From "Deciding whether to have kids has never been more complex. Enter parenthood-indecision therapists" (WaPo).
The most-liked comment over there is:
When I was in my early 20s, I knew I did not want kids. Simply no interest. Children have never held any fascination with me. To me, they are needy and demanding and consume whatever life you had before them. I'm now near 60 and have never regretted it. We have 7 billion people on this overpopulated planet. Not having a kid is not a tragedy.Second-most-liked:
I'm sure my comment will cause a lot of controversy, but personally I think bringing children into this completely messed-up world is totally irresponsible. Unless things change tremendously -- and very, very soon -- they face a world of violence, hatred, ecological devastation and economic privation. Not to mention trumpski and his ilk. I made the decision not to have children a long time ago and have never regretted it.Notice that neither comment deals with the subject of the article — people who have trouble deciding and the therapists who treat them.
I wonder if only women seek this treatment. The term "motherhood clarity mentor" suggests the indecision is a women's problem or that men either know they don't want children or if they do want children believe the decision whether to have them or not belongs to the woman.
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97 comments:
How pathetic are WaPo readers! There has never been a time, as we all know, when it has been better, safer, to have children. The world is a wonderful place that gets more wonderful with each passing year. Pathetic, self-absorbed whiners.
As for helping people decide, I can understand having a hard time hearing your own inner voice when all the other people won’t shut up. Hiring a “new-life coach” for a few hundred bucks seems like a good investment, though it seems to me if they’re taking this step, then the answer is yes, they do want children. They’re just afraid, as they should be.
If I were a Chinese army head, such comments would be exactly what my secret propaganda unit be leaving on the US websites
My daughter, a Bernie voter with two degrees and half way tp a third, read Peterson's book and now, at age 38 is due in July. She wavered a bit as she admired her sister-in-law and how she was raising her three kids but then decided on no. Now, maybe partly because of that book, as he is committed and happy about it. The baby, a girl, already has a name.
As far as her age, she will be almost exactly the age my mother was when she had me and she had my sister three years later,
These women are just looking for someone to confirm what they have already decided. And they are not going to a trusted relative, but to someone with questionable ethics. I can't believe how utterly corrupted Western women have become. They always come first. And if a human being does somehow become attached to their uterine wall, they have no qualms about destroying it. We are always being judged by G-d, and His plan isn't to go to fucking law school and climb the ladder.
Good grief. Looks like some therapist found a way of making some money. If a woman can’t make the decision whether to have children or not by herself ( and her partner) maybe she shouldn’t have children. There are going to be some really tough decisions that require quick thinking as a parent.
As I've said before, I have several close relatives who never had children and now it's too late. And they regret it.
Individualism is a trap. Man is a social animal and his fundamental purpose is social.
Women were meant by their natural constitution, basic biology, to bear and raise children, in the context of a social group where this natural function was assisted and, no small matter, enforced by social dynamics. This is so because child bearing is the purpose of any natural system, including human social groups.
Technology however has created a vast range of perverse incentives in human society that prevent or hamper reproduction. Group dynamics can work opposite to its natural purpose, having become fixed on the pursuit of vain and irrelevant values. It is all fallout of humanity's inability to cope with technological change.
Women advising women NOT to do the natural thing is perversion. This was not unknown in ancient societies, but the usual reason for such is that these often lived on the edge of survival, at Malthusian limits or in cases of catastrophic famine. Extreme things happen in extreme circumstances.
But for comfortable well fed modern women it is mainly a matter of social status seeking and social anxiety that clumps in groups and amplifies, all helped by communications technology. Women seem much more vulnerable to this group-brainwashing into neurotic behavior. Humanity could easily talk itself into extinction, death by meme.
Maybe this is evolution’s way of weeding out the hysterics.
Sometimes having too many choices can be a curse.
Today is such a worse time to have a child than when I was born (1955). Then, there was real fear of thermonuclear conflagration. Now, climate immolation that can only be averted by a Green Nude Eel idol. Glad Mom and Dad had some courage.
No child deserves to have a Miserabilist for a Mom. Cheer up, ladies. Trump won't be President forever.
Seems like making decisions in general are becoming more difficult for younger people. Maybe it’s part of the notion that everything needs to be perfect before one has a child. Perfect career, perfect house, perfect partner( although I’d caution against having children with losers or abusers). The world in which we bring children was never perfect and never will be.
Notice that neither comment deals with the subject of the article — people who have trouble deciding and the therapists who treat them.
Yet another feature of Socialist and Communist systems is there doesn't seem to be this problem. The government just decides whether or not it needs children and either starts bribing you to have them and telling you it's your national duty, or limiting your choices to either none or one.
AOC, for example, has already decided you probably shouldn't be having kids.
Perfect career, perfect house, perfect partner( although I’d caution against having children with losers or abusers).
Used to just be they needed to be a good person.
Then they can't be anyone who voted for Trump.
Now they must be an avowed Socialist, not just a run of the mill progressive.
The circle of acceptability is getting smaller by the hour.
We would not be here if women were not fundamentally wired to think motherhood is a great idea and men to be easily convinced to agree.
But whatever your attitude on that may be, surely having children, or not, is something you should make sure there is agreement about before you get married?
If there isn't, one thing you will be is divorced.
Ah, if only their mothers had felt the same way. There were too many smug wankers even back then.
Unless things change tremendously -- and very, very soon -- they face a world of violence, hatred, ecological devastation and economic privation. Not to mention trumpski and his ilk.
As Tim McGuire pointed out there has never been a better time by every objective measure outside of the institutional rot at the core of the psychological pollution pumped out by idiots of this ilk.
And by the way isn’t that WaPo comment tantamount to saying the world is a “shit-hole country”?
I like my kids.
Anyways I agree, I guess there may be some evolutionary mechaninism working here.
I just got back from a college reunion of sorts. Just a few of us that shared a common bond, not a big production. Most of us have children, and yes, they are time consuming. Most of us have children at our entering adulthood, and thus can see the moment where the children become self sufficient. All of us are grateful for adding something to our lives and the lives of others. It is more important than our professional lives.
Indecision is common when you have a lot of unknowns. You should seek those who know. The thing is with WaPo commenters is that lesson from Mark Twain about the things we know that just aren't true. I don't care what your malthusian stance is, you really could not know how the world will be a century from now.
"if they do want children believe the decision whether to have them or not belongs to the woman"
Huh. I thought only what women "believed" mattered.
Anyway, I am pleased prog women are deciding not to have kids. Of course, the downside is that, since they set the tone in the culture and the MSM cater to them, kids will be next prog target. Too loud, too "needy," too much of a burden on Gaia.
Tim M
It's remarkable isn’t it? The world tout court keeps getting better. Global poverty has declined steeply even in just the past 15 years. Small pox is gone. Starvation is now always political. But these sensitive souls feel the oppression so intensely, the horror or Trump is so much greater than the horror of Hitler or Mao or Stalin, or bubonic plague, that it wrings their hearts so.
"that men either know they don't want children or if they do want children believe the decision whether to have them or not belongs to the woman."
Well, it's not as if men can drive to Babies 'R Us and pick out a baby. Without a woman involved, it becomes a LOT more complicated.
Most men do one of three things (1) marry a woman who holds the same ideas about family and children or (2) does not marry, or marries someone who does not want children or (3) is indecisive. If he's indecisive he'll go along with whatever his wife wants, or he won't get married. Wanting to have children is powerful, and the indecision of one person can break up a marriage if the other does want children.
But, then there's the question of what happens if both of them are indecisive. I imagine they can't make decisions about many things, from children, to what movie to watch, to deciding which sofa to purchase. Maybe this is the couple that hires the therapist?
I've noticed that most married men are ready to go forward when their wives are ready. It's the wives who start charting if they don't get pregnant on the first few tries. & it's the wives who call up their husbands to say fertile time! Get home for fun at lunch time!
These people are sick.The privilege of creating and caring for a human being is the pinnacle of privilege. The experience makes you a real person. Without that experience you are never a whole human being. Think that over.
“But whatever your attitude on that may be, surely having children, or not, is something you should make sure there is agreement about before you get married?”
I agree. My youngest daughter was with someone for quite a few years who wouldn’t commit to marriage or children. She finally dumped him and quickly met a man who didn’t run for the hills when she told him after they started getting into a serious relationship that because she was already over 30 she wanted to be married with children and not in the too distant future. He wasn’t shocked or scared off. They got engaged almost immediately thereafter. They were married a year later and started a family within a year and are still happily married. Both are liberals.
When she told me she had told him about her wishes so soon after becoming serious, I said “You did what?!” I’m proud of her honesty and clarity.
MIchael, Congrats on the upcoming happy event!!!
My two daughters are the most important thing in the world to me.
Apparently not as important as pointless political posturing to female WAPO readers.
Never wanted to have children but if I had found a partner who did strongly enough I would have gone along. Never felt a biological imperative because the population kept growing just fine without me contributing. But never thought there was a moral case against children. Things are much better than when my great great grandfather died at 36. (Thank goodness he didn't wait to have my great grandfather.) If we go back to the days of life expectancy of 36 it will still be worth being born. I would have been grateful for the first 36 even without the last 26 (and who knows how many more).
Yes "motherhood clarity mentor" should be changed to "breeding clarity mentor" if only because a woman can become, through adoption, a mother without breeding, and would not deserve the opprobrium reserved for the wanton breeders.
Not breeding is not a tragedy. What is a tragedy is gummint policy that exacts taxes and fees (in the form of current carbon taxes) from non-breeders primarily for the future benefit of the progeny of the breeders.
Having children is not a choice, it is a by product of having sex. Only in the last 50 years have we turned it into a choice through effective birth control. If you're making a rational decision the decision is always no. An emotional decision is to have children but as fewer and fewer people do it it will become more difficult to raise children and it will create exponential increase in the number of people saying no. The only way to stop this is to stop birth control.
Inga,
Yea!! I'm glad she dumped him. It would have been horrible to wait even longer, during those precious years. I think men know they want to get married real fast. If they are indecisive, they aren't interested.
The burden to save the planet by not breeding falls on the woman as long as our laws grant her the exclusive right to breed or not. The man is no more than an advisor.
As is so often the case, buwaya nails it.
How miserable, how enervated, are so many modern Westerns! The plethora of lifestyle choices available--and time to consider them--has made few happier. Quite the opposite, they spend their surplus time and income thrashing in analysis paralysis, forgetting that the clock is always running.
There are no guarantees in child-raising. Most often you get one close to the norm, which is tautologically obvious. Sometimes you get a genius, an artist, a saint, or an entrepreneur, and sometimes you get a wretched mediocrity, a psychopath, or some otherwise impaired person. And at such a cost!
Religion used to provide the function of putting one's individual life into a larger context, where even if honest mistakes were made, it might be made better in the long run. It seems like so many people now do not know what to do with their one and only life: No manual, and no do-overs--no pressure there. They are free of traditional constraints- but what to do with this freedom?
Accordingly, the slow-motion suicide of the West continues.
Second Best wrote: I'm sure my comment will cause a lot of controversy, but personally I think bringing children into this completely messed-up world is totally irresponsible. Unless things change tremendously -- and very, very soon -- they face a world of violence, hatred, ecological devastation and economic privation. Not to mention trumpski and his ilk. I made the decision not to have children a long time ago and have never regretted it.
Her kind will die out through natural selection. The future does not belong to her herd of ilk.
Maybe this is evolution’s way of weeding out the hysterics.
Absolutely. I am also glad these women don't want children.
As for the woman who doesn't want children because of the supposedly imminent ecological catastrophe, I wonder what the world's population would have to drop to before she decides children are a good idea.
We have 7 billion the world now, on its way to 8. Suppose there were only three billion people on earth. Would she want children then? One billion? 500 million?
I just wonder how few people there would have to be on earth before she realizes this ecological catastrophe isn't happening after all.
The term 'neurotic' was once used to describe a mental health issue, not as a way of life. I have never in my life met a woman--sleep-deprived or not--who was sorry she had children. For most women, motherhood is the most demanding but rewarding role they can play and is their most important contribution to society.
FTR: Jesus said that the reason He came born as man was to give men a Way to the God. Then he shared with that us was that God’s name Father. Not Yahweh, not Adonai, not The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, but Father.
It's a threat to try and get Trump out of office. Call their bluff.
“Yea!! I'm glad she dumped him. It would have been horrible to wait even longer, during those precious years. I think men know they want to get married real fast. If they are indecisive, they aren't interested.”
Me too! They broke up once during their almost ten year relationship (she was with him during undergrad and law school) then got back together again for few more wasted years. Finally she had enough,her biological clock was ticking louder so she broke it off for good and met her now husband within months. He wasn’t a bad guy, just a selfish one.
Soon? How about 2024...
Maybe when President O'Rourke lifts the gloom it will be safe to have children again.
But we want these people voting at age 16.
they face a world of violence, hatred, ecological devastation and economic privation
Sounds horrible. You should take yourself out, too...
Those two comments seem like they're crying out for someone to tell them they were right.
Oh...I see chillblaine had the same reaction.
At some level, deciding to have children is an irrational decision. It's a leap of faith that things will work. Uncertainty makes people uncomfortable.
I do not regret having kids. I hope to have grandchildren some day, but we'll see.
"He wasn’t a bad guy, just a selfish one."
Sometimes this type does not want to be upfront. They like the convenience of the relationships. They don't want a family anytime in the near future. I wish they would admit it, so the other person wouldn't waste time. My personal opinion is that men are not indecisive about marriage. They are all in & know very quickly. Or they don't want to put a ring on it.
& Congrats on your grandchildren!
“Maybe when President O'Rourke lifts the gloom it will be safe to have children again.”
Funny, but all my daughter’s college and law school friends are married and having children. One friend of hers who is a nurse and married an ER doc already has four children. Another friend of hers married and is having a really hard time conceiving due to her advanced maternal age. She’s a dermatologist and her hubby is a professor. Another friend who she went to undergrad with who also became an attorney has three kids already, three in a row and close together. All of these young women are liberals who didn’t seem to have any difficulty making the decision to marry and have children.
“Congrats on your grandchildren!”
Thanks. I have five now ranging in ages from 18 to 2. Love being a grandma!
Husbands should have as much input into the decision as the wives do. Raising children is a joint project.
My guess is that the kinds of women who go to these counselors really want children, but can't get beyond what their feminism tells them they should want out of life.
Husbands should have as much input into the decision as the wives do.
Well, they have to put it in.
Mulling some of these issues myself recently. I do not see a parenthood-indecision therapist in my near future.
I think bringing children into this completely messed-up world is totally irresponsible.
Geez, people have been saying this my entire life, and I'm 54 next week.
"Well, it's not as if men can drive to Babies 'R Us and pick out a baby."
Andy Cohen made the cover of People magazine for doing just that. You just need money.
Feminists have hacked at the family as the basic unit of society, ever since Germaine Greer wrote in "Sex and Destiny" (1984): "Common morality now treats childbearing as an aberration. There are practically no good reasons left for exercising one's fertility."
Apart from companionship, having someone care for you when you're old, and experiencing humanity and life, that is.
"Mother is the dead heart of the family, spending father's earnings on consumer goods to enhance the environment in which he eats, sleeps, and watches the television." (The Female Eunuch, 1970)
Why get married?
"Women fail to understand how much men hate them." (The Female Eunuch)
Better to be a lesbian. Or have no sex at all.
I didn't have a child of my own until I was 34. My wife was the same age, and she made the decision. I went along with it, because she wanted them.
Twenty years later, I'm grateful that she did. Yeah, it was terrible at times. And I wish they had turned like in some ways better. But I don't regret it. They're great people, I learned so much about how humans develop from them, and I hope I can leave a legacy that will support them. I only hope I have taught them things they can use.
The only regret I have is that we didn't have more children.
traditionalguy said...
" creating and caring for a human being...makes you a real person. Without that experience you are never a whole human being. Think that over."
OK, I've thought that over -- and concluded that it is arrogant bullshit.
Thanks. I have five now ranging in ages from 18 to 2. Love being a grandma!
Likewise with my mother and mother-in-law. Nonnas are the best & we're lucky to have them both! One of my best memories: my mother seeing my first born the night I delivered.
Inga said the notion that everything needs to be perfect before one has a child. Perfect career, perfect house, perfect partner( although I’d caution against having children with losers or abusers). The world in which we bring children was never perfect and never will be.
Amen to that.
If you wait for the perfect time to have children, you might just find that the time has passed.
There is never going to be "perfect". The kids, if they are allowed to live and be born, don't care about perfect.
I do not have children because my ex-wife of 30 years had medical issues that prevented her from carrying a baby to term.
We thought about adoption, but she really did not want kids. Her career was more important. I was indecisive, but not to the point of feeling terrible pressure to resolve the dilemma. That we did not have kids is probably good.
My current (and forever) wife was in a similar situation (in her 30's, both finishing grad school, etc), but she really wanted kids. After spending a TON of money on fertility treatments, she talked him into spending a TON on Korean adoption.
Her kid was a handful and her ex was physically and emotionally absent. It continues to be an incredible financial sacrifice. Nonetheless, she never had any regrets. My stepson is now a fine young man (albeit often a pain in the ass) and I am thrilled to have him in my life.
You don't need a therapist to help you decide. It is going to be difficult. It is going to be expensive. You will have to make many sacrifices. You will have to develop new skills and attitudes. If it feels important to you, just do it.
@IceNine....My comment was not arrogant bullshit, of which I am perfectly capable as you know by now. That was my personal testimony. It is how arrogant bullshitters among us finally learn what it means to serve others. Then, horror of horrors, you become the adult and are no longer the child.
These apocalyptic WaPo commenters think the world is disintegrating but that Medicare and Social Security will take care of them in their old age. Medicare and Sociel Security is provides for by other people’s children. For now.
“...creating and caring for a human being...makes you a real person. Without that experience you are never a whole human being. Think that over."
“OK, I've thought that over -- and concluded that it is arrogant bullshit.”
My oldest daughter doesn’t have any children and is now is too old to have any of her own. She’s not heartbroken. She would’ve liked to have a child, but had the wrong husband and the years got away from her. She’s the Navy Chief and her life is full of taking care of other people’s young adult children. Plus she’s a doting Auntie and adores her nieces and nephews and they her.
The single greatest resource on this planet is human ingenuity.
It is a renewable resource that pays for itself.
Human ingenuity allows billions to be fed, sheltered, and clothed.
Human ingenuity stretches resources further than previous generations might have guessed.
Malthus was wrong.
Every neo-Malthusian was and is wrong.
The output of humanity is not limited by much, except our own creativity.
If only we could have as many children as some on this blog have pretended to have, the human race would live forever.
The wicked solution is two choices too late. However, dodo dynasties, short of normalization, are a legitimate choice.
That said, it's not the mother or father's decision. We're not children anymore. Reconcile.
“If only we could have as many children as some on this blog have pretended to have, the human race would live forever.”
If only we could have commenters who aren’t psychopaths.
I too would prefer dozens of figments of my imagination.
But when imaginary kids are birthed so late in life, they often have defects.
Well, it was a nice thread...
tradguy> No. That in fact was your personal relegating to non-(full)humanity those who did it differently than you. It was virulently parochial. There are many ways to serve and to learn to serve others...trust a genuine full human being who has done it all his life. Your view of the meaning of humanity is fine for you - I don't dispute that. You went light years beyond that, my friend.
We had our first when I was 31. My wife's maternal instincts had kicked in and it was her idea. Having children definitely changed me for the better-as it should. I don't think this was an accident as I believe humans are hardwired to do this; it's basic human nature to procreate (and the man is usually the last to figure it out). I see the feminists as trying to revoke human nature because they don't like their particular biological role in procreation. But I also believe that human nature is immutable and any attempt to revoke it (or failure to acknowledge it) cannot possibly succeed and can only lead to grief.
Wait, Royal ass Inga, are you upset that I mentioned commenters who pretend to have children?
That seems an odd take, given your reputation for veracity.
I might have to reconsider all that I know to be true.
"...virulently parochial..."
This is a set of words without meaning.
Wow, that was a toxic comment. Can see why Althouse is going to introduce a new commenting system.
Feminism?
I have 12 neices and nephews parented by feminists.
Typo. 10.
“Wow, that was a toxic comment. Can see why Althouse is going to introduce a new commenting system.”
Yes but will she be consistent? This guy has repeated this same nuttery for years now. But eh, whatever, I’m pretty sure most commenters know he’s a bit “off”.
I'm not sure what the problem is, Birkel, but I can help you. Decreeing that those who haven't had children can never be full human beings is an objectionably harsh (virulent) statement springing from a limited, narrow (parochial) viewpoint.
“I have 12 neices and nephews parented by feminists.”
Go figure, feminists do have children and get married too. I know plenty of them.
Ice Nine,
The long-tailed cat in the room full of rocking chairs generally squeals.
Sorry, bro.
Royal ass Inga,
Ditto.
feminists as trying to revoke human nature
It ("child") is a burden, women are cast as beasts of burden, men are painted as rapists and sometimes rape-rapists, business has an interest in cheap labor, Democrats have an interest in diversity, and the State has an interest in taxable commodities.
Yes but will she be consistent? This guy has repeated this same nuttery for years now. But eh, whatever, I’m pretty sure most commenters know he’s a bit “off”.
I don't know. It will stop the name calling and ugly behaviour from starting in the first place. That is a good thing. It will cut down on interesting back & forth, but some of the toxic comments are so toxic, it might be for the best.
The toxic aspect of that comment kind of took my breath away. In the midst of people enjoying a conversation about children, and their own children and grandchildren, it was a big piece of stinky poo.
“It will stop the name calling and ugly behaviour from starting in the first place. That is a good thing. It will cut down on interesting back & forth, but some of the toxic comments are so toxic, it might be for the best.”
I hope so.
“The toxic aspect of that comment kind of took my breath away. In the midst of people enjoying a conversation about children, and their own children and grandchildren, it was a big piece of stinky poo.”
I guess I’m used to if after all these years. I do hope for a better commenting experience for everyone.
Fake children everywhere are appalled.
Fake mothers are in all ways offended.
It's an abomination that liars cannot countenance.
How Darwinian. Not having kids means you are extinct, literally. The future belongs to others. You will have no influence on it.
Unless things change tremendously -- and very, very soon -- they face a world of violence, hatred, ecological devastation and economic privation.
I'd like the people who actually live in places that are violent, sectarian, ecologically devastated, and economically deprived to chime in.
"I wonder if only women seek this treatment. The term "motherhood clarity mentor" suggests the indecision is a women's problem or that men either know they don't want children or if they do want children believe the decision whether to have them or not belongs to the woman."
Back when Mother Nature was running the show, nobody asked women if they wanted to have children. But I guess we have built up a pretty good reserve, we can afford to spend a few dozen generations breeding women who really want to have children.
"I'm sure my comment will cause a lot of controversy, but personally I think bringing children into this completely messed-up world is totally irresponsible."
This person would seem to be saying that the World is so "messed-up" that it is not desirable to be alive in it. Yet I suspect he goes right on shoving food into his face.
The term "motherhood clarity mentor" suggests the indecision is a women's problem or that men either know they don't want children or if they do want children believe the decision whether to have them or not belongs to the woman.
Or maybe they know that the state has decided that men have no reproductive rights, only responsibilities, so they don't bother worrying about it.
Hey bitchez! Ya know what? No one wants you to have children. I say anyone who twice for Obama and then for Clinton should be sterilized. And if you refuse, mandatory abortion! It's a constitutional prohibition I found emanating from them penumbras.
Spare us from your palaver. Do us a favor, kill yourselves now, your carbon footprint is way too big.
Never in my entire life have I ever wanted something more than to check in with that near 60 "I'm happy I never had kids" comment-person when they're near 70. By that point, almost all of us start needing a little help to get by and I can't wait to see how much he enjoys relying on total strangers.
Mike
I too would prefer dozens of figments of my imagination.
But when imaginary kids are birthed so late in life, they often have defects.
That certainly has been true hitherto — because people's eggs and sperm age with them as they grow older. But it need not be true in the future. This is because stem cells have been discovered in recent years that can grow into new, young eggs or sperm. Such stem cells can be basically manufactured (“reprogrammed”) out of one's ordinary body cells, which can then produce pristine germ cells deriving from one's own original inheritance to make babies from.
"That in fact was your personal relegating to non-(full)humanity those who did it differently than you. It was virulently parochial. There are many ways to serve and to learn to serve others...trust a genuine full human being who has done it all his life. Your view of the meaning of humanity is fine for you - I don't dispute that. You went light years beyond that, my friend."
I don't think anyone is saying that childlessness means that you can't realize your inner Mother Theresa. But it's pretty indisputable that there are parts of the human experience that can only be realized and understood by....experience. I imagine every good and serious parent knows The Thunderbolt, the sudden and stunning realization that this baby born a day or two ago is now inextricably linked to you for as long as you live. That the baby is your hostage to a fortune you can never fully control and that that fortune can gut you like a fish.
I've never experienced combat in war but I imagine there, too, are revealed parts of your humanity that can be accessed in no other way. I'm certainly not butt-hurt about my inability to understand it. That would be arrogant and parochial.
STOP THE MADNESS. Just DO IT.
"Never in my entire life have I ever wanted something more than to check in with that near 60 "I'm happy I never had kids" comment-person when they're near 70. By that point, almost all of us start needing a little help to get by and I can't wait to see how much he enjoys relying on total strangers."
Fear not. The self-centered seldom grow out of it. Surely after 50 years of working for a boutique non-profit and lots of international travel they're entitled to have you do their shopping for them.
I am reminded by some intelligent commenters responses that telling someone you have had good experiences triggers them that you have told them they were left out of something good. That's a normal response. So I should probably have kept my mouth shut. Or, you can stop reading this before it gets worse.
When my children were born, I had a profound experience that a part of me had left me forever and was now residing in each child. And I suddenly my job assignment was to guard and nurish that part of me in each child's life. I did that and they did their part ; and finally my missing part came back in the form of excellent grandchildren.
“When my children were born, I had a profound experience that a part of me had left me forever and was now residing in each child. And I suddenly my job assignment was to guard and nurish that part of me in each child's life. I did that and they did their part ; and finally my missing part came back in the form of excellent grandchildren.”
I think your wife and kids are truly blessed to have you in their lives. What a wonderful way to express being a father.
Only thing I wish is that we had a 4th. and then maybe a 5th. After that the 7 person minivan fills up.
Kids are great.
As always (dammit) my dad was right. If you wait for a perfect time to have kids, you'll never have them. He's. Always. Right.
And Althouse Blog comments is truly blessed to have you, dear Inga, in the new chosen comments system. MAGA!
Calm down, that means "Making Althouse Great Again."
"This person would seem to be saying that the World is so 'messed-up' that it is not desirable to be alive in it. Yet I suspect he goes right on shoving food into his face."
I said much the same, I recognized patterns in the way the world was going and decided I didn't want my offspring to be a part of it. Doesn't mean I get to suicide out though, I'm stuck out of morality.
I may have chosen poorly, I'm certainly aware I need to be on guard and not let my perception of reality adjust to justify the decision. I'm also the child of two alcoholics and my childhood never happened, which may have something to do with the selfishness of my decision. But it seems to be a major cause of the decline in birth replacement rates, this despair about the future.
I had an interesting moment in my head once, out of Herbert's Dune, where I shouted down all the ancestral voices with "your line ends with me!". They were NOT happy. LOL.
I'm not one of those people that Mike mentioned who makes a thing about it. And I made a decision to never regret my choice once it was too late. Why beat yourself up over something you can't change?
There is a freedom too. The wife and I have enjoyed exploring it. I didn't admit my preference to her until she opened the awkward conversation admitting she didn't want children. I would have gone either way just for her but I was relieved.
And if she goes before me, I have a bucket list of people who need to die, and no family that can be punished for my actions. Going out with a bang. No worries, petty internet fights don't make the cut.
"It is easier to live through someone else than to become complete yourself."
~Betty Friedan.>>>
What horse-shit! As though the only way to complete yourself is to have no deep involvement with other people. I do live through my children; I see ever-unfolding aspects and mysteries of all life through their eyes and their experiences. And they live through me; they have experienced life through my eyes and experiences too, and will carry my persona in this way throughout their lives. The same holds true for my husband and me. We don't BECOME complete without other meaningful people in our lives; we become insane.
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