Lauren Langford, who coaches swimming at another high school in the area, told The Washington Post that she believes racism, in addition to sexism, may have been a factor, given that the teen is among the few nonwhite athletes in a predominantly white sport....The photograph at the link shows the outside of the school building, no students visible. I'd like to see a picture of the suit forced on these girls, and I'm skeptical of the idea that a high-cut style was chosen because it's "more hydrodynamic." If everyone's wearing the same suit, it doesn't matter that how hydrodynamic it happens to be. I suspect that those who chose the suit wanted sexier-looking suits — perhaps to appeal to the vanity of the girls. If you go for a skimpiness that's cute but not overtly sexy on an average athletic girl, you'll have something that might look outrageous on somebody else. By stupidly sexualizing the female athletes and then relying on a formalistic application of the rules, the officials stumbled into a charge of racism.
The teenager didn’t pick out the swimsuit — her school chose it and issued it to her. But even though all the girls on her team were dressed identically, she was the only one cited for a uniform violation. Annette Rohde, who was working as an official during the meet, told the Anchorage Daily News that another female ref explained that the bottom of the girl’s suit “was so far up I could see butt cheek touching butt cheek.’’...
Over the years, the conservative one-piece swimsuits traditionally worn by competitive female swimmers have been phased out in favor of a higher-cut style that has less fabric and is more hydrodynamic, but also more revealing. The changes in the cut and fit, Langford said, make it “even more frequent that you’re picking a wedgie.”...
“The fact that she’s been told she’s intentionally trying to draw this sexual attention has really crushed her,” Langford said.
Go back to the "conservative" style, you idiots!
Posts
107 comments:
How is that racist?
I overheard the story on the ABC evening news last night. Sorry, I can't report on the wedginess.
As rhhardin says, most of the half hour was local stories for soap opera women.
OTOH, officials anywhere are idiots.
I think Ann has analyzed and concluded this situation correctly.
The one time I click on a WAPO article, there's a paywall.
won't ALL THESE PROBLEMS be solved in a few years?
Once the REAL Womyn (that is, Chix with Dicks) take over all of women's sports, No ONE will even remember issues with 'wedgies' the concern Then will be that women's dicks hang out of the female swimsuits
Agreed. She didn't choose the suit, so it's the school's fault for making her wear it.
Funny, we have a client with a grade school daughter, I think she's 14, who just earned and Olympic trial cut. Her suit looks like something you would have seen on the beach in the roaring 20s- coverage from calf to neck (twenty three skidoo!). The suit fabric reduces cavitation drag and is slicker than bare skin. It's hard to believe a suit that exposes more skin would be more hydrodynamic...
John Lynch said...
Agreed. She didn't choose the suit, so it's the school's fault for making her wear it.
y'all are assuming that
a) she didn't pull her suit up into her ass
b) she did try pulling it Out of her ass
Maybe what you are assuming is true; OR, Maybe there is MORE to the story?
Democracy Dies in Darkness!
It sure sounds like this swimmer was selected for punishment for being a black whore instead of being a white whore. But they loved those new suits.
"Funny, we have a client with a grade school daughter, I think she's 14, who just earned and Olympic trial cut...."
These high-tech suits are great and also completely solve the problem. At the higher level, schools could choose these and solve the problem and get the best hydrodynamism. I assume this is a more expensive choice, so if it can't be made, the old-fashioned one-piece with leg cuts at the leg rather than the ass level is the answer.
Her school issued the swimsuit to her, but this was an extramural competition ("Friday night's meet with a rival from across town"). Did the school district choose the suits, or did the school? If the choice was at the school level, it would make sense to want a more hydrodynamic suit, rather than simply selecting based on vanity or looks.
IMO the giant issue here: Shouldn't "inappropriate suit" be something judged BEFORE the race, not after? Before you can switch into something else and still race. Afterwards you're just disqualifying people based on what sounds like a subjective test, and can hardly avoid the appearance of bias.
rehajm is correct.
Modern racing suits have less drag than exposed skin.
They also have massive compression to streamline the swimmer.
Whoever picked the team suits appears to be a moron. However, as usual, it may be that the person who wrote the article is the moron.
"I'm skeptical of the idea that a high-cut style was chosen because it's "more hydrodynamic.""
"I suspect that those who chose the suit wanted sexier-looking suits — perhaps to appeal to the vanity of the girls."
"By stupidly sexualizing the female athletes "
That was a quick jump to a conclusion.
As early as the 70's, some serious female swimmers had suits that were so tight they had a clasp on the shoulder that was undone when not swimming to relieve the pressure and maintain blood circulation.
What about Aquaman BabesWear?
Men are using more hydrodynamic swimsuits now too. It allows the athletes to get faster times than they would using older style suits. Which makes the sport more exciting.
Being the parent of a HS girl swim and water polo athlete, I can tell you I would never checkout a girls bod. It's like kryptonite. This is a pervert rule invented by Oso Negro ;^)
In the late 60's early 70's, they made boys with long hair swim with water polo caps.
cavitation drag
Swimmers don't move fast enough to produce cavitation; they just deal with viscosity, laminar flow/turbulence, etc.
Re: “it doesn't matter that how hydrodynamic it happens to be”
Not true. Swimming, like every sport that is timed, is not just about competing against the other swimmers, it is also about competing against the clock for PRs.
Such sports are a relentless quest for shaving tenths of seconds off your PR any way possible. Of COURSE you want the faster swimsuit!
I swam and coached swimming for years. It's not for the excessively modest. Girls bleed on the block and piss in the pool. I have had Olympic athletes change their suits on deck with minimal shielding from interested eyes. It's not a thing. These people got worked up over nothing. By the way, in 1973, the Missouri State High School Athletic Association tried to boot me from the pool at the state meet for long hair. My beloved coach, a former USMC Drill Instructor was having none of it. I think they were frightened of him.
Hmm, store up the complaint until the girl wins. Reminds me of Billy Martin, George Brett and the notorious "Pine Tar Incident".
"the officials stumbled into a charge of racism"
To be fair, in this day and age most people accused of racism don't "stumble" into it. The racism steamroller smashes them flat from behind as they were minding their own business and going about their lives.
'Go back to the "conservative" style, you idiots!'
Wow, that's pretty racist. Everybody knows conservatives are white supremacists. At least you didn't compound your transgression by calling them "retards."
Clearly this is Trumps fault.
Speaking of competition, sex 'n' race -
Former Misses Navajo help contestants in butchering contest"
"Miss Navajo Nation contestant Shaandiin Parrish, of Kayenta, Ariz., after removing the sheep’s backbone during the butchering competition on Monday in Window Rock."
I think I know who's going to survive when the infrastructure collapses.
If they all wore the same style suit, then if one was disqualified, they all should have been. If not, the problem isn't with the suit, it's with the official's perception of the swimmer's body.
Picture of the wedgie or it didn't happen.
How come a story about a swimmer is illustrated with a picture of the track?
Interesting that they do not identify the sex of the referee even though sexism is featured. It does however imply that the female ref who made the “cheek touching cheek” remark is the ref who DQ’d her.
Some questions... How much do you want to bet that the ref that DQ’d her is female? And that if it were male, that fact would have disclosed? And that because the ref is female but the story tries to push a sexism narrative, that created a problem so they had to be cagey about who the ref is?
Women are guilty of sexism against other women. Let’s not pretend otherwise.
There is other reporting that the disqualification was overturned on appeal.
I'm skeptical of the idea that a high-cut style was chosen because it's "more hydrodynamic." If everyone's wearing the same suit, it doesn't matter that how hydrodynamic it happens to be.
That's fine within the team, where everyone is wearing the same uniform, but different reams have different uniforms. If one team's suits give them a 0.1 second advantage, that will win a handful of races.
I would like to see the suit we're talking about, but it's actually not that important to the claim--that many girls were wearing the same suit, but only 1 was disqualified.
Besides, I also don't need to see the suit to know it's less revealing than the men's suits.
I remember when Australian swimmer Ian Thorpe wore that full body suit that covered him from his wrists to his ankles. I hated that suit.
Am I the only person who wonders whether the girl was given the right size of suit? The coaches are supposed to know the rules and to verify that their team members meet the letter of the rules.
I was a high school swimmer some 55 years ago, and I recollect that the rules on suits were lengthy and detailed. For us guys, the rules called for 5” of material on the center of the side, no part f the buttocks could be visible, and IIRC, the top of the suit had to be even all the way around (no dips in front of back). Rules for women’s suits were even more lengthy. I guess that changed in the last half century, as have we all.
Water is a code word for White Nationalism.
Darrell is correct, water sports are all essentially a white privilege pride parade.
Also, women in water sports dis-proportionally have sun freckles, which is another layer of privilege for US males.
To address Althouse’s specific point about going more “conservative”, that is not necessary when the ref pretty clearly made a bad call here.
Discipline the ref, make the victim whole, and move on.
The coach and the story tried to gin up a systemic sexism and racism angle but when it’s really just one dumbass ref... likely female. Yawn.
Based on my seventy plus years of closely studying the phenomenon, black girls' butts are usually shaped much differently and more full than white girls' butts, while Asian girls often have no butts at all. So, it should be no mystery that the swim suit fabric allotment required to cover the butt of a white girl would often be insufficient for a black girl and overkill for an Asian girl. Hence, the thing that caused this girl to be singled out for a wedgie while others were not is most probably related to her genetic makeup producing the condition commonly known as "baby got back." Rather than a racial issue it's more likely a PC issue, i.e., would you want to be the school swim coach that had to explain to the school board that you allocated different swim team equipment based on the race of the swimmer? Which is not to say that a compromise design that would accommodate all derrieres would not be appropriate. Unfortunately, if one were to undertake such a compromise design then all concerned might have to first admit there may be physical differences in the races, which, of course, we all know is as ridiculous as acknowledging only two genders.
tim maguire: I'm skeptical of the idea that a high-cut style was chosen because it's "more hydrodynamic." If everyone's wearing the same suit, it doesn't matter that how hydrodynamic it happens to be.
That's fine within the team, where everyone is wearing the same uniform, but different reams have different uniforms. If one team's suits give them a 0.1 second advantage, that will win a handful of races.
Althouse's comment confused me at first, too, but I believe she's presuming that the suit decision was made at the league (conference?) level and applies to all teams.
Nonetheless, there's also the matter of records, so there is an interest in having current competitors more hydrodynamic than previous competitors.
Another example that no matter what POC can’t get things right.
The fastest, race legal female suits go just above the knee. The fastest suits that aren't legal go to the ankle.
That being said, different hips definitely affect the suit. Fit women with big hips, if they are wearing a traditional suit usually "look best" in a high cut suit. Otherwise they end up with their legs looking like an overstuffed sausage.
That being said, you know when a suit is wedged so tight, your butt is revealed "cheek to cheek". That would be like getting out of the water with your chest hanging completely out and not fixing it.
And again, better performing suits are actually more modest and the knee length accommodates all hip sizes better.
Incidentally, there's a reason why competition female beach volleyball players wear bikinis and the males wear shorts and tank tops. And it's not because through girls think sand wedgies are fun.
More importantly, how will trans men look in that suit?
Overweight teenagers tend to think that they're the "right size." This young woman is probably "fat blind."
This story is infuriating and I feel terrible for that girl.
Chowderheads gotta chowderhead.
“I suspect that those who chose the suit wanted sexier-looking suits — perhaps to appeal to the vanity of the girls.”
Almost certainly. From what I’ve seen, that’s the way teenage girl subculture works, The hottest girls, that is the ones who will look best in the skimpier suit, have the most say in what suit is selected. Those for whom the suit is less, uh, suitable, won’t dare speak up for fear of drawing attention to what they perceive as their physical shortcomings. A phenomenon that can be observed watching any cheerleader squad. No one is going to ask the fat girls or the Mennonite chick how short the skirts should be.
It’s all just human nature but I feel kind of creepy for having processed this realization.
"Intentionally" wedging herself? Nice victim-blaming there, Judge.
Big Mike’s observation about size is also relevant. High school sports teams hand out equipment in a manner reminiscent of boot camp horror stories. It’s usually up to parents to alter and adapt.
Let's first start with why the WASHINGTON (D.C.) Post is investigating and reporting on this story from ALASKA.
Having read the story now -- so the school (and school district) already knew because of prior complaints that there was an issue with the swimsuits.
Sounds like they need to own up to them being the cause of all this controversy, rather than try to shift the light onto the girl.
Do you imagine it's usually the officials, or school coaches, etc, who push for skimpier/sexier uniforms?
20 years ago I asked a friend of mine why the HS girls on the soccer teams and softball teams always rolled their sleeves and the tops of their shorts up, exposing more skin. She was a soccer player and said they had to roll their sleeves in order to gain mobility. I pointed out that the guys' teams didn't roll their sleeves up and didn't seem to have a problem moving their arms as needed. I also pointed out that rolling their shorts at the top actually made them constrict more, at the top of the legs, and would seem to actually hinder movement. She laughed and said something about tanning.
Have you seen the outfits the girls teams wear for volleyball now? I know I'm an old fuddy-duddy but I have to put myself back in a HS mindset and marvel at the change.
I don't know about this particular case, but from what I can tell the insistence on skimpy, revealing uniforms seems to be driven by the girls/athletes themselves. Stop slut shaming strong young women!
The entire team should have protested or walked.
"By stupidly sexualizing the female athletes "
They are high school girls. Many of their lives revolve around being sexually alluring to the boys. Back in the 1970s, when my partner was that age, her older sister would roll up her skirt after leaving the house, and when she could get away with it in school. No doubt her sister did something similar.
Reading the other stories linked by the WP, it is clear that this controversy is NOT about girls' bodies, as alleged, but is about schools providing the wrong swimwear.
And this comment from a swim coach does not help their argument or credibility --
"the only reason this ever became an issue is because certain people cannot keep their ultra-conservative beliefs to themselves."
That coach also says this --
"This same girl was the subject of one rogue team parent’s photography project last season, in which they took graphic photos of her backside in her swimsuit — without her knowledge or consent — and circulated the images via email as evidence that her attire is immoral. She is a minor — that parent should be arrested for possession and distribution of child pornography."
Well, if a photo of the girl in the swimsuit would constitute child porn, then yes, it is inappropriate for the school to have provided it.
Then there is this comment/testimony from the story linked above -
I am a former age group swim coach in Alaska . . . the issue that Alaska swimming is having right now, has nothing to do with racism, body shaming, or sexism. It is the fact that the child being written about has not been wearing the “uniform” or swimsuit the way it was made or meant to be worn. In my opinion, it is, and has been obvious to swimmers, parents, coaches and officials that the swim suit worn by this swimmer is purposefully placed in a manner to expose more area. I have personally witnessed this swimmer’s suit and can say that it is not being worn in the intended manner. . . . this swimmer had been warned on more than one occasion that even though the suit was within FINA guidelines, the placement of the suit was not.
Go back to the "conservative" style, you idiots!
Today's word is Bonehead.
There’s a black girl in Alaska?
Does any brown person anywhere ever get their feelings hurt and it DOESN'T become a national news story?
FFS. Give it a rest. A black chick, hell frankly any chick, having a wedgie is not a national news story.
There’s a black girl in Alaska?
I was surprised at the presence of molten ice.
There’s a black girl in Alaska?
Yes. There is A black girl in Alaska.
Wedgies are sexy? Don't think the weenies in high school thought so.
I started these comments thinking one thing -- more or less what Ann Althouse said -- that it was the school's fault or that plus a prurient official, but now suspect that it's the swimmer's fault and that she deserved disqualification.
Since I don't have enough information this is nothing more than a guess, but thinking about the current political environment and adding together the fact that this was an issue the previous year, see Mark's comment at 9:23 AM, plus the swim coach comment from Mark's 9:39 AM, then suddenly there is a 'click' in my head and I'm pretty sure that the swim coach comment is the truth:
"...the issue that Alaska swimming is having right now, has nothing to do with racism, body shaming, or sexism. It is the fact that the child being written about has not been wearing the “uniform” or swimsuit the way it was made or meant to be worn. In my opinion, it is, and has been obvious to swimmers, parents, coaches and officials that the swim suit worn by this swimmer is purposefully placed in a manner to expose more area. I have personally witnessed this swimmer’s suit and can say that it is not being worn in the intended manner. . . . this swimmer had been warned on more than one occasion that even though the suit was within FINA guidelines, the placement of the suit was not."
It sounds like the ref actually only disqualified her ass. The rest of her still won. We all deny responsibility for what our ass has done. It's perfectly normal and expected. My ass and I rarely even speak to each other anymore. I don't care. Nobody likes him anymore anyway.
WaPo is indulging their diversitist bigotry. The issue may be implicitly a color judgment (e.g. body form), but it is not race or skin color. They need to stop normalizing racism and other color judgments for leverage and profits.
"... obvious to swimmers, parents, coaches and officials that the swim suit worn by this swimmer is purposefully placed..."
It is so common for people to look at a female and to think they know that her purpose is to cause them to feel the way they do.
I remember how I was accused when I was a teenager wearing miniskirts, which I did because they were in style and they looked cute to me.
Not seeing any racism in this. Ridiculous that the girl could be disqualified while wearing a suit designed and issued by the school. And more hydrodynamic? Please, these are high school athletes, what possible meaningful difference could it possibly make in their swim times?
"It is so common for people to look at a female and to think they know that her purpose is to cause them to feel the way they do."
Well, you have to admit that you gals do spend a crazy amount of time, effort and money on looking a certain way, and it's not designed to look as professional and asexual as possible. It would make no sense to do that if it had no effect on others. As obvious as that is, you all strongly deny why you do it. You do it when you expect to see others, not when you know you will be alone, so...
"Please, these are high school athletes, what possible meaningful difference could it possibly make in their swim times?"
It doesn't really affect their swim times, but the swimsuit's extra exposure could take seconds off the time it takes for male attendees to head to the bathroom to masturbate.
I am Laslo.
There is no way to know if racism is a part of it. We can't read the ref's mind. If only one girl's ass was hanging out, then she made herself different, maybe accidentally, but if she has a history of doing it on purpose, then some sanction may be right, but taking away the win seems misdirected. Instead, she probably should have been given a spanking.
"I remember how I was accused when I was a teenager wearing miniskirts, which I did because they were in style and they looked cute to me."
They weren't in style becuase they were cute. It was the sexual revolution, and you were a revolutionary.
When I started reading this thread, my first thought was...
"This is Laslo bait."
GEORGE BRETT YOU MAGNIFICENT BASTARD!
Story from the local Anchorage news channel: High school swimmer disqualified over fit of school-issued swimsuit. The only photo of the swimmer is from the waist up and she does not look necessarily 'curvier' than any other girl her age.
Also, looks like the authority that governs Alaska school sports has reinstated her win: Victory for Breckynn Willis, as ASAA reinstates her win.
And it’s not just mixed-race girls from Alaska, it’s Jewish girls from New York -- remember the ad pitch for Jewess Jeans on early Saturday Night Live: “Guaranteed to Ride Up”?
Even the "high legged" cuts are not THAT "sexy":
https://www.speedousa.com/teams-swimwear
If you have a big butt, I could totally see how you would get a swim wedgie in a vigorous race. How mortifying for the teenager to have extra attention drawn to her body.
I was on the swim team in high school. At that level of competition (where you're talking about potential college scholarships), even teenagers don't care about how they look. They care about getting that .01 second advantage so they can WIN.
Our Beloved Professor Althouse said...
"I remember how I was accused when I was a teenager wearing miniskirts, which I did because they were in style and they looked cute ON me."
fify (fixed it in such a way that it accurately reflects the truth; unfortunately, in doing so it will IRRITATE our Professor..... Sorry Prof! Believe what you want to believe)
Also, looks like the authority that governs Alaska school sports has reinstated her win: Victory for Breckynn Willis, as ASAA reinstates her win.
From that story --
In addition to reversing the disqualification, the Anchorage School District said it will seek to "suspend, with the intent to revise" the rule from the National Federation of High School Sports that defines appropriate swimwear.
Well that sounds like an admission of guilt. That is, that the official made the right call according to the rule. But they simply don't like the rule.
jaydub said...
Hence, the thing that caused this girl to be singled out for a wedgie while others were not is most probably related to her genetic makeup producing the condition commonly known as "baby got back."
The school obviously needs a Competitive Twerking Team so these 'curvier' girls can dominate. Somebody get Title 9 on this!
Hi Ann:
It is so common for people to look at a female and to think they know that her purpose is to cause them to feel the way they do.
and:
I remember how I was accused when I was a teenager wearing miniskirts, which I did because they were in style and they looked cute to me.
Where's the contradiction?
There is video:
https://youtu.be/74M0hPAeFHs?t=50
I have two words- "naked competition"- solves everything.
Why of course it was racism. What isn't blamed on racism anymore?
Conservative Swimsuit
I don't know anyone's motivation in this, but I do know bathing suits from a lifetime of sewing and a lifetime of swimming laps. If this girl has a longer torso than the other girls, the suit may well ride up into her crack. The suit that fits fine one day will ride up with the gain of just a little weight. Hell, I have a whole riff, both funny and vulgar, on my bathing suits, only told among women.
Please, these are high school athletes, what possible meaningful difference could it possibly make in their swim times?
Coming from a competitive swimming family, it makes a BIG difference. Scholarships, for one. Olympic qualifying. If the kids have been swimming since age group, they're already on a path long before they reach high school.
Do we know if she or her coach had been warned beforehand to unwedge?
Probably, it was like the Harvey Weinstein Affair, something people knew and talked about but never acted on 'til now.
Jim at said...
Please, these are high school athletes, what possible meaningful difference could it possibly make in their swim times?
Back in the late '70's (not exactly a tolerant time), ALL the boy swimmers at my High School shaved their legs and arms (chests, too?). Why? Because it made them feel that they were a little faster (Maybe, Made them a Little faster). They caught shit for it, and were called an 'f' word; but, they kept doing it because it made them feel they were a little faster.
Mom wants the referee who made the call sacked.
"Hell, I have a whole riff, both funny and vulgar, on my bathing suits, only told among women...."
No one here but us chicks. And guys who identify as chicks so they can hear the story.
I am Laslo.
What came first, the rooster, hen, or chick?
A tale of chickpeas, chicks, chickens, roosters, and hens.
The Olympic men's suits are so small you wonder how they stay on, particularly after shrinkage occurs, and they make their pelvic bones look weird.
I asked my date to the prom while she shaved my back prior to the big meet. She said Yes!
"I asked my date to the prom while she shaved my back prior to the big meet. She said Yes!"
Swim meet, or was this one of those Chess Club Things?
I am Laslo.
Just another $Metoo scam.
Nothing to see here--move along.
I asked my date to the prom while she shaved my back prior to the big meet
Does that mean she was using a straight razor?
The wedgie ref was female. It's in the Post story, butt a little hard to pick out.
The Olympic men's suits are so small you wonder how they stay on,
Not anymore. They go down to the knee ... like spandex.
If she'd been Jewish it'd have been antisemitic. If she'd been an Eskimo it would've been anti-Eskimo prejudice. Yawn.
Honestly, someone run some tests prove these hyper-small swimsuits don't save significant amounts of time, and then go back to the older ones. And give them the option of swimming nude. That will get rid of the whole issue.
Swimming is the dullest sport to watch. All you see is a head and arms thrashing around as the go back and forth in the pool. No wonder everyone makes a big fuss about how they look when the Girls get out of the pool.
Gays love the swim team. Like men's volleyball its a haven for male perverts.
Never go swimming in the ocean. Fish piss in it.
Good news - they appealed and her disqualification was thrown out
https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/460969-female-swimmers-swimsuit-disqualification-overturned-after
Sorry for not looking up the HTML tag method.
Sorry, Laslo, girlfriend, the stories only work with visuals.
They go down to the knee ... like spandex.
Yes, but they barely cover the pubic bone at the top.
Fish piss in it.
The original(?) W.C. Fields quote was "Fish fuck in it."
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