howard thinks democrat primary voters select the democrat party candidate.
That's adorable....
r/v: "According to a number of pills at least three Dems beat Trump in a hypothetical contest."
LOLOL
I'll bet any of those dems will be given a 99% chance of winning the general...right up until the real votes are counted.
I'll bet Trump will have "no path to 270", "Texas is turning blue!!", "The Blue Wall will stand tall against Trump!!"
And all on top of Christopher Steele offering up a "brand new" dossier in the UK claiming (and I s*** you not) that Putin and his henchmen got Brexit passed, Putin has been cultivating & "grooming" Boris Johnson as an agent for at least 5 years and that Putin wants Boris Johnson to win the general election in Britain in December!!
Is it just me, or have we heard all of these same storylines from the our resident lefty dummies over and over and over and over.....
...and these "new" storylines will go the way of all the old lefty storylines. As they inevitably must.
(cue sad trombone)
Bruce you are ignoring Amy, a dark horse moderate progressive with experience who has crafted decent bills that unfortunately sit on McConnell’s desk waiting for a vote. Slowly she is inching her way forward in the polls and fund raising, and I predict will be on the ticket.
silly rabbit, so no sodas, no guns, praise of the skydragon and moloch,
yet the actual Stalinist, well Trotskyite, Jeremy Corbyn, pal of hamas, isn't a real threat, what color is the sky on their world,
The D-machine that makes people like Stephanopolis, The Clintons, and the Bidens super-wealthy (to name a few) are in panic mode.
The left have knee-capped Trump, but they wonder how to hold onto power in any way they can.
So confusing - that corruption ring.
roesch/voltaire said...
What chaos? According to a number of pills at least three Dems beat Trump in a hypothetical contest.
Do ever wonder, if Maybe you've had Enough pills? You seem pretty woozy, already
Quigley went too far - to the point of being ridiculous and making his opponents arguments for them - but he wasn't entirely wrong. In his day, ideological differences had to be funneled or filtered through parties that weren't wholly ideological. Today we get ideology pure and undiluted through ideologically polarized parties, and raw ideology is about as healthy as raw sewage.
Plus, in Quigley's day ideological conflicts were simpler (though they were beginning to get more complicated by race). His critics couldn't conceive of how passionate and destructive ideological conflict could be (though they were to get a foretaste of that soon enough in the late Sixties).
*
Chaos in the Democratic Party? Why not call it Democracy? The usual, non-chaotic situation is people thinking a variety of candidates have a shot at winning, when everybody knows that only one or two have a real chance.
“silly rabbit, so no sodas, no guns, praise of the skydragon and moloch,”
With gun control, Bloomberg is almost mainstream for a Dem. For a former Harvard Law School prof, Warren would ban the basic militia weapon, the AR-15, her first day in office. I can pretty much guarantee that if she gets the Dem nomination, you won’t be able to get an80% or 100% complete AR-15 lower receiver next summer. Colt is pulling out of the civilian market right now, due to overcapacity in the market. Don’t expect 5hat to last if she is nominated.
The so called "battles" of WWI were actually massacres in which up to 250,000 men were killed or wounded. Sometimes tens of thousands would be killed in an hour or two. The generals who planned those battles believed in the strategy of attrition. If they killed more of the enemies men than their own, the battle was listed as a victory so they kept planning those battles. After the war, the diplomats who had blundered into that war designed a peace treaty that enabled Bolsheviks, Nazis, and Fascists to gain and consolidate power in defeated or even their own countries......When you speak of people who really fucked things up, hands down, the award has to go to that generation. Relatively speaking, boomers aren't all that bad.
“Bruce you are ignoring Amy, a dark horse moderate progressive with experience who has crafted decent bills that unfortunately sit on McConnell’s desk waiting for a vote. Slowly she is inching her way forward in the polls and fund raising, and I predict will be on the ticket.”
Amy who? Another female Senate back bencher? That Amy?
Amy doesn't understand that she has to win the votes of the people in the aisles of Walmart, not be the person in the aisles of Walmart herself. Unimpressive.
And while America has become more comfortable with eccentricity in politicians, we aren't quite ready for a candidate who eats salad with a comb and throws binders at people.
Still, there are a lot other things she could be successful at, which is more than you can say for some of the other candidates.
Please clap!
Chaos is simply a short year unpredictable condition. If it feels like Chaos to someone, they means they can’t predict what’s going to happen with any level of comfort. It doesn’t mean the situation is actually unpredictable. As I said to a business leader who was struggling when their market changed - simply because you don’t understand doesn’t mean it’s not understandable.
they thought howard Schultz would be a thing, he ended up a jeopardy question,
they thought howard Schultz would be a thing, he ended up a jeopardy question,
Actually, a Jeopardy answer.
Drago's dimmentalia showing. The party bosses are the ones who will have the power and means to trash Bidens. Won't happen because they are chickenshits afraid of the insuing kaos.
Chaos is the fact that no dem frontrunner is emerging and the candidates who appear to be frontrunners are incredibly weak. Chaos is that Bloomberg could enter as a dem and move independent and suck votes off Dem polls.
Chaos is that their frontrunners are actually terrible leaders and they are focused entirely on poll results or checking boxes of who the person is (skin color, gender, etc.) rather than actual capability as a president.
henry's comment- the first in the thread- probably indicates the media's rationale.
Increasingly, to me at least, Bloomberg's entry does look like a planned smoothing of Clinton's late entry into the race. I don't remember who suggested it the other day, but the commenter theorized that Bloomberg was entering the race so that Clinton's late entry wouldn't look so opportunistic- in other words, Bloomberg is taking the fire for Clinton, who will follow within a month- maybe just after Thanksgiving.
I am going to predict the Iowa, New Hampshire, and South Carolina results:
Iowa: Warren 31%, Buttuvwxyz 20%, Sanders 18%, Klobuchar 13%, rest of field 18%
New Hampshire: Warren 35%, Sanders 25%, Buttuvwxyz 15%, Biden 14% rest of field 11%
South Carolina: Biden 40%, Warren 30%, Sanders 15%, Buttuvwxyz 10%, rest of field 5%
After this, it will be Biden vs Warren, and I predict Warren wins everywhere except through the South and Delaware.
If Hillary Clinton is The Great White Hope for the Democrats then it's all over but the crying for the Democrats. As for chaos, my 401K is up almost 25% for the year through Friday, give me more chaos please. One thing I'm certain of, is if the Democrats win the trifecta next year my 401K will go down 25% and my taxes will go up.
"her "Medicare for All" plan."
I heard a bunch of commercials this weekend for supplemental insurance for folks with Medicare. It got me to wondering, if Warren gives us Medicare for All, will all of us Americans have to carry supplemental insurance then?
Speaking of cruel neutrality, this study seems to support the idea by demonstrating that "Empathic Concern Fuels Political Polarization":
https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/american-political-science-review/article/how-empathic-concern-fuels-political-polarization/8115DB5BDE548FF6AB04DA661F83785E
“Increasingly, to me at least, Bloomberg's entry does look like a planned smoothing of Clinton's late entry into the race. I don't remember who suggested it the other day, but the commenter theorized that Bloomberg was entering the race so that Clinton's late entry wouldn't look so opportunistic- in other words, Bloomberg is taking the fire for Clinton, who will follow within a month- maybe just after Thanksgiving.”
The problem there, I think, is that Crooked Hillary would actually have to campaign, and I don’t think that she has the health for it. It’s one thing to swoop into the Dems’ convention, save everyone by taking the nomination, then spend the next 3-4 months sporadically campaigning. Much different than spending most of a year on the campaign trail. I also don’t think that she would do well on stage debating the other candidates. Her voice, never good in the first place, now sounds old. And she probably wouldn’t be able to hide her disabilities.
Chaos is good for the media. It gets everyone wound up and encourages views. Hence it sells advertising and makes the media money.
Chaos is bad for the Democrats, at least for the time being. There is no one discernible standard-bearer around whom all can rally and lead the party back into power.
Democratic chaos is fine for Republicans. They know who their candidate is. They're confident they can stay in power.
Chaos probably means nothing to independents. At this point they don't know or care what they'll eventually do.
I miss Marianne. She was entertaining and not hateful. Still chockfull of bad ideas, like the rest of the Dems, but not hateful. She didn't seem like she was just itching to throw all us normies into the FEMA camps.
they can't tell the difference,
https://legalinsurrection.com/2019/11/report-many-undecided-democratic-voters-care-about-electability-not-ideology/
Hillary was not supposed to lose,
...so they were never prepared for this scenario.
the Titanic wasnt supposed to sink, so the life-raft thing got a little chaotic.
Howard said...
The best way for the Democrats to move forward is to throw the Bidens under the bus. That's productive chaos
11/11/19, 9:11 AM
You spelled "Clintons" wrong, but getting warm.
https://mobile.twitter.com/pspoole/status/1194024830640836610
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