July 5, 2019

"President Trump on Friday said he is 'thinking of' issuing an executive order to allow for a citizenship question on the 2020 census..."

"... as his administration faced a midafternoon court deadline to say how it planned to move forward.... Mr. Trump said he was considering four or five options about how to add a citizenship question to the 2020 census after the Supreme Court ruled that the administration’s rationale for creating such a question was 'contrived.' ... 'We’ll see what happens,' Mr. Trump said on Friday. 'We could also add an addition on. So we could start the printing now and maybe do an addendum after we get a positive decision. So we’re working on a lot of things including an executive order.... I have a lot of respect for Justice Roberts, but he didn’t like it... But he did say come back — essentially he said come back.'"

The NYT reports.

80 comments:

wild chicken said...

Jawboning. He does a lot of that.

Worth a try eh?

eric said...

He says he has a lot of respect for Roberts but he just tweeted, "John Roberts is in Malta. Hopefully he'll stay there."

Hahahahahaha!

Chuck said...

Last time this came up in an Althouse blog post, I tried to make just a couple of points.

One was that if it were up to me, I'd have the citizenship question on the census form, as it was many times in the 20th century.

The other point I was trying to make was that Trump -- through his personal comments, Tweets, and his apparent pressure tactics within his administration -- has made it HARDER for DoJ lawyers to defend the actions of the Department of Commerce in this case.

Today was a great example of that. Asked by reporters for Trump's comments on the district court fiasco that was transcribed from July 3, Trump offered up one of the few dumb and useless bases for having the citizenship question. (Trump basically said that it was for redistricting, which the Administration's lawyers have been carefully running away from all the way through the litigation.)

https://twitter.com/hansilowang/status/1147174028181999616

Jeff Brokaw said...

A government that cannot legally add a citizenship question to its own census ... think about that.

Is this really who we are, and where we are?

Because that has “decline and fall” written *all* over it.

Chuck said...

George Conway retweeting on today's Trump verbal idiocy:

https://twitter.com/gtconway3d/status/1147197516162764801

Hagar said...

It needs to be a multiple choice question:
Citizen?
Permanent visa?
Temporary visa?
Illegal alien?

Jeff Brokaw said...

If a government does not have the authority, on its own census, to ask a person who lives within the borders of that country if they are a citizen, then who does have that authority?

Nobody, I guess? Good to know.

Kevin said...

The other point I was trying to make was that Trump -- through his personal comments, Tweets, and his apparent pressure tactics within his administration -- has made it HARDER for DoJ lawyers to defend the actions of the Department of Commerce in this case.

Either:

1. The President has the authority
2. The President does not have the authority
3. The President has the authority if the Supreme Court thinks he should have it

Option 3 is nowhere to be found in the Constitution.

Option 2 is invalidated due to years of past inclusion and Roberts' own ruling.

Kevin said...

Roberts is correct is correct that Justices are not just Red and Blue.

Some are verifiably insane.

n.n said...

We the People... and our [unPlanned] Posterity.

Civil rights, without enumeration of diversity, sex, gender, illegal aliens, and other special interests. Novel.

Ice Nine said...

George Conway - the worst case of legal TDS short of Laurence Tribe and Chuck - for all I know could be the smartest lawyer around, but his name before any opinion on Trump is like stamping that opinion with a big red circle/bar that says, "IGNORE."

narciso said...

They do have the authority to do so, just robetts is such a punk who doesn't deign to be accountable to anyone.

David in Cal said...

This is a winning campaign issue for Trump if the SC refuses to let him include the citizenship question.

I'm Full of Soup said...

I said on Twitter that Trump should just give the printers $1.4 Billion in cash [if Obama can find $1.4 Billion in cash I guess every president now can do the same] so the printer can "accidentally" add the citizenship question on the census form.

Kevin said...

Trump should send the issue back to the courts with the reason being that all the Democratic Candidates for President signaled their intention to cover the cost of healthcare for illegals, and the government needs to know how many people there are to adequately calculate the costs of such a law.

Accurately calculating the costs is a legal requirement of the legislative process prior to any such bill being signed into law.

He can get his budget director and the head of the CBO to vouch they have no way of knowing today how many people are in the country illegally.

Bay Area Guy said...

Solution: Ask the question on the census. And, over the next 6 months, the Court can decide whether it must be answered. (Duh, it should be answered)

The Left is batshit crazy on the question of illegal immigration. They want it, but refuse to acknowledge how bad it is for the country and the illegal immigrants themselves.

alanc709 said...

Chuck, George Conway has as much credibility as you do. In other words, none.

walter said...

"contrived" is of a piece with other creative decision making approaches like Mueller and Comey's.

Original Mike said...

I'm still despondent over the lawyers who had work over the 4th.

MountainMan said...

Alabama lawsuit on the legality of counting illegal aliens in the Census

readering said...

Roberts held that the Census could include a citizenship question but not for a pretextual reason. Trump just gave another pretextual reason. At some point, the Court will have to decide that there is something behind giving pretexts.

Ann Althouse said...

The NYT makes it sound as though Trump is just trying to put on a show of not giving up easily.

Narr said...

Haven't read comments yet, but I heard NPR interviewing some immigration activists, who explained patiently that people in their communities distrust being put on any lists.

Concentrate on that one. They speak for undocumented people, who are resistant to becoming documented, because in today's climate of fear generated by Trump (who terrorizes kids in concentration camps), to be put on a government list is unfair.

It's Kafka's world, I just live here.

Narr
Soy un cucaracho!

narciso said...

admittedly this was a very convoluted decision, but you don't get to mind read and you don't send it back to the same Obama apparatchik, that said they did not have the authority,

narciso said...

it's feminine person, Narr, honesty 'am I the only one not on crazy pills' they want to be eligible for certain status, but they don't want to be accountable for said status,

Drago said...

Althouseblog PSA

Remember, LLR Chuck has openly and proudly admitted that he has ONLY 2 purposes at Althouseblog:

1) Smear and lie about Trump in order to help the dems
2) drive a wedge between Althouse herself and her readers

That would fully and completely explain Chuck's previous racist posts and attacks on women and children while advancing far left talking points.

narciso said...

well there is the cedula, state issued id card, which usually doubles as work permit, certainly in el Salvador, I remember from the james woods film when he was a lefty and stone hadn't gone completely nuts,

Drago said...

Personally I think we ought to explore why it is exactly LLR Chuck feels compelled to try and separate Althouse from her readership under the pretext of posting as a "LLR" "principled conservative" (yeah, I did laugh a little after writing that!)

Drago said...

John Roberts has now gone the full obama/dem route and is simply making it up as he goes.

Interesting side note: Roberts was directly responsible for FISA court oversight during the period of time obama/biden were spying on Trump and running frame up operatives into the Trump campaign.

Roberts is in Malta? Gee, thats where Mifsud is from.

During that period of time Judge Rosemary Collyer's report specifies that 85%+ of the FISA database queries were improper and those illegal queries continued until Adm Rogers properly shut them down.

The contractor teams performing those illegal FISA queries include FusionGPS and Hillary-Server-bleaching Crowdstrike.

What an interesting an insular little community they have over there.

Thanks for staying on top of that Judge Roberts, chief legislative architect of RobertsCare.

Gee, I cant think of a single reason Roberts might be aligned against Trump and simply making it up as he goes.

Real "straight" arrow.

narciso said...

oh you haven't heard the latest twist, Michael hayden's henchman, Pfeiffer, just discovered that mckinsey had a contract with the puzzle palace, which unlike the one with booz Hamilton, that allowed snowden to be hired, has some bugs in it, and they blame admiral rogers for it,

narciso said...

look who else qualifies for the count,

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/2020-census-prison-population_n_5a7cb966e4b044b3821b0507

Michael K said...

I assume they could print the short form census documents first and then do the long form which presumable would include the citizen question.

One the other hand, he could say, "The chief justice has made his decision. Now let him enforce it."

narciso said...

I think that is the strategy, note above how Pfeiffer who belongs to the Chertoff group, throws another grenade at admiral rogers, seeing as general alexander did such a great job,

walter said...

I guess the less pretextual reason would be:
"Cuz."

Mark Jones said...

Option 1: Put the question on the form. Then you have months to fight over whether it's a legal question. If not, you can just air some PSAs advising people they don't have to answer it.

Option 2: Ask ARE YOU IN THE COUNTRY LEGALLY? That's not a citizenship question.

rcocean said...

I wish Trump would talk less about what he's going to do - and just do it.

rcocean said...

immigration activists = Left-wing open borders activists.

rcocean said...

The Left wing judges. District Court, 9th Circus. The liberal bloc on the SCOTUS have made it clear they do not want the immigration laws enforced. They are finding EVERY action by Trump to be unconstitutional.

How much longer can they engage in this obvious political behavior before the American people wake up?

Chuck said...

I really do remember when the Althouse comments pages weren’t this stupid, or this obnoxious. And it wasn’t that long ago. Trump changed things.

narciso said...

That's crystal clear to anyone with understanding you think the city of Baltimore where judge hazel hales from carres about citizens

Drago said...

LLR Chuck: "And it wasn’t that long ago. Trump changed things."

Yes, the very individual who openly proclaimed his ONLY reasons for posting here are smearing and lying about Trump as well as somehow, someway, "driving a wedge between Althouse and her readers" for some reason that he wont explain is complaining about the quality of the posts on Althouse.

Tell us Chuck, did Trump force you into a life of Smear Merchanting and Lying?

Did Trump force you to try and drive a wedge between Althouse and her readers?

Did Trump force you to make racist comments?

Did Trump force you to attack Children and Women?

You know, I cant think of a single stronger indicator for a leftist than trying to shift responsibility for his own failings onto some political leader....

....and there is Chuck.

Unexpectedly.

h said...

I do hope that in the comments in a blog from a Constitutional law professor, I will see some more informed discussion about whether (in light of the SC decision on the issue) the President can by executive order add the question on citizenship. I understood the SC decision to say something like, "Yes, the executive branch has the authority to add a question like this, but it has to be backed up with a rationale that is better than -- less baldly political than -- the rationale that the Trump administration has give us." So I (as a non-lawyer) don't understand whether this allows the administration to add the question now and provide a better rationale in court cases yet to arise, or whether the administration needs to provide a better rationale and have it approved by the SC before it can add it to the questionnaire.

Drago said...

You know, Chuck would never really commit to a life of Smear Merchanting and Lying and driving wedges between blog hosts and readers, its just Johnson and this damn war!!!

Marcus Bressler said...

What Trump says in interviews or in front of the press has NO bearing on any case before the courts. It matters what the lawyers say in the pleadings. That being said, Roberts is a snake who punts at first blush and also is capable of using Trump's campaign promises as a legal question when they are not put forth in the briefs, et cetera. We pay all those bastards to decide cases and stop sending them back to lower courts again and again.

THEOLDMAN

readering said...

Does Drago get a special alert when Chuck posts? Weird.

narciso said...

How is it four justices, were able to mostly conclude properly the secretary had the authority but Robert's could not.

narciso said...

Although some of their reasoning was suspect, this decision required clarity not anbiguity.

rhhardin said...

"Would you swear that you are a US citizen if we asked you that on this form?"

walter said...

"What exactly are we afraid of learning?"
Oh..maybe that the forever # of 11 million is a tad low.

narciso said...

ambiguity invites delay, clarity makes it easy to carry out the required practices

Drago said...

readering: "Does Drago get a special alert when Chuck posts? Weird."

Another leftist's very very special concern for an Admitted Smear Merchant who professes to be a "LLR" and "republican" and "conservative" is, once again, duly noted.

Its almost as if the entire lefty-verse gets a special call to action when their pal Chuck is on the receiving end of well deserved criticism and scrutiny.

Its almost as if they were all on the same team or something......

Chuck said...


Blogger Marcus said...
What Trump says in interviews or in front of the press has NO bearing on any case before the courts. It matters what the lawyers say in the pleadings. That being said...


Case after case; Trump screws things up for the lawyers on his side by saying stupid shit. You’d like it to have no bearing but smart lawyers would tell the client to STFU, and a smart client would take that advice. I think the lawyers in the DoJ Civil Division for Government Programs are smart lawyers. They might not have a chance to actually advise the President.

Having read a few of the old Trump deposition transcripts, I know very well who the dumb client is.

walter said...

He must like Malta...went there after Obamacare decision.

narciso said...

This is the payback against admiral rogers:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.politico.com/amp/story/2019/07/02/spies-intelligence-community-mckinsey-1390863

Drago said...

LLR Chuck: "Case after case; Trump screws things up for the lawyers on his side by saying stupid shit"

Another Smear Merchant lie.

The leftists and LLR-leftists have made up BS judicial "rules" for Trump that never existed before and these same activists on the bench are twisting the laws beyond all recognition

No real "conservative" lawyer would ever make excuses for such judicial behavior.

Yet Chuck does.

Gleefully.

Almost as gleefully as he celebrated the dens winning the House in 2018.

narciso said...

Yes that was something like three months wages.

Drago said...

And if anyone thinks the left and LLR-left are going to put away their unconstitutional make-believe rules when Trump is gone you are crazy.

As with obamas spying on congress and journalists, it was an easy progression to spying and running frame up ops on an opposing party and campaign, these new 1 direction ratchet rules will be deployed over and over until the dems and their LLR allies get what they want: total left-wing power.

narciso said...

Yes kingpin brennan had the candidates passports in 08, how do you think he became counter terror advisor then director, then reporters to cover his spiking the ball, and 5hen the Senate intelligence committee itself, hes like a villain from spawn

Drago said...

Its also impossible not to notice the immediate increase in smears and lies emanating from Chuck at those moments when the democrats are experiencing political setbacks or are being exposed as lefty hacks, such as in the immediate aftermath of their lunacy-filled debates.

That was the moment LLR Chuck popped in immediately with a transparently false assertion that Trump was going to announce some mythical Federal Busing Plan, which was rapidly exposed as a complete fabrication by Chuck.

Expect much more of this in the coming days and weeks and months from "Smears & Wedges" Chuck.

narciso said...

He hears voices through his fillings, the question at stake is whether the political class will be accountable to the people

narciso said...

Now it turns out this lawsuit was filed in the sdny by the acting atty general Barbara Underwood in conjunction with judge Jesse furman the brother of Obama's economic advisor, anyone see a conflict here.

Kathryn51 said...

essentially he said come back.'"

Haha, not according to my liberal (as in, absolutely bat-shit crazy) friends. This is it - the Constitution is under attack! Trump is going to SPIT in the face of the Supreme Court (amazing how the SC is "good" or "evil" depending upon the ruling). I made one small attempt to set the record straight on the SC ruling - gave up. Altho I'm an attorney - attempting to speak to non-attorneys - it doesn't matter. Orange Man is going to institute martial law or somethin'.

Mr. Majestyk said...

Public Service Announcement:

Non citizens can be here legally. MANY are. They are called permanent residents. So admitting to being a citizen doesn't mean you're here illegally.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled commenting.

narciso said...

Drone strike on the supreme court obviously, there is derangement right out of a Charles mccarry tale

walter said...

Per Chuck!,
Trump is your average perp in the justice system.

walter said...

(Chuck! also misses the days of presidents McCain and Romney)

Anonymous said...


I really do remember when the Althouse comments pages weren’t this stupid, or this obnoxious. And it wasn’t that long ago. Trump changed


Better get back to your safe space at the Bulwark when you get back from the bow tie store, snowflake.

narciso said...

That's in the multiverse, where Quentin beck comes from not really.

Achilles said...

readering said...
Roberts held that the Census could include a citizenship question but not for a pretextual reason. Trump just gave another pretextual reason. At some point, the Court will have to decide that there is something behind giving pretexts.

The President doesn't need a reason. He has the authority to do it. Period.

Roberts admitted that Trump has that authority.

Roberts also admitted he doesn't give 2 shits about the constitution or the law. He said the constitution gives him the power to require the president to produce a reason that satisfies him.

Without any actual citation of course.

Roberts is a globalist tool just like the rest of you.

Achilles said...

Chuck said...

Case after case; Trump screws things up for the lawyers on his side by saying stupid shit. You’d like it to have no bearing but smart lawyers would tell the client to STFU, and a smart client would take that advice. I think the lawyers in the DoJ Civil Division for Government Programs are smart lawyers. They might not have a chance to actually advise the President.

Having read a few of the old Trump deposition transcripts, I know very well who the dumb client is.



This is pure bullshit posted by a complete loser.

You douchebags are justifying lawlessness with the simple statement: Because Trump!

I would like Ann to explain how she would teach Chuck's bullshit "Because Trump!" legal reasoning to one of her classes.

Roberts is a disgrace.

narciso said...

It's the 31st amendment clearly

walter said...

If you were of SCOTUS, wouldn't Malta be you your refuge?

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walter said...

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Crazy World said...

Is Chuck a census worker? Why does he care who shouldn’t be in this country so much? Did the President harm you in some way?

Fen said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Fen said...

Chuck: I really do remember when the Althouse comments pages weren’t this stupid, or this obnoxious. And it wasn’t that long ago. Trump changed things.

Ya know, it's bad enough that you guys threw a 3 year temper tantrum because you lost the election. But then to blame Trump for the toxicity you spew here every day, it's like saying the girl in the short skirt is responsible for all the catcalls.

If you had any class, you would have recognized the fault lies in your own behavior, and you would be too ashamed to show your face here.


BTW, you were an obnoxious troll when I left here 5 years ago, long before Trump took office. You spiked and hijacked threads the same way you still do today.

Meade has said you are no longer welcome here. You are a douche for not doing the principled thing. Shows what kind of man you really are.

Kevin said...

Chuck: I really do remember when the Althouse comments pages weren’t this stupid, or this obnoxious.

But then you thought, “Hey, maybe I should set up an account and start commenting too!”

Rusty said...

Well,Chuck. You could raise the tone of this place immensely if you just quit showing up.
There's a good lad.

Hey Skipper said...

[Chuck:] I really do remember when the Althouse comments pages weren’t this stupid, or this obnoxious. And it wasn’t that long ago. Trump changed things.

I seem to remember reading you are a lawyer.

What I don't get, even though I stayed in a Holiday Inn Express, is where in the law giving the executive branch authority over census matters is there a requirement to satisfy the pretextual needs of the judicial branch?

If it isn't to be found — and Congress could fix this anytime — on what basis, other than on account of because they said so, did the five justices find against the administration?

Trump may be his own worst enemy (hard to believe given the rabid vitriol he has been subject to these last several years, but still). Fine. Where in the law is that material?