Althouse: "Dick Cheney was the safe-cracker, the professional you brought in who knew all the ins and outs of our government. He was the ultimate gamesman. With Trump..."

November 19, 2018

"Dick Cheney was the safe-cracker, the professional you brought in who knew all the ins and outs of our government. He was the ultimate gamesman. With Trump..."

"... the front door to the White House is wide open. There's deer and dogs and hyenas running around. And this guy is like an orangutan just throwing shit around. But Cheney was the grand master who finished the deal. Donald Trump has no belief system. So I would take the hyenas, the random wild animals running through the White House over Cheney any day of the week. If Cheney had stayed in office — let's say we didn't have term limits, and he was able to go another four, eight years — they would have invaded Iran."

Said Adam McKay, quoted in "The Dick Cheney Dossier: Inside Adam McKay’s Searing Exposé of D.C.'s 'Ultimate Gamesman' in 'Vice'" (Hollywood Reporter).

141 comments:

rhhardin said...: He doesn't understand gamesman. The gamesman wins even when he loses. That's to Trump, not Cheney.

The gamesman wears black socks with a white tennis outfit to put his opponent off.; 11/19/18, 10:52 AM
Limited blogger said...: "...they would have invaded Iran..."

As Scott Adams says - this is mind reading.; 11/19/18, 10:54 AM
Dave Begley said...: "They would have invaded Iran."

Wild and baseless speculation.

And General John Kelly is just throwing shit around the West Wing?

"Let's say we didn't have term limits...."

Let's say we didn't have the Electoral College.

The above being said, I'm intensely interested in this movie. Cheney grew up in Lincoln.; 11/19/18, 10:54 AM
Darrell said...: Adam McKay sucks from the cock of Socialism.; 11/19/18, 10:55 AM
mockturtle said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 11/19/18, 10:56 AM
Dave Begley said...: In any event, invading Iran probably better than handing Iran billions so that they can build nukes and terrorize the Middle East.

At least Cheney and Trump is on the side of American citizens as opposed to Iranian mullahs.; 11/19/18, 10:56 AM
rehajm said...: Adam McKay isn't very good at analysis in Trump's case. It's amusing to call him an orangutan if you don't like him, though. Also, the word orangutan makes an allusion to the word orange and some people think Trump is orange. So that's fun...; 11/19/18, 10:56 AM
Professional lady said...: TDS is getting so boring. Even if you hate Trump you should be able to recognize that he's a really smart guy who has a plan that he has rather masterfully been able to execute so far in his own unique way.; 11/19/18, 10:57 AM
mockturtle said...: Donald Trump has no belief system.

Trump has never been an ideologue and that is a plus. An ideologue will always eschew practical solutions when they clash with his beliefs.; 11/19/18, 10:58 AM
Dear corrupt left, go F yourselves said...: Yet another fake news hollywood obsessive portrayal of collective outrage. They were so certain Bush-Cheney were Hitler and they WERE going to take over the world and install theology!; 11/19/18, 10:59 AM
jaydub said...: Exactly how does a screen writer and SNL alum write a creditable expose of the White House? Doesn't an expose require some inside knowledge that can be exposed? Where does his inside knowledge come from? The SNL cast? I think the bullshit flag needs to be raised on this one.; 11/19/18, 10:59 AM
rcocean said...: Orange man bad - article no 10,324 and counting.

But I never liked Cheney. What can you say about a man who heads a VP selection committee and chooses himself! With his bad heart (his has annual heart attacks) he never should have been chosen.

One reason we ended up with Trump, is Bush II did ZERO to develop a successor or new Conservative talent. So we got McCain in 2008 and Romney in 2012.; 11/19/18, 10:59 AM
rcocean said...: Its nice to remember that before they hated Trump, they hated Bush-Hitler, Cheney and Rumsfeld.; 11/19/18, 11:01 AM
Comanche Voter said...: This clown can call Trump an orangutang and nobody in Hollywood gives a flyin' flip. But when Roseanne Barr calls Valerie Jarrett a chimpanzee (family resemblance there) then the Hollywood Heavens Fall!

Cheney, like Rumsford, had been around the swamp a long time. You do pick up some bad habits from the swamp creatures if you stay there long enough. And sooner or later somebody becomes the biggest alligator in the swamp.; 11/19/18, 11:03 AM
Dear corrupt left, go F yourselves said...: More evidence that SNL is a democrat party operation.; 11/19/18, 11:04 AM
Mike Sylwester said...: Orangutan?

David Brooks wrote that Donald Trump is a wolf.; 11/19/18, 11:06 AM
Fernandinande said...: Searing Exposé

I am up tenterhooks creek without a tenter.; 11/19/18, 11:06 AM
Lucid-Ideas said...: rcocean said, "Its nice to remember that before they hated Trump, they hated Bush-Hitler..."

My favorite thing about all of the Hitlerisms is the fun new word combos they create...

Bush-Hitler...bushitler...bullshitter.
Trump-Hitler...trumpitler...trilter...trumpeter
Reagan-Hitler...reitler...reiter...realtor
Someone is literally Hitler...literalitler...literitler...literator

Fun!; 11/19/18, 11:16 AM
Fernandinande said...: Speaking of fake news,

Drudge -> For the first time, researchers say Facebook can cause depression
"Published: Nov 18, 2018 10:10 a.m. ET
The findings are published in the December Journal of Social and Clinical Psychology"

That seemed pretty obviously false, so google [Facebook can cause depression] -> first result:

New Study Links Facebook To Depression: But Now We Actually Understand Why.
Apr 8, 2015; 11/19/18, 11:17 AM
SeanF said...: If Cheney had stayed in office — let's say we didn't have term limits, and he was able to go another four, eight years...

Can someone point me to the part of the Constitution which establishes term limits for the Vice Presidency?; 11/19/18, 11:22 AM
Fernandinande said...: Also Drudge: "Christian Bale Portrays VP Cheney as Alcoholic, Out-of-Control Madman..."; 11/19/18, 11:23 AM
MikeR said...: "here's deer and dogs and hyenas running around. And this guy is like an orangutan just throwing shit around. But Cheney was the grand master who finished the deal." Can the author really be this incoherent? I'm choking on the metaphor of the grandmaster on safari, in the veldt, with orangutans...; 11/19/18, 11:27 AM
Bob Boyd said...: McKay's astrologer told him what goes on in the private minds of Cheney and Trump. Like-minded people on the internet affirmed it. There are people on the internet who could tell him it's ludicrous, but he doesn't have to talk to them.; 11/19/18, 11:29 AM
khematite said...: The 22nd Amendment establishes term limits for no one but the president. Cheney could have been McCain's candidate for VP in 2008 or for that matter, could have run for the presidency itself that year or in any election since. Cheney is legally eligible right now to become president or vice-president in the next election. McKay's gratitude for term limits is completely unwarranted.; 11/19/18, 11:30 AM
Ann Althouse said...: "here's deer and dogs and hyenas running around. And this guy is like an orangutan just throwing shit around."

Sounds like an episode of "Bojack Horseman."; 11/19/18, 11:38 AM
Tommy Duncan said...: Absent facts, this so-called expose' is simply a crude opinion hit piece.; 11/19/18, 11:38 AM
Robert Cook said...: "In any event, invading Iran probably better than handing Iran billions so that they can build nukes and terrorize the Middle East."

We returned money to Iran that was theirs to begin with. They haven't built any nukes and they are not the chief nation terrorizing the Middle East. (We are.); 11/19/18, 11:39 AM
Howard said...: Hitlery writes itself; 11/19/18, 11:39 AM
Howard said...: Isn't this the exact samey-same argument Achilles makes against the Neo-Con Globalists cabal of BushCheneyHillaryObama and why he loves Trump so much?; 11/19/18, 11:41 AM
William said...: I think Trump sincerely believes in capitalism. That gives him a leg up on McKay.........I'd like to see a movie that dramatizes the complex relationship that Hillary had with Harvey Weinstein or the storm tossed romance of Huma and Anthony. It's the stories that never get told that are the true narrative of our era.; 11/19/18, 11:49 AM
Amadeus 48 said...: Eek! I’m reeling. The horror! The horror!; 11/19/18, 12:01 PM
Lewis Wetzel said...: I read the article. A partisan hit job & hate fest dubbed "entertainment" and released on Christmas day.
Every right wing bogeyman makes an appearance in the film, from Rumsfeld to the Koch brothers.
Paramount bought the movie from McKay, who wrote and directed it. McKay hates Republicans and especially Cheney so much that he goes frothing mad at the mere thought of either being in the White House.
In case you are wondering where McKay earned his chops as a savvy political observer, smarter than the 50% of Americans who do not understand that Republicans are all evil Nazis, McKay is a college drop out. Just like a construction worker living in a trailer in Alabama, McKay has "some post secondary education."; 11/19/18, 12:03 PM
MayBee said...: I’m sure super liberal Adam McKay has knowledge about deep inside the Bush and Trump White Houses; 11/19/18, 12:05 PM
Mike Sylwester said...: There is a movie about how Dan Rather tried to derail President George W. Bush's re-election by means of a fake National Guard document, but that movie portrays Rather and his colluders as heroes.

There should be a movie about how that fake National Guard was concocted and provided to Rather and his colluders. We still don't have a movie about that.; 11/19/18, 12:05 PM
Mike Sylwester said...: Supposedly, Vice President Chaney went around within the US Intelligence Community and twisted arms until he got a false finding that Iraq's Saddam Hussein was building weapons of mass destruction. I'm sure that the movie will depict Chaney thus twisting arms to get that false finding.

The public still does not know who in the Obama Administration went around within the US Intelligence Community and twisted arms to get a false finding that Russia's Vladimir Putin was meddling in the 2016 election.

Was the arm-twister Vice President Biden? The public still does not have a clue.

Maybe, a couple decades from now, there will be a Christmas movie about how the US Intelligence Community concocted the RussiaGate hoax during the Obama Administration.; 11/19/18, 12:15 PM
Ken B said...: A certain strata of people learn growing up that they are smart. Some of them never learn they can also be dumb. That leads to certain kinds of pronouncements. The confident flat assertions McKay makes, with no evidence, show he is one of these.; 11/19/18, 12:23 PM
Bill Peschel said...: "a false finding that Iraq's Saddam Hussein was building weapons of mass destruction"

A "false finding" despite Saddam's endless games of "hide the WMDs" from U.N. weapons inspectors.

A "false finding" despite Saddam keeping his nuclear scientists on a short leash for the day he could restart his program.

A "false finding" despite finding stocks of WMDs in the country after the invasion.

Admittedly, a lot of the stocks of nerve gas were much smaller than expected, and the nuclear program didn't amount to much at the time. It appears Saddam was bluffing to build up the impression he was the strong horse, but he stood on the world stage and bragged about pushing back at the U.N. and refusing to abide by the agreement he signed.

He just didn't believe they would actually do something about it. He chose ... poorly.; 11/19/18, 12:28 PM
Earnest Prole said...: I'll wait until I see the movie to judge its politics for myself, but I already know Christian Bale is the greatest screen actor of his generation. See the remake of 3:10 to Yuma, the imaginary Dylan bio I’m Not There, and American Hustle to start.; 11/19/18, 12:32 PM
Ken B said...: Bill P
They found some too, years later. But the real issue was that SH had a treaty obligation with the UN to prove he had destroyed all his, and he did not do so. Even Chirac admitted that (whilst taking bribes from Iraq).; 11/19/18, 12:34 PM
Dear corrupt left, go F yourselves said...: Dan Rather and Mary Mapes had a time machine. They were able to go back in time and take the typewriter and transport it into the future where modern computers and word processors morphed with the type-writer to deliver a type writer with modern Microsoft word typeface.

IT'S A MIRACLE!

Also - the Russians hacked our brains.; 11/19/18, 12:40 PM
robother said...: Whatever the intelligence failings on WMD, we can all agree that the $2 trillion and 6000 US soldiers (and 10s of thousands of wounded) were a small price to pay for creating thriving democracies in Afghanistan and Iraq, 21st Century versions of Japan and Germany....; 11/19/18, 12:44 PM
bagoh20 said...: That might be true, but until we see what happens with Iran and it's nuclear ambitions, we won't know if it would have saved lives or cost them in the long run. There is more risk from Iran every month. Some could have, and probably did say the same about Germany in 1938-39. "Peace for our time" was true..., but "our time" was short.; 11/19/18, 12:53 PM
Hagar said...: Dick Cheney has his faults, but to claim he is underhanded and deceptive is hard to understand. I always thought he was more for the sledgehammer approach than was really wise.; 11/19/18, 12:56 PM
gilbar said...: If Cheney had stayed in office — let's say we didn't have term limits, and he was able to go another four, eight years...

I must have missed when Cheney was President? I didn't remember him being elected, yet alone Re-elected President, and i SURE don't remember Cheney having the votes that a third term was possible? Or, is he saying that Cheney was SO POWERFUL; that he controlled the President... was SO POWERFUL that he would have MADE O'Bama pick him as President... was SO POWERFUL that an O'Bama/Cheney ticket would have been successful... was SO POWERFUL that he would have controlled THAT President...
BUT!
While Having THAT SORT OF POWER, he stepped aside because of a term limit that didn't apply to Vice Presidents?
Okay, slowly put down the pipe; just put it down; 11/19/18, 12:58 PM
Hagar said...: Even Rumsfeld could be tactful when he wanted something from you, but Cheney, he just told you like it was, regardless.; 11/19/18, 1:04 PM
Gabriel said...: @rcocean: What can you say about a man who heads a VP selection committee and chooses himself!

A man supremely confident in his ability to do the job, and confident that his recommendation would be acceptable to the President.; 11/19/18, 1:05 PM
Dear corrupt left, go F yourselves said...: Stuff is easy in hindsight.

Colon Powel didn't want to take out Saddam back when we should have. That was a mistake.; 11/19/18, 1:25 PM
The Vault Dweller said...: "In the end, he makes me sad. He almost makes me tear up," McKay says, actually wiping back a tear from behind his glasses. "I see a guy who gave it all away. And his story is kind of America's story. I feel the same way about our country now. Cheney had it. America had it. Like we were rolling into the '70s, and poverty was at an all-time low. Income inequality was like at an all-time low. I went to Temple University, a city school. I owed $3,800 in student debt when I left. The country was working, and unions were strong. You just feel we gave it away."

This was the most interesting bit I thought from the article. It isn't often that you hear someone think back fondly on the 70's thinking of them being full of unbridled optimism. I mean with Carter we, had stagflation, and economic malaise. Nixon and Watergate weren't uplifting. Also dealing with the end of the Vietnam war and it's aftermath, doesn't seem optimistic. Though McKay was I think child during the 70's so perhaps his view is different.; 11/19/18, 1:28 PM
Lewis Wetzel said...: It is possible to believe the Iraq War was a mistake without believing in bizarro-world conspiracy theories about warmongers & Jewish neocons.
But not for today's insane leftists.; 11/19/18, 1:37 PM
FIDO said...: Didn't his enemies say the same about Andrew Jackson?; 11/19/18, 1:49 PM
rehajm said...: Though McKay was I think child during the 70's so perhaps his view is different.

I was a child in the 70s. I was a little young to remember Vietnam though I remember driving in the middle of the night to pick up my uncle returning home. I do recall a feeling of collective malaise, most certainly the collective disappointment in Carter and his policies, from the adults I encountered and on television.; 11/19/18, 1:52 PM
FIDO said...: "Trump/Cheney: Because we want to see the gate go to 11."; 11/19/18, 1:53 PM
Gordon Scott said...: My wife, who is not even remotely conservative in politics, watched the trailer for Vice beside me. When the scene plays and Cheney says he'll accept the VP if Bush lets Cheney run foreign policy, energy and defense, my wife snorted. She is no fan of GWB, but she knows perfectly well that Bush ran his own administration, and Cheney didn't. Cheney couldn't even get Bush to pardon Scooter Libby, and Bush actually was sympathetic to Libby.

It's a fantasy. Just like the fantasy that Gary Hart was all about ideas, man, and he had a vision, and no one could forsee the future like he could....; 11/19/18, 2:16 PM
Big Mike said...: People keep thinking that evil genius Cheney was the reason we went into Iraq, and not George Tenet, Director of Central Intelligence, who (according to Bob Woodward's book) literally danced around the Oval Office assuring a skeptical George W. Bush that it was a "slam dunk" that there were WMD in Iraq.; 11/19/18, 2:19 PM
Robert Cook said...: "Admittedly, a lot of the stocks of nerve gas were much smaller than expected, and the nuclear program didn't amount to much at the time. It appears Saddam was bluffing to build up the impression he was the strong horse, but he stood on the world stage and bragged about pushing back at the U.N. and refusing to abide by the agreement he signed.

"He just didn't believe they would actually do something about it. He chose ... poorly."

All the stocks of nerve gas found were smaller than expected, as they were merely the fractional dregs of the much larger original stocks that had been destroyed. They were essentially just crumbs that got lost and forgotten.

Hussein didn't expect we would invade as he was cooperating with the U.N. Inspectors. You forgot to mention that for four months prior to our illegal invasion of Iraq, there were new U.N. Inspectors on the ground in Iraq, searching for alleged WMD. They found nothing, even after searching locations they were directed to by the U.S. They were not done with their inspections and needed another few months to complete their mission, but they were told to terminate their activities and leave the country immediately as the invasion was scheduled to commence.

So much for the invasion being a "last resort." We wouldn't let the inspectors even finish their search. My guess is, after four months of finding nothing, Cheney was shitting himself thinking they would find nothing after further inspections, thus removing the crucial basis for our illegal invasion. They could not have that...they wanted their invasion!

Criminals just got to be criminals, don't you know?; 11/19/18, 2:19 PM
Robert Cook said...: "People keep thinking that evil genius Cheney was the reason we went into Iraq, and not George Tenet, Director of Central Intelligence, who (according to Bob Woodward's book) literally danced around the Oval Office assuring a skeptical George W. Bush that it was a 'slam dunk' that there were WMD in Iraq."

Tenet was merely giving his bosses what they wanted to hear and what they were pressuring everyone to deliver.; 11/19/18, 2:26 PM
Robert Cook said...: "It is possible to believe the Iraq War was a mistake...."

No, it was an intentionally perpetrated crime.; 11/19/18, 2:27 PM
MikeR said...: "Tenet was merely giving his bosses what they wanted to hear and what they were pressuring everyone to deliver." In case anyone actually cares about the truth of this issue, it is readily available: War and Decision by Douglas Feith. It gives extensive documentation of the entire process, including minutes of meetings as they happened and original documents.
Or, everyone can hold on to their preconceived notions, as delivered to them by their favorite columnists.; 11/19/18, 2:35 PM
Lewis Wetzel said...: Hussein didn't expect we would invade as he was cooperating with the U.N. Inspectors.
Danger! Selective memory at work!
Saddam forbid the inspectors from examining many sites within Iraq. Saddam was, of course, still in violation of the ceasefire agreement that ended Desert Storm and left him in power.
You can entertain yourself with Robert Cook's fantasies, or you can read the text of Joint Resolution 114, the dcocument voted on by our legislatures that explains the reasons for taking military action against Saddam Hussein's Iraq: https://www.congress.gov/bill/107th-congress/house-joint-resolution/114/text

Sanity results from looking at the data and avoiding mind reading and just-so stories.; 11/19/18, 2:36 PM
IgnatzEsq said...: The other way we could have invaded Iran is to elect "We Came, We Saw, He Died" Hillary Clinton whose background included voting for War (Iraq) as a Senator and advocating for War (Libya, Syria) as Secretary of State. She was fairly consistent about wanting to drop bombs on brown people.

Dodged a big bullet there (so far).; 11/19/18, 2:39 PM
Matt Sablan said...: Cheney was how we used to square that Bush was stupid and an evil genius. Poor guy; you'd think having been for gay marriage before Clinton or Obama would have been worth some street cred for the guy.; 11/19/18, 2:44 PM
rcocean said...: The liberal obsession with Cheney is just part of their pattern of treating Republican Presidents. To them, there are only two kinds:

1) Evil - Like Nixon or Hoover.

2) Dumb - Like Reagan, Ford, Ike or Bush II.

The dumb ones always have - according to the MSM, some evil mastermind pulling the string. With Ike = Nixon/Sherman Adams. With Reagan = Jim Baker/Don Reagan. With Bush I = Sununu/Lee Atwater. With Ford = Kissinger. With Bush II - Cheney.; 11/19/18, 2:49 PM
William said...: I was one of those who felt that the Iraqis would greet us as liberators after the overthrow of Saddam. Who knew that he was about the most progressive and enlightened ruler that the mideast can produce. Hillary made a similar mistake in Libya. Qaddaffi, as it turned out, was the leader that Libya needed. Well no matter. I'm sure that if we make efforts to rid the Saudis of their royal family everyone in that country will love us and go on to live in peace and democracy.; 11/19/18, 3:01 PM
Ron Winkleheimer said...: The guy is an idiot. $3800 in 2018 dollars is $24,858.57. And he didn't graduate. The 1970s were about waiting in line for hours to gas up your car. Stagflation, 21% interest rates on home loans, the beginning of manufacturing moving overseas, wage and price controls, race riots sparked by school busing. The Cambodian refugee crisis, the Killing Fields, the fall of Saigon.; 11/19/18, 3:05 PM
Kevin said...: Cheney was how we used to square that Bush was stupid and an evil genius.

They're still trying to tamp down Trump's accomplishments because they can't pull the same thing with Pence or Kelley.; 11/19/18, 3:06 PM
Mr Wibble said...: I was one of those who felt that the Iraqis would greet us as liberators after the overthrow of Saddam.

The Iraqis did welcome us as liberators who overthrew Saddam. That doesn't mean that they didn't have severe cracks in their society, not to mention that once the welcome died down, people wanted things like electricity and running water and a functioning government.; 11/19/18, 3:08 PM
Jeff Weimer said...: Cheney knew his shit, no doubt. He would be an invaluable asset to this administration as he was to GWB. But this is ridiculous.; 11/19/18, 3:09 PM
Ingachuck'stoothlessARM said...: "Cheney was a safe-cracker", but not a safe cracker.

gnome sane?; 11/19/18, 3:10 PM
BUMBLE BEE said...: HEY NOW HEY NOW.... listen up Bobby "Pallets 'O Cash" Cook got the skinny here. Inside track... square business!
Stuxnet never happened!
Hope he doesn't have kids!; 11/19/18, 3:18 PM
steve uhr said...: He is a badger so I always give him the benefit of the doubt.; 11/19/18, 3:24 PM
Drago said...: MikeR: "In case anyone actually cares about the truth of this issue, it is readily available: War and Decision by Douglas Feith. It gives extensive documentation of the entire process, including minutes of meetings as they happened and original documents.
Or, everyone can hold on to their preconceived notions, as delivered to them by their favorite columnists."

You need to keep in mind that our Cookie is a lunatic conspiracy theorist who literally believes Reagan conspired with the Ayatollah to keep Americans hostage longer so he would prevail in the 1980 election.

Literally.; 11/19/18, 3:30 PM
Jim at said...: No, it was an intentionally perpetrated crime.

Saddam Hussein fanboi chimes in.; 11/19/18, 3:42 PM
Achilles said...: Robert Cook said...
"It is possible to believe the Iraq War was a mistake...."

No, it was an intentionally perpetrated crime.

And lets list out the perpetrators who have pushed war in the ME the last 2 decades:

Every major government in Europe and their intelligence agencies.
Every Major democrat politician.
Every major republican politician.
The CIA, FBI, NSA.
Every major MSM media outlet in the US and most abroad.

In other words everyone that is trying to take Trump down.

All of Howard's and Inga's current friends.

And all of these people are deathly afraid that Saudi Arabia and Egypt and Israel will remain friends.

All of these people support Iran and their various wars in the ME.; 11/19/18, 3:45 PM
Achilles said...: Jim at said...
No, it was an intentionally perpetrated crime.

Saddam Hussein fanboi chimes in.

No.

Cook is half right.

You are half right.

People need to stop defending the GOPe. They are the cuck wing of the democrat party and have been traitors from the start.

All of the neocons are openly supporting democrats since Trump was elected. This should tell you something.

I have far more invested in the effort to help the ME become a better place than almost everyone here.

Whether Bush was a dupe or a piece of shit the result was the same. The uniparty turned the ME into a dumpster fire on purpose and Republican leadership was right there with the democrats in that effort.

I was on the ground in both countries. Everything was in place for victory to be achieved. We were purposely held back and it was calculated.

The people who sent us there did not want us to win.

They wanted us to lose. That includes Bush.; 11/19/18, 3:52 PM
narciso said...: Certainly the problem that were incurred in Iraq were as much originating in Europe as were native to the region, consider the bombing of the un compound that of the al Rashid hotel the Italian peacekeeper in nasiriya came Madrid and later Milan, the hit on massoud came from brussels.; 11/19/18, 4:19 PM
Rick said...: Robert Cook said...
No, it was an intentionally perpetrated crime.

It seems like yesterday Cook derided others for basing beliefs on not-facts.; 11/19/18, 4:36 PM
Gk1 said...: BDS is exchanged for TDS? And this is an improvement, how?; 11/19/18, 4:38 PM
walter said...: Ron Winkleheimer said...The 1970s were about waiting in line for hours to gas up your car. Stagflation, 21% interest rates on home loans, the beginning of manufacturing moving overseas, wage and price controls, race riots sparked by school busing. The Cambodian refugee crisis, the Killing Fields, the fall of Saigon.
-
Yep...and CW McCall's "Convoy".; 11/19/18, 4:43 PM
Ralph L said...: I read the post title and thought he was dead.; 11/19/18, 4:53 PM
Lewis Wetzel said...: Robert Cook's comments on this thread are creepily Chomsky-like.
Have you ever read any of Chomsky's anti-American screeds? Cohomsky likes to assert, as obvious facts, things that he has no way of knowing (such as the mental states of people he has never met). People act like puppets whose strings are pulled by historical forces which he understands, and which you do not (but he is willing to teach you).; 11/19/18, 4:56 PM
narciso said...: in a decade, it will be Crenshaw derangement or something else, if chemical weapons were no concern, why did the times keep a tally of several years instances when coalition forces encountered said weapons, in the WikiLeaks, there is a whole catalogue of instances with
use of said weapons, where are the records of destruction of said weapons,; 11/19/18, 5:21 PM
Vance said...: Robert Cook is here defending Saddam? And he defends Iran?

Well, he always did love murderous, evil societies. That's what far leftism is, after all: turning functioning places into evil, murderous societies. For all the faults of the Czars, Nicholas's Russia was far better than Stalin. Cook, however, will tell you otherwise. Sure, Cuba, Romania, Korea, China... all corrupt, poor places prior to the left taking control. They degenerated rapidly after leftists got in power. Cuba was much better run by the Banana companies than by Castro--for the common person, at least.

Now, Cookie is pining away for Saddam's rule, and he defends Iran. Who cares if it "was Iran's money!" Did they pay for the airliner they shot down? The terrorism they've committed? Did they reimburse Iraq for the damage caused in the 80's during the Iran/Iraq war? No? Then they don't deserve "their money" do they?

"But they are an evil, dictatorial murderous regime! They hate America! They need to be supported!" That's Cook and Inga's argument.; 11/19/18, 5:22 PM
FullMoon said...: I remember Limbaugh playing a montage of MSM asking if Cheney had enough "gravitas" for the job.
Not being a Rush listener, was first time I heard that sort of MSM montage.; 11/19/18, 5:29 PM
Drago said...: There are some of us recall watching in real time as Saddam transferred chem weapons to Syria and a couple squadrons of aircraft and boats to Iran. The rest he buried out in the desert.

Of course, we did our own fair share of burying Iraqi weapons in the desert with our tanks outfitted with plows.; 11/19/18, 5:29 PM
Sam L. said...: Dick Cheney LIVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVES!!!11111!!!!1
(The HORROR!! The horror...); 11/19/18, 5:34 PM
Kevin said...: All these movies about Bush. Where's the Obama movie?

Bill Clinton had Primary Colors and The War Room, which were about him getting elected, not governing.

I bet we get our first Trump movie before a real one on Obama comes out.

I'm not counting the one about he and Michelle going on a date.; 11/19/18, 5:48 PM
Dear corrupt left, go F yourselves said...: Hollywood only allows leftward agitprop.; 11/19/18, 5:49 PM
narciso said...: there was the one about the fellow who became a human posterboard for Obama, but you're right, the media find him so scintillating, that he couldn't appear in 'julianne's bender' what I call game change,

so they will revisit the niger narrative, ignoring the fellow who sent Wilson, was a state inr analyst who had been in the capital back in 99 when the Iraqi envoy zahawie showed up; 11/19/18, 5:52 PM
narciso said...: jay roach of Austin powers, and game change fame, is adapting Michael wolff's fever dream for showtime I think, there was a time most of the antiwar films were funded by dubai's film production arm, anapurna participant films, but they are on the right side now, hence that Moroccan diplomat, tried to hack the ambassador's emails, and mueller is going after them too,; 11/19/18, 5:56 PM
narciso said...: this is the other prong of the assault,

https://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/2018/11/al-qaeda-linked-operations-room-continues-to-attack-assad-regime.php; 11/19/18, 6:13 PM
cronus titan said...: Dick CHeney has been gone 10 years and he still live rent-free in their heads. THey must really believe that if HE were here, he'd consume the progressives with fireballs from his eyes, and bolts of lightning from his arse.; 11/19/18, 6:14 PM
narciso said...: yes he is ras al ghul, in their mythology, remember in this scrum it was cheney and addington vs. fitz comey mueller and goldsmith, all the deep state players, we see with different place settings 15 years later,; 11/19/18, 6:27 PM
n.n said...: The last war before Obama's Libya, Syria, Ukraine, Somalia, Niger, Egypt, Iraq (again), Afghanistan (again), etc., the progress of diversity (e.g. anti-nativism), and global "immigration reform".; 11/19/18, 6:29 PM
gadfly said...: "... the front door to the White House is wide open. There's deer and dogs and hyenas running around. And this guy is like an orangutan just throwing shit around. But Cheney was the grand master who finished the deal. Donald Trump has no belief system. So I would take the hyenas, the random wild animals running through the White House over Cheney any day of the week. If Cheney had stayed in office — let's say we didn't have term limits, and he was able to go another four, eight years — they would have invaded Iran."

And for all the Trump negatives cited above ... we may yet see the invasion of Iran under Trump, especially with neocon John Bolton as National Security Advisor and Trump's emotional decisions. Mental sickness is far more dangerous than Dick Cheney's bad ticker and his disciplined decision-making. Perusing "Angler " has convinced me that Cheney worked hard gathering pertinent facts every day to make the right decisions while Trump works two hours a day carrying out the perfunctory meets and greets of the office of president.; 11/19/18, 6:41 PM
Achilles said...: Drago said...
There are some of us recall watching in real time as Saddam transferred chem weapons to Syria and a couple squadrons of aircraft and boats to Iran. The rest he buried out in the desert.

Of course, we did our own fair share of burying Iraqi weapons in the desert with our tanks outfitted with plows.

The Bush administration had a direct hand in covering up these shipments to Syria.

Why the fuck did they do that?; 11/19/18, 6:42 PM
narciso said...: speak of the devil, anapurna pictures is neck deep in this,; 11/19/18, 6:54 PM
Robert Cook said...: "Drago said...
"There are some of us recall watching in real time as Saddam transferred chem weapons to Syria and a couple squadrons of aircraft and boats to Iran. The rest he buried out in the desert."

When did this happen, and when did you witness this?; 11/19/18, 7:04 PM
Drago said...: Robert Cook: "When did this happen, and when did you witness this?"

In real time.

Unlike your insane Chomsky-esque nonsense about GHWBush absconding with an SR-71 during the Carter Presidency and flitting off to Paris to meet with the Ayatollah's reps to work out the "keep hostages hostage longer" make believer deal (per Gary Sick who spawned the entire October Surprise lie that the entirety of the left bought hook, line and sinker).

The only thing sadder than that whack job theory/conspiracy are gadfly's sad little postings wherein he fails to even live up to LLR Chuck's pathetic offerings!; 11/19/18, 7:13 PM
FullMoon said...: Gadfly sez:

we may yet see the invasion of Iran under Trump, especially with neocon John Bolton as National Security Advisor and Trump's emotional decisions. Mental sickness is far more dangerous than Dick Cheney's bad ticker and his disciplined decision-making. Perusing "Angler " has convinced me that Cheney worked hard gathering pertinent facts every day to make the right decisions while Trump works two hours a day carrying out the perfunctory meets and greets of the office of president.

Then you agree best thing would be nuclear bomb. Get it ovr with in one shot, don't get bogged down again.
Any reason not to?; 11/19/18, 7:15 PM
Drago said...: Fullmoon: "Then you agree best thing would be nuclear bomb. Get it ovr with in one shot, don't get bogged down again. Any reason not to?"

You are attempting to have an adult logical dialogue with gadfly?

LOL

Wow.

This should be fun.; 11/19/18, 7:16 PM
Robert Cook said...: "Robert Cook is here defending Saddam? And he defends Iran?"

No. And no.

"Did they pay for the airliner they shot down? The terrorism they've committed? Did they reimburse Iraq for the damage caused in the 80's during the Iran/Iraq war? No? Then they don't deserve "their money" do they?"

Do you mean did we pay Iran for an Iranian passenger airliner we shot down? Have we repaid the Iraq and Afghanistan and other M.E. countries for the terrorism we have committed or sponsored?

Why would Iran reimburse Iraq for a war Iraq started, aided and abetted by the U.S., with weaponry we provided to Iraq?; 11/19/18, 7:18 PM
Rabel said...: McKay was born in 1968. His memories of the 70's might be somewhat limited.; 11/19/18, 7:20 PM
Robert Cook said...: "Robert Cook: 'When did this happen, and when did you witness this?'"

In real time.

In "real time"...when?

How did you happen to witness this? How close were you to Iraq's movement of WMD to Syria and Iran? Why would Saddam move aircraft and boats to Iran, an enemy nation?; 11/19/18, 7:24 PM
Drago said...: Robert Cook: "In "real time"...when?"

Prior to start of active hostilities.

During Strike Planning exercises.

You know, the mission stuff you pull out of the files and update as one gets closer to the "balloon going up".; 11/19/18, 7:27 PM
Drago said...: Robert "the hopeless" Cook: "Why would Saddam move aircraft and boats to Iran, an enemy nation?"

LOL

"Teheran to Seize the Planes Iraq Sent to Iran for Safety"
By YOUSSEF M. IBRAHIMJULY 31, 1992

https://www.nytimes.com/1992/07/31/world/teheran-to-seize-the-planes-iraq-sent-to-iran-for-safety.html

Try picking up something other than whatever Chomsky is writing sometimes Cookie.; 11/19/18, 7:29 PM
narciso said...: Syria were fellow baathists certainly members of the nasquabandi among the security services or at least the salafi members of the awakening.; 11/19/18, 7:31 PM
Drago said...: Seriously Cookie, how can you pretend to know what you are talking about when you are so astonishingly ignorant of so many basic important facts about what really occurred?

Unbelievable. You come off like some dime store High School history "teacher" who simply parrots the marxist line.; 11/19/18, 7:35 PM
Robert Cook said...: Ah, so Iran expropriated these aircraft, some of them passenger airplanes, as partial compensation for the damages Iraq did in their aggressive war against Iran. The article doesn't say why or under what terms Hussein moved these plans to Iran, but it doesn't appear it was a case of Iran agreeing to hold these planes for Hussein. In short, Hussein wasn't getting these planes back for future use.

This was in 1992, as the first Gulf War was in its last stage, before Hussein had even been ordered, much less commenced, to destroy his WMD or otherwise subjected to post-war sanctions.

FAIL.; 11/19/18, 7:42 PM
Drago said...: Cookie, that is a very very funny fall back position.

But then, its all you've got, isn't it?

Cookie: "This was in 1992"

No, it wasn't. Saddam sent the aircraft and boats over during the active hostility phase in early 1991.

But when one is as big a dummy as Cookie, why not just keep getting it all wrong?

LOL

#MarxistDoubleFail; 11/19/18, 7:47 PM
Drago said...: What's funny is 15 minutes ago Cookie had no idea the transfer of assets from Iraq to Iran had even occurred.

In fact, the mere mention of it astonished him as an unbelievable and unlikely event.

15 minutes later he is now an "expert" on these events.

LOL

Too, too funny. Very Inga-like.; 11/19/18, 7:49 PM
Drago said...: Perhaps someday I'll tell you about the small flotilla of Iraqi boats that were making a midnight run around Bubiyan Island trying to make it to Iran.

They didn't make it.; 11/19/18, 7:57 PM
Robert Cook said...: "No, it wasn't. Saddam sent the aircraft and boats over during the active hostility phase in early 1991."

Even worse for your argument. You said these transfers occurred "prior to the start of active hostilities," (by which you mean our unwarranted and unprovoked illegal invasion), "during strike planning exercises" (for our unwarranted, unprovoked, illegal invasion).

That it happened in 1991 shows that this was not Hussein trying to "hide" weapons from us after he had been ordered to destroy them, as he had not yet been ordered to do so. Iran took the planes, he wasn't getting them back, so they were not available to him to destroy when when he was destroying the weapons he had been ordered to destroy. The timeline destroys your entire claim.

FAIL.

(Is it you or Birkel who is apparently a high school history teacher? If it is you, I pity the misinformation your students are receiving. They might as well be going to school in Texas!); 11/19/18, 7:57 PM
narciso said...: Reading comprehension isn't his strong suit, he used the 1991 event as an analogy.; 11/19/18, 8:00 PM
Robert Cook said...: "What's funny is 15 minutes ago Cookie had no idea the transfer of assets from Iraq to Iran had even occurred.

"In fact, the mere mention of it astonished him as an unbelievable and unlikely event.

"15 minutes later he is now an "expert" on these events."

No, I don't claim expertise. I just read what you provided. It told me your claims are wrong. You can understand my ignorance, given that I thought you were claiming to have seen Hussein transfer this material prior to the start of the second Gulf War in 2003, as a means of hiding weapons he had been ordered to destroy...which had not yet occurred when these planes were moved. Your own facts impeach your claims.

FAIL.; 11/19/18, 8:01 PM
Drago said...: Cookie: "That it happened in 1991 shows that this was not Hussein trying to "hide" weapons from us after he had been ordered to destroy them, as he had not yet been ordered to do so"

LOL

A virtual Strawman ARMY!!!

No one claimed saddam was hiding aircraft or naval asset transfers to Iran during the latter part of the active '91 hostilities.

Saddam shipped out his chem weapons prior to the active hostilities in '91 after Bush stupidly made it clear we were going un but delayed the ops because the Turks balked at allowing a third duvision'pincer attack from their territory.

Giving saddam all the time he needed to run convoy after convoy to Syria pre-combat.

What the hell does 2004 era events have to do with that.

LOL; 11/19/18, 8:20 PM
Drago said...: Looks our Marxist pal is rewriting history on the fly.

In the future comrade, why dont you leave that to your marxist betters who are more competent at doing that?; 11/19/18, 8:22 PM
narciso said...: Did the fourth Id delayed deployment really
make that much of a different on the long run; 11/19/18, 8:29 PM
Drago said...: Narciso: "Did the fourth Id delayed deployment really make that much of a different on the long run?"

Probably not, but what General Staff is going to argue against more resources to execute a large scale attack?; 11/19/18, 8:31 PM
Robert Cook said...: ”No one claimed saddam was hiding aircraft or naval asset transfers to Iran during the latter part of the active '91 hostilities.”

From the article you linked to:

”Iran has decided to expropriate 132 military and civilian Iraqi planes that sought refuge in several Iranian cities in the final phase of the Persian Gulf war to escape destruction at the hands of allied forces last year,Saudi and Kuwaiti officials here say.”; 11/19/18, 8:33 PM
Drago said...: Yes Cookie, the "final phase of the Persian Gulf war" refers to the active hostilities phase.

Which is what I have been saying.

Not to be confused with actions saddam took PRIOR to active hostilities with material transfers to Syria.

LOL

You cannot possibly be this dense.; 11/19/18, 8:36 PM
Robert Cook said...: That is not at all what you have been saying.; 11/19/18, 8:50 PM
Robert Cook said...: Plus, the claims were that Hussein transferred weapons prior to the 2003 war, not back in 1991.; 11/19/18, 8:56 PM
Rick said...: Robert Cook said...
How did you happen to witness this?

Note the standard Cook uses to challenge what he doesn't like, then compare to his evidenceless assertions the Iraq justifications were deliberate lies and criminal acts. While he pretends to value facts and rationality in fact he's a conspiracy nutter.; 11/19/18, 9:01 PM
Drago said...: Robert Cook: "Plus, the claims were that Hussein transferred weapons prior to the 2003 war, not back in 1991."

What you meant to write is that additional claims of transfers to syria occurred prior to the 2003 combat period.

I am not arguing against that as why wouldnt saddam do that? He had already pulled the same thing 12 years earlier.; 11/19/18, 9:02 PM
Drago said...: Robert Cook: "That is not at all what you have been saying."

Yes, it is.; 11/19/18, 9:03 PM
Drago said...: Rick: "While he pretends to value facts and rationality in fact he's a conspiracy nutter."

Indeed.

I would bet he is completely on board with the Gary Sick/Mercury News conspiracy that the CIA was running drugs into the US (a commie lie meant to undermine our Central American policy of fighting Cookies commies.

And dont get me started in TailWind; 11/19/18, 9:06 PM
Robert Cook said...: Of course the CIA was running drugs.; 11/19/18, 9:27 PM
Drago said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 11/19/18, 9:40 PM
Drago said...: As expected cookie.

There is literally not a single lefty conspiracy theory cookie doesnt buy into.

Lets try this one: Cookie do you believe GWBush knew of the attack on 9-11 and let it happen on purpose?

(This one, along with the lefty conspiracy theory that GWBush had the twin towers blown up (an inside job) are the 2 theories that identify the most lunatic of marxist lefties); 11/19/18, 9:40 PM
Original Mike said...: ”Lets try this one: Cookie do you believe GWBush knew of the attack on 9-11 and let it happen on purpose?”

Based on a discussion from several year back, he does believe it.; 11/19/18, 10:34 PM
Paul said...: While I respect Cheney quite a bit, still Cheney shot a fellow hunter and so far Trump has not. I might be fired but not fired upon.

And yes, Trump wins, even when he loses. And thank God we didn't invade Iran.. we still haven't won in Afghanistan.; 11/19/18, 10:44 PM
narciso said...: That was five years in, Iran was a much harder but to crack with twice the population of iraq, with a full air and missile complement.; 11/19/18, 11:14 PM
Ray - SoCal said...: The chance of Trump invading anyone is zero. He sees the downside of what happened inAghanistan, Iraq, and Libya.

It took a huge disaster, 9-11, to make a us invasion politically feasible.

And we are still fighting in Afghanistan, with no path I see to victory for the us. I hope this changes.

9-11 seems to have changed how Cheney viewed the world.; 11/19/18, 11:36 PM
narciso said...: William dalrymple In his belabored account of the first Afghan war. Makes broad comparisons to Iraq war.8; 11/19/18, 11:44 PM
Known Unknown said...: "Like we were rolling into the '70s, and poverty was at an all-time low."

i.e. more people were poor.; 11/20/18, 12:40 AM
DEEBEE said...: Did not know Adams brain is Iran. Dick definitely tarried.; 11/20/18, 4:04 AM
JAORE said...: " My guess is..."
- R. Cook

We know.; 11/20/18, 5:30 AM
Robert Cook said...: "Lets try this one: Cookie do you believe GWBush knew of the attack on 9-11 and let it happen on purpose?"

No. But his administration did largely disregard the Clinton administration's warnings of how serious a threat bin Laden and Islamic terrorism might be.; 11/20/18, 6:59 AM
Robert Cook said...: "Based on a discussion from several year back, he does believe it."

Really? What did I say?; 11/20/18, 7:01 AM
Ankita Singh said...: I really like this awesome post. This is great and awesome post.
https://www.bharattaxi.com; 11/21/18, 3:31 AM
Drago said...: Cookie: "No. But his administration did largely disregard the Clinton administration's warnings of how serious a threat bin Laden and Islamic terrorism might be."

Another sad lefty lie offered up to explain away the "Gorelick Wall" and other Clintonian nonsense.

Heres the extent of the Clinton Admin's warning that the Bush admin had to work with: Bin Laden determined to attack US

Well gee whiz, if that isnt actionable intelligence I dont know what is!!

LOL; 12/7/18, 3:27 PM