August 12, 2019

"He said that criminalizing sex with teenage girls was a cultural aberration and that at times in history it was perfectly acceptable."

"He pointed out that homosexuality had long been considered a crime and was still punishable by death in some parts of the world.... He said people in Silicon Valley had a reputation for being geeky workaholics, but... [t]hey were hedonistic and regular users of recreational drugs. He said he’d witnessed prominent tech figures taking drugs and arranging for sex.... When I later reflected on our interview, I was struck by how little information Mr. Epstein had actually provided. While I can’t say anything he said was an explicit lie, much of what he said was vague or speculative and couldn’t be proved or disproved.... [E]arly this year Mr. Epstein called to ask if I’d be interested in writing his biography. He sounded almost plaintive. I sensed that what he really wanted was companionship. As his biographer, I’d have no choice but to spend hours listening to his saga. Already leery of any further ties to him, I was relieved I could say that I was already busy with another book. That was the last I heard from him. After his arrest and suicide, I’m left to wonder: What might he have told me?"

From "The Day Jeffrey Epstein Told Me He Had Dirt on Powerful People" by James B. Stewart (NYT).

80 comments:

Leland said...

This is like CNN admitting it didn't cover Saddam Hussein negatively. But then this is the NYT that also paid Walter Duranty, so perhaps that is more historically accurate.

tcrosse said...

What might he have told me?"

Things it would be dangerous to know.

Big Mike said...

After his arrest and suicide, I’m left to wonder: What might he have told me?"

He might have told you enough to get you killed. Sorry, let me correct that. He might have told you enough to get you to kill yourself. With multiple gunshots to your head. Using your non-dominant hand.

Beasts of England said...

'...had a reputation for being geeky workaholics, but... [t]hey were hedonistic and regular users of recreational drugs.'

Or as I used to call them, the good ol' days!! 😜

madAsHell said...

What might he have told me?

Nothing. He was a pimp. He was always drawing people in to screw them.

BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

Powerful people go *whew!*

buwaya said...

The writer missed an opportunity.
This book would have sold, and sold, and sold.

Achilles said...

From "The Day Jeffrey Epstein Told Me He Had Dirt on Powerful People" by James B. Stewart (NYT).


Democrats couldn't get more ridiculous if they tried.

Our elites are completely outed.

We see you and we see your followers.

Biden said we could take in at least 2 million more people. They are so desperate to replace legal voters and citizens.

Achilles said...

buwaya said...
The writer missed an opportunity.
This book would have sold, and sold, and sold.


Not through any normal publisher.All of the paths to monetize the book would be closed to him because they are controlled by the same powers that would be destroyed by the book.

He would have to be content with a place in history and a sudden onset of depression and induced suicide.

Unknown said...

Would it have sold? He was a free man at the time and surely wouldn't have admitted anything criminal. Likewise he wouldn't have invited lawsuits and discovery by dropping a lot of names.

Beasts of England said...

'This book would have sold, and sold, and sold.'

No kidding. He should have pulled a Jayson Blair and cashed in.

buwaya said...

He could have done the whole thing "Crazy days and Nights" style.

https://www.crazydaysandnights.net/

No names. Just hints, and more hints.

tim maguire said...

""He said that criminalizing sex with teenage girls was a cultural aberration and that at times in history it was perfectly acceptable."

He’s not wrong. Of course, lots of things have been acceptable at one time or another. We all have to live with what's accepted in our time and place.

AAT said...

Imagine all the people who felt a "profound sense of liberation and that their life had returned to them tenfold."

AAT said...

""He said that criminalizing sex with teenage girls was a cultural aberration and that at times in history it was perfectly acceptable.”

Same thing with slavery, right? And human sacrifice too.

Clark said...

James B. Stewart is the guy who wrote The Partners in 1983 (about 8 big law firms) and Den of Thieves about Boesky and Milken in 1991.

Big Mike said...

I also see that the FBI finally bestirred itself earlier today to raid Epstein's "Orgy Island." Michael K., if you're around, you can tell Kate for all of us that if the agents come back saying that they found nothing, then no one is going to believe them.

steve uhr said...

Achillies - I think in this booming economy a nation of 325 million could prob add another 2 million without skipping a beat. why you are so sure they will all be dems. New, lawful immigrants come here for Liberty and free enterprise. Republicans believe in those values.

rcocean said...

Epstein certainly had a point. Until recently, Abortion, Transgender, Homosexuality, and pre-martial sex were condemned, now they are celebrated. Why shouldn't pedophilia, or polygamy be the next on our cultural "Evolution"? Once you give up the anchor of Religion, anything is possible.

rcocean said...

"New, lawful immigrants come here for Liberty and free enterprise."

Bullshit. You have ZERO evidence to the prove that. Some do. Most don't.

AAT said...

“Epstein was found hanging in his Lower Manhattan jail cell with a bedsheet wrapped around his neck and secured to the top of a bunk bed.”

Wow. That would take some serious determination. His feet would be on the ground. I would have to see a diagram I think. It would be easier to hang yourself with your dick.

AAT said...

"New, lawful immigrants come here for Liberty and free enterprise. Republicans believe in those values.”

Yeah, and not very many Republicans have a big problem with “lawful” immigration either.

Beasts of England said...

'I think in this booming economy a nation of 325 million could prob add another 2 million without skipping a beat.'

Have you ever created a single private sector job?

caplight45 said...

Somebody had a Tom Hagen/Frankie “Five Angels” Pentangeli moment with Mr. Epstein like in Godfather II. Perhaps in the end he chose wisely.

buwaya said...

" New, lawful immigrants come here for Liberty and free enterprise."

And your educational system does everything it can to turn them into bitter enemies of the people you already have. Many evade the brainwashing, but a vast number do not. It is a deliberate attempt to create jealous tribes.

The evil of this system can seem astonishing, to a foreigner who understands what he is seeing. I was frankly shocked, almost two decades ago, and it has just gotten worse, much worse.

gilbar said...

He said that criminalizing sex with teenage girls was a cultural aberration and that at times in history it was perfectly acceptable

He's got a point!
read this book once (LOTS of people Swear it's ALL TRUE, in fact; they'd KILL YOU if you said it wasn't) And in this book, the Main Character had sex with a (in Fact, MARRIED!) a teenage girl (in FACT, with a Nine year old). . . But, it was All Okay, on account of because, they'd been married for a couple of years already by that point.

This book was All Full of moral stuff, about how you should only wipe your ass with your left hand; and that you should kill any Jews hiding behind rocks and trees (In Fact! the book said, that the rocks and tress would help you: It was sort of SciFi ish)

AAT said...

It was pretty nice here in the US when it was only 160 million. Lots of open space and woods near cities. Few “no trespassing” signs.

AAT said...

I wonder if he had a doula help him to hang himself with a sheet off of a bunkbed.

Otto said...

Cheap journalism. The NYT is becoming a rag paper.

rhhardin said...

There's something to be said for historical imagination. A lot of today's important moral truths are entertainment and vanity.

n.n said...

With the normalization of transgender spectrum indoctrination and corruption, social progress has left children as viable targets. I wonder if a judge with a sympathetic orientation would be willing to come out and force liberal sanction of child love.

I wonder if he had a doula help him to hang himself with a sheet off of a bunkbed

A death dealer is ethically committed to honor Pro-Choice.

Oso Negro said...

Blogger AAT said...
""He said that criminalizing sex with teenage girls was a cultural aberration and that at times in history it was perfectly acceptable.”

Same thing with slavery, right? And human sacrifice too.


That's right. Having sex with teenage girls is probably a gateway aberration to slavery and human sacrifice. Older American men should only have sex with boys or older women. THOSE ARE OUR CULTURAL NORMS YOU FUCKING PERVERTS!

rhhardin said...

Most of the important moral truths today are preserved by men. Women are always discovering new ones.

narciso said...

I think the main point is what once was properly condemned is now celebrated



https://mobile.twitter.com/julie_kelly2/status/1160971919061110785

narciso said...

And what was exalted is now looked upon,

Michael K said...

Achillies - I think in this booming economy a nation of 325 million could prob add another 2 million without skipping a beat. why you are so sure they will all be dems

Steve, I assume you are OK with no welfare for illegals. Right ? Right ? Right ?

Phidippus said...

steve uhr said: "I think in this booming economy a nation of 325 million could prob add another 2 million without skipping a beat."

Two million who? Singaporeans? Hong Kong Chinese? Germans? Norwegians? Canadians?

The problem is we have an ~1000 mile border with a third-world narcostate, which itself has a southern border through which invaders (some of whom come from Africa-- what did they do, swim?) from other third-world narcostates pretty much freely travel. And head, invariably, north.

If you want to fix that booming economy, especially the part that poorer American citizens participate in, let 'em all in.

And they (the ones who are coming in from the south) actually nearly always do vote Democrat.

In principle, perhaps we could, but have no obligation to, absorb 2M or so productive, legal, immigrants from non-hellhole countries. Surely you do not imagine that this is the outcome that the lefty open-borders enthusiasts have in mind, do you?

Does that help?

Milwaukie guy said...

He didn't squeal on the big boys and he leaves a legacy of justifications. He is a NAMBLA martyr.

Polygamy is next, because diversity.

AAT said...

Teenage girls don’t have fully developed brains. There are reasons for these cultural norms. It’s not a “gateway,” it’s wrong in itself.

Seeing Red said...

""He said that criminalizing sex with teenage girls was a cultural aberration and that at times in history it was perfectly acceptable.”

No more redneck jokes. At least they married them.

EDH said...

JEFFREY EPSTEIN WANTED TO FREEZE HIS HEAD AND PENIS AFTER DYING: REPORT

Newsweek BY SHANE CROUCHER ON 8/1/19

The bizarre pseudoscientific obsessions of disgraced financier Jeffrey Epstein, currently awaiting trial on charges of sex trafficking minors, are under the microscope after he reportedly wanted to freeze his head and penis after dying.

According to The New York Times, Epstein, 66, is interested in the controversial transhumanism movement, which believes advanced technologies should be used to modify and enhance humans' physical capabilities.

One unnamed transhumanist who had conversations with Epstein told the Times about his aspiration to freeze body parts after death using cryonics, a pseudoscience whose proponents claim it will eventually be possible to resurrect frozen people.

The publication also reported that Epstein, who was convicted in 2008 of soliciting a minor for prostitution and made to register as a sex offender, wanted to seed the human race with his DNA by impregnating up to 20 women at a time at his Zorra Ranch in New Mexico.

EDH said...

World’s briefest deposition: Do you, Jeffrey Epstein, have an egg-shaped penis?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7nyWOzR-1L0

Amadeus 48 said...

"What might he have told me?"

Nothing.

William said...

Epstein was a world class manipulator. He would have told Stewart only those things that served the cause of Epstein. I'm pretty sure the book would be self serving and nothing like Byron's memoirs.....Epstein got that right about sex with teen age girls. It wasn't so long ago that the audience at the Oscars rose to their feet to give a child rapist a standing ovation. Every generation creates their own sexual mores, but Hollywood is its own place and time. They like to think that they're very advanced, but they're just different and worse than the rest of us.

rhhardin said...

A good test, for any moral truth, is to ask whether it was discovered by a woman.

rhhardin said...

Many moral truths are tied to the nagging instinct.

Phidippus said...

EDH: "JEFFREY EPSTEIN WANTED TO FREEZE HIS HEAD AND PENIS AFTER DYING: REPORT"

You can tell Newsweek has really gone down hill by the redundancy in this headline.

William said...

To which would you ascribe the greater degree of difficulty: garroting yourself with a prison sheet or having sex with thousands of underaged girls on your own private island?.....I think it's quite possible that Epstein was depressed and had sufficient imagination and drive to figure out a way to commit suicide. Still, it does seem that there must have been some underhanded dealings suborned in order to enable the act....Nothing in his life so became him as his way of leaving it.

buwaya said...

Hmmm -

The published material is uncovering more and more.

That, plus speculation below. How much to credit this? Who knows.
What is certain is that these people all had unusual friends and contacts.

http://toresays.com/2019/07/07/exclusive-photos-epstein-who-was-blocking-the-unsealing/

Some names mentioned - Jeff Bezos, Brin and Page and Schmidt (Google), Myhrvold (Microsoft, etc.), Richard Dawkins and Steven Pinker.

wildswan said...

I hate to think what teen-age girls would develop as moral norms but probably they would make fun and handsome guys and the latest clothes and giggling a human right. But the norms would never include being handed over to fat old men who can't get women on their own because for one thing they don't want women, they want children, and for another they are abusive. Jeffrey Epstein took the worst eras worst morality as his own and in the end the worst eras worst morality is the way he died.

William said...

What's haunting about all these sex scandals is how they got away with it with so many for so long. Crosby drugged and raped dozens of women. I don't know what the body count was with Weinstein, but his victims included some of the best known, best connected women in the world. These were women who came from rich families and who had their own publicists and lawyers. Yet he was able to get away with raping them and doing it over a period of decades. Epstein was involved with thousands of girls and implicated some of the richest and/or most influential people in the world in his crimes.....It's kind of mind boggling. My heart goes out to Anthony Weiner. He's about the only well know sex criminal who didn't get away with much or for too long.

wildswan said...

Trump won't be caught up in Jeffrey Epstein's scandals because he would never have let someone else run the show. He would have fired Epstein in ten minutes; and in fact he banned him from Mar-A-Lago. Besides Trump doesn't drink and drug which is what makes orgies exciting and he likes women, not little girls.

h said...

I started to write a comment that said, "religious fundamentalists have a clear consistent way of addressing these: they oppose homosexual activity as opposed to God's law, and they oppose sex with teenage girls as opposed to God's law." But as I wrote that I realized that I could not actually defend the second part of this proposition. Do fundamentalist Christians, or conservative Jews, or strict adherents of Islam actually have a scriptural basis for opposing sex with teenage girls? I guess they would all agree that sex outside of marriage was proscribed. But do they all (any) oppose marriage to teenage girls? (I ask this sincerely, I don't know the answer.)

John henry said...

16 year olds can marry in Wisconsin

9 year olds can marry in Washington, Idaho and some other states.

With parental or judicial consent.

Per Wikipedia.

As I said at Chicago Boyz, if the girls had been of legal age it would have been no big deal. Embarrassing if it came out but not much more. The Queen would not have been pleased with Prince Andrew cavorting with a 22 year old. He's cavorted in the past, she has not been pleased and nothing has come of it. Tell Bill Clinton that if he doesn't come up with $500 not to tell Hilary about some 21 year old bimbo and he'll tell you very presidentially to fuck off.

But when the girls are below the legal age, in some of these Epstein cases, significant jail terms can result. How much would a billionaire be willing to pay to not serve 10 years in the pokey? A lot more than $500, you betcha.

If the girls were for a honeypot/extortion scheme it only works if the girls are underage.

John Henry

John henry said...

It may not be fair to go to jail for 10 years for a 16 year old, sexually mature girl.

But try telling that to the judge and see how many years it gets you shaved off your sentence.

John Henry

h said...

replying to AAT who said: "It was pretty nice here in the US when it was only 160 million."

I have a strong reaction against this kind of argument. Life in the 1950s was in almost all material ways worse than life today. I was alive then. We (my upper middle class family) had 4 (black and white) channels on our (one) TV. We had no internet. We had one car with no sound system, and no airbags, and no ability to accelerate beyond 60 mph. We never ate out (away from home). In the aggregate, we had much higher incidence of poverty, of undernutrition, of disease; we were less well educated; we never had "child-care" except from our parents.

Anyone who really believes that this life was "pretty nice" can re-create much of it: cut your cable, cut your internet, stop eating away from home, stop taking vacations except to visit family, live with one family car; quit one of your two parent jobs. And I bet no one, not one single person, would take me up on this challenge.

John henry said...


Blogger AAT said...

It would be easier to hang yourself with your dick.

Speaking of which, I heard an interesting anecdote on Sunday's No Agenda podcast. On thursday they had played some audio from a deposition where some lawyers were asking Epstein if he had an "egg shaped penis" His lawyer objected so they read someone's description of his penis as being wide at the base and "pointed" (their word) at the tip. Epstein and his lawyers walked out.

Between then and yesterday, one of the show's producers (as they call listeners) sent a note that he was a tattooist/piercer/body modification for a living. This kind of penis decsribes someone who uses a penis vacuum pump to enlarge his penis. Apparently this kind of result takes some serious long term, one might almost say excessive, usage.

Just another data point in the Epstein tale.

Perhaps one of our medico's can opine? Or perhaps Franki who seems to have a store of medical knowledge.

John Henry

John henry said...

I see EDH beat me to it with the Egg shaped penis deposition. And with a video clip!

Well done.

But you did not have the reason for it. So nyah, nyah, nyah.

(Just kidding)

John Henry

narciso said...

How about safe streets, dependable employment, a degree of social piece, intact families,

readering said...

Stewart, who practiced law before switching to journalism, has written lots of books but only one bio. Rick Rescorla. He was never going to write Epstein's bio. And as a gay man Epstein's teen blond harem would do nothing for him.

Roughcoat said...

Well, I was a child in the fifties ... lower middle class, family of 6 in a 2-bedroom tenement apartment with 1 bath, countless cockroaches, occasional rats, crazy incoherently yelling neighbors from Ireland, Eastern Europe, and Scandinavia ... building heated by a coal burning furnace that intermittently emitted poison gas forcing our evacuation ... 10 yards across the alley from my bedroom window was a noisy factory ... b&w TV often with broken picture tubes, no vacations except to visit grandparents at Christmas and Thanksgiving, battered used car, no meals out except once in while at local hamburger stand, and ...

And I loved it. Fondest memories. Loved every single minute of it. Nobody told me were hard up so I didn't know it. Very happy childhood.

Unknown said...

There's a lot to be said for everyone you loved still being alive..

R.J. Chatt said...

According to Jewish tradition, sexual relations are only allowed within marriage. Epstein was full of shit and everyone knew that. While the author might feel some guilt or regret over a missed opportunity I doubt the world is missing out or would have gotten anything worthwhile from him talking to Epstein

Achilles said...

steve uhr said...
Achillies - I think in this booming economy a nation of 325 million could prob add another 2 million without skipping a beat. why you are so sure they will all be dems. New, lawful immigrants come here for Liberty and free enterprise. Republicans believe in those values.

Your dishonesty in your caricature of us is just like all you pieces of shit. You can't argue in good faith because everyone knows you are full of shit.

We have no problem with say a Canadian style immigration system. Apply in your country legally. Come here. Support yourself for a few years. Obey the law. You are totally welcome to come.

But you do not want that.

You want millions of random poor people to invade our country that you can treat like slaves and vote for democrats.

Fuck off.

I will never allow you or your friends to have power over us.

Yancey Ward said...

Stewart is lucky he didn't take up Epstein's offer to write the biography- that is a close brush with sui.....er......death.

Crazy World said...

What a pathetic sad man, wth happened to him to inflict his perversion on soooooooooo many?

tim maguire said...

AAT said...
Teenage girls don’t have fully developed brains. There are reasons for these cultural norms. It’s not a “gateway,” it’s wrong in itself.


I recognize the name Osso Negro, but don’t recall his general posting tone so maybe he was being facetious, but what I thought as I read him was, “defending sex trafficking to own the cons.”

tim maguire said...

h said...
replying to AAT who said: "It was pretty nice here in the US when it was only 160 million."

Anyone who really believes that this life was "pretty nice" can re-create much of it: cut your cable, cut your internet, stop eating away from home, stop taking vacations except to visit family, live with one family car; quit one of your two parent jobs. And I bet no one, not one single person, would take me up on this challenge.


AAT’s comment is about crowding and access to nature. Elbow room, not modern technology. Though as some here have pointed out, modern technology has its downsides. Cutting the cord yourself won’t change what needs changing and would be a case of throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

Birkel said...

So this is the real life versions of elites hinting teenage girls?
The Hunt 2: Underage Boogaloo

Is that the game the elites were playing?
Burn it all down.
Spread the ashes.
Salt the earth where it had stood.

AAT said...

"This kind of penis decsribes someone who uses a penis vacuum pump to enlarge his penis.”

That would explain the fixation on teenage girls.

Bruce Hayden said...

To play devil’s advocate, an argument could be made that Epstein was right.

In the law, we have malum in se and malum prohibitum. Traditionally, throughout much of the world, murder has been considered malum in se, while consensual sex with post pubescent teenaged girls only recently, in the last century or so, become malum prohibitum In parts of the western world. On the flip side, male homosexuality has really only been tolerated in that segment of the population for roughly half a century. In much of the Muslim world today, homosexuality is still a capital offense, while marriage, and thus sex, with post pubescent teenaged girls is just fine. And one of their Prophet’s brides wasn’t even that old. I think if you think that consensual sex with underaged post pubescent girls is evil, you have to accept the corollary, that Islam, as a religion is evil. And, given the moral relativism of the left, that means that engaging in sex with underaged post pubescent girls is not malum in se but merely malum prohibitum - something that isn’t intrinsically bad, but rather just something that society has chosen to outlaw.

Western society can now afford to outlaw most sex with underaged girls, regardless of consent, because we no longer have to breed our females shortly after menarche, when they can have children, in order to perpetuate the species. In my family that line seems to have been in the late 19th century. My grandparents were all born in the 1890s, and most of their siblings survived to adulthood. Not so with their parents’ generation, born shortly after the Civil War. We have a four sided gravestone from that generation, for the four brothers to my great grandfather who all died in Augusts when they were under two. Much of the country didn’t get there until the early 20th Century, and parts of the world are just getting there now. If it takes 8-10 kids to perpetrate the species, and life spans averaged 40 or so, waiting until 18 or so for sex is a luxury that few could afford. Thanks to modern medicine, vaccines, etc, we now can. We can also, as a society afford homosexuality, which effectively takes the individuals out of the breeding pool, when, in past ages we couldn’t.

Just a reminder here, I wasn’t giving personal opinion here, but rather just playing devil’s advocate for Epstein.

Narr said...

Polygamy! Save us from polygamy!

One of my favorite comedy series is The Saga of Warren Jeffs. Apparently this guy is so dangerous and important that major networks devote hours of their time to reporting on his life and misdeeds. (This may merely reflect that little that was newsworthy happened during the Obama years, so I've seen fewer Jeffs shows in recently.)

Teenage girls may not have fully developed brains, but considering how many adults lack fully developed brains . . .

Narr
Girls are on their own, but they can handle it!

Calypso Facto said...

"I was struck by how little information Mr. Epstein had actually provided.... That was the last I heard from him."

Facebook update: James Stewart marked himself safe from Arkancide.

Kirk Parker said...

Bruce @ 8:12am,

What you said was completely reasonable, and could have formed part of a reasonable discussion of this issue.

Unfortunately we no longer live in an era of reasonable discussion.

Todd said...

"He said that criminalizing sex with teenage girls was a cultural aberration and that at times in history it was perfectly acceptable."

You will get much less jail time and fewer negative consequences today as a 30 year old woman having sex with a 14 year old boy (or girl) than a man having sex with an underage girl. Cause "girl power!".

Sure, Epstein was a pig but let us NOT forget all the other men and WOMEN enablers that supported / enabled him.

Shame he was suicided before he had a chance to talk (WHO did NOT see that coming?). Maybe one or two of the FBI agents that raided his island saved some of the incriminating stuff before it all accidentally got burned/lost/eaten by the dog...

dreams said...

My grandfather was born in 1875, his older brother was born in 1874 and the older brother married in 1894 to a girl born in 1891, ages 20 and 13. This was in rural Ky where the people lived on farms, that 13 year old girl was old enough and no doubt already had most of the rural skills such as cooking, canning, quilting and gardening that would be required of a backwoods nineteenth century farm family. They went on to have a bunch of children and one of their great granddaughters became Jefferson County Judge/Executive and later ran for governor of Ky.

https://louisville.edu/ur/ucomm/mags/summer99/cover_story.html

Aggie said...

"He said that criminalizing sex with teenage girls was a cultural aberration and that at times in history it was perfectly acceptable"

People used to regularly die painful and debilitating deaths before the age of 30 too, but I didn't see him volunteering for that particular privilege.

Reading between the lines, it looks like Stewart found Epstein to be banal and unworthy of his notoriety, and he was right to direct his professional attention to more interesting subjects.

n.n said...

He's right. Pedophilia is a trans-social orientation. The bitter clingers are standing in the way of social progress.

Sammy Finkelman said...

What might he have told me?"

Not too much that was true.. That almost certainly wasn't true about Elon Musk.

And it wasn't true that other people told him their secrets.

I Have Misplaced My Pants said...

Cause "girl power!"

No, that's not at all why. It's because every time this topic comes up all the dudes start grinning and saying Man I just WISH Ms. Sexypants had asked me to stay after school, hell yeah!