Jr. begins with, "What if Bush had done this to Obama?," which is a great question, calling us to think in neutral objective terms — the polar opposite of thinking about "revenge" for "the family."
He develops the idea that the investigation has always been corrupt, and when Jesse Watters asks him if "it's always been rotten to the core," Don Jr. says:
It always has been. We always said that. It is so ridiculous that — let it go though. The real problem I have with it — other than millions in legal fees and lots of time wasted and being smeared throughout the media for years — at least they uncovered this — what if they wouldn't have? If they would have just let it go at this point — I mean — there is a little bit of sweet revenge in it for me and certainly, probably for the family in the sense that if they wouldn't have done this, this stuff would be going on. This would be going on at the highest levels of government. They'd be continuing to do it to my father, trying to undermine his actions. Imagine how effective he could be — given the year he's had — without this cloud over his head. So I want them to come — but come to a conclusion already because you've been looking for 2 years. You've come up with nothing other than their own nefarious actions and their own collusions. So at this point, you've gotta come to something. Just come to something. Because, if they try to drag it out for a year, they try to drag it so that the Democrats have their talking points. I watch it right now. You see the Democratic Senators — "This is McCarthyism" — I'm like — "What?!" You have a guy that's been screaming "Russia! Russia! Russia!" with no evidence, obvious collusion — all this shade — for 18 months, screaming about McCarthyism? The irony is ridiculous at this point."Revenge" was a terribly bad word choice for him there — especially alongside "the family." (And it didn't help that he mispronounced "nefarious" so that it began with the first 2 syllables of "Neapolitan.")
And he does string a lot of ideas together in a casual speech style that's a lot like his father's. This can be confusing, especially when the word "it" flies by. A little bit of sweet revenge in what?
Trump antagonists are going to see the popping out of the word "revenge" as highly significant. It resonates with the idea that Trump doesn't understand the proper functioning of law and government but views the presidency as a realm of personal power. It reminds them of Trump's continual insinuations about "loyalty." Don Jr. jabbered a lot of words, but that one word — revenge! — revealed the nasty inner workings of the Trump family.
To Trump fans, "revenge" will seem like an odd word that feels diluted by all the other words. It was immediately moderated by the phrase "in the sense that" and all that followed. You can see that Don Jr. feels that he and his father have been terribly mistreated (and prevented from doing even more of their good works) and those terrible Democrats might easily have gotten away with their nefarious plot against the President.
But I think even in the Trump-sympathetic reading, there's a revelation of how Trump talks about himself behind the scenes, that he feels beleaguered and must fight for his life in a battle of good and evil. I want to balance that by saying that I think many of his opponents also seem to see themselves as fighters in an epic battle between good and evil.
I wonder why someone who goes on television in a hot political environment isn't more guarded in the choice of words. How do you let a word like "revenge" slip out? I have to think that Don Jr. is like his father, trusts his instincts, and believes that things will work out best if you let the words flow out spontaneously. People — not all people, but some people — will feel that you're speaking from your heart and are a real person and that even if you're flawed, you're basically a good person or will at least let us see where you are bad. Donald Trump Sr. has said so many things the wrong way, and it sometimes seems incredible that he sails on through, but I think we — many of us, not all of us — have a taste for word salad.
Revenge is one spicy ingredient in a word salad best served cold.
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287 comments:
1 – 200 of 287 Newer› Newest»Revenge without hatred.
Women get so worried about everything. It's a manipulative politician's dream.
I'm so happy I already had the tag "revenge."
I want to balance that by saying that I think many of his opponents also seem to see themselves as fighters in an epic battle between good and evil.
...and are also talking like mafiosi these days.
Stonevenge, an ancient voodoo site in Haiti.
There's also scavenge, taking what's left of your enemies.
But this is a war. The Dems want to impeach Trump and they don’t even try to hide it.
The day after the election Hillary was spinning the Russia-Trump collusion story for two reasons: 1. To hide her own collusion via the Steele Dossier; and 2. To hamstring Trump. It has worked. So far.
Angel-Dyne said...
...and are also talking like mafiosi these days.
Not sure that defending the FBI counts as talking like mafiosi.
It's not the Democrats really, but the news audience, namely soap opera women.
They don't mind being duped so long as it's soap opera entertainment.
So the story has legs and politicians use it because it has legs.
Ratings drive the whole thing. Otherwise the machinations would fall into an abyss unnoticed.
AReasonableMan said...
Not sure that defending the FBI counts as talking like mafiosi.
It does in Boston.
I agree bad choice of words. I guess if he had said karma it would have been ok. Put in context, it seems he meant it that way. What goes around comes around. I really don't get too upset when someone mispronounces a word though. Who hasn't? Also, there's regional differences in the way words are pronounced. Sometimes words just come out wrong too.
The news people are leftist because they're in the soap opera business, and that's where the soap opera stories are.
Althouse is analyzing the effect of words on soap opera women. The suggestion is that politicians should take that into account, rather than that women should shape up in the level of their civic participation. Teenage girl is not good.
What words do you have to use to get women to vote like adults. The problem for the right.
Revenge was a bad word. But when the other side is calling you fascist Nazi traitors, I can't blame someone for wanting it. Both sides should take this as a cue to mellow out.
He seems awfully confident that nothing is there, that you have to admit. Instead of revenge, vindication?
The left's strange new respect for law enforcement is transparent posturing.
Revenge comes from L vindicare. There's vindictive and vindication.
The differences are in how much hatred is supposed to be there.
"Revenge is one spicy ingredient in a word salad best served cold."
And silently.
Silence becomes Don Jr. He did not inherit The Gift.
How about calling the Trumps, The Avengers?
The Obama/Clinton/Soros owned FBI and CIA just spent several years conspiring with British Intelligence and Saudi Princes to target the Trump family for destruction. And in the game they used Donald Jr.'s innocence as a weak link to set them up.
They missed. That really excited Donald, Jr. And our new President next signed an Executive Order on 12/21/17 to destroy them just like he promised he would do.
When is the NYT, WaPo or Mother Jones going to report on their meeting with Steele and why they didn’t run a story on the Dossier in October 2016? I think the newspapers would say they would never run a story based on anonymous Russian sources that they couldn’t interview; especially since some were Kremlin officials.
I wonder why someone who goes on television in a hot political environment isn't more guarded in the choice of words.
Because you don't see it as a political environment once people start breaking the law. You see it finally in terms of right and wrong, that anyone but the most fervent deniers should finally admit the underlying facts.
Don Jr. said those words because he believed the political fight was now over that the truth had been made public.
He didn't remember that in some circles there is no truth, only politics.
"Not sure that defending the FBI counts as talking like mafiosi."
Dems and the media are just defending the impeachment narrative. They could care less about the FBI, except how they can use the FBI to complete the coupe d'état.
Not sure that defending the FBI counts as talking like mafiosi.
Whitey Bulger disagrees.
Trump the Elder was not silent when he told the American public that Barack The Magnificent "tapped my wires". For next few weeks, he was subject to ridicule. Yet he knew.
My guess is that Don Jr. knows.
"I wonder why someone who goes on television in a hot political environment isn't more guarded in the choice of words"
Because this administration isn't politically correct. Thankfully.
The Democrats are going to twist and turn anything that is said.
Also remember that Trump likely knew everything in the Nunes Memo as soon as he took office.
He's been waiting for a year for the machinery to grind forward, for the FBI to stop stonewalling, and for Congress to finally receive documents and testimony to that effect.
A year of having people say the FBI can't be investigating you without hard evidence, so the investigation itself proves something illegal went on.
A year of hearing that Rod Rosenstein couldn't have pushed for a Special Prosecutor unless he had real evidence of Trump's collusion with the Russians, and therefore we likely had a treasonous President who should be removed on those grounds alone.
A. Fucking. Year.
Given that, I think Don Jr. was quite restrained.
Because he's a Trump and he talks funny.
Trumpsters prefer politicians who talk like real people rather than mush-mouthed funeral director-types who specialize in word salads.
The relationship between Democrats and law enforcement is complicated.
It is, according to Democrats, perfectly acceptable to put police in a blanket and fry them like bacon.
It is perfectly acceptable to criticize law enforcement defending themselves against "gentle giants" who have assaulted and battered the police officer.
It is acceptable to call ICE agents the "American Gestapo" when enforcing the law.
Yet, criticizing the FBI for abridging the civil rights of American citizens is wrong, in some way.
I would enjoy seeing an attempt to square these positions that didn't involved the accurate assessment of "Each position is taken to maximize the political advantage of Democrats in an attempt to wrest complete power and control from the citizens and give it to elected Democrats and the entrenched bureaucracy."
Trump antagonists are going to see the popping out of the word "revenge" as highly significant.
As you did? ;-)
I want to balance that by saying that I think many of his opponents also seem to see themselves as fighters in an epic battle between good and evil.
That is the problem. I saw a cartoon they other day, split panel, on the right was a Hebrew person with a Star of David on his shirt and a death camp tattoo on his arm. In the left panel is a person who is obviously Muslim going by his garb who has a crescent moon stitched on to his shirt and a death camp tattoo on his arm. How can you argue with that? Trump has proposed a temporary ban on people from seven Muslim countries entering the country so that methods can be devised to ensure that people coming from those countries are not terrorists. Which is morally the same as putting Muslims into death camps? Or that the eventual plan is to exterminate Muslims? What? The entire justification of the Antifa movement is that street violence is justified because Republicans are Nazis and therefore denying them a voice in politics is not only justified, but imperative. None of these people seem to grasp the fact that if you force 1/3 to 1/2 (at least) of the people in the country out of ordinary politics by forcibly silencing them using intimidation that the result is not going to be that they just go away and you get your way. Or that the level of repression they are wanting in order to silence views that they disagree with is on par with Maoist China. In fact, they seem to desire that.
The Nunes memo has proven to be a damp squib, as predicted. The claim that Trump is under extraordinary or unusual pressure because some people want him impeached rings hollow. Trump's rise to political power was built around the Birther movement, the sole aim of which was to illegitimately remove Obama from power based on a lie about his birth place. After that sleazy effort Trump has few grounds for complaint about anything that happens in politics.
Revenge is the right word. After the election, Trump signaled that he did not want to go after Hillary. The FBI's abuse didn't need to come out but for the phony collusion investigation. Trump and his family have been exposed in the worst way (Jr accused of treason for meeting with the Russian lawyer). Now the other side is being similarly exposed. Of course it's revenge, even if the politically correct term is justice.
Totally disagree with Althouse. Revenge is at the top of my personal word salad on this matter, and while Don Jr should shut up, I know exactly how he feels. What those pseudo sanctimonious idiots James Comey and Adam Schiff have been spouting makes me sick. They are destroyers of our country.
Having spewed all that, I voted for Trump because I knew he would be held accountable, but Hillary never would. I had no idea that the Dems/media would go insane. But they have.
Politics is built on revenge. Fear of their vengeance from the Clintons kept other Democrats in line for a couple of decades. The Speaker of the House can (and will when he can) reduce the status of party members if they fail to assist in ways he deems important. Presidents exercise the appointive power to reward and punish. It's at the core of the game up and down the line.
But you are not supposed to say so, especially if (like Don Jr.) you do not have the power to effect the vengeance.
@ARM - C'mon, man, you got better than that! Which is it? A threat to national security or a damp squib?
ARM letting his totalitarian freak flag fly!
'How do you let a word like "revenge" slip out?' Jeepers. Most of us aren't politicians. We don't watch every word. If we tried, we wouldn't be able to think. Probably most politicians aren't able to think either.
Never say anything unless you've scripted it beforehand.
Great system.
ARM asserts: Trump's rise to political power was built around the Birther movement
LOL! Are you really so clueless?
ABT: Not sure that defending the FBI counts as talking like mafiosi.
But I *am* sure that the truth claim "is not talking like a mafiosi" has no logical connection to "is defending the FBI".
But we already knew that your avatar is only meant as a charming bit of ironical self-deprecation.
The leftwing prog-D machine is fully corrupt. Schiffty-D on down and on up.
mock: LOL! Are you really so clueless?
No, he's just yanking your chain. He's a broken man whose only consolation these days is trying to get a rise out of sincere folk with shit-tier sophistry.
A shame, really. ABT used to have a comments personality a cut above Inga/Ritmo grade.
I'm shocked, shocked I tell you, that someone whose family has been harassed and threatened by powerful criminals would use a word like "revenge", rather than a more colorful saying like, oh, "I hope they all rot in hell".
Pure Scott Adams. We've all been bullied.Baron says "let's play it this way at inauguration,means Ds will have no time to use their party organs to sell their socialism is better than the Pubs's. Even Bigger wins." "Ante up, I bet my milk money against your KFC bill. Btw, isn't Bannon late on destroying the Rinos, and the pubs soon after?
Draining the swamp drip by drip. Which the Ds will do for us if we play it my way.Since our defense contractor donors and their elected stooges will fight it every step of the way." "good boy, but you should have bet more."
Instead of sweet revenge, Don Jr. shouldve called it unverified and salacious revenge.
I'll have the salacious word salad. Russian dressing. On the side.
rhhardin: What words do you have to use to get women to vote like adults. The problem for the right.
Women, and non-white men (who vote more like women than white women).
It'll be interesting to see if Trump actually succeeds in getting a significant number of black men to "vote like adults".
I want to balance that by saying that I think many of his opponents also seem to see themselves as fighters in an epic battle between good and evil.
They are correct in seeing themselves in this way.
They are incorrect about which of those two sides they are on.
Still waiting for the correct FRI response to Hillary's lawlessness.
The Nunes memo has proven to be a damp squib, as predicted.
The knee-jerk dismissal by dishonest partisans like ARM was, in fact, predicted and predictable. So what?
unverified and salacious
Good one Meade.
"unverified and salacious" - Comey's comments about the Steele Dossier.
I didn't even know this was a thing. I guess not everyone was watching the Superbowl last night.
I read about this story yesterday, and out of the context of “it’st a little bit of sweet revenge, in the sense that...” it sure sounded worse. I was rolling my eyes. But I used to do that when I would here the first reports of something that Sarah Palin said, and then when you would get the context, it was completely different.
Can you imagine waking up in the morning thinking “I have to argue my case as if he never said thus and so because that gets me to the real truth!” These liberals are demanding to be spoken to as if they were small children, or else they will pretend to misunderstand you.
Trump's rise to political power was built around the Birther movement
That's just bullshit. States that went for Obama, twice, voted for Trump because he addressed issues, deindustrialization, illegal immigration, etc. that both major parties either ignored or promoted policies that exacerbated the problems. Both major parties were all in for globalization. It was seen as "inevitable". I put that in quotation marks because it is a direct quote, from Barack Obama. Another quote, "what is he going to do, wave a magic wand." That was in regards to manufacturing jobs returning to the United States. The GOP is equally invested in globalism. Trump ran against globalism. He ran as a nationalist. His SOTU speech stressed that he continues to be a champion of nationalism.
Middle class wages have been stagnant for decades, towns outside of liberal enclaves have been decimated by outsourcing of manufacturing overseas. The establishment line on this is that life is hard and there are winners and losers, we are the winners and you are the losers. So sad. Turns out that is not a winning political strategy if some one can be found to oppose it.
The collective corrupt left were terrified of the release of the Memo - so they threw a damp squid over it.
Not sure that defending the FBI counts as talking like mafiosi.
Ask Whitey Bulger. He will tell you that there are lots of good eggs who understood his needs in the FBI.
Why can't wr criticize the FBI? They have 100 years of shady shit (in addition to some good stuff) several have mentioned Boston and Whitey Bulger. More recently there was the Nevada land grab from the Bundys for some Harry Reid donors. Ted stevens is another example. There's FBI sniper Lon Horuchi murdering Randy Weaver's wife. Trying to drive mlk to suicide etc. And much more.
The FBI is a corrupt agency and always had been going back to it's foundi g. I doubt it can be reformed, it should be abolished.
If nothing else, get Hoovers name off the building
John Henry
”The left’s strange new respect for law enforcement is transparent posturing.”
Right, they should form up into police auxiliaries and arm themselves with batons and break up those disrespectful Black Lives Matter protests because Law Enforcement!
Meanwhile, some of them can head down to the border and help out Border Patrol! Maybe volunteer to work with ICE ferreting out illegals!
It’s always black and white with liberals. What helps them gain or hold power and what doesn’t. That’s why “unhelpful” is a big part of their thought processes.
But pointing out the non stop criticisms of law enforcement by there side is just “whataboutism!”
So what evil has Trump done? He got congress to drop the US corporate tax rate so that it is on par with other industrialized nations which allows it to compete with them in regards to manufacturing. This, along with cheaper energy available in the US and a relatively well educated work force also means that China is no longer as advantageous a spot for locating manufacturing. Especially since any kind of high-tech manufacturing there means that your IP is going to be stolen. And, rather ironically, automation undercuts their wage arbitrage. In addition, he is reducing the regulatory burden on businesses. The result is a growing economy that leads to less unemployment and growing wages, for everybody.
Clearly Satan incarnate.
ARM said: "The Nunes memo has proven to be a damp squib, as predicted."
Whoa, whoa, whoa Tonto. Your side PREDICTED our national security interests would be exposed, our intelligence methods compromised, and our agents would be at risk with the release of the Nunes memo. Now you say it's a squib, "as predicted"?
You lefties rewrite history before the ink is dry on the original version.
Considering how some are fighting its reversal tooth and nail, I'm beginning to think that the destruction of the middle-class wasn't just an unfortunate side effect of globalism.
AA: It resonates with the idea that Trump doesn't understand the proper functioning of law and government but views the presidency as a realm of personal power.
Yet, it already is "personal". Guelphs and Ghibellines personal. This is all about "we want 'our kind', not 'their kind' in power". We already are a nation of men, not laws. That this is not so, that "our kind" represents impersonal rule of law, is the self-serving "idea" (narrative, meme) that needs to be discredited.
Don't know how damaging or helpful any particular instance of "personalizing" this stuff is, but "our kind" seems to be doing a pretty good job these days of revealing their own, highly personal, extreme full-of-shitness whenever they feel compelled to defend themsel...er, our noble institutions.
So the Democrat position is that Trump colluded with the Russians to get your kids jobs and increase your wages?
Angel-Dyne reminds me: No, he's just yanking your chain. He's a broken man whose only consolation these days is trying to get a rise out of sincere folk with shit-tier sophistry.
You're right, of course. And I don't usually rise to the bait. It was a weak moment caused by momentary lack of coffee.
The corrupt leftwing machine deserves some revenge.
The Corrupt leftwing machine are the bad guys in Kill Bill.
I'm with Don Jr. He didn't "jabber." He was mostly on point. I am encouraged that the New Yorkers are realists and have no illusions, if they ever had any, about what they are up against. It's war. So far, the Trump seem to take it as a personal battle, which is fine and motivating in itself. Now they just need to see the deep ideological warfare progs are engaged in.
Of course, there is a tremendous "irony" in Dems and Deep Staters using accusations of Russia collusion to gin up a phony investigation, all the while in fact colluding with Russian operatives.
What we don't have yet is evidence on the actual reasoning of the FISA court. If Steele's Russian sources are in fact unknown, or were unknown to the FBI and the court, the basic evidence supplied was not only unverified but unverifiable. If any application that involved spying on Trump was granted under those conditions, that would a part of the scandal that has yet to be fully covered.
Oh, he wants to renegotiate decades old trade deals so as to make them more advantageous towards the US! That's pretty evil, I guess?
Come on Inga, et al. Help me out here. What evil has Trump and the GOP done?
FISA Abuse Memo Proves The Need For An Independent Investigation
Democrats are right. The validity of the 2016 presidential contest is in question. Until we get to the bottom of what the FBI was up to during the election, questions about it will fester and further degrade trust in the institution.
The notion peddled by Democrats over the past few days, that releasing House Intelligence Committee Chairman Devin Nunes’s memo would irreparably damage national security, has been proven absurd. There’s no reason the public shouldn’t have an accounting of what went on. And there’s no reason an investigation into the FBI’s actions should undermine Robert Mueller’s investigation into Russian collusion — or whatever he’s looking into at this point (even if this is the purpose of some GOP partisans). It might even insulate it.
Darkisland is right. The FBI should not be sacrosanct. In my lifetime there have been many abuses of power by both FBI and CIA and not only at the behest of the administrations they serve. They sometimes serve their own interests. The swamp is deep and wide and requires a thorough draining. How this can be implemented without a chaotic purge is the big question.
Mother Jones said in 2013 that the reason FISA rejects only 0.03% of applications is because the 'evidence' is so thoroughly vetted beforehand. Right.
"If you’re rich enough to cook up a “dossier” and powerful enough to know the right people, you too can have the government spy for you. That’s what it looks like. Change the affiliations of players involved, and ask yourself if that’s a precedent you’re comfortable with."
All the bitterness here on Althouse is quite difficult to explain. Republicans control all three branches of government, yet all you do is bitch and moan about Democrats and now other Republicans, such as the FBI. Aren't these problems a product of Trump's political incompetence rather than an issue with his opponents, who are simply doing their job?
Rex Stout: "The Doorbell Rang," 1965
Aren't these problems a product of Trump's political incompetence rather than an issue with his opponents, who are simply doing their job?
It's only dishonest partisans like you that view abuses of power as "simply doing their job". Honest people know better.
ARM asserts: Trump's rise to political power was built around the Birther movement
He's obviously not as bright as he thinks he is.
Arm said: "Republicans control all three branches of government ..."
It take 60 votes to control the senate, but then you knew that. Disingenuous is thy label and you wear it well.
… this administration isn't politically correct. Thankfully.
Simply stated, this is one of the main reasons Trump won.
And I question the premise that revenge is intrinsically bad, especially since we all know that the MSM/Dems/NeverTrumpers/Obama Deep State would NEVER hesitate to take the same opportunity against Trump, or anyone in the Trump family. It was on one of Mike Cernovich’s videos that I heard that sooner or later Trump always gets revenge. I think it is a valuable reputation to have by way of discouraging at least some of the numerous frivolous attacks.
ow other Republicans, such as the FBI.
“Just years apart in the 1990s, they both gave up their top-tier private law firm jobs to return to the trenches of prosecuting criminals — Mueller as a junior prosecutor in Washington, DC, and Comey in Richmond, Virginia,” Washingtonian reports. “Both men were rising stars mentored and guided by Eric Holder in the 1990s during Holder’s time in the Justice Department under the Clinton administration.”. - Washington Post
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2017/live-updates/trump-white-house/trump-comey-and-russia-how-key-washington-players-are-reacting/brothers-in-arms-the-long-friendship-between-mueller-and-comey/
Yeah, Republicans! BTW, since the Republicans control the executive, why are your panties in bunch about how Republicans are running it?
Not sure why Mueller didn’t recuse himself since this investigation involves is “brother in arms.” Well, the Eric Holder, Scandal Goalie nonpareil part does explain it.
A Title I FISA warrant sought and obtained which allowed the dems to completely surveil every single person in the Trump campaign and all their family members and all their friends and the oppo FBI was allowed to go back as far in the past on all those citizens as the oppo-FBI wanted to go.
To obtain a Title I warrant, the FBI has to stipulate and be prepared to prove that an American citizen is an active agent of a foreign power and presents a certain threat to our national security.
Yet there is Carter Page, walking around without even a fake hint if an indictment.
Because Carter Page and others are not the REASON for the investigation, they were the EXCUSES for the fake investigation that the dems and oppo-FBI used to spy on American citizens for political purposes and to frame a opposition political leader.
Jr. begins with, "What if Bush had done this to Obama?," which is a great question, calling us to think in neutral objective terms
Enough with pointing out double standards. They are always bad questions, not great ones. Not only do the MSM and the rest of the left not think in neutral objective terms, but they do not care about double standards.
Recently in a few documentary series and shows I've heard a lot of clips of recorded conversations between LBJ and some other person. And none of these recordings raise any objections from the left. They see nothing wrong with LBJ having this surreptitious recording system. And yet, as we all know, the Dems ripped Nixon over his recording system.
Just like they ripped Nixon over alleged "dirty tricks," "spying" on political opponents, and obstruction. Of course, what we see now from the Dems, MSM and rest of the left is deflection, demonization, obstruction, obfuscation, counterattacks and cover-up in light of the rising mountain of evidence of their own engagement in disinformation to use the powers of government to spy on their opponents in a scheme that dwarfs anything involved in Watergate.
Complaining about double standards is a waste of time.
It seems perfectly natural and appropriate to me.
We have no illusions about the nature of politics and political systems, or what is required to keep order. It is kept by a balance of terror.
It has its rules, and when they are broken, especially in the form of personal attacks, the recourse is personal vengeance. That also is a rule, that insult or harm imposes the obligation of vengeance. Vengeance is an unavoidable burden imposed on him, regardless of his preferences or his charity.
Assuming there is some impersonal system that will somehow make it all right is a fantasy. A rather supine, passive, shirking fantasy.
The law, and political process, are just tools, or unaccountable things best regarded as forces of nature. The conflicts are always personal.
Speaking like mafiosi is simply revealing the truths of conflict hidden by the superstructure overlaid on reality by the squeamish.
Ron W: Oh, he wants to renegotiate decades old trade deals so as to make them more advantageous towards the US! That's pretty evil, I guess?
Come on Inga, et al. Help me out here. What evil has Trump and the GOP done?
Since she's not here, I'll step in and help. All the things you mention, even if positive (which they aren't, which I can demonstrate after I look them up on HuffPost) are totally trivial and irrelevant non-issues. Trump is a racistsexisthomophobetransphobemisogynistislamophobe*, and anybody who argues otherwise is a white supremacist.
Any more questions?
*I've actually heard all these nouns used in a single sentence following the words "Trump is...". More than once. Separated by spaces and with proper use of commas, which gives one hope that sanity is not yet irretrievably lost.
More recently there was the Nevada land grab from the Bundys for some Harry Reid donors. Ted stevens is another example. There's FBI sniper Lon Horuchi murdering Randy Weaver's wife. Trying to drive mlk to suicide etc. And much more.
Let's not leave out the FBI crime lab scandal or sending in an army to surround and incinerate a lot of innocent people in Waco, after using inflated allegations as a pretext, just to go after the disfavored wacko Koresh.
I've only seen the first episode of Waco, but it brought back a lot of bad memories.
David Souter was a “Republican” too.
Because Carter Page and others are not the REASON for the investigation
I've heard reports that Page was in the past an FBI informant prior to his doing anything with the Trump campaign.
LOL ARM - all D-corruption flows from the Clinton Crime machine.
TiV: David Souter was a “Republican” too.
The larger disingenuousness here, of course, is his feigning* ignorance of the ongoing transformation of the American party-political landscape, which everybody else in the world has noticed and been remarking on for quite some time.
*I'm starting to suspect it isn't feigned.
mockturtle said...
ARM asserts: Trump's rise to political power was built around the Birther movement"
Uh,sure. That's why all those blue collar Obama voters in the rust belt states voted for Trump.
Leftists are incapable of taking a honest look at why people rejected the Democrats in 2016. Too painful, I guess.
"Trump's rise to political power was built around the Birther movement, the sole aim of which was to illegitimately remove Obama from power based on a lie about his birth place. After that sleazy effort Trump has few grounds for complaint about anything that happens in politics."
Lulz
THe main form of denial here is about Trump's political incompetence. Who thought it was a good idea to put Don Jr in front of a camera anywhere? And that is the least of their offences to the art of politics.
Like all things Trump this revenge is exaggerated and does not question evidence of collusion but only how the FISA was obtained, there is plenty of evidence for the investigation to continue, and I suspect the last laugh is one act away and will be served cold.
THe main form of denial here is about Trump's political incompetence.
That this political incompetent could make fools out of the political geniuses in the Clinton campaign, not to mention the Most Qualified Person Ever to run for President, must really burn.
You guys want to believe that because Trump is sticking it to the man then all the laws of politics should be now suspended. Trump is in trouble here because he seemed to believe that he had been elected to the head of a shithole country, where his tactics would have worked, rather than to lead a mature democracy.
tcrosse said...
That this political incompetent could make fools out of the political geniuses in the Clinton campaign, not to mention the Most Qualified Person Ever to run for President, must really burn.
It doesn't bother me at all. I thought the Dems were committing malpractice forcing Clinton on all of us long before the election. The current Dems are incompetent. Their failure, even now, to distance themselves from Hollywood being a perfect example. But, when in power under Obama, they ran a tight ship. As did Bush, with Cheney.
roesch/voltaire
As an obvious expert on collusion, can you point to the exact part of the US Code that prohibits collusion? Also, can you point to the part of the USC that defines collusion for the circumstances you think are collusion?
I've searched and searched but I just can't find the Title, Section, or Paragraph that you keep referencing.
Thanks!
Occam's Razor: Hillary was a terrible candidate who ran a terrible campaign. For a True Believer that must be too hideous to contemplate.
AReasonableMan denies that in the kingdom of the blind, a one eyed man is king. Interesting position to take.
Also, you typed that Trump is in trouble. But I'm not quite sure why. Could you tell me, precisely, what Trump is doing that is causing his trouble?
Your explanation must fit with the following data points:
1) Trump is president,
2) Congress is controlled by the President's (nominal) party,
3) A majority of governors are from the President's party,
4) A majority of state legislatures are controlled by the President's party,
5) The President gave a SOTU that received majority support from Democrats,
6) The President's approval rating has ticked up, recently.
Thanks in advance.
"But, when in power under Obama, they ran a tight ship."
So tight that Clinton and Obama nearly got away with their many abuses of power. Jail To The Thiefs!
"those terrible Democrats might easily have gotten away with their nefarious plot against the President."
Thus far, the Democrats *have* gotten away with their plot to let Hillary Clinton skate for crimes that almost certainly *did* seriously damage America's national security. Who knows which hostile governments read everything the stupid bitch wrote the whole time she was Secretary of State? They didn't even bother with a cover-up. Comey stood up on national TV and said, "I think Hillary Clinton is a nice lady and these laws should not apply to her. Not guilty."
Meade said...
So tight that Clinton and Obama nearly got away with their many abuses of power.
If this belief makes you happy it has some utilitarian value, but a majority of people do not see Obama as an abuser of power and it's a little late to change that perception now that Trump is doing his best to tear down the FBI and DOJ.
I agree with AReasonableMan.
The press has done an exceptional job covering for the long train of abuses that Obama and his Administration perpetrated on the American people. The deprivation of civil liberties fostered by the IRS, FBI, DOJ, ATF, CIA, NSA, and others has largely gone unreported.
They'd might see it as revenge.
A majority of people knew what Bubba was and voted for him again anyway.
And some of them were willing to put him back in the WH as First Man.
ABT: Trump is in trouble here because he seemed to believe that he had been elected to the head of a shithole country, where his tactics would have worked, rather than to lead a mature democracy.
A statement that, to any intelligent adult, begs so many questions on so many levels as to be essentially meaningless. Sort of thing that works well on stupid people, though, so not to be sneered at if one's goal is obtaining the votes of "soap opera women" (hi rh!) of both sexes.
Interesting how some so easily accuse Obama of wrongdoing without any evidence, yet get upset over Trump being investigated for wrongdoing witha probable cause finding. If Obama did illegal activities, why isn’t he being investigated by Trump’s DOJ? Sessions could order the FBI to investigate Obama, no?
Angel-Dyne said...
"ABT: Trump is in trouble here because ..."
A Bit Tipsy? Arbitrary Bad Taste? Architecture Behind Topiary?
ABT: ...but a majority of people do not see Obama as an abuser of power and it's a little late to change that perception now that Trump is doing his best to tear down the FBI and DOJ.
Wow, ABT, you're really on a roll today, churning out the statements chock-full of chewy non sequitury goodness. Fine work, even by your standards.
Jupiter: A Bit Tipsy? Arbitrary Bad Taste? Architecture Behind Topiary?
In a recent thread Paco Wové started calling him "A Butthurt Man", which appealed to my admittedly sometimes puerile** sense of humor, as well as as being a good description of his current state of flailing mopery.
**Which probably explains why "Architecture Behind Topiary" also made me laugh, out of all proportion to any sense it made.
"...Interesting how some so easily accuse Obama of wrongdoing without any evidence."
Obama illegally used a pseudonymous email to communicate with Hillary via her private server. That's more than evidence of wrongdoing -- that's proof.
“In a recent thread Paco Wové started calling him "A Butthurt Man", which appealed to my admittedly sometimes puerile** sense of humor, as well as as being a good description of his current state of flailing mopery.”
Not only your sense of humor is puerile, your entire being seems so.
I think the young man is being a gentleman. Revenge is far more polite than fuck you.
Just saying
"Limping and hopping along after Trump’s droppings makes you look like a turkey vulture going affter road garbage."
Two minutes later:
"Not only your sense of humor is puerile, your entire being seems so."
History for Inga begins anew every two minutes. Lulz
Using the the three branches of government to seek "revenge" against the FBI, the Special Prosecutor, and the Democrats? To thwart the investigation into Trump operatives' criminal conspiracy to steal the election? That sounds like obstruction of justice, and abuse of power reminiscent of Nixon and Watergate. I would build a new Federal Prison in DC (not just a new wing of Leavenworth) to house all the miscreants. I propose the name: Trump Watchtower, Pitch and Putt, and Maxfli Revolution Control Federal Penitentiary. To support the Althouse Blog, please purchase a dozen Maxfli Revolution Control balls on Amazon. Thank you.
https://www.amazon.com/2015-Maxfli-Revolution-Control-Pack/dp/B01G0QOGRK/ref=pd_bxgy_200_2?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B01G0QOGRK&pd_rd_r=78X3HC39W0VKCATQY920&pd_rd_w=laTKO&pd_rd_wg=jVLgn&psc=1&refRID=78X3HC39W0VKCATQY920
Already deleted your stupid reply, Inga? Lulz
“Limping and hopping along after Trump’s droppings makes you look like a turkey vulture going affter road garbage."
Two minutes later:
"Not only your sense of humor is puerile, your entire being seems so."
History for Inga begins anew every two minutes.Lulz.”
Indeed I’m laughing too. I think there are some folks here who need to be slapped down once in a while. I give as good as I get when it’s appropriate. I absolutely despise arrogant bitches who bully others and I’ll happily rip her a new asshole when she does it.
I’ll happily rip you a new one too, Fabi. Just give me a reason.
Please do, Inga -- I hate to be left out! Lulz
“Since she's not here, I'll step in and help. All the things you mention, even if positive (which they aren't, which I can demonstrate after I look them up on HuffPost) are totally trivial and irrelevant non-issues. Trump is a racistsexisthomophobetransphobemisogynistislamophobe*, and anybody who argues otherwise is a white supremacist.”
Speak for yourself. I don’t read or ever quote from HuffPost. I read the same publications Althouse does. I even read your right wing rags just to see what dreck your side is pushing. An intelligent person won’t underestimate their opponent. You are not nearly as intelligent as you’d like to think you are. You’re really no more rational or reasoned than Achilles.
Now go and brush off your knees give them a rest, kneeling in front of your idol for so long isn’t conducive to being able to walk upright with purpose. Limping and hopping along after Trump’s droppings makes you look like a turkey vulture going affter road garbage.
“Please do, Inga -- I hate to be left out! Lulz.”
Be patient grasshopper, your turn will come. Start bullying someone and then I’ll pay attention to you too.
It’s hilarious to picture an arrogant wanna be elistist turkey vulture, and some people make it easy to do, lol.
I forgot to say "please", Inga. ;-)
“I forgot to say "please", Inga. ;-)”
Don’t beg, it’s not dignified.
ABT: Ass Before Teakettles?
Inga: You are not nearly as intelligent as you’d like to think you are.
You are very probably correct about this. Like the French dude said, "no man is satisfied with his fortune, but every man is satisfied with his wit". Though I am satisfied that my self-estimation isn't quite as inaccurate as some other people's.
mockturtle said...
ABT: Ass Before Teakettles?
2/5/18, 11:51 AM
Arrogant But Teabagged?
“Though I am satisfied that my self-estimation isn't quite as inaccurate as some other people's.”
In your arrogance, you are mistaken. You have a very high opinion of yourself. The higher the pedestal you put yourself on, the farther you have to fall when someone pushes you off of it.
Sometimes, when I complain that the quality of discourse at Althouse has fallen from some previous standards, I feel like an old fuddy duddy, other times not so much.
Well, since blog rules have changed, there seem to be no rules. I’ll take advantage of it, as others have.
Please, Inga, please!
Inga's revenge
Zen Master Inga: You are not nearly as intelligent as you’d like to think you are.
Grasshopper-Dyne: You are very probably correct about this.
ZMI: In your arrogance, you are mistaken.
I accept the gift of your paradoxes from beyond the realm of the rational, O enlightened one. Perhaps after many years of meditating upon them, I shall grasp the deep meaning of your koans.
This was a better effort than 'butthurt' but still not exactly Oscar Wilde.
It's long past time for Don, Jr. to convert to Buddhism and go to Thailand to become a monk who is sworn to silence.
And if he doesn't, for Don, Sr. to make him an offer he can't refuse.
Or, something. (Not to avoid being deposed, just to STFU.)
“I accept the gift of your paradoxes from beyond the realm of the rational, O enlightened one. Perhaps after many years of meditating upon them, I shall grasp the deep meaning of your koans.”
Why don’t you grasp your lips and glue them shut, before attempting to speak for me, when someone addresses me, not you. Meditate on this, take your condescension and patronizing snobbery and shove it up your ass. Or maybe you could ponder why someone of your vast knowledge and high intelligence could be duped by a moron like your President. Maybe it’s because his bigotry resonates deeply within your bowels.
Now go back and eat some more road garbage you angelic buzzard
Tsk, tsk, temper, temper....
Inga
Ah, but he is your president too. He is the President of the United States of America of which you are a citizen. HRC is not and will not be POTUS. Ever.
Inga @12:52:
That was awesome, Inga. Five stars.
“That was awesome, Inga. Five stars..” croaks the Angelic Buzzard, high praise indeed. I’ll be happy to repeat it if I have to.
“HRC is not and will not be POTUS. Ever.”
Is that supposed to be important to me?
Inga is, again, spanked very hard by Angel-Dyne and believes she, Inga, did the spanking. Splendid to watch.
Trump antagonists are going to see the popping out of the word "revenge" as highly significant.
Good. They should.
They deserve it.
AReasonableMan said...
"Sometimes, when I complain that the quality of discourse at Althouse has fallen from some previous standards, I feel like an old fuddy duddy, other times not so much."
If you aren't satisfied with the quality of the discourse here you should probably raise the quality of your contribution.
I don't know which is more entertaining. Inga trying to be relevant or Inga pissed.
Angel Dyne, I salute you.
And I never, ever want to piss you off.
“Inga is, again, spanked very hard by Angel-Dyne and believes she, Inga, did the spanking. Splendid to watch.”
It’s been splendid kicking her ass. I’m not impressed by your delusions of who is the spanker and who is the spankee, you passive aggressive asshole. Neither of you condescending bitches can “spank” anyone here, you only think you can.
“Angel Dyne, I salute you.
And I never, ever want to piss you off.”
Yeah, buzzards gather in flocks to eat road garbage, be careful of the truck barreling toward you. It can easily without much effort, get two birds with one swipe.
“If you aren't satisfied with the quality of the discourse here you should probably raise the quality of your contribution.”
You might want to take your own advice.
Rusty said...
If you aren't satisfied with the quality of the discourse here you should probably raise the quality of your contribution.
Not sure that bitchy little comments like this are the best approach. Seems to be enough of that already.
"But, when in power under Obama, they ran a tight ship."
-- You realize Obama illegally spied on journalists and Congress, right?
I feel like an old fuddy duddy, other times not so much.
You are more like an inoculation against your own views. You present them here in possibly a weakened form, and they are immediately knocked down, you don’t answer any of the objections, and so you end up strengthening the views you seem to want to oppose.
I am not sure at all that you aren’t some kind of pro-Trump Russian bot, given the devastating effectiveness of your whole shtick at discrediting the anti-Trump POV. A simple example would be your lack of an answer to a simple question such as “why is it OK to. criticize cops, as in BLM, but not the FBI?
Inga is an even more potent inoculant, given her even more stubborn refusal to acknowledge and explain apparent holes in her arguments. Maybe if you had looked at Wikileaks, you would understand why quoting articles from the press that you then seem unable to defend, is a losing tactic. Maybe you are trying to warn off people who haven’t yet critically examined the press POV from even considering to stray, like a. shepherd for the little flock of liberals, but other than that, I don’t see what you think you are accomplishing here other than hardening the views against your declared point of view.
Not sure that bitchy little comments like this are the best approach. Seems to be enough of that already.
So that’s a no then. See above.
"If this belief makes you happy it has some utilitarian value, but a majority of people do not see Obama as an abuser of power--"
-- You know Obama illegally fired an IG that was investigating one of his cronies and then claimed the man was senile, ruining his reputation, right?
“Inga is an even more potent inoculant, given her even more stubborn refusal to acknowledge and explain apparent holes in her arguments. Maybe if you had looked at Wikileaks, you would understand why quoting articles from the press that you then seem unable to defend, is a losing tactic. Maybe you are trying to warn off people who haven’t yet critically examined the press POV from even considering to stray, like a. shepherd for the little flock of liberals, but other than that, I don’t see what you think you are accomplishing here other than hardening the views against your declared point of view.”
LMAO. It’s hilarious to hear you dopes give yourselves credit for posting “original” thoughts. I’m happy to tell you that this is yet another delusion of yours. The stuff you regurgitate comes straight out of right wing rags and conspiracy theory sites, almost word for word. You are simply too dishonest to post your sources.
It’s been splendid kicking her ass.
Not always easy to figure out which side of the D/K line you are on. A hint might be that you know the difference between rhetoric and logic, rhetoric sounds like logic, often, but isn’t. You and ARM seem oblivious to what to many here is a bright line.
And this is before we get to arresting a man for a video causing a riot, even though Obama was communicating with Clinton on an illegal server and knew it was a terrorist attack not caused by a video.
But.
Yes. Continue the lie that Obama was "scandal free."
Michael,
"Inga is, again, spanked very hard by Angel-Dyne and believes she, Inga, did the spanking. Splendid to watch"
Sounds like a Lazlo post!
The stuff you regurgitate comes straight out of right wing rags and conspiracy theory sites, almost word for word. You are simply too dishonest to post your sources.
Give me a link then, I just composed that myself. The idea of inoculation is an old one from campaign strategy, but I would like to know who else said it about weak sauce commenters on blogs.
The other thing you could do is tell my why it is wrong. You won’t do that for reasons outlined in the original comment you responded to. As if you are trying to prove its correctness.
Matthew Sablan,
"Continue the lie that Obama was "scandal free.""
If a scandal falls in the forest, but the media had their earplugs in and didn't hear it, then it didn't occur!
Your President is on TV as we speak making a complete fool of himself. Dow down by over 800 points.
Good grief Althouse.
Hilary, the DNC, FBI, Justice Dept, Obama administration officials, Congressional Democrats, and media conspired to frame the GOP candidate and then elected President. They’ve called him Hitler, fascist, every kind of “ist” in fact, encouraged and acted out the fantasy of beheading or otherwise assassinating him, attacked his youngest child as retarded and his wife as a prostitute (I could go on at great length) and you’ve got your panties in a twist over the word “revenge”?
Wake up to the real world.
Yes, the old “look squirrel!” argument of which Aristotle was a great champion.
"Your President is on TV as we speak making a complete fool of himself. Dow down by over 800 points."
-- If you're American, he's "our President." Is that down 800 better or worse than it has been on average over the past 15-20 years?
You just prove my point for me, over and over. The thing is though that people with open minds can figure out for themselves who has coherent arguments that they can defend and who is cutting and pasting talking points, or on a good day, paraphrasing them.
Was Obama your President? I recall a right wing neighbor who said he wouldn’t fly the flag as long as Obama was President and he didn’t.
Stocks down by 1100.
Dow down by over 800 points
Schumer says, "Thanks, Obama".
Yes squirrel! Squirrel!
You just prove my point over and over. It’s utterly transparent Igna.
Dow down 1500.
Inga
Cheer the down DOW. Sick. At 2400 it is still 6000 pts above the day President Trump was elected.
Wall Street has awakened to what’s happening in DC.
Boy, it came back 500 points so quick that now it’s only down a 1,000 still miles above where it was when he took office. I think there is a term for when the market reaches a certain point and megabucks flow in. which just happened.
I don’t bother the people at the bank, and ask them to not bother me, but I hope they took a position!
It's called a dead cat bounce.
Inga
LOL
No, you moron it has awakened to the fact that the economy is roaring and inflation and higher rates are imminent .
"Dow down 1500."
2/5/18, 2:10 PM
And back up 500 in less than 10 minutes.
Bad idea to sell America short.
ARM
No, it is not called a dead cat bounce you idiot.
Anyway, about all of those sites that posted the same thing I posted. Now that that excitement is over, do you have a link? You were so certain, I am sure you must have one! You would never make a bold assertion like that based on your bigoted belief that I am an idiot! You must have the proof at the ready!
While Inga was blindly swinging her sledgehammer around, Angel Dyne skipped over, elegantly jabbed Inga right between the ribs with her épée de combat and skipped away without Inga's sledgehammer ever coming close to her. It was so adroitly done that Inga does not realize she is bleeding. The sledgehammer has made loud noises ineffectually crashing against the the walls, so Inga believes she must be hurting someone.
Again, beautifully done, Angel Dyne.
It’s a dead squirrel bounce.
He was my president, even if I didn't agree with him a lot. That's been the connective glue of American presidents since Washington.
For our intrepid market watchers. Remember that for every seller there is a buyer. Take care with your money. Do not mix your idiotic politics with your money. Ask those commenters who sold on the election. LOL.
Really this "Not my president" thing took off over George W. Bush, and it has been bad for general congeniality ever since.
Now would bel a good time to start incremental purchases in the market.
Particularly if your horizon is out several years and beyond.
“No, you moron it has awakened to the fact that the economy is roaring and inflation and higher rates are imminent .”
Keep fooling yourself. It’s more than that... you should know that. That you don’t, is telling.
No, you moron it has awakened to the fact that the economy is roaring and inflation and higher rates are imminent .
Higher demand for labor = higher wages and harder to find workers. More demand for raw materials, inflation, tamped down by higher interest rates. But they won’t reply to your uncontroversial assessment, because they sold all of their stocks the day after the election! And damn it, they are going to hold their positions ’til they are vindicated!
That you don’t, is telling.
You have zero powers of introspection, apparently. It’s one of the things that’s fascinating about your character, the continuing question, “can she really be that dense?” And each day you take it to new depths.
“While Inga was blindly swinging her sledgehammer around, Angel Dyne skipped over, elegantly jabbed Inga right between the ribs with her épée de combat and skipped away without Inga's sledgehammer ever coming close to her. It was so adroitly done that Inga does not realize she is bleeding. The sledgehammer has made loud noises ineffectually crashing against the the walls, so Inga believes she must be hurting someone.”
Sorry sweetie, I don’t live in your fantasy land.
Apparently the markets are demanding higher energy prices due to restricted supply, more regulation, and higher corporate income taxes, and we are just too stupid to see it, “telling.”
Inga
You have been made a fool of once on this thread. Take your foot out of the bucket and move along. The market does not give one shit about what you think it cares about. Or, act on your stupidity and sell everything you have because the market is going to zero based on Russiarussiarussia. Go ahead.
"Bad idea to sell America short."
Not a bad idea to hedge.
Gee, I wonder what happened to that slam dunk sentencing of Gen Flynn by Muellers team of democrats?
All in the last several weeks the judge over seeing the case is forcibly recused from the Flynn case (pssst, this obama appointee sack of s*** was also a FISA court judge on you know what!), lots if interesting info about the Hillary/obama weaponization of intelligence agencies emerges with lots more to come from the IG and committees, then suddenly, the Mueller Gang decides maybe we need a little timeout on that sentencing thingy.
I wonder if its because ay sentencing Flynns legal team might be able to pose some "interesting" questions to the Mueller/Hillary legal hit squad on the record?
Yikes!
That could get ....uncomfortable.
Sorry sweetie, I don’t live in your fantasy land.
You fantasy land is your own, nobody here is going to argue that.
Michael said...
No, it is not called a dead cat bounce you idiot.
Someone's lost their sense of humor. There's no need for panic. This when we sort out the boys from the men.
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