[Richard Ned] Lebow was told to write an "unequivocal apology" to [Simona] Sharoni and submit a written copy by May 15 to the... executive committee [of the International Studies Association]. The apology should focus on Lebow’s actions, rather than Sharoni’s perceptions of them, it said, adding that if he failed to comply, the executive committee would consider appropriate sanctions.ADDED: I made a new tag: elevators. It was a lot of work to go back and add it to everything in the archive. Now, there are 44 posts with that tag. There's a lot of variety: architecture, survival, Prince, the "elevator pitch." But a lot of those posts are like this new one: men using the enforced captivity to interact with a woman. An elevator is an opportunity to talk, to touch, to intimidate, to imagine getting access to a woman's hotel room. Do you remember the Rebecca Watson incident?
Lebow refused. He also sent an email to colleagues calling his treatment "a horrifying and chilling example of political correctness" that "encourages others to censor their remarks for fear of retribution." In an email to The Chronicle on Sunday, Lebow said he made the joke "to relieve the slight claustrophobia I felt in such a crowded lift."
He said it was a man, not a woman, who asked for the floors and that the other men in the elevator were not his "buddies" as she had described them. He wasn’t smiling, he said, and she wouldn’t have known if he was because he was standing in the back and she was in front of him....
Sharoni told The Chronicle that the real chilling effect will be against people who experience and report sexual harassment. "For decades, women and other marginalized groups in the academy had to put up with white men who decided what counts as a violation and what is ‘frivolous,’" she wrote in an email. "As someone who has dedicated her life to confronting sexism (and other forms of discrimination and oppression) in academic spaces, I cannot and will not remain silent when misogyny is at play."...
"Personally, I can understand why someone hearing the elevator remark would take offense," [said Craig N. Murphy, a professor of political science at Wellesley College and a former president of the International Studies Association]. "Sure, it’s an old joke, one my father used to repeat in the 1960s, maybe even into the early 1970s, which was when he started to learn about what he called ‘male chauvinism,’" Murphy wrote. "I still tell some of my dad’s stupid jokes, and I hope I’d be gracious if someone pointed out that, as a result, I’d mindlessly said something offensive. I hope that, in time, Ned will see it that way."
May 7, 2018
When the women's studies professor offers to push the elevator button for you and you ask for the "women's lingerie department."
This really happened in an elevator at a San Francisco Hilton where an academic conference was going on. And the man who thought he could blurt out what is an old wisecrack was a political theory professor. He did not get shrugged off as pathetically old and out of step. He got taken to task, The Chronicle of Higher Education reports, and it was so brutal that he's provoked to fight back:
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180 comments:
The protecting women with real complaints is a cop-out.
The correct response is I'll make any damn joke I want.
Jokesters see incongruity as fun. That would be good for women moving into nontraditional jobs.
You need more men amused by women.
What a horrible, bizarre academic environment Prof. Althouse's generation has left us!
She should be required to wear a name tag that says, "Danger! Women' studies professor.
“The correct response is I'll make any damn joke I want.”
Elevator Feminist: What floor?
Male Elevator Rider: That’s Not Funny
Humorless women expand the arena for jokes.
I wonder how many this particular crocodile had eaten before it got around to him ?
I wonder which word triggered her? Was it "ladies" or "lingerie"? What if he had simply said "lingerie" with "4th floor"? Is it ok to say "hello, ladies" to a group of female academics?
Explain to the women's studies department, and all interested, that jokes are a domestication of hostility.
It's already domesticated. You can't improve it further.
That wisecrack is so old, I haven't heard of it.
* * *
For a moment I seriously wondered if the convention was in the upper floor of an urban mall and the guy really was going to the lingerie department.
Pushing buttons- White Men, Male Chauvinists, Feminists, Women's Studies Professors, Wellesley College, San Francisco, Claustrophobia, Dad's, Sanctions, Sexism, Misogyny, Retribution, 1960's... Buttons!
Or did he say "women's lingerie"? The article uses both phrases. "Women's lingerie" doesn't roll off the tongue like "lady's lingerie".
Paste a women's lingerie label on the conference floor buttons in all the elevators.
She should be required to wear a name tag that says, "Danger! Women' studies professor."
She should be required to wear an orange jumpsuit. "Women's Studies" professors are by definition frauds and mountebanks.
The apology should focus on Lebow’s actions, rather than Sharoni’s perceptions of them, it said,
Fake apologies not allowed.
Maybe he was expressing a subconscious desire to wear ladies' lingerie and now she's shaming and othering him over it.
Toxic femininity.
When someone is rude you have 3 options:
1. address the issue with the person directly and immediately
2. find the person later and address it directly
3. forget it
The option of reporting the offender to the authorities is only open to children less than 8 years old, and the proper response form any adult is to tell them to deal with it and probably get over it. When adults run to the authorities for bad words we have the Stasi.
Lebow's action, by itself, is to have joked and so is not offensive. There is nothing to apologize for absent Sharoni's perceptions of the joke. Thus the guy can't win. Good on him for refusing.
Is Lebow allowed to be offended by her taking offense at his innocently offered joke?
-sw
So, did she press the button or didn't she ?
He should be required to plead guilty, and then stand trial so all the world can hear him confess his crimes against humanity.
It's the Stalinist way.
Key word: white.
Not to get all ad feminem, but Sharoni teaches at that Athens of the North, Plattsburgh, NY.
Good for him. I’m even more impressed that decades of political correctness hadn’t completely erased the adolescent imp that lies dormant in all of us, waiting to blurt out something, perhaps not particularly funny, but irrepressible given the right prompt. I’ve been waiting 30 years for someone to say “It’s a foul day to be abroad” to me.
Sue for libel. She purposefully lied about what he did to harm his reputation.
What if he was gay, serious, and shopping for himself?
"I hope I’d be gracious if someone pointed out that, as a result, I’d mindlessly said something offensive. I hope that, in time, Ned will see it that way."
But of course the point is that someone didn't just "point out" someone had said something offensive. She went into SJW mode to extract a public apology, on pain of institutional sanctions.
There is little moral difference between most women's studies today and a "The Problem With Jews - 101" in a 1939 German university.
Do they have a men's lingerie department?
Mistress Sharoni entered the elevator. So far the conference had been a bust. Dom Gertrude had put out a paper which undercut one she was working on, Frau Blucher said a perfectly catty thing, none of the male attendees was in any way interesting enough to flirt with (but they never were...why aren't there more Chris Hemsworths in Academia and Women Conferences).
She wedged herself into the full elevator, wondering at how horribly aromatic this car full of male swine would turn out to be.
"Which floor?"
"Women's Lingerie."
Her mouth opened...then smiled. Tightly clenching her eyes, she fought to stop the tears of joy. At last...at LAST Finally, FINALLY, where life had left her shorted out in the looks department, in any kind of academic excellence, in any style of fiscal success, leaving her only the dregs of bullying young female students...at LAST! She would have her Fifteen Minutes of Outraged Fame! She'd be able to dine on this story for months and have something to write about for the next ten years!
She purred as she asked 'What did you say?"
Anything with "Studies" in the name is radioactive anyway. Stay far away.
Oso said: "Or did he say "women's lingerie"? The article uses both phrases. "Women's lingerie" doesn't roll off the tongue like "lady's lingerie".
Oso, she is no lady!
Maybe I would have apologized if she complained that the joke wasn’t funny. But then I think I’d be apologizing to the rest of the crowd in the elevator, not the “studies professor.” Maybe he should have written the letter, and apologized for the poor joke, and offerred a number of better/funnier ones that he’d be sure to use in the future?”
Lebow wins one: He refuses to apologize.
Lebow loses one: He attempts to explain it away.
How many Feminists does it take to laugh at a joke?
Still waiting for the first one...
In reading this, i couldn't help but feel sorry for Meade. He has to put up with this crap every day.
FIDO @8:54 has it down. Well done, sir.
And Michael K: She should be required to wear a name tag that says, "Danger! Women' studies professor.
Elevator Pitch Meets Elevator Bitch
He's a professor of political theory. She's a professor of women's and gender studies. They should be chained together and thrown from a helicopter over the sea. Problem solved!
When the women's studies professor offers to push the elevator button for you it's already too late. There is no right answer.
Another article from the same publication;
"Are You in a BS Job? In Academe, You’re Hardly Alone"
Somewhere, in Victorian heaven, Margaret Dumont is smiling. The wiseguy Groucho gets his comeuppance, on Marx's birthday.
This makes me day! I'm so happy!
I can't believe they attempted to dictate to him not only that he write an apology but the actual tone and content of it. The ONLY response to that is a resounding FUCK OFF.
What's the difference between being annoyed and being offended? If you have to ask, you don't belong in Women's Studies.
Having clicked the link and viewed the profile photos, I guarantee you he wasn’t perving on the elderly women’s studies professor. He probably didn’t even notice her, or if he did he might have thought her a short old man who would appreciate his old fashioned joke.
Good boy, FIDO, good boy. Here's a treat.
There's a word for the last living animal in an otherwise extinct species, but I forget what it is.
Maybe I am slow on the uptake, but why is that joke offensive. I grew up in New York City and on 34th Street there was the "World's Largest Department Store", Macys'. They had commercial elevators with real operators they would open and close the door for the customers. Because there were so many people getting on they would not ask for the floor you wanted but instead announce for each floor the specific departments. They actually announced, fourth floor women's lingerie, and so on. The joke was that you were pretending to be in or the operator of the Macy's elevator, when you were actually in a small elevator with one or two people. The joke had nothing to do with women, per se.
Okay, I plead no-coffee-yet, but I didn’t get the joke. I had to follow the link to recognize it was an old male who told it. Ah, I see!
Got me thinking, what might be funnier today?
• “Infectious Diseases Department, please.”
• “Interplanetary Travel Department” (while I rubbed my eyes adjusting my second eyelid)
At least those might have garnered (sorry) him more room on the elevator.
The option of reporting the offender to the authorities is only open to children less than 8 years old, and the proper response form any adult is to tell them to deal with it and probably get over it. When adults run to the authorities for bad words we have the Stasi.
I remember, I think it was in Crime and Punishment, reading a scene were two men who are strangers to each other get in an argument on the street and one threatens to call the police on the other one for insulting him. At the time I remember thinking, "thank God that could never happen in the US."
I am eagerly awaiting the publication of the feminist's guide to appropriate jokes. Probably won't be a very big book.
But a lot of those posts are like this new one: men using the enforced captivity to interact with a woman.
Was he using enforced captivity to interact with a woman? Do you have any reason to believe that he would not have told the same joke if there were only men in the elevator?
This only happened because the "offender" was an academic and it took place in an academic environment. Shows you what the power roles are in that environment, doesn't it?
In the real world the "offender" would simply shrug and tell her not to get her panties in a bunch.
There is a hell.
It’s being stuck eternally in an elevator with a women’s studies feminist.
Enforced reading of these fucking idiot Marxist feminist posts from Althouse would be Purgatory
Althouse and her comrades are committed to proving that the female stereotype is true. Nothing stops the bitching. In fact, Althouse seems committed to proving that misogyny is a pretty good idea..
"Sharoni, who wrote in her complaint that she has experienced sexual harassment in academe in the past and was shaken by the incident,"
Shaken, not stirred. As mixed by Octopussy.
"The joke had nothing to do with women, per se."
Exactly. Much less intimidating or harassing a woman on the elevator. It is easy to imagine him saying the same thing in a elevator full of men.. The humor is invoking the old Macy's department store elevators, coupled with the cheap thrill of a man looking at lingerie draped on mannequins.
The women Studies professor (and the International Studies executives) would want him punished just for saying it, whether or not any actual woman heard him say it.
So what was supposed to be the misogynistic part of the comment?
1) Was the inference supposed to be that the man thought the woman was an elevator operator;
2) was it supposedly offensive for him to ask anyone which floor the lingerie department was on;
3) was it supposedly offensive to assume that by virtue of being a woman, one would be more likely to know what floor the lingerie department was on;
4) was it supposedly transphobic to say ladies or women’s lingerie;
5) or what?
Gahrie said...
I am eagerly awaiting the publication of the feminist's guide to appropriate jokes. Probably won't be a very big book.
That's not funny
This happened off campus in a hotel elevator...what business is it of the school?
Elevator Pitch Meets Elevator Bitch
Nicely done.
>>"As someone who has dedicated her life to confronting sexism (and other forms of discrimination and oppression) in academic spaces..."
Universities are the most PC places in the US, and she's "dedicated her life" to "confronting sexism" and "oppression"?
Really? I would love to hear some examples of her "oppression" in an academic environment.
Or maybe I'm just misreading her quote completely. Perhaps her point is that an elevator is an "academic space"?
Kissinger was correct. In the academies, the fights are so vicious because the stakes are so small.
Proof that women should not be allowed to be hired into academic positions unless they can prove in advance that they have a sense of humor.
Gahrie said...
"I am eagerly awaiting the publication of the feminist's guide to appropriate jokes. Probably won't be a very big book."
Nope. But it will be very funny.
This quote is actually tells us what this is really about.
'"For decades, women and other marginalized groups in the academy had to put up with white men who decided what counts as a violation and what is ‘frivolous,’" she wrote in an email. "As someone who has dedicated her life to confronting sexism (and other forms of discrimination and oppression) in academic spaces, I cannot and will not remain silent when misogyny is at play."'
This is about who has the power to set the norms and she assumes that the norms she wants to set are the correct ones because of the identity of the people setting them. The norms were wrong when white men were defining them. They are correct now that someone other than white men are setting them. If you asked her why that was she would give some cant about oppression and list a bunch of isms. But the real reason is she has the power and wants to use it to make sure she gets to keep it. Telling people that you've been working for decades to fight sexism sounds much more selfless than telling them you've been working for decades to acquire power.
Fido at 8:54 wins the thread
Anyone else remember the story of a congressional page stepping into an elevator with Congressman Fred Grandy and saying, "Lido Deck, please"? In the story, Grandy was a real dick about it, had the kid fired. (It didn't happen.)
I Have Misplaced My Pants:
"The ONLY response to [the demand that he write an apology to specifications] is a resounding FUCK OFF."
Yes. But taking a step back, I'd have a lot more respect for Sharoni if she'd said "Oh fuck off," and been done with it.
When the women's studies professor offers to push the elevator button for you and you ask for the "women's lingerie department."
"2nd floor...
hardware, children's wear...
lady's lingerie.
Oh, good morning Mr. Tyler, going... down?"
How is a Feminist Professor like a prospective stripper?
They both want to make mountains out of molehills.
I'm here all week, folks. Tip the waitresses and try the veal.
...adding that if he failed to comply, the executive committee would consider appropriate sanctions...
And those being what? Make him walk the stairs from now on?
Thank you, Ms. Sharoni, for once again fulfilling the modern feminist's responsibility to daily provide more evidence for the belief that bitchez be crazy, and that everything that misogynists have ever said about the unfitness of women for non-domestic occupation and public life is true. Thanks a whole fucking lot.
Toxic femininity (Bill,RoT @8:33am) indeed.
(I'll leave it to the gentlemen here to express gratitude to Mr. Craig N[utless] Murphy for impugning the dignity of their own sex.)
Does this guy have tenure? So why is his response any different from Rhada the Hutt from Fresno U? "Bite me, I have tenure."
If you make it heroic to be a victim, then mentally unstable people will go out of their way to become victims.
"Sharoni, who wrote in her complaint that she has experienced sexual harassment in academe in the past and was shaken by the incident" Only someone mentally unstable could be shaken by a mild off hand joke, not directed specifically at her or another specific women, but one that indicates that men find women attractive. THE HORROR!
It must be difficult to be on the left and support college seminars on Fisting and Bondage or class room exhibitions of porn, yet be offended at a mild elevator joke.
Stupid jokes are de rigueur for men, Angel.
Tell them not to get their panties in a wad..
Mistress Sharoni should tell me about her reaction to a Mapplethorpe exhibit.
Words. A joke.
I'm glad he refused a forced apology. I stand with HIM.
This PC crap must stop. You're offended, over words that cluster to form a joke? Get over yourself.
What's the joke? He should be reprimanded for a poor sense of humor.
The real joke is you can turn on TV or look at the internet and hear/see people making dick and vagina jokes and that's OK. But a women's underwear joke is beyond the pale?
BTW, I have no sympathy for the left-wing pol-sci Prof, no doubt he would the first one to form a lynch mob and string up any of his colleges who made a joke that poked fun at liberals, Jews, blacks, Asians, gays, Hispanics, Muslims, Obama, Trump haters, Albinos, or Communists.
"As a survivor of sexual harassment in the academy, I am quite shaken by this incident," Sharoni wrote.
Survivor?
Basically, this is just Trotsky being accused by Stalin of making a counter-revolutionary remark.
She should be required to wear a name tag that says, "Danger! Women' studies professor."
LOL - love that idea.
"Survivor?"
Some, have been so offended, they actually died.
Didn't you know that?
>The norms were wrong when white men were defining them. They are correct now that someone other than white men are setting them
Exactly right. She's confronting oppression by... leading the charge to oppress someone else.
She's fine with totalitarianism, as long as she's setting the rules.
Is this Women's' Studies Professor white? If so, then she is extra offensive.
She could have engaged him a battle of wits.
But I feel she was unarmed.
"thank God that could never happen in the US."
Close, San Francisco.
Whatever happened to Rebecca Watson? She was a hoot. Did she ever come out of the closet as a Lesbian?
hard to believe the 60's sexual revolution led to this.
Lingerie is a micro aggression.
It's actually about wanting society to be her husband and worried about her feelings, the more irrational the feelings the better.
Society though doesn't care about her feelings.
timing is everything
Lucien: So what was supposed to be the misogynistic part of the comment?
Richard Ned Lebow, white male.
Sharoni, by her self-description an outrage addict, may have been hard up for a fix and leapt on anything. (Kinda like the way they say desperate coke addicts at parties would lick the mirrors the blow has been served on.) The more likely explanation is that Sharoni is just a stupid bint and got triggered by the word "lingerie".
It almost sounds like a joke
A women's study professor and a X walk into an elevator...
What's that other Dad Joke. Oh yeah:
Academic politics are so vicious because the stakes are so small
The real offense was referring to “women’s lingerie.” Why can’t men wear lingerie too? He was guilty of binary thinking, transphobia and hostility to cross-dressing. He must be cashiered.
Women's studies ignoring the elevator in the room.
Hallmark should start an "offensive joke day".
Think of all the card sales that would bring.
Bigger than the Christmas Coke marketing created.
Wait. Is there a man's lingerie department?
FIDO: Stupid jokes are de rigueur for men, Angel.
You guys need to tell Mr. Murphy he's supposed to make stupid jokes, not be one.
> Think of all the card sales that would bring.
I meant to type "garner"
You'd think elevators would be natural comedy clubs.
levis, light
floor four
garner belts
Revenge of the Pink Panther
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-s3RTKE2QV8
You guys need to tell Mr. Murphy he's supposed to make stupid jokes, not be one.
Too late. He's already a Poli Sci Professor. He is permanently enclowned.
I'd rather study under Lebow at King's College London, than study under Sharoni at Merrimack College.
For many reasons.
The woman should have voiced her displeasure to the guy and/or tell him his joke sucked. He would have been embarrassed and probably apologized.
Maybe Sharoni saw this as a chance to get some ink, and get out of Plattsburgh and into the Big Leagues. You can't make an omelet without breaking some balls.
The joke could have been said in a creepy way or a bad dad joke way where you roll your eyes and groan, depends on how well you know someone and know their personality to to see one way or the other.
I wasn't sure if I spelled "Merrimack College" correctly, and that inspired a joke, which I would like to share with you:
Q: What is the correct spelling of "Merrimack College"?
A: Who cares?
Weightlessness (apesanteur in French) is next to godliness. Can you find love on an elevator?
This song, Apesanteur, by the popular French singer, Calogero tries to answer the question.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IocBANuIb0
Where are the usual cadre of our leftist commentors? Would love to hear them defend Sharoni?
Why is it that commies and all their progeny are so bereft of a sense of humor?
Maybe it's better this way:
High School Senior: How do you spell "Merrimack College"?
High School Counselor: Who cares?
Or:
Corporate Recruiter #1: How do you spell "Merrimack College"?
Corporate Recruiter #2: Who cares?
Or there is this new take on a classic:
Here's another one:
Merrimack College Student: How many women's studies students does it take to change a lightbulb in Professor Simona Sharoni's classroom?
Merrimack College Diversity Counselor: That's not funny!
Or here is another one:
Last night, I dreamed I interviewed Professor Simona Sharoni while wearing lingerie. Why Simona Sharoni was in lingerie, and how she ever managed to find the correct department from which to purchase some, I'll never know.
Yeah, that one doesn't work so well.
Merrimack College is a Catholic affiliated school in Massachusetts - not Plattsburgh NY. Interesting that they would want her and she would be 'comfortable' plying her trade there. Cuz if there are misogynist schools out there, Catholic ones would top the list.
-sw
*Taps Microphone* Is this thing even on?
Tough crowd.
If the professor making the joke had been a gay man and was making an ironic joke about how the women's lingerie department had NO appeal to him, would it still have been purportedly harassive?
So a phrenologist and a homeopath are sitting in a bar at an academic conference, when Simona Sharoni walks in. The phrenologist turns to the homeopath and says "There goes the intellectual neighborhood"
Speaking of lingerie in academia, we have this: Cornell Student Presents Thesis Dressed in Underwear
tcrosse said...
Maybe Sharoni saw this as a chance to get some ink, and get out of Plattsburgh and into the Big Leagues.
She seems intent on proving sexism isn't particularly prevalent anymore. Trying to get someone fired over something this trivial shows if she experienced more meaningful sexism we would have heard of it. Yet we didn't.
She trampled on xis trans rights.
In the 20's, when my grandmother started working in our local department store, since deceased, the lingerie dept. was called "Foundations." She sold them so well they moved her to Ready-to-Wear.
Humorless pedantic females -- most likely unfuckable, too.
Must.Stay.Away.From.Them.
Sharoni's Wikipedia entry puts her at SUNY Plattsburgh. Sue the bastards !
Unknown said: Lingerie is a micro aggression.
Only the thongs.......
B.A.G.
Sharoni is not the only humorless one...
FIDO and I have been wearing our fingers to the nub writing jokes for the lucky, lucky commenters on this thread and not ONE thank you!
Not trolling: what part of what he said was offensive? I get that he mentioned women's undergarments and that's maybe not appropriate in a public setting with a mixed crowd (although, you know, even that seems a bit Victorian in the sense of "don't call the bottom of a table "legs" way, esp. given our SlutWalk current mores), but what about that actually causes offense? If he was talking about something he bought for his wife to a friend of his in the elevator and that was overheard, would that also be offensive? If he'd have said "women's shoes" for the floor would that have been offensive?
I'm sympathetic to the idea that people are "trapped" in elevators and some people use that social and physical restraint to engage in bad behavior. I'm sympathetic to the claim that women are more often the victims of such bad behavior and have a justifiably greater fear of being subjected to it.
I'm struggling to find what's OFFENSIVE about what this guy said, though. I understand we're not allowed to ask that and we're supposed to accept the victim's assertion of offense but I'd really like some kind of an explanation as to WHY that was offensive before agreeing that this or that punishment is just.
>Not trolling: what part of what he said was offensive?
The being a man part.
Lebow refused. He also sent an email to colleagues calling his treatment "a horrifying and chilling example of political correctness" that "encourages others to censor their remarks for fear of retribution."
Where was his outrage when this wasn't directed at him?
First they came for the alt-right white-supremacist deplorables...
Remember, a man saying "lingerie" in an elevator is horribly offensive and requires a groveling apology.
Mandatory attendance at a production of "The Vagina Monologues" is educational.
Wearing pussy hats is empowering.
Being a man is the crime. All the rest ... just minor details.
Come on, no one remembers any of the old Warner Brother's cartoons? Practically every scene with an elevator in it has a "2nd floor, lady's lingerie" gag in it.
Probably in homage to the Macy's department store, I guess. But I instantly recognized where the prof was coming from.
If it's OK for Bugs Bunny, why not anyone else? Heck, I bet this old bat would be offended by "Baseball Bugs" where Bugs Bunny is playing a game of baseball and distracts the catcher with a picture of a swimsuit model (it's a one piece, of course... this was pre-bikini).
Probably a firing offense to show that cartoon today.
She could have countered by asking him whether he prefers Olga or Bali brands of bras.
Sharoni told The Chronicle that the real chilling effect will be against people who experience and report sexual harassment. "For decades, women and other marginalized groups in the academy had to put up with white men who decided what counts as a violation and what is ‘frivolous,’" she wrote in an email. "As someone who has dedicated her life to confronting sexism (and other forms of discrimination and oppression) in academic spaces, I cannot and will not remain silent when misogyny is at play."...
Sharoni told the world that she's a whiny, humorless prig who lacks the gumption to stand up for herself when it matters, and instead goes crying to daddy to protect her from the mean man who made her sad.
Hey Sharoni, you have a problem with what someone says to you? Respond to them, right then.
Pathetic babies like her need to grow up
mockturtle said...
She could have countered by asking him whether he prefers Olga or Bali brands of bras.
5/7/18, 11:40 AM
"What's the foundation for that comment? Are you trying to be supportive?"
He tried to be clever, when a simple fart would have sufficed.
Pretty dumb joke - I would have rolled my eyes and left it at that.
A quick perusal of this stupid cunts social media post confirms everything you would have thought. Short lesbian haircut, those feminist bitch glasses, photos of cats, and of course, support for palestinian terrorism and hatred of the NFL for promoting violence.
A thoroughly disgusting and awful human being.
Re: "Survivor:"
One would think that people who were victims of violent assault, violent sexual assault, rape, or any other physical violence--and the interest and advocacy groups supporting such people--would strongly object to the watering down of the term "survivor" in that manner. Everyone alive is a survivor of some kind of hardship but conflating "taking offense" with "being physically abused/sexually assaulted/raped" only serves to water down the very real claims such real victims have on our sympathy/psychological interest or concern. Have any of those organizations ever said "Hey, stop using that term for minor bullshit like taking offense, we're using it for real hardship like recovering from major physical trauma!"
I guess that'd be wrong--feminists would prevent that and say that all psychological pain is subjective and no one other than the victim/survivor has any right to define or even discuss the damage done by anything. Seems pretty shitty, though.
Interesting that Sharoni, like the leftmedia, invokes the support of the ghost army: here the anonymous woman in the elevator who was also, allegedly, (personally) offended and who pointed out that such remarks are no longer (societally) appropriate.
Feminists, like other lefties, can’t manage without the daisy chain. Their biases have no stand-alone substance.
@TestTube,
Yes, I give you a hearty guffaw. All jokes welcome -- mirth must emerge from the feminist swamp:)
"Not trolling: what part of what he said was offensive?"
In my opinion, it wasn't offensive as much as it was odd. I've never heard of the joke.
For some people, oddness to a degree that causes discomfort can be offensive or discourteous. These are people who believe strongly in etiquette. I don't fall into that category, and I am more casual. I understand people can be socially awkward and I am empathetic to a bad joke.
It could be seen as offensive from the perspective of etiquette. Did an indvidual fail to observe the proper courtesies? It's more of a British way to view the world.
Another way it could be seen as offensive: women are more likely to get scared if a strange man says something sexual, and she's in a confined space. Some men are unaware of how girls and women tend to survey potentially dangerous situations.
Let's say a strange man made this joke about women's panties. I would not be offended because of the joke. But I might be nervous. If I was alone in an elevator, I would be on alert. I would want to get to the lobby where I would see hotel staff and, hopefully, a lot of other people. If I was with several other conference attendees, I would not be concerned. But I would make sure I did not get off the elevator into an empty hallway with that particular individual.
A little caution goes a long way. I've never been attacked or systematically harassed or whatnot. I am, like many small women, alert to situations that are more likely to become dangerous.
Common sense and etiquette would go a long way to resolving these situations.
1) She was obnoxious. Using this situation to gain power and attention.
The association needed to use some common sense about her complaint.
2) He was socially awkward. Did not mean to offend. Understandable and sympathetic.
However, don't make sexual jokes around strangers in elevators is, generally, the polite way to behave.
Feminism lifts and separates.
It can't possibly be offensive. Are You Being Served? was on PBS!
Some men are unaware of how girls and women tend to survey potentially dangerous situations.
That's why Samuel Colt made them equal to men.
They can't reconcile the female who's the equal of a man and the female who's offended at the drop of a hat. They don't even notice there's a discrepancy.
Sharoni, she must be getting all the pussy now.
At least he didn't start singing "M-M-M-My Sharoni."
How many feminists does it take to push an elevator button?
"However, don't make sexual jokes around strangers in elevators is, generally, the polite way to behave."
Making a joke about lingerie is sexual? Maybe to a Victorian schoolmarm. "Oh dear, he mentioned female undergarments! Fletch my smelling salts!"
It was a pretty lame joke, but it's not like he suddenly decided to tell a stranger the one about the sailor in the whorehouse...
wwww you have a point. If I was alone with the jokester on the elevator, I would perceive it as creepy and not just a dumb joke. I would react the same way you would. In this case however, she was not alone with the jokester on the elevator.
She could have said "Oh, is my slip showing?" and been spoken well of by everyone for the rest of the conference.
Butt no.
I am eagerly awaiting the publication of the feminist's guide to appropriate jokes. Probably won't be a very big book.
I'm holding a copy of The Feminist's Guide to Appropriate Jokes in my hand right now -- it's a sheet of paper that's blank on both sides. Sorry, Althouse, but I didn't use your Amazon portal.
He ain't woke...
Love in an elevator
Jackie's in the elevator
Lingerie second floor
She said 'can I see you later
And love you just a little more'
I kinda hope we get stuck
Nobody gets out alive
She said 'I'll show you how to fax
In the mail room, honey
And have you home by five'
She could also have looked him up and down and replied, "I would never have guessed!"
That comment provoked her to report him? Seems a rather extreme, perhaps even hysterical, reaction.
They actually announced, fourth floor women's lingerie, and so on.
Doesn't anybody remember this from Bugs Bunny? Second floor, day goods and diamonds! Or something like that.
Lotta people trailing their coats, desperate to trip or be stepped on.
"How many feminists does it take to push an elevator button?"
Don't you mean lesbians?
Nothing advances tolerance, diversity and multiculturalism like ostracizing people at the drop of a hat.
We've been bitching about the woman, but what about the Executive Committee that made the demands on the perp prof? They're even worse.
I'm holding a copy of The Feminist's Guide to Appropriate Jokes in my hand right now -- it's a sheet of paper that's blank on both sides
Not true. I took a class with a feminist professor and she routinely engaged in anti-male humor including small dick jokes. Their sense of humor is completely determined by the politics involved.
"If they can put a man on the moon, why can't they put them all there ?" - Lily Tomlin
mockturtle said...
She could also have looked him up and down and replied, "I would never have guessed!"
Yes, but that would require her to be an adult, functional human being
Instead she's a leftist
gregq,
I think the better quip would be "No judging.."
bagoh20 said...Nothing advances tolerance, diversity and multiculturalism like ostracizing people at the drop of a hat.
--
Well..it does have a way of keeping the cultures "multi".
"Doesn't anybody remember this from Bugs Bunny? Second floor, day goods and diamonds! Or something like that. "
I saw some of the cartoons as a kid, but I can't remember a lot. Get it mixed up with Road Runner beep beep! I would have missed the reference and my reaction would have been "huh?"
"wwww you have a point. If I was alone with the jokester on the elevator, I would perceive it as creepy and not just a dumb joke. I would react the same way you would. In this case however, she was not alone with the jokester on the elevator."
Same. Totally agree. The reaction of the Association is crazy. The woman is acting nuts too, and I'm assuming a personality disorder, or at the very least attention-seeking behaviour.
Is that Association British? The Association wants a written letter of apology. Absurd, of course. No coerced letter can be sincere. The asking for a letter of apology feels British.
Some people use hot button SJWs topics to gain power. The issue is secondary. It's about gaining personal power. Or acting out from their own trauma. Or both. After the woman complained, it's up to the sane people, like the larger Association, to recognize when people with personality disorders are acting up.
Instead the Association went along with the crazy.
Are you being Served?
Constant Pussy Jokes. Constant Gay Jokes. Young Mr. Grace was an Old perv.
Very funny. And I am unanimous in that.
Of course, she could have zinged him with a joke of her own.
But, go look at her picture - its online. What a humorless oddball.
Besides, Gender studies is just welfare for middle-class women. No one cares about it.
Sharoni holds a Ph.D. in Conflict Analysis and Resolution.
Her dissertation was titled, "Sue The Bastards."
Her other choice was to carry an elevator around campus.
I don't think it's fair to jump from what he did to "men using the enforced captivity to interact with a woman. An elevator is an opportunity to talk, to touch, to intimidate, to imagine getting access to a woman's hotel room."
Gilbert Gottrfied: "And they call themselves, THE ARISTOCRATS!"
Announcing "Ladies Lingerie" at the next stop and holding the doors open until the joker left the elevator would have been a witty response. So would have been the complete ignoring of the remark, as most sane adults can do.
The woman is, to quote Popehat, a "censorious asshat".
Here is how the elevator joke goes:
Guy in the back of crowded elevator: "ballroom please"
Lady in front of him, quickly stepping a little forward: "oh, so sorry"
ISA Code of Conduct. https://www.isanet.org/Portals/0/Documents/ISA/ISA%20Code%20of%20Conduct%200418.pdf
I've belonged to a number of professional organizations, There is no way I would be a member of the ISA.
All this crap about her being a "survivor". I've survived being punched in the face, a boss that tried to fire me, deaths of friends and relatives etc but I'm not a "survivor", I'm just myself. Calling yourself that is just a clever way of calling yourself a victim.
At the Feminist Elevator Ride Cafe...
...you can joke about anything you want.
Rabel said...
Sharoni holds a Ph.D. in Conflict Analysis and Resolution.
LOL.
"She is currently working on a project on feminist critical pedagogy and a book on men and masculinity in the age of empire. Simona is a single mother who enjoys world music, drumming and dancing. ... check out: simonasharoni.com. (Content from: http://www.plattsburgh.edu/academics/gws/faculty/sharoni.php)"
plattsburgh.edu page says: "The page may have been removed, had its name changed, or is temporarily unavailable."
Simona is a single mother
IVF? Or a really crowded elevator?
Crude, perhaps rude, but survivable. Did he persist?
What doesn't break you, may make you stronger.
if he failed to comply, the executive committee would consider appropriate sanctions
fascists, thugs, bullies and monsters
mockturtle said...
She could have countered by asking him whether he prefers Olga or Bali brands of bras.
Braless, I imagine...
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