April 1, 2019

"This affectionate and sometimes intimate physical style is one of the former vice president’s trademarks, a defining feature of the warm and upbeat persona he has built..."

"... during more than four decades in the national spotlight. But the appropriateness of Biden’s physical behavior toward women is now being questioned, after a female Democratic politician penned a viral Internet piece describing an alleged 2014 encounter that left her offended and uncomfortable. As Biden prepares to announce whether he will run for president in 2020, the episode has raised questions about whether the older, self-described 'fingertip politician' is well-suited for the White House in the wake of the #MeToo movement and at a moment of rapidly shifting social norms.... Though photos attesting to this behavior abound on the Internet, they were often framed in past news accounts as harmless and sometimes entertaining — a sign of 'Biden being Biden.'... Then controversy erupted this weekend after [Lucy] Flores, the former Democratic nominee for lieutenant governor of Nevada, described Biden placing his hands on her shoulders, leaning in to smell her hair and kissing the back of her head as she prepared to speak at a 2014 campaign rally.'I had never experienced anything so blatantly inappropriate and unnerving before,' she wrote... During an interview Saturday, Flores said that she did not feel a sexual overtone in Biden’s alleged behavior toward her, but that this should not lead people to discount its seriousness....."

From "Joe Biden’s affectionate, physical style with women comes under scrutiny" in WaPo.

This is a pretty long article but it does not even mention something that I think is crucial. Who was involved in launching this new attack? The material is old. The Flores incident goes back to 2014. #MeToo prompted new speech about old incidents, but #MeToo goes back to the fall of 2017. Biden's likely candidacy has been plain since 2016. Biden has been leading the polls for quite a while. Various candidates who may think they deserve front-runner status — including all the women — find themselves stalled behind 2 old white men — Biden and Sanders — and looking at 2 young white men — O'Rourke and Buttigieg — moving up on them. Did Flores act entirely on her own or did one or more of the female candidates or their operatives move behind the scenes to scare up the old stories and push old Joe into disqualifying himself?

I watched Flores on Jake Tapper's "State of the Union" yesterday, and he confronted her with questions about whether she acted alone. She jumped very eagerly, so eagerly that we wondered if she was lying. I'm talking about the part that begins at 6:17, which we rewound and rewatched numerous times. Tapper asks "Did you have any conversations about what happened with any presidential campaign before you wrote that piece for The Cut?" She says "No" before he gets to the end of the question, and then — when he echoes and re-questions with "No, you haven't talked to anybody?" — "No, no," a double "no."



Here's the transcript.

151 comments:

rhhardin said...

#MeToo will run into #NobodyCares, if it hasn't already.

If it's not reported at the time, it didn't happen.

She decided to be shocked long after the event, rather than showing it at the time.

Narayanan said...

***Did Flores act entirely on her own or did one or more of the female candidates or their operatives move behind the scenes to scare up the old stories and push old Joe into disqualifying himself?***

Is this inside baseball thinking?

Proof that Ladies can play baseball, even if they don't have no bat to swing as old Joe is finding out to his grief.

Joe can take his bat and go home now.

I'm not Laslo

mccullough said...

Time to drag Obama’s name into it. Biden was Obama’s Vice President. Obama tolerated this behavior from Biden.

So did these Senators who have been around for awhile. Why didn’t Bernie or Amy or Cory or Kirsten ever say anything

What about the Senator that Obama called The Prettiest Attorney General? Why didn’t she decry that remark as well as Old Joe.

rehajm said...

it does not even mention something that I think is crucial. Who was involved in launching this new attack

Yes, if you're interested to know if she's motivated to harm Biden or to harden Biden. In a race with two dozen candidates it's just an early volley. The timing is matters- an early attack to break momentum or an early tempering of old claims so Biden can claim old news?

RMc said...

Gonna be a long year-and-a-half.

whitney said...

You know what would be funny if a requirement for being on these shows was you got hooked up to a lie detector.

John henry said...

Biden's creepiness with wome, and especially young girls has been known for years.

No shame at all. Dozens of instances including one of him fondling a young daughter of a new senator at his swearing in.

Full video available on the web though not in the media.

John Henry

Quaestor said...

Who would have predicted that the self-appointed cultural vanguard of the 60s, 70s, 80s, etc. — sexually liberated, socially progressive, urbane, sophisticated — folks whose deeds and opinions hit all the shibboleths that have dominated the Democratic Party since Scoop Jackson was kicked into the political gutter, would become such rancid bluestockings that SloJo's hair-sniffing penchant has become a national controversy.

Tommy Duncan said...

Flores said that she did not feel a sexual overtone in Biden’s alleged behavior toward her, but that this should not lead people to discount its seriousness....."

"Even though there is no evidence, the seriousness of the charge is what matters." -Tom Foley (D)

The Godfather said...

Trump’s behind it. “Blue Collar Joe” is the only threat to his base.

rehajm said...

By the way- how is that #MeToo thing coming along?

David Begley said...

Who launched the attack on Amy? Who launches any of these attacks?

Mary Beth said...

I don't like her. She pronounced the "t" in "often".

wendybar said...

And yet, there is a video showing Jeff Sessions swatting Joes creepy hands off of his granddaughter during his swearing in....https://www.facebook.com/MichaelSavageFanPage/videos/10155164351455773/

jaydub said...

None of this "affectionate and sometimes intimate style" BS explains him swimming nude in front of female members of his secret service detail. Joe's been considered a creep on multiple levels for a long time, so he should have known this was coming.

rhhardin said...

Whenever a woman says she felt uncomfortable I assume it's something that required a dash to the ladies' room for repairs.

Michael said...

Did Lucy Flores brush her hair? Her glossy, feminine hair? It worked and she should have thanked Joe for demonstrating her wondrous appeal. Let Joe be Joe. Send the Puritans back into the stocks to pelt one another and leave the rest of the world alone.

Wince said...

I'm talking about the part that begins at 6:17, which we rewound and rewatched numerous times.

It’s hard to judge a square denial like that.

The part starting @7:33 where she talks about “feeling a little less pressure” from the party this time because of all the “amazing” candidates is where she seems to start dissembling and regurgitating talking points with glances to the left to perhaps feign sincere soul searching.

Wince said...

As a follicly challenged individual, Biden should invoke the George Costanza defense.

"Thick, lustrous hair is very important to me."

Not Sure said...

Flores fragiles

rhhardin said...

explains him swimming nude in front of female members of his secret service detail.

That's the delicate flower squad of secret service agents. They should train them as locker room radio reporters.

Curious George said...

"This affectionate and sometimes intimate physical style is one of the former vice president’s trademarks, a defining feature of the warm and upbeat persona he has built..."

Yeah, this dog won't hunt. Sniffing little girls and playing with their hair, and getting all touchy is not affectionate, it's skeevy. The guy is a perv.

Henry said...

Does anyone remember Leo Bascaglia?

stlcdr said...

The fact that these accusations/attacks/retaliations are trotted out simply to bring someone down is, itself, creepy. It should have been brought up and addressed at the time of occurrence or once identified.

People who do this sort of thing have no interest in justice, or doing the right thing.

tim maguire said...

I've noticed in a few different places now the Biden defense: he's just a caring man being warm and supportive in his positive and decent warm and caring way.

Bay Area Guy said...

Why do powerful Democrat leaders feel entitled to smell the hair of their female subordinates?

Hagar said...

Is anyone claiming the pictures are photo shopped?
There are a lot of them, going back decades.

AllenS said...

From Wiki --

Flores's mother left her family when she was nine, and Flores's father worked multiple jobs, so Flores had to care for her younger siblings. After her mother left, Flores's school performance suffered, and she looked to local gang members for role models

She also did not graduate from high school, but obtained her GED, and she had an abortion when she was 16.

Something tells me that nobody put her up to this, but she wants blood. Joe Biden's blood.

Tank said...

Sanders says one incident is not disqualifying. He also didn’t care about those damn emails.

Among other things, he’s too stupid to be president.

Big Mike said...

Did Flores act entirely on her own or did one or more of the female candidates or their operatives move behind the scenes to scare up the old stories and push old Joe into disqualifying himself?

Frankly, my dear, I don’t give a damn. Obviously, in a roundabout way, this orchestrated attack on Creepy Joe Biden was initiated by the DNC’s realization that Donald Trump would have a field day calling him Creepy Joe and running attack ads showing him perving on young girls in front of their humiliated parents. Maybe ostentatiously wiping his hand on a handkerchief after shaking hands at a debate. So blame Trump for ending the long time Democratic wink-wink, nudge-nudge summed up in the phrase “it’s just Biden being Biden.”

In retrospect (and to many of us at the time) Barack Obama doesn’t seem to have been much of a leader. He couldn’t get — didn’t try — to force Hillary to use her dot-gov account for official business and couldn’t get Creepy Joe to keep his hands to himself. And he couldn’t even get a simple web site for Obamacare set up and stress tested after having two full years to do it.

exhelodrvr1 said...

"Affectionate and sometimes intimate"

Apparently it was OK with Obama. And Hillary never complained about it, either.

Wilbur said...

The Godfather said...
Trump’s behind it. “Blue Collar Joe” is the only threat to his base.
--------------------------------------------------------------------

Are you acquainted with any member of Trump's base? What is it about Joe Biden that would hold ANY appeal to that group of people?

Big Mike said...

That's the delicate flower squad of secret service agents.

Not long ago a former agent published a story about Biden getting drunk and trying to get handsy with an agent’s girlfriend. That’s kind of low, even for a Democrat.

Mike Sylwester said...

Democracy Dies in Darkness!

Big Mike said...

@Hagar, it’s not just still imagery. Get on YouTube and use the search string “Creepy Joe Biden.” I think the guy was showing the world how powerful he was — “Look st me! I am so powerful I can get away with grabbing wives in front of their husbands and little girls in front of their parents.” One of the clips shows Creepy Joe reaching for a granddaughters of Jeff Sessions and Jeff shows he’s pretty powerful in his own right by slapping Biden’s hand away.

dreams said...

We're doomed, Trump is buying us a little more time which is good for me but I worry about what's in store for the younger people.

Curious George said...

And Hillary never complained about it, either.

She was probably grateful.

Here's a video of ole creepy Joe.


stevew said...

Biden has held the lead in many polls for a sustained period of time, and he is openly alluding to a run, both of which explain the timing. As for the source, my bet is on the Clintons. As the other candidates fail to launch in any meaningful way, Hillary has determined that Creepy Uncle Joe is her only real opponent. If she keeps him from running her path to the nomination is easier/secure.

I predicted the other day that #metoo is old and tired and unlikely to cause Biden any serious concern, but given the way he is responding and the fact that additional cases are being revealed, am significantly less confident in my prediction.

Aside for the politics of this, and my general lack of sympathy to the #metoo movement, I do think Joe's behavior is extremely creepy. We'd have a serious chat if he did that sort of move with my wife or daughter or female family member or friend.

narayanan said...

mccullough said...

Time to drag Obama’s name into it.
Biden was Obama’s Vice President.
Obama tolerated this behavior from Biden.

added by me ...

Weinstein was Obama’s Friend and moneybags.
Obama tolerated his behavior.

Ignorance is Bliss said...

rehajm said...

Yes, if you're interested to know if she's motivated to harm Biden or to harden Biden.

I suspect the incident hardened Biden all on its own...

narayanan said...

jaydub said...

None of this "affectionate and sometimes intimate style" BS explains him swimming nude in front of female members of his secret service detail.

Of course not ... but if you think of it as the long gun to back up secret service protection everything becomes clear.

AlbertAnonymous said...

“...something that I think is crucial. Who was involved in launching this new attack? The material is old.”

Careful Professor, you’re not allowed to question who was involved or why now. She must be believed, and therefore Joe must go.

Not my rules, but them’s the rules. Live. Die. Sword.

rehajm said...

I suspect the incident hardened Biden all on its own...

I'm so happy someone's paying attention.

michaele said...

The new ick factor coming to light about Biden's long known creepy behavior with women and girls reminds me of the recent revulsion towards Michael Jackson's behavior with young boys thanks to the Leaving Neverland documentary. Maybe many people are paying more attention to their gut reactions nowadays.

Seeing Red said...

If only Biden left a pubic hair....

stevew said...

This is a pretty good take down, complete with photos. Check out the looks on the faces of the other folks in attendance. Priceless!

https://thepoliticalinsider.com/joe-biden-creep/

Greg Q said...

As Biden prepares to announce whether he will run for president in 2020, the episode has raised questions about whether the older, self-described 'fingertip politician' is well-suited for the White House in the wake of the #MeToo movement and at a moment of rapidly shifting social norms.... Though photos attesting to this behavior abound on the Internet, they were often framed in past news accounts as harmless and sometimes entertaining — a sign of 'Biden being Biden.'...


They were always wrong. It's just that Democrats and the press BIRM have no morals and ethics, only an unadulterated lust for power for the Left

henge2243 said...

It’s all warm and upbeat until you get a hard cock in your ass.

Martha said...

Morning Joe’s Mika Brezinski vigorously defended Biden who she described as a friend:

“There’s a lot of things I know about Joe Biden– I’ve known him for a long time — he is extremely affectionate extremely flirtatious in a completely safe way,” adding “I am sure that somebody can misconstrue something he’s done. But as much as I can know what’s in anyone’s heart, I don’t think there is bad intent on his part at all.”

well as long as Biden’s heart is pure he can fondle anyone, anywhere forever!

chickelit said...

One day in the not too distant future, Flores will miss that sort of male attention from male strangers. She'll become one of those bitter women who wonders what happened.

Greg Q said...

Blogger Wilbur said...
The Godfather said...
Trump’s behind it. “Blue Collar Joe” is the only threat to his base.
--------------------------------------------------------------------

Are you acquainted with any member of Trump's base? What is it about Joe Biden that would hold ANY appeal to that group of people?


Joe Biden has spent his political career not being a total left-wing nut, and claiming to care about issues that affected blue collar workers

This puts him completely out of step with the modern Democrat Party, but solidly in the mainstream of American voters.

If he wins the Democrat Primary, IMO he'll be the most formidable Democrat Presidential candidate.

Is he a sleaze-bag? Off course he is!

So what? Didn't stop Bill "bimbo eruptions" Clinton. Expecting Democrat voters to care about morality and human decency is like expecting mafia thugs to object to smuggling

chickelit said...

After the last Dem candidate circles the drain, it's almost like they'll need an old warhorse to reappear on the scene.

Michael K said...

Among other things, he’s too stupid to be president.

There is a book by a neurosurgeon titled. "When the air hits your brain" The subtitle is "You're never the same."

Joe has had two craniotomies.

Francisco D said...

I am not a Joe Biden fan. IMO, he's been wrong about nearly every foreign policy issue for the last 35 years.

However, he is well known in DC as being one of the truly nice guys. He is also known for being "handsy." I suspect that is just his personal style.

Unknown said...

"Who was involved in launching this new attack? The material is old."

Is there some evil genius behind this? The same entity behind the attack on Kavanaugh? The same one who caused all of these allegations against Roy Moore three weeks before the election in Alabama?

chickelit said...

Unknown said...Is there some evil genius behind this? The same entity behind the attack on Kavanaugh? The same one who caused all of these allegations against Roy Moore three weeks before the election in Alabama?

Gloria Allred?

Michael K said...

Gloria Allred?

I'd be more interested in who funds her. I don't think she is doing all this for free. Her clients seem to disappear after the election.

Michael said...

Watched the video Curious George posted, 8:22 a.m. Maybe one borderline thing in there. Biden imagines he is a great father figure, leader, man of influence and statesmanship. I disagree with his policies, but as Francisco D said, this is his style. Creepy? Maybe to some, but if this style disqualifies someone from running for office, or simply moving through life with everyone else, the standards have become absurd. If he swims naked in his own pool, good for him! Whose business is that, and why? Wait, and Lucy Flores looked up to gang members but can't handle Joe Biden? Good grief.

BJM said...

This photo clearly shows Biden touching the side of Longoria's breast. He knows what he's doing, so do the two men in this photo.

As with the nude swimming, I think he gets off on doing it in plain sight and he's been given tacit permission for years.

Unknown said...

Is 50 Shades of Grey still selling well with Women?

When your are VP, they let you smell their hair from behind....

chickelit said...

If she was never alone with Biden and this happened at a live rally, surely here must be footage of the alleged kiss.

Char Char Binks, Esq. said...

That woman was FLAUNTING her occiput at Joe. He's not made of stone!

jaydub said...

"...well as long as Biden’s heart is pure he can fondle anyone, anywhere forever!"

If your heart is pure they'll let you grab them by the pussy.

Curious George said...

Creepy Joe getting a quick sniff way back in 2008.

AZ Bob said...

Though photos attesting to this behavior abound on the Internet, they were often framed in past news accounts as harmless and sometimes entertaining....,

Who did this spin? It is obvious in reading this article.

Sally327 said...

I'm fascinated by this defense, which would never be accepted in any work place, that Joe Biden was just demonstrating his "persona" as a warm and friendly guy when he was Mr. touchy-feely with random women not his wife. But, you know, not in a sexual way or anything.

And the women, they didn't object, right? Not until now, and it's just this nobody from Nevada. So it must be political, one of the campaigns is behind it. Which, let's face it, is just as likely to be one of the men as it is any of the women running. It's good politics and it's not like the story is completely made up. Biden as a smarmy old goat, it's not exactly a hard sell.

Achilles said...

stevew said...
This is a pretty good take down, complete with photos. Check out the looks on the faces of the other folks in attendance. Priceless!

https://thepoliticalinsider.com/joe-biden-creep/


This link actually convinced me Biden is not a normal sexual predator.

He just gets off on dominating others and making people uncomfortable.

The picture of him with his hand on that old police offficer’s leg is priceless.

exhelodrvr1 said...

Joe's needs are Joe's needs.

HoodlumDoodlum said...

I can keep posting it if you want: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBZN2ODgSAk
[SNL: Sexual Harassment PSA (with Tom Brady)]

It's the "creepy" problem--actions and activities that might objectively be ok are judged on their subjective reactions: how does this or that make the person, or others, FEEL at a given time? How do those feelings possibly change over time? How can we use those FEELINGS to police behavior, both behavior that has happened and behavior we want to encourage or prevent in the future?

The sketch is a joke, obviously, but it gets to the heart of the problem of subjectivity: behavior that might be "creepy" from one person is no problem from another person based on how the target and/or others feel at the moment about the person and/or situation.

If you really want to think deeply about the topic it'd get philosophical quickly--how can we know our own mind or the minds of others and how can there be any common knowable objective reality if our only interaction with it, individually, is through our subjective experience which we know changes over time?

Biden's behavior was there all along--it was something people laughed at and laughed off. This individual felt bad about it at the time (and apparently told people about it back then) but nothing came of it (likely because other people FELT it wasn't a big deal). The subjective experience many people now have when viewing these pictures and thinking about Biden's behavior is different now than it was back then. The past hasn't changed! If you live by feelings and wokeness/Progressivism (which is always changing), though, being retroactively guilty is always a possibility.

rightguy said...

So its official ; the dems absolutely shall not nominate in 2020 a W3 person (White-With-Wanger).

So one of the 4 B's down, 3 to go.

(Bootygig will be the hardest- that guy is a player)

Limited blogger said...

That Jeff Sessions clip is classic.

Creepy Joe coming in with both hands, but Sessions swats him away.

HoodlumDoodlum said...

Francisco D said...
I am not a Joe Biden fan. IMO, he's been wrong about nearly every foreign policy issue for the last 35 years.

However, he is well known in DC as being one of the truly nice guys. He is also known for being "handsy." I suspect that is just his personal style.


If his personal style makes people feel a certain way, though, then he's guilty. If those people happen to identify as women and feel "creeped out" by this personal style then he's a creep and should face the consequences thereof.

These are the rules.

Skeptical Voter said...

Ah dear old Slow Joe. He's learning that there are "long knives" in today's Democrat Socialist Party. Just as Ernst Rohm learned that there were "long knives" in the National Socialist Party. You can be in favor with the top (Obama selected Joe as VP) but then when you fall out or are a threat--you are "kaput".

I don't know whether Obama is orchestrating this or not--frankly I don't think Obama has the organizational chops to handle a two car funeral in Texas. But somebody there in the dim shadows of the Party has decided that Joe has to go.

I don't much care one way or the other what the Dims do to themselves and their putative leaders. But I'm not fond of "handsy" types.

Bay Area Guy said...

"Smell them by the hair" is the new "grab 'em by the pussy."

I am not Laslo - but wish I was.

Curious George said...

Completely normal.

Bill Crawford said...

"This affectionate and sometimes intimate physical style is one of the former [movie producer's] trademarks, a defining feature of the warm and upbeat persona he has built..."

Sam L. said...

The WaPoo covering for Biden? Quel Suprise!!

chickelit said...

Smell the Flores and stop.

Limited blogger said...

Clip posted by Curious George is startling, scary and beyond creepy.

chickelit said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
HoodlumDoodlum said...

Ann Althouse said...This is a pretty long article but it does not even mention something that I think is crucial. Who was involved in launching this new attack? The material is old.

That sounds suspiciously like something someone who doesn't automatically #BelieveAllWomen would ask, Professor. But nice people know better...

chickelit said...

I think that Julián Castro, a castrated male politician if ever there was one, is behind this. Castro is someone who is proud of never having had a male role model of any sort except for his brother. He is also a "hispanics ueber allies" kind of guy. He's also running for POTUS.

HoodlumDoodlum said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Freeman Hunt said...

Doesn't seem like a creep. Seems like the male equivalent of those women who like to hug everyone. I would also like to know who has decided to try to destroy him.

Curious George said...

"Doesn't seem like a creep. Seems like the male equivalent of those women who like to hug everyone. I would also like to know who has decided to try to destroy him."

Really? So touching young girls and fondling and sniffing their hair is okay?

Big Mike said...

@Freeman, get on YouTube and look at the videos.

@Achilles, I think you and I are in agreement that Biden isn’t being “affectionate;” he’s showing off that he’s so powerful, look what he can get away with.

Yancey Ward said...

I am not sure Flores is lying about coordinating this with one of the other candidates- she quite likely is personally motivated by the politics to take Biden out, though, perhaps to aid Sanders or one of the female candidates.

However, all of that is really irrelevant- it isn't like Flores is the only woman treated this way by Biden- she is simply describing Biden behavior for which there are multiple recorded instances, including with under aged females.

Let me put this way for Biden defenders (though I see none in is thread with a quick scan)- if you behave this way working for a business, you get your ass fired after the second reported incident. Such behavior is almost textbook examples of sexual harassment- it isn't like he did this to Ash Carter himself.

Hagar said...

I don't think any of those being talked about so far has any substantial backing behind him or her among the various factions within the Democrat Party.
Treeman, you ain't seen nothin' yet!

Murder of Crows said...

Geez, Jake Tapper is looking old and tired

Murder of Crows said...

The statement about being never alone is very interesting to me, because it implies that by not being alone they are protected from claims of inappropriate behavior. I feel like if a conservative politician had a policy of not being alone with people of the opposite sex, in order to avoid allegations of sexual misconduct, they would be derided by progressives for having such a policy.

Yancey Ward said...

What would WaPo have done with such video evidence of Roy Moore sniffing strange womens' hair and putting his hands right under their breasts, for example?

FullMoon said...

Crazy Joe is a trichophiliac. Probably wears a diaper to absorb the ejaculatory respons from sniffing hair, especially the childrens. Watch all the vids. He seems particularly attracted to shoulder length or longer, and, the younger the better. Common knowledge among staff to order any female visiting or having photo with Biden to wash hair with organic, non fragrenced shampoo prior to arrival.

Adding to that sickness is the obvious racism and sexism. Never sniffs a man's noggin, or a black woman's afro or weave.

Can anybody prove it is not true? No? Didn't think so.

"Hair fetishism, also known as hair partialism and trichophilia, is a partialism in which a person sees hair – most commonly, head hair – as particularly erotic and sexually arousing.[1] Arousal may occur from seeing or touching hair..., "

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hair_fetishism

Amadeus 48 said...

No, no, no, no, not really.

Yancey Ward said...

Did Biden ever meet Fabio?

Freeman Hunt said...

"Really? So touching young girls and fondling and sniffing their hair is okay?"

"Touching" seems to indicate a type of touch not alleged. Yes, touching someone's head or shoulders is often okay. "Fondling" is another word choice that seems calculated to indicate a specific kind of action that no one has alleged. Playing with kids' hair may be annoying, but it isn't necessarily creepy either.

Freeman Hunt said...

In the Sessions video, it seems obvious that both Biden and Sessions are brushing something off of the girl's hair. There's no hand slapping.

Curious George said...

"Touching" seems to indicate a type of touch not alleged. Yes, touching someone's head or shoulders is often okay. "Fondling" is another word choice that seems calculated to indicate a specific kind of action that no one has alleged. Playing with kids' hair may be annoying, but it isn't necessarily creepy either."

You left out sniffing.

Rick said...

What would WaPo have done with such video evidence of Roy Moore sniffing strange womens' hair and putting his hands right under their breasts, for example?

What an amazing coincidence all WAPO articles incorporate exactly the level of nuance required to put Reps in the worst light possible and Dems in the best. It's like leftists justifying race preferences: there's always a justification available if you're sufficiently motivated to find it.

Char Char Binks, Esq. said...

"Doesn't seem like a creep. Seems like the male equivalent of those women who like to hug everyone."

That's called "being a creep".

I'm not saying it should be. I'm saying it is.

AZ Bob said...

For a laugh, go to the WAPO twitter on "Joe Biden’s affectionate, physical style with women comes under scrutiny." The responses are not following the spin.

Curious George said...

I'm hoping that FH is pulling an April Fools joke.

tim in vermont said...

God gave Biden a sign that he should be a leader of men, can you blame him for wanting to show it off to the women charged with protecting him?

Joe himself said that we should get rid of English jurisprudence, so I can't see respecting any claim of innocence until proven guilty from him. He sure looks guilty, he's been "credibly accused," which is the new standard, so bye bye Joe.

FullMoon said...

"Doesn't seem like a creep. Seems like the male equivalent of those women who like to hug everyone."


Around here the male equivalent of those women who like to hug everyone is simply men who like to hug everyone.

Shake hands with the men, return hugs for the women, that's my motto. Full frontal hugs with non-related spectacular women my favorite.

Some confusion lately as one of the peripherals trans from young woman to young man and back again. Used to shake his hand and talk about construction tools and stuff when "he" was installing security systems.

Now, "she" is waitressing and all feminine and cute. Very distressing.Maybe I will compromise with an Obama type fist bump?

Limited blogger said...

The fist bump was a great innovation. I use it all the time with everyone.

Fen said...

Ah yes. Takes me back to the 90s. A decade of being lectured by the Left about sexual predation in the workplace. Couldn't enjoy a play or movie without being hectored. Then Bill told a subordinate of his campaign to "suck it" and when she sought discovery to "establish a pattern of predatory sexual misconduct in the workplace on the part of the defendant", Bill coerced others to lie under oath (subornation of perjury, obstruction of justice) and violated the civil rights of a female Democrat.

And the Left pivoted on a dime and said "It's just about sex, MoveOn".

So I tried to argue their own principles back at them. And I soon realized what a waste of time and energy that was. There was no argument that would appeal to their values about the sexual harassment of women. Because they never had those principles or values to begin with. I was shelling a hill they had never occupied. And it started to sink into my idealistic thick skull:

The Left doesn't really believe in the things they lecture the rest of us about

I coined it as a reminder that when debating the Left, you first need to find out what their true motives are. Because they always lie. It's much like Althouse's "civility bullshit" tag - if you think the Left is serious about civility and decorum, you are going to waste a ton of ammo trying to shame them into compliance by spotlighting their "hypocrisy".

... And now we have Kavanaugh slimed by the Washington Post over the allegations of some crazed harpy. Gang rape sex club? But Creepy Joe who is actually on video behaving like a dirty old man inviting girls to come play with the cute puppies in his kidnap van is defended with this headline: “Joe Biden’s affectionate, physical style with women comes under scrutiny.

Fen's Law was coined on this blog 20 years ago. The more things change...

FullMoon said...

HaHa! Another complains
Personally, I hope a whole bunch come forward, whether they are telling the truth, or making it up in order to feel important. Kavanaugh the racist creep for what he did to Thomas.


"I never filed a complaint, to be honest, because he was the vice president. I was a nobody," Lappos said. "There's absolutely a line of decency. There's a line of respect. Crossing that line is not grandfatherly. It's not cultural. It's not affection. It's sexism or misogyny."
https://www.courant.com/politics/hc-pol-biden-grabbed-aide-20190401-vl7chim3hrdjtcwu2tszrhozzm-story.html

tim in vermont said...

Funny how abstruction of justice about Bill's physically intimate and affectionate style was no harm, no foul, but if we could somehow show that Trump impeded an investigation into absolutely nothing, an accusation cooked up by the Clinton campaign, he should swing for treason!

Democratics are not a cult though.

Fen said...

"Yes, touching someone's head or shoulders is often okay."

NOOOOOOO. As a male conservative, you do NOT touch or hug a woman. Unless you lifelong ambition is to be Assistant Manager at McDonalds. She can touch and hug you all she wants, but you better be wearing a body cam in case she has regrets the following morning.

FullMoon said...

Comment deleted by Joe Biden Secret Service Detail

Fen said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
FullMoon said...

"The scene was brief but striking: At last week's G-8 summit in St. Petersburg, United States President George W. Bush stepped behind German Chancellor Angela Merkel, reached for her shoulders, gave her a brief massage and then kept walking. Visibly startled and uncomfortable, Angela Merkel threw up her arms. A moment to be remembered, it seems: Within hours, links to photographs and video footage of the surprise neck grab were already racing across the Internet -- from YouTube to Technorati. "Bush: Love-Attack on Merkel!" read the headline in the German tabloid Bild. Several Web sites denounced commander in chief Bush as the "Groper in Chief."

http://www.spiegel.de/international/bush-s-massage-gate-rubbing-the-chancellor-s-neck-and-getting-an-earful-a-428852.html

wwww said...

For her-it's a Bernie attack. The others? I'm guessing introverts who hate hugs & become extremely awkward with anyone getting within 3 feet of their personal space.

Awkward: an introverted male WASP trying to greet an Italian. I-am-a-robot-who-cannot-touch-others. beep. beep. beep. Danger-Will-Robinson-Danger.

Big Mike said...

@Freeman Hunt, I took another look at a copy of the video (multiples have been posted), and it appears to me that Sessions is swatting Biden's hand away. I admit that I was influenced by the title of the clip using the word "slap" to characterize it thus, but there isn't much difference in my book between a swat and slap.

Fen said...

Fen's Law was coined on this blog 20 years ago

Ooops that's wrong. Correction:

The incident (Clinton's Impeachment) occurred 20 years ago.
But it wasn't until 2006 that I coined it here.

Matt Sablan said...

Let's run that spin by HR and see if it flies.

Bay Area Guy said...

Another grope charge against Biden -- 2009 Connecticut.

He's like a less predatory version of Harvey Weinstein.

tim in vermont said...

" The others? I'm guessing introverts who hate hugs & become extremely awkward with anyone getting within 3 feet of their personal space."

I know, and you can't believe how stuck up Juanita Broaddrick was.

tim in vermont said...

Believe all women unless they are talking about a Democrat.

Freeman Hunt said...

I'm not in favor of labeling people sexual predators based on awkward interactions. A semi-famous person once greeted me with a bear hug and kisses on both cheeks. This was a big surprise to me, a handshaker, but not a big deal. I can't imagine calling the totally harmless, friendly person a creep over it.

There don't seem to be any allegations of anything sexual. Even the people saying that they don't like how he touched them are saying that it wasn't sexual. Why call him a creep?

StephenFearby said...

"Another grope charge against Biden -- 2009 Connecticut." Wasn't a grope or an unwelcome French kiss, but an Eskimo kiss.

From wikiHow:

How to Do an Eskimo Kiss

"The myth of the Eskimo kiss states that this kissing style evolved so that the Inuit people in cold climates could kiss without their lips freezing together. In reality, the Eskimo kiss--called a kunik--is a way to greet and show affection to family and loved ones who, when met, often have only their eyes and nose exposed. Learn to do the Eskimo kiss and the kunik to share a sweet moment with someone you love."

https://www.wikihow.com/Do-an-Eskimo-Kiss

But from the illustrations) kuniking would seem to be kinky when done to a non-consenting adult.

But not as bad as toe sucking.

Sally327 said...

"There don't seem to be any allegations of anything sexual. Even the people saying that they don't like how he touched them are saying that it wasn't sexual. Why call him a creep?"

There wouldn't be, though, would there? That's part of the power game he'd be playing, using his position to force himself on women in a way that he can later acknowledge was physical, yes, but should be okay because he wasn't trying to get laid or anything. Rape isn't a sexual act either. Not that I'm implying he's guilty of rape but his sexual desires, or lack thereof, are completely irrelevant.

Matt Sablan said...

"A semi-famous person once greeted me with a bear hug and kisses on both cheeks."

-- That's still an acceptable greeting. Creeping behind a woman, sniffing her hair, rubbing her shoulders and kissing her from behind is... not a common, if a bit too extroverted for my tastes, way to say hello.

Biden may not be a criminal or a sexual harrasser or #MeTooingRapist or whatever the current term is -- but if Biden was an R not a D, Trump would be being asked if he denounces him during every press meeting for days.

wwww said...

Why call him a creep?

I've been confused for a couple of days about it. I've got some relatives from the southern Med. Head kissing, hugging, close personal space are not unfamiliar to me. Men cheek kissing each other, hugging children.

There's political motivation. Aside from that, perhaps certain men see his actions as a power play connected to sex? This type of person -- I don't think he has been around huggers very much. It freaks them out. I get it the non-understanding, as some of my relatives are WASP-y WASP WASP. Very extreme WASP, sometimes in a hilarious way.

Perhaps they have never seen men who are the hugging-type. Maybe they've only seen men hold babies and then rough-housing with kids. They aren't familiar with people who hug, kiss back of heads, stroke hair affectionately, men kissing each other's cheeks to say hello. I'm familiar with all of that, particularly hair stroking and kissing of kids. Was at a memorial service the other day, and a second cousin spent a lot of time stroking the hair of a toddler. The comment to me, "I can't stop touching her hair. It's so soft." Clearly it was a comfort, and the toddler took it as affection.

DavidD said...

Well, duh.

Boys have not been allowed to just be boys since at least the 1980s.

It’s a wonder it took this long to come back to bite him.

Matt Sablan said...

WWww: Really? Do you do behind the back head kisses to practical strangers? I'm pretty introverted with clear boundaries; I'm the person who when women come in for the hello hug, I step back and offer a handshake. But, is this really a sort of universally accepted greeting I didn't know about?

Matt Sablan said...

"Flores said that she did not feel a sexual overtone in Biden’s alleged behavior toward her."

Yet, Flores also said: "But I had never experienced anything so blatantly inappropriate and unnerving before. Biden was the second-most powerful man in the country and, arguably, one of the most powerful men in the world. He was there to promote me as the right person for the lieutenant governor job. Instead, he made me feel uneasy, gross, and confused. The vice-president of the United States of America had just touched me in an intimate way reserved for close friends, family, or romantic partners — and I felt powerless to do anything about it."

So, which was it? Was it intimate, romantic and gross -- or was there nothing sexual about it?

She also now says she'd support Biden if he is the nominee, which may be why now she doesn't see anyhting sexual about it, when in the original quote -- it was clear that she did.

wwww said...

It's not a universally accepted greeting, no. But I wouldn't be freaked out by it, either. Particularly by someone who I had previously met and socialized with who flew in to support me. But I'm used to face kiss greetings, hugging, hand-holding in friendly contexts.

I can tell you my WASPy relatives would be freaked out by the greetings of my Med relatives. And they would think they are too loud & put too much garlic in their food and drink too much wine & wave their hands around too much. Honestly, the reaction kind of freaks me out, because I tend to hug people. I think I'm careful to distinguish the people who are uncomfortable, but I'll be more avoidant in the future.

Matt Sablan said...

What is it with the women complaining about Biden trying to insist it wasn't sexual?

"It wasn't sexual, but he did grab me by the head," Amy Lappos told The Courant Monday. "He put his hand around my neck and pulled me in to rub noses with me. When he was pulling me in, I thought he was going to kiss me on the mouth."

You know, all that totally platonic, mouth kissing, nose-rubbing things you do with all your friends.

wwww said...

So, which was it? Was it intimate, romantic and gross -- or was there nothing sexual about it?

She's contradicting herself. I don't get what is going on with her, except she was massively uncomfortable. She seems to think Biden is a creep, but she said it wasn't sexual. ?? I'm confused by her. Why is Biden a creep if she doesn't think it was sexual or done with bad intentions?

wwww said...

What is it with the women complaining about Biden trying to insist it wasn't sexual?

I don't know. Are they a bunch of introverts who hate physically affectionate huggy-people? Ok. Got it. Or do they think it was sexual and creepy? Ok, Got it. But if they just want someone else to run for President, can't they just say that? Being a huggy-person is not a reason to not run for President.

I do think nose rubbing sounds strange.

Curious George said...

I'm not in favor of labeling people sexual predators based on awkward interactions. A semi-famous person once greeted me with a bear hug and kisses on both cheeks. This was a big surprise to me, a handshaker, but not a big deal. I can't imagine calling the totally harmless, friendly person a creep over it.

There don't seem to be any allegations of anything sexual. Even the people saying that they don't like how he touched them are saying that it wasn't sexual. Why call him a creep?


So if you ever get to meet Freeman go in for the side boob feel up, and move on to her kids. Same side boob feel up, plus fondling and sniffing her kids. Grab them by both sides of their head so they can't move and give them a little peck on the nose or lips. I mean it's just awkward. Not sexual.

Unbelievable.

Curious George said...

"Even the people saying that they don't like how he touched them are saying that it wasn't sexual."

All those people are wives of democrats or democrats that Biden has power over. But yeah, just awkward.

Kids, don't worry about this 70 year old man copping a feel. No big deal, just awkward.

But mommy, uncle XXXX touched me in a bad place!

Shhhh little girl. It's just his style. Achward, but nothing else.

Limited blogger said...

That little girl whose head was being held, taking a huge gasp of air, while her sister looked on in horror, kind of did it for me.

Inga...Allie Oop said...

“So if you ever get to meet Freeman go in for the side boob feel up, and move on to her kids. Same side boob feel up, plus fondling and sniffing her kids. Grab them by both sides of their head so they can't move and give them a little peck on the nose or lips. I mean it's just awkward. Not sexual.

Unbelievable.”

Wow, what a creep you are.

rcocean said...

Biden said at the rally: “A guy who ended up becoming our national leader said, ‘I can grab a woman anywhere and she likes it.’ They asked me if I’d like to debate this gentleman, and I said no. I said, ‘If we were in high school, I’d take him behind the gym and beat the hell out of him.’”

Was Biden talking about Trump or himself?

rcocean said...

Grabbing 'em by the pussy - can just mean "hello" to a Hugger.

FullMoon said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
wbfjrr2 said...

The answer to Althouse’s question is Hillary. You didn’t think she’d ever give up, did you? She will try, unsuccessfully, to get the nomination. She’s a madwoman driven to seek power, with no bounds on her tactics or deceit.

Not that I care for Biden. Just another hack.

FIDO said...

The Jeannie is out of the bottle: Dems weaponized 'feelz' of women re men to get Trump and they are finding that the fallout of this are destroying their own. It's like spraying teargas upwind. Heck, MOST Republicans have been totally untouched by this or were destroyed by things from DECADES ago.

Every politician thinks they are powerful and extra charming. They win elections, don't they? So the idea that ANY Democratic male pol has not done some flirty flirt with an unenthusiastic girl...well, maybe if they are Mayor Buttigieg. Just don't ask any MEN about Buttigieg.

When it comes to falling sex rates and marriage rates, Ms. Althouse and other Feminists want to discuss porn, want to discuss video games, want to blame it on the rain that was falling FALLING, blame it on the Sun...in the sky.

But whatever you do, don't put the blame on you.

I am sure many Feminists like Jessica Valenti and Matt Yglasias think that this is just a small course correction which might SLIGHTLY be an overreaction.

How do you think we correct back? How do you 'unindoctrinate' women about putting away this sword? Heck, 52 years later, some women still can't get over a lecture on fashion!


I know that MeToo was a recent phenom, but it is the culmination of a lot of hard Feminist work to wreck normal romantic interactions so women wouldn't fraternize with the enemy so much. And since most women have met A bad actor or A cad like Aziz...


That this is afflicting Biden (and will be used against Beto and Butthurt and has been used against Bernie) well...this is a nice life lesson. I hope the Left and Feminism savors it.



FIDO said...

How the hell did that happen? My comment got posted immediately!

SomeoneHasToSayIt said...

You've heard of Short Guy (height) Syndrome? Sometimes manifests like with a Franco Columbu? Sometimes in a career in comedy? I think there might also be something of the opposite, let's call it Big Dick (especially a 'shower') Syndrome. Someone who has few other attributes (e.g. lacking in smarts) than that one (born on 3rd) attribute and often manifests a certain swagger and pushy behavior. Some of you may have come across the type. They like finding opportunities to appear nude in locker rooms and in front of (female) others. Well it sometimes also comes with being 'handsie', taking liberties, invading personal spaces, because, hey, if she only knew how well endowed I am, she wouldn't mind. Is this Biden's issue?

iowan2 said...

So what's the deal with all the Dems bringing out the long knives against Biden?

Did Trump nominate him to SCOTUS?

Big Mike said...

I will not vote for Creepy Joe Biden. In addition to perving on girls, he teaches Con Law but publicly told the world that Article I of the Constitution describes the Executive Branch. If it wasn't for Althouse and Glenn Reynolds I would assume that Con Law was where the law schools stashed their dunces.

Sebastian said...

Sorry if I repeat earlier comments: quotable quote from Lucy Flores: "We are expected to — quote, unquote – “keep our dirty laundry” to ourselves. And it’s always in service to the party."

Clyde said...

In the end, it doesn't really matter who is "launching this new attack." SOMEONE in the Democrat field was going to do it. Politics ain't beanbag, and anyone who has seen the numerous pictures and videos of Biden invading women's and young girls' space and touching them inappropriately knew that someone would use them to destroy his candidacy in utero.

I laughed when I saw the wife of the former Secretary of Defense saying that the picture of Biden with her was being taken out of context. If it was only one picture, that explanation might work, but there are far too many of them out there to explain them all away. Biden would have had a hard time with them even before the #MeToo era; now it's impossible. Biden is toast, and if the Democrats are foolish enough to nominate him, Trump's surrogate will destroy him.

stevew said...

What if Creepy Uncle Joe is the source of these revelations? Stick with me here. He knows this stuff is out there, he knows the GOP will use it against him in the general election, and he suspects the female Democrats will also attack him on this (#metoo & all), so he gets it out there, gets the attacks going, responds as he did with sensitivity and understanding but complete denial of the worst characterizations of his actions. If he survives this round he can then always say, if the issue comes up again in the future, that it has been adjudicated and old news. If he doesn't survive he gets out before he gets in and saves a lot of heartache and money.

Then again, when has Joe ever demonstrated that sort of cleverness and smarts?

tim in vermont said...

Even the people saying that they don't like how he touched them are saying that it wasn't sexual. Why call him a creep?

I kind of always thought that people had a right to define their own personal space and if you are going to just invade their space in an intimate way without any idea about how it will be received, over and over again, well, that’s going to be defined as “creepy.”

I don’t see why a woman who is trying to be taken seriously as a professional should be immediately be treated as an object of physical affection first by a very powerful man. It’s belittling. Droit de seigneur.

But standards don’t apply when we are talking about Democrats, so feminists just need to take another one for the team!\

But the stuff coming out of the Ukraine will do him in. Talk about actual collusion.

Linda Fox said...

Would LOVE to see electronic communications around the last 6 months or so for Flores, her staff members, and the AOC campaign.

I'd bet my WHOLE retirement monies on there having been some - um, what's that word? Collusion between Flores and the AOC staff.

LilyBart said...

Better question - why is Biden's touching little girls only become a problem now when they're all gearing up for the election cycle? Why was is ok to ignore that he was imposing himself on these girls - touching them and invading their personal space in uncomfortable ways - before now?

FIDO said...

Just to note: The Roy Moore allegations were FORTY YEARS AGO and a private citizen. But she had no problem spending a lot of time on that little imbroglio.

For Althouse to suggest a passive aggressive dismissal something from 2014 when Biden was still VICE PRESIDENT as 'old news' shows a bias that maybe she should address.


He was vice president and doing creepy hand things. If Roy Moore (let's call it the Roy Moore Metric) can be blamed, so can a Democrat.

Tom Grey said...

Biden was NOT as bad as Pres. Clinton - ask Juanita Broaddrick. But she, too, was expected to "keep her dirty rape laundry" to herself.

He IS creepy, he's been creepy, but it seems he doesn't believe it which means, he'll keep being creepy. No chance.

Flores likely lying, tho possibly technically true. If it's a politician not officially with a specific campaign.

It's too bad that #MeToo means far fewer male mentors for women, but more successful men will be following the Pence rule - never be alone with a woman not your wife.