From the October 9, 2016 debate transcript:
TRUMP: [Y]ou should really be apologizing for... the 33,000 e-mails that you deleted, and that you acid washed, and then the two boxes of e-mails and other things last week that were taken from an office and are now missing. And I’ll tell you what. I didn’t think I’d say this, but I’m going to say it, and I hate to say it. But if I win, I am going to instruct my attorney general to get a special prosecutor to look into your situation, because there has never been so many lies, so much deception. There has never been anything like it, and we’re going to have a special prosecutor.... we’re going to look into it, because you know what? People have been—their lives have been destroyed for doing one-fifth of what you’ve done. And it’s a disgrace. And honestly, you ought to be ashamed of yourself....You can say is that what we want from a President, but that is what the people voted for.
CLINTON: … because everything he just said is absolutely false, but I’m not surprised.
TRUMP: Oh, really?
CLINTON: In the first debate…[laughter]
RADDATZ: And really, the audience needs to calm down here.
CLINTON: … I told people that it would be impossible to be fact-checking Donald all the time. I’d never get to talk about anything I want to do and how we’re going to really make lives better for people. So, once again, go to HillaryClinton.com. We have literally Trump—you can fact check him in real time. Last time at the first debate, we had millions of people fact checking, so I expect we’ll have millions more fact checking, because, you know, it is—it’s just awfully good that someone with the temperament of Donald Trump is not in charge of the law in our country.
TRUMP: Because you’d be in jail.
Posts
156 comments:
Our Beloved Professor Althouse said...
You can say is that what we want from a President, but that is what the people voted for
And THAT, is The Impeachable Offense
She should be in jail. She broke laws, repeatedly. Laws for which lesser mortals who made smaller breaches were imprisoned by the administration of which she was a part.
There is a lot I do not like about Trump. His willingness to pursue public corruption is not one of those things.
If the Obama FBI and DOJ did its job - and didn't point shave the entire investigation - Hillary would have been indicted and convicted.
Not even a close case! She destroyed evidence!
Immunity deals galore and nothing in return. No grand jury impaneled. Comey made the no prosecution decision contra to SOP.
What we want in a president is the willingness to put no one above the law.
So yes, this is what we want in a president.
I question the intelligence, judgment, and values of anyone who says otherwise.
Short answer: Yes.
Making corruption unprofitable is a policy that's used as deterrence.
I can't think of anybody in politics in the last fifty years as corrupt as the Clintons. Yes, they should bein jail, if we had equal justice under the law. What she did to circumvent accountability as Secretary of State alone should carry a heavy fine and possibly jail time. And that is only a small portion of her life-long corruption.
Setting up the private server to hide her communications was illegal and wrong on its face. More important is the reason that she decided to do it. She didn't want her globe-spanning pay for play operation to be scrutinized.
Heck we could go all the way back to the Miracle of the Cattle Futures and conclude she is at least as crooked as Bernie Madoff.
I'd prefer that an incoming administration not find it necessary to investigate its predecessor. For that to work, though, the predecessor needs to not be corrupt on an intergalactic scale.
It's not political enemies. It's wrongdoers.
Post assumes facts not in evidence. We only know Hillary was Trump’s political opponent. It would take some investigation to conclude she was his political enemy.
If Bernie Sanders had won, does anyone think there would have been chants of "lock him up!" No, because the chants of "Lock her up!" are generated not by Donald Trump's powerful personality, but by Hillary Clinton's degenerate malfeasance.
I don’t find a private citizen proclaiming his disdain for high ranking politicians that commit thousands of felonies to be all that chilling
He's not promising to prosecute people because they are his enemies (real or perceived).
Otherwise, Nancy Pelosi and Adam Schiff would be under indictment, but they are not. Trump is dealing with them in the political arena
Most rational Americans know that if they had done what she did they would be financially ruined or in jail or both. I had various security clearances to fairly high levels for 40 years. I got twice a year briefing telling me the punishments for the violations she committed. There was no intent required for the punishments. All those punishments included jail time.
Before the election, I had talked with a liberal couple in California who also worked in the aerospace industry. They were aghast at what she had done and considered the whole presidential election an awful choice between a very probable corrupt criminal and a blow hard.
I'm glad the blow hard won.
I would just like to announce today that I plan to run in every presidential campaign for the remainder of my natural life. As a result of my perpetual run for the highest office in the land, anything I may have done in the past is entirely off-limits to any investigation. To even suggest I should be investigated is an insult to democracy itself. Thank you and God bless America.
Hillary lecturing us all about the supposed wrongdoings of Trump is like a severely inebriated alcoholic lectoring a casual drinker that they're drinking too much. In fact, you could extend that analogy out to most of the prominent Democrats and various deep staters of the swamp. Those who live in glass houses...
New Rule: Everyone is subject to investigation and prosecution except those running for office as Democrats against Trump.
Got it.
Chilling to who? That was music to my ears, but they still haven't played a single note of the song. Chilling is Democrat party members announcing that ads critical of Democrat party members should not be permitted to be broadcast.
Hillary is a criminal and should be in prison along with many of her cohorts.
"So yes, this is what we want in a president.
I question the intelligence, judgment, and values of anyone who says otherwise."
So do I, tim.
Breaking the law should lead to prosecution. With no "except if your name is Clinton" or other bullshit exceptions.
Trump needs to start farting around and get AG Barr to get a team of prosecutors to go after Obama and all of his miscreants. The country should have known that when you elect a Chicago politician corruption from top to bottom is absolutely guaranteed.
The problem for the impeaching Democrats is two-fold here:
(1) the Democrats have spent the last 4 years trying to prosecute Trump and his staff using false information literally purchased from foreign sources in Russia and elsewhere. This isn't a conspiracy theory of anyone- it really did happen as outlined in the Mueller Report. No one with any integrity of any kind can deny this happened.
(2) and for this particular issue, the main problem is that the Bidens are almost certainly guilty of influence peddling. If Hunter Biden had been some outstanding businessman with a with a long reputation of success dating back to when his father wasn't Vice President of the United States assigned the task of handling relations with China and Ukraine, perhaps Hunter Biden's business dealings wouldn't matter very much. However, Hunter Biden is a complete loser with a known cocaine habit who suddenly was being paid millions of dollars by Chinese and Ukraine "business" interests as the corresponding governments were negotiating with his father. This will be the bulk of Trump's defense when this goes to Senate trial after impeachment, and it won't look good for the Democrats or Barack Obama.
She SHOULD be in jail...along with a lot of others in the previous administration.
The Democrat Immunity Act already passed and signed into law per the DC Swamp. Hillary should have been in jail, as others have stated. Of course, Trump was just using "Campaign Rhetoric" since his AG's have done NOTHING to "Put Hillary in Jail".
I love the idea that looking into Biden's open -and bragged about - corruption is somehow an impeachable office. Its like something out of the Babylon Bee.
She committed a crime.
She set up a Private SERVER to run her pay-to-play emails in secret while she headed up the STATE Dept.
She mis-handled classified information. A crime.
But most of all, she did it in order to HIDE her secret dealings. Dealings that poured money into their Family Foundation.
She then went on to delete 30,000 subpoenaed e-mails.
Cash Flowed to Clinton Foundation Amid Russian Uranium Deal
If you're a democrat - your crimes vanish as time passes?
And, we can talk about the Clinton Foundation. It isn't any accident at all that the donations to the Clinton Foundation collapsed the minute Trump won the election- almost literally dropped to nothing. The Clintons used the foundation to pay family members and important political staff large salaries for what is apparently no work at all in charity. It was nothing but campaign contributions and literal bribes, and all of it ended the night Clinton lost and couldn't make good on the quo.
After the "Pussy Grabbing" video, I honestly thought DJT was toast. I was already skeptical of him, but committed to voting for him because I thought Hillary was so horrid.
And, then, Trump had that debate, and brought Juanita Broaderick, Kathleen Willey and Paula Jones (the Bill Clinton sexual harrassment victims) to it, and then went off on Hillary.
I thought to myself, this guy is playing a different game. He actually plays to win.
#MAGA
"It's not political enemies. It's wrongdoers."
Well put, but I have to say this leaves me torn. Yes, no one is (or should be) above the law. But the precedent of criminally prosecuting someone who's running against you, or high officials in the preceding administration, leaves me feeling pretty queasy. There's a certain "banana republic" feel to it.
On the whole Ukraine/Biden thing, I note the criticism of asking another country to assist in investigating your "political rival" (even assuming Trump viewed Biden as the likely nominee back in July). But hypothetically: What if Biden wasn't running? Then it would be okay? And if so, does that mean that continuing to seek high office insulates you from investigation/prosecution? Reminds me of Berlusconi, and I don't think that's what we're shooting for here.
LOL - I do like how the hack CNN guy lectures the audience to shut up.
It is illegal to cheer the idea of a Clinton paying for her crimes.
It's illegal to dig for dirt on Clinton Corruption. Biden too, now!
Meanwhile, Sasse the asse has given us his pearls of wisdom. Namely, "We don't go to Commie Chinks and ask for help" or some such nonsense. This from a clown who wants to give the Commie Chinks hundreds of $Billions in one-sided trade deals, and has opposed Trump on the Border and "Free" trade.
"TRUMP: Because you’d be in jail."
But she isn't. Promise broken. I'd like Trump to stay on task. Instead, he's a loose cannon that occasionally hits the target.
Althouse has never acknowledged that Hillary broke the law. And that she committed multiple felonies--like using a private server for her email (where every email could be charged as a felony [once a certain point was reached] under the new law that went into effect when Obama was inaugurated.) Or letting people without a security clearance have access to secret communications, like her daughter and her maid as she acknowledged. Those are slam-dunk convictions only requiring that the gov't prove that it happened--and the bathroom server is the proof and the emails--all of them--are confirmation. People have spent years in jail because their girlfriend checked her email on a laptop with classified information.
She also doesn't make it clear that Democrats are labeling ordinary and expected Presidential behavior a crime and having the Media shout it out with tearful concerned faces.
It's illegal to travel to the Ukraine to ask questions.
Unless you're a D. Then not only is it OK - you're son can make millions.
your
I never wanted Hillary in jail, or even indicted. Too disruptive to the country.
What I did want is somebody, ANYBODY that assisted in her crimes and cover-up indicted and put on trial so we could have a finding of facts on the record.
Instead, the FBI/DOJ gave everyone around her immunity, destroyed all incriminating evidence, and allow Hillary to run around proclaiming how innocent she is to this very day.
The chilling part is that anyone anywhere voted for her->
That is chilling.
Clinton provided the last opportunity for our government and their media acolytes to prove to the unwashed masses that the system wasn't totally corrupt. Instead they punted because showing any kind of honest integrity would have inconvenienced the DNC. To add to it, I'm now supposed to support impeachment because these same people, through their biased, word-parsing interpretations, are convinced Trump said something improper? Yeah, GFY.
It's time for them to reap what they sowed.
Hillary certainly belongs in jail. She kept State Department emails private, subverting the concept that State serves the US, not Hillary. She mishandled classified documents. The Clinton foundation was corrupt. Why wouldn't I support a president who thinks crime and corruption should be punished.
Why hasn't Hunter Biden come on the TV shows to answer questions or sit for an interview with the NYT? Don Jr. and Eric Trump are on Twitter and tv all the time.
Hunter is pretty quiet -- quietly making lucrative side deals, like a leech, off his father's political access.
Hunter is quiet about the lucrative Ukraine and China side deals.
Obama is quiet about the campaign.
What does that say about Biden?
They had to invent charges to open an investigation against trump, theres a dozen statutes she violated.
Donald Trump, the 2016 candidate, was open about his plan to prosecute his political enemies.
Can you not say that every Democratic candidate for 2020 is open about their plans to prosecute their political enemy?
Donald Trump, the 2016 candidate, was open about his plan to prosecute his political enemies. Remember "Because you'd be in jail."
What a NYT/WP/CNN style of mischaracterization of the facts.
Trump was open about investigating and prosecuting corrupt politicians who were -- and still are -- corruptly politically protected. He was open about removing the obstructions of justice that have allowed above-the-law criminals to run rampant in government.
Hillary stays out of jail and will continue to stay out of jail because she has the goods on politicians who are just as corrupt as her.
The Media knows this, but still shills for her. That is because they are th "cool kids" no matter how venal and corrupt they may be.
Enemies of the American people, not merely or in particular his personal enemies. That his political interests are aligned with our national interest is a feature, not a bug.
Dark Helmet says: "I can't think of anybody in politics in the last fifty years as corrupt as the Clintons." Neither can I. I don't think we've seen a complete dissection of how they used the Clinton Foundation to launder illegal payments and "campaign donations".
Hahaha. This is fantastic. One of your finest posts.
The post and gilbar's first comment pretty much say it all.
And yet, he is President and she is not in jail.
Keeping campaign promises again.The delay has been the fight to clear our President of Media Storms cooked up in detail by the corrupt CIA/FBI/DOJ/NSA/State Dept all accusing him of exactly whatever they were doing.
As one writer said they accuse Trump of a bucket full of dirt and ignore Hillary's Landfill of garbage.
Funny this topic comes up. I was thinking recently of this debate and how Trump's physical wandering during her answering sessions & coming near her rattled her so much. She nearly loses her composure. Now that we know Trump better, I was wondering if Trump did that on purpose.
a special prosecutor.... we’re going to look into it, because you know what? People have been—their lives have been destroyed for doing one-fifth of what you’ve done.
Not a political enemy, but injection of some consistency. Not selective, opportunistic legal and ethical standards. Not witch hunts and warlock trials.
Speaking is illegal, if you're Trump.
Money grubbing is fine, if you're a D.
Got it.
Trump is doing what he was elected to do. Hillary, the Bidens, Comey, Rosenstein, countless others belong in jail.
I feel like a god-damned fool every time I obey some law that I don't like, and could probably get away with ignoring.
No wonder they hate him so much.
This gets at one of the things that has bedeviled our politics for the last quarter-century: the need to give Bill and Hillary Clinton a pass because politics.
You can legitimately criticize Republican/conservative behavior under Trump, Obama, and Bush but this current era of bad feelings started with the Democrats with Bill Clinton. They violated so many norms and trashed so many standards for Bill and Hillary and then had to engage in ever-increasing amounts of hypocrisy and denial about it that they poisoned the well in the public square.
That doesn't let Republicans/conservatives off the hook, of course. We're all responsible for our own actions. But if you want to know how we got to where we are, a good place to start is pondering the standing ovations given to accused rapist Bill Clinton at every Democratic National Convention since 2000.
Mike
Is there a coed federal prison somewhere where they can be cell mates?
"TRUMP: [Y]ou should really be apologizing for... the 33,000 e-mails that you deleted, and that you acid washed, and then the two boxes of e-mails and other things last week that were taken from an office and are now missing."
It truly saddens me that there are Americans, lots of them, who apparently believe she does not belong in jail. It's depressing. I think I'll get out the cookie dough and watch some more math videos.
Promising to put political crooks isn't chilling.
"Before the election, I had talked with a liberal couple in California who also worked in the aerospace industry. They were aghast at what she had done and considered the whole presidential election an awful choice between a very probable corrupt criminal and a blow hard.
"I'm glad the blow hard won."
But why is "the greatest nation on earth" (sic) condemned to such miserable choices between greater and lesser evils in each presidential election? No matter who wins, we're stuck with shits in the White House (and Congress).
At the same time it was revealed that Hillary told her minion to strip the security classification off of emails and send them to her, a sailor was convicted of taking personal photos of the sub he was working on.
Convicted and jailed.
Hillary also directed her minions to destroy thousands of emails, several of which were judged to be classified, to hide her tracks.
This is why I blame Gerald Ford for starting it all by setting the precedent of pardoning Nixon. He should have been tried, with the evidence out in the open. Then, after his conviction, Ford could have pardoned him, but at least the facts -- all the facts -- would be out in the open.
Of course, if you think Trump was going after his political enemies and that is wrong, I'll await your judgment of all these Democrats going after their political enemies now, to the point of convicting Trump before he has even been investigated.
If you say you believe in the rule of law, then apply it to everyone.
Clean up on aisle D!
Not chilling at all. That effing bitch has been considered above the law for so long, she just smiles and discards anyone else's viewpoint, knowing she is safe from prosecution.
Put a Charlie Hebdo artist's tattoo rendition of the prophet Mohammed on her forehead and throw her in with the prisoners at Guantanamo. That'll take that effing smile off her face real quick.
Hillary is still corrupt and never paid a price.
Sad.
Democracy Dies in Darkness.
So why didn’t Trump seek a special prosecutor like he said he would? Not really fair to call someone a crook when you have the power to initiate a formal investigation but elect not to.
But why is "the greatest nation on earth" (sic) condemned to such miserable choices between greater and lesser evils in each presidential election? No matter who wins, we're stuck with shits in the White House (and Congress).
Cookie,
I don't see any evil in Trump. There is an annoying quality to his sometimes oafish presentation that really stands out, but not evil.
Maybe you can explain.
"But why is "the greatest nation on earth" (sic) condemned to such miserable choices between greater and lesser evils in each presidential election?"
Because no one in their right mind would subject themselves to this. Maybe if we started putting the crooks in jail for running their scams, normal people would be willing to enter the arena.
But why is "the greatest nation on earth" (sic) condemned to such miserable choices between greater and lesser evils in each presidential election.
Because politicians are people that desire power over other people, which is inherently evil. (And inevitably corrupting.)
But why is "the greatest nation on earth" (sic) condemned to such miserable choices between greater and lesser evils in each presidential election?
I think this is an interesting question. Some working theories: They aren't miserable choices you're just impossible to please. It's one of the few professions where sociopathy is a valuable skill. Crime pays in politics.
a quick link to our Professor's Favorite Newssite:
Dems Worried If Impeachment Fails They'll Have To Nominate Electable Candidate
WASHINGTON, D.C.—Democrats are beginning to grow worried that if their impeachment effort fails, they'll have to resort to plan B: nominating an electable candidate and winning an election.
"The real danger here," said Nancy Pelosi in a meeting of top Democrats, "is that the normal way of getting rid of a president---impeachment---fails. Then, we'd have to try to find someone who isn't a smug, smarmy doofus and get the public to like them."
@Robert cook: "But why is "the greatest nation on earth" (sic) condemned to such miserable choices between greater and lesser evils in each presidential election? No matter who wins, we're stuck with shits in the White House (and Congress)."
now there is a question for the ages.
This is another reason why populist politicians like Trump gain traction: To root out corruption in higher government.
It's one of the reasons The People decided to turn away from the GOP-e.
If there's no consequences for political corruption, then you'll get more political corruption.
There is some good news today though: Apparently there are more and more on the Left who have had it with Get Trump By Any Means Necessary, and they're starting to make their voices heard. Check out Aaron Mate. He was very critical of RussiaGate, and he thinks this latest impeachment effort is a complete waste of time on the part of the Dems.
Robert Cook said...
But why is "the greatest nation on earth" (sic) condemned to such miserable choices between greater and lesser evils in each presidential election? No matter who wins, we're stuck with shits in the White House (and Congress).
_____________
Buwaya - call your office >>>> Robert Cook wants to talk (and learn maybe)
"This is why I blame Gerald Ford for starting it all by setting the precedent of pardoning Nixon. He should have been tried, with the evidence out in the open. Then, after his conviction, Ford could have pardoned him, but at least the facts -- all the facts -- would be out in the open."
That was the point...to prevent all the facts from being brought out in the open.
Fulfilling your oath to "take care that the laws be faithfully executed" is not a wrongful prosecution of your political enemies.
So, running for President (as a Democrat) exempts one from the law?????
This from a LAW Professor!!!
in May 2013, Biden was selected as a direct commission officer in the U.S. Navy Reserve, receiving an age-related waiver and a second waiver due to a past drug-related incident. Joe Biden administered the commissioning oath to Hunter Biden in a White House ceremony.
The following month, Biden tested positive for cocaine during a urinalysis test and was subsequently discharged.
So,
Hunter had No Qualifications for Military Service
No ROTC
No Service Academy
No Military Prep School
No Jr ROTC {which means; I have more military Qualifications than Hunter did}
But, they gave him a DIRECT COMMISSION, for some reason
Oh, AND he was TOO OLD (but; got a Waiver, for some reason)
Oh, AND he had a prior Drug Record (but; got a Waiver, for some reason)
Then, , for some reason; when he was sworn in, he was sworn in: by Jo Biden
THEN, He Lasted LESS THAN A MONTH before he was kicked out, for being a cokehead
Isn't That FUN?
If you destroyed federal records of meetings with foreigners at a time when they were flooding your “foundation” with hundreds of millions in donations, you would be in jail, well, as long as you are not a powerful Democrat
https://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politics/2016/0705/Did-Hillary-Clinton-violate-protocol-by-using-burn-bags
We have a deposition under oath from Huma Abidin that she did it..... Nothing.
I think people are not paying attention to the vast number of citizens that would cheer if Trump instructed the military to throw the Clintons into a volcano...regardless of whether it is legal.
Hillary is speaking at University of Michigan soon! Talk about ethics!
If you stay. in Trump’s DC hotel you are doing it to curry favor, but if you gave, as Putin’s cronies in Russia did, $150 million to Hillary’s foundation, and $500K for dinner with bill, as Putin did, it’s simply value for money, no currying of favor occurs.
Also, John Podesta was given 70 thousand shares of stock in a “clean energy” company owned by Russian energy giant Gazprom, which the day before the election was worth many millions, and the day after, was worthless. You know who else is involved in a “clean energy” company, but in the Ukraine? Nancy Pelosi’s son.
It is little wonder that they are fighting hammer and tongs against any more rocks being uncovered by Trump. Trump is like Beowulf, first he defeated Grendel’s mother, now he is cleaning out the trolls nest.
She is still not in jail. Either he, as president, is not in charge of our laws or he wasn't serious.
Hillary Clinton absolutely should be in jail. She doesn't even deny her mishandling of classified info. Comey's babble about her lack of criminal intent in her breach of security protocols is nothing but bullshit. The crime is in the deliberate failure to follow the protocols that were agreed to as a condition of her security clearance. What she did or didn't mean to do with the classified info has no bearing on her criminal culpability.
Got a problem where you need the attention of the US Department of State? Well, our Secretary of State, appointed by the President of the United States, Barack H Obama and confirmed by the United States Senate, has a foundation, and if you really want a meeting with her, you would do well to make an eye catching “donation.”
Don’t worry! If there’s an investigation, we will destroy all of the evidence! Fuck Congress!
Imagine if it were Donald Trump who had done that.
You promote corrupt people to the top of your party, you vote for them, lie for them, and defend them, and then you are exasperated when someone from the other party wants them investigated? The problem isn't just corrupt politicians. You who defend them are yourselves corrupt for doing it. I'd rather be deplorable.
Just line up the reasonable charges side by side against Trump versus Hillary and Biden, and you will find it very lopsided in numbers, seriousness, and the volume and veracity of the proof. Trump is being accused of what his enimies are known to have done, while they find no actual proof or even a crime against him. Could Hillary or Biden stand up to two years of a special prosecutor on them? If the intelligence community wanted them brought down it would be like shooting fish in a barrel, but they seem to be having quite a problem finding anything on Trump that they didn't manufacture themselves.
After seeing all the investigating of Trump we have been through, and seeing what has come of it, it's hard not to conclude that Trump may be proven to be the most honest politician ever to hold the office of President. I wonder even if "Honest Abe" could come out so clean.
Before the election I reassured Trump hating friends that he would be pretty ineffectual. And mostly he has been. I felt vindicated when he airily dismissed pursuing her after the election. He is mostly hot air. I often find the resulting breeze amusing though.
Hillary's lack of criminal intent is a perfect match with Comey's.
I don’t think that the West has seen a foreign minister as nakedly for sale as Hillary since Tallyrand. When you and I read about it, we felt disgust for Tallyrand and France treating the US like a benighted colony, Hillary read about the XYZ Affair and was taking it as a “How To” and wondering how she could apply it to countries like the Ukraine.
I just don’t think that reporters shouting down Trump’s answers because he wasn’t going to fall for their moronic litte traps, or countenence their little DNC soundbites as questions is going to fly among anybody who is remotely fair minded.
He didn’t put her in jail because he didn’t want to go the banana republic route. It turns out that he has no choice on that matter, since the Democrats are gone full on banana republic with Burisma as their version of the United Fruit Company. Plus, they attacked first with their special counsel fraud, run by the very guy who destroyed evidence Congress had subpoenaed ,on behalf of Hillary, of course.
This is Kafka grade gaslighting.
As Bill Clinton supposedly said, "it’s hard for your opponent to badmouth you when you have your fist in HIS mouth.” That’s their defense, and it isn’t going to fly when fully exposed, except among the true beleivers.
Where are all of the Democrats who could come on here and prove anything we have said is wrong? Nowhere to be seen because they can’t. They can just yell liar, but not prove it. Schiff has been caught in a lie this week, Biden is caught in lies almost daily, and I am not talking convicted on a Trumpian standard, where it is called a lie if you don’t agree with it as a matter of opinion, I am talking about lies about simple, factual situations.
It isn’t going to work.
"why is "the greatest nation on earth" (sic) condemned to such miserable choices between greater and lesser evils in each presidential election?"
In the current situation, the greater evil had the gall to promote the lesser evil, mistakenly thinking he'd be easy to beat in the final round.
Does no one remember that in 2016, Pres. Obama’s FBI was investigating the Republican candidate for President? Including seeking dirt from Russian sources, by the way. Did Schiff and Pelosi complain that this was an impeachable offense by Obama? Even after Trump took office, holdovers from the old regime orchestrated a continuation of the investigation.
@Robert cook: "But why is "the greatest nation on earth" (sic) condemned to such miserable choices between greater and lesser evils in each presidential election? No matter who wins, we're stuck with shits in the White House (and Congress)."
It's enough to make one question the wisdom of a big, powerful central government, eh Cookie?
Snopes says that Hillary never said “Were all going to swing from nooses” after being so angry with Matt Laur for asking her a real question she didn’t want asked. But their only evidence that it is “false” is that it didn’t come from a “reputable news gathering organization.” Well neither did a lot of stuff the Drudge Report used to run, but a lot of it was nevertheless true. Hillary said at the time “The problem with the internet is that there are no gatekeepers!” As Drudge said once, a lot of his news came from "people who shouldn’t have been in the room.”
Anyway, it’s looking more credible now, and is Matt Laur still working for NBC? Snopes notes that Laur was never fired as proof it was false.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/hillary-clinton-noose/
"Before the election I reassured Trump hating friends that he would be pretty ineffectual. And mostly he has been. "
What modern President has accomplished more in just 3 years? I could list it, but we all know it's pretty extensive in almost all areas where he has the authority to do things without the Congress. Even more surprising has been his willingness and ability to shine light on the media, and get people to expose their own corruption and bias in a way that is unprecedented. Nobody has ever done this, and he does it at great cost to himself.
they were so sure they had him in their crosshairs,
https://thefederalist.com/2019/10/04/testimony-from-ukraine-envoy-kurt-volker-directly-contradicts-democrats-impeachment-narrative/#.XZeB4LJfpLo.twitter
Blogger steve uhr said..."So why didn’t Trump seek a special prosecutor like he said he would? Not really fair to call someone a crook when you have the power to initiate a formal investigation but elect not to."
He probably didn't want the shitstorm.
The Godfather said...
Does no one remember that in 2016, Pres. Obama’s FBI was investigating the Republican candidate for President? Including seeking dirt from Russian sources, by the way. Did Schiff and Pelosi complain that this was an impeachable offense by Obama? Even after Trump took office, holdovers from the old regime orchestrated a continuation of the investigation.
It's industrial strength gas-lighting.
At some point someone In China or another intelligence agency will leak some of Hillary's emails for shits and giggles to disrupt this country. And it will be as grubby and sour as we have long suspected. It will be like a price sheet like "Give the Clinton Foundation 3 million and you will get the "Silver Access" to the State Dept. Give 20 million get the "Golden Access" etc. Even then the DNC and the media will be like "Ho-hum, this is old news. Besides can't was get back to a place in our country where we forgive and forget?"
bagoh20 said...
After seeing all the investigating of Trump we have been through, and seeing what has come of it, it's hard not to conclude that Trump may be proven to be the most honest politician ever to hold the office of President. I wonder even if "Honest Abe" could come out so clean.
Democrats, republicans, the entire media, The entire federal government including the entire spy and prosecutor agencies, foreign governments...
...of a man that has been in the public eye for decades...
Yea. This point is understated and under appreciated 10 fold.
Consider all the highly educated, probably very high IQ Yale Law grads working in various lawfare related groups. They tweet and write all kind of high-minded stuff about authoritarian populists destroying US norms, about the need for Congressional oversight, protection of whistleblowers, etc. The "protecting democracy" crowd. They are all extreme partisans, many of them alums of the Obama admin, and they work for or have founded nonpartisan, civic virtue-sounding nonprofits. I'd like to extend Althouse's notion of "civility bullshit" to specifically refer to the deployment of ostentatious civic virtue for utterly partisan ends while maintaining a high-minded nonpartisan pose. These are not lawyers representing their clients in an adversarial justice process. These are partisan operatives using academic and career credentials, their university and civil service perches, and high-minded rhetoric about our institutions and the truth to obfuscate the truth and shred the very norms they speak in defense of towards their specific partisan ends. "Civic virtue bullshit" or "civic virtue gaslighting." It's the most insidious kind of bullshit--think Neil Katyal as a paragon of this practice. Instapundit described this phenomenon in The Appearance of Impropriety, but it hasn't got a pithy name.
Well Steve, you tell me was a special prosecutor is going to find on Hillary or Biden that is worse than what is already known?
Pelosi’s own son is “on the board” of one of these companies in the Ukraine, collecting who knows how much every month, and for what? Because he has mommy’s direct line, a direct line to one of the most powerful people in the world. That’s why he’s on that board. Is it illegal? Probably not, but neither is asking the Ukraine to investigate election interference that originated there.
This is Teapot Dome all over again, and even bigger, and the press is utterly uninterested because their hyper wealthy paymasters are probably the next people to be shown as grasping kleptocrats.
Katyal is particularly good at this: he wrote op-eds in defense of Gorsuch and Kavanaugh, and otherwise burnishes his principled nonpartisan resume, often in ways that also happen to help him in his legal practice where he appears often in front of the Supreme Court. But he's a major mentor, adviser and fundraiser to the very partisan lawfare groups, lending his principled nonpartisan reputation to their charade of civic virtue.
Among the reasons I find this brand of bullshit so disturbing, besides the fact that it's so damned effective, is that I used to be taken in by it. I still struggle sometimes to ascribe the appropriate level of guile to people who, because of their effectively postmodern belief system, believe that anything effective towards their ends is necessarily just and in accordance with their deeply held principles, which is basically their only deeply held principle.
“Plan to prosecute his political enemies”?
No. He wanted to prosecute criminals like Hillary. And now Quid Pro Quo Joe, and his loser son Hunter.
It’s not his fault that his enemies tend to be criminals.
Mattman26 @ 10:44am,
"But the precedent of criminally prosecuting someone who's running against you, or high officials in the preceding administration, leaves me feeling pretty queasy. There's a certain 'banana republic' feel to it."
I understand; I have the same uneasy feeling.
However, I get just as queasy thinking that the crimes of Important People can be overlooked because of "Don't You Know Who I Am?" That's every bit as much banana-republic, isn't it?
Trump's relative guilelessness, as well as his lack of malice, are so refreshing in this world of wily operatives inflated by the sense of their own virtue and worthiness and fueled with contempt for their inferiors.
Lack of malice?!?!?
"I understand; I have the same uneasy feeling.
However, I get just as queasy thinking that the crimes of Important People can be overlooked because of "Don't You Know Who I Am?" That's every bit as much banana-republic, isn't it?"
Thanks, Kirk. That insight is helpful to me, because I also have the queasy feeling.
did anyone else notice how calmly she took his remark ("because you would be in jail"). If someone said that to me, I would be incredulous, and it would show on my face, because I know I have committed no crime.
She knows her crimes, therefore she was not surprised.
The people voted for Clinton. The electoral college went for the other guy.
readering said...
The people voted for Clinton. The electoral college went for the other guy.
The Majority of People, in a Majority of States, voted for Trump.
California and New York went for the other one.
fify!
Pretty funny, in a sad sort of way:
"Hillary stopped by the Venice Biennale, the umbrella organization that includes the Venice Film Festival, allegedly a favorite stalking ground of old Clinton pal, Harvey Weinstein, to attend the exhibit of “HILLARY: The Hillary Clinton Emails."
For an hour, Hillary sat in a replica of the Oval Office pretending to read her own emails as part of an art project. To make her humiliation more complete, HILLARY was staged at the Despar Teatro Italia, a former theater turned into a supermarket. Confused shoppers watched a former American presidential contender pretending to be the President of the United States in an Italian supermarket.
There’s your chicken, your canned tomatoes and your pasta. Upstairs is a crazy lady who thinks she’s the President of the United States. Go easy on the chardonnay, you don’t want to end up like her.
Even Lady Macbeth went mad with more dignity than Hillary Clinton.
Hillaryland
The people voted for Clinton. The electoral college went for the other guy.
So those who voted for the other guy weren't people. Untermenschen?
rudeness, crudeness and anger do not necessarily entail malice. fighting hard in the political arena as Trump does, where he's mostly counterpunching, is not a sign of malice either. justifiable anger at corrupt politicians falsely accusing you of misdeeds of which they're actually guilty also does not suggest malice. malice in sense of desiring to cause pain or enjoying it more aptly describes the punitive attitude of many of our elites towards the deplorables, and malice in the more legal sense aptly describes Clinton's server shenanigans and possibly, likely, some of Biden's corrupt behavior over the years.
The people voted for Clinton. The electoral college went for the other guy.
That pesky Constitution!
oh hell, we'll just go ahead and say it--
over a year ago "that 8chan poster" (insert 17th letter of the alphabet here)
stated that the "running for office" would be, at least in part, to provide cover for wrongdoing/crimes.
-------
the left is deft at inventing literal/figurative "get out of jail free" passes---
The term "protected class" can now be applied to so many of their symbiotes,
and has extended to their pols in politics/govt.
If it is "banana republic" to hold pols accountable, then it is equally "banana republic" for them to be exempted by the same token.
Skylark. I don’t think one should loosely throw out labels like crook. How about giving the person a chance to defend themselves in a court of law?
Trump shouldn’t whine about Clinton since he could have had DOJ conduct another investigation with the charging decision made by doj lawyers and not the fbi
If he thinks the Bidens are crooks, why doesn’t he tell Barr to investigate? Nothing improper with investigating if there is a reasonable basis to believe a crime has occurred and the investigation is not started purely for political purposes. And if there was such an investigation there is nothing wrong in asking other countries to assist with the investigation. Doj does that every day of the week
But why is "the greatest nation on earth" (sic) condemned to such miserable choices between greater and lesser evils in each presidential election? No matter who wins, we're stuck with shits in the White House (and Congress).
Because:
1. Washington DC is the psychopathic center of the world, according to a scientific study.
https://www.sciencealert.com/psychopath-capital-of-the-us-according-science-states-ranked-washington-dc
2. Washington DC has taken control of public policies that should be owned by the states. That immense growth of money in DC has created 7 of the 10 wealthiest counties in America. That immense growth of power has only served corruption.
Cookie,
You should drop the Democrats and go libertarian. You can be part of the team that wants to take over the world so they can leave everybody alone.
Trump shouldn’t whine about Clinton since he could have had DOJ conduct another investigation with the charging decision made by doj lawyers and not the fbi
Come on steve, you are not as dumb as Ritmo. You know that Trump did not have control of the DOJ until Barr. Rosenstein was part of the coup plot.
Come on.
The veneer of our sophistication and civilization has been thinned. The selective application of the law is a characteristic of all human societies, but we're usually better at creating and maintaining the illusion of the rule of law. Some prosecutions of powerful people will hopefully help to restore that important illusion.
If Obama Hillary and their minions hadn't started the phony russian Hoax and left Trump to be president and concentrated on policy and the 2020 election, things would be different now.We would be no so divisive and we would have have a good replacement for Obamacare, a good immigration policy and much more good things for the country, they are the villains in this story.
readering said...
The people voted for Clinton. The electoral college went for the other guy.
No, the illegals went for Hillary in CA. The national popular total was LESS than the CA popular total. She lost the country outside CA by 2 million votes.
When Trump goes down, he’s going to bring a shit load of people with him. And prob guarantee the dems win the WH for the next 20 years. Tell me then how much you love trump
The veneer of our sophistication and civilization has been thinned. The selective application of the law is a characteristic of all human societies, but we're usually better at creating and maintaining the illusion of the rule of law. Some prosecutions of powerful people will hopefully help to restore that important illusion.
norma desmond, although I had that name picked for palomino Pelosi,
The people voted for Clinton. The electoral college went for the other guy.
5 counties in California had 5 million more votes for Hillary than Trump.
Driver's licensees for illegals, automatic voter registration (motor-voter), ballot harvesting, had nothing to do with it-
it was the The People!
"When Trump goes down, he’s going to bring a shit load of people with him."
This from the man who just said "How about giving the person a chance to defend themselves in a court of law?"
Living in the bay area I pretty much need to keep my political outlook to myself but it is truly amazing how ignorant people are on how impeachment works or what the chain of succession would be. At lunch someone was wondering out loud if it's possible to have Hillary sit out being named president after Trump is impeached, so that Nancy Pelosi could rule until the 2020 elections. At least one of her friends helpfully pointed out that there probably isn't enough time left before the election next year and that they will keep the spot open?!?!? You would have to have a heart of stone not to laugh. :-P
Tell me then how much you love trump
Steve, I retract what I said about you being smarter than Ritmo. That is some heavy TDS. It must hurt.
. The selective application of the law is a characteristic of all human societies, but we're usually better at creating and maintaining the illusion of the rule of law. Some prosecutions of powerful people will hopefully help to restore that important illusion.
Not likely. What you see on the national scale happens every day in county courthouses.
We are a nation that pretends we have rule of law based on legacy, not in practice.
If one or more of Brennan, Comey, McCabe, Clapper or Clinton (note it's not enough to nail Strozk or some other mid level official) gets the book thrown at them over the improper use of our intelligence and law enforcement apparatus, I'll certainly feel a lot better about things. I think a lot of people will. They don't even have to do much jail time for the salubrious effect to take hold.
steve uhr: "When Trump goes down, he’s going to bring a shit load of people with him. And prob guarantee the dems win the WH for the next 20 years. Tell me then how much you love trump"
LOL
Did you read that in a dossier of some sort?
These idiot leftists can no longer feign sanity. It's all out in the open now.
Steve, I retract what I said about you being smarter than Ritmo.
Is this our Steve uhr? He is famous.
"Plaintiff Steven Uhr is a man on a mission. Some years ago, he discovered the existence
of what he believes to be a vast nationwide conspiracy — involving literally thousands of
entities and individuals — to bring an end to “happy hour” and other drink promotions and
thereby increase the profit margins of bars and restaurants. Since discovering this conspiracy,
-2-
Uhr has brought multiple lawsuits — first as an attorney representing others, now as a pro se
plaintiff representing only himself — seeking to recover damages from the alleged conspirators.
Uhr has not been discouraged by the fact that, to date, all of his lawsuits have been
dismissed. Nor has Uhr been discouraged by the fact that he has no evidence that he personally
has ever paid a penny more for a drink because of the alleged conspiracy. Nor has Uhr been
discouraged by the fact that many of those who he alleges are involved in this conspiracy —
including medical doctors, police officers, educators, scientists, and charitable foundations
dedicated to improving public health — would have no reason to join a conspiracy to help bars
and restaurants increase their profits on liquor sales. Nor has Uhr been discouraged by the fact
that some of those who he alleges are central to the conspiracy — in particular, distillers,
wholesalers, and distributors — would lose money if retailers raised drink prices and thereby
lowered alcohol consumption. Uhr plows ahead, filing lawsuit after lawsuit, seeking to force
defendants who appear to have caused him no harm to pay him millions of dollars in damages.
In this action, Uhr brings antitrust and RICO claims against 22 defendants, including four
chain restaurants with locations in Minnesota, the owners of several bars in Madison, Wisconsin,
numerous national retail and wholesale alcohol and restaurant trade associations, the former head
of alcohol policy at the American Medical Association, two major financial institutions, several
attorneys, a nonprofit organization, and the president of the University of Minnesota.1
That guy would hate the UK, where for some reason "happy hour" drink promotions are completely disallowed.
If he thinks the Bidens are crooks, why doesn’t he tell Barr to investigate?
Go back and read the conversation with Zelensky again. Especially this part: I would like to have the Attorney General call you or your people and I would like you to get to the bottom of it.
Did you miss that part? On purpose?
Pretty interesting, FullMoon.
From case linked above:
"But the gulf between the
facts that Uhr alleges and the conclusions that Uhr draws is vast, and it is unbridged by
reasonable inferences or even common sense."
That guy would hate the UK, where for some reason "happy hour" drink promotions are completely disallowed.
Do bars there still close at 11:00?
I'll wait to hear Steve Uhr's side of the story-
Been burned too many times.
Full Moon: Nice 'out' but why would anyone who is concerned about conspiracy use his real name on blog comments? Perhaps Mr. Uhr--our own Mr. Uhr--will step up to confirm or disavow this report.
Robert Cook @11:39 AM: "But why is "the greatest nation on earth" (sic) condemned to such miserable choices between greater and lesser evils in each presidential election? "
Nice touch with the scare quotes and faux-clever sic. I suppose you pine for the good old days in the 1930's USSR when things weren't so... messy. Inconvenient people just quietly disappeared. Often along with family members. Well the world has changed in many ways and in no way for the best, eh Cookster?
To answer your question, our elections suck because of the intractable corruption inherent in human nature. Which latter is, one gathers, something you don't really believe in.
The interesting thing is, and I'd like to hear your thoughts on this, that despite the wretched frailty of human nature, the United States is, in fact, the Greatest Nation on Earth. (Hint: The reason has to do with our Founders' deep understanding of history and their realistic appraisal of... human nature.)
And that's not just my opinion, it's also the opinion of the majority of humans who want to come here from their various socialist paradises.
Is it Trump's fault that so many of his opponents are crooks? And why is it that the top Dems are always so corrupt that the only defense is to call Trump names and make up false charges that years of investigations, hundreds of subpoenas, thousands of hours of interviews, and millions of dollars can't seem to prove?
Even Trump hater Comey found Hillary guilty, but made up a lame illegal excuse saying she didn't really mean it. Of course she didn't. She had her own server to save tax dollars, and deleted thousands of emails that only discussed her views on the music of Ludacris as a metaphor for a synthesis of a post racial utopia and a neo-consumerist vegan military dictatorship.
It just doesn't get more nakedly corrupt than Hillary Clinton accepting $145 million in bribes through her foundation, or the Bidens accepting $1.5 billion from the Communist Chinese as a "donation". And yet, half of our population still makes excuses for this.
What will it take? The Secret Service auctioning off the Presidency on the Capital building steps?
The problem with our country, as with ancient Rome, is not our institutions, but the general decadence of the country itself.
It just doesn't get more nakedly corrupt than Hillary Clinton accepting $145 million in bribes through her foundation, or the Bidens accepting $1.5 billion from the Communist Chinese as a "donation". And yet, half of our population still makes excuses for this.
What will it take? The Secret Service auctioning off the Presidency on the Capital building steps?
The problem with our country, as with ancient Rome, is not our institutions, but the general decadence of the country itself.
So now doxxing by Drago is allowed? Steve Uhr should put his law degree to some good use.
Ann Althouse may be intelligent, but for her to ignore the obvious corruption in the Democrat Party exposes her as morally lazy.
Inga: "So now doxxing by Drago is allowed? Steve Uhr should put his law degree to some good use."
???
LOL
Full Moon: Nice 'out' but why would anyone who is concerned about conspiracy use his real name on blog comments? Perhaps Mr. Uhr--our own Mr. Uhr--will step up to confirm or disavow this report.
Numerous people use their own names. They are more courageous than I.
Inga said...
Known Unknown, I may have zero proof that collusion happened, but you also have zero proof that it didn't happen. As I said it's classified info and we are not privy to it. Be patient. Not every thing gets leaked.
5/12/17, 3:29 PM
"But the gulf between the
facts that (Inga) alleges and the conclusions that (Inga)draws is vast, and it is unbridged by
reasonable inferences or even common sense."
responsible hospitality conspiracy Blog
There must be a reasonable explanation.....
"Uhr, of all people, should know when and where he purchased his drinks; indeed, as
between him and defendants, Uhr is the only one who could know. And Uhr should also know
whether he was offered a drink special when he purchased his drinks. Nevertheless, Uhr fails to
include any such factual matter in his complaint. Although he acknowledges that the Twin
Cities have 20 Applebee’s restaurants, 10 Chili’s restaurants, and 15 Famous Dave’s restaurants,
Uhr does not identify the location of any Applebee’s, Chili’s, or Famous Dave’s where he
purchased a drink. Nor does he identify when he purchased a drink at any of these restaurants
(or at the one Fuddruckers). Indeed, Uhr’s failure to identify when he purchased his drinks
means that he has not even alleged parallel conduct, which makes his conspiracy allegation even
weaker than that found insufficient in Twombly. And Uhr does not allege — because he
10Uhr’s only basis for alleging that the Minnesota restaurants curtailed drink specials
appears to be the fact that they participated in ARM training. But the fact that a restaurant
participated in ARM training does not mean that the restaurant eliminated or reduced drink
specials. As discussed above, ARM participants were not required to eliminate or reduce drink
specials; instead, curtailing drink specials was one of 18 recommendations presented to them by
the University of Minnesota. A substantial percentage of the ARM participants rejected the
recommendation that drink specials be curtailed, and Uhr does not know whether the restaurants
where he bought his drinks were among this group.
-20-
admittedly does not know — that any of these restaurants were failing to offer drink discounts at
the time that he purchased his drinks."
Numerous people use their own names. They are more foolish than I.
Fixed if for ya, FM.
rehajm said...
Post assumes facts not in evidence. We only know Hillary was Trump’s political opponent. It would take some investigation to conclude she was his political enemy
___________
Hillary is enemy of all decent humans. American in local context, Trump's in limited political election context.
Implicitly known by all.
Fearsome responsibility to admit ... Trump takes it on.
Inga said...
So now doxxing by Drago is allowed? Steve Uhr should put his law degree to some good use.
10/4/19, 5:57 PM
INGA??? Fen, come back, all is forgiven! Just don't tell Chuck.
The phrase 'the lesser of two evils' does not imply moral evil.
Will need some clarity on the difference between prosecuting a political enemy or political opponent and prosecuting a criminal.
Post a Comment