August 9, 2019

"Promise Rings and Immigrant 'Invasions': How Evangelical Purity Culture Helps Explain Trumpism."

Headline at Vanity Fair for an article by Jill Filipovic.

Subheadline: "My virginity-until-marriage pledge was based on the premise that if you don’t know any better, you’ll never want anything more. Similarly, adherents to Trumpism would rather know less, and risk stagnation and decline, than come into contact with information that complicates their view of America."

Excerpt: "Making America great again and forgoing kissing for courtship both promise an easy route to a glorified past. Both come from a fear of the unknown, an aversion to new experiences, a deep disgust at a perceived other attaining equal footing....  Much has rightly been written about the racism at the heart of Trumpism.... But I also hear the same fear that echoed in the anti-experimentation, anti-sex warnings repeated to me as an adolescent.... I took off my promise ring because not long after I got it, it became clear to me that the primary beneficiaries of these rules were men.... Purity proponents, like Team Love It or Leave It, assuage their fears with a demand that everyone else keep their life small..."

183 comments:

Bob Boyd said...

Rank bigotry.

rhhardin said...

Snake-handling economists.

tommyesq said...

She seems like quite a catch...

rhhardin said...

You can't understand a man until you've walked a mile in his water moccasins.

narciso said...

She used to be hawt, but now shes just crazy qnd evil

Oso Negro said...

I don't think I have EVER read something more deluded with regard to what is good for men. Let me testify, as a young man I rejoiced in girls who easily dropped their panties. REJOICED! I never stopped enjoying it. Purity pledge???! You gotta be kidding me.

Beasts of England said...

'Similarly, adherents to Trumpism would rather know less, and risk stagnation and decline, than come into contact with information that complicates their view of America.'

Oh, no - she's on to us!!

rhhardin said...

Always think audience.

Shouting Thomas said...

The war against the rubes in the Styx continues.

If you're a perv living in NYC, the fight with Mommy and Daddy back home in the Styx is eternal.

Somebody's got to be to blame because you hear Mommy and Daddy in your brain.

Fernandinande said...

Similarly, adherents to Trumpism would rather know less, and risk stagnation and decline, than come into contact with information that complicates their view of America.

Jill understands me! Sigh.

I think so, anyway - what is "Trumpism"?

rhhardin said...

The lava lamp figures in.

Howard said...

Ivanka must be secretly paying off Vanity Fair.

Big Mike said...

Much has rightly been written about the racism at the heart of Trumpism

When did treating people identically, regardless of skin color, become racism?

I took off my promise ring because not long after I got it, it became clear to me that the primary beneficiaries of these rules were men.

You took of your promise ring because you wanted to get laid.

narciso said...

It's a delusion of immense dimensions, it makes you doubt anything else they write like gabriel Sherman's poison pens against roger ailes

Tank said...

And Jill projects her mental problems onto the rest of us. Isn’t she the one with the Clinton picture breasts, or was that someone else?

Mike Sylwester said...

Liberals try to cause trouble for Christians -- for example, by using discrimination complaints to bankrupt Christians' small businesses.

That's why Christians will continue to vote for Donald Trump.

chuck said...

Trump promotes chastity. Did I miss something?

JML said...

No worries. Fuck, get pregnant, have an abortion. It is all very liberating. Only then can you really feel good about yourself.

Anonymous said...

"Jill Filipovic". Whatevs.

Don't understand your fondness for the writers occupying this "female undergraduate wanking" niche. Never a glimmer of intelligence or insight to be seen therein.

etbass said...

This kind of thinking plus dismay at the mass shootings. No connection whatsoever.

henry said...

she has it backwards. She might try responsibility, it has rewards she can't imagine.

stevew said...

So the primary beneficiary of a virginity until marriage pledge is the man. And the commitment to Make America Great Again is the easy path to regain our better past. Oh, and just for good measure, Trump supporters are trying to simplify their lives by refusing to consider new and different ideas and such.

Jill, sweetie, you're doing it wrong. Try expanding your circle of friends and discussion mates to people outside your ideological cocoon.

Tom T. said...

The bit about wanting to know less and avoid information that complicates one's view of the world seems like pure projection.

Ann Althouse said...

"Don't understand your fondness..."

False premise. Start there. Understanding may follow.

narciso said...

Well you cant Fisk miss filipovic:

https://sultanknish.blogspot.com/2019/08/no-city-for-old-commies.html?fbclid=IwAR1AqqJobqyvjlwF-o-apkhz9h_JwHOE3tKDZW0RJQtRxjJpOTgfEl5ryK8&m=1

Francisco D said...

Similarly, adherents to Trumpism would rather know less, and risk stagnation and decline, than come into contact with information that complicates their view of America."

This sort of bullshit has been par for the course with elitist liberals. They pride themselves on understanding nuance. Deplorables are so damned pragmatic and objective.

The problem is that many liberals were educated by leftist professors who led lives of the mind rather than lives of concrete accomplishment. They taught that you can change the world with words and thoughts rather than actions. The smart ones understand that word and actions are equally important.

Bay Area Guy said...

Hmmm. Seems like an awkward analogy: my political support for the Prez as a humble citizen is like her purity pledge as a frigid liberal evangelical?!!? Were any boys even trying to roger her?

I don't get it.

Make Vanity Fair Mediocre Again!

Kevin said...

I took off my promise ring because not long after I got it, it became clear to me that the primary beneficiaries of these rules were men.

In her case, I think she’s right.

Rusty said...

Another leftist that still isn't getting it.

Hey Skipper said...

That is a 1500-some odd word testament to the fact that unexamined ideas aren't worth having.

Ralph L said...

the primary beneficiaries of these rules were men

Because we want an expensive virgin cow instead of free milk.

J. Farmer said...

Similarly, adherents to Trumpism would rather know less, and risk stagnation and decline, than come into contact with information that complicates their view of America.

Funny, that is precisely how I would define anti-Trumpists.

I took off my promise ring because not long after I got it, it became clear to me that the primary beneficiaries of these rules were men

That is insane. The main beneficiaries of chastity are men? The exact opposite is true. Preaching loose sex and hookup culture to women has been a boon to men. At the detriment of women. Do you meet a lot of women who say, "Gee, I really wish I had done more sleeping around when I was younger." And of course, this ignores the fact that one of the primary virtues of chastity is the well being of your future children.

One of the unfortunate side effects of modern feminism is that boys' issues have been pushed to the back of the bus. Fatherlesness is one of, if not, the most potent predictors of maladjusted behavior in adulthood. And yet the issue gets practically zero airtime. Meanwhile, vast sums of money and attention are paid to whether or not enough high school girls are signing up for AP Physics. Fatherlessness has, grotesquely, become a feminist issue because we are expected to respect the choice of a woman to raise her children alone. A woman's self-esteem is expected to come before a child's well-being. The reason illegitimacy was treated with such ostracism in the past is because society recognized its destructive potential. A society with a lot of men who grew up without fathers present in their lives is a recipe for a lot of social ills. And those social ills are feminist issues (e.g. rape, domestic violence, philandering, etc.).

Derek Kite said...

And all the men you shagged were generous and interested in your welfare?

Lurker21 said...

Just what one would expect from a liberal feminist fashionista. Jonathan Haidt addressed in a more serious way the idea that conservatives had different values than liberals and considered questions of loyalty versus betrayal, authority versus subversion, and sanctity versus degradation as well as the questions of care versus harm and equality/fairness versus inequality/cheating that liberals prioritize.

Conservatives value stability and continuity, and tend to oppose things that threaten that stability and continuity (of course this becomes problematic when we take the changes wrought by dynamic free market economies), but making it all about sex is childish and unenlightening. "Fear" of change or the unknown isn't always a bad thing. Call it "care" or "concern" or an unwillingness to act rashly or to accept transformations passively and one can see that it also has positive effects.

traditionalguy said...

The Dem's battle to vote in lawlessness rolls along. No boundaries is lawlessness, and that always leads to continual war of assaults and reprisals. Voila, we then become Venezuela.

Trump has taken up our fight to survive the enemy of lawlessness.

Koot Katmandu said...

She had Daddy hate issues. Her whole world view is slanted toward sex.

Hunter said...

But how does she know either idea isn't correct?

How do you know having more experiences is inherently a good thing? Or will make you happier? There is, in fact, evidence to the contrary.

Fewer Sex Partners Means a Happier Marriage (The Atlantic)

Over at the Institute for Family Studies, Nicholas Wolfinger, a sociologist at the University of Utah, has found that Americans who have only ever slept with their spouses are most likely to report being in a “very happy” marriage. Meanwhile, the lowest odds of marital happiness—about 13 percentage points lower than the one-partner women—belong to women who have had six to 10 sexual partners in their lives. For men, there’s still a dip in marital satisfaction after one partner, but it’s never as low as it gets for women...

Nicholas said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Unknown said...

Hey, I just had a thought!

I feel like my feeling about one thing is explained by my feelings about something unrelated..

Quayle said...

We are all certainly free to take the approach that "I should be able to do whatever I want to do - anything at all - regardless of any social constraints or testimonials or suggestions from others."

And if you're big enough and strong enough to handle all the emotional pain that can come, by all means - go broaden your perspectives on all manner of things.

Or you might try paying attention to what choices and actions bring emotional pain to you and others, and see if you can avoid doing those things.

Nicholas said...

"a fear of the unknown, an aversion to new experiences". OK, how about Jill Fillipovic overcomes her aversion to walking, alone, around an MS13 controlled area? New experiences guaranteed.

Shouting Thomas said...

So, a couple of years ago the problem was that Trump was an absolutely shameless whore fucking all his groupies.

Now, he's a Puritan.

How to reconcile?

Fen said...

"adherents to Trumpism would rather know less, and risk stagnation and decline, than come into contact with information that complicates their view of America."

Snort.

The total lack of self-awareness on the Left is a wonder to behold.

Quayle said...

How come the people that start almost every discussion with "Who are you to tell me what I can and can't do?", always seem to end that discussion with a long diatribe of telling other people what *they* should and shouldn't do?

Hunter said...

It is pretty ignorant and closed-minded to assume there is nothing about any past era of a society that may have been better than today, and might be worth trying to recover. That certain other things about the era were worse is beside the point.

Even today's progressives, to be honest, have past eras they want to go back to. Witness the occasional hand-wringing over how, back in the mid-1900s, you could own a house and support a family on one blue-collar income while this is (supposedly) impossible today. The heyday of American manufacturing, union muscle, and old-school progressives in the mold of Wilson, Teddy, and FDR expanding government in every possible direction. This, according to the left, is when America was Great. Before Reagan and Newt Gingrich ruined everything.

Fen said...

"I took off my promise ring because not long after I got it, it became clear to me that the primary beneficiaries of these rules were men."

I hear ya. My favorite stripper is always going on about how SHE is exploiting ME, and not the other way around. I just nod and tell her to work her ass and pinch her tits harder.

You've cum a long way baby!

Shouting Thomas said...

I watch the Disney Channel sometimes with my grandkids.

Remember the old days, how the teen Disney starlet began her career as the virginal all American girl, then transformed into dirty Miley Cyrus?

Nowadays, the Disney starlet starts her career as dirty Miley Cyrus gyrating her hips and ass.

This is the reality that all our kids live in.

Mr Wibble said...

If girls grew into women who recognized, validated, and acted on their desires, what would happen?

Based on the past two generations? Single-motherhood, broken homes, barren spinsters bitter at their life choices, young women confused and ashamed by their desire for motherhood, a massive rise in sexual assault allegations, and rampant STDs.

And for men troubled by changing family structures and expanded female power, there was one more obvious benefit to marrying a virgin: You’d never be found to be sexually inadequate.

If I said the women slut-shamed (and the majority of slut shaming comes from other women) because they were afraid that guys would realize how bad most women are in bed, the screeching would be non-stop.

Sexual adequacy is more about the connection you have with your partner than any one technique. Want to have good sex? Find someone that you trust and care enough about that you care about their experience, and they care about yours. Trust each other enough that you are willing to experiment. Stick with someone long enough that you can learn about their needs and likes.

The fear that this rise will strip away unearned advantages from whites is just as well founded as the virginity-men’s anxiety that sexual experience would make women more romantically discerning.

Except it hasn't made them more romantically discerning. If anything, free love has made them less so. By turning the dating scene into a meat market full of rutting animals, you put women who want to be discerning at a disadvantage. You turn sex into a purely mechanical act, devoid of any emotional connection, and that in turn strips away much of what makes sex a wonderful experience.

We might even entirely reject the idea that marriage and childbearing should be our primary purpose and greatest aspiration.

You could also reject the idea that human beings can't fly. Biology, however, doesn't give a damn about your ideas. The vast majority of women want marriage and children, and if they had to choose between that and a career climbing the corporate ladder they'd choose the former in a heartbeat. What you're proposing has been a recipe for misery.

Fen said...

"Isn’t she the one with the Clinton picture breasts, or was that someone else?"

Jessica Valenti.

Mr. Forward said...

"You took of your promise ring because you wanted to get laid." Big Mike

I don't know what the house rules are. I don't want to turn the comments into back patting and fishing for compliments. Wish we had a thumbs up capability. So I've had to restrain myself, If I texted LOL'd every time I laughed out loud, these threads would be cluttered. Some of you have been hitting it out of the park lately. Which is our job, so no medals, no names, but thanks. A good laugh in the wee hours is golden.

WWIII Joe Biden, Husk-Puppet + America's Putin said...

Seems like the left are sinking into insanity.

They cannot abide Hillary's loss, so they write this crap. is it like a drug to them?

Quaestor said...

it became clear to me that the primary beneficiaries of these rules were men...

Durn tootin... No woman can do better than getting pregnant by a man she doesn't want to marry and then killing her spawn with less moral concern than going off her vegan diet to enjoy an occasional pork chop.

Hunter said...

Quayle said...
We are all certainly free to take the approach that "I should be able to do whatever I want to do - anything at all - regardless of any social constraints or testimonials or suggestions from others."


“All things are lawful for me,” but not all things are helpful. “All things are lawful for me,” but I will not be dominated by anything. “Food is meant for the stomach and the stomach for food” — and God will destroy both one and the other.

...But that's just the ramblings of one old homophobic misogynist from a backward society that didn't even have microscopes.

Tank said...

Grand Beagle Fen said...

"Isn’t she the one with the Clinton picture breasts, or was that someone else?"

Jessica Valenti.


You're right!

Quayle said...

I left hanging in large herds and using extreme caution at the waterhole when it became clear to me that the primary beneficiaries of these practices were the lions.

HoodlumDoodlum said...

Other people have different conceptions of self respect, and of respect for a higher power/higher rules than I do, therefore people who disagree with me are backwards and exult in their ignorance.
Only a close minded regressive Trumptard would try to steer children away from engaging in sexual activity, after all. The patriarchy doesn't want you to be a slut and that's exactly why you should--the same understanding extends to all things so that if some belief is in keeping with mainstream traditional American thought it must be opposed.

Inflate that to a few thousand words and cash your check from Vanity Fair. It's honestly remarkable how shallow this kind of stuff really is!

rcocean said...

Women not having pre-martial sex favors men? Wow, that's some logic.

rwnutjob said...

Old couple on the porch of the retirement home.
She hauls off & slaps her husband on the shoulder
He says: What was that for?
She says: for being so bad in bed all these years.
He thinks for 15 minutes & then hauls off & slaps her on the shoulder.
She says: What was that for
He says: For knowing the difference.

Fen said...

"But I also hear the same fear that echoed in the anti-experimentation, anti-sex warnings repeated to me as an adolescent..."

Please don't stick food up in there and avoid the risk of pregnancy till you graduate. What a bunch of phobic squares.

Do you know WHY your mother told you not to lust after the produce aisle? Experience.

Fen said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Michael K said...

The Dem's battle to vote in lawlessness rolls along. No boundaries is lawlessness, and that always leads to continual war of assaults and reprisals. Voila, we then become Venezuela.

It's working well in California


A man who authorities say “unleashed evil” across two Orange County cities when he went on a stabbing spree in Garden Grove and Santa Ana, leaving four dead and two wounded, was identified Thursday as a 33-year-old gang member who has a vast criminal history dating back several years.

Investigators were seeking to determine what allegedly motivated Zachary Castaneda to target the victims Wednesday in what was described by police as a series of random attacks, and which marked a spasm of deadly violence not seen in Orange County for years.


And

Court records show Castaneda has been charged with several felony and misdemeanor crimes in past years, some in 2019, including felony counts for criminal street gang vandalism, possession of a controlled substance, carrying a dirk or dagger and buying or receiving a stolen vehicle.

Over the years he’s racked up busts for drugs, car thefts and parole violations. He also has a domestic violence record that dates back to 2009.

According to jail records as recently as last month, Castaneda was arrested twice on suspicion of non-violent offenses – and released twice.

At a news conference on Thursday, Chief Tom DaRe said Castaneda should not have been eligible for release under the AB109 inmate-realignment legislation, police said.


That's lefty speak for emptying the prisons.

Anonymous said...

AA: ""Don't understand your fondness..."

False premise. Start there. Understanding may follow.


A desire to make a quibble out whether "fondness" accurately describes the motivation for analyzing undergraduate wanking does not a "false premise" make.

rcocean said...

The people who write/read Vanity Fair hate stuff like "promise Rings" or anything that smacks of Christianity or "middle class morality". Because they are the elite.

TrespassersW said...

Subheadline: "My virginity-until-marriage pledge was based on the premise that if you don’t know any better, you’ll never want anything more.

When I read something that's that wrong--the way this woman completely misunderstands the premise of purity pledges--I don't see the point in reading any more. It would be like picking up a primer on geometry and reading that the theorem "All right angles are congruent" is incorrect. Time to put that book down again.

rcocean said...

They love "Immigrants" because they know wealthy people much money off cheap labor. Its that simple. All the moralism is bullshit.

chickelit said...

Vanity Fair still reeks like Graydon Carter. If Christopher Hitchens were still alive he'd eviscerate that rag and its ragtag team.

Wince said...

Making America great again and forgoing kissing for courtship both promise an easy route to a glorified past.

Somebody remind her it was over 50 years ago today that Sgt. Pepper told the band to play.

Mr Wibble said...

Do you know WHY your mother told you not to lust after the produce aisle? Experience.

Father says, "Your mother's right, she's really up on things
Before we married, mommy served in the WACS in the Philippines"

rcocean said...

Zachary Castaneda = white (hispanic) when killer. Otherwise, a Hispanic.

Jamie said...

What the actual hell?

Disclosure - I haven't read the comment thread so I'll bet I'm going to be repetitive. But I want to comment without being informed by other commenters, because... What the bleep kind of tortured metaphor is this? Purity pledges arise from **disgust**?! Trump voters are like virgins because they don't wanna know anything (I'm not even sure if this statement is less true about Trump voters or about virgins!)?! MEN are the primary beneficiaries of purity pledges?! MEN?!

I just can't. The excerpt here, at least, reads like a college essay - the "writer" trying to draw a parallel that no other aspiring college entrant will have come up with so she can stand out. Or a beauty pageant candidate trying to wow the judges with her "depth." And what she's come up with is the pomo version of "world peace." Anodyne, ill-considered, and yawningly popular enough to get by, maybe.

mccullough said...

Another sheltered New Yorker.

Bob Boyd said...

Just another young girl hoping against hope to dodge the doula for a few more years.

0_0 said...

Why do progressives think they know exactly how and what Trump supporters are thinking, and why?

Bob Boyd said...

When you're hammering Trump everything looks like a nail.

Mr Wibble said...


Vanity Fair still reeks like Graydon Carter. If Christopher Hitchens were still alive he'd eviscerate that rag and its ragtag team.


I wish Hitchens could have lived long enough to see Trump win. He wouldn't have supported him, but to watch the Clintons' humiliation, and the destruction of so much of the hypocritical and corrupt left, as well as the hypocritical and corporate right, would have pleased him.

Francisco D said...

That is insane. The main beneficiaries of chastity are men? The exact opposite is true. Preaching loose sex and hookup culture to women has been a boon to men. At the detriment of women.

That is so retro of you, Farmer. Does the APA know about your views?

Psychologists used to be objective and have good common sense. Now they are woke, except for Jordan Peterson..

... and maybe a few other old timers.


Jon Burack said...

Maybe Jill is trying to get a date. Seems like a poor strategy, but what do I know?

Char Char Binks, Esq. said...

Tom, is this about your parents throwing out all your Styx albums because they thought they were satanic?

Jamie said...

"I took off my promise ring because not long after I got it, it became clear to me that the primary beneficiaries of these rules were men.

In her case, I think she’s right."

Is there an official nominating process for Thread Winner? Because I nominate Kevin.

narciso said...

Ah yes graydon helped cover epsteins crimes with a pillow exalted dumpster fire lindsay Lohan, and spread trash about thr huntress

doctrev said...

I'm not sure news gets more bottom tier than Jill Filipovic. The only thing more hilarious than watching reporters try and fail to explain Christian subculture- deceiving their gullible liberal readers- is doing more than five seconds of due diligence into it.

Yeah, I can't imagine why the Joel Steins and Jill Filipovics of the world constantly smear Christians as trying to destroy the world to hasten the Rapture. It's a complete mystery that no one can decipher.

Krumhorn said...

Durn tootin... No woman can do better than getting pregnant by a man she doesn't want to marry and then killing her spawn with less moral concern than going off her vegan diet to enjoy an occasional pork chop.

Excellent!

- Krumhorn

SGT Ted said...

Idiots like Jill come up with random weird shit like this and project it into the heads of other people to justify hating them. Then they preen and prate about how smart and clever they are to other idiots.

Progressive intellectual bigotry is the gift that keeps on giving.

Sebastian said...

"Making America great again and forgoing kissing for courtship both promise an easy route to a glorified past."

Forgoing kissing is easy?

"Both come from a fear of the unknown, an aversion to new experiences, a deep disgust at a perceived other attaining equal footing"

Huh, what?

"Much has rightly been written about the racism at the heart of Trumpism"

And all of it BS.

"I took off my promise ring because not long after I got it, it became clear to me that the primary beneficiaries of these rules were men"

How is that?

OK, so Toni M had no clue, now this lady has no clue. Does anybody over there on the other side actually try to understand the opposition, the deplorables as they actually are? Arlie Hochschild, maybe. Which other prog has even made a half-decent attempt?

Big Mike said...

Similarly, adherents to Trumpism would rather know less, and risk stagnation and decline, than come into contact with information that complicates their view of America.

Seems self-evident that "stagnation and decline" are more descriptive of the US economy under Barack Obama than under Trump. It does make one wonder who knows less -- the people who supported Barack Obama or the people who look at what Donald Trump is doing and has done to effect change.

MikeR said...

Ann, do you sometimes choose articles for comment because they are mindbogglingly dumb?
Why embarrass her further?

David Duffy said...

I stopped being polite and considerate toward women because it only benefited women. When making a decisions my first question is, "will this benefit women?" If the answer is "yes" I do the opposite, no matter what it cost me. This is the only reasonable way to make choices.

When first meeting a women, the focus of my conversation is always her body parts and hair and I am always critical. To discuss anything else is only to benefit women. This helps the President and keeps my experience nicely limited.

SGT Ted said...

"I took off my promise ring because not long after I got it, it became clear to me that the primary beneficiaries of these rules were men"

There is a rather large subset of women who avoid take responsibility for their own choices when it involves delayed gratification by blaming men.

Hey Skipper said...

[Mr Wibble:] You could also reject the idea that human beings can't fly.

J. Farmer @0809:



Bushman of the Kohlrabi said...

A charitable interpretation would be that she's willing to sound like a complete moron if it helps her monetize the current environment of leftist derangement. That it probably gives her a shot at some cool party invitations is an added plus.

SGT Ted said...

The fatal flaw in the idiot Jills pronouncements is the assumption that progressive ideology isn't regressive in scope.

Equal Rights and Individual Liberty are historically the ultimate in "progressive" ideological goals. Using the State to deny Equal Rights, roll back and restrict Individual Liberty and punish political enemies is a regression to a tyrannical past.

Progressives have always been simply Monarchists who desire to use Credentials in place of Bloodline to determine who the Rulers get to be.

SGT Ted said...

"Why do progressives think they know exactly how and what Trump supporters are thinking, and why?"

Because it allows them to be hateful bigots with no moral qualms.

Progressives have always targeted unpopular populations of people to feel better about themselves. It used to be blacks, Jews and retarded people that were their targets. Now it's Christians, white males and non-leftist people.

WWIII Joe Biden, Husk-Puppet + America's Putin said...

Shorter Vanity Fair: We hate you but please vote for the corruptocrats.

Bay Area Guy said...

Memo to Jill:

We don't care about your purity pledge, your chastity belt or your no-pussy proclamations.

As self-appointed spokesman for the male members of the human species, frankly, your "no-pussy" pledge is not of any concern to us. None. Zero.

So, if you wanna write the 642nd installment of your "I hate Trump" article, go ahead. We don't care about that either. But don't incorporate your pussy-chastity-evangelical-summer camp-daddy issues onto us. It makes you look stupid.

J. Farmer said...

@rcocean:

The people who write/read Vanity Fair hate stuff like "promise Rings" or anything that smacks of Christianity or "middle class morality". Because they are the elite.

Exactly right. Charles Murray points out in Coming Apart that the elite tend to have strong industriousness, work ethic, and families though low religiosity. Amy Wax has remarked about elites that they "talk the 60s but live the 50s."

David Duffy said...

I'm always amazed at how rational people become when they abandon their Stone Age religion.

Jupiter said...

I would cheerfully accept a "new experience", in the form of half a dozen additional MS-13 members, to be scattered throughout NYC, if in exchange I no longer had to share the country with Jill Filipovic.

Nichevo said...

And for men troubled by changing family structures and expanded female power, there was one more obvious benefit to marrying a virgin: You’d never be found to be sexually inadequate.

If I said the women slut-shamed (and the majority of slut shaming comes from other women) because they were afraid that guys would realize how bad most women are in bed, the screeching would be non-stop.


Indeed - the notion that some women can be lousy lays, even if they've got a good face/physique, is novel/revolutionary/heresy/blasphemy to some. Or that some women dislike sex, whether or not they are good at it (but probably not). And that this is not necessarily the man's, or any man's, fault.

You've seen how she gets about anything resembling lookism (unless to say that she's pretty of course). Imagine Althouse's reaction if one were to diagnose her various sexual quirks and hangups as "frigidity." That kind of injurious accuracy is just what SJW Newspeak is intended to drive out of our minds.

Jill-baby, at any time, you using your sexuality is going to benefit some man or other (as well as yourself, you hope). Pretty hard to avoid.

dreams said...

Liberals are always bragging to themselves and to each other about how much more informed they are than the ignorant conservatives/Trumpers but they're the ones who are ignorant because of their liberal bubble which causes them to be oblivious of all the reasons for a different point of view, self-indulgent behavior that isn't available to conservatives given the dominance of the liberal media and the total liberal culture.

alanc709 said...

You found nothing intriguing in the news, yet this is a subject for a blog? ANother example of progressive derangement?

FrankiM said...

“Why do progressives think they know exactly how and what Trump supporters are thinking, and why?"

“Because it allows them to be hateful bigots with no moral qualms.

Progressives have always targeted unpopular populations of people to feel better about themselves.”

Lordy! The hypocrisy.

readering said...

The things people absorb at NYU Law School.

Bill Peschel said...

"Ann, do you sometimes choose articles for comment because they are mindbogglingly dumb?
Why embarrass her further?"

Because like it or not, this is the water we're swimming in.

Bay Area Guy said...

So Jill got wise and "rescinded" he no-pussy pledge, because a light bulb went off in her brain that not offering the pussy to men actually benefitted them?

Hmm. That's a pretty big inference hanging out there like a high, slow curveball to Albert Pujols.

Bruce Hayden said...

“Exactly right. Charles Murray points out in Coming Apart that the elite tend to have strong industriousness, work ethic, and families though low religiosity. Amy Wax has remarked about elites that they "talk the 60s but live the 50s."”

I think that is exactly right.

A significant majority of divorces are instigated by the woman. And the more sex partner’s she has had, the more likely she is to get divorced. Divorce hurts the wealth amassing prospects of the couples getting divorced, but it really hurts the chances of their children. And they in turn, when they get divorced, or even worse, have kids out of wedlock, condemn the next generation to an even worse lot.

If you want your children, and then grandchildren, to be doctors, lawyers, stock brokers, etc, and amass wealth, the best way to accomplish that is to get married and stay married.

One of the interesting things I noticed about the prep school that my kid attended is that they were one of the very few kids in their class from divorced parents. One girl had grandparents’ money behind her, but couldn’t hack it scholastically (actually ended up at the infamous Columbine HS). And, out of 70-80 kids, that was it. Then, about junior or senior year, there was a rash of parental divorces (5 or 6)- the parents had stuck it out until the kids were well positioned on a college track, and the parents’ divorces weren’t going to adversely affect their outcomes.

Brian McKim and/or Traci Skene said...

Jill tried to "complicate my view of America" once. I forget what it was she wrote-- it was a year or two ago-- but I clearly remember it as being one of the dumbest thing I have ever read. So now I save time by not reading anything she's written since.

WWIII Joe Biden, Husk-Puppet + America's Putin said...

The angry video gamer Christian hater/Jew hater class are not so industrious.

Oso Negro said...

@ Hunter - Yes! It was good for me if all the other boys wanted to have fewer sex partners. I entirely agree. How can a person be special if everyone does it?

effinayright said...

Conservatives value stability and continuity, and tend to oppose things that threaten that stability and continuity (of course this becomes problematic when we take the changes wrought by dynamic free market economies), but making it all about sex is childish and unenlightening. "Fear" of change or the unknown isn't always a bad thing. Call it "care" or "concern" or an unwillingness to act rashly or to accept transformations passively and one can see that it also has positive effects.
******************************

As you mention in passing, conservatives support free-market capitalism, the most dynamic change agent on the planet---which seriously undercuts your argument.

I think most conservatives would point to "Chesterton's Fence" as evidence that they simply want to see the reasons for change, not that they're opposed to all change.


Bruce Hayden said...

“But that assumes that sexual morality is the primary organizing force for evangelicals. Historically it hasn’t been. Indeed, the origins of evangelicalism as a modern political movement have more to do with opposition to Brown v. Board of Education than Roe v. Wade. American evangelicalism cannot be disentangled from racism—particularly as it becomes further intertwined with the larger religious right.”

Notice how that was done. Evangelicals supposedly opposed Brown v Board of Education, and, thus, a half century later, they are irretrievably racists, and therefore can be hated and ignored by all right thinking people, or at least by mind controlled sheeple like the author. It’s called assuming your conclusions.

HoodlumDoodlum said...

People who agree with me and my worldview are smart and good; people who disagree with me and my worldview are ignorant and bad.

I mean, that's it! The rest is backfilling examples and restating the premise in slightly different ways.

Michael K said...

Evangelicals supposedly opposed Brown v Board of Education,

Hubert Humphrey, with respect to the 1964 Civil Rights Act, said "If this law results in quotas, I'll eat the bill !"

He didn't live long enough

Lewis Wetzel said...

". . . a deep disgust at a perceived other attaining equal footing"
Self-awareness isn't a big thing with our cultural elites, is it?

Matt said...

How exactly do you resist stagnation and decline by importing the dummies and ne'er-do-wells from corrupt, backwards and alien countries?

One might be inclined to think doing so might speed up the stagnation and deckine.

Unknown said...

They never mention the severe, ongoing, issues we have with STD’s in our country when they are bashing abstinence or at the very least restraint.. Gonorrhea is almost antibiotic resistant. Millions of people have HPV. It’s out of control. Saying it’s only good to wait because if you haven’t had anything else you won’t know any better completely ignores the fact that casual sex outside of emotional connection erodes you and does not bring joy. Commitment is what makes intimacy possible.

dbp said...

I'm not sure about the "logic" of evangelical purity explaining Trumpism. The president is from a mainline protestant church, has been married three times and is reputed to have had numerous affairs.

Ingachuck'stoothlessARM said...

Fuck America, Fuck Trump, Fuck me!
Open Minds, Open Borders, Open Legs!
Live Large!

Sam L. said...

It's Vanity Fair. I don't give it any never-mind. It's like the "wah, wah, wah" sound in the Charlie Brown cartoons when grown-ups are talking.

Otto said...

"talk the 60s but live the 50s." Fits Ann to a tee. She loves peering into the basement but always from a comfortable perch. That's why she busted her arse to get out of Greenwich village.

Mr Wibble said...

I'm not sure about the "logic" of evangelical purity explaining Trumpism. The president is from a mainline protestant church, has been married three times and is reputed to have had numerous affairs.

Evangelical support to Trump is based on two things, IMHO. First, a transactional arrangement that they support Trump and he in turn backs their policies. Second, Trump seems to actually respect the evangelical vote. You don't have to agree with them to recognize that their concerns are legitimate and to propose policies to address their issues.

Bay Area Guy said...

Despite my Luddite tendencies, I am actually a fan of evangelical Christianity. Sure, there's some weird Jimmy Swaggart-type hustlers, but there's also Billy Graham-types, who did great work. Even though I'm not part of that, on the whole, it's a net plus.

Myself, I'm a flawed Catholic, part of a deeply flawed Church. But, again, on the whole, they do wonderful work with schools, hospitals, orphanages, and social fabric of our country. Definitely a net plus.

I am a BIG proponent of Western Civilization, of which Protestantism, Catholicism, and Judaism are big parts. So, despite my own personal flaws, I gotta give them their due credit.

Earnest Prole said...

Now do Puritanism and the Left.

The Cracker Emcee Refulgent said...

So removed from observable reality that it reads like a Prog acid trip. Are they really that cowed by their own straw men?

PluralThumb said...

" Fuck America, Fuck Trump, Fuck me!
Open Minds, Open Borders, Open Legs!
Live Large! "

Keep cool and carry on.

I hear Autumn should be quite nice this time around. Falling leaves are very relaxing.

jeremyabrams said...

The left lives in abject fear of Americans becoming more patriotic and more connected to God, and worst of all, happier.

Anonymous said...

Bill Peschel to MikeR: "Ann, do you sometimes choose articles for comment because they are mindbogglingly dumb?
Why embarrass her further?"

Because like it or not, this is the water we're swimming in.


But we already know that. We already know the tracks that the stultified en-bubbled brains of tools like Filipovic run on, we can predict what they're going to say about anything. We already "know the enemy". They are shabby hacks putting out rancid propaganda that presents no ideas worthy of disinterested analysis. It's not as if carefully-reasoned commentary pointing out their errors and stupidities is going to make a dent. Neither they, nor their audience, nor their masters care.

Only equally dim-witted and aggressive counter-propaganda would be likely to have any effect on the people dumb enough or brain-washed enough to buy into this stuff.

Comanche Voter said...

What a load of codswallop. She's preening for the "cool kids" who read Vanity Fair. A more objective assessment would say that this is narcissistic projection.

Yancey Ward said...

Wow! A girl that will sleep with you without any conditions is most mens' dream.

I happen think chastity before marriage is probably good for both sexes, though I never practiced this myself, and as far as I know, I was never a women's first time either. However, this is just my opinion based on experience of being 53 years old. What I knew at 18 wasn't much.

LA_Bob said...

I think Vanity Fair had some advertising space they couldn't sell, so they published this stuff instead.

gilbar said...

Saying it’s only good to wait because if you haven’t had anything else you won’t know any better completely ignores the fact that casual sex outside of emotional connection erodes you

Seems like someone is confusing Features, with Flaws; and complaining about ojectives

gilbar said...

objectives

gilbar said...

This is Fun!
the Brown v. Board of Education decision of 1954 explains the rise of conservative evangelism in the late '70s early 80's?

Roe v. Wade DOESN'T explain it; because conservative evangelism didn't Immediately erupt in 1974?
But Brown v. Board of Education from TWENTY YEARS EARLY, Does?

Got it!

Freeman Hunt said...

Lots (most?) of evangelicals don't go in for this "purity culture" nonsense. (Nonsense that strikes me as pagan anyway.)

Chastity is good. "Purity culture," however, is prosperity anti-gospel applied to sex.

Nonapod said...

It equal parts interesting and saddening to see a typical progressive's interpretations and imputations of the mindset of Trump supporters specifically and conservatives in general.

On the surface progressives appear literate, thoughtful, and self aware. They're often well educated and relatively financially successful. They have all the tools available to educate themselves about their fellow human beings and to try to understand what really motivates them. But they seem to lack the capacity to move beyond sophomoric comprehension of people who think differently from them. They seem to feel it's sufficient to simply reduce conservatives to ridiculous caricatures, like hobgoblins, or "deplorables".

We've seen it played out with liberal posters on these very boards. Rather than engaging on the substance of the arguments, they'll blanketly accuse people who disagree with them of being Trump cultists or whatever. They simply seek the lowest hanging fruit, the worst possible interpretations of those who disagree with them at all times rather than actually attempting to critically analyze their arguments.

It's sad, but I suppose it's very human. Homo sapiens have engaged in "othering" and tribalism as long as we've existed as a species. Perhaps we're really no more enlightened now than we've ever been, it's just that we like to pretend we are since it makes us feel superior.

n.n said...

Waiting until marriage acknowledges one of the basic truths of couple relationships: babies... fetuses. The man and woman who are not ready to commit, but are wholly aware and responsible, will not create a burden for themselves, or risk a Planned or shared child.

That said, "In Stork We Trust" is the faith of a willfully ignorant activist and tolerance of a wicked solution. Also, diversity or color judgment (e.g. racism, sexism) is an anachronistic artifact of a progressive age. The Left made a bad choice, several bad choices, now lose your quasi-religion and discover some reconcilable principles. Finally, stop placing the lives and dignity of men, women, children, and babies at risk while pursing wealth, pleasure, leisure, democratic leverage, and social progress.

Martin said...

The thing to keep in mind is that when progressive types get this crazy, they are probably projecting their own thoughts, which they cannot admit to themselves, onto the "other."

So, my guess is that Filipovic is using her "wokeness" (which, of course, destroys the capacity for useful thought) and hatred for Trump and anyone who would support him, onto those she hates and despises.

Now, I have never met her so maybe I'm, wrong. But, she has never met me, either, and in fact I doubt if she has ever had a serious political conversation with a Trump supporter.

DavidUW said...

Yeah it’s pretty obvious to anyone that men, specifically the upper 20% or so of men in looks money and power benefited the most from the sexual revolution.

n.n said...

If you're a perv living in NYC

They still think "grab them by the pussy" was an admission, when to date it was an observation and revelation of trans-social practices in some liberal circles.

Leland said...

I took off my promise ring because not long after I got it, it became clear to me that the primary beneficiaries of these rules were men.

Well yes, if it worked to get you to go to bed with them, but then you did accept the terms, which was they would only screw you over while you wore the ring.

I decided to look for other of her headlines:

Since Chappaquiddick, Democrats' views of women have evolved. Republicans' still need to.
Subheadline: "The new movie about the Ted Kennedy's involvement in the death of Mary Jo Kopechne highlights the progress women have made in the Democratic party"

In which she compares Ted Kennedy killing somebody as something unacceptable today by Democrats, because Democrats wouldn't even accept sexual abuse such as Al Franken. Which causes me to Google "Bob Menendez", and yep, her hypothesis fails.

daskol said...

She used to be hawt, but now shes just crazy qnd evil

That's a bit unfair. She's still pretty hot.

n.n said...

the upper 20% or so of men in looks money and power benefited the most from the sexual revolution

Sexual license and normalization (i.e. promotion) of selective-child under the euphemistic labels "planned parenthood", "reproductive rites", etc. "In Stork They Trust" has led to progress for #MeToo #SheKnew #SheProgressed and for males hoping to avoid commitment and responsibility. A wicked solution with "benefits".

MikeR said...

"'Why embarrass her further?'
'Because like it or not, this is the water we're swimming in.'
But we already know that. We already know the tracks that the stultified en-bubbled brains of tools like Filipovic run on, we can predict what they're going to say about anything."
Oh, I don't know. Doubt I could have predicted this one.

Todd said...

I took off my promise ring because not long after I got it, it became clear to me that the primary beneficiaries of these rules were men....

So says a woman with little to no self worth. Talk about getting it backwards...

walter said...

J. Farmer said...
"Similarly, adherents to Trumpism would rather know less, and risk stagnation and decline, than come into contact with information that complicates their view of America.'

Funny, that is precisely how I would define anti-Trumpists.
--
Exactly.
We had 8yrs of New Normal Obama bigotry of low expectations.
Filipout is just taking two of her obsessions and thrashing about trying to relate them.

dreams said...

If you attempt to defend yourself against the charge of racism, then you've already lost because you've let them define racism.

daskol said...

Shorter Filipovic: toxic masculinity yadda yadda.

JohnAnnArbor said...

Similarly, adherents to Trumpism would rather know less, and risk stagnation and decline, than come into contact with information that complicates their view of America.

Start with pre-conceived notions like that, arrive at pre-arranges result. No surprise.

Vance said...

Wickedness never was happiness.

That's pretty much the exact description of modern "progressive" problems. They want to be happy in doing wicked things--and it never works. You get pleasure, yes... but no happiness or joy.

Being promiscuous and then killing your unintended baby--how does that make anyone happy?

Chastity before marriage and fidelity afterwords is a pretty good recipe for happiness.

I'll digress here a bit: I've often said, tongue in cheek, that the reason God is God is because He is the only male that completely understands women--everything else in the universe is easy compared to that.

But He does understand both women and men, and knows what makes us happy--and wickedness does not. It's not just some old brain addled Shepard's whims.

daskol said...

Filipovic is frustrating: she's intelligent, but so suffused with ideology and full of contempt that you'd never guess it from her writing. She's also charming personally and has a good sense of humor (got to know her a bit as she dated a friend when she was pursuing a legal career), but that's also hard to believe given her stridency. It's all a bit sad.

Clyde said...

Sounds like a "loophole" girl to me. (NTTAWWT!)

Clyde said...

But she doesn't know jack shit about Trump supporters, like the rest of the people in her bubble.

daskol said...

Indeed. At the same time, she thinks she's got them pegged.

Anonymous said...

I was listening to a Zig Ziglar recording just a few minutes ago. He was on the topic of how a good family life is a key part of a good life. His message of encouragement is mostly about how to get over your self-limiting behaviors and do things that lead to success in life.

Zig spent a little time on the topic of commitment to one's spouse and children. He mentioned the work of a researcher who studied 80 societies that have come and gone. The common pattern was first there were strict expectations that sex was with one's spouse and the society flourished, then a relaxation of those rules and society declined, then collapse. The theme through the cycle was the motivation of men to produce value of some kind to provide for their families. As families went out of favor and the men turned to entertaining themselves their society went downhill and crashed.

I think 80 examples says the pattern is well established.

Narr said...

I had never heard of Jill Filipovic before today, and certainly had never seen her.

Now I have. Shame she couldn't be both hawt and smart!

Narr
Best schools, amirite?

Lewis Wetzel said...

". . . adherents to Trumpism would rather know less, and risk stagnation and decline . . ."
This is the opposite of the truth. "MAGA" expresses a desire to stop stagnation and decline. Trump adherents believe that what they need to know to be participants in creating this nation is being withheld from them because it "doesn't fit the narrative."
Look at the incuriosity of the media and our intellectual class on the origins of the "Russian Conspiracy" hoax.

daskol said...

This story made Filipovic famous beyond the feminist circles in which she was already a prominent blogger (feministing). Note that her first reaction was to find it funny. Her friends corrected her, though: she'd been abused.

Bruce Hayden said...

“I happen think chastity before marriage is probably good for both sexes, though I never practiced this myself, and as far as I know, I was never a women's first time either. However, this is just my opinion based on experience of being 53 years old. What I knew at 18 wasn't much.”

I will admit to having had dreams about missed opportunities from when I was 18, and even younger. Some of it was cues from the girls that I missed. Even later - for example, one woman, maybe 20 years ago, sat next to me at a bar, and proceeded to show me that she had removed her dance underwear because they were too hot. And some of it was not being able to keep a seduction going.

One of the reasons for age differentials in statutory rape laws is that, for at least awhile, an age based knowledge gap does exist. 17 year old boys with 16 year old girls doesn’t give either that much of an advantage. But add 10 years to the boy’s age, and it becomes too easy for him to exploit the girl.

Still, I do have maybe one regret. Met a woman I am still close to, when she had just graduated from HS, and I was halfway through college. I was somewhat sexually experienced. She was not. Things went swimmingly for maybe a month, and then my errant hands got carried away. That was it for the relationship, though I don’t think that either of us realized it for some time. Then, almost a half century later, I think that we both wonder what might have been.

dbp said...

I'm not sure about the "logic" of evangelical purity explaining Trumpism. The president is from a mainline protestant church, has been married three times and is reputed to have had numerous affairs.

"Evangelical support to Trump is based on two things, IMHO. First, a transactional arrangement that they support Trump and he in turn backs their policies. Second, Trump seems to actually respect the evangelical vote. You don't have to agree with them to recognize that their concerns are legitimate and to propose policies to address their issues."

I agree that it is rational for evangelicals to support Trump--he is largely supportive of their goals. What I think is irrational is for people like Jill Filipovic to suppose that purity culture is why they support Trump or how we got Trump. For adherents to so-called purity culture, they support him in spite of his libertine ways.

Anonymous said...

The researcher was J.D. Unwin. His book, Sex and Culture, was published in 1934. Here is a scan of the entire book:

https://archive.org/details/b20442580

Some commentary on J.D. Unwin's work:

https://iotwreport.com/anthropologist-j-d-unwin-on-the-decline-and-collapse-of-feminist-societies/

gilbar said...

Question?
after she took off her promise ring because not long after I got it,

can we assume that Then she started Putting Out?
or did she keep her legs crossed?

On Account of Because;
IF she held out, than what's the point of this story?
IF she decided to make herself Available, doesn't that mean that then Men took advantage of her?
It's Clear (TO ME) that the primary beneficiaries of these Betties putting out rules are men....

Seeing Red said...

Purity proponents, like Team Love It or Leave It, assuage their fears with a demand that everyone else keep their life small..."

No travel, eat local, no meat, live in a box, and LIoLI wants others to keep their lives small?

Seeing Red said...

Keeping your footprint small. Major cluelessness going on in that article.

Bay Area Guy said...

"I'm not sure about the "logic" of evangelical purity explaining Trumpism"

Yeah, I thought the charge against Trump was that he was grabbing them by the pussy. Now, they're complaining about not grabbing by the pussy.

Seeing Red said...

It’s getting to the point the Chicoms and those vile Progs should hook up and exchange ideas and views.

The Chicoms fired their academics cos they don’t “get Trump.”

I think that’s the catchphrase. They just don’t get it at all.

Spaceman said...

Sure this isn't Babylon Bee?

n.n said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous said...

Here is this evangelical Christian's reason to support Trump.

Hillary was the alternative in 2016. Talk about someone who is deplorable.

For 2020 the alternative will be a socialist, and socialism always fails.

Also, Trump is a lot of fun!

n.n said...

It's not diversity. It's not a color judgment. That said, emigration reform to mitigate the progress of immigration reform at both ends of the bridge and throughout.

Chuck said...

Pompous ass

Drago said...

Filipovic could easily be confused with any run of the mill NeverTrumper/LLR.

Drago said...

Anybody else catch a glimpse of Biden manhandling a gal who had the unmitigated gall to dare ask the LLR-Approved Joe Biden how many genders there are?

LLR attacks on said gal beginning in 5 - 4 - 3 - 2 - 1.......

h said...

I think a lot of commenters are missing the basic Filopovic logic:

1. There are are religious conservatives who encourage chastity before traditional marriage; this attitude is bad (because it keeps women from realizing their full sexual potential, or something).
2. Trump is bad.

Therefore -- since 1 and 2 are both bad -- the attitude describe in 1 is identical to the Trump described in 2.

n.n said...

how many genders there are

Two sexes: male, female. Two genders: masculine, feminine, respectively. And the transgender spectrum for individuals that exhibit transversal physical and/or mental attributes.

Narr said...

Sex is a biologic category; gender is a grammatical term in some languages.

At least that's what my college edition Random House Dictionary printed in 1969 indicates.

Narr
How things have changed

Lawrence Person said...

The words "Jill Filipovic" are your signal to stop reading.

JamesB.BKK said...

Shorter: What's wrong with these people not celebrating coming into contact with more potential herpes infections, and new neighbors with all-night loud music, fireworks, and several cars and roosters in the yard?

DEEBEE said...

Ahh, a vag that took off her promise ring and became a cunt

Tina Trent said...

Weimar feminism.

alanc709 said...

Is this woman related to the gal who claimed Trump abused her in Bloomingdales or wherever? Whatever happened to that one?

JAORE said...

The inside of my bubble is bigger than the outside... and the furnishings are fabulous.

gilbar said...

Is this woman related to the gal who claimed Trump abused her in Bloomingdales or wherever? Whatever happened to that one?

Whatever DID happen to that one? down the memory hole!

TJM said...

This woman and that magazine are crazy trash. Why post her crap?

tim in vermont said...

“Comparison is the thief of joy” - Teddy Roosevelt