From "As May’s Government Teeters Over Brexit, Trump Gives It a Shove" (NYT). The Sun article is here.
ADDED: Also in the NYT, "Boris Johnson, Donald Trump and the Rise of Radical Incompetence/Like America’s president, Brexiteers resent the very idea of governing as complex and based in facts," by William Davies (who has a forthcoming boook titled "Nervous States: How Feelings Took Over the World"):
A common thread linking “hard” Brexiteers to nationalists across the globe is that they resent the very idea of governing as a complex, modern, fact-based set of activities that requires technical expertise and permanent officials. Soon after entering the White House as President Trump’s chief strategist, Steve Bannon expressed hope that the newly appointed cabinet would achieve the “deconstruction of the administrative state.” In Europe, the European Commission — which has copious governmental capacity, but scant sovereignty — is an obvious target for nationalists such as Prime Minister Viktor Orbán of Hungary....
What happens if sections of the news media, the political classes and the public insist that only sovereignty matters and that the complexities of governing are a lie invented by liberal elites? For one thing, it gives rise to celebrity populists, personified by Mr. Trump, whose inability to engage patiently or intelligently with policy issues makes it possible to sustain the fantasy that governing is simple....
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58 comments:
I was surprised at how even-handed the Sun was in their treatment of Trump’s interview.
A little honesty makes all the right people scream.
At least the NYT headline is accurate.
PC really is a huge unnoticed power play, is what Trump points out.
Trump is trying to help May keep her job. The odd thing here is that he is putting his advice into the public domain.
If you were to go for advantageous deals first, you'd notice PC is always against you.
Trump is right again.
Uh oh, he said it out loud.
I think by now we know that Trump is right, Mrs. May is a miserable loser. She failed her country.
“I was cutting a ribbon for the opening of Turnberry — you know they totally did a whole renovation, it is beautiful....I said, ‘Brexit will happen"
What a salesman!
But he added: “I think what has happened to Europe is a shame. Allowing the immigration to take place in Europe is a shame. I think it changed the fabric of Europe and, unless you act very quickly, it’s never going to be what it was and I don’t mean that in a positive way. So I think allowing millions and millions of people to come into Europe is very, very sad. I think you are losing your culture. Look around. You go through certain areas that didn’t exist ten or 15 years ago.”
...although from The Sun's formatting, it's hard to tell if those sentences were really uttered sequentially, or cherry-picked from different parts of the interview.
Trump being a pro democracy populist mentions in public that the English population won their demanded Referendum to leave the German run EU Superstate. They won it 25 months ago. Since then Farage was thrown out and May was chosen as PM by the losing elite Remainers to be their foot dragging pretense of a deal maker to leave with or without the EU's permission. She she just surrendered British sovreignty back to the European Superstate.
And that is all supposed to be Trump's fault? No, it was Nigel Farage's fault and everybody knows it. The Churchilian moment of May 1940 is replaying itself. So Trump suggests no surrender to Germany.
If May remains in the EU common market scheme, she really can't enter into a separate trade agreement with the US, whether Trump is willing or not. All Trump is really doing is pointing out to her that her choice lies either with the US or the EU on trade, but not both.
Per the daily mail comments, what Trump said was spot on and very popular.
Looking at the best rated comments is usually an easy wage to gauge popular reaction, but sometimes trolls.
Isn't it fun having a president who isn't your typical mush mouth politician with the personality of a funeral director?
If Trump were a British citizen he mught be facing jail and a neighboring cell to Tommy.
Nah. I've heard that Europeans don't respect Trump and don't care what he says.
I saw nothing fact based about Strzok yesterday, nor do I consider him a technical expert; so yeah, I reject him.
And don't forget, peasants, elites cost money. Lots of money. And they deserve it because you worms are not able to govern yourself.
"Radical Incompetence" actually fits Obama much better than Trump. Trump has been a incredibly effective President, standing up to extreme resistance Obama never had.
I really don't blame May. She was a Remainer before the Brexit vote, and after. She was charged with executing Brexit when she became PM. She said she would carry out the will of the people, but her heart isn't in it.
It would be like getting full funding for Trump's wall, then electing a democrat to build it.
What happens if sections of the news media, the political classes and the public insist that only sovereignty matters and that the complexities of governing are a lie invented by liberal elites?
The truth will set us free?
I’m getting so tired of the smug lectures about “fact-based” and “complex” and “expertise” and so on. I understand how people can feel repulsed by Trump on a gut level; I felt very much that way a couple years ago (and still do to a degree). But you know what? Despite his weirdness, despite the Democratic freakout, despite an insanely hostile media, despite the Russia investigation, etc., things are working out pretty well for the United States.
I didn’t even vote for Trump, but I still feel condescended to by these lectures because I don’t hate Trump with every fiber of my being. I try to be objective about him. I try to give him a chance. I try to remind myself that I don’t have all the answers and my political beliefs are just that, beliefs.
Listening to Questions for the Prime Minister, I gather that Theresa May's claim to fame is that she can run a semi-socialist government in Britain better than Labour can.
That is a low bar.
BDNYC, I believe there are many just like you. Count me one.
You do have to say what happens to old contracts that had assumed european courts would govern disputes.
May let the Remainers construct the exit plan. I was watching a BBC or ITV series about the behind-the-scenes at the negotiations, and the Brexiteers hardly got a chance to speak. I couldn't make it through a single episode.
UKIP will be the dominant political party in the UK by 2030. The old guard Tory-Liberal majority is utterly incapable of governing, or utterly unwilling to govern.
Trump is right, again. His bilateral trade deals with Britain were premised on Britain’s adherence to Brexit. So when the Brits tried to cheat, Trump called them out.
Britain can deal with the Democrats like they did during the American Civil War.
"The odd thing here is that he is putting his advice into the public domain."
Competing interests between countries. Who would have thought? I thought it was all backslapping and hugging going on behind those closed doors all these years. Can't we just get along? The horror!
The silliest criticism of Trump is that he is not transparent. (Other than hiding the fact that he is Putin's puppet of course).
What happens if sections of the news media, the political classes and the public insist that only sovereignty matters and that the complexities of governing are a lie invented by liberal elites?
The complexities of governing are related to the complexity of what’s being governed. If the entity grows too complex, it outstrips the ability of the govenrment to effectively govern.
Were our elites truly elite they’d be educated in basic, well-known principles such as these.
Local governments and the reduction of the regulatory state are efforts to restore government’s ability to properly function. It’s those who believe a small group of people can run an increasingly complex planet who are out to destroy it.
Progs very adamant that we shut up and let our betters permanently run things. People like Maxine Waters, Jimmy Comey, Petey Strzok, Billy Kristol, and Oma and Opa Clinton.
Change is hard when you're a wallowing bureaucrat and the media who support what they do. Apparently lashing out and using words like incompetence makes you feel better.
A common thread linking “hard” Brexiteers to nationalists across the globe is that they resent the very idea of governing as a complex, modern, fact-based set of activities that requires technical expertise and permanent officials.
This sort of pronouncement re what's allegedly going on in the heads of "Brexiteers" and "nationalists" is a "common thread" among globalist fantasists.
"They are simple-minded." "They don't respect expertise." "They are black-and-white thinkers who don't understand complexity and nuance."
This is self-justifying nonsense. Put aside for now the irony of people whose world view appears to be about as profound as a Coca-Cola commercial criticizing the rest of humanity about their lack of understanding of the "complex, modern, and fact-based". What the simple-minded yokels don't respect is 1) "experts" actively working against the yokels' interests, and 2) "experts" without expertise. The simple-minded folk expect some level of competence. They're not interested in "nuancing" their way into accepting both incompetence and corruption in their rulers. (You can get away with some level of corruption only as long as you exhibit a reasonable level of competence. Being both corrupt and incompetent ain't gonna fly for long.)
In the end, claims to elite status must be justified by actually, you know, ruling wisely and competently *in the interests of the people over whom you are claiming the right to govern*.
Yelling about how much smarter you are than the yokels and waving your credentials around, while instigating, presiding over, and doubling down on one disaster after another, is not usually the path to earning respect for your "expertise".
If these clowns were anywhere near as competent and expert at governing complex, modern societies as they claim to be (and with such ludicrous self-satisfaction), the peasants wouldn't be revolting. But I guess it's in the nature of things that a ruling caste is always the last to notice that it's lost the mandate of heaven.
May is having to deal with financial people who are the London rich.
They are not interested in British history or much other than their money.
Just like San Francisco and New York.
So Trump now says that his interview with The Sun is “fake news”?!?
If I understand Trump — never an easy thing to do — he is saying that The Sun left out some positive and flattering things that he said about Prime Minister May. And that White House staff have their own recording. What a weird, deflective claim! Trump can’t back off what he said on the Sun’s recording.
I want the White House’s audio recording. Maybe there is some merit to what Trump is saying. But it seems doubtful. Anyway, this is one of those things like “shithole countries” where I want a recording. I want Trump held to his own words and claims. Somebody is lying and I want to know who.
Somebody is lying and I want to know who.
Look in the mirror. You already stipulated that your job is to lie about Trump and project everything in the worst light. No take backs!
I want the White House’s audio recording. Maybe there is some merit to what Trump is saying. But it seems doubtful. Anyway, this is one of those things like “shithole countries” where I want a recording. I want Trump held to his own words and claims. Somebody is lying and I want to know who.
I recommend holding your breath and stamping your feet. If that doesn't work you could try throwing yourself to the floor and then roll around while screaming.
Blogger Ralph L said...
“I was cutting a ribbon for the opening of Turnberry — you know they totally did a whole renovation, it is beautiful....I said, ‘Brexit will happen"
What a salesman!
Wait! What kind of weird bullshit is that?!?
Trump got to Turnberry on a Friday, for a weekend opening. And the Brexit vote happened on the Thursday; the day before he got there.
Is Trump saying that he “predicted” the vote AFTER it happened?
I think the guy has s slightly psychotic quality.
Darrell I never ever wrote that my job was to lie about Trump. Lying about Trump is exactly what I don’t want to do. I want Trumpism to be killed, by nothing other than, or apart from, the truth. I want Trump to be derailed by truths so simple and direct that no one — especially the most ardent Trump cultists — can deny them.
There's a big difference between needing bureaucrats and experts to carry out a policy and having them decide what the policy is. Trump has indeed been terrible about the first. But the "permanent government" and its defenders have been terrible about the second.
Darrell I never ever wrote that my job was to lie about Trump
Sure you did. "Twisting words" is lying. Taking things out of context is lying. Repeating a story that was clearly marked as pure speculation in New York Magazine about Trump getting that Playboy Centerfold pregnant and ordering her to have an abortion (all attributed to another billionaire--Elliott Broidy.) Talking shit about Barron is lying. Etc.
I don't save every one of your comments, but if you want me to reproduce your Dept. of Black People comment, I will certainly oblige.
Blogger pacwest said...
The silliest criticism of Trump is that he is not transparent. (Other than hiding the fact that he is Putin's puppet of course).
Yes; that is the silliest criticism of Trump.
At the same time, the most serious criticism of Trump is that he is untruthful, unreliable, self-interested and otherwise lacking in any governing ideology.
And Trump continues to prove that criticism to be remarkably valid.
A common thread linking “hard” Brexiteers to nationalists across the globe is that they resent the very idea of governing as a complex, modern, fact-based set of activities that requires technical expertise and permanent officials.
What Mr. Davies & his ilk never want to admit is possible is that governing has become so complicated that even the bureaucratic elite are stymied by its complexity. They think they are doing something because they go through the procedural motions, just like they should, but from the viewpoint of the electorate, things don't change. Except, of course, that after 30 years of service this bureaucratic elite gets to retire with a pension at the electorate's expense.
The fact that the bureaucratic elite never deliver to anyone except themselves does much to set the stage for someone like Trump who stomps in, sword in hand, to cut the Gordian Knot. I won't be surprised if, world-wise, some uglier characters arise that start chopping more than knots.
and otherwise lacking in any governing ideology.
And yet, all his actions are spot on--more so even than Ronald Reagan in the short time he's been President. The only thing I would have done that he didn't, is get rid of all the Obama barnacles. At the FBI. At the DOJ. Everywhere. And I would have kicked Paul Ryan in the nuts and Jeff Sessions in the ass to wake him up.
Yeah, its all complex. Like "Immigration is always good" and "Don't renegotiate those trade deals, they're perfect!"
Super-complex.
Reagan said:
There are simple answers. Just no easy ones.
Or another man said:
Everything in war is simple, but the simplest thing is difficult.
"otherwise lacking in any governing ideology."
I think the thing you are missing here is that he is willing to be influenced by the views of those around him (and I'm not downplaying the danger inherent in that). Not that much of his 'ideology' is rooted in long held principle, other than using what he views as common sense solutions gained through a long business career. Obviously ymmv as to how sensible his common sense is. But most of what he is saying and doing are not new ideas. The presentation is different. I'll give you that.
A common sense revolution led by a madman.
If this is incompetence I’ll take some more, please.
“ADDED: Also in the NYT, ‘Boris Johnson, Donald Trump and the Rise of Radical Incompetence/Like America’s president, Brexiteers resent the very idea of governing as complex and based in facts,’ by William Davies (who has a forthcoming boook titled ‘Nervous States: How Feelings Took Over the World’)”
That’s rich. Progressivism is all about feelings.
A common thread linking “hard” Brexiteers to nationalists across the globe is that they resent the very idea of governing as a complex, modern, fact-based set of activities that requires technical expertise and permanent officials.
Otherwise known as save my job.
I thought the tv show Mr. Prime Minister covered all this.
OTOH, whose facts are we using? If you can’t agree on “the facts” you’ll never agree.
BTW the lifers get a lot wrong. KISS Principle should be mandatory. Also get out of my way principle.
Brexit will happen"
May said it again today Brexit is happening.
You’re the one who took that comment out of context. Isn’t that what they’re working on?
And the oooh look is EU we will have a special trade deal with the US which firms up May.
They are simple-minded." "They don't respect expertise." "They are black-and-white thinkers who don't understand complexity and nuance."
Dems toss out that nuance excuse when they lose, ive read or heard it often enuf over the years in post-election coverage. They forgot to add voting against your own self-interest.
Brexit it’s like Britain Never EVAH governed itself. It’s just too too horrific to think about.
"A sky poll states more than half the people suggests Trump was right to air his views on British Government and Brexit..."
I didn’t even vote for Trump, but I still feel condescended to by these lectures because I don’t hate Trump with every fiber of my being.
Yep.
I've gone from agnostic to support. Not only is he doing things I'd like him to do, he's exposing the left as arrogant, deranged assholes to regular Americans who don't pay much attention to politics.
Generally if someone tells me it's too complicated to explain I conclude that they don't understand it. Not understanding something is not blameworthy, many things are beyond understanding including most complex human interactions that involve large numbers of people. Insisting that you know what's best when you don't understand something and that anyone who disagrees is an idiot is pretty obnoxious.
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