Althouse: "Ambassador Taylor was correct that what the U.S. had been doing in Ukraine comported with the Trump National Security Strategy of resisting persistent aggressions by Russia and China."

November 14, 2019

"Ambassador Taylor was correct that what the U.S. had been doing in Ukraine comported with the Trump National Security Strategy of resisting persistent aggressions by Russia and China."

"In early 2019, that included helping Ukraine’s newly elected government and its young president, Volodymyr Zelensky, stand up to Mr. Putin’s murderous little green men in eastern Ukraine. Mr. Taylor’s substantive point was that the Trump-Giuliani channel undercut a sound U.S. policy course when suddenly military assistance to Ukraine got caught up in Mr. Trump’s desire, or need, to have the Ukrainians investigate the Bidens. So what else is new? Internal policy battles of this intensity are a constant of government life. Other than dragging in the Bidens, this is hardly different from a host of similar Trumpian foreign-policy interventions.... All these decisions, and not least the events with Ukraine, are absolutely valid voting issues for the next election.... It would have been valid as well if the Democrats had chosen to conduct normal oversight hearings.... But why are Americans being forced to endure the elevation of the Ukraine saga into the current impeachment melodrama? Presumably the Democratic left and its allies believe the faux gravity of 'impeachment' will grind down Mr. Trump’s support at the margin and jack up anti-Trump turnout.... Once the Adam Schiff show closes, undecided voters will have about 10 months to decide if his politics of pursuit and retribution has been worth the trouble."

From "The Take Down Trump Project" by Daniel Henninger (MSN.com link, originally in the WSJ). Henninger suspects voters will blame Democrats for wasting a congressional term pursuing Trump instead of legislating in some beneficial way.

ADDED: Henninger doesn't talk about this, but I think voters may see the Democrats as doing something close to what they're accusing Trump of doing — using governmental power for personal political gain. If they succeed in making us anxious and outraged about Trump, we'll also feel anxious and outraged about them. What do you do with that feeling? Turn away from politics? Take note of human nature, shrug it off, and keep playing, at least enough to cast a vote?

90 comments:

Big Mike said...: Henninger suspects voters will blame Democrats for wasting a congressional term pursuing Trump instead of legislating in some beneficial way.

Well DUH!; 11/14/19, 7:51 AM
rhhardin said...: Investigate crowdsource and other dem shit in Ukraine. Trump doesn't care about Biden as a rival but as part of an illegal conspiracy in 2016. Please cooperate with Barr, was the message.; 11/14/19, 7:51 AM
Ignorance is Bliss said...: ...instead of legislating in some beneficial way.

I'm pretty sure beneficial legislating was never an option...; 11/14/19, 7:52 AM
Shouting Thomas said...: Legislating is seldom a beneficial thing.

I prefer a deadlocked, do-nothing Congress. The U.S. is doing fine with a Congress doing nothing but pursuing the impeachment distraction.

The last time Congress decided to do some serious legislating, my medical insurance bill tripled. I didn't notice a exponential improvement in medical care.

What's important is that President Trump be re-elected. I suspect he will be. He's done a great job in the face of the loony Democratic witch hunts. I wonder what he could do if the voters re-elect him.

Will the Democrats refuse, again, to accept the outcome?; 11/14/19, 7:53 AM
rehajm said...: With a strong economy like we’ve had do voters really care about Congress legislating? Seems like one side is hopeful they take down Trump and the other side is happy Congress is distracted.; 11/14/19, 7:53 AM
MayBee said...: It’s true! Why give these the veneer of an “impeachment inquiry@? Why is oversight not enough?

And are any of these people the least bit curious about why Trump thought the Ukraine might be able to help him with crowdstrike? Who told him that?; 11/14/19, 7:54 AM
chuck said...: Hmm, that doesn't sound right. My understanding is that military aid was not delayed, and was also not provided by the Obama administration. I'd really like to see a careful account of events with a timeline. I expect we will need to wait for that. I'd also like to see an account of Ukrainian meddling in US politics. Everyone meddles in US politics, but the Ukraine, known for its corruption, may have done more than most.; 11/14/19, 7:54 AM
Kevin said...: The dogs bark, but the caravan moves on.; 11/14/19, 7:57 AM
tim maguire said...: While Trump may have the authority to unilaterally stop aid payments, he didn't do it on the fly. There were meetings, advisers gave advice. When were those meetings? Who was there? What was said?

Why are we bombarded with these generalities encouraging us to come to our own conclusions when there is a paper trail and a host of witnesses who can tell us how this decision was made?

I'm sick of the innuendo. I'm sick of how much time and energy is spent on dancing around the facts hoping we don't notice that the facts we need exist but are being withheld.; 11/14/19, 7:59 AM
rhhardin said...: Hey it's even in the transcript

NUNES: I just want to be clear that some government officials oppose President Trump’s approach to Ukraine, but many had no idea what concerned him. In this case, it was numerous indications of Ukrainian interference in the 2016 election to oppose his campaign and support Hillary Clinton. Once you know that, it’s easy to understand the president’s desire to get to the bottom of this corruption and to discover exactly what happened in the 2016 election.

which the witness said he was unaware of.; 11/14/19, 8:00 AM
Wince said...: Henniger is right about process.

But will voters be moved more by Trump's breaches of bureaucratic process than the Democrat's abuse of legislative process?

Non-partisan voters are likely to be moved by results more than process, which decidedly favors Trump.; 11/14/19, 8:03 AM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: Daniel not David.; 11/14/19, 8:03 AM
Temujin said...: They've wasted more than a congressional term. They've been at it since November of 2016- days before the election. While I typically prefer a doddering congress that passes as few bills as possible, there are some large issues that have not been resolved, or even taken up. Everything- including important trade deals and immigration have all been tabled for 'Russia, Russia, Russia', followed by 'Kavanaugh the Hun', followed by' Impeachment!'.

It's been a non-stop show of lunacy and I see no reason why any thinking person would elect a Democrat in their lifetime. For at least 2 generations. These people are a ____ show.; 11/14/19, 8:03 AM
Seeing Red said...: Why are we bombarded with these generalities? After talking with some grade school teachers, It’s being run by people who believe in Common Core. Common Core also believes in generalities.; 11/14/19, 8:03 AM
Quayle said...: If our foreign affairs are not centered on and driven by quid quo pro, then why do we have any foreign relations at all?

Or do you want to argue that the President, the chief law enforcement officer of the country, is only personally benefited when he or she pursues potential criminal corruption?

Or are you saying that if Al Capone had decided to enter the race for President when the G-men were closing in on him, the criminal instigation would have had to stop because it personally benefited Coolidge, Hoover, or Roosevelt?; 11/14/19, 8:05 AM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: I thought Democrats had the reputation for being good at process but current events indicate otherwise. The overreach that started with Kavanaugh continues for no good reason.; 11/14/19, 8:06 AM
tim in vermont said...: Taylor is like Ann Coulter. "Trump has been too slow in reversing Obama policies in Ukraine!”

Imagine being convicted for drunk driving when no officer actually saw you driving drunk, there was no accident or damage to your car, without even a witness who saw you driving drunk, just on the word of a bunch of people who hated you who claimed that they had heard that you had been driving drunk.; 11/14/19, 8:06 AM
Joe Biden, America's Putin said...: The hivemind Trump hate cult will go along with any lie.

The only hope is with people who see the truth.; 11/14/19, 8:08 AM
Xmas said...: Chuck,

This is one timeline of events.

I think the funniest part of this whole things is that the Republican Senate may take this very seriously and require the Impeachment Trial take 6 weeks. Assuming the House committee hearings take a few more weeks and the full House vote takes place near the end of November or early December, the Senate trial is going to last until close to the end of January. That'll keep Harris and Warren tied up during the important run up to the Iowa and New Hampshire primaries.; 11/14/19, 8:08 AM
tim in vermont said...: "which the witness said he was unaware of.”

But you can tell by the uniforms that these are Top men. Top. Men.; 11/14/19, 8:08 AM
Francisco D said...: A friend of my wife was talking to her hairdresser and he told them that one of his friends overheard that Ambassador Taylor was at a wild Ukrainian sex party with Adam Schiff. He believes that they were filmed and then blackmailed by the Ukrainians.

That is my clear understanding.; 11/14/19, 8:09 AM
Wince said...: Mr. Taylor’s substantive point was that the Trump-Giuliani channel undercut a sound U.S. policy course when suddenly military assistance to Ukraine got caught up in Mr. Trump’s desire, or need, to have the Ukrainians investigate the Bidens.

Another take would be that Ukraine military assistance was never really in question and the investigative cooperation Trump sought was a separate ask, and that the staid bureaucrat Taylor was simply hyperventilating at Trump's feint.; 11/14/19, 8:11 AM
rhhardin said...: What do you do with that feeling? Turn away from politics?

Althouse notices she's being played but not what the audience is. It's women.

Don't look for improvement in politicians until women in the audience improve.

Some female self-awareness as to their susceptibilities is needed. Stop voting like women.; 11/14/19, 8:11 AM
gilbar said...: Skylark said...
Imagine being convicted for drunk driving when no officer actually saw you driving drunk, there was no accident or damage to your car, without even a witness who saw you driving drunk, just on the word of a bunch of people who hated you who claimed that they had heard that you had been driving drunk.

Talk to Sam Grant about that! Oh, that's right, you can't; he died of throat cancer in 1885
Plenty of books about it though. Every report of Grant's drinking came from people that:
Weren't there, at the time/place reported
Hated Grant, usually on account of because he fired them for incompetence; 11/14/19, 8:14 AM
rcocean said...: What its all about Alfie? What has Trump actually done in the Ukraine that is worthy of impeachment? Answer: Nothing. That's why this is all so boring.

Also, the D's are hiding their star witness: Eric Ciaremella because if he told the truth the "Whistleblower" would be exposed as a Democrat Partisan hack who hates Trump.; 11/14/19, 8:15 AM
stlcdr said...: Blogger Shouting Thomas said...
Legislating is seldom a beneficial thing.

I prefer a deadlocked, do-nothing Congress. The U.S. is doing fine with a Congress doing nothing but pursuing the impeachment distraction.

...
11/14/19, 7:53 AM

On the same page. As long as congress is not doing their job (sic) things are better for the the people they supposedly represent.; 11/14/19, 8:15 AM
rcocean said...: The DNC press is absolutely in the Tank for the D's. Every NPR story and radio news break gives us the breathless details of how Tump did something really, really bad, although *EXACTLY* what, is always left unsaid.; 11/14/19, 8:16 AM
Seeing Red said...: Hang them from lamp posts.

Tar and feather.; 11/14/19, 8:18 AM
rcocean said...: We have laws that need to be fixed, so a "Do nothing"congress is just a status-quo Congress on the road to ruin. Its like saying, we don't need to do anything about that iceberg just ahead, lets just stay the course, and "do nothing".; 11/14/19, 8:18 AM
Seeing Red said...: We need that new deal with Canada and Mexico.; 11/14/19, 8:18 AM
Hagar said...: Again, has anyone shown that Trump knew of the elusive "hold" on the Ukrainian aid package?
Especially since the aid seems to have been forthcoming at about the usual pace for such things in Washington, hold or no hold.; 11/14/19, 8:19 AM
stevew said...: "it was numerous indications of Ukrainian interference in the 2016 election"

As the Instapundit likes to say, I'm old enough to remember when foreign interference in our elections was a really, really bad thing, according to Democrats.

Guys like Taylor, so-called career diplomats, were all butt hurt that their advice and counsel, once heard by Trump, was dismissed and that he was taking a different (some say parallel) course. So now Taylor and the others collude to undercut the duly elected POTUS.

That is MY clear understanding.; 11/14/19, 8:19 AM
rcocean said...: They may not be legislating, but they're still spending more and more $. But trying to reason with a wealthy Boomer is like talking to French Aristocrat in 1790. Everything's OK with me and mine, what's the problem?; 11/14/19, 8:19 AM
Tank said...: As I’ve said before, the shame of it all is that Donald Trump is not a doctrinaire conservative. He is a goal oriented deal maker, who likes to get things done. The Democrats could have worked with him to achieve many of their mutual goals, for example: infrastructure, modification of trade agreements to be at least neutral to American business and, yes, even immigration. Trump specifically indicated his flexibility on that issue.

Instead, they have spent his entire presidential term trying to undo the last election.; 11/14/19, 8:20 AM
gilbar said...: Francisco D said...
A friend of my wife was talking to her hairdresser and he told them that one of his friends overheard that Ambassador Taylor was at a wild Ukrainian sex party with Adam Schiff. He believes that they were filmed and then blackmailed by the Ukrainians.
That is my clear understanding.

Well, then; IT'S TRUE!
Democrat Mike Quigley went on record today in Congress as saying "hearsay can be MUCH better evidence than direct evidence."; 11/14/19, 8:21 AM
MayBee said...: ADDED: Henninger doesn't talk about this, but I think voters may see the Democrats as doing something close to what they're accusing Trump of doing — using governmental power for personal political gain.

Exactly, and they almost admit as much when they reiterate that Impeachment is not a criminal process, but a political one. Does it really exist just to politically dump the guy you don't like? If so, why hasn't it been used a million times before?

I can't imagine Obama secretly talking with Iran and cooking up a reason to send them billions of dollars while subvetring our banking laws didn't use back channels and raise a lot of eyebrows. At the time, he was threatening Congress not to impose sanctions on Iran. Are we supposed to imagine he was doing this for the good of *our* country and not for his own self-defined victory? If the people who listen in on phone calls could keep their mouths shut for that, why did they suddenly start yapping when Flynn talked to the Russian Ambassador (and not stop since); 11/14/19, 8:22 AM
gilbar said...: Seeing Red said... We need that new deal with Canada and Mexico.

Where's Our USCMA? WHERE'S OUR USCMA??? WHERE'S OUR USCMA?????; 11/14/19, 8:23 AM
Tank said...: rcocean said...
The DNC press is absolutely in the Tank for the D's.

Wait a minute there.; 11/14/19, 8:24 AM
Michael K said...: My understanding is that military aid was not delayed, and was also not provided by the Obama administration.

Not mentioned, of course. Still trying to decide what would be best for the Senate. Now they are saying they will insist on a trial.

“There’s some people talking about trying to stop the bill, dismiss charges basically as soon as they get over here. I think that’s not going to happen. That would require 51 votes,” Cornyn told reporters Wednesday. “I think it would be hard to find 51 votes to cut the case off before the evidence is presented.”

There may be several reasons. They may be insisting they are not beholden to Trump. They may be insisting that the evidence will be good for Trump and make them look neutral.

It does give people like Romney the opportunity for mischief.; 11/14/19, 8:24 AM
n.n said...: He is conflating corruption with "Bidens". Perhaps that's a revelation. Those "murderous little green men" mitigated the progress of a humanitarian crisis forced by a consensus of Western and Kiev ambition and corruption. The humanitarian crises (e.g. trail of tears, waterboarded children, refugee crisis, slavery, gun running from Libya to rebels) that was forced in Libya, in Syria, in Egypt, etc. and evolved in the greater Middle East in a vacuum, in an abandonment of Americans, and the so-called "Spring" following the end of the Iraq War. Meanwhile, China is effectively colonizing Africa with men isolated and excluded following the regime's selective-child days, genocide (e.g. immigration reform and diversity) in Mongolia, clinical cannibalism of its Muslim population, and progress near and abroad. These were the heady days of peace, and a segue to witch hunts and warlock trials held for anyone who would oppose their progress.; 11/14/19, 8:24 AM
iowan2 said...: There were meetings, advisers gave advice. When were those meetings? Who was there? What was said?

Why are we bombarded with these generalities encouraging us to come to our own conclusions when there is a paper trail and a host of witnesses who can tell us how this decision was made?

You're right. The existence of the meetings demonstrates POTUS was not running wild, operating on his own worst motivations. Dis-positive to the narrative. There are dozens of these factoids floating in this soft coup bile, being forced on us by Democrats.; 11/14/19, 8:25 AM
Dust Bunny Queen said...: Francisco D said...
A friend of my wife was talking to her hairdresser and he told them that one of his friends overheard that Ambassador Taylor was at a wild Ukrainian sex party with Adam Schiff. He believes that they were filmed and then blackmailed by the Ukrainians.
That is my clear understanding.

LOL.

The Lyrics to THIS song by REO Speedwagon were running through my head while listening to Jim Jordon sum up the insanity.; 11/14/19, 8:27 AM
n.n said...: It does give people like Romney the opportunity for mischief.

Beware overlapping and converging interests. Obama, Clinton, Biden did not progress alone in their ambition and corruption.; 11/14/19, 8:27 AM
Leland said...: voters may see the Democrats as doing something close to what they're accusing Trump of doing — using governmental power for personal political gain.

I noticed that when Hillary's excuse for a private server was to prevent having to respond to FOIA request. Usually politicians want to be seen doing things by the public, but there are a few things politicians don't want to be seen doing, and she was doing enough of those things that she needed her daily work hidden from the public.; 11/14/19, 8:28 AM
Joe Biden, America's Putin said...: The kind of bullshit corruptocrats are trying to sell:

Hearsay is better than direct evidence.; 11/14/19, 8:30 AM
Joe Biden, America's Putin said...: DBQ - I've had an REO speedwagon song stuck in my head all week. weird that you posted that.; 11/14/19, 8:32 AM
n.n said...: Trump acted to mitigate progress in Ukraine and in the process confronted corruption that threatened a government in Kiev beholden to Western and oligarchic interests and placed the people at persistent risk. Well, at least we're no longer discussing carving Turkey, slicing Syria, planning Iraq in order to establish Kurdovo.; 11/14/19, 8:36 AM
Joe Biden, America's Putin said...: No one is above the law.

Except Hillary and her deep state water-carriers.; 11/14/19, 8:36 AM
Joe Biden, America's Putin said...: I heard someone say that this Shcitt-Show is all for Corruptocrat party fund-raising.; 11/14/19, 8:38 AM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: This procedural beltway bullshit is why most people completely ignore politics and many will be shocked by the huuuge win Trump garners next year.; 11/14/19, 8:41 AM
stevew said...: Side note: on Brett Baier's program last night he went to video of Trump's reaction to yesterday's hearings, which came during a press appearance with Erdogan following a meeting of those two. I thought to myself, Erdogan is in Washington meeting with Trump and no one is talking about it? At least not in the A section.; 11/14/19, 8:43 AM
JPS said...: Remember the ultimate Kinsley gaffe from LTC Vindman: Trump was attempting to subvert the foreign policy of the United States.

Democrats should go with that. It's what they think, after all.; 11/14/19, 8:45 AM
rcocean said...: "There may be several reasons. They may be insisting they are not beholden to Trump. They may be insisting that the evidence will be good for Trump and make them look neutral."

Why should they want to appear neutral? This isn't a Serious Impeachment, its a partisan joke. And everyone knows it.

I'd put it differently. One, it hamstrings Trump, and gives them an excuse for doing nothing in terms of passing his agenda, which they don't like. Second, it may hurt the D's by preventing the D Senators from campaigning. But getting back to the legislation.

McConnell and his gang have zero desire to do anything that isn't on the "Big Donor" "Chamber of Commerce" agenda. The don't want to pass a new NAFTA, they don't want to reform the immigration laws, reduce drug prices, or build a border wall. Or do almost anything Trump wants. This impeachment gives them an excuse.; 11/14/19, 8:46 AM
rcocean said...: As for Turkey, who gives a Damn? I wonder who's been bought off, and why all these Senators are so incredibly concerned about what Turkey is doing. BTW, do you know that the Turkey is a Democracy, and the President is elected? You'd think from the way the Liberal MSM and all these R Senators talk he was a dictator. He's not.; 11/14/19, 8:49 AM
chickelit said...: Q: If they succeed in making us anxious and outraged about Trump, we'll also feel anxious and outraged about them. What do you do with that feeling? Turn away from politics? Take note of human nature, shrug it off, and keep playing, at least enough to cast a vote?

You assuage that feeling of anxiety by casting your vote for Hillary Clinton who is waiting to lead us all home.; 11/14/19, 8:51 AM
traditionalguy said...: Nothing here makes any sense until you realise that the War against treasonous corruption using foreign countries as cut outs for Soros's cash bribery schemes that have long owned owned the Dems and many RINOs, is advancing to a final great Battle. This last ditch move by Pelosi and friends is like the German's desperate Ardennes Offensive in December, 1944. If it works, they survive. If it fails, they will be imprisoned for their War Crimes.

The 100,000+ sealed Federal Indictments from the last two yearsof Grand Jury work done by Sessions, Durham,and Barr shall not return void. Pelossi hopes that when the arrests start all of her useless media shows Inquiring about Impeachment will have made the arrests seem more like Trumpian political revenge.

Nancy drinks more and Trump laughs.; 11/14/19, 8:57 AM
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...: I do take issue with Henninger calling Trump's interest in who assisted the Deep State Democrats in taking down his 2016 candidacy “monomania” as if the obsessive behavior in question is Trump’s. We should ALL want to know exactly who was sabotaging our elections. These WSJ guys all seem a little too much like their old colleague Glenn Simpson still.; 11/14/19, 8:57 AM
PB said...: A few things stood out.

1. As a witness has recounted their backgrounds it was all I served here I served there but there were no mention of concrete accomplishments. Those are resumes that would get bounced in the first review in the private sector.

2. They were questioned on some important matters involving the Ukraine that had been in the news for the last couple of years but both witnesses were surprisingly uninformed about these things or claimed to be. Not very good experts, are they.

3. Mike Quigley, hearsay testimony better than direct evidence? Really?; 11/14/19, 8:58 AM
MountainMan said...: I have been trying to avoid all this nonsense but my wife has had Fox News going non-stop all day yesterday and now this morning in another room. I just happened to see a couple of minutes of Rep. David Cicciline (D-RI) being interviewed by Bill Hemmer. Completely delusional. He does have his talking points down pat but I just don’t see how any of his comments align with the some of the transcripts of testimony from yesterday that I read last night. And Hemmer didn’t challenge him on anything, a real softball interview. Cicciline already has Trump tried, convicted, and on his way out of office.; 11/14/19, 8:59 AM
Bruce Hayden said...: “Also, the D's are hiding their star witness: Eric Ciaremella because if he told the truth the "Whistleblower" would be exposed as a Democrat Partisan hack who hates Trump.”

So, what happens when the Dems vote out articles of impeachment, and the Republicans in the Senate call him as their first witness?; 11/14/19, 9:03 AM
wildswan said...: rcocean said...
The DNC press is absolutely in the Tank for the D's.

I hear Tank is colluding with someone about something.; 11/14/19, 9:10 AM
Kevin said...: Why would the Republicans want to forestall a trial?

Call Schiff.

Call the whistleblower.

Call the Bidens.

Ensure this doesn’t go unpunished.; 11/14/19, 9:15 AM
NorthOfTheOneOhOne said...: Michael K said...

There may be several reasons. They may be insisting they are not beholden to Trump. They may be insisting that the evidence will be good for Trump and make them look neutral.

It does give people like Romney the opportunity for mischief.

And it also causes problems for the Harris, Booker, Klobuchar, and most significantly Warren campaigns. Don't forget that.; 11/14/19, 9:17 AM
Sebastian said...: "But why are Americans being forced to endure the elevation of the Ukraine saga into the current impeachment melodrama?

Why, oh, why? I'm sorry to see Henninger venture into Althouse territory.

"but I think voters may see the Democrats as doing something close to what they're accusing Trump of doing — using governmental power for personal political gain."

You may think so, and that's to your credit, but that's not how it's being played: just look at the front pages of the major newspapers today. Brave Dems are cleaning up Trump's mess with governmental truth tellers.

Of course, they know that many Althouses voted for Hill since they feared Trump's "chaos." They're just adding a little more chaos, trusting that the timid Hill voters will break their way again. It's not a bad gamble.; 11/14/19, 9:23 AM
Char Char Binks, Esq. said...: "That is my clear understanding."

Straight from the horse's mouth, and now we're getting it from the other end.; 11/14/19, 9:27 AM
narayanan said...: rehajm said... With a strong economy like we’ve had do voters really care about Congress legislating?
__________________
flip side : will any voter want to throw the bums out?; 11/14/19, 9:30 AM
Skeptical Voter said...: Francisco D--the hookers at the wild Ukrainian sex party looked at Little Pencil Necked Adam Schiff and said, in chorus--"You can't handle a sex party little boy--Nyet, Nyet, Nyet!"

On a more serious note I see that some Democrat Congress Critters are now critical of Trump for (allegedly) failing to support our very important Ukrainian ally in our struggle against our most serious enemy--Russia.

The caravan of course moves along and the dogs are still yapping---but I seem to recall Presidential Candidate Romney in 2012--chided by Obama when Romney said that our most serious global enemy was Russia. Qouth The New "Light" Worker, "The 80's are calling for their foreign policy back." Didn't those Democrat yappers get the memo from Obama?; 11/14/19, 9:50 AM
Dust Bunny Queen said...: I am laughing at the Democrats for saying that NO one knows who the whistle blower is. How can you accept testimony from someone that NOBODY has seen.

I envision this guy..... Eric Ciaremella.....as being the UNKNOWN Witness like the Unknown Comic from the Gong Show. The Wizard of Whoopie!!!! ..... (Good thing she had proof that proves that she is the mother of his baby.)

Is he going to show up with a brown paper bag over his head and talk in a funny voice.

Talk about Kangaroo Courts. Maybe Captain Kangaroo can officiate. Get Clarabell the clown to honk his horn every time someone says Eric Ciaremella. Honk honk honk.

I would watch this.; 11/14/19, 9:52 AM
Equipment Maintenance said...: Bruce Hayden said...So, what happens when the Dems vote out articles of impeachment, and the Republicans in the Senate call him (the WB) as their first witness?

I think he takes the fifth, and I think Shiff knows that's what he'll do, which is why he won't be called to testify in the House. If they're stupid enough to vote impeachment and give control of the process to R's in the Senate, they deserve what they get.; 11/14/19, 9:57 AM
narayanan said...: rcocean said...

"There may be several reasons. They may be insisting they are not beholden to Trump. They may be insisting that the evidence will be good for Trump and make them look neutral."

Why should they want to appear neutral?
__________________
could they be cruel also?; 11/14/19, 10:01 AM
Kevin said...: When will they ask State Department officials if they've heard of Trump peeing on the bed with hookers while he was in Russia?

Might as well work that into the "facts" which Schiff found.; 11/14/19, 10:02 AM
wildswan said...: "I caught the Swamp," said Trump.
I think that may be the point of the impeachment. If they would have left things alone, what would I know? Why are they going so far, I ask myself? As others are saying - why not oversight? Why not an election? Seems to me, this is an era of a paradigm shift in which new methods of corruption developed in response to America's position during the Nineties as the one remaining superpower are being exposed. Somehow Hunter Biden's position on Burisma may have been a way to do things which is replicated world-wide and the Swamp knew it. Maybe it was so obvious to them that an investigation of Burisma was a revelation of the Swamp Way that they twitched into action without thinking that nothing about the Ukraine and nothing about New-Mode Corruption was obvious to the American people and nothing about it interested them. The Ukraine? Zemslosky was accused by Ziprudsky of corruption and Shoehupsky was in investigating but Yerleansky said it was shamsky and so whatsky.

Then the Dems foolishly made it all comprehensible by saying "Trump is investigating Biden. Get Trump."
"No," says Trump, "I want the Ukrainian company, Burisma, investigated."
"Well," say these sailors on the Ship of Fools: "IT'S THE SAME THING!!!"
"Oh," say I and about 63 million others, "I did not know that."
"I caught the Swamp," says Trump.
Up pipes Captain Concussed Kangaroo: "Impeach Trump. Everybody knew Burisma and the Biden's were the same thing, just the way everybody knew about Jeffrey Epstein and Harvey Weinstein."
"Oh," say I and about 63 million others, "I did not used to know any of that but I'm a learner. And so we should impeach Trump because you can't expose corruption in the Ukraine or probably anywhere else without tripping over some Dem Presidential candidate or his son or his campaign manager and investigating Dems Presidential candidates and campaigns is not allowed. OK. Dobroho ranku, Ukraine. I get what's happeninskying, Trump caught the swamp, as promised and is reeling it in like giant fighting alligator."; 11/14/19, 10:04 AM
narayanan said...: If RBG can "workfromhome" and vote on cases - why not Senators "workfromcampaign" and vote on impeachment?; 11/14/19, 10:05 AM
narciso said...: I know consider the source

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1194798232179597312.html; 11/14/19, 10:06 AM
Amadeus 48 said...: "I think voters may see the Democrats as doing something close to what they're accusing Trump of doing — using governmental power for personal political gain."

Well, I never! Who would think such a thing?

Well, that might be a strategy. I'll leave that up to others. I'm just a lowly worker. [coy smile]; 11/14/19, 10:12 AM
narciso said...: Worst nazi evarr

https://thefederalist.com/2019/11/14/trump-administration-vows-to-fight-eu-decision-to-put-warning-labels-on-jewish-products/#disqus_thread; 11/14/19, 10:23 AM
Gospace said...: gilbar said...
...................
Talk to Sam Grant about that! Oh, that's right, you can't; he died of throat cancer in 1885
Plenty of books about it though. Every report of Grant's drinking came from people that:
Weren't there, at the time/place reported
Hated Grant, usually on account of because he fired them for incompetence

I think the teetotaler Trump would reply as Lincoln did: "Find out what whiskey he's drinking and send a barrel to every general." Grant fought.

Trump fights. Reason enough to support him.; 11/14/19, 10:27 AM
Bay Area Guy said...: I don't care what his resume is, Taylor is a clueless goofball. He is allowing himself to be used by the "Get Trump" Squad to help impeach our President, by pretending to be a honest public servant, a man of upright rectitude. Like many of his bureaucrat buddies, he doesn't understand how unimportant he is to the average voter. The President - elected by 63 Million voters - directs our foreign policy, not Ambassadors. We don't give a shit whether Taylor was "concerned" about "irregular channels". Stay in your lane, dumbass.; 11/14/19, 10:43 AM
JAORE said...: "While Trump may have the authority to unilaterally stop aid payments, he didn't do it on the fly. There were meetings, advisers gave advice. When were those meetings? Who was there? What was said?

"Why are we bombarded with these generalities encouraging us to come to our own conclusions when there is a paper trail and a host of witnesses who can tell us how this decision was made?"

Yeah [dumb ass implied]. Every time the left gets butt burn over Trump's decisions, let's open up all conversations, notes and opinions of everyone in every meeting. Especially those involving foreign leaders. Yep no brainstorming topic dismissed and NOT put on the table. No comment on how trustworthy a "trusted friend" really is in the eyes of POTUS, the CIA, State left unpublished.

Yeah boy, GREAT idea.; 11/14/19, 10:46 AM
John henry said...: Gilbar,

Re Sam Grant:

The story is told that during the trials of war in the West, General Grant began to indulge too freely in liquor. His chief of staff, Rawlins, boldly ventured to tell him so. That this was the act of a true friend Grant fully recognized.

"You do not mean that? I was wholly unconscious of it. I am surprised!" said the General.

"Yes, I do mean it. It is even beginning to be a subject of comment among your officers."

"Why did you not tell me before? I'll never drink a drop of liquor again."

He never did. Time after time in later years, dining with the Grants in New York, I have seen the General turn down the wine-glasses at his side.

Andrew Carnegie autobiography (excellent book. Also excellent is Carnegie's bio of James Watt)

On the other hand:

"When the legend becomes fact print the legend."

The man who shot liberty valence

John Henry; 11/14/19, 11:23 AM
n.n said...: let's open up all conversations, notes and opinions of everyone in every meeting. Especially those involving foreign leaders.

Cooperate or we'll Gaddafi you, then redistribute your resources... and we'll even throw in some Americans as a good faith measure, so that you know we are ambitious and furious.; 11/14/19, 11:26 AM
Sam L. said...: I'm not anxious, but I am angry with the Dems.; 11/14/19, 11:46 AM
JPS said...: About Grant's drinking: Sherman would be a firsthand source -

"Grant stood by me when I was crazy, and I stood by him when he was drunk, and now we stand by each other."

- if that quotation really came from Sherman. I haven't seen it debunked, but as Thomas Jefferson said, don't trust everything you read on the internet.; 11/14/19, 11:49 AM
Francisco D said...: Grant stood by me when I was crazy, and I stood by him when he was drunk, and now we stand by each other."

Grant had been a drunk in the past, but not when he was commanding the Union Armies. How can a drunk get up before dawn every day and write out marching orders to his generals in great detail?

I think it was Shelby Foote who wrote that Grant spent three hours every morning writing out precise orders. I know from his autobiography that Grant likes to write and is actually quite a good writer.; 11/14/19, 11:56 AM
narciso said...: How about that:

https://mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKBN1XO1HK?__twitter_impression=true; 11/14/19, 12:20 PM
John henry said...: Francisco,

Someone here recommended chernows bio of grant earlier this year and I read the sample. Sounded good but then I decided to read Grant's own words instead.

Really excellent book.

I've read Carnegie's autobio as well as his bio of watt several times over the years. I am always amazed at how good a writer he is. Extremely readable. Amazing considering he grew up poor and had a total of 3 months schooling.

I have a bit of expertise with steam engines and he gets all the technical and engineering both readable and right.

Both books are available as free audio books at librivox.org both very well read.

John Henry; 11/14/19, 12:30 PM
narciso said...: Crazy notion:

https://thehill.com/opinion/white-house/470420-the-president-not-diplomats-sets-official-foreign-policy?amp&__twitter_impression=true; 11/14/19, 12:49 PM
hstad said...: AA, not to put a damper on this meme, but not everyone is hyped and the real "bombshell" is from CNN's Chief Legal Analyst Jeffrey Toobin who said, "...neither witness “had direct contact with the president…that’s a problem...” Adam Schiff has lost CNN the most anti-Trump outlet!; 11/14/19, 1:57 PM
minnesota farm guy said...: I agree with those who feel that a "do-nothing" Congress is generally to be desired. However in this Congress there are two particular matters that would greatly benefit Americans if they were addressed: USMCA; and a resolution of the status of the so-called DACA people. Both issues could be dealt with fairly easily with a bit if flexibility and compromise. Trump has already made an opening bid on DACA that went no where. The Dems of course refused to make a counteroffer so the the DACA generation remains in jeopardy and will probably lose their temporary protection at SCOTUS. Of course, Trump will never campaign on the Democratic irresponsibility toward this group. It would be ungentlemanly!

I watched excepts from Taylor's testimony and though he seems a nice guy and fairly honest my takeaway was that he had no direct evidence of a quid pro quo; had never communicated such to the Ukrainians; and that he admitted he had no direct knowledge what Trump was thinking about aid to Ukraine.; 11/14/19, 2:30 PM
Martin said...: I tend to agree with Henninger--if something appears irregular about all this, the Foreign Relations Committee can look into it. Elevating it to impeachment, and having that process in the Intel rather than Judiciary Committee or a special committee formed for the purpose if Pelosi doesn't trust Nadler as some reports say, is just risible and I suspect (and hope) that next November the Dems will pay a big price for putting the country through this.

Old saying, "Pigs get fed, hogs get slaughtered." Trump gives the Democrats plenty of irregular things they could look into and use to build a political case against his re-election, and every week or two there is another juicy morsel. But they can't just accept the gifts he gives them, they have to overreach.

I do not subscribe to the school that holds Trump is a master strategist/politician, constantly trolling and manipulating his opponents. But at times like this, I wonder...; 11/15/19, 11:57 AM