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93 comments:
Its a jungle out there.
Earthy deck.
Good piece by Jason gay - Wisconsin Alum-on the women's victory. For those not pay walled.
This isnt the first time this has haooened:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/07/07/donald-trump-aides-call-kim-darroch-sacked-leak-damning-cable/amp/
Taiwan to buy 108 M1A2 tanks.
So does the Greek election mean anything larger in Europe than a local throw-the-bums-out?
The new Democrats along with pasok shared a duopoly since the fall of the colonels they were displaced by the economic crisis
...The Trump-Epstein link appears purely social, far short of Mr. Clinton’s 20-plus plane rides on Epstein’s “Lolita Express” private jet around the globe in the early 2000s....
True, but I dont trust comeys daughter handling the case
"Good piece by Jason gay - Wisconsin Alum-on the women's victory. For those not pay walled."
Do you have a section you like that you could quote? I'm pay walled. Surprised Althouse didn't say anything about Rose Lavelle's Wisconsin connections. Just watched her goal again. She got some height in the air.
Need a splash of color there Meade,
The men's national soccer team is tied with Mexico.
The representation of fans in Chicago make me question that claim of *only* 11 million illegals.
Deck? I don't see no stinking deck!
Mine has a view of the boat ramp and small airport across the bay. And right now, the shadow of the hill to my west is about to say Good evening to the neighborhood.
Mexico's semi was first. US fans waited too long to buy tickets until after Jamaica. Chicago game sold out.
The Mexican player who scored the goal is wearing the same sports bra as Brandy Chastain was in 1999.
Or Chicago has a large Mexican/Hispanic population.
No largely boricua (Puerto rican)
The Mexican player who scored the goal is wearing the same sports bra as Brandy Chastain was in 1999.
That was generous of her!
It's still not an American sport at the men's level. Most of the fans at the London baseball games last month were American.
Apparently there was a huge loud chant of equal pay after today's match in the Lyon stadium.
Via Insty:
Global consumer electronics makers HP, Dell, Microsoft and Amazon are all looking to shift substantial production capacity out of China, joining a growing exodus that threatens to undermine the country's position as the world's powerhouse for tech gadgets.
HP and Dell, the world's No. 1 and No. 3 personal computer makers who together command around 40% of the global market, are planning to reallocate up to 30% of their notebook production out of China, several sources told the Nikkei Asian Review.
DOJ just reported the Census trial team being replaced. Assume leaks will reveal reasons. I'll hazard a guess. Fury that lawyers went along with plaintiffs' proposed discovery schedule in Maryland.
The Mexican player who scored the goal is wearing the same sports bra as Brandy Chastain was in 1999.
Unknown: "That was generous of her!"
Diet coke up my nose. Well played.
At the end of Luke 19, this is what known as palm Sunday, jesus is on the way to Jerusalem from where he started in Jericho, why did he choose palms because that was the symbol of the second maccabees revolt, his disciples borrowed a colt because it signified the house of David as he approached the gates, he wept while others were cheering him, because he saw the destruction of Jerusalem more than30 ueas later
Okay.
So when the pharisees rebuke the crowds he is setting them up, with all those old testament references
How exactly is a Democrat going to revers the tariffs on China while getting nothing in return, I wonder.
readering: "Apparently there was a huge loud chant of equal pay after today's match in the Lyon stadium."
Meanwhile, in real world, there was a loud chant of Deliver Equal Revenue!!
Here is one from the Smithsonian Channel I never knew before. The US captured an undamaged Mitsubishi Zero in the Pacific, flew it with a test pilot, noted its limitations and built a US fighter specifically designed to exploit those weaknesses. It makes you wonder if the Japanese had read any military history before attacking Pearl Harbor. You are never going to win a war with a major industrial power if you can’t destroy their ability to make weapons.
Yamamoto warned the control junta about this, they didnt listen.
"Apparently there was a huge loud chant of equal pay after today's match in the Lyon stadium.”
I wonder why people tuned them out as political?
But seriously, the US wins too much. I remember being in Australia when a woman who had won a BRONZE medal returned from the Winter Olympics She was greeted like a national hero, well, hero of the moment. It was sort of touching. Not that I would change the rules or anything, it’s just that you can’t get all excited about wins in the same way.
"So does the Greek election mean anything larger in Europe than a local throw-the-bums-out?"
Tsipras had a shot several years ago to cement his position, but he pissed it away when he bent over for the EU.
And, no, it doesn't mean anything larger. The Greeks are a defeated people at this point- the new government won't be any better.
Nobody I believe it was in the Aleutians. Pilot forced to land. Didn't think to destroy his plane. Found later.
One point we can concede is that sport is one of the few professions in the US where a gender pay gap actually exists.
They never are going to get their equal pay unless they can force us to watch. It’s typical lefty economic dirigisme.
Study of revenues 2016-18 showed women's team brought in slightly more than men's. 50million to 49 million dollars.
Highest tv audiences have been for women's team matches.
NY Times interprets DON announcement as implying census trial team quit.
"they can force us to watch."
They don't need you to watch. They have lots of fans. If they played in Chi-town the stadium would be packed. It was packed in France.
Their audience is young. & that's the market that buys stuff.
Well, there is a loon calling out on the lake, so I think it’s time for screens to go dark and to enjoy the evening.
readering: "Highest tv audiences have been for women's team matches."
In which markets?
Among which demographics?
What was the average viewing/dwell time?
Oh well
https://mobile.twitter.com/AG_Conservative/status/1147698061692551173
readering said...
Study of revenues 2016-18 showed women's team brought in slightly more than men's. 50million to 49 million dollars.
If players for the national teams get paid I don't care if the men's and women's players get paid to play the same amount of money for the national team. I didn't even know they got paid.
We know that is not what those women are bitching about.
WSJ wrote an article on the revenue. https://www.wsj.com/articles/u-s-womens-soccer-games-out-earned-mens-games-11560765600
They won 2015 World Cup. This win boosted interest and women's game revenues which then exceeded men's.
I support the men's team & want them to do well, but that team couldn't fill a stadium in Chicago tonight. Chicago stadium filled with 80% Mexico fans while the women's team attracted enough people to Paris to dominate the stadium seating. The Mexican team has had to put out publicity stuff in English because they've attracted so many American English-only speakers.
& USWMNT audience skews young. That's who buys sports stuff. They won another World Cup. They're legends now. Millions of pre-teenage girls who play soccer are watching them & asking for jerseys. Of course there's tons of interest. It's not that impt. to revenues if older men don't want to buy jerseys or tickets. Daughters are going to ask their Dads to attend games & buy jerseys.
@readering, the Zero flipped over on boggy ground, breaking the pilot’s neck.
@Althouse, over at Instapundit there is a link to a story that Melania Trump knew immediately rhat Christine Blasey Ford was lying. How did the woman fool you but not Melania?
Blogger Big Mike said...
@Althouse, over at Instapundit there is a link to a story that Melania Trump knew immediately rhat Christine Blasey Ford was lying. How did the woman fool you but not Melania
Why do you claim AA was fooled?
As cruel neutral she could view the Senate circus as joust ( or WWW as I do.)
A weeping Kavanaugh was out of kilter!
For Melania as mother her child's safety is under constant threat forever more.
"there was a huge loud chant of equal pay after today's match in the Lyon stadium"
The women's world cup championship is equal to a men's high school team. What do they get paid?
What would be "equal" is for both male and female teams to get the same percentage of the gate.
Someone is on a grudge mission to divide the commenters here from our very tolerant hostess, Althouse.
I'm trying to imagine a bigger loser.
"Hey Chuck, the gang is going out for drinks, wanna join us?"
"Can't. I'm waiting to see if I can make some blogger lady angry with her jackass commenters"
LOL.
“They don't need you to watch. They have lots of fans.”
Who are they going to play week in, week out?
There was that one girl who grabbed the flag off the ground before the “US team” danced on it. So there’s that.
Now they are blaming the Russians for the Climategate leak, well, they are saying it was a hack, it seems obvious it was a leak. Why is it that so many people want to give Russia credit for putting true information in the hands of the American people?
Boy, the lefties sure love women's soccer. In Los Angles the soccer teams' fans all waved Mexican flags.
Related ? Probably
Blogger Fen said... Someone is on a grudge mission to divide the commenters here from our very tolerant hostess, Althouse. I'm trying to imagine a bigger loser. "Hey Chuck... LOL.
The only thing worse than being "Eddie Haskell" Chuck is being someone who thinks he has any influence on anybody other than humor and/or trigger schadenfreude. You need to take your anti-estrogen pills if you are going to inject T. Shrunken balls and catty behavior are not features.
Blogger Achilles said...
readering said...
Study of revenues 2016-18 showed women's team brought in slightly more than men's. 50million to 49 million dollars.
If players for the national teams get paid I don't care if the men's and women's players get paid to play the same amount of money for the national team. I didn't even know they got paid.
We know that is not what those women are bitching about.
No, you are right. Nobody, especially world class hyper-competative athletes, cares about getting paid more money based on their ability to earn. This is because liberals hate to be rich and womens female soccer players are all liberal socialists and some even Stalinist and or Trotskyite.
The reason for "bitching" is some mysterious conspiratorial agenda designed to take your guns away, force your wife to get an abortion if the child is male and make you share your house with Hondurans.
Last night my neighbor, who is from South America, had about 20 cars over. Big party. I figured there must be some soccer game on, but I wouldn't know. I don't watch that game. Found out this morning the mens US vs Mexico was going on.
I simply could not care less.
It's July. NFL training camp starts in a few weeks. Thankfully.
This is because liberals hate to be rich and womens female soccer players are all liberal socialists and some even Stalinist and or Trotskyite.
No, "Liberals" (leftists) hate anyone ELSE who is rich. As for liberal Socialists, I'll bet the pink haired lesbian is one.
Football season is coming.
"I'm trying to imagine a bigger loser."
I can. Heck! Anyone who reads these threads can easily do so.
'cause nobody has to imagine 'em. They're right here in front of us, day-after-day-after-day-after-day-after-day-after-day, constantly taunting other commentators with childish remarks and immature slurs...commentators who often-times aren't even posting in the thread, yet these losers still feel the need to call 'em out and attack 'em over long-held political grudges.
Now THAT'S a loser, for sure. Maybe not the "biggest" loser, but definitely bigger than most.
“Need a splash of color there Meade,”
The color green might not agree with you.
Looks really nice.
Ours has a lot of flowering plants right now.
Bees seem to appreciate it.
They've been leaving me alone.
"Who are they going to play week in, week out?"
Do you mean who do they play for when not in the World Cup? Rose Lavelle is with the Washington Spirits. You can look up the schedule on the internet.
Rose Lavelle is with the Washington Spirits.
Are they filling stadiums?
If Chuck didn’t exist, we’d have to invent him. He is such a perfect stand in for the irredentist wing of the Republican Party.
"The women's world cup championship is equal to a men's high school team. What do they get paid?"
Seems to me the issue is Revenue and Fans. Doesn't matter if you think they are a bad product. The question is if the millions of fans think they are a bad product. Can they fill a stadium? Will pre-teen girls buy their jerseys?
Do the athletes in the US M vs. WNT have more fans and bring in more revenue? equal revenue? less revenue? Those are the questions I would want answered when evaluating pay levels.
https://soccerstadiumdigest.com/2019-nwsl-attendance/
They should be paid slightly better than minor league baseball players maybe?
Men’s attendance is more on a par with Major League Baseball
https://soccerstadiumdigest.com/2017-mls-attendance/
Maybe the fact is that there is actual demand for the players on the men’s team outside of the World Cup?
Are they filling stadiums?
I don't live anywhere near WA DC right now, so haven't been to one of her games. Wall Street Journal says the women's national team has pulled in more revenue then the men's team since they won the world's cup in 2015. Now, I'm not a sports reporter.
All I know is what the article says. Does that seem plausible to me? Yes, for the US MNT and WNT. The US MNT has been going through coaches and having issues. Meanwhile millions of girls who play soccer and fans are into the US WNT, which is a very popular team.
Now, for the men, I know that the Seattle Sounders pull a HUGE crowd each game. That's a men's team if you are not familiar. There's a march to the match in Pioneer Square that's a bit rowdy. You can look it up on you tube if you want to see fan rivalries between Seattle and Portland. It's passionate. As one women said, game day is "no place for a baby."
The difference of course is that a Major League Baseball team plays 162 games per season. So they probably should be compared to the NFL, except the NFL also gets mega huge TV ratings. Any NFL team that averages under 5K fans per game would be forced to move.
I don't know the details of the dispute. They'll work it out in mediation. Do think the women's national team is bringing in fans with these wins. My overall opinion is that funding the sport, for both men and women, makes good sense for the health of the league and future revenues.
Seattle Sounders draw an average of 43K fans per game, which would put them in 32nd place in the NFL last year, right above a team that just moved.
The Seattle NFL team draws just under 60K fans per game. So I don’t know about “huge” but respectable and encouraging for soccer fans, I guess. The Portland woman’s team is the second highest drawing team and draws 18K on average. The mens players are simply more valuable *outside* of the World Cup. They have more options.
So they probably should be compared to the NFL,
Hold on: You do know soccer player in the US, men and women, get paid a LOT less then the players in the NFL?
“Do think the women's national team is bringing in fans with these wins”
I will wait for hard numbers. But looking at it now, it seems pretty obvious to me that the mens players bring significantly more money to the sport when the parameters are not narrowly defined.
Seattle Sounders draws huge fans for games in Seattle. Fans on the street and dressing like they're going to a Seahawks game.
I am not an expert on this lawsuit/ mediation. I don't know details so I don't have opinions about the dispute.
But I do know the dispute is not over "we should be played what male NFL players are making." That's not the question. They aren't asking for NFL salaries. No one is. That said, I do think there is a salary cap issue for men's soccer players in the US league. But that's a different question.
But looking at it now, it seems pretty obvious to me that the mens players bring significantly more money to the sport when the parameters are not narrowly defined.
Part of the wider question is about strategies to grow the sport. World Cup wins attract fans. Well funded athletes attract more athletes in the future. True for both men's and women's teams in the sport.
You do know soccer player in the US, men and women, get paid a LOT less then the players in the NFL?
I meant that you can’t compare attendance to baseball, which plays 82 home games and you can make it on a lower average figure, not that the attendance is close. There is no NFL team anywhere close to the abysmal figures that the NWSL draws. The lowest NFL team last year, a team which then moved, roughly doubled the best attended NWSL team, and the lowest team was an outlier. From 31st place on, the NFL triples the highest attendence and beats the middle to lowest teams by at least a factor of ten, not counting huge TV revenue from massive audiences.
MLS is plodding along, somewhere around where the NFL was in the ‘50s. It will probably grow, but it’s just economic fantasy
to suggest that the women’s world cup players are worth the same, empirically, as the men. You have to severely restrict the evidence you look at.
I guess if you think the best strategy to grow the sport is to associate it with harping and complaining over money, especially in politically charged terms, MWSL is free to try it!
It’s still a good thing that that one player thought to pull the America Flag off of the ground just as the other players were set to begin dancing on it.
I thought the discussion is about a specific soccer team who has a legal suit pending and is in mediation. There's specific numbers they all can talk about. As I said, I am not familiar with the details. I have a general interest in the League paying men & women soccer players generously because I want to support the sport.
One other thought: There have been a group of haters on the soccer thread. My conclusion is that some American men HATE soccer and want it to disappear entirely from the American scene. They don't want it on ESPN. They don't want to hear about it. They don't want American teams playing in the World Cup.
So, it makes sense that sort of guy would want to not pay the players. That some commenters active interest in the destruction of soccer. (I don't know where you stand, but I'm guessing from your comments you do not support soccer or the team.) If the salaries are bad, the best will be drawn to other sports. That's in the interest of the haters. People who support the game are going to see it different.
Rappino says that discussion is over.
So there.
I don’t care if soccer is on ESPN or wherever. I just don’t like being told that women’s soccer is somehow equivalent to the men’s sport, and that I owe it to myself to watch it and I am unpatriotic if I don’t. Any more than I like being told, against the evidence of my own eyes, that the LPGA is equivalent to the PGA. I don’t like being lied to, and they all take the same fake awed tone of voice. "This lady player is the equal of Tiger Woods in our sport!" Ha! I have seen Tiger Woods play and at the top of his game, he was an amazing athlete to watch, like Michael Jordan, in my lifetime anyway. He did stuff that you see other players do once in a while, shot after shot after shot round after round.
I don't know how this abuse can stand if gender is a construct.
"I just don’t like being told that women’s soccer is somehow equivalent to the men’s sport, and that I owe it to myself to watch it and I am unpatriotic if I don’t."
It's easily ignored. The World Cup is 1 time every 4 years.
No one cares if you watch soccer or not. I don't care if you watch it. If someone in your personal life is bugging you to watch it, that's a personal issue. There's lots of things to get upset about in life. A game showing on the TV you don't like is not one of those things.
The TV revenue for the Female World Cup is $138 million. For the men's its $6 Billion. How this is divided up between the team's who participate, I don't know.
Further, what's not often mentioned is the women are paid by USA soccer - the men aren't. The men are pros that are paid by their Teams. IOW, the women are subsidized.
To explain it. Imagine if you had world cup in Baseball. The men would be pros and the new york yankees or whoever, would pay their salaries while they were on the world cup team. But a women's BB team would be made of amateurs or from obscure female BB teams. They would have to be PAID by world cup in order to play.
So, any comparison between the mens and womens futbol teams seems unreal. But I think the women should be paid what they're worth.
In tennis, the women & men are paid the same. Even though the men play 5 sets and the women 3. How is that fair?
Wall Street Journal sports writer linked to this story: Women’s World Cup Final Tops Men’s 2018 Championship Game by 20% in Early Ratings . https://www.thewrap.com/womens-world-cup-final-ratings-usa-netherlands/
He's been busy tweeting since the win:
I hope you enjoyed it; many millions did. If you couldn’t bear to watch this edition of the USWNT; if you rooted for the Dutch, just to prove a stubborn point: lah-dee-dah and boo-hoo-hoo for you. You missed all the fun.
The USWNT won the World Cup, Megan Rapinoe is now a legend, and the haters can go sit on a rock.
https://twitter.com/jasongay?lang=en
Sunday's Women's World Cup match ranked as one of the highest-rated soccer telecasts in US history. Full Nelsen #'s will be released soon...
Brian Stelter
My conclusion is that some American men HATE soccer and want it to disappear entirely from the American scene.
I'm an American man who likes soccer in general, and the US women's national team in particular. I have been following the team since the first women's world cup in 1991. That's why I am pissed off at Rapinoe. The US WNST has spent thirty years building a fan base based on a wholesome image (good role models for daughters), a positive attitude and patriotism. (Not to mention a commitment to excellence and great soccer)
Could you imagine Michelle Akers, or Mia Hamm, or Abby Wambach being this selfish? Rapinoe is burning through a lot of good will. Look at the reaction to O'Hara rescuing the flag after the game.
I would have some respect for Rapinoe if she had simply resigned her spot with the statement that she cannot represent the US while Trump is in office. But that would require Rapinoe to have honor and be willing to sacrifice, and I don't think either is true.
Rapinoe is a great athlete, but has serious defeciences as a person.
My conclusion is that some American men HATE soccer and want it to disappear entirely from the American scene. They don't want it on ESPN. They don't want to hear about it. They don't want American teams playing in the World Cup.
You sure seem to spend a lot of time attributing motives to people who really don't care.
For the record, I've always watched a bit of soccer ... be it the Sounders, the USMT (Gold Cup and World Cup) and I'll even catch a few games to watch Messi, Ronaldo and the other top teams because they're the best at what they do.
Up until this year, I've watched the USWNT, too. The match against Canada a couple years ago was classic.
Know what I didn't watch a single second of this time around? ANY match of the Women's World Cup. Three guesses as to why.
You bring your left-wing, Hate-Trump political bullshit onto my TV? Click.
Every time.
Gahrie,
I'm not talking about people like you. I'm not taking about the political stuff. The people I'm taking about have NOT been arguing with me about political stuff for 2 days. They've been complaining that ANY women playing soccer are horrible to watch and untalented.
I'm talking about the guys who have been bashing women's soccer as soccer. Talking about what a bad product it is. Writing over and over again about how women are untalented and awful to watch. I was surprised by their sentiment. They seemed upset they weren't the audience.
These men told us (those who enjoy the games) that we have horrible taste for watching soccer and women's soccer in particular. These men made a great fuss about how men are superior to women at sports. They seemed hugely offended women's soccer was put on TV. I've come to some conclusions over the past few days. I've read a lot of men commenting on the internet about women's soccer. Many do not seem to care about the politics, but feel upset a soccer game played by women was shown on TV.
These are my conclusions:
These men are upset they are not the intended audience. They aren't the fan base, and they're upset ALL sports are not catered to their specific interests. The same men claimed to only watch women's sports if the women were scantily clad and "hot." The only women acceptable in sports were women beach volleyball in bikinis. If not, they want the sport off their TeeVee.
Women's soccer is offensive to these men. The existence of it in the public sphere -- on TV or in the press is offensive. Not this particular team or a particular person, but the sport itself.
NOTE: My comments refer to a specific sub-set of people.
It was not intended to refer to every man or every person who doesn't like soccer or prefer men's soccer over women's soccer. Obviously lots of people like things or avoid things for different reasons. I'm not talking about the people who like women's soccer and boycotted for political reasons. I was in dialogue with people who complained about the quality of women's soccer, not about the political issues.
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